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Orgganon
Portugal28 Posts
have you checked the vods on youtube on TheCore? you will get a broader idea on CG's and how they're used with TheCore. either way, if you open the document, in the bottom u can choose the Terran sheet and there u find the suggested CG's also. for example P for CC's and O for production. as i play zerg can't be of much help there but vods definetly can. (or jak, or some teran player) youtube/thejakatakshow  hope this helps | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
TheCore 0.7 | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
Genius. Love it. What about macro hatches? Does doing this allow us to make option 7 for creep better? I think it might. | ||
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SpoogeCoffer
New Zealand51 Posts
On May 04 2013 02:02 JaKaTaK wrote: @Spooge Which abilities that are on / right now would you shift-queue? Infested terrans - as an example if you are using the classic "four infestor hitsquad" type shenanigans with four burrowed infestors you will queue up a move then shift+spam infested terrans out. Also there are some instances where you might want to shift+queue up a series of snipes from a distance (preceded by a move). All in all / is a fucking awkward key for abilities when there are other options readily available. But for these two specific instances I believe that fungal is better on / as there are basically no instances that you'd ever want to queue this after a movement command (though I can certainly envision some circumstances that could call for it but you'd never see it at high levels of play, as an ie some bronzie shift+queuing up fungals or something onto mineral lines), so perhaps neural would be the best on this key but again there are some instances when you'd want to queue a move before a neural. As for ghosts nuke is no good (generally you'll queue move before nuke). EMP suffers from the same thing as fungal really while you generally won't emp on a movement queue at a high level (instead instant casting it) I can see bronzies wanting to do this. And I believe that snipe will see a bit of use following a move command. The least of these evils would probably be EMP. For these reasons I believe it's bad to press / with your thumb and so its use should be calculated on the difficulty of having to press it with your index finger. tl;dr I'm against / being used as an ability key on the basis of queuing up abilities after movement commands. Edit: Apparently thrusters are also on / this is something that will quite often see movement queuing. Queue your drop to just outside base, queue thruster (to get over static defense) toward mineral line then queue unload. This is I hope you can see very awkward with / having to be actuated by your thumb. Edit 2: I don't mean to mock your efforts, I love that you're still experimenting with optimisations. It's just that I think you're just heading down the wrong track with trying to use / as an ability key. | ||
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Orgganon
Portugal28 Posts
(actually only after reading ninjury saying it was really good) «-- lazy bastard | ||
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Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On May 05 2013 18:39 lailaiwd wrote: Dear Jak, I just started using the Core and have some questions about the control groups. Right now I have command centers on K and Production on L. My army units are on I,O, and P. I use 8 for upgrades and 9 and 0 for drops. When I tap through these buttons it feels a bit weird though. What do you suggest that I change? I play terran by the way. How did you get CCs on K? o_o On May 05 2013 11:19 rebelsaint wrote: Regarding the Zerg control groups for hatches and inject queens, I have changed my add to hatchery group to be Alt-O (ZRL layout). This way I can immediately set the camera location to the hatchery when I add it. Alt-O-J adds my main hatch and sets my first camera all at once. Alt-O-K for my natural, etc. To reset the group if I ever have to, I picked Ctrl-"." but I never use it and it could probably be anything you wanted. I don't ever accidentally add anything to that group because I have to hit Alt to do so. Inject queens I moved to CTRL-O. This can actually work for Terran and Protoss as well by binding Add to CG 1 to Alt+J or Alt+I (TRM or PRM), thus creating the combo of Alt+(J/I)+(O/P/L/;/9/0). I personally believe that the pinky is best suited for this one, especially because the game doesn't let you build workers when Alt is held down (this leaves finger reaction time as the only factor in the decision). I wish I could set an alt for SCV with Alt+I to optimize the opening seconds of the game, and damn it would feel beautifully articulate, but alas.  All this leaves into question is what Ctrl+O should be used for now, if anything. Oh, and one more thing, I thought of a potential use for the rapidfire which is almost impossible to confuse with hax: Use it with the build worker command when the game is loading in order to build a worker at the first possible frame. :D EDIT: Or not. Rapidfire doesn't work with Selection. :/ | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
Alt sucks, do we really want to use it whenever we add to the hatchery CG? I suppose you always want to center it and add the camera location so it doesn't seem to be a big issue, but its definitely worse than Ctrl. Streamlining the adding of camera keys for bases definitely sounds interesting. Concerning / as an ability: I don't think throwing it away completely as an ability is a good idea, but I think that we should mix it in when it doesn't sacrifice functionality in efficient play. I'll be taking another look at / for abilities, especially with the specifics that Spooge mentioned, and put it out in the next patch. | ||
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Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On May 06 2013 00:20 JaKaTaK wrote: Alt sucks, do we really want to use it whenever we add to the hatchery CG? I suppose you always want to center it and add the camera location so it doesn't seem to be a big issue, but its definitely worse than Ctrl. That Add to CG command is used 3 or 4 times in the average game... it doesn't have that high of a priority, so you might as well make it harder to mess up (I've added 20 rax to my CC group on multiple occassions...) and make cameras easier to access as well. | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
For zerg, every time one makes a base hatch, one adds it to the control group and makes it a base came. This requires some combination like: Ctrl P Alt K Notice how alt is pressed anyways. With rebels idea, one would press Alt P K, eliminating the repetitive movement if the thumb. This is huge! The only time it is less efficient is with macro hatches, but the difference one loses by pressing alt instead of Ctrl for every macro hatch is way smaller than the gain one receives by eliminating one terrible thumb stroke per base, especially once considered that (I estimate) one has three bases per one or two macro hatches. Here is what would be most efficient IMO. I changed alt p to alt J because 1) j allows great combo ability with the base cams (no base is one the pinkie) and 2) it allows the queen cg to be operated more normally. Add to cg 1: alt J Create cg 1: Ctrl shift J Select cg 1: p Add to cg2: Ctrl p Create cg2: ctrl shift p Select cg2: shift P I don't know how it will work with the other races, but it necessarily saves an action per base for zerg, and also can eliminate two repetitions (one with the thumb, and one whenever the index is used for a base cam). | ||
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JDub
United States976 Posts
At the same time, adding macro hatches to your hatch CG would be slower that way, since it would require pressing alt instead of just Ctrl. Personally I don't think it's worth it to make that sort of change, it adds complexity for what I see as no gain | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
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Borskey
160 Posts
And it's not just a Zerg improvement either- it works for the other races just as well. Doesn't have to interfere with the current bind at all, since it can just be an alternate bind. Though you could make it the main one if you wished (I know I've had games where I've screwed up my hatch or queen control groups). | ||
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Borskey
160 Posts
Only thing it conflicts with is "morph to ultralisk", but I think someone using TRM is far more likely to need the idle worker button over that. | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
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Borskey
160 Posts
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slowbacontron
United States7722 Posts
On May 06 2013 00:26 Antylamon wrote: That Add to CG command is used 3 or 4 times in the average game... it doesn't have that high of a priority, so you might as well make it harder to mess up (I've added 20 rax to my CC group on multiple occassions...) and make cameras easier to access as well. You mean you only use Add to CG a few times per game? I use it almost every time I have to modify a CG, and only need a hard reset occasionally. | ||
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StillRooney
Sweden106 Posts
On May 06 2013 04:37 slowbacontron wrote: You mean you only use Add to CG a few times per game? I use it almost every time I have to modify a CG, and only need a hard reset occasionally. I think the discussion is only regarding Nexus/CC/Hatcheries. | ||
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slowbacontron
United States7722 Posts
On May 06 2013 04:52 StillRooney wrote: I think the discussion is only regarding Nexus/CC/Hatcheries. Of course I would fail to understand the overall conversation >.< Sorry | ||
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BruceLee584
Canada6 Posts
Thanks guys! | ||
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Vanngar
United States30 Posts
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