• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 05:17
CEST 11:17
KST 18:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Ro4 Recap : The Peak8DreamHack Dallas 2025 - Info & Preview14herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, GuMiho, Classic, Cure6Code S RO8 Preview: Classic, Reynor, Maru, GuMiho4
Community News
[BSL20] RO20 Group Stage0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifiers (May 28-June 1)7Weekly Cups (May 12-18): Clem sweeps WardiTV May3Code S Season 2 (2025) - Qualifier Results212025 GSL Season 2 (Qualifiers)14
StarCraft 2
General
DreamHack Dallas 2025 - Info & Preview Power Rank: October 2018 herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2025) Code S Season 2 (2025) - Qualifier Results Code S RO8 Preview: Classic, Reynor, Maru, GuMiho
Tourneys
DreamHack Dallas 2025 $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) EWC 2025 Regional Qualifiers (May 28-June 1) [GSL 2025] Code S Season 1 - RO4 and Grand Finals
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance Mutation # 473 Cold is the Void Mutation # 472 Dead Heat Mutation # 471 Delivery Guaranteed
Brood War
General
Cwal.gg not working BW General Discussion [ASL19] Ro4 Recap : The Peak BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Artosis baned on twitch ?
Tourneys
[ASL19] Semifinal B [BSL20] RO20 Group Stage [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Grand Theft Auto VI Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Plays: Diplomacy TL Mafia: Generative Agents Showdown Survivor II: The Amazon
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Trading/Investing Thread Men's Fashion Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Books] Wool by Hugh Howey
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL.net Ten Commandments
Blogs
Yes Sir! How Commanding Impr…
TrAiDoS
Poker
Nebuchad
Info SLEgma_12
SLEgma_12
SECOND COMMING
XenOsky
WombaT’s Old BW Terran Theme …
WombaT
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11240 users

[Q] What is unit critical mass? - Page 4

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
shadymmj
Profile Joined June 2010
1906 Posts
June 26 2010 09:19 GMT
#61
Another thing that I want to talk about is where carriers fit in this concept of critical mass. Maybe a simple definition is when "units are exponentially more effective in a group" rather than being solitary.

As some people said, 1 carrier can't do much, but 8 of them can do a lot. That is not very surprising. One expects 8 carriers to do 8 times more damage than 1 can. Say the enemy zerg matches 3 mutas for each carrier you have (in no way is this a A > B scenario). That would be 24 mutas against 8 carriers.

Would it be better if you had 1 carrier engaging 3 mutas in 8 places of the map simultaneously, or a ball of 8 carriers taking on the ball of 24 mutas? Even if we take into account the bouncing glaive, the carrier ball will be superior. Why? Something to think about.
There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds.
danl9rm
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States3111 Posts
June 26 2010 09:39 GMT
#62
all I got from the OP was that critical mass of colossi could be considered 8.
LoL, wow! if you catch me with my pants down after massing 8 colossi, i am definitely deserving of a loss.
"Science has so well established that the preborn baby in the womb is a living human being that most pro-choice activists have conceded the point. ..since the abortion proponents have lost the science argument, they are now advocating an existential one."
Azrael35
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1 Post
June 26 2010 19:41 GMT
#63
On June 25 2010 13:54 FC.Strike wrote:
When I voted "Not Really" I really meant "No, and I think that this information would be entirely detrimental to new players."

The absolute worst thing you can do is dive into a situation and just take somebody else's word for it. Doing this sets up mental blocks in your head which prevent you from truly exploring and evolving your strategies.

Instead it promotes this sense of static satisfaction wherein you think that you've already found the "best" way to do something and that's that.

When the beta comes back, just start TESTING things. Try moving out with 3 colossi. Ask yourself how that felt. Now try 4. Ask yourself how that run felt. Etc.

You're looking for structure and shortcuts when there really isn't any. I strongly believe that anything attempting to structure strategy in the way you described does more harm than it does good.

The people who need it (the newer players) gain a skewed concept of the game
The people who don't need it will find it worthless



What your saying makes sense and I get what your trying to promote but....

For someone who is looking to obtain this information as a basis for comparison or a starting point to honing there own comfort zones it isnt as damaging as you describe. "PvE is checkers and PvP is chess" Obviously if someone takes any advice and applies it as an absolute they are destined to failure but anyone who takes the advice as a baseline for study with the full intention of adaptation and reaction, it can be a helpful tool that eliminates some of the more unnecessary trial and error.

I guess what I'm saying is I agree with your warning but not with your assertion of "No" it isnt helpful at all. It should be used as a baseline for your own comparisons only but it is indeed a useful tool if used correctly.

-Az
If at first you dont succeed, dont sky dive....
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
June 26 2010 22:23 GMT
#64
"Critical mass" is really an over used concept.

What most people mean is that
"At equal macro levels, at one point his units will start to beat your units"
The only true "critical mass" is if you can defeat his 200/200 army with said units.

The term is used because of 2 reasons:
1: When 1 unit has higher range than another you get a bigger advantage in bigger numbers due to you being able to abuse the free shots more and more.
2: When 1 unit has a splash damage component the advantage scales up similarly.

Colossus are the usual example because they have 9 range and big splash. However, is 8 colossus unbeatable by a 200/200 army? no you don't even need close to that. What about a 130/200 army with 8 colossus and lots of stalkers and sentries? Well its quite tough to deal with that as zerg if you have mostly hydralisks, So a lot of people say "oh well he's going critical mass of colossus" But if you're on like a high supply on roach/hydra/ling and with a decent surround you can still win comfortably.

I think its way overused because it depends so much on composition and positioning as well as general micro.

The sc:bw was like "6 corsairs kill infinity mutaliks" when in fact like 12-14 with a good surround wins. However if you are both making sairs and mutas his sairs are going to win if you are both putting in similar resources. [He'll win more and more in bigger numbers, due to splash]
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 43m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 23096
Sea 1389
actioN 511
Stork 274
Killer 100
PianO 82
sorry 42
sSak 38
Mong 36
Liquid`Ret 26
[ Show more ]
NaDa 26
Rush 23
Sharp 23
soO 17
Sacsri 10
Movie 5
Dota 2
XaKoH 653
ODPixel648
XcaliburYe460
Fuzer 253
League of Legends
JimRising 537
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1786
shoxiejesuss753
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor156
Other Games
ceh9607
C9.Mang0561
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH271
• LUISG 17
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2102
League of Legends
• Stunt715
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
43m
Road to EWC
5h 43m
Replay Cast
1d
SC Evo League
1d 2h
Road to EWC
1d 5h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 19h
BeSt vs Soulkey
Road to EWC
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
SOOP
3 days
NightMare vs Wayne
Replay Cast
4 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
4 days
GSL Code S
5 days
Cure vs Zoun
Solar vs Creator
The PondCast
5 days
Online Event
5 days
Clem vs ShoWTimE
herO vs MaxPax
GSL Code S
6 days
GuMiho vs Bunny
ByuN vs SHIN
Online Event
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-05-16
2025 GSL S1
Calamity Stars S2

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
ASL Season 19
YSL S1
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
China & Korea Top Challenge
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
DreamHack Dallas 2025
Heroes 10 EU
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025
ESL Pro League S21

Upcoming

Rose Open S1
Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLAN 2025
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2025
2025 GSL S2
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.