• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 23:53
CEST 05:53
KST 12:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 1 - Final Week6[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall12HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0
Community News
Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed8Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll2Team TLMC #5 - Submission extension2Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation17$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced7
StarCraft 2
General
Who will win EWC 2025? Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed Team TLMC #5 - Submission extension The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) WardiTV Mondays Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL Starcraft in widescreen BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone
Tourneys
Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches [Megathread] Daily Proleagues CSL Xiamen International Invitational [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Summer Games Done Quick 2025! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Men Take Risks, Women Win Ga…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 439 users

[D] Map features that favor a specific race

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
Post a Reply
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-27 23:15:57
June 27 2012 16:17 GMT
#1
Hello guys, lately I have been thinking about something awesome, a data base that would include all the known map features to favor, or disfavor a specific race. This would help alot when thinking of a map layout and trying to see if it would be balanced.

For example, when you are making a new map you could just pick an even number of features that favor each race and use them in your map.

I think if everyone donates their knowledge to this, it can be very helpful to new and experienced map makers alike. I will start with my knowledge as a master Protoss player, but I am sure there are many more features I forgot to mention, if everyone helps out this could become a great resource!

Map features that favor a certain race specific to a matchup:

PvT:
- Large rush distance (warp ins remove reinforcements travel time and its easier defending pushes)

TvP:
- Close air distance (easier drops)
- Lots of air space (drops are easier, and can escape easier when attacked)

TvZ:
- Siegeable bases from different height
- Ledges (for reaper harass and tank dropped there to be safe and provide cover for other units)

ZvP:
- Open areas (to get easier surrounds)
- Empty air / unpathable high ground area near bases (for brood lords placing)

PvZ:
- Natural with small entrance (Easier to block in time for early pool and to defend overall)

General map feature per race:

Protoss favored:
- Chokes (unless going zealot-archon style, which is rare)
- 3rd tucked by main (easier to defend with blink stalkers)
- Excessive change in height (both the colossus and the stalker using blink can pass through different levels of height easily)
- Inbase expo (Terran can build a 2ns CC in his base regardless, and Zerg has the easiest time expanding, so Protoss gains the most out of a safe expansion that is easy to defend)

Terran favored:
- Large main (easier drop off and more space for buildings)
- Main with LOS blockers (easier drop off)
- Short rush distance (Terran has slow units that need to travel to get to the enemy base)
- Island bases (Terran has the easiest time taking an island expansion)
- Expansion path that goes toward the opponent
- Gold bases (Terran normally has less workers then Protoss and Zerg, so gold bases are more beneficial to it)

Zerg favored:
- Many expansions (Zerg is the strongest race lategame - debatable)
- Close by 3rd (not necessarily an easy one, just close since getting creep there is easier)
- Xel'naga towers (Zerg most of the time has map control and so has control over the towers, also Zerg benefits the most from the towers, cause it is a reactionary race)
- Expansion path that goes away from the opponent
- LOS usage (easier to ambush and counterattack)
- Air space behind mains and unpathable high grounds (for easy overlords placement)

If you got a reasonable feature that favors a race say it here and if supported I will include it in the OP, or if you think one of the features I included is wrong in some way, tell me and I will change it.

I hope this will help map makers to make better and more balanced maps gl hf's!
vaderseven
Profile Joined September 2008
United States2556 Posts
June 27 2012 16:23 GMT
#2
It depends alot on the matchup. In TvZ, for example, Terran loves choke points and abuses them. In TvP, Protoss loves choke points and abuses them.
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
June 27 2012 16:32 GMT
#3
On June 28 2012 01:23 vaderseven wrote:
It depends alot on the matchup. In TvZ, for example, Terran loves choke points and abuses them. In TvP, Protoss loves choke points and abuses them.

But I am talking in general, while there are certain matchup specifics, there are also generally favorable features, for example chokes are good for TvZ right? I already included that Zerg likes open areas, and chokes are good for PvT, already said Protoss is good with chokes . From the general favoritism you can conduct the specific favoritism. I can maybe add later on matchup specifics, if the general ones are not enough. but for now I want to get a good data base of the map features that generally favor a certain race.
monitor
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2404 Posts
June 27 2012 16:53 GMT
#4
I think you have to approach this with specific MUs if you want to actually get a good sense of what races like. Here's some of my thoughts on openness and expansions.

PvZ
Protoss - chokes, close thirds, limited airspace
Zerg - open space, open expansions, airspace for BLs, expanding away from the opponent

TvZ
Terran - cliffs/ramps for tank setups, easily dropped expansions (meaning the opponents base is close by air), aggressive expos
Zerg - wide open expansions, few cliffs/siege positions at expansions, expos away from opponent
*chokes are a lot more variable in this match up because sometimes bio terran doesn't like chokes (infestors, banelings)

PvT
Protoss - chokes, aggressive or defensive expanding
Terran - open space, aggressive expanding (most cases)
Mapmaker & TLMC Judge. Amygdala, Frostline, Crimson Court, and Korhal Compound (WoL).
Guardian85
Profile Joined May 2012
162 Posts
June 27 2012 16:53 GMT
#5
Good initiative, but i think its just as important to list all the disbenefits too, not only the race spesific benefits.

Like putting unpathable rocks NEAR main base HQ, and NEAR other expansion HQ placements, disbenefit especially for zerg.

Or like None pathable cliff edges, disbenefits Terran and protoss.
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
June 27 2012 17:36 GMT
#6
monitor: breaking the data into matchups takes more time, so I was going to go away from it, but I see it is the best way so I will turn it into per matchup.

Guardian: what do you mean by rocks near main base? near expo's I guess you mean blocking them?
Guardian85
Profile Joined May 2012
162 Posts
June 27 2012 17:51 GMT
#7
The rocks was about building availability, in the way that zerg already has restricted buildspace on creep, one rock in the "right / wrong " spot, could really make it difficult to build buildings, if the rock is in a position where it hits the build grid from multiple angles.
Its not a serious setback, and would be annoying to most races, but still can be used to make slight changes.
SiskosGoatee
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Albania1482 Posts
June 27 2012 20:41 GMT
#8
People have said this since times and used this to theorycraft about map balance before the actual stats were in and seldom did the actual stats coincide with people's perception of map balance. Does anyone remember crossfire? People were screaming left and right that it would be impossible for ZvP, it turned out to be an impossible PvZ map. When Terminus was introduced, everyone was like 'Ohhh, this map is so large, good for ZvT', it turned out to be a TvZ favoured map.

Ultimately, it's far too complicated to judge a map balance by that and I don't even know if those things really factor in and decide map balance.
WCS Apartheid cometh, all hail the casual audience, death to merit and hard work.
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
June 27 2012 20:51 GMT
#9
Well, if there was an actual list of every feature, you could compare them all and actually see (in theory) if the map is balanced. Since every feature is included it is supposed to work, only problem is to actually get every feature.

To that matter, who do you think an in-base expo favors?
ArcticRaven
Profile Joined August 2011
France1406 Posts
June 27 2012 20:58 GMT
#10
Don't forget overlord spots, LoS blockers , main size, drop paths, lowground pylon powering mains, reaper backdoors, airspace/mineral line relationship.

I think inbase expos favor Toss, then Terran, then Zerg, because zerg has the easiest time securing expos, then terran, then toss ; so if they are free, this zerg advantage and toss disadvantage is removed.
[Govie] Wierd shit, on a 6 game AP winning streak with KOTL in the trench. I searched gandalf quotes and spammed them all game long, trenchwarfare247, whateva it takes!
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
June 27 2012 21:17 GMT
#11
LoS favors Zerg right? main size i already did covered I think, what can I say about lowground pylons exactly? ledges I will add and airspace is mostly good for zerg and terran right?
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
SEL Masters #4 - Day 2
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 243
StarCraft: Brood War
Sharp 53
Noble 17
Icarus 6
Dota 2
monkeys_forever1093
NeuroSwarm133
League of Legends
JimRising 865
Trikslyr79
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K515
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King294
Other Games
summit1g14936
shahzam1313
WinterStarcraft285
Maynarde115
kaitlyn31
RuFF_SC221
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick3408
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH301
• Mapu16
• practicex 8
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Scarra2844
• Rush2012
• Lourlo980
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
6h 7m
WardiTV European League
12h 7m
ShoWTimE vs sebesdes
Percival vs NightPhoenix
Shameless vs Nicoract
Krystianer vs Scarlett
ByuN vs uThermal
Harstem vs HeRoMaRinE
PiGosaur Monday
20h 7m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 12h
Replay Cast
1d 20h
The PondCast
2 days
WardiTV European League
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Epic.LAN
3 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
[ Show More ]
Epic.LAN
4 days
CSO Contender
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Online Event
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Liquipedia Results

Completed

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Championship of Russia 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters

Upcoming

CSL Xiamen Invitational
CSL Xiamen Invitational: ShowMatche
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
K-Championship
RSL Revival: Season 2
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Underdog Cup #2
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.