On December 13 2011 01:27 FuFighter wrote: Why do people seem to think that articles posted on TL have to be unbiased?
Anyways: MC fightiiiiiing!
They don't HAVE to be. But especially when they turn out completely wrong of course you are gonna get criticized for them .
People should criticize them for being wrong then, not for being biased. ;-) I think the article was fine and well written. Maybe it was biased but it wasn't like "Hero is gonna win because he is a liquid player". Most of the time he was given a slight edge so I think it's fine. It's definitely more fun than picking MVP
well in the end he was giving him a slight edge because he is liquid. so i dont get ur point really ;(
On December 12 2011 10:45 Micket wrote: For what reasons is Hero being given title of 'best Protoss player in the world'? He can't get past 2nd round of Code A, has an awful win rate in Korea, and stomps foreigners. He is incredibly creative and smart, but trashing around foreigners will always make you look good.
Where is the oZ hype? Brown? Parting? Heck, MC deserves more hype, guy is goooood.
Yup, if Hero were still in oGs he would still be a middle of pack protoss. He deserves credit though for being able to consistently beat weaker players than him, I don't think his problem is being 'nervous' from that perspective.. it's more like in Korea there aren't too many pro players weaker than him.
Yes, he was considered a top prospect while being on oGs by people who paid attention to the scene.
You don't think his problem is nerves, yet today he played a self-destructive game in each set, and playing like that would have been beaten by most mid-tier foreigners as well?
- Slamming his army into Roaches chasing a Queen that he has no chance of killing, then giving up. - Cannoning DRG's natural in the midgame, then giving up. - Losing a Warp Prism to one single Queen. - Going Nexus first in PvP without being aware of the map features or blocking / chasing down the Probe in his base. - Going Nexus first in PvT without even fully scouting mvp's base (and his Probe was basically free to look anywhere for a full minute).
Anyone with a modicum of common sense would realize that the games he played today were OBVIOUSLY not representative of his skill level and that none of those mistakes and decisions are actually normal when his mind is in the right place. But then again, there isn't much of common sense on TL these days.
He's only been exposed to playing games on the big stage for the last 2 or 3 months, it's not his skill (or lack thereof) that is holding him back. He has confidence issues, nerve issues, and at a stretch his decision making isn't the best, but these things come naturally from maturity and experience.
He went for cannon rush because he was already out of the tournament. He only lost to MC because he blocked his ramp with his cannon, which was at the time a difficult decision to make, and his zealots couldn't chase after the probe. Antiga Shipyard is possibly the most common map for terrans to do 1 rax expand against toss, so going nexus first isn't exactly showing "nerves". Tbh, those games WERE representative of his skill, people just hype him up too much
I think HerO's problem is just that he's too cutesy ingame. I was sure he would go for a fast expansion build vs MC and get rolled. Against a player as aggressive as MC, playing greedily is really bad decision-making.
On December 12 2011 10:45 Micket wrote: For what reasons is Hero being given title of 'best Protoss player in the world'? He can't get past 2nd round of Code A, has an awful win rate in Korea, and stomps foreigners. He is incredibly creative and smart, but trashing around foreigners will always make you look good.
Where is the oZ hype? Brown? Parting? Heck, MC deserves more hype, guy is goooood.
Yup, if Hero were still in oGs he would still be a middle of pack protoss. He deserves credit though for being able to consistently beat weaker players than him, I don't think his problem is being 'nervous' from that perspective.. it's more like in Korea there aren't too many pro players weaker than him.
Yes, he was considered a top prospect while being on oGs by people who paid attention to the scene.
You don't think his problem is nerves, yet today he played a self-destructive game in each set, and playing like that would have been beaten by most mid-tier foreigners as well?
- Slamming his army into Roaches chasing a Queen that he has no chance of killing, then giving up. - Cannoning DRG's natural in the midgame, then giving up. - Losing a Warp Prism to one single Queen. - Going Nexus first in PvP without being aware of the map features or blocking / chasing down the Probe in his base. - Going Nexus first in PvT without even fully scouting mvp's base (and his Probe was basically free to look anywhere for a full minute).
Anyone with a modicum of common sense would realize that the games he played today were OBVIOUSLY not representative of his skill level and that none of those mistakes and decisions are actually normal when his mind is in the right place. But then again, there isn't much of common sense on TL these days.
He's only been exposed to playing games on the big stage for the last 2 or 3 months, it's not his skill (or lack thereof) that is holding him back. He has confidence issues, nerve issues, and at a stretch his decision making isn't the best, but these things come naturally from maturity and experience.
Errr. A lot of the points you bring up are exaggerated and wrong. Cannoning the natural of DRG was not mid game at all. He didn't give up, he misplaced his second cannon slightly so that lings had a slightly larger surface area. He lost his warp prism to 2 queens, not 1. It's kinda impossible to lose a warp prism to 1 queen unless you're hellen keller. He went nexus first pvp BECAUSE HE WAS AWARE OF THE MAP FEATURES. I mean come on, really? He could have done a better job with the probe, he pulled probes as if to surround it and then pulled them back. So that ended up costing him the game I guess. And then in the PvT he did scout mvp's base, then he left it. Then he tried to go back in but there were marines there. You can't blame that on hero. He picked a greedy build and lost a build order game. Woo.
And he's been playing gsl games for a lot longer than 2 months. He gets far in the code a qualifiers almost every season, and yes, he hasn't done very well in them, but hey, that's super duper stressful.
I'm no protoss player, but I do support Hero because he's so creative and fun to watch. I think his lack of success in this tournament is mostly because he played what? 4 tournaments in the last month? He's been flying everywhere and hasn't had the time to practice as he wants, and he's probably incredibly tired and jet lagged.
On December 13 2011 01:27 FuFighter wrote: Why do people seem to think that articles posted on TL have to be unbiased?
Anyways: MC fightiiiiiing!
They don't HAVE to be. But especially when they turn out completely wrong of course you are gonna get criticized for them .
People should criticize them for being wrong then, not for being biased. ;-) I think the article was fine and well written. Maybe it was biased but it wasn't like "Hero is gonna win because he is a liquid player". Most of the time he was given a slight edge so I think it's fine. It's definitely more fun than picking MVP
well in the end he was giving him a slight edge because he is liquid. so i dont get ur point really ;(
My point is that Hero, at least in my opinion, can beat those players if he has a slight edge (eg. no nerve issues or something like that) whilst players of the TL roster that have been struggeling lately would probably not win against those players even if they had a slight edge (eg MVP having nerve issuses). Therefore predicting that HerO will win might be biased but it's a bias I personally don't mind.
If on the other hand I was picked up by TL today and they predicted me to win anything against any progamer I would mind since it was completly biased and like saying "he will win JUST BECAUSE he is on TL".
In my opinion the TL articles don't have to be completly unbiased and as long as it's reasonable like giving a player HerO an edge... at least that's what I was trying to say.
Somehow, I am a bit content seeing that cocky prediction of him going 3,5 to 0,5 (the one against MC being a coinflip). Somehow, I am a bit sad that he was eliminated. It would've been a great moment for him to shine... :-(
TL has always been biased in its writing, but at least it hasn't been so apparent. With the recent MLG article and now this write up, the quality and just any pretense of rational analysis has gone out the window. How do you pick these writers? You guys are like the Fox news of esports.
Please take a deep breath, look inward, and try, just try to find a bit of common sense next time. And think to yourself before you post, " is this a bit too extreme, am I currently of a sound mind? "
On December 13 2011 12:48 Flare23 wrote: TL has always been biased in its writing, but at least it hasn't been so apparent. With the recent MLG article and now this write up, the quality and just any pretense of rational analysis has gone out the window. How do you pick these writers? You guys are like the Fox news of esports.
Please take a deep breath, look inward, and try, just try to find a bit of common sense next time. And think to yourself before you post, " is this a bit too extreme, am I currently of a sound mind? "
I rarely quote someone like this but honestly I think this about covers it. I read a final edit jammed into the middle of a preview for mlg where someone had a bone to pick with EG. Im reading and have read just sheer silliness about liquid players and continue to read it. Look man I support liquid players, Ive supported them with actual expenditures. But dont make up a new article and "horse" shit around with your bias pretending your some sort of journalist.
Do you really use this for your resume? I hope not.
On December 13 2011 12:48 Flare23 wrote: TL has always been biased in its writing, but at least it hasn't been so apparent. With the recent MLG article and now this write up, the quality and just any pretense of rational analysis has gone out the window. How do you pick these writers? You guys are like the Fox news of esports.
Please take a deep breath, look inward, and try, just try to find a bit of common sense next time. And think to yourself before you post, " is this a bit too extreme, am I currently of a sound mind? "
Well I think after this pitiful performance it will be toned down at least.
On December 13 2011 12:48 Flare23 wrote: TL has always been biased in its writing, but at least it hasn't been so apparent. With the recent MLG article and now this write up, the quality and just any pretense of rational analysis has gone out the window. How do you pick these writers? You guys are like the Fox news of esports.
Even if some parts of the article are arguable, I think "Fox news" is an insult in this context.
Reading this annoyed me, both for it's odd tone and sloppy writing like the following.
"Though he's only half rehabilitated, you can't count MC out. Flip 'inconsistent' on its head, and you can call a player 'streaky.' I'm not saying it's definitely going to happen, but there's a definitely a strong five day run in MC if he puts it all together."
I personally really want HerO to win against MVP. Besides that, I'm only really interested in watching DongRaeGu vs MVP, even though I'm confident that MVP is going to win it.
EPT
