Forget Avalon. Forget Lost Saga. Hell, you should forget Club Day and Arena too.
With one of the biggest sponsors in a long time, a set of maps that drive a stake right in the heart of the "Swarm Season", and a stellar lineup where basically every S-Class player made it through the prelims, the Starcraft fan in all of us has to start feeling that unmistakable tingling in the deepest corner of the nerdiest part of the brain that says, in the barely audible whisper of something too good to be true, "This wont be just another MSL".
That this wont be another one-race circus, delivering boring beatdowns into lackluster finals.
This wont be playing second fiddle to the (often deservedly) heavier hype of the OSL matchups.
This season, you should think to yourself, is going to be something special - with a winner who doesn't follow in the tradition of fOrGG, Mind, or Luxury, but in the hallowed footsteps of the true MSL greats like NaDa, Oov, and sAviOr.
In short, when it comes to the Nate MSL: You wont forget.
Now that's a bold claim, and laying the whole thing on gut instinct isn't a very solid foundation, so let's examine the latest MSL news to get a clearer picture of just why our coverage team is so excited for these games to begin.
Maps
From left to right: Match Point, Odd-Eye, Ultimatum, Fighting Spirit
This is one of the most exciting map pools for a tournament in a long time. Bringing in arguably the best two proleague maps at the moment, Match Point and Fighting Spirit, and replacing the crimes against humanity that were Carthage and Byzantium with the all-new MSL-exclusives, Odd-Eye and Ultimatum, the organizers behind the MSL have finally decided to take a serious stance against the balance issues that have been plaguing individual leagues as of late.
Are there problems? Yes, of course. In their mad rush to never have to say the words "Kwanro" and "Finals" in the same sentence ever again, the MSL organizers have done perhaps a little bit too much to weaken the Swarm. To put it simply: these maps, as far as can be seen, are not Zerg friendly. Most alarming are Match Point and Fighting Spirit, which have a combined 8-0 record in TvZ - bringing the ghost of Tiamat to mind, better known as one third of the deadly Arena trio that basically handed fOrGG an MSL gold.
Combine that with what seem to be Terran-friendly features on the new maps (though, as always, what a map seems to favor and what it actually does favor are often different) and we could have the opportunity for Humans to win their first starleague title in over a year (Not counting GOM S3, where Flash did snag the trophy) - or at the very least, start knocking out the weak Zergs en masse, creating some breathing room for Protoss players and increasingly the likelihood that we will see a varied mixture of races going forward.
As exciting as a major upset may be for the spectators and fans, it has to noted that there are two kinds of upsets that appear similiar, but are actually extremely different in the quality of entertainment they produce. The first kind, as when a written-off July came back to win an OSL against the extrmely on fire new player BeSt, or when a kid named IPXZerg came out of nowhere with an exciting new style of play and starting tearing up leagues, are the good upsets becuase they have significance. The better player didnt just win, they won and continued to prove that they deserved that win (ala Bisu beating sAviOr in the MSL finals or Flash cheesing Bisu out of leagues).
The second kind of upsets are where an overall stronger player is knocked out because of a weak matchup, stupid mistake, poor build, or imbalanced map. Bisu losing to Shine in the OSL is a perfect example: yes, Shine played better in that series, but by barely scraping by 2-1 and eliminating the best Protoss in the world, he created a void of entertainment that he simply is not capable of filling and almost certainly created an easier road to the finals for someone else.
After FantaSy dropped out in the prelims to Stats, I was afraid we would be in for a tournament full of the latter type of upset, yet suprisingly he was the only top-tier player not to qualify for the Ro32. Bisu, Jaedong, Flash, Calm, Kal, Iris, Stork, Effort... they all made the cut, and this is honestly one of the biggest steps towards having a historic tournament, having players who play historic-quality games. Imagine the intensity of a Ro8 consisting entirely of people on the Power Rank. A Ro4? While there are surely more upsets to come (I for one dont foresee Kal making it past the Ro32), the sheer number of quality players who have made it this far means we have good odds of seeing some really epic series down the road. Perhaps an honest to god Grand Finals quality Jaedong/Bisu Bo5? Let's wait and see.
Preview Groups 1-3
The first two MSL groups begin in a few moments, with the third starting two days from now. Here are some last minute predictions of how they will go down:
Calm < Match Point > BeSt Light < Fighting Spirit > fOrGG < Ultimatum > < Ultimatum > < Odd-Eye >
This is an interesting group - there are two MSL champions here, one (Calm) is the clear favorite to win as he is the only concretely S-Class player among the four, though he has definitely stumbled lately - check out his OSL game against Fantasy where he looked seriously off of his A-game - and the other (fOrGG) is without a doubt the clear favorite to lose 0-2, as he simply is not in form to make a serious run at an individual leage or even, in my opinion, take off an upset game. That leaves a guess as to who will advance second. I'd love to say it will be BeSt, and if he plays as sharp as he did vs Flash in proleague, than I do in fact believe he will be moving on behind Calm, but I have a very strong feeling that Light with his never failing ability to play solid (not great, not bad) will simply cruise past the roller coaster Best, who rockets beween good and bad on a daily basis.
Ugh, I hope Hwasin makes it through here because none of the other three are even close to in form enough to make a run in this MSL. Yes, even you Kwanro - no matter how far you got in the last one. Shine at least is a promising rookie who has already accumulated a high profile win over Bisu and a solid win rate in all matchups, so I predict him to either advance 2-0 or 2-1 depending on how he does vs. Hwasin (who - despite a loss to Zero yesterday in the OSL, looked extremely solid).
Iris < Ultimatum > Saint hyvaa < Odd-Eye > Flash Winners < Match Point > Losers < Match Point > Final < Fighting Spirit >
I dont know enough about how Iris is playing lately to give a 100% concrete judgement that he will cruise past Saint and Hyvaa, but I will give him the benefit of the doubt in these predictions because he has proven time and time again for years that he can play world class TvZ when he wants to. If I had to pick a possible zerg to take his place, it would be Hyvaa, because Saint is awful. You might notice i'm not even mentioning the fourth person in the group; there simply is no reason to. Flash is playing at another level lately and nobody in this group is a true threat to him or his amazing streaks in both TvZ and TvT at this point.
That's it for this MSL update; we hope you are as excited as we are for the real NATE MSL to get underway and share our hope that it will be one of the best in a long time. Stay tuned next week for recaps of groups A,B, and C and previews of D,E, and F!
Why does everyone say that the only reason ForGG won his MSL was because of the maps? Does anyone even remember that series? I know it's nitpicky because that's not the focus of the article... but ForGG played way better than JD in Arena. :O. Tiamat the huge exception of course..
Anyways, I agree with this article I feel like this is going to be a special MSL. Liked the article alot.
Thx a lot very intressting to read, though I found the article a bit too negative (forGG and Kwanro bashing etc..): do you want the MSL to run on a script? Introducing bad maps for Z just because they are playing a lot better than other races now isn't a good way of making a tournament. Why don't just give the trophy right away to the popular Protoss star...
On November 26 2009 19:02 Ragnorak wrote: Is it possible to remove the OSL spoilers (Zero vs Hwasin)? I know its only a single game, but I was looking forward to watching that.
You should expect spoilers in news posts. That's why it's news.
i haven't been paying attention to PL in 2 years...can someone plz fill me in...are zerg dominanting atm? Is it to do with map pool or advances in play style?
On November 26 2009 19:02 Ragnorak wrote: Is it possible to remove the OSL spoilers (Zero vs Hwasin)? I know its only a single game, but I was looking forward to watching that.
You should expect spoilers in news posts. That's why it's news.
On November 26 2009 21:45 Mischy wrote: i haven't been paying attention to PL in 2 years...can someone plz fill me in...are zerg dominanting atm? Is it to do with map pool or advances in play style?
In PL it's hard to say if any one race is dominating; the end of last season saw lots of Zergs due to very friendly maps *coughGod'sGardencough*.
At the moment Flash is the only rock solid player (and even his TvP is shaky): the other top players are fairly evenly distributed: Bisu and Stork, Jaedong and EffOrt, Leta and fantasy - if anything, Terran is probably on top again, as good Terrans (Ruby, Light, Really) seem to be mostly cruising, but current PvT is also brutally efficient. Maps or style, not sure which.
On November 26 2009 21:45 Mischy wrote: i haven't been paying attention to PL in 2 years...can someone plz fill me in...are zerg dominanting atm? Is it to do with map pool or advances in play style?
Zerg has been doing well, and Terrans are doing okay. Protoss has been struggling, there are far fewer Protoss appearances in Proleague (37 TvTs, 21 PvPs and 42 ZvZs to date for example; 98 total Protoss appearances in games played, 134 Terran appearances, and 156 Zerg appearances).
In the OSL Ro16, there are 4 Protoss, 4 Terran and 8 Zerg; In the MSL Ro32, there are 8 Protoss, 8 Terran and 16 Zerg. Zergs are currently at 58% winrate vs. Protoss in Proleague, which is favorable to Zerg, but not as much as the preseason map testing led to believe.
My personal explanation? There is some Z>P bias in the ZvP matchup; Zerg players are doing better, overall, than Protoss players because of it, and since Zerg players are having a better overall performance, more of them get into Starleagues and they are fielded more often by their coaches in Proleague.
Oh wow, did they change Group C's MSL with E's because Flash has to play vs Hite that day? That'd be a shockingly good bit of news by tournament organizers/kespa to stop from overscheduling already overworked players like Jaedong and Flash who have duties in all three leagues.
On November 27 2009 00:39 TwoToneTerran wrote: Oh wow, did they change Group C's MSL with E's because Flash has to play vs Hite that day? That'd be a shockingly good bit of news by tournament organizers/kespa to stop from overscheduling already overworked players like Jaedong and Flash who have duties in all three leagues.
didn't even think about that, oh if that could just be possible :o
Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So his bio win against Jaedong on Outsider and other similar games are all a joke right, and he's actually not that good.
On November 27 2009 03:39 MuffinDude wrote: iris is terrible, i put him in my fpl and he hasn't gotten me shit, hyvaa will be able to take him right now.
Yeah Iris doesn't deserve to be classified as a "top tier" player with Flash, Jaedong, et al. Hes done absolutely nothing this season.
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So his bio win against Jaedong on Outsider and other similar games are all a joke right, and he's actually not that good.
I place Fantasy in the group of big names. Not bad, but NOT ON JAEDONG OR EFFORT'S LEVEL. Just another guy who can beat up the bad players, lose all important games to the best players, and go about even with every other glorified okay player. Maybe I'm being harsh when I say okay, because okay to me means they never make any stupid mistakes (which would make games boring to watch, but it really hard to do none the less). It's been a year since Fantasy has gotten a medal (both silvers), and in StarCraft time that's enough to say he's not a force in the scene.
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So his bio win against Jaedong on Outsider and other similar games are all a joke right, and he's actually not that good.
I place Fantasy in the group of big names. Not bad, but NOT ON JAEDONG OR EFFORT'S LEVEL. Just another guy who can beat up the bad players, lose all important games to the best players, and go about even with every other glorified okay player. Maybe I'm being harsh when I say okay, because okay to me means they never make any stupid mistakes (which would make games boring to watch, but it really hard to do none the less). It's been a year since Fantasy has gotten a medal (both silvers), and in StarCraft time that's enough to say he's not a force in the scene.
Are you dumb? Effort has never gotten a medal, and yet you say he's up there with Jaedong.
On November 27 2009 00:39 TwoToneTerran wrote: Oh wow, did they change Group C's MSL with E's because Flash has to play vs Hite that day? That'd be a shockingly good bit of news by tournament organizers/kespa to stop from overscheduling already overworked players like Jaedong and Flash who have duties in all three leagues.
If that’s true, then I think they’ve made flash’s schedule even worse. Next week, he’ll have proleague against STX on Tuesday, stork on Wednesday, and msl on Thursday.. I’m a bit worried about that.
Counting Kespa sanctioned games, Fantasy is 6-7 vs, Jaedong, 2-2 vs. Flash, 3-2 vs. Bisu. Stork is 7-7 JD, 8-4 Flash, 9-9 Bisu,. while Effort is 1-5, 1-6, and 0-3. If this teaches us anything, Fantasy and Stork is more closer to S class than Effort and Effort's like Leta. All the wins come from lesser players. Can't be the best if you can't beat the best.
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So two 2nd place finishes and 1 semifinal in 3 consecutive OSL's is mediocre? so unbelievably biased its sickening. Fantasy is pretty mediocre sometimes in Proleague (still has about 60% winrate there overall and was top-10 in win differential last season) but he DOMINATES in the OSL. he is unarguably top-3 Terran and has been for a long time
On November 27 2009 07:36 lone_hydra wrote: Counting Kespa sanctioned games, Fantasy is 6-7 vs, Jaedong, 2-2 vs. Flash, 3-2 vs. Bisu. Stork is 7-7 JD, 8-4 Flash, 9-9 Bisu,. while Effort is 1-5, 1-6, and 0-3. If this teaches us anything, Fantasy and Stork is more closer to S class than Effort and Effort's like Leta. All the wins come from lesser players. Can't be the best if you can't beat the best.
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So his bio win against Jaedong on Outsider and other similar games are all a joke right, and he's actually not that good.
I place Fantasy in the group of big names. Not bad, but NOT ON JAEDONG OR EFFORT'S LEVEL. Just another guy who can beat up the bad players, lose all important games to the best players, and go about even with every other glorified okay player. Maybe I'm being harsh when I say okay, because okay to me means they never make any stupid mistakes (which would make games boring to watch, but it really hard to do none the less). It's been a year since Fantasy has gotten a medal (both silvers), and in StarCraft time that's enough to say he's not a force in the scene.
Are you dumb? Effort has never gotten a medal, and yet you say he's up there with Jaedong.
On November 27 2009 13:25 MageKirby wrote: If anyone, I want Best to win the MSL, just because of what happened in the Grouping Ceremony xD
enlighten?
Every zerg was like "I want BEST!" and he got picked multiple times. Until I was smacking my forehead and saying: "Don't waste your swap on Best. Some other zerg is just going to take him off you."
On November 27 2009 03:24 Chef wrote: Mildly amused by your classifying Fantasy as a top tier player. He was basically 'good' for one season when mech was really strong on the mappool, and then slipped back into complete mediocrity.
I see two good players (Jaedong, Effort), a couple players who are fun to watch (Movie, Kwanro, Kal, Iris) and A LOT of players who aren't very good right now, but I watch anyway because they have a big name (or are hyped a lot). And also Savior, who I can't categorize because I would like it even if he won doing 4pool every game.
I mean, thankfully there isn't anyone who's a total pansy, and is gonna lose because of a sunken break or something, but most of these players are mediocre. Flash is on a winning streak and has a chance to get back into form, but he hasn't beat anyone in particular (save Savior, but even I can tell you that's not a big deal).
So his bio win against Jaedong on Outsider and other similar games are all a joke right, and he's actually not that good.
I place Fantasy in the group of big names. Not bad, but NOT ON JAEDONG OR EFFORT'S LEVEL. Just another guy who can beat up the bad players, lose all important games to the best players, and go about even with every other glorified okay player. Maybe I'm being harsh when I say okay, because okay to me means they never make any stupid mistakes (which would make games boring to watch, but it really hard to do none the less). It's been a year since Fantasy has gotten a medal (both silvers), and in StarCraft time that's enough to say he's not a force in the scene.
Are you dumb? Effort has never gotten a medal, and yet you say he's up there with Jaedong.
waiting for chef's response to this
All: 93-48 (65.96%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): L W W W W L W W W L | View Games vT: 33-18 (64.71%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): L L W W L L W W W W | View Games vZ: 36-21 (63.16%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): W W W W W W L L W L | View Games vP: 24-9 (72.73%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): W W L W W W W W W W | View Games
lol... That's why. Effort is beating the players who matter right now. Fantasy is going no where.
I don't really like Effort. I don't know why, but I just haven't gotten attached to him. I want to like Fantasy, but look at who he's playing right now:
Who's he won against that's worth bragging about ? He has nice stats, but not against the best players... Effort does. Maybe Effort will slip into mediocrity too, but right now he's worth watching as a candidate for the next gold. He's been solid for a really long time, which is what a medalist needs to be. Fantasy didn't really have much competition for his silvers. A washed up Bisu who was never that good at PvT, a player named Luxury still trying to prove himself, then against the only opponents that had any substance to them at the time, Jaedong and Stork (stork who now is old news) he lost in 'close' series. Fantasy getting a silver in weak competition isn't worth much. It seems to me lots of players would do just as well if they had as lucky a draw as Fantasy. Fantasy just seems like another player who had a shot and didn't realise his potential. It's not like he lost to Jaedong and Stork and we felt 'oh, he really deserved that.' He deserved to lose to two superior players. Anyone betting on Fantasy in those games better have had odds.
''Just another guy who can beat up the bad players, lose all important games to the best players''.
That perfectly describes Effort. Effort is 1-5 (3-5 if we include GOM) against Jaedong, 1-6 against Flash and 0-3 against Bisu. How is that nice stats against the best players (which you claim he has)?
''It's been a year since Fantasy has gotten a medal (both silvers), and in StarCraft time that's enough to say he's not a force in the scene.''.
How can you use that as an argument to why Effort is a level better than Fantasy? Fantasy has reached 2 finals and 1 semifinal (and won PL for his team by beating the current bonjwa 2-0) whereas Effort has NEVER reached a semifinal.
All: 93-48 (65.96%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): L W W W W L W W W L | View Games vT: 33-18 (64.71%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): L L W W L L W W W W | View Games vZ: 36-21 (63.16%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): W W W W W W L L W L | View Games vP: 24-9 (72.73%) | Last 10 (old -> recent): W W L W W W W W W W | View Games
lol... That's why. Effort is beating the players who matter right now. Fantasy is going no where.
I don't really like Effort. I don't know why, but I just haven't gotten attached to him. I want to like Fantasy, but look at who he's playing right now:
Who's he won against that's worth bragging about ? He has nice stats, but not against the best players... Effort does. Maybe Effort will slip into mediocrity too, but right now he's worth watching as a candidate for the next gold. He's been solid for a really long time, which is what a medalist needs to be. Fantasy didn't really have much competition for his silvers. A washed up Bisu who was never that good at PvT, a player named Luxury still trying to prove himself, then against the only opponents that had any substance to them at the time, Jaedong and Stork (stork who now is old news) he lost in 'close' series. Fantasy getting a silver in weak competition isn't worth much. It seems to me lots of players would do just as well if they had as lucky a draw as Fantasy. Fantasy just seems like another player who had a shot and didn't realise his potential. It's not like he lost to Jaedong and Stork and we felt 'oh, he really deserved that.' He deserved to lose to two superior players. Anyone betting on Fantasy in those games better have had odds.
In Ever 2009, he was knocked out by Jaedong who was at his peak.
In Batoo, he had to go up against Jaedong, Bisu, Luxury (who was playing rather well at the time), and Leta (who was also playing well at that time).
Though his Incruit run had a much softer line-up, he had to face Stork, the best PvTer of all time in the finals.
Very few players in history have gotten so far in 3 OSLs in a row.
Your other points: Bisu has played the best he's ever played this year than over his entire career. He's 91 wins - 36 losses (71.65%) since January 1st, 2009. That's definitely NOT washed up.
Have you been watching PL this season? Stork is on fire. Sure he dropped 2 games last night, but 1 was to Sea who's been making a comeback of sorts, and the other was to a zerg, Hyun (ZvP has always been Stork's weakest matchup).
EPT![[image loading]](http://i45.tinypic.com/10h3sso.png)
![[image loading]](http://i47.tinypic.com/2rxcf0m.png)
![[image loading]](http://i50.tinypic.com/1olhef.png)
![[image loading]](http://i49.tinypic.com/30mlc9i.png)
Calm, 
BeSt, 
Light, ![[image loading]](http://i47.tinypic.com/orl3mb.png)
![[image loading]](http://i46.tinypic.com/nybcxe.png)
![[image loading]](http://i45.tinypic.com/a2ae4o.png)
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