EPTWinter Warfare Mafia - Page 8
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
I don't think I'd waste my time on making a trfel filter dive to that extent to come out with an "I dunno" and then immediately vote him after as mafia, it doesn't really make sense, I know basic "mafia" post styles and I just don't care about how I look in posts like that when I'm town and it'd be far more riddled with intention to get trfel lynched. I'm just trying to clear people from being mafia. I also stand by the fact I think the chezinu lynch was shit. Don't really care if he was confirmed mafia (and I said as much). I think lynching someone else for better information and stance taking would have been way more effective. You entered the thread just yelling that I was mafia again, voted for chezinu who was already an extremely runaway and deadset wagon and then didn't have the guts to vote me even though youv'e been sure I'm mafia for the entire game and haven't ever changed your tune. That's extremely bad play. I also think you just By the way, your third quite in your "case" about me is also poor reading comprehension on your part. This is in fact a town read post on Trfel. I'm just saying I don't think I agree with his points on you but I think the point of view he presented was an acceptable train of thought. This feels like a new low for you. Honestly just not impressed and think you're mafia trying to throw anything you can to make your point of view stick but I'm trying extremely hard to be charitable with that take. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 15 2023 03:01 Rels wrote: Day Two Vote Count sandroba (4): marvellosity, Koshi, Palmar, Chezinu (4): Trfel, Alakaslam, sandroba, raynpelikoneet Trfel (1): die_meatbaby (0): Palmar (0): Not Voting (1):die_meatbaby With 4 votes, sandroba is currently set to be lynched! The deadline is Friday, Dec 15 3:00am GMT (GMT+00:00), which is in Slight take back. It wasn't a dead set lynch but it very much felt like it was at the time so now I'm a bit conflicted. Will read back. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 15 2023 23:41 Holyflare wrote: Slight take back. It wasn't a dead set lynch but it very much felt like it was at the time so now I'm a bit conflicted. Will read back. I re-take this back, rayn's vote looks absolutely awful, especially considering the posts around it. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 03:31 raynpelikoneet wrote: Holyflare's fliter is very meek throughout the whole game. There is no posts that raise eyebrows into any direction. Then at the same time he claims he is busy and that's why he is not playing up to standards or whatever, you know what i mean, and then he claims also that if he was mafia he would not make those wishy-washy posts because he could do better. It doesn't make sense, if he has no time to play better (as town or as mafia), why would he play better as mafia? Not what I said. I said I know words, phrases and posting styles that are traditionally mafia oriented. If I were not really invested mafia trying to not get too much attention I wouldn't end a big post in a conclusion that ended up almost 50/50 with a town lean because that is obviously a waste of my precious time I'd have to influence the thread or steer it in a direction. You should know what my game style is as mafia and it's most certainly not whatever you're pretending to think it is now. What influence have I had to inject in this game that I needed to? I just have a good time chatting through things with people and point things out occasionally and that's all that's been required of me. You can see the thought processes behind what I'm writing as clear as day. Did you look into why I decided to make a post about trfel? No. Your case is so surface level it's insane. You're not paying attention to my motivations and that's extremely uncharacteristic and uncharitable and I think you're just trying to hammer home any point you can for the sake of it. Think about it from my point of view of sandroba progression, admitting that sandroba is starting to look a lot better, acknowledging points sandro made about trfel finally and reading back DPs filter to determine what he thought because he was also trfel focused. Want to get to the bottom of trfel because he's a key slot that needs solving and coming out with what I said. If you read Trfel's filter what would your conclusion be? If you read through my post what points did I specifically raise that you think should have swayed me further? You look at one line out of hundreds and incorrectly summarise the thought I put in throughout and try and whittle it down to nothingness. That's not town rayn imo. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 03:36 raynpelikoneet wrote: Also if i accuse of town HF of something, he tries to reason with me, at least up to some point. Here he has not done any of that (while my argument was at least reasonable, regardless of if it makes him mafia or not). And that's why because noone understood my argument (i still don't know why), he had perfect chance to just call me boring, stupid and all time low, and i don't remember what other names -- i.e. just attack my credibility instead of trying to talk to me (even when he didn't believe i am mafia). I don't understand why town!Holyflare thinks not reasoning with town!rayn should have a "good" outcome in any case. I can understand why defaulting into ad hom against town!rayn should result in good outcome for mafia!Holyflare. I explained my whole thought process, we had a back and forth about it talking normally and you then ignored everything I had to say after and asked other people about it who said the same things I did and then have just said I'm mafia the entire game while reading almost nothing I wrote or interacting with me (your mafia read!). It seems like you don't actually care about being correct on me. I'm just labelled as something and pushed off to the side. You don't try and look for instances that you were maybe wrong about me, you're not playing constructively, you are destructive. Look at Koshi telling you about my chezinu points and posts (you ignored), look at slam saying the same thing (you ignored). What exactly do I work with here if you don't care? | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 04:06 raynpelikoneet wrote: Your "thought process" on my original case was exactly this This is not an answer to what i said. Or if it is, it's a bad one. After that you started deflecting from the subject. I don't think this is true but if it is it's because I know there's literally nothing to say to you at that point that would make you think otherwise because it's impossible to work with you when you've drawn a conclusion as either alignment. There was literally no avenue where you offered an explanation for me being town (the correct decision) and instead you just shut down my correct line of thought and never interacted with me again. Which is particularly why I think you are mafia, you have never bothered once to show to people after that interaction what other things I have done that are mafia-like, you haven't questioned whether you've been wrong and you most certainly haven't appeared in the thread to ever evaluate anything you've thought about me. We can see that because it's literally the first time you've apparently opened my filter just now to try and point out things to people. Even after I've pointed out one of the three wishy-washy posts wasn't actually wishy washy, it was a town read on trfel you haven't admitted you were wrong or backed down in the slightest. Your inability to re-evaluate is IMO a definitive mafia trait of yours. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
My thought process about the day can be surmised into: Sandro is probably mafia Palmar announced he has mason, I say he should mason sandro (no incentive to promote this if sandro is town) I spend some time looking at the game state from the perspective that sandro is mafia and notice that chez isn't really being mentioned by anyone in the game when mafia generally love bringing him up as an option if he's town or even just town mentioning about him but nobody is doing that so game state wise he's probably mafia so I check out his filter. I notice the character break specifically when he's talking about sandro which kind of doubles down my perspective about their association ~lots of irl work in between~ palmar posts the logs and I don't think they're particularly great sandro counters all that and starts flinging stuff out about his reads and palmar and whatever. This whole situation makes me think Palmar is mafia tbh, although I'm not invested enough to care about pushing it and it's just easier to say nothing and wait for my chance. I think sandro looks better regardless so I start entertaining his world that trfel is mafia. I also went to read back a bit of the night posts about what DP was saying (the stuff about DP sleeping etc, which I still think DP's pushes were really uncharitable to trfel). Trfel's filter doesn't really give me much in terms of conclusion. I still think there's an off chance he could have been mafia but I still think it's a coin flip and even after everything now still think it's possibly a coin flip, although I didn't pay much attention to people's stances around chez or yesterday's wagon at all. I dunno really what happens after this I wasn't really around much. I just know that the game state indicates chezinu is mafia and I don't want people to forget that (my 100% mafia post) and then slam kinda rolls with it. I think chez is an awful lynch, don't really care if he's mafia or not he will still be mafia in X days when we can lynch him anyway and a wagon on someone else would have been more useful. I don't really care enough to put in the energy to derail to something else because it's a lot of hassle (and I'd rather chill not in the game) to push onto someone like you and palmar and chez is a shrug ok fine lynch. You make some bad posts about me again and don't acknowledge what people are saying and you vote chezinu while sentiment is obviously pointing there after saying I am probably mafia. I don't think it's a good look for you, you didn't seem to evaluate anything and I don't think a town you ever votes there. Looks a lot like a bus vote. I try and bait you into voting me and you don't which solidfies that imo you were just trying to get credit and you don't actually think I'm mafia. Here we are. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 04:58 sandroba wrote: HF main points for being mafia for me are: - trying to bury me while it seemed like I would be a viable lynch - Arguing against the Chezinu lynch even though he thought he was 99% mafia due to "no info" bullshit - Not really trying to get anyone lynched d2 pretty much just following palmar marv koshi Points for being town: - He seems to be trying to put in time to investigate stuff, that Trfel analysis looks genuine to me - He gives off a vibe of self-assured innocence that comes off in his posts. - Flat out calling Chezinu 99% mafia and refusing to vote for him is very balsy for mafia I stand by still thinking you were mafia. I think you only became "findable" after the palmar situation and even then I'm still hesitant about it because I don't like your directioning/positioning with what you're saying currently or what you were saying just after the chez stuff. In my mind you should be tripling down on palmar and trfel but you're doing some weird thing where you're keeping me at arm's reach still and not really comitting to trying to find me or investigating any of my stances or mindset. I didn't argue against the chez lynch to any meaningful extent other than one post saying I think it was shit and I will triple down and still say I think it was a shit choice even if I knew he was very likely to be mafia. I don't advocate for the stance of always getting mafia being good, I think even a lynch on a townie that people had taken stances on would have just been as good, perhaps better. Although he was the rber so more fortuitous for us in the long run. I believe information and forcing people to do things that is uncharacteristic for them or puts them in positions they don't want to be in is a much better situation. I'm not that invested in this game to care what happens if the direction is fine with what I'm thinking at the time. If the direction goes wayward I'll interject with some of my own work (see the trfel stuff when I thought you were looking a bit better) but if I don't have to be in the game I'll try not to be. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 04:41 raynpelikoneet wrote: Here is timeline: ------(1)------------(2)-----> at (1) rayn questions sandroba at (2) Palmar makes his first post Holyflare, you voted for me after that. You were asked for your reasoning. You said one of the reasons was my town read on Palmar. Now this makes it clear you have read until (2). We discuss this further, and it becomes apparent you have not processed anything i have written properly enough to even realise i am at point (1) questioning (with my only relevant post in the game atm) your scumread sandroba. I call you out saying you cannot have thought about my posts properly, because you haven't even read me questioning your scumread sandroba (backed up by your own words). To which you answer "oh i just wanted to get a vote down" and some other shit. But this doesn't make any sense because you already had made a thought process on voting rayn, which you disclosed before. I understand i am not very good at english or not very good at explaining my shit, but this doesn't make any sense. None of the answers make any sense with what actually happened, and what actually should have been the thought process if anything was true. It's annoying people can't even understand this. I did not think about your posts properly, we are in agreement here. I was not that invested in the outcome of my vote as you seem to think I was. I thought your posts looked mediocre, I missed your question to sandroba (although I still think it's irrelevant to the points I made about you) and I thought what I was saying about you made sense enough to me to outline it in an entry post explaining my thoughts. 1) existing or not existing is only relevant to one of the very last sentences I wrote and that you bolded and nothing more in the 30 or so lines in that case. If you remove the word question from my post, does what I say about you disappear? The answer is no, and thus the fact you keep talking about 1) mattering to the situation is what is very confusing. I understand the english part and that's why I'm trying my best to avoid talking about this because to me what I am saying is very obviously explainable and I feel like I did a good job of explaining what I meant with it and why what you're saying isn't really relevant because even if I was mafia, I simply have no need to lie or fluff up my post with this questioning bit. The simple thing is the word question is irrelevant and you can replace it with "push" or nothing and the sentiment of my post remains. I am town. That's it. Nothing more. If you are town we can try and work past this game and just go after Palmar or something easy because I think he looks a bit silted atm. So even if you think I'm mafia and I think you're mafia we can probably find a mutual ground here and look into him. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 05:25 raynpelikoneet wrote: Cool, then you understand maybe 35% of what i was doing D2, and i think i succeeded.  You think you were baiting me and I think I was baiting you :shrug: | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
On December 16 2023 05:32 raynpelikoneet wrote: See this is why i thought, and one one of the reasons i still think you're mafia. You voted for me, you claimed reasoning for your vote. You didn't read my posts properly. I didn't, and i don't believe you did that as town. Very well documented that I do in fact do this as town. | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
2) The problem i have here is that if youre telling the truth i would expect town!HF to get into discussion with me about it, that's what this is pretty much about. Since what i know from you, that's what you usually do. This is a quote from our last game we played together btw. You were mafia, I was town. So it's not like I would actually get into a discussion with you any more than I would there. Why are you saying I should have behaved differently? | ||
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Holyflare
United Kingdom30774 Posts
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