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Trying to find out where I am at in the game, these are my very loose positions as of right now.
Green:
Marv, Rayn, DP, Vivax, Slam, LS
Green Brown:
Chez, MZ
Red Brown:
TTT, Copcake,
Red:
Vayoletta,
Somehow I feel like there might be a Mafia in the green group but I don't know who that would be at this point.
I really am not sure why there would be no mafia on my wagon day 1 and Vivax, LS and DMB are all town, so even though CC is looking better to me, how likely that 4 townies are on my wagon and mafia don't jump on?
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On June 13 2023 08:56 TankTopTiger wrote:
DP you've seen me explain in werewolf games to newer players why lynching suspects is actually required to win.
Yeh and vayoletta was a suspect.
But we could just be getting snagged here, and I won't consider this as a reason to lynch you unless vayoletta flips red.
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On June 13 2023 09:07 TankTopTiger wrote:
What made Vayoletta a suspect pre-flip?
Can you spell out your reasoning for why it wasn't a policy lynch?
I already posted it. But basically in the two posts she made she was alluding to having reads while posting absolutely nothing.
Also if you are town you are probably undervaluing town reads and not lynching into them.
The thing that struck me was your hard no to a Vayo lynch, when there were very few good options, and your lack of urgency in finding an alternative to an increasingly obvious mislynch.
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On June 11 2023 10:42 TankTopTiger wrote:
Not gonna lie, having good town activity does actually make policy more appealing. But no I value the early information over it. If we policy, we're only getting the info mafia want us to have.
I am open to lynches on DMB, CC, and LS. Possibly Slam or Vivax too but unless someone makes a banger case in the next 10 minutes I'd have no conviction for it.
What did you mean by this TTT?
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On June 13 2023 09:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 09:05 DarthPunk wrote:On June 13 2023 08:56 TankTopTiger wrote:
DP you've seen me explain in werewolf games to newer players why lynching suspects is actually required to win. Yeh and vayoletta was a suspect. But we could just be getting snagged here, and I won't consider this as a reason to lynch you unless vayoletta flips red. Arguing about this is useless. It was perfectly clear TTT considered Vayoletta / marv policy lynches and didn't want to policy lynch. Regardless of if YOU think they were policy lynches or not, he thought so. It doesn't make him anything.
Disagree, if TTT is scum with vayoletta, he would absolutely position himself against policy lynches to protect them getting flipped day one.
That is exactly the kind of play I would expect from him.
But its associative so not that important right now.
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On June 13 2023 09:42 TankTopTiger wrote:
Mmmm I think in my first games I might have been pro-policy lynching because I didn't understand the reasons it was bad. Not sure if those are under spaghetticus or no.
DP you've seen me explain this stuff as town much more recently in werewolf in A52.
if I recall correctly that was around no-lynching not policy lynching. Policy lynching isn't a thing in IRL mafia, because everyone is right there.
You can see why i View this is a weird position to take right?
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On June 13 2023 10:04 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Alright let’s start with the NK’d townie who I wanted to lynch the fuck out of today -_- AND YES I KNOW NK WIFOM IS A THING PREEMPTING EVEYRONE REMINDING ME Spoiler for readability, here are Hapa's reads: + Show Spoiler +Hapa is green on slam: HereDoesn’t like me: HereReally doesn’t like me (he quotes my first post twice in two hours): HereThinks Cake/DP is TownVTown maybe: HereLS is wishy washy town: HereRed on me and Chez: HereWaffling on me: HereGreen on Slam, Rayn, Vivax, LS: HereDoesn’t want to lynch DP: HereDoesn’t want to lynch CopCake: HereTorn on me: HereThinks DMB is a mislynch: HereUnknown on Chez, Marv, and Vayoletta: HereRed on TTT: Here+1’s the idea of a Vayoletta lynch: HereNot happy with a DP lynch: HereSettles on a DMB lynch HereFinal vote for me: HereBoth Hapa and I then make it clear we’re going to go after each other tomorrow. I was honestly floored he got NK’d. I was absolutely going to go after him for the DMB vote and the flipflop about vayoletta. I know I don’t have much thread presence but now that he’s flipped town it seems like it would have been a better scum play to let the two of us go after each other. So why did they kill him? I can think of three reasons: a) They wanted to frame me because he was the loudest voice calling me scum in the thread. I find this unlikely because nobody has really come out of the woods to push for my lynch today which honestly surprised me a bit b) They were blue hunting. Hapa didn’t have a super long filter but was clearly engaged with the game. Maybe scum thought he was blue trying not to draw attention to themselves. This is certainly a possibility. c) He had the scum team nailed. His scum list is me, TTT, Chez, and maybe Vayoletta. Now I know I’m town, so let’s see how many other people are calling the others scum. Just going to focus on Chez for now. a. Slam indirectly calls out Chez and says he’s sheeping Hapa b. Rayn votes for chez but unvoted well before the lynch and has since buddied him a bit c. I townread chez for a meta guess about chatGPT d. Not going to check DMB since she was dead e. Marv has one post saying he has no idea about chez’s alignment f. Vivax repeatedly calls chez unreadable and enigmatic and has buddied him a lot g. DarthPunk has Chez in his Green/Brown category h. Not gonna look through Chez about himself lol i. TTT says chez is cryptic/trolling/not playing the game j. Vayoletta has Chez listed as a PoE suspect k. CopCake simply says “chezinu… is chezinu” l. Hapa called Chez out multiple times m. LS says that Chez wasting his vote on Rayn is pretty bad Ok I have to be honest that took longer than I was expecting and I’m very surprised how few people have actually called out Chez. I wasn’t sure what I was going to find reading everyone’s filter to get their reads on him but I certainly wasn’t expecting Hapa to be the only person to directly call him out as scummy. LS is ironically the only other person who comes close (aside from Rayn's early vote). I’m going to post this now and start looking at how everyone has been reading TTT. I know a lot more people have at one point or another called him scum so I’m not expecting to learn as much. Bottom line, if Hapa got killed for being right on one of his reads, I think there’s a decent chance it was Chez... I guess I need to reread Chez now too fml. If you feel I have somehow misrepresented your read of chez feel free to throw spears and correct me.
Do you really think they were blue hunting with two blue roles outed already?
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On June 13 2023 10:19 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 10:14 DarthPunk wrote:On June 13 2023 10:04 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Alright let’s start with the NK’d townie who I wanted to lynch the fuck out of today -_- AND YES I KNOW NK WIFOM IS A THING PREEMPTING EVEYRONE REMINDING ME Spoiler for readability, here are Hapa's reads: + Show Spoiler +Hapa is green on slam: HereDoesn’t like me: HereReally doesn’t like me (he quotes my first post twice in two hours): HereThinks Cake/DP is TownVTown maybe: HereLS is wishy washy town: HereRed on me and Chez: HereWaffling on me: HereGreen on Slam, Rayn, Vivax, LS: HereDoesn’t want to lynch DP: HereDoesn’t want to lynch CopCake: HereTorn on me: HereThinks DMB is a mislynch: HereUnknown on Chez, Marv, and Vayoletta: HereRed on TTT: Here+1’s the idea of a Vayoletta lynch: HereNot happy with a DP lynch: HereSettles on a DMB lynch HereFinal vote for me: HereBoth Hapa and I then make it clear we’re going to go after each other tomorrow. I was honestly floored he got NK’d. I was absolutely going to go after him for the DMB vote and the flipflop about vayoletta. I know I don’t have much thread presence but now that he’s flipped town it seems like it would have been a better scum play to let the two of us go after each other. So why did they kill him? I can think of three reasons: a) They wanted to frame me because he was the loudest voice calling me scum in the thread. I find this unlikely because nobody has really come out of the woods to push for my lynch today which honestly surprised me a bit b) They were blue hunting. Hapa didn’t have a super long filter but was clearly engaged with the game. Maybe scum thought he was blue trying not to draw attention to themselves. This is certainly a possibility. c) He had the scum team nailed. His scum list is me, TTT, Chez, and maybe Vayoletta. Now I know I’m town, so let’s see how many other people are calling the others scum. Just going to focus on Chez for now. a. Slam indirectly calls out Chez and says he’s sheeping Hapa b. Rayn votes for chez but unvoted well before the lynch and has since buddied him a bit c. I townread chez for a meta guess about chatGPT d. Not going to check DMB since she was dead e. Marv has one post saying he has no idea about chez’s alignment f. Vivax repeatedly calls chez unreadable and enigmatic and has buddied him a lot g. DarthPunk has Chez in his Green/Brown category h. Not gonna look through Chez about himself lol i. TTT says chez is cryptic/trolling/not playing the game j. Vayoletta has Chez listed as a PoE suspect k. CopCake simply says “chezinu… is chezinu” l. Hapa called Chez out multiple times m. LS says that Chez wasting his vote on Rayn is pretty bad Ok I have to be honest that took longer than I was expecting and I’m very surprised how few people have actually called out Chez. I wasn’t sure what I was going to find reading everyone’s filter to get their reads on him but I certainly wasn’t expecting Hapa to be the only person to directly call him out as scummy. LS is ironically the only other person who comes close (aside from Rayn's early vote). I’m going to post this now and start looking at how everyone has been reading TTT. I know a lot more people have at one point or another called him scum so I’m not expecting to learn as much. Bottom line, if Hapa got killed for being right on one of his reads, I think there’s a decent chance it was Chez... I guess I need to reread Chez now too fml. If you feel I have somehow misrepresented your read of chez feel free to throw spears and correct me. Do you really think they were blue hunting with two blue roles outed already? I don't really think it's likely which is why I spent so much time looking at Hapa's reads. I can't discount it being a possibility though so I added it to the list of reasons.
I think you missed a reason, Hapa is a strong town player and would , become correct.
I don't place much stock into NK analysis because it is so easily manipulated by mafia.
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On June 13 2023 10:25 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 10:22 DarthPunk wrote:On June 13 2023 10:19 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:On June 13 2023 10:14 DarthPunk wrote:On June 13 2023 10:04 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Alright let’s start with the NK’d townie who I wanted to lynch the fuck out of today -_- AND YES I KNOW NK WIFOM IS A THING PREEMPTING EVEYRONE REMINDING ME Spoiler for readability, here are Hapa's reads: + Show Spoiler +Hapa is green on slam: HereDoesn’t like me: HereReally doesn’t like me (he quotes my first post twice in two hours): HereThinks Cake/DP is TownVTown maybe: HereLS is wishy washy town: HereRed on me and Chez: HereWaffling on me: HereGreen on Slam, Rayn, Vivax, LS: HereDoesn’t want to lynch DP: HereDoesn’t want to lynch CopCake: HereTorn on me: HereThinks DMB is a mislynch: HereUnknown on Chez, Marv, and Vayoletta: HereRed on TTT: Here+1’s the idea of a Vayoletta lynch: HereNot happy with a DP lynch: HereSettles on a DMB lynch HereFinal vote for me: HereBoth Hapa and I then make it clear we’re going to go after each other tomorrow. I was honestly floored he got NK’d. I was absolutely going to go after him for the DMB vote and the flipflop about vayoletta. I know I don’t have much thread presence but now that he’s flipped town it seems like it would have been a better scum play to let the two of us go after each other. So why did they kill him? I can think of three reasons: a) They wanted to frame me because he was the loudest voice calling me scum in the thread. I find this unlikely because nobody has really come out of the woods to push for my lynch today which honestly surprised me a bit b) They were blue hunting. Hapa didn’t have a super long filter but was clearly engaged with the game. Maybe scum thought he was blue trying not to draw attention to themselves. This is certainly a possibility. c) He had the scum team nailed. His scum list is me, TTT, Chez, and maybe Vayoletta. Now I know I’m town, so let’s see how many other people are calling the others scum. Just going to focus on Chez for now. a. Slam indirectly calls out Chez and says he’s sheeping Hapa b. Rayn votes for chez but unvoted well before the lynch and has since buddied him a bit c. I townread chez for a meta guess about chatGPT d. Not going to check DMB since she was dead e. Marv has one post saying he has no idea about chez’s alignment f. Vivax repeatedly calls chez unreadable and enigmatic and has buddied him a lot g. DarthPunk has Chez in his Green/Brown category h. Not gonna look through Chez about himself lol i. TTT says chez is cryptic/trolling/not playing the game j. Vayoletta has Chez listed as a PoE suspect k. CopCake simply says “chezinu… is chezinu” l. Hapa called Chez out multiple times m. LS says that Chez wasting his vote on Rayn is pretty bad Ok I have to be honest that took longer than I was expecting and I’m very surprised how few people have actually called out Chez. I wasn’t sure what I was going to find reading everyone’s filter to get their reads on him but I certainly wasn’t expecting Hapa to be the only person to directly call him out as scummy. LS is ironically the only other person who comes close (aside from Rayn's early vote). I’m going to post this now and start looking at how everyone has been reading TTT. I know a lot more people have at one point or another called him scum so I’m not expecting to learn as much. Bottom line, if Hapa got killed for being right on one of his reads, I think there’s a decent chance it was Chez... I guess I need to reread Chez now too fml. If you feel I have somehow misrepresented your read of chez feel free to throw spears and correct me. Do you really think they were blue hunting with two blue roles outed already? I don't really think it's likely which is why I spent so much time looking at Hapa's reads. I can't discount it being a possibility though so I added it to the list of reasons. I think you missed a reason, Hapa is a strong town player and would , become correct. I don't place much stock into NK analysis because it is so easily manipulated by mafia. That's true but you could say the same for people like Marv, Rayn, or Vivax. If scum was going to kill anyone on potential I'd have to imagine they'd need a reason to differentiate amongst the potentially strong town players in this game. I'm not going to sit here and say we should lynch Chez based on the NK but I do think it's worth looking back and what Hapa said.
Yeah absolutely worth doing it. I do it myself, I just don't place that much weight into it.
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Can anyone link me to the other site Vayoletta plays?
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On June 13 2023 10:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 10:38 DarthPunk wrote:
Can anyone link me to the other site Vayoletta plays? I don't know any. Only finnish site and games are like 5yrs old (and in finnish), i havent played with him elsewhere.
So no meta?
My partner is half Polish so the fact that Vayoletta ended in an A made me assume they were a girl.
Whoops.
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On June 13 2023 10:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:Pretty much no meta. I think i have played with him two or three games where i have been town (and followed one). Every game i have super mega epic scum read on him from the start and every game he is town. Definitely no meta, lol  Generally he is more active, but I don't think activity is alignment indicative for him. He strikes me as a person who wouldn't be "scared" to play as scum, while i have never seen him play scum. His handle is a variant from his original nick he uses when we play Terraforming Mars, he changes it as a joke based on what we talk in discord channel ^^
I love terraforming mars. Have you played ark nova? It reminds me of it some how.
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On June 13 2023 11:26 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 11:15 DarthPunk wrote:On June 13 2023 10:59 raynpelikoneet wrote:Pretty much no meta. I think i have played with him two or three games where i have been town (and followed one). Every game i have super mega epic scum read on him from the start and every game he is town. Definitely no meta, lol Generally he is more active, but I don't think activity is alignment indicative for him. He strikes me as a person who wouldn't be "scared" to play as scum, while i have never seen him play scum. His handle is a variant from his original nick he uses when we play Terraforming Mars, he changes it as a joke based on what we talk in discord channel ^^ I love terraforming mars. Have you played ark nova? It reminds me of it some how. Nope. One person in our group has it (irl-group) but we haven't had time to play it (we have combined ~300 different board games i think )
Awesome! I played twilight imperium for my birthday with 6 players. We spent 13 hours and didn’t get closed to finishing.
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Rayn who do you have in your lynch pool right now cause I can only really see TTT and maybe MZ.
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On June 13 2023 11:38 raynpelikoneet wrote:
My biggest fear is that both of you and marv are mafia. It's not impossible given how marv treats you <-> me. I don't understand how you are "more townie" than i am, since we have had basically same reads aside from Cake. You having been more "thread boss" shouldn't mean shit.
You actually just seem less townie than last game. I had basically the same read as Marv on this. Last game you put posted me but this game I am edging you out by pages.
I’m not saying you are mafia here but I can understand how you look less town than your usual standard.
Also marvs read on me is heavily derived from the eod stuff as is yours.
The paranoia makes me feel better about you though.
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I advocate a vig shot on chez btw. If we have one.
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Point 2 is sheeping my case on copcake. Actually his 'case' on cupcake was summarising my own thoughts rather than adding anything new.
That's probably the most compelling reason that he is mafia in my opinion.
and the inconsistencies in point 1 are pretty compelling.
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On June 13 2023 16:06 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 15:59 TankTopTiger wrote:
Aight. I think I'm a goner.
Even if I somehow make it out of this lynch, I don't think I'll live through the next one now that I'm pretty sure basically everyone is against me. I don't really want to spend the next 1-4 days fighting just to die anyway. I don't really blame people for being sus overall on me, I'm playing differently to last game for sure. But I am frustrated by the constant reading comprehension issues, the repeating the same questions, the ignoring my questions, the pedantry. You guys don't understand how I think, you didn't last game and you don't this game. That's fine but you seem to think you do??That's fine I guess it's just... Too much effort for me. I no longer have agency in the game, I'm not engaged, and I'm pretty bamboozled overall.
When I'm dead: I don't really have strong town reads. My read on Rayn was heavily based on some early interactions, and he hasn't really done much since then. It's stale and since everyone agreed he was town, I didn't really want more work on my plate filtering him when he was never going to be lynched.
DP I can never be sure because I haven't actually encountered his scum play in forum mafia and he speaks very highly of himself in this regard. He seems more agentic than last game where he was town (I don't see how Rayn think's he's current town boss compared to DP, Rayn afked the lynch and hasn't really done much more than perpetuate D1 convoes). I don't like how DP thinks I would go for policy lynches. In no game we have ever played together have I been the type of player to value points on the board over game state. DP, you realise what you're expecting me to want to do is bolt face turn 1 in an FFA right? Right?! I don't really see this as something he could possibly expect from me. I always play for control first every single time.
MZ seems townish but has difficulty understanding other points of view. If someone disagrees with him they're stupid dumdum. He felt this way last game too. MZ, you don't understand what I'm saying, and you're super motivated to twist it into contradiction.
Town is about to be 6-3. I stand by my read on CC, it's the best case. When you see I'm town, also make Vayo answer the question regarding their baseless reads. I'm also suspicious of Marv because he just doesn't seem active enough now he's free. Any other strong town player can't keep themselves from engaging. DP has no time and yet somehow his filter is enormous. I don't know Marv well, but his actual content posts are minimal within a filter barely over two pages long. When I subbed in last game, I felt I had a lot more to say than Marv does now.
Slam is... less than last game. He's just doing less. I have no idea why people have strong ideas about him... actually that's a recurring issue with you lot, you've normalised baseless reads.
Good luck town whoever tf you are <3 Although this is early to throw in the towel
Although this is based on meta. I’m pretty sure he is more likely to be town based on this post.
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On June 13 2023 16:11 Alakaslam wrote:
It really is true that TTT was a bit obtuse at times last game, usefully enough to keep them around in fact.
Generally very clear headed though, not sure I want to lose that . Though we may have already
I don’t think he is the lynch. I’d like to flip vayoletta or Copcake.
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On June 13 2023 16:13 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2023 16:06 marvellosity wrote:On June 13 2023 15:59 TankTopTiger wrote:
Aight. I think I'm a goner.
Even if I somehow make it out of this lynch, I don't think I'll live through the next one now that I'm pretty sure basically everyone is against me. I don't really want to spend the next 1-4 days fighting just to die anyway. I don't really blame people for being sus overall on me, I'm playing differently to last game for sure. But I am frustrated by the constant reading comprehension issues, the repeating the same questions, the ignoring my questions, the pedantry. You guys don't understand how I think, you didn't last game and you don't this game. That's fine but you seem to think you do??That's fine I guess it's just... Too much effort for me. I no longer have agency in the game, I'm not engaged, and I'm pretty bamboozled overall.
When I'm dead: I don't really have strong town reads. My read on Rayn was heavily based on some early interactions, and he hasn't really done much since then. It's stale and since everyone agreed he was town, I didn't really want more work on my plate filtering him when he was never going to be lynched.
DP I can never be sure because I haven't actually encountered his scum play in forum mafia and he speaks very highly of himself in this regard. He seems more agentic than last game where he was town (I don't see how Rayn think's he's current town boss compared to DP, Rayn afked the lynch and hasn't really done much more than perpetuate D1 convoes). I don't like how DP thinks I would go for policy lynches. In no game we have ever played together have I been the type of player to value points on the board over game state. DP, you realise what you're expecting me to want to do is bolt face turn 1 in an FFA right? Right?! I don't really see this as something he could possibly expect from me. I always play for control first every single time.
MZ seems townish but has difficulty understanding other points of view. If someone disagrees with him they're stupid dumdum. He felt this way last game too. MZ, you don't understand what I'm saying, and you're super motivated to twist it into contradiction.
Town is about to be 6-3. I stand by my read on CC, it's the best case. When you see I'm town, also make Vayo answer the question regarding their baseless reads. I'm also suspicious of Marv because he just doesn't seem active enough now he's free. Any other strong town player can't keep themselves from engaging. DP has no time and yet somehow his filter is enormous. I don't know Marv well, but his actual content posts are minimal within a filter barely over two pages long. When I subbed in last game, I felt I had a lot more to say than Marv does now.
Slam is... less than last game. He's just doing less. I have no idea why people have strong ideas about him... actually that's a recurring issue with you lot, you've normalised baseless reads.
Good luck town whoever tf you are <3 Although this is early to throw in the towel Although this is based on meta. I’m pretty sure he is more likely to be town based on this post.
To expand on this the only reason I’m not basically clearing him by this post is the fact that he identified I’m sentimental on lynches and maybe he is super manipulating me to town read him in this spot.
But I would expect if he was mafia to argue and shit up the thread not just post reads and give up.
This guy is one of the most argumentative people I know. And he does that shit in irl mafia too.
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EPT
