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On September 05 2016 02:29 scott31337 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 04 2016 23:56 DanelerH wrote:On September 04 2016 19:33 scott31337 wrote:DanelerH These are your current reads that you have posted. You believe Palmar is mafia, is that correct? On September 03 2016 22:41 DanelerH wrote:
After looking through Trfel's filter, I don't see anything that points to xem being Mafia. As such, I'm going to place xem under Town. Here is my current list:
Town:
Holyflare
Vivax
Geript
Koshi
Trfel
Mafia:
Tictock
Scott
Palmar
Out of the ones listed under Mafia, I think we should lynch either Scott or Palmar. And this from Palmar. On September 03 2016 00:03 Palmar wrote:
I am not mafia, no idea why people still think that's really an option.
I don't have the energy to argue against the train of stupidity that's coming after me. so instead I'll just share what I think is relevant in this game and you guys can then either listen to me now, or you can listen to me later.
Koshi: Almost definitely town. He is, in his own bad way, trying to get the game solved. Also, it's literally his town meta to think I'm mafia and be wrong about it. He's also not just tunneling one thing (for example he's not just tunneling me, he's actually doing other stuff). I liked his case on TW at the time on day 1, although I don't really think TW is mafia but I might be wrong on that. He also gets a massive towncredit for pointing out geript's inconsistency during day 1.
Vivax: Essentially the same as Koshi, effort and stubbornness rating is through the roof compared to what I'd expect of mafia Vivax. He's also being a paranoid baddie which is something he excels at. He has also pointed out inconsistencies (specifically one by geript, I think) that was really good.
Trfel: To me, he's been completely under the radar this game. I might try to open his filter and read it before the evening, but so far I've essentially ignored most of his posts, which is often a good indication that someone is mafia (I tend to ignore mafia because their posts are usually bland and boring).
Scott: I liked one post by him on day 1 so weakest townread ever? I don't really know, another person I have less formed opinion on.
geript: Once again, he's almost lock mafia. His posting has been repeatedly proven to be out of touch with his own reality, and he's basically happy to sit back and let things happen.
Holyflare Another basically lock mafia. I'm almost more sure on him than geript. The main problem is that he barely cared during day 1, no matter how much he wants to make it look like he had a hand in the TW push. Then he came in late, helped with some shenanigans that to me made little sense (why didn't he try to shennie onto geript instead?). But even then he was light on actual content. Then during the night he starts hammering me for literally something he made up (trying to paint me bad for the Rels thing). there is 0% chance holyflare actually thinks what he says he's thinking. He's also quite a bit better at scumhunting than Koshi and Vivax and thus should know better than to think I'm mafia.
TW I don't know much about his posting today, but I sort of agreed with koshi's initial case, but he didn't sound like mafia when we were talking in the thread. So while I'm not gonna go overboard with it, I think he's more likely to be town.
Danieler No idea, not really read his filter much. I think I liked something he said, but I can't remember what or why. Like I don't have him in my mental "these people are scum" group.
Tictock Not really read up on him again. I basically gave him a townread when he posted the gif-reads on day 1 and I've not bothered with him since. Maybe it's time, but I think there's much higher mafia chance people. So tell me what is wrong with Palmar's post. This post specifically? It's odd that you want me to look at a specific post, but here: The main problem is that Palmar doesn't have an opinion on one person (Scott) and hasn't read the filters of three others (Trfel, DanelerH, Tictock). At that point in the game, that was nearly half the players. Another issue I have with the post is the Geript read. As I have already said, it doesn't make sense for Geript to be Mafia. Granted, this was before the Day 2 lynch, but Palmar's read on Geript hasn't changed. The last issue I have is giving Town-reads for ridiculous reasons. For Scott, it was because of liking a post on Day 1 (granted, Palmar admitted to this being a weak read and classified it as "no opinion"). For me, xe thinks xe liked something I said (but can't remember) and I'm "not in [xyr] mental 'these people are scum' group". For Tictock, it was because of liking the images for reads. It's pretty weird you skipped my other post as well. Please expand on ridiculous reasons please.
By "other post," I'm assuming you're referring to when you asked for my list. You already quoted it, so I saw no reason to respond with the same list twice. As for expanding on ridiculous reasons, I didn't see them as good reasons for Town-reads.
Scott: Liking one post barely got Scott a Town-read. It ended up being an "unformed opinion."
DanelerH: Liking one post, but not being able to remember it should land me in null. Not putting me in xyr "these people are scum" group is fine, but, in my opinion, should be a conclusion you come to after reading the filter (which Palmar did not do).
Tictock: Liking the images for reads. Do I really need to explain this one?
On September 05 2016 02:29 scott31337 wrote:It's like this post from Vivax - Show nested quote +On September 01 2016 10:39 scott31337 wrote:On September 01 2016 09:43 Vivax wrote:On September 01 2016 09:32 Trfel wrote:
The thing I really don't like about Koshi, is why is he so confident about scott31337 being town?
I looked through Koshi's filter, and I didn't see any reasons that he gave that scott31337 is town. Koshi said that he built a town case on scott31337, so I missed it (please link?), but I'm not seeing anything.
I also saw where Koshi said that he doesn't think that scott31337 is mafia but he really could be. Since then, scott31337 has not done anything worth townreading him for (in my opinion anyway), but Koshi's become far more confident in scott31337 being town, for seemingly no reason. If anything, the vote count analysis makes scott31337 look scummier IMO, not townier.
So this really confuses me. You're just the hero I deserved. The shitty part about this game is that if you start making inquiries about people who suspect you, they start calling you a discreditor or dismiss all you write as omgus (disfo being the best example). I even admit to suspecting people who throw scum at me almost instinctively, which is why my play is the weakest when a lot of people suspect me. It just creates too many distractions for me to handle. Sure I could just not give a fuck and do it anyway but I've learned that it mostly hurts my already not very popular opinions. So while I do my scott thing you do this Koshi thing and we're gucci. Hope you enjoyed this post of self-awareness. Scum surely can learn something from it when it comes to tilting me. This post has townie feels or you just changed your "meta" so much that I've read before, fuck it man. I'm going back to watching Trump's speech though in my home town. ##Unvote This is just so from a town mindset I finally figured out he was just tunneled town - It was just one post. Do you think that was ridiculous too?
Yes, especially since it had nothing to do with this game.
On September 05 2016 02:29 scott31337 wrote:
Your reads seem quite opposite from Palmar and I and others.
I'll ask again -
I want to know who you think are the three mafia.
Answered above.
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TT and Dane trying to play at mylo after being mostly afk. I'm 100% sure neither of them are scum.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
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It's completely sarcasm. It's just one of those things I've always noticed... that afk scum play more as the game ends not less. IDK which of those two I'm voting for but probably dane.
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I think I'm probably going to vote for Scott.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
so can people please explain why we didn't lynch scott yesterday?
or your reasons for voting tw over him
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Because Palmar was the starting wagon, then it shifted to Tumblewood. It was never on Scott, except for one of Vivax's votes.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
Why were you comfortable just sheeping wagons? I was definitely on scott, vivax should have switched and hell even ticktock was.
If he's your scum read why didn't you hop on him back then? I was pretty much telling people to lynch him all day?
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Your lynch was also on Palmar. I was okay with the vote because Palmar was another person I was suspicious of. As for why I vote switched, the points on Tumblewood made sense and the vote on Palmar/Scott was clearly not going to happen.
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I just realized that I misread the Day 2 Lynch Count. Apparently there are two sections for votes on Scott for some reason.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
Ok, also we can't split our votes today, we actually need to consolidate otherwise we could just flat out lose to last minute switches. If you think trfel is actually mafia then convince me. I didn't think he really was at all and all his lists were pretty much identical to mine day 1 (hence why I never said anything about him).
I find it hard to reason that ticktock suddenly starts scum reading him after using trfel as an example to scum read me on day 2 for trfl's analytical approach vs my not doing anything approach. Suddenly trfl hasn't done anything and was instead wishy washy? I don't buy it.
I also absolutely hate all of Scott's reads (lets be real I'm talking about myself) which are entirely and purely associative based on an unflipped player (trfl), ticktock was also happy to just plonk his afk vote on scott yesterday and then fook off. Scott also just posted multiple vote counts with coloured names that lept to a really strange conclusion and suddenly ticktock is all aboard riding with him when he basically spent an entire cycle SCUM reading me for doing the same thing.
I think ticktock is very likely mafia since he's jumping on all of these opportune things and being incredibly inconsistent and writing all these narratives.
I'm gonna try and make a nice formatted post with evidence and quotes but you guys better play. I can't carry you forever, 100% dead if I get it right today.
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So, I hate to be that guy with all of the excuses.
But in addition to setting up my apartment taking significantly longer than I thought, we also don't have internet here due to circumstances out of our control. And it'll be a few days until we can get that fixed, which isn't making it very easy to play mafia.
I forget exactly what the arguments presented against me were. I think that Palmar said something about being "under the radar", which is actually a situation that I tried to avoid by claiming scum at the start of the game (in an attempt to draw attention and be able to interact with people enough before I left for college in case I was busier once college started). But whatever. I think that scott31337 said something about associations with Holyflare, and unflipped association is not a very good argument. I forget if he said anything else or not.
I think I remember Tictock posting some big long thing with a bunch of quotes. I think that the main thing was that I didn't explain exactly everything that I was doing. If you will allow the use of meta to save time, if you look at my town play (maybe in the second half of my time at TL Mafia or so), you will see the same thing. I will tell people what they need to know, and no more. I'll make a case if I am confident in someone being mafia and persuasion is necessary, but otherwise there is little need. Lately I've been trying to add a bit more explanation to make it easier to read me. The point being, this is something that I do as town.
Meta aside, Tictock picked on my vote switch D1. I thought that scott31337 and Tumblewood were both scummy, and went back and forth as to which one I wanted to lynch more. In the end, Tumblewood's seemingly not playing for townreads made me want to lynch scott31337 a bit more. As for Day 2, I still don't know for sure who the mafia is. I wish I did, but I don't.
Tictock
scott31337
Palmar
Geript
Koshi
I think that the three mafia are in there. I think that scott31337 is by far the most likely mafia. Geript and Koshi feel very much like town to me but I should still check them again at some point.
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The main point of hesitation that I have about Tictock is that he scumread Holyflare once and has voiced suspicion of him at other times. To me, Tictock's mafia play tends to be reactive and under the radar; I don't feel like he's a player who wants to take the forefront as mafia. And his Day 1 (up until the last two minutes) seemed solid.
That said his scum play is actually pretty decent. One big tell is that his activity and involvement increases when he needs to survive when he's mafia. And to me, that seems present in this game, both Day 1 after Tumblewood's push started, and with his latest series of posts and reads (after vanishing Night 1 while being suspected). To me, that activity pattern makes by far the most sense from mafia; were Tictock town, I would think that he'd want to follow up the lynch more, since his big suspect Tumblewood was still alive. Or explain himself for his strange vote switch away from the guy he was super confident was mafia. Or something. Vanishing for a while feels mafia-motivated.
So I could definitely see Tictock as mafia this game, and I think he has a decent chance of being mafia, but there are a few things that give me pause.
As for scott31337, he keeps coming back in and posting, but the amount of content (even quality aside) doesn't make sense to me. It doesn't feel like he plays to a conclusion in reads (to me, one example of this is say, you make a read on everyone, now it's natural for you to be done because you made a read on everyone); instead, he seems to leave at random times and when he's present, it's hard for me to see direction across his play. It also feels very mafia-motivated in timing, it feels like he is more involved when there is more pressure on him.
So I'd rather lynch scott31337.
Good night.
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On September 05 2016 05:13 geript wrote:
TT and Dane trying to play at mylo after being mostly afk. I'm 100% sure neither of them are scum.
On September 05 2016 06:26 geript wrote:
It's completely sarcasm. It's just one of those things I've always noticed... that afk scum play more as the game ends not less. IDK which of those two I'm voting for but probably dane.
What? Neither of us have been that afk, in fact Dane and you have basically the same filter length and besides my day or two that I took off to play Legion launch (which I even mentioned was going to happen pre-game) I've been around plenty and have almost as much filter as you and Dane combined.
Also this logic feels backwards to me as neither me or Dane are really being considered for lynch today imo. So why would our coming back to play more now be mafia motivated when as scum we could just lay low still?
If you were going to use this argument on anyone this game it would be Scott, but you don't even mention him...
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On September 05 2016 09:01 Holyflare wrote:
Ok, also we can't split our votes today, we actually need to consolidate otherwise we could just flat out lose to last minute switches. If you think trfel is actually mafia then convince me. I didn't think he really was at all and all his lists were pretty much identical to mine day 1 (hence why I never said anything about him).
I find it hard to reason that ticktock suddenly starts scum reading him after using trfel as an example to scum read me on day 2 for trfl's analytical approach vs my not doing anything approach. Suddenly trfl hasn't done anything and was instead wishy washy? I don't buy it.
I also absolutely hate all of Scott's reads (lets be real I'm talking about myself) which are entirely and purely associative based on an unflipped player (trfl), ticktock was also happy to just plonk his afk vote on scott yesterday and then fook off. Scott also just posted multiple vote counts with coloured names that lept to a really strange conclusion and suddenly ticktock is all aboard riding with him when he basically spent an entire cycle SCUM reading me for doing the same thing.
I think ticktock is very likely mafia since he's jumping on all of these opportune things and being incredibly inconsistent and writing all these narratives.
I'm gonna try and make a nice formatted post with evidence and quotes but you guys better play. I can't carry you forever, 100% dead if I get it right today.
Scott is never mafia for comeing back to the game like he did. He's clearly actually trying to solve the game and I doubt scum in his spot ever tries to scum read the people he is pushing.
Come at me HF, prove I'm mafia. Changing my reads and voting like I have is almost never how mafia play imo, but you go ahead and try to show that it is.
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United Kingdom30774 Posts
Scott is never mafia for comeing back to the game like he did. He's clearly actually trying to solve the game and I doubt scum in his spot ever tries to scum read the people he is pushing.
I don't know if it's because you're mafia or just inexperienced but this is almost entirely what mafia does in lylo after not playing the entire game. He didn't even try and solve the game he just made an association and coloured in some votes.
Hence, you know, why geript made the same read, albeit bs and wrong on you and dane, it's a very mafia thing to do.
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On September 05 2016 16:25 Koshi wrote:+ Show Spoiler +My only read is TT is town.
Are you actually mafia?
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Someone remind me to properly respond to Trfel's posts #1612 and 1613 later on, I'm getting called away and only skimmed them.
This part jumped out at me though:
I forget exactly what the arguments presented against me were. I think that Palmar said something about being "under the radar", which is actually a situation that I tried to avoid by claiming scum at the start of the game (in an attempt to draw attention and be able to interact with people enough before I left for college in case I was busier once college started). But whatever. I think that scott31337 said something about associations with Holyflare, and unflipped association is not a very good argument. I forget if he said anything else or not.
I'm not a fan of the bolded statement here, I think it's more mafia sided thinking than town. Trfel is referring to his opening post here:
On August 29 2016 05:59 Trfel wrote:Beentheredonethat is the worst cohost on TL. I didn't think he would be cruel enough to make me mafia two games in a row 
Now town really will only start that game with a post like this to get reactions from people, and that is how I've been interpreting that post and is part of why I've been townreading Trfel most of the game. Starting the game off by trying to get reactions and push for info is a very towny thing to do, and that is what I thought Trfel was doing.
However claiming that this open was to "not play under the radar" as Trfel is now saying, is much more mafia indicative. Mafia are usually very aware (maybe even nervous) about their opening and try to open in ways that either make them look town or don't draw much attention to themselves. Saying that he claimed scum to stand out then means that he was worried about how he looked at the start of the game.
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But then he totally revealed his master plan, gosh darn that sneaky trfel.
I'm going to sheep myself and vivax's crazy research and call trfel town. Somehow ticktock has forgotten vivax showed trfel has never opened like that in any mafia game.
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EPT
