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[M][N] Mini Mafia: The (kinda) Vanilla Experience - Page 12

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:07 GMT
#1116
Btw BH what's up with the unvote :/
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:09 GMT
#1123
On October 24 2015 03:07 GlowingBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 03:03 Xatalos wrote:
Hm Onegu's return seems okay... Although why is rayn 90% town? Elaborate?


Sorry, why is he okay?

BTW I'm pretty sure Vivax is mafia now. He comes back, jokes about stuff, says some random stuff about killing me, but actually talks about nothing else in the game. His read on yamato has vanished, too.

I can't understand what you guys find townie in him.


Well I think his read post was decent enough. It looked like he had actually read the thread somewhat.

Mostly it's that from what I've seen of his scumgame, it's extremely uninvolved / lurky. Here he's invested in the discussion at various points and actually seems to care about what's going on.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:43 GMT
#1164
On October 24 2015 03:31 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 21:46 Xatalos wrote:
Really marv? I think Slam has said a lot more interesting stuff already than he ever did last game (as scum). There he just basically hanged around, trolling, but I thought he was town because he was so "natural" in the thread.

This game... Mostly I was enlightened by him liking ritoky for his "town BH makes reads based on his RNG push DING DING" post (which really makes me feel better about ritoky too, since I forgot that post and wondered a bit about his confidence in BH being town... Now I understand). Also I liked how he brought up the weird progression from rayn regarding GB... Which basically went like certain town -> die scum, based on.. What? Missing posts from GB earlier? Then why that hard defense of him in the first place, without even reading his posts? And now the confident scumread because that's where the thread was flowing?

What I'm trying to say is, reading Slam's posts made me feel better about Slam and ritoky, and worse about rayn. Not really sure how you came to your conclusions marv...?

On the other hand, GB has felt a bit better lately. The Vivax read is a bit... But like marv said, it feels like a really weird target to pick as scum. And I liked his meta thing about me. And he's unlikely scum with rayn (no reason for scum rayn to suddenly go on the offensive this late in the day otherwise after hard defending him before).


So I See you going to the mat for slam here. How does Slam convince you rayn is scum? I'm glad to see someone on board with the "GB being stubborn could be a town-tell" boat, but how does this have to do with an associative tell with rayn? Rayn is totally willing to attack teammates when appropriate as scum, and in a game with no investigative roles I'd be a lot more confident about rayn lasting through lylo as scum than I would GB. Can you explain in a bit more detail why rayn as scum wouldn't change his mind on GB as scum, if GB's push starts to falter?

Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless.


This post is bad and you should feel bad.

Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 22:34 Xatalos wrote:
Let's see... My current thoughts are... (not in any particular order)

Town

Vivax
Blazinghand
ritoky
Alakaslam

Nullish

GlowingBear
gumshoe
Hopeless1der
Onegu
yamato77
marvellosity

Scummy

Chromatically
raynpelikoneet

That's where I'm at... I think there's at least 1-2 scum between rayn/Chrom and then 1-2 in the null section.


Why do you have marv as scum? As I noted earlier, Marv is like supremely demotivated as scum now (to the point of almost throwing games, never trying, conceding with 3 or 2 scum alive, etc). It's super obvious to me that marv is town, since he's actually trying to play the game rather than be a little whiny baby about it. Just look at his game history.


It wasn't a decisive part really, but Slam brought up the whole issue of rayn's read on GB and how it shifted based on thread sentiment rather than anything changing about GB. He was first oddly certain about GB being town, then suddenly oddly certain about him being scum (and this happened because of pressure gathering on GB, not because he said new stuff). I don't really see why rayn should have dropped the GB read as scum since GB is still a lynch candidate.

Do you townread Chromatically and why?

I didn't have marv as scum back when I made that post. Currently I'm leaning towards the possibility. Mostly because of his odd hard defense of rayn that was based on something that didn't even happen. It makes the most sense in the event of a rayn/marv team, but we'll see if that's the case.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:46 GMT
#1167
On October 24 2015 03:46 Chromatically wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 03:41 Blazinghand wrote:
...

On October 23 2015 23:10 Chromatically wrote:
So I assume no one agrees with me on Xatalos then?

On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless.


Here are the basic points I made: Xatalos was active without posting anything particularly in the beginning of the game (mafia do this because they want to appear active but have trouble posting content), waffling on votes (mafia do this because they want to keep their options open and not ignore their partners), throwing suspicion on rayn initially (mafia do this to make people look worse than they are), weird read on BH (mafia throw out townreads without thinking about why). The last two points are meh, but the first two I think are pretty clearly scum traits and certainly not "null at worst" from any perspective. The filter length defense is the only good one I've heard, but filter length is not everything.

If people really don't want to lynch Xatalos, I'll obviously consolidate onto someone else. But I do think I made a strong case and I feel good about it.


Uh, isn't that consistent with Xat buying into RNG, townreading me, and pushing the RNG target? The actions you've described are like, the actions of someone who has joined the glory of RNG so unless you're saying "buying into RNG is scummy" I dont' think you've got a case here buddy

...

Are you trying to say that Xatalos' read on rayn is based on him following RNG?


Haha :D:D:D:D
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:48 GMT
#1169
This is the game where town Xatalos brutally pwned scum rayn: http://www.vendetta-strada.net/showthread.php?tid=1983
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:50 GMT
#1170
(Wiki)
On October 24 2015 03:44 Vivax wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote Chromatically

He failed the entry test of participating on a wavelength with others (which is why he didn't make it into my initial town list)

He's good at nonstop producing reads with some arguments attached to them but doesn't really interact with the thread much until he gets scummed.

The ritoky picture argument he called a slam dunk argument (Not sure if bad or mafia for this one, but both is also possible. So it's 66 % vs 33%, science never fails).

Feels mechanical (stick up his arse).

And obviously, this is part me, part marv propaganda.


Hmm... Well, I'm extremely fine with the lynch being rayn vs Chromatically.

"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:56 GMT
#1173
This is the best page of any Mafia game ever http://www.vendetta-strada.net/showthread.php?tid=1983&page=45
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 18:58 GMT
#1175
Ah, the delicious tears of rayn :D


"Post: #2216RE: WTHITAHAIH?!?!?!?!? Mafia
Like Xatalos doesn't have any reason to think i am mafia other than "sheeping cory".
Xatalos when did you become adumb sheeple in your opinion?
You sheeped me on D1, you sheeped cory on D1. You sheeped cory on N1, now you don't have cory to sheep so you are making bad cases, you are not being consistent at all.

You call me tunneling and attacking "easy targets". You FUCKING voted for Tiger who was the "easiest target" ever on D1, you had SIU as a scumread all game long, another "easy target". Your vote ended up on rsoultin who you yourself called "an easy target". At least i had fucking balls to think scummy play is scum.

Hypocrite scum."
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:00 GMT
#1178
On October 24 2015 03:57 Chromatically wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: Alakaslam

I think I've been clearly posting my thoughts in the thread and that you should be able to see my thought process behind how my reads have formed or changed.

I'm okay with Slam being lynched. I think BH or Xatalos would probably be better but I'm doubting myself on Xatalos now too so I don't really know.

I'm probably overreacting to marv because no one else seems to think it's weird.


Hm you mean the way how he "cherrypicked" on your meta? Well... Dunno really, as I don't know your meta. And it's overall hard to comment since I don't exactly trust either of you.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:01 GMT
#1180
On October 24 2015 04:00 Vivax wrote:
I did skim that game trying to catch a glimpse of something sexual


Did you?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:03 GMT
#1182
Btw less than 2 hours to lynch and Slam is still getting lynched.

Which is not the way to go.

Now get on rayn/Chromatically instead and it should be a decent lynch.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:05 GMT
#1185
On October 24 2015 04:04 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 04:03 Xatalos wrote:
Btw less than 2 hours to lynch and Slam is still getting lynched.

Which is not the way to go.

Now get on rayn/Chromatically instead and it should be a decent lynch.

all the best townplayers on Slam

Slam isn't the way to go

pro xata logic as always


It remains questionable if the majority of people voting for Slam are even town. In any case, Hopeless and yamato are hardly "top players".
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:08 GMT
#1190
On October 24 2015 04:02 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 04:01 Xatalos wrote:
On October 24 2015 04:00 Vivax wrote:
I did skim that game trying to catch a glimpse of something sexual


Did you?


Are you telling me there is?


Well, tbh it might be better to focus on this game now.

I think your vote on Chromatically is fine enough. I may drop my own vote on him if need be. It's just that I'm not totally confident about him and rayn seems like the clearer choice.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:09 GMT
#1194
On October 24 2015 04:06 marvellosity wrote:
yamato is a good townplayer when he actually plays, which is all too rare.

me/rayn/yamato

pretty good


It feels extremely questionable to sheep you three when yamato is hardly playing at all, rayn is 100% scumreading me for BS reasons and you're defending rayn for almost as bad of reasons.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:13 GMT
#1203
On October 24 2015 04:07 GlowingBear wrote:
I don't want to lynch chromatically. Especially now that Vivax is voting him.

And I've been putting thoughts on Rayn. His flip one is bad. He said it was very unlikely I was scum and that I was very level headed with my read in Vivax.

Then Vivax said something about me scum reading him before asking questions, and Rayn agreed and called me scum over the same posts he called me "very unlikely to be mafia". It doesn't make sense.

I'm voting rayn


"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:14 GMT
#1204
On October 24 2015 04:07 Onegu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 03:03 Xatalos wrote:
Hm Onegu's return seems okay... Although why is rayn 90% town? Elaborate?


I have started to read rayn completely on how he reacts with me. If he is more buddy to me its likely he is scum. If he is bitching about my play he is town. Oh he enjoys playing with me but wants to win more as town so he wants me to do more.


And?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:16 GMT
#1207
On October 24 2015 04:11 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 04:09 Xatalos wrote:
On October 24 2015 04:06 marvellosity wrote:
yamato is a good townplayer when he actually plays, which is all too rare.

me/rayn/yamato

pretty good


It feels extremely questionable to sheep you three when yamato is hardly playing at all, rayn is 100% scumreading me for BS reasons and you're defending rayn for almost as bad of reasons.

this is why you are not a competent townplayer


Because I don't take BS arguments and sheepvotes seriously?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:18 GMT
#1208
Oh yeah Onegu did say rayn was 90% town. Although he never explained why.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:19 GMT
#1209
Hmmmm.... I guess your meta thingy was supposed to be the explanation?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
October 23 2015 19:23 GMT
#1214
Onegu... Are you really sure about your rayn read? Because you said that town rayn "wants you to do more". But here his reactions to you have been basically like "I don't want to talk with you", "shut up and sheep". Is that him wanting you to do more? Well, it's not exactly buddying either, but...
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
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