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On May 18 2015 11:35 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 06:39 Damdred wrote:
Well Palmar is town that's my first town read of the game. Thats a bad read. Why was Palmar town for scumreading you?
Damdred has already explicitly answered this exact question in the thread. Have you been reading thoroughly?
On May 18 2015 11:35 Oatsmaster wrote:
scib, feels a lot like you are making up a read for the sake of a read.
I'm sorry you feel that way Oats. Am I correct in inferring that you think my read on Zealos is a bad read? If so, what do you make of the fact that Damdred and Palmar agree with my read on Zealos?
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On May 18 2015 11:47 Damdred wrote:
Sci thoughts ok the obi smd vivax reads
One step ahead of you mate.
+ Show Spoiler +On May 18 2015 11:28 Damdred wrote:
Well at first I wanted your thoughts specifically but I got impatient and just started putting whatever in the thread to get some discussion going.
Vivax is kinda being a dick to me and it makes me think he's town to an extent XD. But for a more serious answer, I actually get better vibes off of him for those sentences that go from thinking ze is town to doubting you to thinking maybe he's wrong. It shows a somewhat believable train of thought to me in this situation that starts with I think I'm right, he's sees you disagree says he doubts you.
Then however you deliver what I consider to be a pretty good reasoning on why ze is mafia at this point, so it makes vivax reevaluate at that point.
I think its a pretty towny way of thinking, he also doesn't immediately jump on ze here he moves him back to null to think more about it instead of over reacting and humping on him
also it seems he was wanting to pressure and call some things I did or didn't do into question. I liked it even if its just surface stuff right now.
@Damdred
I find your analysis on Vivax reasonable, and I would probably agree with all of it had I never played with Vivax before. But I think I've seen Vivax act dickish as mafia before. And I've always thought of Vivax as very sure of his convictions to the point of fault, so I was more surprised than impressed that he moved from town to null on Zealos. Maybe I have the wrong idea of him though: like I said I don't feel too confident in reading him. Whatever I guess; hopefully I will get a better sense of him as the game moves along. I'll keep thinking about this.
Regarding obi, I had him marked down as nullish. I've never played with him before so I feel like I cannot sympathize with some of your argument. I suppose I could look at the games you referenced at some point.
I'm waiting to see more from him before I decide if his first couple posts are worrying enough to warrant a scum read.
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On May 18 2015 11:53 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 07:21 Damdred wrote:
I think its a nonsensical stance for Mafia!Palmar to take at this stage of the game that Damdred is scum.
Especially given how Palmar thinks (highly) about how I play the game and how I eventually gain momentum as the game goes along and if i'm town I can easily get off the mislynch as long as I try anyway. I don't see mafia Palmar going after me early in the game.
Plus hes done this before to me as town I think This is saying "palmar wont do this as scum"". Which is horrific reasoning. Why wont he do this as scum? why is this specifically something only town Palmar does? Presumably hes wrong, so you are townreading someone for being wrong?!?!?
It is very interesting to me that three people (myself, Stutters, and Damdred) think that Damdred's explanation of his town read on Palmar is completely reasonable, while three other people (Vivax, GB, and now Oats) think it is a horrid explanation.
On May 18 2015 11:53 Oatsmaster wrote:
Why wont he do this as scum? why is this specifically something only town Palmar does?
@Oats
It looks to me like you are asking questions Damdred clearly answered in the post you quoted. What specifically doesn't make sense here? Take as a premise that Damdred is town and that Palmar thinks highly of Damdred's play and knows that town Damdred would be very difficult to mislynch.
Therefore, a mafia!Palmar trying to start a lynch on a town!Damdred would be a puzzling move, as Palmar should know that the lynch will not go through. Perhaps Palmar should have picked an easier mislynch target. Since it would be a puzzling move from mafia!Palmar, and damdred thinks he has seen Palmar do this exact same thing as town before, Damdred concludes that Palmar is probably town.
At what point does that reasoning become horrific?
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On May 18 2015 12:10 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 11:40 sciberbia wrote:
I'm sorry you feel that way Oats. Am I correct in inferring that you think my read on Zealos is a bad read? If so, what do you make of the fact that Damdred and Palmar agree with my read on Zealos? well no not exactly, damdred never references your read when saying he has a scumread on zealos.
@Oats
I'm sorry to have to contradict you there, but...
On May 18 2015 11:28 Damdred wrote:
Then however you deliver what I consider to be a pretty good reasoning on why ze is mafia at this point, so it makes vivax reevaluate at that point.
Given this quote, is Damdred now also scummy for agreeing with me?
On May 18 2015 12:10 Oatsmaster wrote:
I dont think that its bad to scumread zealos, but the reasons you brought up are all weak and I dont actually think wishy washy is a scumtell.
OK I'm just going to disagree with you on that.
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+ Show Spoiler +On May 18 2015 12:22 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 06:41 sciberbia wrote:On May 18 2015 05:20 Damdred wrote:
I'm not sure what exactly is mafia-ish about commenting on someone else opening, rather than coming into the thread and not say anything. Unless you are saying that i'm not actually commenting, or commenting and not giving him anything to work for?
Now if you agree with either of these shame shame on you. @Damdred Can you explain the bolded? Am I to understand your first post as saying "I'm setting high expectations for you scib"? Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 06:44 Damdred wrote:On May 18 2015 06:41 sciberbia wrote:On May 18 2015 05:20 Damdred wrote:
I'm not sure what exactly is mafia-ish about commenting on someone else opening, rather than coming into the thread and not say anything. Unless you are saying that i'm not actually commenting, or commenting and not giving him anything to work for?
Now if you agree with either of these shame shame on you. @Damdred Can you explain the bolded? Am I to understand your first post as saying "I'm setting high expectations for you scib"? I am glad that someone understood dwhat I was saying. Like, I HATE this interaction. First post is Damdred saying he doesn't know what is mafia-ish on his post. Then gives two example why his first post could be mafia-ish but it's a shame if I assume one of those makes him mafia. Why does he thinks it could make him look as mafia, then?? Also, sciberbia bolds this, then asks something COMPLETELY UNRELATED, and Damdred answers like "phew you got it!" without explaining anything. A huge ARGGGGGH
@GB
It's not unrelated at all lol. You just don't understand the message he was trying to send with his first post which is why you think it's unrelated. Damdred can you please explain this more clearly to GB? I feel like I've been posting too much.
If damdred doesn't reply for a while, I'll just explain his posts to the best of my ability.
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On May 18 2015 12:34 Damdred wrote:
Last time I think me and scib were in a game he hard carried the scum team to victory(?) I think anyway, I had high expectations and wanted him to know it because I think well of him as a player.
To clarify, by telling me to "get to it", I assumed Damdred was telling me that he expected a lot of contributions from me (probably due to the prior game he mentioned), or else he would be disappointed and/or think I am scum. As I mentioned later, I saw this as a townie move because I am town and I don't see why would mafia!damdred would try to motivate town!sciberbia to play at my best.
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On May 18 2015 12:26 Onegu wrote:
cuz nobody other damdred has answered my question. And I have asked like 2-3 times now.
Dude chill out a little. How are we supposed to know why Palmar thinks Damdred is scum? I suggest you wait until Palmar returns to the thread and ask him then if he has not already cleared up the issue himself.
Alternatively, ask obi why his vote is on damdred. This could be a productive line of questioning.
You are acting like the entire thread has a scumread on damdred but that is simply not true: I for one do not and I can't read either Palmar's or Obi's mind and tell you why they do.
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On May 18 2015 08:09 GlowingBear wrote:
I like Damdred's explanation this early. Sounds like possibly town.
Can you quote the explanation you liked and say what you liked about it? I'm not sure which explanation you're referring to.
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On May 18 2015 13:27 Damdred wrote:
You also missed the joke entirely
Can you explain the joke you are referring to?
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@GB
Regarding your suspicions of me, I am not mafia and therefore I could obviously explain to you the town motivation and reasoning behind all of my posts, but unless you start rallying people to lynch me (which I doubt will happen), I am not going to respond point by point because I don't think it would be a productive discussion. If town, you are currently victim to confirmation bias, but with any luck I will help bring home a mafia lynch D1 and you'll warm up to me of your own accord.
I'm going to bed soon if anybody has anything they are burning to discuss with me.
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On May 18 2015 14:03 GlowingBear wrote:
Also, there is no difference in Palmar pushing you for the lynch and obi voting you this early. They are all unjustified votes. If you read someone to have the courage to call you mafia as town, you should read someone who have the courage to sheep someone like that as town too.
I'll stop pushing this matter. All there is have to been said is said. I will wait on people's opinion on this.
I disagree with you on this point. I feel there is a distinct difference between Palmar's vote on Damdred and Obi's vote on Damdred. Palmar implied that something in Damdred's filter makes Palmar think that Damdred is scum. Obi implied that he is voting Damdred solely because Palmar did. While you are correct in saying that they are both in some sense "unjustified", I think that Palmar's at least carries some promise of future legitimate justification whereas Obi's does not. I see them as fundamentally different moves and don't have any problem with Damdred coming to different conclusions about them.
On May 18 2015 14:03 GlowingBear wrote:
I hate your response here. You could simply say you were joking, or that you had no read on me yet. But your answer was "there is no point to share a read on someone who tunnels every game". It's poor reasoning.
I agree with this point on Damdred. If it is true as you say that Damdred respects your play, then it is worrying that he made some early jabs at you ("You don't want to make the headline with GB do you Palmar?") and then took another jab at you here instead of actually just answering your question. This point alone is not enough to make me think Damdred is scum though.
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On May 18 2015 14:34 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 14:26 sciberbia wrote:On May 18 2015 14:03 GlowingBear wrote:
Also, there is no difference in Palmar pushing you for the lynch and obi voting you this early. They are all unjustified votes. If you read someone to have the courage to call you mafia as town, you should read someone who have the courage to sheep someone like that as town too.
I'll stop pushing this matter. All there is have to been said is said. I will wait on people's opinion on this.
I disagree with you on this point. I feel there is a distinct difference between Palmar's vote on Damdred and Obi's vote on Damdred. Palmar implied that something in Damdred's filter makes Palmar think that Damdred is scum. Obi implied that he is voting Damdred solely because Palmar did. While you are correct in saying that they are both in some sense "unjustified", I think that Palmar's at least carries some promise of future legitimate justification whereas Obi's does not. I see them as fundamentally different moves and don't have any problem with Damdred coming to different conclusions about them. On May 18 2015 14:03 GlowingBear wrote:
I hate your response here. You could simply say you were joking, or that you had no read on me yet. But your answer was "there is no point to share a read on someone who tunnels every game". It's poor reasoning.
I agree with this point on Damdred. If it is true as you say that Damdred respects your play, then it is worrying that he made some early jabs at you ("You don't want to make the headline with GB do you Palmar?") and then took another jab at you here instead of actually just answering your question. This point alone is not enough to make me think Damdred is scum though. Meh... Palmar implying? He just said 100% mafia... I still dont get the read even from GB. Like I thought he was trying to solve the game.
Well maybe I am wrong, but when I hear someone say they have a 100% mafia read, I assume
1) That they are exaggerating by saying 100%
2) That they have some reason for thinking the person is mafia
So I think Palmar is implying that he has some reason for thinking Damdred is mafia, which he has not had the courtesy to share with the thread. It would be really nice if he could just spit it out and not leave us all here speculating as to what he meant, but I'm sure he enjoys the attention.
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+ Show Spoiler [my previous question to oats] +On May 18 2015 12:18 sciberbia wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 12:10 Oatsmaster wrote:On May 18 2015 11:40 sciberbia wrote:
I'm sorry you feel that way Oats. Am I correct in inferring that you think my read on Zealos is a bad read? If so, what do you make of the fact that Damdred and Palmar agree with my read on Zealos? well no not exactly, damdred never references your read when saying he has a scumread on zealos. @Oats I'm sorry to have to contradict you there, but... Show nested quote +On May 18 2015 11:28 Damdred wrote:
Then however you deliver what I consider to be a pretty good reasoning on why ze is mafia at this point, so it makes vivax reevaluate at that point.
Given this quote, is Damdred now also scummy for agreeing with me?
@Oats
I would appreciate it if you answered this when you return to the thread. According to you, my reasoning for voting zealos was weak, and therefore anyone who buys into it is scummy. And despite your claim to the contrary, I have now proven that Damdred, for one, bought into it.
Therefore, you must either conclude that Damdred and anyone else who buys into my reasoning is scummy, or admit that my reasoning for voting zealos is actually not so weak. I encourage you to do the latter.
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On May 18 2015 15:32 Oatsmaster wrote:
I saw that post, didnt pick up that he was talking to you.
Damdred is scummy, YES.
Interesting. Ok well at least you are sticking to your story.
On May 18 2015 15:32 Oatsmaster wrote:
Also I hate it when people say they will lynch mafia but fail to mention who exactly should die. Which makes me feel like they arent sure about their top read.
I will openly admit that while I do think my Zealos reasoning is solid, I am not 100% certain of his guilt, and pending future evidence, I reserve the right to change my vote. If you are going to hold that against me, I'm not sure there is anything I can say to convince you of my towniness.
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On May 18 2015 15:41 Zealos wrote:
Hasn't offered any reasoning, or anything of use to the thread, AND miss spelt my name
I agree with your characterization of Palmar's play thus far. I think most of the thread would agree that Palmar's early play leaves a lot to be desired.
If you have time, could you give your opinion of ObiWanShinobi? Similar to Palmar, he has popped in and out of the thread, made some random posts, and not offered any reasoning or anything of use to the thread. Would you also consider voting him, or is there a difference between him and Palmar that makes Palmar more suspicious in your eyes?
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Hey guys I have returned as well. We've got 25 hours and we've got some work to do here.
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On May 19 2015 00:28 Zealos wrote:
I'd like to hear more of what you think of Palmar though honestly, I still think he has just been a destructive voice so far, I'd like to know if you agree with that assessment, and if you do, whether you think it indicates a mafia lean?
Destructive? I'd say a little distracting but mostly just a nonentity so far. And yea sure I would give Palmar a mafia lean at this point. Previously when I have played with him, he has given off strong town vibes by now and I'm currently not seeing it.
On May 19 2015 04:03 Zealos wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2015 04:01 Onegu wrote:
I really dont like zelous at this point.
First he says only one of palmar or damdred is mafia.
He votes Damdred for not looking like his assassination game. Which doesnt make much sense as my play isnt going to look like that game either.
Then he says we should switch to palmar for???? Not really sure I guess because palmar hasnt done anything...
Then he goes back to Damdred for the same assassination reason.
What changed Palmar still hasnt done anything. So why switch again?
##Vote Zealous well im safe because you can't spell my name. also i was unsure over which of Damdred and Palmar to vote for. I'm pretty certain now that Damdred isn't helping town this game, and I think he's scum. I get it, they're different games, but the entire posting style is so different and its jarring
Am I correct in saying that you did not play in Assassination? It seems like you are basing your scum read on him mostly on a meta comparison from a post-restricted game that you didn't even play in, which seems very shaky to me.
On May 19 2015 00:10 Zealos wrote:
Also whats with this love in with Damdred and Scrib love in on page 7-8?
Well in case it isn't obvious, I'm thinking town on Damdred and I think he's a pretty good player. He called me top town and said he has high expectations of me. Mutual respect and cooperation seems called for. Regarding the post you quoted, I don't think it was a rubbish post.
On May 19 2015 02:04 Zealos wrote:
I really really don't like Damdreds play actually, it's so different from his Day 1 of Assassination Mafia.
He's making so many useless posts and making obnoxious points which can't possibly be helpful to a town team.
Wasting space and time for the thread to progress in the direction of hunting scum too.
I think he's Scum
Can you point to some of the so many useless posts of his that are useless / wasting space and time? Maybe put a collection into a spoiler. Abrasive I will grant you, but it looks to me like the vast majority of his posts have clear content, one of the reasons I think he is town.
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@Zealos
Oh one other thing I wanted to ask you. Why did you say that one of Palmar and Damdred is scum? Were you saying that there is some sort of connection between their alignments, like one is town and the other is scum?
Sorry to throw so many things at you at once. Please try to answer this question and both the questions in my previous post though. Break your answers into separate posts if you want.
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@Obi
If you're busy at the moment, feel free to keep your answers short, but it's time to start playing the game man. We need contributions from you.
Who do you want to lynch today?
Why did you vote for Damdred early in the game?
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@ShoCkeyy
Would you vote for GB today? Why is he not on your list?
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EPT
