On May 12 2015 23:09 Palmar wrote: you're right that was a bit dick-ish, sorry LS
But the point stands. Sandroba not posting as mafia in one game does not mean he cannot post in another, and because of the filter limitations it's not exactly hard to post 3 pages of stuff in one game.
Same with RoL. He's lazy and shit as either alignment. But he did jump a dumb remark from me (apparently a lot of people here are literally sheldon).
Like maybe I'm just wrong and bad about sandroba, projecting my own personality on him too much but he's now done two things this game where I just think "If I was towndroba in this situation I'd have reacted completely differently". Aside from my initial point about how him saying he'd keep an eye on marv was basically a pointless sentence that doesn't fit in (If he doesn't say that, can we then assume he's not keeping an eye on marv? Isn't the default position in all mafia games to always keep an eye on everyone?), there is more too.
1). Sandroba's reaction to me calling him scum.
On May 11 2015 23:30 sandroba wrote:
On May 11 2015 23:24 Palmar wrote: Every time I say something really dumb the thread dies.
fixed it for you.
I wouldn't mind killing jat either.
Dismissal. He doesn't defend against my point and he doesn't try to use it to pry into my own alignment. He just outright dismisses my stuff, only to come back later and say:
On May 12 2015 19:55 sandroba wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:49 Palmar wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:49 sandroba wrote:
On May 12 2015 19:47 Palmar wrote: I don't really think BM is mafia but I haven't read too much up on the game.
Any time frame we should expect the reading to start? I enjoy playing games with you, but not when I can't actually discuss important points with you and get your input.
You're mafia so why do you care?
If you believe so, I want you to tell me why that is. I can't tell if you are trolling/tunneling aimlessly or you actually believe what you are saying.
Which implies he doesn't know why I think he's mafia, when I had already explained it then.
Also
2). His reaction to the BM pardon.
Sandroba literally just made this case on BM:
On May 12 2015 19:34 sandroba wrote: I think we do need to lynch BM today. The bullshit level in his posts is a lot higher than anything I've seen from him. It is still possible that he is town and using a large quantity of drugs but that I cannot account for, and unless someone can confirm him town so he can be safely ignored we will need to deal with him at some point and I would prefer if it was today. One example of the BS he is pushing that I think points to him clearly lying on purpose and not being on drugs is this post:
On May 12 2015 16:22 Bill Murray wrote:
On May 11 2015 10:06 Trfel wrote: Hello.
I'll get to this game in a few hours at the latest. I am sorry for my absence today, I'll be better during the week than on weekends.
The purpose of this post is to ensure that I comply with the "one post every 24 hours" rule. Meanwhile, enjoy some music.
So Trfel makes excuses "ill be absent" "this post it so ensure that i comply with the one post every 24 hours rule" then he posts a video... cool. really beneficial before this all he had done was harass people
Then I nuke him for behaving like this, which didnt fit how he played last game as town
WITHIN AN HOUR of him "fulfilling his daily post on mothers day", he posts:
On May 11 2015 14:05 Trfel wrote: You're kidding me.
You nuked me for low activity on a weekend, and Mothers' Day?
I really hope you are not town here, because you being town would really kill my motivation to play this game. I mean, if you're going to give the majority of your posts for the first 24 hours away, you really shouldn't be killing me for not playing in a 24 hour period.
And not only that, but he wants to misrepresent what happened He instead attacks me NOT for me nuking him, but wants to lie and come up with some bullshit excuse to basically omgus me
1) he tries to nuke me in return that doesnt work 2) he votes me 3) he then proceeded to ask me if i have any more nukes after unvoting 4) he finds out i have no more nukes 5) he votes me again
this guy isnt enjoyable to play with, and his behavior is self serving and scummy as fuck
He is clearly nit picking and ignoring parts of trfel post. trfel states that he is going to be back in a few hours to this game but BM does not bold that part and bolds parts that change the meaning of the post. Also he flat out lies about the time elapsed between the 2 posts, which was 4 hours, not one, in accordance to the part BM chose to overlook in his first post. Conclusion is I think he is doing it on purpose and is mafia for it. ##vote: BM
And his primary scumread gets pardoned.
This is fucking sandroba people. Not some random scrub who doesn't know jack shit about the game. Again, I may be projecting my own personality but I'd be so mad at this.
Think how I would've reacted if anyone would've pardoned GB in mini mafia mini thing or someone had pardoned WoS in noir 3. I was mad enough with people just not listening to me. But someone actively shutting me down? Fuck that.
I don't think sandroba cares, I think he didn't defend my case and instead chose to dismiss it and I think my initial point was very good.
We should lynch sandroba.
Palmar is scum. This post is the biggest BS in this thread besides bill murray. You are not projecting anything, you know how I play and "sandroba isn't defend against my case" is completely dumb since you posted something retarded that I dismissed as troll. You aren't reading anything, you are trying to force this read and haven't given any insight on any of the suspicious people that are being discussed. We should lynch palmar.
Dismissal count: 2
Go on
And yes, I told you didn't think BM is mafia and I still don't think he is. There is no reason at all for him to antagonize a ton of potentially strong townies and to use nukes randomly as mafia. I loved Gb's pardon and I also had already given a semi-tone read on him.
I've talked about rol and I've talked about you. I've hinted I think VE is town.
So yes, I have given plenty of insight.
So you are saying I'm mafia because 1: I said i would keep my eye on marv (????) 2: I didn't rage at GB who I think is town. (????) Which is completely retarded and doesn't make anyone mafia in any world. Despite my current level of activity and the content which I'm posting which I abosolutely never do as mafia because simply I can't keep up. Knowing who the scum team is simply crushes my interest and I have to try really hard to even pretend I have a scum read and I'm a lot more sucint and direct about my reads which I can't justify. You've talked about RoL who I'll give a prise to anyone who can guess his alignment at this point with a good margin of success. You've said you think VE is town, but didn't say why. You haven't talked about Xatalos and Vivax at all which are the main people being discussed. You simply ignored what I've pointed out about BM and read him town randomly. Palmar isn't this bad. He is mafia.
I'm not sure I get the rationale of a mafia-Palmar honing in on a target with the history that you have with each other. Palmar's played plenty of games with you (probably only more with me + VE) and realistically if he wanted to choose a prominent player to target, he should have chosen me, because he loves to scumread me no matter my alignment. Instead he chose you, when (if i'm wrong, correct me) you have quite a good history of trying to read each other.
I like to think I am pretty good at reading Palmar normally and he can easily get into stupid dumb tunnels as town
in the situation of sandroba-town and palmar-mafia, gunning for you seems like a kinda suicidal play with no upsides for him, so i think this can be town-town
On April 30 2015 22:45 Palmar wrote: In XXX I tried to lynch JAT, who was mafia. In hammertime I was wrong. I thought I was right and I was wrong. In GoT I didn't play. I was wrong but I never pushed it because I had no idea if I was right or not. In Mini I tried to lynch GB, who was mafia In Down Under I tried to lynch Superbia (mafia), but the host done goofed In Down Under reboot I didn't play. I tried to defend slam but had no real alternative In Imperial I wanted to lynch geript and was wrong In Horn I tried to lynch Damdred and JAT. One was mafia the other wasn't. I was sure on neither. In Linux I tried to lynch SL (mafia) before sheeping Damdred onto Eden (mafia) In PYP I tried to lync marv (mafia) In Noir 3 I tried to lynch WoS (mafia)
Marv: explain to me why you don't think sandroba is mafia. More than just a sentence. If I'm wrong on this I'm just wasting my day and it's weird that no one agrees with me. I think I'm also running out of posts but that's okay.
I am also being thrifty with my posts until later, but this bears responding to.
sandroba's posts this game are much longer and content-filled than in games he's played recently (he's rolled mafia quite a bit). In those games his reads are shallow and forced (to use his own words). In this game he actually makes observations that make sense, and his reads are more organic - e.g. he was pushing jat for his picky tone which I think was valid, and the way he backed off jat was valid too. How he approached me also looks natural, he advanced reasons why he was suspicious of me and asked me questions.
added to this is that he appears in the thread at times when he doesn't have to (i.e. when he has time) as opposed to when he is mafia he posts when he absolutely has to.
also sand is right, i don't really know why the things you said about him would make him mafia
i think if sand is mafia he's chosen this game to play much, much, much better than normal for some reason. i don't really think that's the case
his VE read - i think a couple people picked up on that because they didn't like it - well, ok, but VE in years gone by (when sand played a lot more) was MUCH more active than he plays these days. It wasn't an unfair thing for him to think, and i think him saying openly that he wasn't married to his VE read looks ok for him
BH could be mafia after all, because he's joined what is a pretty terrible sandroba wagon when what I posted should at least be enough for sandroba not to be lynched today. I don't understand how he can on one hand shoot down a nuke headed for me and then on the other hand completely ignore my fleshed out opinion on sandroba. I said earlier that I wasn't going to lynch someone who shot a nuke coming down on me, but the arguments about his lack of scumreads ---> sheeping this case on sandroba made my read do an about turn
I was leaning town on Palmar as well, but I also don't understand how he can ask me a question about sandroba, get a fuller response than I normally bother to give (apparently i like talking about good players or something) and then say "well, marv said all that but my points still stand herp derp"
There are also too many outlier votes right now.
I dislike Xata a little less than before, but would lynch in a pinch. Still finding it very difficult to believe that Vivax plays like this as town
##unvote ##Vote: BlazingHand
I don't believe BH "buys" Palmar's case. I think Palmar's case on sandroba is at best misguided tunnelly town and BH has been around long enough (and played with sand enough) to be able to at least grapple with this
On May 12 2015 07:22 Onegu wrote: Its a Ver game Im going to take it more serious. This would be true for either alignment.
He says this when it benefits himself. He only made one post which I consider "more serious" than his normal play. And he hasn't been following through with this since.
But it's his continual usage of hearts to annoy rsoultin that pushes it over the top. That's just not a towny thing to do. And he hasn't been keeping up with the greater seriousness that he mentioned earlier.
His constant frustration at rsoultin is perfectly in line with how he would feel if he loves playing scum and finally rolls scum, but then has rsoultin scumreading him from the very start of the game.
This is not a good case. His continual usage of hearts to annoy rsoultin may be dickish, and it may not be a "towny" thing to do, but it's definitely something a towny CAN do.
Like is anyone, including you, Trfel, going to sit here and tell me townies aren't fucking annoying and dickish all the time? I'm usually significantly more dickish as town. I townread rsoultin in Ippo because I thought she was being a cow.
Your final paragraph reads as "here's the mafia narrative". Ok, well maybe the town narrative is that he's angry at a rsoultin who he perceives as mafia, no-one else agrees with him, and she's antagonising him? There are 2 lynches that I just introduced where I find it hard to say "the townie motivation is kinda likely". Vivax's play is just SO far off his townplay, it's very very difficult to handwave away.
BlazingHand saving me, and jumping on a weak case on sandroba while not entertaining the counterarguments is also very very difficult to handwave away with a town motivation.
Note: I'm not trying to say Onegu is definitely town here, he may or may not be, but I think lynching him on conjecture is not the right play when we can lynch people with far clearer differentiations
rsoultin I just skimmed your filter looking for your Onegu case but I didn't find it, can you sum up the thrust of it for me in just a couple sentences?
Can you argue to me that you can't see the townside for what you're arguing, and then can you argue me the townside for what vivax and BH are doing/have done?
On May 13 2015 06:00 Blazinghand wrote: waho whoa whoa whoa don't lump me in with vivax, i'm useless yess, but i used my power for good instead of evil, surely that earns me not getting lynched until D2 hue
It's like you're not even basically reading the thread!
On May 13 2015 06:06 Vivax wrote: I'm VT aka plebeian, you aren't losing much (besides I'd have to be afk the next 1 and a half/two days cause I go camping with a bunch of other people for a birthday party)
You know my reads, I don't explain them much, and that's fine cause I've been trying to hard as town in the past.
The problem with this whole story is that I've "tried" several times in the past to really handicap my towngame for almost exactly the same reason and I can never follow through with it
And while you're not me, the difference is stark as fuck.
On May 13 2015 06:07 Vivax wrote: Many are like "low activity, disjointed posts" and shit and that's gonna be a lesson that meta sucks when people want it to suck.
rsoultin - looking back your case on Onegu is actually ok, but you admit that it can come from town too. But i don't think my argument for Vivax only doing this as mafia holds as much water anymore
It looks like after I made the comment about not being able to help myself trying when I am town, Vivax also maybe can't help himself. So that's not at all certain anymore. Maybe he's town.
I'd say Xata was a better lynch than Vivax at this point, but BH is a better lynch than both
BlazingHand made a lolreply (more scumpoints from Palmar for me \o/) to Obi where he altered his quote to try to say "well i do this as town as WELL as mafia". The thing was, in... er... Aperture, kita made quite a good meta case about how scumBH doesn't actually do anything where town-BH is strung into action. And that's what's happening here.
The thing with BH is that he's very obviously selectively reading the thread, and disregarding the stuff that he doesn't like. So it goes
1.Palmar case on sandroba 2.sometime later marv makes a sandroba defence 3.BH sheeps 1, disregards 2
Then I also made my case on BH based on this, but BH ignores it completely and later only responds to my post where I lumped him (or something) in with Vivax, and saying he's not like Vivax. but it totally disregards what i said in the first place. So that's 2 strikes.
I literally cannot reconcile, at all, how he keeps saying we should sheep this Palmar case d1 when it was a really bad case.
Even earlier in the thread he made some post about "Palmar and marv being the only ones possibly more skilled than me" yet it seems like he's totally ignoring me for convenience.
On May 13 2015 08:45 Trfel wrote: Does anyone want to switch to KelsierSC?
The only reason that I think he is town is meta and activity. Meta being that he was very aggressively poking at people earlier, but in his town games he tends to townread people early (this is uncertain, though, since I did not find a scum game of his where he posted early in the game).
His reads have changed with seemingly little reason and his focus has been on the wrong things. I find it hard to see his reads coming from a town mindset.
We are lynching your target and now 15 minutes before deadline you are coming up with this? Seriously?
The timing is not ideal, but deal with it. I've told you why I'm not completely sure on him, but I his weird reads as of late are really making me want to lynch him more.
ksc's reads are always terrible
he's just town
i agree with this, minus the insult
i have a game in mind that i can't remember right now that really heavily reminds me of his play here. i'll find it tomorrow if someone prods me. or i'll just remember
EPT
