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The Shining
United States2406 Posts
So you've been in the thread an hour but no thoughts, reactions, conclusions on my reappearance into the thread? I find my name in your filter a few times. You had trouble reading me your first few posts on me. Has that changed? You had me as black, not green or red in your list post, with a little caveat that you're scum leaning me but would like to see more of me. You clearly say I haven't given you much to work with and ask for D2 reads. They're here now. Thoughts? Questions? Concerns? | ||
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The Shining
United States2406 Posts
That scumread at least is consistent with your list post but there are 3 scum out there. What is your conclusion on Ritoky? You agree with his logic, but not the conclusion. You are tired of him claiming conf town. But that post literally tells me nothing about how you're reading Ritoky. | ||
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The Shining
United States2406 Posts
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
So in that ~hour, I did exactly what I said I would do. Finished reading/catching up. Your right, I didn't look at your return to the thread much. Nothing stood out in my initial read through, besides the points I already commented on. I'll be sure to make sure and take a look at what you've done since getting back here, I need to re-read a lot of what happened while I was busy. As for ritoky, I actually missed you calling him out on using "confirmed town" so you can claim sheep if you want but I was bugged by that all on my own. I'm clearly asking him to clear up the vote logic thing kus as I said it makes no sense to me how he came up with that scum team. I'm also clearly saying he looks scum for the "confirmed town" thing. You sure your reading my posts? | ||
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The Shining
United States2406 Posts
Meh, that's my mistake. "Every time you make that statement, you smell more and more like scum." I suppose what I was getting at was you're not really giving a solid scumread here. You're making a conditional read. It reads as if him not saying he was confirmed town anymore would make him not scum anymore. And if you're scumming him, what makes him better than, say, Prpl(your current vote)? Whether you sheeped/parroted there or not, it stands to reason that claiming you were caught up meant you had seen me, or someone, call him out on using the confirmed town phrase. Even if it bugged you on your own, it's kind of hard not to think to yourself, "hey, didn't this bother someone else, too?" Presenting it like that makes it look an original thought, which it wasn't. I actually agree with what you're saying about Ritoky(obvs, I mentioned the conftown thing, too) but I'm just trying to get a feel for where you're at. Am I wrong in saying your current scum is Prpl/Ritoky/SL? What do you think of Disformation "pressure voting" me and what he's done since? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
The entire day you've been trying to stay active and I see lots of examples of you pushing on people to get better reads (like just now, on me for instance ^.^). In addition you are giving conclusions about people and actively trying to find not just a target for today but the whole team. Overall I'm tempted to give you a full town read atm, but there's a couple things that still bug me as I look through your filter. On May 05 2015 04:50 The Shining wrote: I almost always am before we get to D2 and I can actually do what I'm good at. Vote analysis, night reactions, association regarding first flip, etc. This is one of the main reasons I say I suck D1 and why I try not to play it. But there's no reason not to interact and at least put my reads into the thread. You gave us this promise D1 to help excuse your inactivity. I'm waiting for you to deliver on that promise. Then you post this N1. On May 06 2015 07:12 The Shining wrote: Skimmed from EoD up to now. Scott townflip really hurts but I'm not sure how we could have avoided that. Haven't had time to sit at my laptop for anything and trying to actively read 100+ posts on mobile is impossible. Looks like I'm prime d2 lynchbait so I'm going to actually take my time, reread and answer the questions and reads I was asked for. Not like I need to rush. No way scum kills me tonight when people are still scumming me. Yay me. Why you were so sure you would be D2 lynch? After EoD you seemed to have fallen off peoples radar not to mention that HtS clearly has some pressure her way at that time, so why are you so worried about yourself still? I also found where you mentioned ritoky's usage of "confirmed" + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 06:58 The Shining wrote: Like Cel wasn't this aggressive as scum when we first played but it was his first game. And the list posts and WoTs were Cel's style, and it could be argued that Cel led us right into the Scott ML. I'm not scumming Cel here but the spear head now on Prpl(wouldn't a newbie town be a little hesitant to push so Damn hard after that Scott ml?) Is enough to make me not strong town read him anymore. Definitely not enough to call someone confirmed town. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Prp needs to do something. Plain and simple. Idk why everyone is letting him sit there posting absolutely nothing of value all game. I mean... On May 07 2015 07:28 prplhz wrote: hey guys i'm reading up now anything i should pay attention to? This is his ONLY 2 posts in the past ~30 hours. He has to be the scummiest of scum here or just the worst town in history. Either way I will enjoy seeing him gone. So yes I'd say the current scum team to my eye is most likely prp, SL, and ritoky. y0su is still leaning red, but at least he's given us a full set of reads now. Though tbh I need to re-read his reads as they looked a little flimsy to me first go around. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Also, just in case, no the idea of prp being terrible town is not valid. Even a terrible town would at least be making some effort to read, not ask the thread what going on all the time. | ||
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The Shining
United States2406 Posts
I had just skimmed up the most recent posts at that point and in the last 2-3 pages, my name came up more than once as scum or lurker. It was one of the more recent feelings of thread sentiment and it involved me so I reacted to it. Boop. You get a town point for referencing my post to yours and the differences. Yeah, calling himself conftown and calling others conftown. It's just really strong terminology and leaves an impression, especially in a newbie game. And then we're back to iffy. On the one hand, I do like that you're looking at a lot of different people and angles. On the other, you have 3 scumreads, with a backup. >_< I'm not sure if that's townie paranoia or just a fallback for when one of them gets lynched and doesn't flip scum. I do agree on Prpl, too. Now that we're well into the 2nd half of D2, inactivity is just going to hurt us more and more. I don't think anyone is letting him sit there and do nothing but there's no sense in saying "prpl do something" when he isn't here to read it and every time he shows up, he isn't doing anything. Yeh I'm sleepy...I'll be back tomorrow. Night TT, night town. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
As I see it town should be trying to give everyone their full and honest reads at any given moment. So if I read through a game and at that moment see 5 people looking scummy and say as such, how does that that fact in of itself give you any read? I could legit be town seeing 5 scummy players, or I could me mafia trying to spread distrust anywhere I can. Maybe not something I should ask in game, but it's been used as pressure more than once and I don't get it. Anyway my point here is that you are putting words in my mouth TS. I said y0su (who has been on my scum list) is not out of suspicion (leaning red) but has given reads so I'm ok letting him off the hook for now. At least until I re-read his reads. (here I'll even show you again what I said, + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 16:14 Tictock wrote: So yes I'd say the current scum team to my eye is most likely prp, SL, and ritoky. y0su is still leaning red, but at least he's given us a full set of reads now. Though tbh I need to re-read his reads as they looked a little flimsy to me first go around. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
The disformation read I promised. (full filter read, idk kus I felt like it) Going a bit beyond a read and being brutally honest. He's a newbie here but I think has some at least some prior experience to the game ( He says he's read older newbie games, so that might be it). He opens the game with a fairly casual post, he's friendly and being a character with the  's.After that he gets into the game in a pretty strong fashion. He is clearly engaged and reading the thread + Show Spoiler + On May 03 2015 09:59 disformation wrote: There was a short discussion about HTS starting to play tomorrow. And so on... And yes I am the guy with all dem smilies. Would you like to have some more? You seem kinda upset about it for some reason? On May 03 2015 10:25 disformation wrote: Okay, here we go: At first I was greatly confused why asking questions == mafia in this post. But I guess I kinda asked what behaviour people are looking for, which could also benefit mafia I guess. Still kinda confused about this. Maybe he could explain that to me? Part of the HTS discussion. At first a lack of attention was suspected, but it kinda cleared up into a nullish thing. This raised some red flags for me. Sure he may want to read more stuff from other people to get more reads on them. Or to look who might follow this up... still really suspicious to me. So yeah, overall I have a slight scum leaning towards him. On May 03 2015 19:55 disformation wrote: Good morning everyone. Some stuff I am wondering: Stutters695 : You were around for a bit, but my list on you is empty and your filter is really short. Give us something more to work with? How bad do you think scott looks now? Any idea of who you would lynch as of now? Scum reads? ritoky : Your two pushes so far were towards me were easy pushes on me and y0su, both of which are newbies. Coincidence or looking for easy misslynches? You also seem to be defensive about superbia. Scum mate of yours? sicklucker : For not wanting to play d1, you seem to be around a bit. Changed your mind a bit, or is it more in the vain of your d1 reads being bad anyway? Not sure what your spamy stuff is supposed to be though. Kinda confused tbh. If that was what you were aiming for: congrats. Overall pretty impressive town play for a newcomer imo. However after his opening ~24 hours I think he finds himself in a place where he doesn't know what to make of what info he's gotten. + Show Spoiler + On May 04 2015 20:13 disformation wrote: Scott : Still not looking good to me. Probably the one I would vote for if I had to right now. The Shining: Really short filter, at the time of writing that I will reread him (see aboive), there was not much to go on so he was boring null. Though I did like that he at least tried to put out some reads, even if he said that his d1 stuff isn't that great. Starts to look like a really frustrated towny as of this night. IE with: Makes me want to not lynch him today. Superbia : Was getting a lot of mixed feelings early on from him. Didn't like: And it feels strange that he didn't want to vote scott, who (surprise) is my highest scum read so far. Maybe I also just didn't like him, because he was one of the guys to point out that my entry was crap and I didn't understand why at first. But I really like his push towards me. Shows he really pays attention, points things out and is not afraid of doing pushes. Looking damn towny for me as of right now. A shame he won't be around today. prplhz : I look at his filter and see nothing. I can easily picture him sitting in mafia QT and munching popcorn, since everyone seems to have forgotten about him. HtS : I've read student mafia vii http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/480171-newbie-student-mafia-vii were I thought she was playing good (town). What I have seen here so far really didn't life up to my expectations. Not sure if really lazy mafia or really lazy town though. Hoping to see some good stuff from her today. sicklucker : Didn't like how he said he wouldn't be playing, but was in the thread being a bit distracting. Liking that he is now trying to participate and putting out thoughts. Still a bit suspicious but wouldn't lynch as of now. -celestial- : reading town here. Liked the persistent push on scott. Also really liked this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/postmessage.php?quote=505&topic_id=483492 because my reads where really similar at the time when it was posted. Stutters : See prplhz. ticktoc : not sure what to make of him as of right now. will read his filter this evening. FF : His tone is ultra town to me. A bit spamy. Will maybe have to reread him and look out for contributions, as per the line of ticktoc's thinking. rikoty && y0su : still leaning town, will look at them more and see what they have done lately. geez so many ppl to keep track on. xD I hope this post gives you some insight as to how my "thought" process is working. I will try to keep you updated more about changes in my reads in the future. Did some bad/stupid things so far and can totally see why you would read me as a newbie/bad scum instead of a newbie/bad town. Will have to step up my game it seems. Good thing I have lots of room for improvement. xD Still dis keeps up his same style of play after his weakish reads. He's constantly responding to people and updating his reads based on what he's seeing, all the time telling us what he's thinking. + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 00:33 disformation wrote: Well, this strikes me as a bit odd as I kinda read this as "At this point I don't care if he is mafia or not". So I kinda get where y0su gets his feeling from. But I don't think that is anywhere close enough to dismiss the case or call -c- scum. Plus I agree on him more likely being scum. But this might me nice to keep on hand for the night phase. I really like this post because HtS both gives advice and at the same time tries to draw more information from him and be more exact with his reads. Starting to lean town on HtS. Also regarding ritoky: He also appears very eager to place himself next to the person nearly everyone has a townboner for (FF) and someone who just did a huge push and is very easy to town as well. "Look how towny my nick looks in green." Also just remembered that Superbia was asking The Shining about the links to his other games: Was looking if Superbia mentioned these games in his list post entry of the shining and yes he did: So that is one townie brownie for superbia. Still suspicious of him though. And before I forget again: This I'm adding both because it's showing that Dis is looking at the game from multiple view-points but also because he correctly "reconstructed" my train of thought here + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 02:20 disformation wrote: Hmm. He posted: A bit earlier. So I reconstruct his train of thought as follows: 1. scott looked really bad 2. he starts to look better now 3. well, he still looks the worst, but I am having some doubts because he was starting to look better for a while Since he is a fellow newbie he might not be confident in his reads at all? Maybe he is not confident with bussing his teammate? But his filter is also really short. Granted he has gained some attention for questioning the general town read on FF... but he really needs to give us more to work with. Could see him swinging either way right now. =/ Dis's EoD is a little off, I think he got thrown by scott voting on him (which was a very odd move by scott). He starts by offering his own reasoning as to why he wants to vote scott + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:19 disformation wrote: Main reason I am on the scott train: + I read the case from -c- three times and I found it to be rock solid. HtS: Leaning town on HtS. So she has probably pocketed me already. =p But I thought she was trying hard to make up lost time today. Also a lot of the reads prplhz and rikoty towards her are tone or meta reads that may simply do not function given she didn't have enough time. I'd say to give her at least one day, to see if she will really put out some great reads. Like. I don't even know what this is supposed to be. Dis posts little N1 and he seems shaken early D2. I think the flip on scott maybe shook the confidence he was showing D1? His posting feels a little weak early D2 given what was there D1, but it's a mixed bag and he picks back up as the day goes on. Overall he's total town. As for his vote on TS, I think it's not that hard to see... On May 05 2015 23:21 disformation wrote: Ugh. Reread the filters and looked at the timestamps. You are correct. *sigh* time to take away a bunch of townie brownies from the shining. Why is this game so hard? xD On May 07 2015 00:29 disformation wrote: After looking at some filters. Really don't like prplhz. Willing to vote, not going to do so right this moment, because I am still confused as to where I put some other ppl. Read as: looking very scummy, but I am not 100% if one of my other suspects looks scummier. Yep, expecting to something good from you D2. You've had a few towny posts D1, but by now you could be easily be a scum lurker. On May 07 2015 02:32 disformation wrote: Still super waffly about Superbia. Looking forward to his answers hoping they push me in the one or other direction. Didn't like sicklucker before, starting to see him more as a towny as of now. Still don't like The Shining and prplhz at all. Willing to vote for both of them. Since there is already pressure on prplhz... The Shining: Convice me you are towny and your D2 is as good as claimed. Make me remove my vote on you. Go! | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
TS you joined the discussion today here + Show Spoiler + On May 07 2015 05:36 The Shining wrote: Hell of a lot to read. Not used to a game that has multiple large post posters. Looking at you, Cel/HtS. My thoughts are super scrambled and I'm not quoting anything because I'm on mobile and can't get on my tablet but I'm here and will be here the rest of the day. So pretty much everyone wants to see more from me or pressure me or vote me. D1, it annoyed me. Today, I can understand it. Prpl needs to show up. I've felt he could be scum(like everyone else who took my entrance srsly) and he hasn't done anything since. I couldn't have summarized Prpl better than Cel did if I tried. HtS is very slightly town. The analysis and pushes from her continue to get better as time goes on. Not shying away from her points, putting all thoughts in the thread. I think you asked me what the significance was when I asked you about Dis and you including him. As scum(& you've beat me before as scum, which), I know you're more than capable of convincing town you're one of us, which is why you're not strong town here. And it looked to me like you were trying to pocket a townDis by showing him you were mindmelding. Reading up to now, I don't see that being the case. I'm at work so I'll just be throwing reads into the thread as I keep reading, I'm filter diving today. If I missed your question or concern, it's probably better to quote it since I just read 200+ posts or wait until I get to your filter. | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Lets try this. TS starts posting here and Dis goes away here. So I make of this he didn't get a chance to start reading you in that hour and post anything about it. Wth was that question? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
Reference: + Show Spoiler + On May 06 2015 16:13 y0su wrote: -Celestial- I see why my filter looks so poor, I've been too worried about being wrong. There's clear thoughts and direction in almost every post. I have no idea why/how he survived the night! Tictock He's also one of the few people that expressed hesitation to jump on the "easy" train. I felt the same as d1 rookie town. I believe the way he voted was just a rookie mistake. disformation is it supposed to be disINformation? (that's not a read on him, just curious if people have been writing his name like that on purpose?) His smiles bug me - they make me feel like he's trying to win favor. Trying to sound friendly and helpful. However, a few of his posts have well explained thought processes and I'll chalk up his indecision on learning - for now. ritoky + Show Spoiler + On May 05 2015 07:59 ritoky wrote: IMAGINE THIS: YOURE GOING TO GET LYNCHED ALMOST 100%? AND HTS IS THE OTHER WAGON. AS MAFIA SCOTT, DO YOU A) PUSH ON HTS OR B) GO ON SOMEONE ENTIRELY DIFFERENT. gluck, hope you guys chose right. at least we got some 2ndary wagon info. The Shining giving him red on tone. Very willing to reconsider if/when we get d2 stuff he's promised. Half the Sky beyond "holding my hand" - for which she got T (as it seems very town beneficial) - her posts show a lot of effort and supported conclusions. Sorry, having trouble keeping my eyes open... I'll get back with super, prp, sl and stutters (but the last 3 at least need to step up a bit) On May 07 2015 04:35 y0su wrote: Superbia d1 posting was sporadic and I can let some go with his birthday. His EoD comes off as either just super rushed or trying to create confusion. His posts read like he doesn't have any aim but to get people to vote HtS in a hurry. His posts have a lot of pressure (am I using that right?) to get answers but any conclusions he keeps to himself. He also does a 180 on HtS (based on her meta - not that he survived the night) but keeps his (unexplained) pressure on dis (although as a 3rd wagon). I like is desire for multiple trains but that seems NAI prplhz more like rdhz. No d1 excuse... no filter.. OMGUS vote on HtS. All of that could change if we get some d2 out of him. I particularly don't like + Show Spoiler + you guys need to push this hts thing btw. don't know when's the last time i saw a scum be up for lynch and then oppose the alternative wagon (well okay i sort of did that when it was me or LS in titanic but that was probably a bad move lol). sicklucker I've been waiting for some d2 content from him... all I see is statistical claims. (one of my favorite quotes of all times is "figures don't lie, but liars do the figuring"). Since then, I've always been a skeptic and need some proof(s). "75% of statistics are made up" Stutters695 another "no d1" case... but picking up a bit more now. His posts seem to have direction but it's all at prp without much more than meta. So far I'm not trying to form a scum team so I'm not concerned with a red read voting another red read. Going to be on more now and looking into d2 more critically (especially the interactions of the reds and half red) The first posting of reads is super weak. Actually including Dis's smiles as a serious read? Giving ritoky a full pass for literally one post? I'm not even sure I like how easy he gives me a town read. Especially since he posted that after we had been chatting a bit. Could have easily pressured me a little since he knew he would be posting a read about me shortly. His second set of reads are better. I think I most like his read on Super, feels like he's given the most thought to super (I disagree with the read, but I see thought put into it). The rest of his reads are so close to mine that I fear bias will ruin any attempt at proper analysis. The rest of the day (so far) y0su looks like he did D1, kinda all over the place. He's a little more active but still lacks any solid conclusions in any followup posts to the ones I quoted above. He is putting on more pressure, asking more questions than D1. Overall, he's improving. y0su I'm seeing glimmers of green in your play. But y0su, at this point what do your reads (especially scum reads) look like? The votes look scattered as we near EoD. Who do you think is the best target for today? | ||
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Tictock
United States6051 Posts
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
Unvoted Superbia and voted prplhz. I'm still very confident prplhz is scum. I realise some will say it's a policy vote because of his inactivity but the focus shouldn't be his inactivity it's the way he HAS played. To recap the scum points from the play he has. 1 Sheeped the case on me by ritoky/Superbia without having reads on them or me. 2 Scumreads on Stutters and myself were at best OMGUS 3 There is no follow through on any of his reads whatsoever. This includes his read for tictock. 4 Wishy-washy reads on tictock when questioned by ritoky D1. 5 A middle of the road read on me as well at EoD 1 - when I questioned him on why he was scumreading me, he said I was angry and emotional instead of being calm and then turned around and said I was overcompensating for being too diplomatic. Meta read on me was extremely fabricated (quoted below): On May 05 2015 04:54 prplhz wrote: okay wtf deadline is tonight i don't know about scot31337. i got a good feeling about him pointing out that the shining was joking when other people couldn't see it. i also don't feel like lynching into some new guy for hardly any reason, did that way too much in last student mini. actually i'd much rather lynch hts. hts pointing out last game that it was obvious we were going in the wrong direction when we lynched a new guy for the third day in a row but now she doesn't mind continuing for a fourth day in a row? i don't know the cases on scot31337 don't speak to me at all and one of them is by celestial that i also have a bad feeling about (that people don't share for some reason). (Even with this read, if he didn't like celestial, earlier in his filter, he didn't push celestial at all for being "super tryhard.") | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
On May 07 2015 14:43 Tictock wrote: Anyone else around? I keep feeling like I'm all alone in here when I actually have time to be part of a discussion. Sidenote - I think timezones have a lot to do with this. The two dead players are NA and most of the remaining players are EU. | ||
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
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Half the Sky
Germany9029 Posts
It's just semantics, that point, that is. | ||
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