On December 15 2014 07:58 Trfel wrote:Ok, a few thoughts at the end of the night. I'm not going to go super deep into this, since the nightkills do provide information that can be useful, but here's my thinking. I'm also not going to call someone super scummy or clean right before a bunch of new information comes out, for obvious reasons.
VivaxVivax seems... strange. I'm not really sure what to make of it.
The first thing to note is, he has been making a lot of reads. From looking at his filter, here's what I found.
+ Show Spoiler [Vivax's Reads] +suspicious of 27ninjabunnies
suspicious of ritoky
suspicious of Tubesock
suspicious of KelsierSC
suspicious of Xatalos
suspicious of rsoultin
no longer suspicious of Xatalos
suspicious of batsnacks
less suspicious of batsnacks
suspicious of Fecalfeast
suspicious of Trfel
suspicious of GlowingBear
suspicious of The_Templar
suspicious of Oatsmaster
suspicious of Holyflare
suspicious of Xatalos
I think that this is just a playstyle, and not a sign of being mafia. It's not good or bad. Also, his reads are all well-explained and what he is doing makes sense to me. Really, I don't see any signs of him being scum here. Except, his play leading up to the day 2 lynch deadline has felt a bit off to me.
On page 120, GlowingBear posts Part 2 of his case on Holyflare. The full case summary is posted on page 121. On page 122, I post a case on KelsierSC. Vivax posts a few pages after this, but doesn't respond to either case. Then he mentions the Holyflare case on page 125 and says he is tempted to go for it, and then votes for Holyflare on page 126. No mention of the KelsierSC case at all, despite being suspicious of him earlier in the game. On page 129, I post a response to GlowingBear's case, hoping for a response from one of the GlowingBear voters. Vivax posts like this:
Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 07:41 Vivax wrote:On December 14 2014 07:35 Trfel wrote:On December 14 2014 07:34 Vivax wrote:
Lynch HF
I would love to. Please tell me why, other than linking GlowingBear's post.
Cause I read his post and it convinced me, nothing else really.
No reference at all to the KelsierSC case, no original reasons for lynching Holyflare, no response to the criticism I presented of the Holyflare case, no sign of the critical thinking and analytical Vivax that I saw throughout the rest of the game. The only town explanation I can come up with for Vivax is that he was reading sporadically and missed my repeated questions on GlowingBear's case, and really was that convinced by GlowingBear's case that he didn't mention the KelsierSC case in an attempt to gather support for lynching Holyflare instead.
I'm very hesitant to call Vivax mafia for this. It's the only suspicious thing I see in his filter, while the rest of his play seems to be searching for mafia and being constructive. In the end I leave him at null/town, but he is definitely on my watch list.
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batsnacksIt's sort of the same thing for batsnacks.
The fact that I tried to get batsnacks lynched last game for not providing scumreads and him ending up being town is still heavily in the back of my mind. So I'm not going to try and get a read on him, but here's some thoughts.
Batsnacks makes an early read on Half the Sky, and his reasons for this read have been heavily criticized. I still think this read makes him seem a bit towny, but I could be wrong. His push on LightningStrike is good, too.
Batsnacks clearly noticed that I posted a case on KelsierSC, and he put KelsierSC into his "would lynch" list. His vote remained on Holyflare, and he seemed desperate to get people to switch from KelsierSC to Holyflare. He never provided comments on the KelsierSC case, either.
Show nested quote +On December 14 2014 07:42 batsnacks wrote:On December 14 2014 07:41 Trfel wrote:
Switching to Holyflare because of a gut call. It's hard to explain. If someone really wants me to, I can try though.
^ ppl voting KSC
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GlowingBearI don't have a big read on GlowingBear yet. I am just including him here because he pushed on Holyflare over KelsierSC, and it would seem incomplete if I mentioned Vivax and batsnacks without mentioning GlowingBear.
The main reason I find GlowingBear's push on Holyflare instead of KelsierSC less suspicious than the two previous cases is that GlowingBear acknowledged the KelsierSC case and said that he was fine with a KelsierSC lynch.
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FecalfeastI've been defending Fecalfeast a bit throughout day 2. I suppose that was the first controversial read I made all game, since I only started seriously being suspicious of KelsierSC midway through day 2. Anyway, I maintain that Fecalfeast's play seems to be poor town instead of inactive mafia. He should be on a relatively short leash, though.______________________________________________________________________________________________
sickluckerI said I wouldn't make meta reads. Well, here's a meta read. The main reason is because I tend to have trouble understanding sicklucker's arguments, so I usually somewhat ignore him.
Usually, sicklucker is constantly posting and providing tons of different thoughts. Last game, he said that he likes to make fast reads and he was making reads all over the place. One example of that is when I posted a long post on batsnacks, sicklucker responded “I haven't read your post yet, but you are so town for writing that up”. This game, he has definitely done weird things and made a lot of posts, but they are all related to setup, presents, and roles. Very few reads. I don't think it makes sicklucker scum, but I don't see him as a sure town like some other people do.
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Then there's the arguments between Vivax and Xatalos, and GlowingBear and Holyflare. I haven't put enough time into the recent development of those cases, so I don't feel that I have a right to offer an opinion of those cases at the moment. I hope to look heavily into those tomorrow. In case I die, good luck and happy scumhunting!
EPT
