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HF, what you think is the same thing in my post truly isn't.
Few people tossing shit my way to see what sticks it seems; HF if you want to call me scum, either put up or shut up. You've been pussyfooting around it for days now and you've done completely dick all about it other than take potshots here and there. It just looks like you're trying to cover your bases or something somehow, while getting 'reluctantly led around by the nose' onto lynches you supposedly don't want to be on. You have all these scumreads and you whine and piss and bitch and moan about them all day, and then what happens in the end? You somehow lose your nerve and sheep marv onto people you hadn't even considered for most of the day? Fuck that, you're a WAY better player than that. Scum numero uno right here ladies and gents.
A side note:
Problem I see here (aside from the entire thread following marv's whims, myself included) is people are completely ignoring who they've found scummy for the entire first half to 2/3s of a day. Happened on D1 and now D2 as well. Why was Haru pushed off the table again? GD or Poofter? (For those that wanted them as their primary lynch) Thread sentiment has magically disappeared from the scummier players in this game despite attention being all on that for the larger part of a day, reasoning being mostly, marv.
The difference between paragraphs A and B is that A is a scumread, B is an admonishment of the shittiness of town thus far. (though I admit I have been a large part of that shittiness.)
On August 10 2014 06:28 Holyflare wrote:
Hey jat you're scum for x, y, z!
Hey everyone else needs to stop doing x, y, z!
If you (or JAT) had stopped to think for a second, you'd realize that what I said is exactly what I meant. The fact that the mislynch was completely unanimous means that both scum AND town are completely guilty of dropping their shit and sheeping; the difference obviously being in the motivation. You can't always see what the motivation is, hence telling the rest of town not to all just drop their shit and sheep anymore to make it so goddamn easy for scum.
Now as far the above read of you being factually incorrect, I'll admit I was simply going based on what I felt had happened at the time. I didn't go back to do any filter diving or fact checking; I just seem to remember marv heading both lynches and you pissing and moaning. Yeah you're right, it doesn't make any sense to call you out solely for x,y,z if everybody in the game is doing it, but to me I suppose it was simply an addition to earlier scum points I had against you, and I was only seeing the scum motivation in sheeping coming from you. There was likely bias going on based on your terrible accusations of me earlier, the fact that I basically can't trust you worth a damn in any game ever, or it could simply be a factor of the pull marv seems to have where he somehow magnetizes everyone to his whims. Either way I don't have a good excuse. You're more than welcome to call me scum for shitty play or not reading if you want, though I'm not sure I see the obvious scum motivation in what amounts to flat-out lying about something that is apparently easily verifiable. (Not only that, but I take way more pride in my scumplay than that. I don't get caught, and even if someone catches on, I fight like fucking crazy. 3-month old meta or not, up to you if you want discount that)
Now I'm going to go through your filter thoroughly and give you a fair shot as I always do. I get the feeling what I find at least in relation to the above won't be too far from the truth.
If you're scum this game I refuse to let you get the better of me again. I WILL be the one to get you lynched. If you're not scum then I'm going to need to drop this and move on because there is at LEAST one scum amongst GK/GD/poof/Obi/JAT as well and I have no idea who it is. Haru has basically stopped playing and I'm almost certain of him at this point, though now I feel like I should go back and re-re-read him just to be sure.
+ Show Spoiler +I had a whole list of shit typed out to taunt you further here but that's not getting us anywhere right now.
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Now, I'm actually around right now.
Eden, if you have issues let's get them out. I'll be reading HF in the meantime. If I keep up my scumread on him I have the same issue as before in that it's very dangerous to leave him alive until the end. Especially given that the way NKs have been going, even though you have been preaching that you'd lynch him at LYLO no matter what, you're going to be dead before LYLO if HF is scum and no one will carry on your legacy in all likelihood.
+ Show Spoiler +(If HF is town that would be a decent reason I think scum would keep him alive when marv did dick all the entire night---he made it very clear who he'd be going for and how hard he'd be going for them so HF may be more useful to scum alive than dead atm if town---but WIFOM so meh)
As for the rest of you...hypocritical I know, but please do something coherent and useful, or we've lost this game.
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Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to.
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Haru's post about me being stuck tunneling him was really weird too, because I basically stopped trying to lynch him on day 1.
I don't know what to make of that.
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Also, Wave is town.
Eden, get your vote off of him.
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Explain your above two posts please?
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On August 10 2014 11:51 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to.
His reason was pretty good, he agreed that poofter was scummy for being useless, but he proved that onegu was useless *and* perfectly fits his mafia meta, even though it turned out he was wrong. In no way did I say poofter shouldn't be lynched, marv just convinced me we lynch onegu first.
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On August 10 2014 11:55 WaveofShadow wrote:
Explain your above two posts please?
Like...what few wall-o'-text posts I have bothered with this game have only made people think I was scummier. What exactly makes you think differently Obi?
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Also I feel like I should read poofter as well since HF is on him and he might be the counterwagon to mine.
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On August 10 2014 11:59 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 11:55 WaveofShadow wrote:
Explain your above two posts please? Like...what few wall-o'-text posts I have bothered with this game have only made people think I was scummier. What exactly makes you think differently Obi?
Simple: because it's really easy for you to stop giving a shit and coast to an easy win if you're mafia. Town, for the most part, doesn't really care, so there's no reason for you to start rallying the troops and start doing things.
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On August 10 2014 11:55 gobbledydook wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 11:51 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to. His reason was pretty good, he agreed that poofter was scummy for being useless, but he proved that onegu was useless *and* perfectly fits his mafia meta, even though it turned out he was wrong. In no way did I say poofter shouldn't be lynched, marv just convinced me we lynch onegu first.
Yeah, but it only took you two minutes to change your lynch target. You made no effort to pursue Poofter as a lynch at any point, and you just kind of fucked off when you put your vote down on onegu.
It looked like you didn't really care.
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On August 10 2014 12:00 ObiWanShinobi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 11:59 WaveofShadow wrote:On August 10 2014 11:55 WaveofShadow wrote:
Explain your above two posts please? Like...what few wall-o'-text posts I have bothered with this game have only made people think I was scummier. What exactly makes you think differently Obi? Simple: because it's really easy for you to stop giving a shit and coast to an easy win if you're mafia. Town, for the most part, doesn't really care, so there's no reason for you to start rallying the troops and start doing things.
Unfortunately, I would attribute this to you not knowing me very well----in most cases this wouldn't be a solid town point for me at all because I put effort into my scumgames. This game has been a little different for me for whatever reason. I think it's likely a combination of me having less time overall and maybe being demotivated by losing thus far and the fact that hardly anyone is around to talk when I can be (which is when I do my best work---conversationally)
On August 10 2014 12:02 ObiWanShinobi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 11:55 gobbledydook wrote:On August 10 2014 11:51 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to. His reason was pretty good, he agreed that poofter was scummy for being useless, but he proved that onegu was useless *and* perfectly fits his mafia meta, even though it turned out he was wrong. In no way did I say poofter shouldn't be lynched, marv just convinced me we lynch onegu first. Yeah, but it only took you two minutes to change your lynch target. You made no effort to pursue Poofter as a lynch at any point, and you just kind of fucked off when you put your vote down on onegu. It looked like you didn't really care.
It looked like most people didn't really care. Hence one the paragraphs of my earlier post HF had a problem with. You could probably have said the same of me.
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On August 10 2014 12:05 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 12:00 ObiWanShinobi wrote:On August 10 2014 11:59 WaveofShadow wrote:On August 10 2014 11:55 WaveofShadow wrote:
Explain your above two posts please? Like...what few wall-o'-text posts I have bothered with this game have only made people think I was scummier. What exactly makes you think differently Obi? Simple: because it's really easy for you to stop giving a shit and coast to an easy win if you're mafia. Town, for the most part, doesn't really care, so there's no reason for you to start rallying the troops and start doing things. Unfortunately, I would attribute this to you not knowing me very well----in most cases this wouldn't be a solid town point for me at all because I put effort into my scumgames. This game has been a little different for me for whatever reason. I think it's likely a combination of me having less time overall and maybe being demotivated by losing thus far and the fact that hardly anyone is around to talk when I can be (which is when I do my best work---conversationally) Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 12:02 ObiWanShinobi wrote:On August 10 2014 11:55 gobbledydook wrote:On August 10 2014 11:51 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to. His reason was pretty good, he agreed that poofter was scummy for being useless, but he proved that onegu was useless *and* perfectly fits his mafia meta, even though it turned out he was wrong. In no way did I say poofter shouldn't be lynched, marv just convinced me we lynch onegu first. Yeah, but it only took you two minutes to change your lynch target. You made no effort to pursue Poofter as a lynch at any point, and you just kind of fucked off when you put your vote down on onegu. It looked like you didn't really care. It looked like most people didn't really care. Hence one the paragraphs of my earlier post HF had a problem with. You could probably have said the same of me.
The issue I have isn't that most people don't care: it's that most people either openly didn't give a shit, a la you and me, or looked like they gave a shit and then immediately didn't when they didn't have to, a la GD.
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See it's this shit. Just zero fucking activity when we only have 24h days now and I CAN ACTUALLY ATTEMPT TO FUCKING HELP OUT
I dunno if it's just timezones but this game just hasn't been as much fun as usual. I had fun on Thursday when people were around.
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I know. I really wish I rolled mafia this game. =/
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Holyflare
I feel like I should be looking into more than the specific stuff that we've been all about recently, but I think my instincts were actually right even though I went about it badly. Part of the problem I have is stuff like this that Holyflare has been doing all game:
On August 07 2014 06:05 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On August 07 2014 05:08 Eden1892 wrote:
I've been sitting on it because I figured I could've found better. But I can't find something more convincing than my gut. Good enough though. Like my idol said:
"I know I got to be right now
Cause I can't get much wronger
Man I been waitin all night now
That's how long I've been on ya" If this is true everything you've said all nigjt has been a complete lie. Your 8 step bs, your argument with obi, your statements. All bs.
1) Super aggressive statements about how town he is and everyone else needs to get the fuck off him. Bullying is not a solid town tactic. Only one example provided but there are a fair amount in his filter.
On August 04 2014 08:57 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On August 04 2014 08:50 WaveofShadow wrote:On August 04 2014 08:49 Holyflare wrote:On February 08 2014 10:22 WaveofShadow wrote:
Surprise surprise. I don't even think I need role PMs anymore at this point, I can just assume.
I'd like to make it known ahead of time (to those of you who weren't on voice last night) I'm not even going to attempt to read Slam. You guys can do it, and I'll sheep along.
Now, time to gather some feels. this is eerily similar opening to your mafia game though What's similar about it? the fact you feel disheartened/seemingly disappointed about getting a 'town' pm which is exactly what you did in your game as mafia and you haven't done it in your town games that i checked just now in your profile (newest town ones) you rolled mafia didn't you  ?
2) Tossing potshots at me/artanis/whoever and not following up. Keeping people as 'back pocket' scumreads just in case.
3) Taking credit for what is not rightly his.
On August 07 2014 06:36 Holyflare wrote:
What terrible stuff are you spouting? I'm saying you're scum reading the person making arguments rather than the people who are sheeping those arguments. If they were weak the people sheeping them should be MORE scummy to you than me because they are sheeping bad arguments. Also i brought all the people to consider vivax maybe you shpuld reread. Yes marv switched and everyone else did but before then they were all agreeing with me.
That bolded quote is a flat-out lie which I'll explain further down.
On August 05 2014 18:49 Holyflare wrote:
You make me happy in my special place for mentioning vivax because i wanted to but didn't want him to go full retard for me doing it
To me this reads like simple scumfear of going after Vivax in a more hardcore way than he had been doing up until this point, which wasn't much. A little suspicion here and there, and then we gets the 'ok' from Marv?
On August 05 2014 19:09 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2014 19:05 marvellosity wrote:On August 05 2014 18:49 Holyflare wrote:
You make me happy in my special place for mentioning vivax because i wanted to but didn't want him to go full retard for me doing it you caught him quite easily in whatever game it was. more detailed thoughts? Well he was all over the place in that game so it was quite obvious. Here he's made some pretty bogus read on posts about haru +1-1 post that didn't exist and then it's like he's stuck in a time warp of the first few posts of the game. He pops back to ask more about the same things and asks opinions but isn't pushing anything despite saying he has scum reads. Just drops a i scum read wave, discuss post and goes away for long time.
On August 06 2014 04:09 Holyflare wrote:
There's 0 chance marv is mafia what the fuck? Vivax doing the scummiest shit.
##unvote
##vote vivax
Yes, technically HF was the one to vote him first (before marv at least) but the point remains his main target was Haru (or me or Poofter depending on where you are in his filter throughout the early day
On August 05 2014 04:42 Holyflare wrote:
but whatever i could lynch any of haru/obi/reluctantly wave/poofter )
and he didn't seriously consider Vivax until marv did. No, not a blind sheep like I described it before so that was unfair of me, but the motivation is quite similar in following along with a mislynch and giving marv what he wants.
Let me tell you guys something about marv. It's easy as hell to buddy up to him when he's town and you're scum. I did it in both of my scumgames and I won. I can't say for sure whether HF knows this intimately or not but I wouldn't put it past him. Just follow along with him and you're golden essentially---you saw how happy he was with everybody on his Onegu lynch. But I digress--the mafia motivation is fairly clear for HF on the Vivax lynch. He spread out his feelers onto a bunch of townies (and maybe a bus in Haru? HF has ZERO problems bussing out of the gate despite what some people in the game have said about this being a possibility) and when he gets the okay he runs with it. Town motivation---perhaps he simply found Vivax scummy enough to vote him at that period in time and it has nothing to do with marv? I don't think so.
He's ALL over Haru (and is constantly mentioning me in conjunction, though not always to call me scummy) basically all day and then drops the scumread he's been completely raving over in like 50%+ of his posts to join up with marv? Makes it very difficult to believe. More likely scenario is while HF is not afraid to bus a scumbuddy off the bat, why bother doing something like that when you can buddy marv AND get a townlynch instead? I REALLY don't interpret this as HF heading the lynch.
+ Show Spoiler +Also this shit annoys me: On August 05 2014 17:18 Holyflare wrote:
Also kush. If wave is so skeptical of me then why does he want to sheep my poofter vote and haru vote and everything. He doesn't even look skeptical to me because he's pretty much called me probably town the entire game whereas games like cell he never ever gave out the town read from paranoia I came up with points on Haru completely different from his, asks for his input which he refuses to give me because he is 'too tunneled on Haru' (which, funnily enough, he drops not too long after) and he says that I'm looking to sheep him. Just more examples of his tossing shit at me, though I do think I mentioned this earlier in my filter. Just pisses me off reading it because it's such misrepresentation of me when he knows me better. This and the 'upset at rolling scum' thing which I've brought up previously. Just looks like he's been wanting to keep me on the backburner all game, though I can't honestly be certain as to why he'd keep me behind Poofter today, unless it's because he knows I'm not going to be an easy mislynch.
On August 06 2014 19:11 Holyflare wrote:
Honestly the only reason i didn't lynch haru is because vivax was giving me so many scum feelings that i wanted him lynched to see if he was doing his scummy defences. I'd happily lynch haru next.
And then where did we end up? Association blerrrghhh but why has Haru been saved so often? I really don't follow. I know it was because of marv the second time around (not that I found his solely-based-on-targeting heuristic good enough) but for a guy who scummed it up massively D1 and has all but disappeared the rest of the game since he hasn't been mentioned? Rings more of active defending or at the least misdirection. I think Haru should be the lynch today but that's a little off-topic.
On August 06 2014 19:20 Holyflare wrote:Alternatively mafia chat says quick. Haru dying need more votes on vivax and he does it and they are both mafia 
Intimate knowledge of QT? lol I'll admit this is unflipped association and turrible but it really did stand out. Could be instead 'haru dying need more votes on vivax' except HF the one saying it to basically anyone. A stretch lol but still.
Now about the switch onto Onegu:
I'll admit to this I only a vagu idea why I thought he wasn't pushing Onegu and just blindly sheeped marv aside from me simply not reading properly.On August 09 2014 19:28 Holyflare wrote:
Wave wtf are you talking about? I've scum read onegu since he's subbed in and was the only one bloody talking to him despite everyone being afk??? Vivaxing is from titanic 3 paint where vivax called someone scum and then all the reasons for the person being scum happened after he called them scum. Vivax was mafia duh. Onegu did the same thing by saying he had scum reads other than me and he'd reveal them after night (which is weird enough) but then his only other scum read was marv for not being nk'd. So he lied about it to make it look like he was contributing and after all that ended up vivaxing as town. You can see he got called out on his bs by the heart after I pointed it out.
Tomorrow i will lead a lynch and it will be on mafia as I'm going home to a computer. So be afraid mafia be very afraid.
It's the bolded ultimately. HF talks to Onegu all day it's true and calls him scummy and whatnot but then for whatever reasons pushes Poofter for the entirety of the day, flipping back onto him once again when marv gives the ok. Admittedly his reasons ARE different (and better) than marv's here, but it shows similar motivation to his switching onto vivax.
There are a few glaring issues I find with the whole case above that some bias is all but blinding me to. Town motivations ARE there despite me not mentioning them, and they ARE somewhat obvious so I need not point them out (I will if deemed necessary), but I have a problem in that I can't trust HF EVER. He is completely capable of playing a scumgame like this, and looking extremely townie as scum. I'm looking for subtleties in his scumgame that he may be better able to pull off than others. Essentially there's a couple things HF could do today to make me feel better about him (actually three things, one of which is have a conversation with me but given timezones apparently that hasn't been possible) but I'm not going to tip him off to either. I won't be voting for HF because despite the above case I am NOT convinced that he is scum, just terribly terribly worried that if he is we may have already lost because he's reached an unlynchable stage again. (doesn't mean I won't try)
I'm going to try even harder to be around for some of the day tomorrow but I don't know how possible it's going to be. All comments are welcome, I will do my best to get to everything but I can't promise I can do stuff other than phoneposting.
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HF I would like an explanation at some point as to why anyone should be voting Poofter over Haru today, simply put. You have found both of them scummy, so ultimately this must mean you find Poofter scummier in some way. What makes this so?
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Aaand nvm again I was reading someone else's vote.
Why GD now over Haru OR Poofter given the above?
I just don't understand.
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On August 10 2014 12:02 ObiWanShinobi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2014 11:55 gobbledydook wrote:On August 10 2014 11:51 ObiWanShinobi wrote:
Gd, why is it that it only took two minutes for marv to change your mind about lynching onegu over Poofter? Almost your entire filter consists of you trying to lynch Poofter, but you pretty much stop pursuing it entirely when marv tells you to. His reason was pretty good, he agreed that poofter was scummy for being useless, but he proved that onegu was useless *and* perfectly fits his mafia meta, even though it turned out he was wrong. In no way did I say poofter shouldn't be lynched, marv just convinced me we lynch onegu first. Yeah, but it only took you two minutes to change your lynch target. You made no effort to pursue Poofter as a lynch at any point, and you just kind of fucked off when you put your vote down on onegu. It looked like you didn't really care.
middle of night 1
On August 07 2014 20:40 gobbledydook wrote:I agree with tehpoofter being useless. Compare this to his town game in Newbie Mafia LVI: Town Pooftersand see how much more useful he is when he's town. and his mafia game in World Cup Mini: Scum Pooftersand see how he has only 5 pages of mostly shit by end of day 2. QED we got one!
end of night 1
On August 08 2014 07:38 gobbledydook wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 06:13 Tehpoofter wrote:On August 08 2014 05:52 Eden1892 wrote:
Poofter, summarize your case on gooblegobblegooblegobble.
No peeking at the filter or the thread, as soon as you see this post it. I know you're online so if you don't answer in 5 minutes from this being posted then I'm going to assume you don't have one. I summarized it from memory in a reply to WoS earlier. 1) Shit accusation of me that was scummy for multiple reasons I immediately pointed out 2) Very pure wagon on him Me you Kush Vivax really close to EoD Maifa could have hoped on that ez pz 3) He was around at EoD but didn't talk and had time to vote though. Weird and shit. 4) His contributions haven't been anything to note imo So we getting back together? This post is so scum. Point 1 and 4 apply even more so to himself, omg the hypocrisy. Point 2 is just borrowing credence from confirmed towns to justify a lynch with a bad reason. I don't see a town needing to emphasize how towny a wagon he is on is. Point 3 is just him not reading the thread and trying to add an extra point. The ninja vivax switch that didn't work has been discussed to death and he conveniently ignore the discussion and uses it to attack me. I just don't see any town posting like this.
Then marv comes up with a compelling case than I did on onegu, I ask him why I should lynch onegu before poofter, he gives me the reason.
I certainly didn't change my read in 2 minutes, you're just misrepresenting me now.
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I don't think my issue was that you changed your read, but that you changed your vote and then completely left Poofter alone and didn't pursue that lynch.
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EPT
