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Release
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States4397 Posts
June 26 2014 21:50 GMT
#1501
What about the fact that others told him that he was wrong and he still insisted that he was right?
☺
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 21:50 GMT
#1502
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 21:52 GMT
#1503
On June 27 2014 06:50 Release wrote:
What about the fact that others told him that he was wrong and he still insisted that he was right?

Waitwat? Are we talking about YKZ now? This is like how mafia works... I'm don't even understand why you bring up this argument. if I said that you were wrong (about me) would you be wrong about me?
YouKnowZhou
Profile Joined June 2014
United States262 Posts
June 26 2014 21:54 GMT
#1504
In the vast majority of setups, peopel refer to any investigative role as "cop", "detective", and "DT" interchangeably. I avoid confusion by calling people rolecop or alignment cop, and generally the modifier-free "cop" or "dt" means "alignment cop". Confusion has been cleared up.

So, We have a few hours left and I think our best bet here is lynching LM. I say this because I think it's fairly unlikely that Chezinu or Snickers is fakeclaiming. Chez made it obvious he was the cop earlier, and a scum player wouldn't fakeclaim with three green checks on living players.

If we remove Chezinu, YKZ, Snickers, LM, and Sloosh from the equation, that leaves us with Koshi and Release as "not checked by a cop" unless I'm misunderstanding chezinu. I'd really like to know exactly who he checked besides Artanis. That would really help, chezinu.

With 2 cops we can reasonably assume 1 cop-fooling role, be it Godfather or Framer. Since LM returned "Goon" on night 1 or 3 (on night 2 chez checked artanis), and "Green" on night 2, it means either he was framed N2 and is scum, or he was framed N1 or N3 (whenever chez checked him) and is town. It's not possible he's the godfather, since the godfather would return a role that matches his alignment (ie, green and VT).

The other possibility is that Snickers is the insane cop, in which case his green checks are red checks, and the reason there are 3 is that his target was framed 1+ times. This is actually not as unlikely as it sounds; scum could have easily framed me for alignment N1 and the remaining 2 scum couild be LM and Sloosh (assuming one of them wasn't framed as well).

However, what this means is that no matter what, the scum role has to be Framer, not godfather. The Framer can change someone's appearance in terms of alignment as they see fit, and I assume this means both role and alignment, which means we can't REALLY capital-T Trust any of the checks. However, if we take a look at possibitiles, we see:

1. LM is a VT and he was framed N1 or N3 to look like a Goon.
2. LM is a VT and he was framed both N2 and N3 to look like a Goon, and Snickers is Insane
3. LM is scum and he was framed N2 to look green
4. LM is scum and Snickers is insane

If he flips VT, I think 1 is most likely. scum wouldnt' frame the same guy over and over again, especially if he was town. This would make me and Sloosh more likely to be town imo since it means snickers is sane. However, if he flips scum, I think it's more likely thbat Snicjkers is insane. Again, outside of some specific moves (like if someone is an obvious "We need to check this guy" sort of guy) I expect scum would frame themselves rather than townies. A cop getting a green check is not catastrophic. green checks can be shot. A cop getting a red check, however, is very bad.

Based on my assumption of "scum frames townies not as often as they frame themselves" we can guess snick sanity based on LM alignment.

Lazermo, I'm here and we have 2 hours to keep things rolling. What do you think of this grouping of people?

Do not lynch: Chez, YKZ, Snickers
Let's look more at: Sloosh, Release
Lynch: Koshi


Do no evilness because it is a small one; do not leave a small deed undone because it is just a petty one.
Release
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States4397 Posts
June 26 2014 21:55 GMT
#1505
Yes YKZ. It wasn't a disagreement of opinion; it was the fact that he insisted that 27nb voted because of VT claim, and when 27nb and I said it was because of the "limited information" YKZ still said it was because of the VT claim.

Pushing a confirmed town is not why I think he is mafia. It is the way in which he pushed 27nb.
☺
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 21:56 GMT
#1506
On June 27 2014 06:25 Release wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 05:49 Snickers wrote:
Release is starting to look scummy again. Someone mentions his name, bam he's in the thread.

Because it feels like I make a post then everyone ignores it (and therefore my posts are meaningless). When someone mentions my name, they want my opinion and therefore my posts are not meaningless. Interpret that however you please.

Pretty much YKZ's D1 is what makes him scum.

Because when the thread is filled with tunneling, OMGUS, and is primarily focused on a single battle, asking questions leads us to consider other options. I agree that his passiveness is noteworthy, but even with that, I do not think that it outweighs what I perceive to be his information-gathering agenda.
+ Show Spoiler +
having said that, if he says absolutely nothing until the end of the day and you do flip town, that would make me feel that he is suspicious to similar levels as that which I felt about Snickers D2 (which in hindsight was just timing issues). Afk complete peace out is not tolerable, even more so than 48 hour dinner since YKZ actually did something prior to D2 deadline

First part seems like you are justifying the fact that you aren't giving out reads in a very bad way. That is at least how I interpret it.

So basically, YKZ being wrong=>YKZ is scum. Do you really believe this logic yourself. Also, have you even considered what he has done since then?`He was the fucking dude that got mderg lynched.

Are you not reading or refusing to understand? I never said that asking questions and such was bad. It IS, however, non-commital. Its at most a sliiight town tell but mostly null.
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 21:58 GMT
#1507
Waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait.

So Chezinu fake-claiming makes my lynch like 1000 times worse. You are basically lynching a green-check. That seems pretty bad the last time I checked.
Chezinu
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States7468 Posts
June 26 2014 21:59 GMT
#1508
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town
lol, clueless in The Prism!
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 21:59 GMT
#1509
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?
Release
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States4397 Posts
June 26 2014 22:02 GMT
#1510
On June 27 2014 06:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:25 Release wrote:
On June 27 2014 05:49 Snickers wrote:
Release is starting to look scummy again. Someone mentions his name, bam he's in the thread.

Because it feels like I make a post then everyone ignores it (and therefore my posts are meaningless). When someone mentions my name, they want my opinion and therefore my posts are not meaningless. Interpret that however you please.

Pretty much YKZ's D1 is what makes him scum.

Because when the thread is filled with tunneling, OMGUS, and is primarily focused on a single battle, asking questions leads us to consider other options. I agree that his passiveness is noteworthy, but even with that, I do not think that it outweighs what I perceive to be his information-gathering agenda.
+ Show Spoiler +
having said that, if he says absolutely nothing until the end of the day and you do flip town, that would make me feel that he is suspicious to similar levels as that which I felt about Snickers D2 (which in hindsight was just timing issues). Afk complete peace out is not tolerable, even more so than 48 hour dinner since YKZ actually did something prior to D2 deadline

First part seems like you are justifying the fact that you aren't giving out reads in a very bad way. That is at least how I interpret it.

So basically, YKZ being wrong=>YKZ is scum. Do you really believe this logic yourself. Also, have you even considered what he has done since then?`He was the fucking dude that got mderg lynched.

Are you not reading or refusing to understand? I never said that asking questions and such was bad. It IS, however, non-commital. Its at most a sliiight town tell but mostly null.

Fair enough.

YKZ was wrong, was corrected, still insisted on his wrong reasoning.

I understand, but it doesn't actively lead town astray. Maybe I am being fooled by fake activity and I have to reread his filter, but I am doubtful. I'll revisit this after a reread.
☺
YouKnowZhou
Profile Joined June 2014
United States262 Posts
June 26 2014 22:02 GMT
#1511
On June 27 2014 06:50 Release wrote:
What about the fact that others told him that he was wrong and he still insisted that he was right?


And I *was* right. Yes, *this time* my heuristic failed, but FACT: it is right 90% of the time. I stand behidn the 27nb lynch. I am willing to use kenpachi rule and kenpachi rule extended, and yes, SOMETIMES, i lycnh town. I'll own that. Just because 27nb happened to flip town doesn't mean I'm wrong. The people who defended 27nb happened to be correct, but they were not right. In fact, I should take a look at who defended her for reasons that didn't make sense. Maybe scum looking to collect easy towncred, right?

When it comes down to it, I get it, you aren't as experienced and knowledgeable as me, which means you don't get Kenpachi Rule or the fact that happening to be incorrect. Day 1, I caught scum 90% of the time. If I buy for $5 a bet that 90% of the time I get 10 dollars, and 10% of the time I lose 10 dollars. During that 10% of the time I'll look silly, but on average I will make money. And when I lose my money, you can laugh all you want but I made the right choice.

I insist that I am right because I am right.
Do no evilness because it is a small one; do not leave a small deed undone because it is just a petty one.
Chezinu
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States7468 Posts
June 26 2014 22:02 GMT
#1512
On June 27 2014 06:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?


Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.
lol, clueless in The Prism!
YouKnowZhou
Profile Joined June 2014
United States262 Posts
June 26 2014 22:04 GMT
#1513
On June 27 2014 07:02 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?


Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.


So, to be clear, you are not the rolecop, and therefore do not have a check on LM?
Do no evilness because it is a small one; do not leave a small deed undone because it is just a petty one.
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 22:04 GMT
#1514
On June 27 2014 07:02 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 06:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?


Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.

##Unvote
GG my memory is OP
Release
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States4397 Posts
June 26 2014 22:07 GMT
#1515
YKZ explain this to me:
If you claim vt at the start of the day, and someone votes for you for some uncontiguous reason, does it still count as an appropriate application of the kenpachi rule?
☺
Chezinu
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States7468 Posts
June 26 2014 22:07 GMT
#1516
On June 27 2014 07:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 07:02 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?


Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.


So, to be clear, you are not the rolecop, and therefore do not have a check on LM?


Yup! Couldn't resist the troll... but unlike Caller I will tell you before lynch goes through.
lol, clueless in The Prism!
Lazermonkey
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden2176 Posts
June 26 2014 22:08 GMT
#1517
Okay, for reals. Why are you guys still voting me. Its Koshi/Release thats cool to kill now.
YouKnowZhou
Profile Joined June 2014
United States262 Posts
June 26 2014 22:08 GMT
#1518
On June 27 2014 07:07 Release wrote:
YKZ explain this to me:
If you claim vt at the start of the day, and someone votes for you for some uncontiguous reason, does it still count as an appropriate application of the kenpachi rule?


If you make your first post claiming VT, and the person votes you for some other thing in that post, and their entire case is based off of the first post you made in the game (even if it never references your VT claim), it falls under kenpachi rule extended.
Do no evilness because it is a small one; do not leave a small deed undone because it is just a petty one.
slOosh
Profile Joined October 2009
3291 Posts
June 26 2014 22:08 GMT
#1519
On June 27 2014 06:47 Release wrote:
Forget the check. Stance on YKZ? (goes to everyone)

Still scum.
YouKnowZhou
Profile Joined June 2014
United States262 Posts
June 26 2014 22:10 GMT
#1520
On June 27 2014 07:07 Chezinu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2014 07:04 YouKnowZhou wrote:
On June 27 2014 07:02 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:
On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?

I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal.

I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys.

Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.

Holy fuck...

Lynch this dude please...

##Unvote
##Vote: Chez

LOL

The luxuries of being confirmed town

Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?


Beginning of game, everyone said I was town. Then Art confirmed me town before he died.


So, to be clear, you are not the rolecop, and therefore do not have a check on LM?


Yup! Couldn't resist the troll... but unlike Caller I will tell you before lynch goes through.


If that's the case, I no longer see a reason to lynch LM. His lynch is no longer inevitable, so we must evit it.

##unvote
##vote Koshi


Let's get Koshi. My case still stands:

On June 25 2014 20:15 YouKnowZhou wrote:
As has been mentioned, Koshi posts thhis:

Show nested quote +
On June 22 2014 03:04 Koshi wrote:
I agree with Artanis that VE is town from mderg filter. I was a bit too focused on the mderg scumread into voting BH earlier. It would be pretty insane scumplay to buss each other with big cases into moving away from each other right before lynch.

For me scummers are: Lazermonkey/Sloosh



Then he votes LM, which makes sense

Show nested quote +
On June 22 2014 20:14 Koshi wrote:
Lynching people who are doing absolutely nothing is really good. Never fails really. Always mafia.

##vote: Lazermonkey


When he starts mentioning VE again, he asks for reasons that VE is not mafia

Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 03:15 Koshi wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:11 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:08 Koshi wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:05 Lazermonkey wrote:
On June 23 2014 03:02 Koshi wrote:
On June 23 2014 02:59 Lazermonkey wrote:
SlOosh

Wouldn't I push you harder if my second scumread was my scum teammate?

I think this logic is pretty terrible.

I agree.

Wat.

I honestly don't understand what your trying here. Nevertheless, I am done with you for the moment. If you truly are town then you have better things to do.

1 more Question.

Why is VE not mafia?


then votes VE based on my case, with almost no explanation

Show nested quote +
On June 23 2014 22:05 Koshi wrote:
I actually like this BH case again. The only thing I don't like is the vigi part.

BH is like 99% town for me. I don't even understand why VE/Sloosh/Release are voting for him or calling him scum. If he is alive in lylo I would reconsider but I have never seen BH play this normal. I like this normal play. Sheeping BH pretty good.

##unvote
##vote: VE


Last 2 scums could be VE/Lazermonkey. SloOsh still very possible as well. But he likes me so I like him. I am friendly like that.


Chezinu, your play is not exciting me at all. Add more Chezazzle to it.



Even at this point I consider Koshi to be chill. I don't mind this vote in a vacuum. The 180 on VE is surprising, but I've put in work. The problem here is that the explanation is lacking. Well, don't worry, Koshi shows up shortly thereafter with some mad explanation:(link). In his large post about 6 hours later, Koshi is writing about how LM is town and how he wants to lynch LM, rather than about VE.

People call him out and he defends himself but never pushes VE futher. The lack of followup isn't a main poitn, actually. Really it's just the "vote VE, big case on LM". I don't like it.

Koshi is imo a higher prio target than LM, whose latevote on D2 only really makes sense from a town perspective.

##vote Koshi


and honestly, LM has a GREEN CHECK on him and nothing against that, and he made that latevote D2 that still makes NO SENSE unless he was town. Let's not lynch him, really.
Do no evilness because it is a small one; do not leave a small deed undone because it is just a petty one.
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