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Cell Mini Mafia II - Page 31

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mderg
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany1740 Posts
May 28 2014 20:56 GMT
#601
On May 29 2014 05:54 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 05:51 mderg wrote:
##vote: ritoky

I don´t really agree with his cell order but I´m more sure about him being town than batsnacks. The vote is most likely going to be between these two. So I´m voting for my stronger townread.


so what order would you like?

A, D, E, B, C
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:00 GMT
#602
On May 29 2014 05:56 mderg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 05:54 Holyflare wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:51 mderg wrote:
##vote: ritoky

I don´t really agree with his cell order but I´m more sure about him being town than batsnacks. The vote is most likely going to be between these two. So I´m voting for my stronger townread.


so what order would you like?

A, D, E, B, C


Can you explain this then? You want to start with group A because I presume you have a read on ritoky and it would be easy to solve so that would be a +point but then you jump into wanting 2 of the lurker groups to go next? How do you have such a strong read on D/E? I realise your argument for your own cell will be "because i'm in it so it's easy" but what about everyone else? You're then putting the 2 groups with the least amount of information at the front of the line when we literally have no idea what is going on in them?
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:02 GMT
#603
Also, would someone like to point something suspicious out? Ok, I will!

Why has ritoky kept his poofter town read when he has posted NOTHING for a long time but ritoky has removed bunnies who has posted more often in the past 12 pages? It doesn't add up, his reads are totally suspicious.
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:05 GMT
#604
We have 53 minutes left and everyone afk's ~_~
ritoky
Profile Joined March 2011
United States6851 Posts
May 28 2014 21:05 GMT
#605
On May 29 2014 05:51 Holyflare wrote:
Right there's been 12 pages since then and now and you've failed to update us on any of it or pressure anyone but give summarised reads, you had a strong town read on bunnies like the quote i just showed you but nothing in the 12 pages that you've seen so far since that read should have swayed you to her being not-town. Therefore cell E should actually be your STRONGEST cell so far and should be far far far ahead of everything else (apart from your own cell) because layabout would be a very easy lynch for you.

Mderg only admitted he was wrong because he was pressured with evidence to the contrary by Odin (+ points odin). Do mafia under pressure admit they were wrong when there is evidence present or stick it out and flat out lie in the face of an obvious mistake?


Well in my mind, there exist two worlds as of now: the world where MZ and poofter are mafia together and they are so deep in my pockets that it is unbelievable, or the world where Odin is mafia. As you can tell from my reads, I am living in world 2. So if Odin is mafia, his strategy to try and break into the group would be to target me or MZ, and he chose me so far. IF mderg is mafia with Odin, he could very easily helped push that agenda or it was a very clever scheme to distance himself from Odin. I just don't really see them being mafia together in my mind, and as of now Odin is 90% mafia in my mind.

Why have I dropped on bunnies? Well I was asleep when she posted the thing I really didn't like, which was he cell order. The thing I least like about it is that she places her cell 3rd. I just don't get the argument behind it. I am on board with batsnacks about the mayor putting his cell 1st. I could also come to understand that if everyone believes the mayor is 100% town and someone else in their cell is 90% town, then you could put that group last and have "confirmed" towns for the duration of the game. That said, it is not what George Washington has decreed. I also don't like he placement of D or B. I think putting D 2nd makes me skeptical as hell and I don't like her justification for it. I think it might be indicative of belief that it is an easy ML group. I also don't like cell B last, because I think it will be a very clear town win.
“When interest is at variance with conscience, any distinction to make them friends will serve the hollow-hearted.” -Henry Home
ritoky
Profile Joined March 2011
United States6851 Posts
May 28 2014 21:07 GMT
#606
On May 29 2014 06:02 Holyflare wrote:
Also, would someone like to point something suspicious out? Ok, I will!

Why has ritoky kept his poofter town read when he has posted NOTHING for a long time but ritoky has removed bunnies who has posted more often in the past 12 pages? It doesn't add up, his reads are totally suspicious.


Actually point taken on this. Last game in GS he did the same thing. He came out early and gave me HUGE town vibes, then he faded into obscurity and ended up being scum. So I might just have a poor read on him.

But if I follow his logic of a meta case on Palmar, then the meta case on him from last game indicates he is mafia.
“When interest is at variance with conscience, any distinction to make them friends will serve the hollow-hearted.” -Henry Home
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:09 GMT
#607
On May 29 2014 06:05 ritoky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 05:51 Holyflare wrote:
Right there's been 12 pages since then and now and you've failed to update us on any of it or pressure anyone but give summarised reads, you had a strong town read on bunnies like the quote i just showed you but nothing in the 12 pages that you've seen so far since that read should have swayed you to her being not-town. Therefore cell E should actually be your STRONGEST cell so far and should be far far far ahead of everything else (apart from your own cell) because layabout would be a very easy lynch for you.

Mderg only admitted he was wrong because he was pressured with evidence to the contrary by Odin (+ points odin). Do mafia under pressure admit they were wrong when there is evidence present or stick it out and flat out lie in the face of an obvious mistake?


Well in my mind, there exist two worlds as of now: the world where MZ and poofter are mafia together and they are so deep in my pockets that it is unbelievable, or the world where Odin is mafia. As you can tell from my reads, I am living in world 2. So if Odin is mafia, his strategy to try and break into the group would be to target me or MZ, and he chose me so far. IF mderg is mafia with Odin, he could very easily helped push that agenda or it was a very clever scheme to distance himself from Odin. I just don't really see them being mafia together in my mind, and as of now Odin is 90% mafia in my mind.

Why have I dropped on bunnies? Well I was asleep when she posted the thing I really didn't like, which was he cell order. The thing I least like about it is that she places her cell 3rd. I just don't get the argument behind it. I am on board with batsnacks about the mayor putting his cell 1st. I could also come to understand that if everyone believes the mayor is 100% town and someone else in their cell is 90% town, then you could put that group last and have "confirmed" towns for the duration of the game. That said, it is not what George Washington has decreed. I also don't like he placement of D or B. I think putting D 2nd makes me skeptical as hell and I don't like her justification for it. I think it might be indicative of belief that it is an easy ML group. I also don't like cell B last, because I think it will be a very clear town win.


So odin is mafia and universal town read ritoky and mz are in his group. Who does mafia odin try and target? Universal town read ritoky or could be suspicious mz? Why have you jumped to the totally opposite conclusion of what any mafia trying to push a mislynch would do? Associative cases should also never be used here or in mafia games in general, just because 2 people are doing similar things does not mean they share the same alignment.
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
May 28 2014 21:09 GMT
#608
Why is everyone voting ritoky for mayor.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
mderg
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany1740 Posts
May 28 2014 21:09 GMT
#609
On May 29 2014 06:00 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 05:56 mderg wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:54 Holyflare wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:51 mderg wrote:
##vote: ritoky

I don´t really agree with his cell order but I´m more sure about him being town than batsnacks. The vote is most likely going to be between these two. So I´m voting for my stronger townread.


so what order would you like?

A, D, E, B, C


Can you explain this then? You want to start with group A because I presume you have a read on ritoky and it would be easy to solve so that would be a +point but then you jump into wanting 2 of the lurker groups to go next? How do you have such a strong read on D/E? I realise your argument for your own cell will be "because i'm in it so it's easy" but what about everyone else? You're then putting the 2 groups with the least amount of information at the front of the line when we literally have no idea what is going on in them?

A should be pretty clear. D because I´m having a scumread on tamburini. E because I´m pretty sure bunnies is town, I´m also town so it only leaves layabout. B and C are the cells I´m most unsure about.

As a side note: why didn´t you attack bunnies for her suggested cell orders? The first 3 cells would be the same. So why are my first 3 cells pointed out and hers weren´t?
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:11 GMT
#610
On May 29 2014 06:09 mderg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 06:00 Holyflare wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:56 mderg wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:54 Holyflare wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:51 mderg wrote:
##vote: ritoky

I don´t really agree with his cell order but I´m more sure about him being town than batsnacks. The vote is most likely going to be between these two. So I´m voting for my stronger townread.


so what order would you like?

A, D, E, B, C


Can you explain this then? You want to start with group A because I presume you have a read on ritoky and it would be easy to solve so that would be a +point but then you jump into wanting 2 of the lurker groups to go next? How do you have such a strong read on D/E? I realise your argument for your own cell will be "because i'm in it so it's easy" but what about everyone else? You're then putting the 2 groups with the least amount of information at the front of the line when we literally have no idea what is going on in them?

A should be pretty clear. D because I´m having a scumread on tamburini. E because I´m pretty sure bunnies is town, I´m also town so it only leaves layabout. B and C are the cells I´m most unsure about.

As a side note: why didn´t you attack bunnies for her suggested cell orders? The first 3 cells would be the same. So why are my first 3 cells pointed out and hers weren´t?


because i town read bunnies for other things and it was a wall of text that i cba to talk through but she posted her thoughts about her own opinion of cell order and then voted ritoky which i think is a townier thing to do
ritoky
Profile Joined March 2011
United States6851 Posts
May 28 2014 21:12 GMT
#611
On May 29 2014 06:09 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 06:05 ritoky wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:51 Holyflare wrote:
Right there's been 12 pages since then and now and you've failed to update us on any of it or pressure anyone but give summarised reads, you had a strong town read on bunnies like the quote i just showed you but nothing in the 12 pages that you've seen so far since that read should have swayed you to her being not-town. Therefore cell E should actually be your STRONGEST cell so far and should be far far far ahead of everything else (apart from your own cell) because layabout would be a very easy lynch for you.

Mderg only admitted he was wrong because he was pressured with evidence to the contrary by Odin (+ points odin). Do mafia under pressure admit they were wrong when there is evidence present or stick it out and flat out lie in the face of an obvious mistake?


Well in my mind, there exist two worlds as of now: the world where MZ and poofter are mafia together and they are so deep in my pockets that it is unbelievable, or the world where Odin is mafia. As you can tell from my reads, I am living in world 2. So if Odin is mafia, his strategy to try and break into the group would be to target me or MZ, and he chose me so far. IF mderg is mafia with Odin, he could very easily helped push that agenda or it was a very clever scheme to distance himself from Odin. I just don't really see them being mafia together in my mind, and as of now Odin is 90% mafia in my mind.

Why have I dropped on bunnies? Well I was asleep when she posted the thing I really didn't like, which was he cell order. The thing I least like about it is that she places her cell 3rd. I just don't get the argument behind it. I am on board with batsnacks about the mayor putting his cell 1st. I could also come to understand that if everyone believes the mayor is 100% town and someone else in their cell is 90% town, then you could put that group last and have "confirmed" towns for the duration of the game. That said, it is not what George Washington has decreed. I also don't like he placement of D or B. I think putting D 2nd makes me skeptical as hell and I don't like her justification for it. I think it might be indicative of belief that it is an easy ML group. I also don't like cell B last, because I think it will be a very clear town win.


So odin is mafia and universal town read ritoky and mz are in his group. Who does mafia odin try and target? Universal town read ritoky or could be suspicious mz? Why have you jumped to the totally opposite conclusion of what any mafia trying to push a mislynch would do? Associative cases should also never be used here or in mafia games in general, just because 2 people are doing similar things does not mean they share the same alignment.


Sorry, I don't really understand this post. I guess it's cuz I speak amerikan.
“When interest is at variance with conscience, any distinction to make them friends will serve the hollow-hearted.” -Henry Home
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:13 GMT
#612
On May 29 2014 06:12 ritoky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2014 06:09 Holyflare wrote:
On May 29 2014 06:05 ritoky wrote:
On May 29 2014 05:51 Holyflare wrote:
Right there's been 12 pages since then and now and you've failed to update us on any of it or pressure anyone but give summarised reads, you had a strong town read on bunnies like the quote i just showed you but nothing in the 12 pages that you've seen so far since that read should have swayed you to her being not-town. Therefore cell E should actually be your STRONGEST cell so far and should be far far far ahead of everything else (apart from your own cell) because layabout would be a very easy lynch for you.

Mderg only admitted he was wrong because he was pressured with evidence to the contrary by Odin (+ points odin). Do mafia under pressure admit they were wrong when there is evidence present or stick it out and flat out lie in the face of an obvious mistake?


Well in my mind, there exist two worlds as of now: the world where MZ and poofter are mafia together and they are so deep in my pockets that it is unbelievable, or the world where Odin is mafia. As you can tell from my reads, I am living in world 2. So if Odin is mafia, his strategy to try and break into the group would be to target me or MZ, and he chose me so far. IF mderg is mafia with Odin, he could very easily helped push that agenda or it was a very clever scheme to distance himself from Odin. I just don't really see them being mafia together in my mind, and as of now Odin is 90% mafia in my mind.

Why have I dropped on bunnies? Well I was asleep when she posted the thing I really didn't like, which was he cell order. The thing I least like about it is that she places her cell 3rd. I just don't get the argument behind it. I am on board with batsnacks about the mayor putting his cell 1st. I could also come to understand that if everyone believes the mayor is 100% town and someone else in their cell is 90% town, then you could put that group last and have "confirmed" towns for the duration of the game. That said, it is not what George Washington has decreed. I also don't like he placement of D or B. I think putting D 2nd makes me skeptical as hell and I don't like her justification for it. I think it might be indicative of belief that it is an easy ML group. I also don't like cell B last, because I think it will be a very clear town win.


So odin is mafia and universal town read ritoky and mz are in his group. Who does mafia odin try and target? Universal town read ritoky or could be suspicious mz? Why have you jumped to the totally opposite conclusion of what any mafia trying to push a mislynch would do? Associative cases should also never be used here or in mafia games in general, just because 2 people are doing similar things does not mean they share the same alignment.


Sorry, I don't really understand this post. I guess it's cuz I speak amerikan.


Let's say you are mafia and someone in your cell is getting a town read from everyone. You come into the thread and realise this and you're mafia so you need a mislynch. Who do you target to try and push that mislynch and get a point in favour of your side? Do you target universal town read or the person who isn't universal town read?
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
May 28 2014 21:14 GMT
#613
HF for all what it is worth it is just WIFOM.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:14 GMT
#614
On May 29 2014 06:14 ShiaoPi wrote:
HF for all what it is worth it is just WIFOM.


it's really just not wifom
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
May 28 2014 21:15 GMT
#615
it is. you are looking at it from the perspective of how you would play scum. Does not necessarily mean it is optimal or anything or how another player will go at it.
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
May 28 2014 21:17 GMT
#616
Cell A is just a tossup currently anyway.
I do not like ritoky, MZ's greatest contribution was just buddying like silly and Odin has not been around long enough for me to make a read on him
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:19 GMT
#617
On May 29 2014 06:15 ShiaoPi wrote:
it is. you are looking at it from the perspective of how you would play scum. Does not necessarily mean it is optimal or anything or how another player will go at it.


I have played scum enough times to get into the mindset of anyone that plays scum. He's never played mafia afaik (from the database) so this would be his FIRST time playing scum. First time scum are super nervous about doing anything out of the ordinary, they fit into trends, they will follow people, they won't speak their mind and they won't go against the grain of the town to speak up on something that no many people agree with.

His agenda is to win a point, going after someone with pretty much town reads from 100% of people is not what a first time mafia would do.
ritoky
Profile Joined March 2011
United States6851 Posts
May 28 2014 21:20 GMT
#618
On May 29 2014 06:17 ShiaoPi wrote:
Cell A is just a tossup currently anyway.
I do not like ritoky, MZ's greatest contribution was just buddying like silly and Odin has not been around long enough for me to make a read on him


What don't you like?

Where on this pie chart do you fall?

[image loading]
“When interest is at variance with conscience, any distinction to make them friends will serve the hollow-hearted.” -Henry Home
ShiaoPi
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
May 28 2014 21:22 GMT
#619
your entire freedom thing is just useless fluff and I have no idea how more than half of this thread seems to read you as town, when you are at best a nullread
LiquidDota Staff@TW_ShiaoPi
TL+ Member
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30775 Posts
May 28 2014 21:25 GMT
#620
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/449768-cell-mini-mafia-ii?page=29#564

i like this odin post, i'm town reading him right now for it
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