EPTYou Only Shoot Once Mafia
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On April 26 2014 14:47 geript wrote: ##Vote Caller There's lots of amounts of stupid that I can deal with; well maybe not lots, but that's beside the point. But either fake nuking or real nuking idk 4 hours into a game means you don't care about the game whatsoever. If Caller is town, this is 100% unacceptable especially since Day Vig powers are no-flip. On top of this, Palmer's best day is day 1; why in the fuck if Caller was town would he give Palmer any incentive to just fuck off like that. Like it's a complete crapshoot to think that this would "incentivize" Palmer to read/analyze/whatever over just saying "fuck this game." I know that Caller is known for some pretty fucked up games and as far as I know he's not a half bad player. This play is just fucking ridiculous; if you don't want to play, then don't play. But if you're going to pull bullshit like this, then we're going to fucking lynch you for it. If this isn't real, then we'll find out but I see no reason not to lynch the fuck out of Caller as of right now. 2 My initial reaction is definitely to nod along with this. On April 26 2014 14:54 Blazinghand wrote: I honestly don't see how this says anything about caller's alignment. If you really thought that caller was scum blatantly shooting someone geript you wouldn't feel the need to write such a long paragraph justifying such a simple thought. Caller is just Caller and you're just scum. Scum who is overexplaining cause he knows he's lying ##vote geript I don't agree. In a game with a jillion dayvigs analyzing the use of dayvig shots is actually significant. Plus, do you actually disagree with his analysis? Or just with his post length? On April 26 2014 14:54 VisceraEyes wrote: If Caller is scum someone like Foolishness or Ace dies if they're town not Palmar. This is a good point though. Not voting caller despite mostly agreeing with On April 26 2014 15:02 Blazinghand wrote: VE, be more careful with your posts. They don't grow on trees! Slam, keep on posting, the sooner you use yours up, the better. VE: I understand what you're saying about Palmar, but I do not think it likely he will flip scum. I don't think it's a good policy to just maxvote anyone with a nuke on them because thye MIGHT be scum and shoot someone. If there's anyone I'd trust as town to actually make a non-shit shot, also (besides myself, who never misses) it would be palmar. I'd rather place my vote on geript. Suck it. I like this post too.... How do so many ppl be making so much sense? On April 26 2014 15:45 Caller wrote: ##Vote: Visceraeyes #rekt Ok I never thought I would be agreeing with caller so early but here we are... VE just feels scummy here. At what point do we start calling alakazam scum for wasting his posts spamming so he doesn't have to contribute? Posting now cause my phone is getting wet and I don't want to accidentally delete stuff. | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Is this because he thinks caller is scum? I don't see any evidence of that. So palmar's being pissy. Last game he fucked off because he was pissed at the setup having too many third party players. He was town (but he lost his extra wincon basically because of that, if he had kept playing we would have bought more stuff from him.) But yeah, this doesn't make me think palmar is scum. Actually, if he really does have some power to mess with town he would presumably use it without warning to cause extra chaos, so he's probably either lying scum or pissed off town. Actually, now that I think of it, when I look at the player list and say "who is the most likely to overreact as town and rage-use a power when I shoot them", palmar is in the top two or three for me together with rol and oatsmaster. Not sure what to make of that. Presumably if palmar's town and caller is scum, caller doesn't know palmar's role. So if caller is scum, and still goads palmar like that, he's likely bulletproof in some way. @koshi On April 26 2014 20:23 Koshi wrote: Ok. Palmar is scum. Nice shot Caller. I & Palmar respect Palmar too much for this kind of childish outburst. Ruining the game for town because a scum shot him? He wont do that as town. Palmar is also not trying or promising to read the game. His only interest is taking Caller with him. As town he would only want that if Caller is scum. But then the ruining game for town thing doesnt make sense. Or Palmar lost many dota games and is angry at everybody. Do you really believe the bolded? I don't. [b]host question: is anything known about scum KP? On April 27 2014 01:05 Oatsmaster wrote: Hey Ve, you got shot as scum by someone doing pretty much the exact same thing as Caller right? The guy who shot VE that game was not town though, he was a third party assassin. [B]On April 27 2014 01:37 VayneAuthority wrote: because it doesn't make any sense and ur right typo on my part. Look at role list ---> palmar's threats are unfounded ---> why take him seriously unless you have a motive to focus town's attention on this? It doesn't say in the OP that those are the only roles in the game. It just said those roles may be in the game. That said, I agree palmar is either pardoner or bluffing. | ||
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strongandbig
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On April 26 2014 15:37 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm not in the business of voting for town for playing against how I think they should play. I want to lynch scum. I think geript's outrage at Caller's shot and his numbering his posts makes him more likely to be town. I think IF Palmar is town then there's a chance he'll rage-shoot Caller, and if he's scum then I don't care WHO he might shoot, but until he proves he's town I don't want him shooting anyone. On reread I don't get as bad a vibe from this post as I did before. I guess the first part feels a bit off/overwrought, but it's not as terrible as it seemed. That said, I don't like how VE insists on misunderstanding the caller situation, and how he hasn't been talking about anything but saying the same stuff over and over. Caller's shot is terrible play as either alignment unless he thinks he can get away with it. One for one as scum is terrible and as town his shot is worse, with no information on palmar before shooting. So we are left with two possibilities - either caller is terrible/is playing illogically/doesn't actually want to play, or he thinks he can get away with this shot. This much should be obvious. So if caller is playing illogically and randomly nuking, it obviously says nothing about his alignment. On the other hand, if he did this because he thought he could get away with it or for some other strategic reason, it seems to me much more likely that he's scum. He would have to have some kind of plan or extra information to make a calculation that this would work. What does that mean about VE? Well, VE focuses only on reasons why caller making this shot as scum would be strategically terrible, and even goes so far as to pull a strategic reason for caller to do this as town out of his ass. He ignores the (in my mind far more likely) possibility of a non-strategic action as either alignment. He also ignores the possibility that caller has some extra information as scum, which as I said above makes a strategic shot much more likely to have come from scum than town. I don't like that when this is the only thing VE has talked about, he's ignoring possibilities and building a particular story that I think is very unlikely. It feels kind of like VE knows caller is town. There are possible scum motivations for this. Someone else said that as scum VE likes talking about things where he's right, and if VE knows caller is town then he would be guaranteed to be right. Also, as long as he focuses on this one "big event," he won't have to participate in conversations about other players. (Except for the throwaway townread on geript.) So yeah. It's not a slam dunk but I'm putting my scum bet on VE at this point. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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If people are going to call me scum for including nuance and being honest in my description of my thought process so be it Let me tlmafia it up for you, I'll feign certainty and reduce the actual explanation Palmar could easily be town because he is a vengeful pissant who would actually just say "fuck you guys" as town, as demonstrated by his behavior in catastrophe. However he wanted us to go after caller because he is a pissant not because he thought caller was scum Caller's fake nuke says nothing about his alignment, as he is a shitty troll who would waste a fake nuke on the most provocative target as either alignment VE is scum because his reasoning for caller being town is contrived and snacks of extra information plus he was using it as an excuse not to talk about other people. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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Like, compare this game to catastrophe. Or any town foolishness game. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On April 28 2014 00:03 Koshi wrote: ##vote: SnB strongandbig is actually going after Foolishness "for not caring enough". Also superawesome research work on SnB part. This is a pretty srs misinterpretation. I'm not going after him for not caring enough, I'm going after him for not providing explicit reasoning for his votes, when in my experience he provides said reasoning as town even when he's short on time. Also how had you not voted me already? | ||
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strongandbig
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On April 27 2014 10:00 Koshi wrote: snb his post are strange. His head doesn't make sense to me. He agrees with Caller on the VE read. Next post he shows he didn't think further about the whole Caller Nuke on Palmar his head till this post. So how does this make sense? As a townie you see Caller trow a nuke on Palmar. You see then VE being quite scummy. So you quote a post of Caller saying you totally agree with him about his VE read without taking into account this guy just dropped a nuke? (1) SnB can't see why Palmar might think Caller is scum? A pretty good reason would be Palmar is town and there is a nuke going for his head right? (additional the extra info about the merchant stuff is filler, nobody knows what the fuck SnB is talking about here except the people who played in the GreYmist game and I can tell you it is useless filler) (2) This townread is so lazy... Palmar did jack shit the entire game but hold town hostage and he gives a townread because Palmar warned town for going to be antitown... Really strange townread. (3) Finds some reason for why Caller might be scum because Palmar is hotheaded. ---> Makes me think SnB knows things like for example: SnB knows Palmar is scum and therefore can't take into account a town Palmar being upset because there is a nuke going for his head. SnB gives strange reads. SnB scum. So koshi's reason why I'm scum is that I have strange reads. Lets talk about this in detail. First paragraph: I had a gut "this is scummy" reaction when I saw ve's post. I didn't have it on rereading but the thing you're quoting is from my initial read through post. Anyway you're committing a fallacy here. When a player makes a post about another player, what that post says about the poster and what it says about the subject of the post are two independent questions. First, because pre flip connection theories are inherently unreliable; and second, because even if the poster is scum, his post can still be attacking either another townie or a scumbuddy, and judging the post based on the perceived alignment of the poster is therefore an exercise in wifom. What I'm saying is, even though caller did throw a nuke and looked like scum, I try to judge whether I agree with his reactions and reasoning about other players separately from whether I think those reactions and reasoning make him scum. Sometimes those conclusions feed into each other, like if someone's reasoning is bad and I can find a scum motivation for that bad reasoning. So yes, I do "quote a post of Caller saying you totally agree with him about his VE read without taking into account this guy just dropped a nuke." Now, point (1). You're twisting my words here. I didn't say I couldn't see why palmar might think caller is scum. Palmar had not posted a single thing at that point either accusing caller of being scum, or explaining why he thought caller was scum. I thought and still think it was more likely that palmar had simply raged out at caller and wanted him dead regardless of caller's alignment. Plus, the merchant stuff wasn't useless filler; it was evidence that palmar is the kind of player who will rage out and play counterproductively if he gets pissed off, because that's what his play looked like to me in the later parts of catastrophe. Point (2) - do you honestly disagree? At this point, Palmar thought like everyone else did that the nuke would land at deadline. Saving the pardoner power until deadline rather than soft-claiming it seems like much stronger scum play to me. First explain why this is incorrect or non-townie logic from me, then call me scum for it. Point (3) - my entire read of palmar at this point was based on the fact that he was pissed off at caller for nuking him. That's like the whole reasoning I explained in the paragraph that you labelled (1). How is that me knowing palmar is scum? Like, how does this show me having extra information at all? Also, you're not reading what I wrote again. What I said was that if caller is scum and palmar is town, then caller would likely be bulletproof or something, because palmar is likely to attack back. As scum, I do think a town palmar makes sense as a target for a nuke. It's getting rid of a strong town player, plus palmar is likely to rage and create chaos. The problem is, palmar is also the kind of target I would expect from a troll caller, for the same reason. Anyway - none of the points in this case actually make sense. They don't connect to what I said at all. Koshi is building a case for me being scum but it doesn't engage with what I actually said, it just works it into a fake narrative that I'm scum. | ||
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strongandbig
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I will get you killed | ||
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strongandbig
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Anyway, bh asked me to read him as well so here it is. He accused geript of overexplaining and put an early vote down, flipped that vote a few times, and made his own overexplained case on me. Honestly, I've stopped expecting much out of bh. I know his read on me is wrong, and I really disagreed with how he justified his vote on geript. I know he won't be happy if I just say "he's been wrong in a scummy way, but his posts don't give me a strong gut impression and I don't really expect him to be right so I have a mild scum lean" so I'm gonna go ahead and say "he's 100% scum seal of approval lynch this motherfucker but lynch VE first and probably some other people too." | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On April 28 2014 01:49 strongandbig wrote: Yeah but it will be easier I know he's a decently strong town player who you would be shooting without giving a chance to actually explain himself; that you would be shutting down his accusation of you; that if you shoot him it makes him town unless I'm wrong about your alignment; and that if you shoot him during the day he won't flip. Those sound like good reasons that shooting him would make it easier to get you killed. Seriously explain to me how you shooting Yamato before he explains his case on you would be a townie action. Go ahead. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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i would rather lynch him than caller or palmar or me but that's not gonna surprise anyone | ||
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On April 28 2014 06:55 justanothertownie wrote: Ok, we really need to consolidate. At least to 2-3 lynch candidates. You filthy americans may think it's a long time until lynch but us poor eu people will never make that deadline. Also some people have used most of their posts already. Something like Vayne/oats/Palmar would be my preference I think... ##unvote ##vote: oatsmaster | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Honestly if there's a last minute voteswitch to anyone other than oats it should probably be to slam. Even his explanation doesn't make sense, when he shot Yamato he had already said he was gonna shoot bh not ramdomize between my voters. Seems like an excuse to use a shot without having to justify a strong scum read. It's not just a yolo trollshot like caller's fake nuke was, IMO. Anyway I'll try and sneak a peek at my phone in an hour or so to see if I need to switch my vote. But I've explained my thought processes already and if you still think I'm lying then fine, at least if I get lynched I'll flip town and you can all QQ about how wrong you were. | ||
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strongandbig
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If I die you guys are dumb, because I'm town. Anyone who votes me while thinking I'm town should be seriously looked at - if people are null on me then whatever, but if someone thinks I'm town then swapping to me "to avoid a no lynch" is an antitown move. If I'm dead I guess I'll maybe play again in a few months? We'll see. | ||
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