EPTNewbie Mini Mafia LV
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 24 2014 08:03 Promethelax wrote: We're one short. Though if we get no new players for another few days I'll probably start us on monday using one of the replacements/a slightly modified set-up. Not to criticize your counting skills, and I don't know about private stuff, but if dfs is #9, then #10 yell0w #11 me #12 epishade #13 amiko I might be mistaken though. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 10:46 sqrtofneg1 wrote: It's early stages, let's just fool around. I am not particularly a fan of this post, and a lot of the subsequent posts by sqrt. I understand that this is day 1 and information is at an all time low, but encouraging fooling around and then continuing to do so after some legitimate discussion has begun rubs me the wrong way. I also read Epishade's comments as deflective and dismissive. Unlike Bunnies and like you Epishade I am not convinced that yell0w is scum at all, but you seem to want to say "it's a joke, move on". I disagree, I think bunnies is right to apply pressure and see a response. It seems strange to me that you seem to want to simply move on before legitimate response has been explored. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 12:01 sqrtofneg1 wrote: There was no legitimate discussion prior to that post from my point of view. I thought that Eden was fooling around too. on page 11 you're still talking about a previous game. your response to yell0w's saying "I'm mafia" was "kill him", which wasn't substantiated in any way, which makes me think it was intended as a joke. that would be the "continuing to do so" portion of my post. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 12:07 Epishade wrote: Sqrt screwed around a bunch at the start on the other newbie mafia games too, so that's not out of the ordinary for me. I think Bunny is pushing too hard for a comment made in jest. I may be wrong, and Yellow may be scum, but it seems to me that Bunny loaded that question against Yellow, and then when Yellow answered truthfully, that contradicted his comment he made before that was made in jest. I think Bunny could have just been aiming to paint Yellow in a potential scum-light, but then Yellow joked that "you caught me." Bunny decided to roll with it and vote for Yellow right then, as an easy way to get rid of someone quickly with the first lynch. Really? Because to me, it seemed like bunnies was looking for 1 of 3 things to happen: 1) yell0w to get hyper defensive (which didn't happen) 2) yell0w to counter with aggression (which didn't happen) 3) or someone to deflect for him (which did) I don't think yell0w is scum right now at all, he responded how he responded. It wasn't ideal, but he is sticking to his story saying it was a joke and I don't read him as hyper defensive about it. But you seem to be very pushy about this entire topic and very heavily deflecting for him. It could just be a legitimate read and belief that it is a joke, but you could also be mafia deflecting for another mafia or mafia trying to deflect/pocket a town who faced early pressure. For the most part I simply don't like how you seem to want to move on from what I think is the only real substantive thing happening right now. Not wanting more information and more reads and more reactions tends to be a scummy thing. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 12:20 Yell0w wrote: Just before I leave, just one question for rikory, what would have been a better response from me? What was the ideal response? You could at least get my name right D: And I can't really say cause I don't know you or your personality. You were asked a loaded question, and seemed intent on making a joke, so idk make a joke about contradicting yourself? | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 13:44 Epishade wrote: I guess we just had different interpretations of what he said, leading us to have different conclusions over how to handle it. I thought it was a clear joke and nothing more, but since you saw differently you attacked him. I didn't think the attack was warranted and that's when I got my initial scumread on you etc. I've posted my reasoning before. See, that makes sense to me; but what doesn't make sense to me about your reaction is that you wanted the entire convo to simply go away/end. Which is why I read you as deflecting off of yell0w. If what you're saying is true, and you had a different view of the situation that led you to a scum read on bunnies; then why didn't you push hard back on bunnies? To me you read less so as accusatory toward bunnies and moreso as let's stop talking about this. It also seemed to me at the time, that you were setting yourself up in a bit of the "I told you so" position if yell0w ended up being a mislynch, which I also didn't like. But you have come around a bit for me, the openness in your change of opinion bought you back some credit for me, but I am still now sold on you as town, especially if yell0w appears any more mafia than he currently does when he comes back and starts typing. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 14:10 Epishade wrote: Also, just to be clear, is that a typo where you say "but I am still now sold on you as town,"? Did you mean to say "not" instead? yea it's a typo, shoulda been not. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 29 2014 11:29 27ninjabunnies wrote: We got em boys! And ladies? Lynch em!!! @Yell0w, seriously, you claim mafia, I lynch you in a heartbeat. Been in toooo many games where someone has claimed mafia, doesn't get lynched, and turns out to be mafia. ##VOTE: Yell0w On April 29 2014 12:19 Epishade wrote: Hmmm, I guess I just felt that Yellow was getting unjustly accused of being mafia. I didn't want people to bandwagon on him for making a simple joke throught Bunny's influence. But you've convinced me of Bunny's actions. I take back my scumread on her. I can see how they might have been justified, without anything else to go on right now. She was just digging for information. On April 29 2014 12:20 Yell0w wrote: Just before I leave, just one question for rikory, what would have been a better response from me? What was the ideal response? On April 29 2014 12:43 mtamburini wrote: Bunnies I think we need to apply pressure back on YELLOW. How should I have responded? If your town you shouldnt care on how to appear more towny. This a classic rookie mafia mistake. ##VOTE: Yell0w That is pretty much the most pertinent posts that are beyond 2 pages back in my opinion, you should be able to make your own determinations from them. On April 29 2014 12:10 27ninjabunnies wrote: The bolded part is exactly what I am trying to get at. It's his response, and others' responses to this. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
tamburini: I don't understand the majority of the hate in regard to tamburini. He declared himself the lead of the town with his first post, which you don't have to agree with and I certainly don't; but it places spotlight on him. From that post forward in the entire game he will be under a microscope, so either he is that confident in his scum play or has nothing to hide. As of now, I have no reason to believe he has anything to hide. I personally believe that if he is scum trying to insert himself into the leadership role that he will run himself into the ground eventually. However, what I don't get is why everyone dislikes his reason for voting on yell0w. Personally, with my read on yell0w, I think tamburini is mistaking scum for just bad play; but I wouldn't be opposed to lynching yell0w. To me, tamburini's point is that town should be concerned primarily with locating and lynching scum, and yell0w's primary concern was appearing town. Appearing to be town is mafia's job, not town's. epishade: I have red flags all around epishade, and have for a while. I don't really like many of his reads at all, but before that happened he was deflecting hard for yell0w and trying to kill conversation. There are 22 pages in this thread and a lot of it is predicated on the conversation that epishade didn't want to even happen. As I said earlier, his posts read more genuine and open which buy back some of the scum feel, but my gut says otherwise. bunnies: I have a fairly neutral read on bunnies as of now, leaning town. She is pushing discussion along, which increases the volume of information available (the opposite of what epishade was trying to do before) and to me is a town thing to do. I think what bunnies is doing is useful for town, which gives me a town read; but I am simply wary of people getting behind her on a BW, which will put her back toward neutral a bit for me until there's more to go off of. yell0w: For me, yell0w reads odd for me. Almost as if the game started at 50mph and yell0w was still going 30mph. I think his joke response was neither here nor there for me, but I liked his conviction in defending it when pressured. Then he seemed to be overly concerned with perception and since then has given a lot of info that is piggybacking off of someone else, so he is moving back down my list. Wouldn't be opposed to a lynch. sqrt: I don't know if it is a stylistic thing or what, but there's something weird here. Lots of prods, short comments, and question asking, not much in the way of legwork. Combine that with the lack of seriousness early on and it just strikes me as all very odd. I don't read him as projecting town in any way; whereas most other people I can read town aspects to what they do and say. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 30 2014 05:10 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, I'm willing to bet that scum team isn't bunnies + yellow or epishade + yellow. why couldn't it be epishade and yell0w? epishade was deflecting HARD for yell0w early on. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
you don't think that there is even a possibility that epishade bailed from the sinking ship that is a mafia partner going down in flames? I am not saying it is a likelihood, but the fact that you don't even have that in your mind as a possibility concerns me. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 30 2014 05:35 27ninjabunnies wrote: So, you are putting me more neutral because of a BW lynch? I'm not trying to get a BW lynch going. A BW lynch didn't even happen. I unvoted, and then ttamburini, and now Eden, have voted on Yellow. So the idea of a BW lynch is irrelevant. Your reads, while have backing, are a bit odd to me, tbh. I'll need to hear fro you more. No, you misread that. I think that everything you're doing is very town thus far, but from my pov you have a lot of people putting their ducks in a row behind you very early on; which is something I am simply wary of. When the majority of people start agreeing on a lot of what 1 person says early on it either means that town is very right, or being helped down a bad path. So while I like what you are doing and am leaning town on you, I am simply wary. That is all. And what of my reads don't you like? We have the opposite opinion, from what I can tell, of what tamburini did. And I think it will take quite a lot to make me get over how hard epishade was deflecting and setting himself up in a contrarian position. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 30 2014 08:50 Yell0w wrote: So basically you're just saying the same things again? Okay, I answered everything there already in previous posts, except the last part, which players haven't been proactive or scumhunting. So here goes, in no specific orders: mysterymeat1, I don't think he did anything at all, yet seems present in the thread just lurking. ahswtini, basically just said he didn't like sarcasm because it caused confusion and said that he didn't suspect tamburini and was on the fence on sweetfrost, that's pretty much it, no suspicious read at all. I think dfs also hasn't said much, he did say tamburini was suspicious, don't quite remember if someone said it before though. And I disagree with the second part of your question. I am very confused by this. So you think that the people who are better lynch targets than you are a set of quiet people with very little justification? So you have nothing to really say at all about the couple of people who have walls of text in the thread? That is just odd to me. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On April 30 2014 09:17 Yell0w wrote: @ritoky No, I said there was better targets in people who haven't been proactive or scumhunting, since that was his only good argument, in my opinion. So when Eden asked what those better targets where, he was asking who I thought was less proactive and not scumhunting than me, of course he tried to make it seem like that wasn't his query, but it was. So I answered and said who I thought wasn't doing these things. So I'm saying these are the better lynch targets, if we're lynching people for not being proactive and scumhunting. They are not my biggest scum reads, because he wasn't asking for that. Okay well here you go then, I want you to convince me not to vote for you. Give me scum reads, give me some reason to vote for someone else. My stance on you is that I woke up today thinking "meh he is a little shady, but I am not sold" and throughout today I have gotten more sold. Further I think that lynching you provides me with more information in regard to Epishade who is my top scum read at the moment. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
Regarding what you said about sqrt, I could not agree more with "he did seem to be trying to start conversations when there wasn't one, I just don't think he was doing anything when there was one". And in my mind he just did it again. He said there is nothing going on when you and I were clearly interacting. He just seems to be waiting for everyone else to play the game so that he can pick the winning side. Again, maybe it's a stylistic thing cuz basically nothing he says seems town to me so far, but I just can't find any reason to put him on the good side of the tracks Regarding Epishade, of course we are going to disagree. He came in to defend and deflect for you, that's how I got my scum read on him; but I understand that is the same exact reason why you read him town. I don't really like your scum reads, as I think I have made it clear multiple times I don't read scum on tamburini and I feel that his play thus far, if he is scum, will lead to his own demise. Sweetfrost, after reading his filter, seems to me to be someone who didn't like the direction of the game, and when he saw me doing something different than what was going on got behind it. To me it is either a townie who has similar concerns as me or a mafia trying to dig deep in my pockets early. I can't really say I have enough info to call him mafia, so for now he is more townie. I personally don't see tamburini's lynch or sweetfrost's lynch as better than yours currently. Barring some other evidence the 4 people I am most comfortable lynching as of now are epishade, yell0w, sqrt, and mysterymeat (in somewhat close to that order). | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
I think you're shady for 3 major reasons: 1) You have been non-stop deflecting and trying to get all the attention off of yell0w. When the pressure turned back up you tried to throw it on tamburini. 2) You're respond to those who are reading you town with only positivity and to those who are reading you scum with aggression. 3) I read your filter and almost every post has the word bunny in it or is a response to a post made by bunny. In my reads earlier I told bunny to be wary of people lining their ducks in a row up behind her, and you're very guilty of doing this. You even agreed that tamburini looked a bit weird when someone pointed out that he kept appealing to bunny to get on board the yell0w train. I think you have been doing similar things but in a more subtle way. I also think there are redeeming qualities to you: 1) I think you really are looking at people's posts and trying to figure out alignments. 2) You do legwork rather than the stuff that Ashtwini is doing where it is regurgitation and hopping on a BW 3) You're willing to be and admit to being wrong. Those redeeming qualities are some of the reasons I haven't pushed heavily for a vote on you thus far, even though I have said you are scummy. On May 01 2014 07:37 Eden1892 wrote: Yeah this claim is fucking stupid. - If there's a mafia roleblocker, mtamburini just wasted our vigilante for literally no gain. - Even if he's not roleblocked, we have no way of knowing he's not the serial killer. In fact, his specific suggestion that the parity cop check him tonight and someone else n2 would fit perfectly with a serial killer planning to pick investigation immunity tonight. - I think an actual vigilante would have thought through these problems before claiming. - Even if we ignore the above, look at the context. This claim is basically "I'm just gonna claim because yolo didn't read." What purpose does this serve? How does this advance the town agenda? I don't think mtamburini is mafia, but I'm thinking there's a good chance he's the serial killer. I'm going to reread the whole thread and see how I feel about everyone else; I don't think this changes my scumread on Yell0w because mafia/sk is, from what I remember, a decent explanation for their interaction. While I'm reading, I want everyone online to tell me what they think about mtamburini's claim. @Eden: I mean, I thought everyone else saw what I saw when tamburini claimed he was leader of the town. I thought it was him softing a role that was going to come out early (such as cop) or a role that is self-proving (such as vigi). Hence why I was buying his cool-aid a bit more. I guess maybe that was only me that read into that. So instead let's do a Cost-Benefit Analysis (CBA) of this situation: The world where tamburini is vigi: In the world where tamburini is vigi, he claims he will shoot tonight. If he does shoot tonight there are a couple possible results: 1) He shoots mafia, 2) He shoots a town, 3) He gets roleblocked, 4) He shoots into protection. In the event that he doesn't shoot, then he doesn't shoot and will be under heavy pressure and asked to explain himself. In the event of outcome #1 or #2 occurring we have a CONFIRMED townie for as long as he remains alive which results in a humongous boon for town. Essentially meaning that not lynching him gives us probably somewhere around a 50% chance (based on how you guess the game is set up) of having a confirmed town tomorrow, and probably a 15-20% chance of having a dead mafia + confirmed town tomorrow. (warning: these numbers are not actual calculations, they are made up in my head) The world where tamburini is sk: In the world where tamburini is sk, he MUST kill tonight (at least from when I have previously played sk's must kill every night), and thus the same 4 outcomes will happen: 1) He shoots mafia, 2) He shoot town, 3) He gets roleblocked, 4) He shoots into protection. The major difference between these two worlds won't actually happen during day 2. I think that if outcome 3 or 4 happens, he will have some explaining to do; if outcome 1 or 2 happens then he will be essentially confirmed town for day 2, BUT when 2 kp happens again on night 2; it will be 100% confirmed he is sk and he will henceforth be lynched. The world where he is neither: I see 3 real outcomes to that: 1) he logs on in a few hours and claims this was a reaction test and makes reads predicated upon that, 2) the vigi shoots him in the night for false claiming, 3) he comes back day 2 admits he was fake and trying to save himself from a lynch, and we have to judge him from there. I will let you make your own determinations in regard to what you feel is best, but personally I think there is 0 reason to lynch him right now. His claim is such that he will demonstrate who he is over the course of the next 2 night phases if he lives that long. Plus he gives the town potential for a night kill on a mafia AND a confirmed townie by tomorrow. I just don't see how you don't want that potential. Unless you are claiming vigi over the top of him, in which case he is 100% mafia or sk and we have to decide who we believe. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 01 2014 13:06 Eden1892 wrote: I'm running through the possible scenarios and not getting any non-obvious conclusions. If he's the serial killer we want to lynch him, if he's the vigilante we don't want to lynch him, there's no surefire way today to know the difference, and the serial killer and vigilante are identical as far as the mafia's incentives go -- a source of additional nightkills that could get targeted at them but are statistically more likely to hit town -- so the mafia aren't going to do anything that would let us discern the difference. Hell, he could even be the vigilante and plausibly survive the night depending on whether or not there's a jailkeeper or town roleblocker in the game -- if the mafia player sent to kill the vigilante was roleblocked or jailed, then there'd only be one kill and mtamburini would be alive, in which case we'd probably assume he's a nightkill-immune serial killer and mislynch him anyway. There's just too many possible role interactions to verify anything with certainty. No, I don't think there's any "policy" decision to make, so to speak; the logic from role interactions doesn't give any absolute conclusion like it does in some cases (ex: don't lynch a d1 normal cop claim and make the mafia play around it). It comes down to whether or not you believe his claim. As I've argued before, his claim makes no sense from a town POV. He was completely unprompted. It was way too early out to be claiming to avoid a lynch. If he wanted to confirm himself as town he'd have waited until d2 to claim and then he'd have shot tonight, then claimed the kill on d2. No one asked him for his claim, and it distracted us for the last few pages. Furthermore he's done nothing substantial besides this to scumhunt or make any progress toward clarifying the game state. I guess it doesn't come as a surprise to me because I felt he was softing it since the very start if the game, hence why I find it more believable. I agree with you that his contributions to the town thus far are fairly low outside of what I feel still was a decent call out on yell0w. But I disagree with you that he was "unprompted"; he had the most votes in the game at that point and suitable momentum headed toward him. I think it was a case of claiming earlier to avoid it looking like a desperate and made up claim. As for what you said in regard to scenarios I am still mulling that over in my head and thinking about possible outcomes, so I will take a rain-check on responding to that part. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 01 2014 14:22 Yell0w wrote: Also, ritoky, I am pretty sure mysterymeat1 was third to vote against tamburini, not ahs. On April 29 2014 11:21 Yell0w wrote: I never actually played mafia, I play werewolf in real life, which is pretty much the same I guess, and I don't think him talking is indicative of him being mafia or not, I just think he likes talking. May I point out you said this. On April 29 2014 11:03 Yell0w wrote: So this sqrt guy sure seems to enjoy talking, so he's probably mafia. Yet you don't think him talking a lot is indicative of being mafia? Contradicting yourself already?[/QUOTE] Bunnies is on the hunt! Ill let you borrow my noose.[/QUOTE] On April 29 2014 12:43 mtamburini wrote: Bunnies I think we need to apply pressure back on YELLOW. How should I have responded? If your town you shouldnt care on how to appear more towny. This a classic rookie mafia mistake. ##VOTE: Yell0w On April 29 2014 11:53 mtamburini wrote: I need to prove to myself and the others that have played with me that I am not a donkey and can find scum. My piss poor performance from last game mis hammering on Moose had bothered me for a while and when I heard there was another noobie game I was excited to come back and gain redemption. My inspiration. On April 29 2014 12:52 mtamburini wrote: Fuck that shit no one is off the table today, I want this Yell0w person to die after everything thats happened. 1 Sarcasm 2 Asking how I can be more towny is not towny. These are 2 really good reasons to push harder on Yell0w. I liked bunnies initial push but wasnt ready to jump on board just yet, wanted Yell0w to talk some more and see what they had to say, and I did not like anything said so far. On April 29 2014 22:21 mtamburini wrote: She didn't ask how to be more towny, she asked why is she getting slack for pushing on you and voting on you when Eden just casts a vote on someone who has not said a word and has no accusation towards then. If you can't see the difference in questioning and tone from your question to hers then I don't know what to tell you. On April 30 2014 01:16 mtamburini wrote: I like this fellow. Has not said much of anything but has picked up on something that no one else had really brought up (maybe not even thought about too) Can you give more details on yellow and/or anyone else? It is way tooo early in a mafia game to start trying to pocket someone this hard. Literally at least half of his posts are bunny lets do this, bunny lets do that. She ain't your gf bro. Also I like how in the last post i quoted, dfs points that yellow has been cleared and tamburini asks for details on yellow first and mentions other people as an after thought. [/QUOTE] On April 30 2014 15:57 Epishade wrote: I literally just brought that up in my big post 40 minutes ago or so. On April 30 2014 15:58 MysteryMeat1 wrote: ##VOTE: mtamburini #freeYell0w On April 30 2014 16:03 Epishade wrote: ##VOTE: mtamburini On April 30 2014 18:32 ahswtini wrote: This is a great post. I have nothing insightful of my own to add to the analysis there. However, out of the three, I think mtamburini is the best lynch here. ritoky and sweetfrost's posts are better in that they talk about many different people, whereas mtamburini seems to be gunning straight for yell0w. Therefore it'll be handier to keep ritoky and sweetfrost around for longer as we can get more information out of them provided they continue their way of posting. ##Vote: mtamburini That's in order of posting. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
I am going to ##vote: ashtwini. For me, he is currently a combination of non-helpful play and slightly scummy. I don't like how he was 3rd on the tamburini train citing only someone else's reasoning as justification. I also find it absolutely ridiculous that anyone wants to lynched a claimed vigi with no current counterclaim to him. The potential gain of having him alive is so much more valuable than almost anything anyone has typed thus far. It is an utterly bad idea for town imo. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
I believe tamburini's claim. I don't really read sweetfrost as more scummy than a lot of people. I am down to lynch epishade, ahswtini, and sqrt. If I need to move my vote off of ahs to one of the other two, then hopefully I can in time. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
Now that I can sit down and actually read through what I missed, I don't know how those of you here didn't 100% read him as town. If he is mafia or a role in that scenario he would have been wayyyyyy more desperate to stay alive. I simply don't understand how you read his posts and don't think he is town. On top of that there were basically 3 votes in rapid succession on Sweet for what I thought was the worst reasoning of the day. On May 02 2014 08:39 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, it's short. I can't seem to find anything really useful. I think it'd be more useful to look at the whole thread and see other people's reactions to him. I think this post is funny because: #1 the only person that Sweet seemed to have a particularly strong scum read on was you. And I also think that you missed the context in which his early posts came. He liked me a lot, partly because he liked my reads but I felt mostly because my reads were independent and different from the momentum of the game at that time. There was a lot of anti-tamburini people at that time and a lot of people thinking what he found on yell0w was complete crap. I find it suspicious that the same people who were primarily leading that charge early on were the same people that lynched him. So either they are a group of townies who are just straight reading the game wrong or we got some scum pushing agendas. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 02 2014 09:10 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Rit, I would like you to tell me what you think of the sweetfrost lynch. Did you not read my last post? Or anything I have posted for that matter? I think it was a BW that happened quickly and for the worst reasoning of the day. Particularly after he started typing toward the end. I think there was certainly 1 mafia on it, being Epishade, and potentially 2; second being you. If I had enough time to check my phone 1 more time before the voting ended I would have taken Amiko's advice and switched my vote to you. Outside of that I feel my stances on everything that happened during the day phase is pretty plain, you just have to read my posts. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 02 2014 09:29 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I meant the question in a different way. You're thinking about what happened. I want to know where you're gonna go from here now, and how sweetfrost flipping town affected your thoughts. You asked what I thought about a previous event...dunno how I was supposed to get to future implications from that. Personally I am going to have to agree with Tamburini on this one. Talking too much at night is just plain bad imo. I have my interpretation of what happened and a path that I will personally push for if I am alive. Explaining that now I don't really see as the greatest idea. That, and results of night actions could change that pov. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 02 2014 09:40 Epishade wrote: Can you explain why this is for me, as a new player? If you explain what you are thinking and the direction you want to go during the night phase, from my previous experience it can result in disaster. For example: say you're completely right in everything you believe and you say it all during the night, then the mafia can simply kill you to try and nip it in the bud. Say you're completely wrong in everything you believe, then the mafia can kill you and say "hey look that person is confirmed town, let's look more closely into who they were suspicious of". The positive is that it gets more information out there which is good for town, the negative is that it gives the mafia more options and paints larger targets on people. At least that is my personal opinion on the matter. I can understand if you disagree. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 02 2014 09:52 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, generally you just don't. Unless you're me, and you think you're gonna get killed N1, and you're vanilla town, so you have nothing to be afraid of. This too, in the first game I ever played and some subsequent ones after that there was no talking at all during night phases. It was kinda a stylistic/storytelling thing, that town sleeps at night and most people don't speak in their sleep. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 03 2014 08:49 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I would like everyone to improve their posting. This post wins irony of the month for me. Making dinner, then reading an posting. Already have a strong idea on what I am going to say though. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
Regarding my new #1 scummer sqrt: Why you're a scummer: 1) You demand substantially more information from people than you give back. To me this is indicative of two things: either you're mafia or you're the cop. I personally read you as mafia always trying to test the waters and end up on the winning side or at least a side where you'll get the least dirt on you. I haven't really seen you take any significant stance on your own or lead anything. You're always 2nd, 3rd, or 4th to something; and it sure as hell isn't for lack of activity or effort since your filter has 9 pages. 2) This one is very simple, you voted on sweetfrost who imo was CLEARLY town. You get a slight pass because you weren't there at the very end when he started typing in his defense and was beyond a shadow of a doubt town for his lack of desperation and other indicators in his post. 3) Your reaction to lynching a town was: 0 remorse On May 02 2014 07:57 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I think we can. No N1 flavour? awww.... Really? No flavor is what comes to mind? Not, oh crap I just contributed to a townie death for shit reasoning? Not even a single comment here about how he came up town. 4) You wait around for other's to make cases: On May 02 2014 08:27 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Good. Now, someone should do a vote analysis. Or anything really, I want to talk. "Someone" should do some vote analysis. Yeah, cuz you surely shouldn't even though you have the time to quite obviously. You wouldn't wanna get ahead of yourself and lead anything. Why not wait for someone else to do some analysis so you can make it your own later or follow right behind them. On May 02 2014 08:36 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Everyone, look through sweetfrost's filters, and tell us your thoughts! Go! On May 02 2014 08:39 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Well, it's short. I can't seem to find anything really useful. I think it'd be more useful to look at the whole thread and see other people's reactions to him. You can't find a single useful thing? Not one? Really? Cuz a lot of people didn't think he was scum and a few had him town read. So other people clearly found things, I mean I did. I don't think it's you not finding things, I think it is you not wanting to appear as you found things unless other people did. But wait, this isn't a unique occurrence cuz guess what? It happened again. On May 03 2014 08:33 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I think yellow and tambo are town. I can't really find anything from amiko's filter either, he was significantly more active than sweetfrost, but no on really suspected him. I'm gonna push an ahs lynch. ##Vote: ahswtini Now you can't find anything in Amiko's filter? AMIKO's? The person who I think was in every single person in the game's top 3 town with multiple pages of in depth analysis of players and you find not a damn thing? I find this absolutely ridiculous. Maybe I am able to buy you not finding anything in Sweetfrost's filter as the quantity and quality was significantly less. Okay, I guess I can see that. But I am not someone who buy's wolf tickets. You didn't find any info in either? Not buying it. And not buying you as town. I will make my case on Epishade in a bit because I have to do some things, but it isn't much different than it was before. I also think that unless Epishade or Yell0w die during the night (nice 1 tambo), that it seems almost inevitable that we will have to lynch between them. I will explain why I think that in the other post later. but for now let's cap this off with ##vote: sqrtofneg1 | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 03 2014 10:48 sqrtofneg1 wrote: #1 I've always indulged people with whatever they asked of me. Not my fault they don't ask me much. #2 Well, why aren't you going after the other people who voted sweetfrost then? Sure, you have epishade as #2 scum, but what about bunnies? #3 What about you? Did you have any remorse? #4 This one I can't argue. I do like to wait to see what others think first, before telling my reads. As for not finding anything in the filters, I would like you to find something useful. Sweetfrost honestly gave me nothing, and amiko's only showed his thoughts. No one suspected him, no one really directly interacted with him. So his filter also gave me next to nothing. #1 Why do you have to be prompted or pinged in order to share your thoughts and reads? To me, being open and forthright reads town and hiding and waiting reads as having something to hide, whether its a role or mafia. And I don't have a role read on you. #2 I personally thought we were going to wake up with bunnies dead since she was top of a lot of people's town list, but if Epishade is mafia like I think perhaps he believes he is in her pockets, so she is more valuable alive to him than Amiko was. #3 I think you don't read my posts. I got to my phone 7 minutes late, and wanted to switch my vote to you; and I was nearly irate that people didn't read his lack of desperation as CLEARLY town. I would also like to note that you were the hammer vote (last vote) on a townie. And then just moved on...how is that not scummy? #4 What can I say, I am probably gonna read that method of play as scummy 8 times outta 10 then, to me it just seems like you are waiting to pick the side that ends up least dirty. You just have too much of a self-preservationist approach to appear as VT to me, and like I said, I don't have a role read on you; so that leaves 1 option. The one I arrived at. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
Actions speak louder than words, there's plenty of time in the day for you to fall from #1 scummer. I mean, epishade isn't that far behind. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 03 2014 11:45 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I townread epishade initially because he had taken the time to look at the other games. What reenforced my townread was that he was contributing. He was doing what a good townie should do. My suspicions of him included the votecount, which I made a mistake on, and that he's sheeping most of the time. Okay, but that missed the point a bit. I want to know why those reasons make Epishade higher on your town list than yell0w, to the point where in a final 3 situation you would lynch yell0w. Because in my mind the negative there seems a lot larger than those two positives, which begs the question what about yell0w? | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 03 2014 12:43 sqrtofneg1 wrote: I'm sorry, I don't understand what you're saying here. You stated reasons why you think Epishade is town, but not why he is more town than yell0w. So much so that you would lynch yell0w in a f3 scenario. I am also saying that I think the negative you listed outweighs the 2 positives in my mind. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 14:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: Okay, I can talk finally! I'll read through the last few pages and give yall something to go off of. So here's what we are looking at at the moment. If tamburini got roleblocked, there are two roleblockers in this game, possibly town and mafia. I doubt they would put two mafia rbs or two town rbs. Now, I say this for this reason, I got roleblocked last night. I am neither confirming or denying I am an actual role, I'll leave that up for mafia to decide. However, if town roleblocker roleblocked me, you are an idiot. If mafia roleblocked me, prepared to get wrecked. Also, if town roleblocker blocked mtamburini, you still are an idiot. If mafia roleblocked him, well, still prepare to get wrecked. Now talk over this while I read over the last few pages. Isn't that confirming that you are a role? I would assume that a townie with no role would not even be informed if they are roleblocked, since there is nothing to block there? And aren't you also not considering the possibility of a jailkeeper? | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 14:39 Eden1892 wrote: I think there's a really good chance that sqrt and Epishade are two parts of the scumteam, looking at their D2 interactions here. Let's look: - sqrt says that Yell0w is a strong townread, based on events throughout the whole turn. But he says that he would lynch Yell0w over Epishade. When I confronted him about this he completely deflected with a stupid snarky comment about my inactivity instead of answering me. The deflection in particular has really set off alarms to me because I can't see why on Earth he wouldn't just answer me straight as town. This makes sqrt scum, and he wouldn't have any incentive to indicate a preference to preserve town!Epishade over town!Yell0w after townreading town!Yell0w. He obviously would if we're looking at scum!Epishade though. It's also possible that scum!sqrt just slipped up and forgot he was townreading Yell0w heavily, but I think it's more likely that he's defending a teammate. - Epishade stayed away from commenting on the sqrt case, opting instead to give an overly-lengthy explanation of his read on dravernor (neutral). He then opts for lynching Yell0w who he thinks is town... for... information? What? It's Day 2. We can do better than this. I see this as super-scummy and self-evidently so. sqrt then IMMEDIATELY townreads Epishade for this, which is utterly bizarre to me, because Epishade didn't try to gang up on sqrt. sqrt himself said it required us to accept his towniness which is certainly up in the air. I don't buy it and I think sqrt overstepped in trying to prop up his buddy. sqrt and Epishade are scumbuddies. I could see Epishade being town, maybe, and sqrt just slipping on his read of Yell0w, which is why I prefer sqrt. I'll take Epishade as well but I don't feel strongly about the others to lynch them over one of these two. I also have changed my mind about Yell0w after looking at this interaction. There's no way this whole thing goes down with Yell0w also being mafia. I think Yell0w is town looking at this. Still really suspicious of mtamburini, but he's trying to figure things out while half the game isn't, which runs contrary to the serial killer's MO of hiding in the crowd. He's trending town and I'm more inclined to believe he was the vigilante than I am yesterday. I agree with about 95% of this, the only thing that worries me about you Eden is that you walk on the border between aggressive and bloodthirsty, one being a town attribute and the other being mafia. I will say too that sqrt was the hammer vote last day phase on Sweetfrost, for pretty much terrible justification. Then, as you said I bring up a case against him, and Epishade does what Epishade does best: avoid and deflect. I think Epishade saw me put up a decent case on sqrt and chose not to comment on it and instead go back to the yell0w train because he thinks it is an easy mislynch that he knows at least tamburini will be behind. I agree that they are likely mafia together. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 14:56 27ninjabunnies wrote: Okay, if I was jailed, wouldn't I be told I was jailed and not roleblocked? Then again, I''m not sure how jailer works in forums. It's different in epicmafia and video mafia. I always used this when I previously played as reference for role descriptions: http://mikeburnfire.deviantart.com/art/Mafia-Roles-72597749 It says "he both protects and roleblocks his target" | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 15:21 mtamburini wrote: Thanks for the summary, now what do you think happened is most likely His post says "Therefore we're in scenario #2 and bunnies was jailed." But I think it meant to say scenario #4 if he meant jailed? Cuz isn't #2 roleblocked? | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 14:09 27ninjabunnies wrote: Okay, I can talk finally! I'll read through the last few pages and give yall something to go off of. So here's what we are looking at at the moment. If tamburini got roleblocked, there are two roleblockers in this game, possibly town and mafia. I doubt they would put two mafia rbs or two town rbs. Now, I say this for this reason, I got roleblocked last night. I am neither confirming or denying I am an actual role, I'll leave that up for mafia to decide. However, if town roleblocker roleblocked me, you are an idiot. If mafia roleblocked me, prepared to get wrecked. Also, if town roleblocker blocked mtamburini, you still are an idiot. If mafia roleblocked him, well, still prepare to get wrecked. Now talk over this while I read over the last few pages. @tamburini: To me the bolded part reads: "I am a role, but I don't want to say what", how do you read that as she is saying she is a role? | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 17:11 27ninjabunnies wrote: Ummmm, let me read up on that and get back to you. I'm at a friends' house, so I'm just checking in. Hopefully I'll have one big post for all of you tomorrow. Also, someone CC me, I dare you. Watch me wreck you into the ground. should probably read mine too  | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 16:58 27ninjabunnies wrote: Alright, are you seriously getting paranoid on me now?! Come on, get real. So I do admit, I haven't been posting as much today due to just leaving my campus, and I'm headed home tomorrow So I'll definitely be able to post more. And lynching me because I went on yell0w, got pretty GREAT reads, enough too possibly get roleblocked by mafia. COME ON TAMBURINI! GET REAL. Anyway, my point is, I didn't think to check my pms because I thought I'd either die in the night, or someone would come out the next day and push on me to make meseem scummy... If I was mafia, I'd do a WAY better play than this, and I wouldn't have been defending you tamburini, if you are actual vigi. You can read me pretty well, and I'd try to get you out of the game asap. I came out with the roleblock claim as soon as I realized I was blocked. And I did it for the reason that tamburini had also claimed he was roleblocked. THIS IS INFORMATION TOWN NEEDS. Because I didn't realize the actual role of the jailer, I didn't know it could be a possible jailer scenerio on me, and for that I am sorry. But if there are 2 roleblockers, 1 for mafia, 1 for town, this is information we could use to our advantage. So, from just my claim we already know one thing, that is if tamburini is truly vig, and was roleblocked. One scenerio is that if tamburini IS vigi, and he was roleblocked, and I was roleblocked, too,(which I was) that means I cannot be a roleblocker. So you have that information, now run wild with it. Well if you compare this bolded part with the roles listed in the game on page 1, then....I'll let you fill in the rest. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 04 2014 17:45 mtamburini wrote: Oh cause if she is roleblocker she couldnt have roleblocked me. That doesnt mean there is not 3 roleblokers this game! perhaps i am taking things for granted, but because this is listed as a "newbie game" and there are so few people; I am really trying not to get into highly complex scenarios where there are multiples of the same role. Maybe I should be, but I am not. If we follow with what eden said earlier, that you were MRB'd and bunnies was TJK'd. You are vigi, bunnies is not the JK because she got JK'd, she says she isn't the roleblocker; so if I am going simple, I arrive at 1 role. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
For those who come on while I am asleep I will leave this here: Town Circle: - Me: I am town - 27ninjabunnies - 99.9% town; unless someone counterclaims her, then I will have to re-evaluate and choose which I believe. - Eden1892 - 92% town; he has a very similar read of the game to me, and has been aggressively pushing people for info. - mtamburini - 89% town; I still believe he is vigi, the reason he is not 98% town is because it has not been proven at night and there may come a time where we mathematically have to lynch him in the event he is the SK and not actually a vigi. If you want more of an explanation on each of them, I can provide it when I wake up. I am pretty much ride or die with these 3 as of right now. Scummers: - sqrt - 87% scum; see my previous posts, I asked him more specific questions, I didn't particularly like the answers provided; but they at least brought him to even with Epishade to where I would lynch either. - Epishade - 87% scum; deflecting hard, trying to bait people into mislynching yell0w or trying to sac yell0w to buy credibility, trying hard to pocket and parrot bunnies. overall scummer. Roller coaster: - yell0w - Null - basically for me fluctuates from town to mafia with every post. some I read and it is like, you're mafia; then others I read and he's town. my most recent read on him is that he is a townie who was just playing bad, but I am sure he will post again and that will change. maybe I just can't read this guy. That's where I am at, there doesn't seem to be too much investment in this day phase; I don't know if that is because it is during the weekend, or what is going on. When I wake up I hope there is more going on. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
On May 05 2014 01:05 mtamburini wrote: Ok so she got Jailed maybe and whatever, why cant she just be a helix worshiper? She doesnt have to be a role. She did say something along the lines of I got roleblocked but I wont say if I was a role or not to keep mafia guessing (thats when my paranoia started kicking in more than ever, had small tiny thing in back of my head about bunnies but it seemed way to crazy to be true bu its creeping up on me.) I am under the impression that in order to receive a pm that you got roleblocked that you have to have a role. Again, this is me assuming things that maybe I shouldn't be assuming; but if I was mod and a VT got roleblocked during the night, I wouldn't pm them that they got RB'd, cuz there is nothing to block. | ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
| ||
|
ritoky
United States6851 Posts
i thought the mafia made two pretty significant errors in the game that were not entirely picked up on and exploited as much as they could have been by townies. 1) The night I died, you should have still rb'd tambo instead of mysterymeat. it was clear that tambo was going to "shoot" yell0w; and when you left him un-rb'd it essentially said that you were going to allow him to shoot who he wanted (i.e. not a mafia member). thus essentially 100% clearing yell0w as town instead of leaving it ambiguous and confusing. 2) The moment I died, I knew that eden was mafia. He was the one (contrary to what he said) who brought up the possibility of a jailkeeper; and was fishing for roles really hard at a few points in the game. I was surprised that when he baited my soft claim out and I died that he didn't immediately receive a lot of pressure. Overall, was a fun game. Hopefully we can play more together some time in the future. | ||
| ||
