EPTOn February 20 2014 22:33 prplhz wrote:
First he's okay with raynpelikoneet's plan.
Then he doesn't understand it?
First he's okay with raynpelikoneet's plan.
Then he doesn't understand it?
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[M][N] Default Suspicions Mafia - Page 26
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: My problem is this. And now, please answer this properly and in detail: You make a post which says this: Then there is something that happens between here because you then say this: Now what is that something that happens between these posts? Why do you change your mind and what's the particular post that makes you change your mind? You asked me about my reasoning earlier on. The first part is talking about my stance on you and how I got to that stance from my PoV before you did this post: + Show Spoiler + On February 20 2014 10:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: So here we go (marv i would have expected a bit more from you, i am sad): There are three possibilities about my motives and here they are: 1) I am town and this is my thought process; I misunderstood the setup as i have already explained and thought the votes from previous days are added to the current days votes. That's why i made my plan in the first place. Now this would have been the most pro-town plan because i would have later on brought up the fact that we should treat this as a majority lynch and at the end of the day people who are not in the majority wagon put their votes on themselves. In that way we would have eliminated any cons for the town in setup we possibly can, which is pretty much everything other than the randomness which we can't eliminate. However, that was not the case. Now, i still stand behind my "if you "unvote", vote yourself" plan because of this. If we do not push this policy it leads to possibly stupid and irrelevant questions like "you don't think this dude is scum anymore, why is your vote still on him?". We don't want that because we benefit from clarity and it's beneficial we know exactly WHEN and WHY people drop their scumreads and where they head next. If they don't have next target they should inform that by voting for themselves. This prevents mafia from misrepresenting people because you can always back up your thoughts with your actions in thread (most importantly voting). Having no possibility to unvote is pro-mafia, if you't agree with that you need to explain me why. It's never irrelevant where your vote is at. 2) I did the same pro-town thing as mafia. 3) I just made all this up and and i was just saying shit for no reason at the start of the game. Now here is my question, especially to prplhz, Toad, Palmar and suki; Why did you not try to see what i was/am trying to do and how that would make me whatever alignment. What you did is you took some posts from me and painted them scummy without no thinking behind it. I want to know why. If what i was doing was (1), then i am town. If what i was doing is (2), you can't tell my alignment. If what i was doing is (3), then you are saying i am some random noob which this post already proves i am not because i would have came up with a decent explanation on the fly. So again, why am i mafia? Especially prplhz and Toad? The second part you're quoting is explaining how I realized that your explanation (the above post) makes sense if we take the misunderstanding as a given, which I did not consider before you cleared it up simply because I did not have that same misunderstanding. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:33 prplhz wrote: I don't think raynpelikoneet is bad and dumb. I faintly recall that I think he is actually quite good. Doesn't mean he can't do a dumb thing now and then though. I also recall that kushmasta was loud and flaky and that's not what I'm seeing this game at all, so while he's been a little easier to play with I'm uncertain about him simply because of that. I don't like railroading Toadesstern this early. Koshi also looks bad to me. I don't really understand his posts. First he's okay with raynpelikoneet's plan. Then he doesn't understand it? I think scum are more likely to want to talk about who someone is instead of just playing. He also doesn't actually contribute to the whole discussion around raynpelikoneet, he's around posting one liners like: "This is some high level shit and that's why I'm not contributing" I don't think townies think that, they think "Everybody should know my opinion because it's the right one to have". Like, his filter is full of nothing and he doesn't seem to be trying to actually having an influence on the game. A lot of his trolling also seem weird and out of place. I am pretty sure I somewhere explain how I see rayn his plan. You got to read my entire filter my biased friend. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:44 prplhz wrote: i don't mind sheeping at all, but i also don't mind not sheeping. i've shept (?) palmar plenty of times but i have also disagreed with him. not entirely sure where you're getting this from but you're wrong. why do you want everybody on board the train to lynch-a-toad-ville and why don't you want to "bother" reading into koshi? it's like 12 hours into the day and you just want to lynch toad and can't be arsed to read a filter in the next 36 hours? I just wanted to see what you'd say really. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:45 Toadesstern wrote: you used it to paint me as scum basicly saying I should know better. I don't care how vague you are about that to be honest if you're doing it. You're usually not someone who likes to be vague when talking about meta or someone's reasoning for being town/mafia. How come you just blurted that out without looking it up or taking into consideration that the 2 games I had with him recently both ended on d1 on for me, one being a PM game, one being a ragequit on d1 from me where I certainly didn't go "woahwoahwoah, let's coold down a little and read his filter nice and slowly" I said you should know better than to think rayn would want to get out of taking a stand. Which you should. That's simply true. If there's anything that's immediately obvious about rayn's play is that he is never afraid to take stands, and you don't need an amazing memory to think about that, especially if you've been in a couple of games quite recently with him. Jog on, Toad. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43268 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:51 Toadesstern wrote: You asked me about my reasoning earlier on. The first part is talking about my stance on you and how I got to that stance from my PoV before you did this post: + Show Spoiler + On February 20 2014 10:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: So here we go (marv i would have expected a bit more from you, i am sad): There are three possibilities about my motives and here they are: 1) I am town and this is my thought process; I misunderstood the setup as i have already explained and thought the votes from previous days are added to the current days votes. That's why i made my plan in the first place. Now this would have been the most pro-town plan because i would have later on brought up the fact that we should treat this as a majority lynch and at the end of the day people who are not in the majority wagon put their votes on themselves. In that way we would have eliminated any cons for the town in setup we possibly can, which is pretty much everything other than the randomness which we can't eliminate. However, that was not the case. Now, i still stand behind my "if you "unvote", vote yourself" plan because of this. If we do not push this policy it leads to possibly stupid and irrelevant questions like "you don't think this dude is scum anymore, why is your vote still on him?". We don't want that because we benefit from clarity and it's beneficial we know exactly WHEN and WHY people drop their scumreads and where they head next. If they don't have next target they should inform that by voting for themselves. This prevents mafia from misrepresenting people because you can always back up your thoughts with your actions in thread (most importantly voting). Having no possibility to unvote is pro-mafia, if you't agree with that you need to explain me why. It's never irrelevant where your vote is at. 2) I did the same pro-town thing as mafia. 3) I just made all this up and and i was just saying shit for no reason at the start of the game. Now here is my question, especially to prplhz, Toad, Palmar and suki; Why did you not try to see what i was/am trying to do and how that would make me whatever alignment. What you did is you took some posts from me and painted them scummy without no thinking behind it. I want to know why. If what i was doing was (1), then i am town. If what i was doing is (2), you can't tell my alignment. If what i was doing is (3), then you are saying i am some random noob which this post already proves i am not because i would have came up with a decent explanation on the fly. So again, why am i mafia? Especially prplhz and Toad? The second part you're quoting is explaining how I realized that your explanation (the above post) makes sense if we take the misunderstanding as a given, which I did not consider before you cleared it up simply because I did not have that same misunderstanding. Now this can't possibly be true because your response to me is a response to the post where i explain myself. I never asked you why you DID think i am mafia, i asked you why you DO think i am mafia given my explanation. Like you really didn't understand that? | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
On February 20 2014 09:10 Koshi wrote: ##vote Koshi I am ok with rayn his idea. + Show Spoiler + I am not seeing anything around balla. I might have not known what rayn his plan was at this moment though. I probably just said things. Cuz rayn my bro. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
Although I love you both dearly. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On February 20 2014 22:55 marvellosity wrote: I said you should know better than to think rayn would want to get out of taking a stand. Which you should. That's simply true. If there's anything that's immediately obvious about rayn's play is that he is never afraid to take stands, and you don't need an amazing memory to think about that, especially if you've been in a couple of games quite recently with him. Jog on, Toad. THAT'S EXACTLY THE THING. I don't consider it that way and neither should you. I don't consider a game I joined on n1, that was aborted on n1, that I spend the entirty of n1 to read while you both ignored me until I finished reading, which happened about 30 minutes before the game was canceled a game I "played" with him... On February 20 2014 22:57 raynpelikoneet wrote: Now this can't possibly be true because your response to me is a response to the post where i explain myself. I never asked you why you DID think i am mafia, i asked you why you DO think i am mafia given my explanation. Like you really didn't understand that? I like to explain my reasoning when talking about things. I said that your explanation makes sense. That's the part where I explain what I thought about you at that moment. I didn't want to leave it just like that so I added the explanation about how the change of mind occured though the explanation apparently should have been more in detail because it seems to creep people out. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
it's brilliant really. | ||
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CuteFluffyPuppy
Afghanistan138 Posts
On February 20 2014 10:18 marvellosity wrote: The point of that being that Palmar will talk about things like you've been constantly attacking him for talking about things. And it doesn't mean very much. That's just how he talks about stuff. I'll have to take your word on it. I find it unlikely you'd lie about this regardless of your alignment. I like the point against Toad. Rayn's plan is really not all that useful with the current setup, but it's not that relevant given how Toad responded to it. In regards to prplhz, I find it more likely that he's actually trying to start the game. From my giant sample size of one scumgame and one towngame, he seems to be more carefree and active as town than as scum, whereas he tries to avoid the limelight as scum. The Koshi exit post got me interested in him as it didn't say anything and I didn't remember anything he said from before that. First he says On February 20 2014 09:10 Koshi wrote: ##vote Koshi I am ok with rayn his idea. + Show Spoiler + I am not seeing anything around balla. Then, 7 minutes later.. On February 20 2014 09:17 Koshi wrote: rayn, do you see any suspicious people or are you too busy with the thing with the standard votes that I don't understand. He doesn't understand the idea yet he agrees to it. Why would he not inquire as to the idea or think about it if he's okay with it? It doesn't make any sense. He continues on trolling despite there being a plan on the table that he supports yet doesn't understand. What. Further Toad/Rayn stuff doesn't really give me anything. Marv's initial case makes a good point, but I need more. Don't see what Rayn sees in Suki either. Actually have to go now. Will be back later today and finish catching up then. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22632 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
On February 20 2014 23:08 Palmar wrote: I really like prplhz's point about koshi, don't you marv? doesn't it make you all warm inside? no, it's exactly the kind of thing Koshi would do as town more than mafia, he'd be more careful as mafia. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On February 20 2014 23:06 marvellosity wrote: "I don't consider that I've been in multiple games with rayn recently even though I have" it's brilliant really. how you consider a game that I replaced into, that ended up being canceled 30 minutes after I posted a game I played with him and therefore I should know better because I played a bunch with him is just beyond me. Even rayn said you're pulling shit out of your ass right here and that's quite something comming from you considering we're talking about me here. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On February 20 2014 23:10 Toadesstern wrote: how you consider a game that I replaced into, that ended up being canceled 30 minutes after I posted a game I played with him and therefore I should know better because I played a bunch with him is just beyond me. Even rayn said you're pulling shit out of your ass right here and that's quite something comming from him considering we're talking about me here. EBWOP | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36160 Posts
On February 20 2014 23:10 Toadesstern wrote: how you consider a game that I replaced into, that ended up being canceled 30 minutes after I posted a game I played with him and therefore I should know better because I played a bunch with him is just beyond me. Even rayn said you're pulling shit out of your ass right here and that's quite something comming from you considering we're talking about me here. Literally not what I said. Well done. What I said was perfectly true. You've been in and read games he was in, so you should know that he's not afraid to take stands. You don't need to interact with him to know that. YOU READ HIS POSTS. This conversation is at an end. | ||
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