EPTThoughts???
GSL Open Mini Mafia IV
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Thoughts??? | ||
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Mordanis
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\in | ||
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Mordanis
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brb gonna go write a wall of text case against everyone. | ||
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Mordanis
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On a side note, I think its looking a bit sketchy that it seems like we already have a vote on thrawn (for "hmm") and vivax building a meta case on him for lurking a few hours into the game, it feels like teamwork or opportunistic scum play... | ||
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Mordanis
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Mordanis
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I think the abortive case had some momentum for a second against thrawn is very suspicious. The way Rob voted for Thrawn for lurking, and then !Hey Presto!, vivax comes in showing that thrawn is apparently well known for being lurky as scum, well it all seems very wrong. vivax backed down almost immediately, and Rob stayed the course until thrawn started talking. Now vivax left without any more reads after that. Rob did the *exact* opposite, posting a lot and picking up a read (based on thrawn's thoughts and a joke). Essentially what I'm trying to say here is that the behavior between the two of these definitely warrants more investigation. On vivax I really don't like the way that vivax posted fluff, gave someone else evidence to start a case, and then left it all alone for everyone else to take care of, and then disappeared right afterwards. And then there's this post: vivax goes from one hell of a scum read on thrawn (without really pushing anything) to one hell of a town read on Robik (without telling us why). In short, vivax seems incredibly confident about being right but hasn't really done anything useful aside from helping another player make a case. That seems like as much of a scum mindset as you can get. | ||
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Mordanis
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Mordanis
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On February 13 2014 22:24 VIVAX420 wrote: i misread actually. I thought he was saying i had a hell of a scumread on rob because i asked him a question. actually he said hell of a townread. Quite reasonably because "do you talk this much as scum" implies that you meant Rob was a town read. Robik didn't say "I talk a lot as town", but rather "I like forum mafia because I can make a ton of content". | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 13 2014 18:53 thrawn2112 wrote: Mordanis did you reach any conclusions about robik? I can't tell if you're trying to sell both robik/vivax as a scum team or if you thought robik could be mafia purely based off of his own play. I'm not going after Robik at present. I felt something was off between the two that warranted further investigation, which has led me to believe that vivax is the scummier of the two. Right now, I'm not exactly feeling incredibly rushed to get a lynch in the next few hours, so I'm curious to see the way kush plays vivax. | ||
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Mordanis
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Mordanis
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Hopefully more coming soon! | ||
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Mordanis
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On February 14 2014 02:57 VIVAX420 wrote: Well what I don't like about Mordanis is the fact that he doesn't seem the least bit suspicious about thrawn. When a guy is lurking and posting nonsense you would actually want him to post more and better stuff so you can get a read on him. Hence I can't explain from a town pov why he doesn't want thrawn to be pressured, and thrawn himself already pointed out: I thought this was apparent but I guess I have to explain this. The case on thrawn was the first case with anything to it. There were two people behind it, and it seemed like a mostly meta case (as I recall, Robik was much happier with his read after seeing the game vivax linked). The thing is, I don't know thrawn, or really anyone else well enough to make a meta case or even believe one without outside confirmation. So, I did what I can do, and thought about the posts and the order and such, to try to find scum through analysis. I thought (and still do) that, if there is a strong meta case against someone who has played many games on TL, there will be several games that will show this pattern, and multiple people will be able to verify that the meta case is reasonable. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 14 2014 13:34 VIVAX420 wrote: thrawn timeline: lurk scumstyle start tryharding because vivax caught him continue to lurk when the pressure goes down As per my last post, could someone who knows thrawn let me know if this isa reasonable case or not? | ||
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Also what is this teabagging? afraid to google......... My catch-up is here: + Show Spoiler + On February 17 2014 14:35 JarJarDrinks wrote: ##unvote ##vote: sidesprang This was kinda discussed but sidespringe retracting his vote for roundabout makes no sense: Here he explains how it's a policy vote:So he's saying that even if he's town, he deserves to be lynched for fake claiming scum. So why in the world would he unvote him after round said he was lying? Here's his explaination:but that makes no sense. He just told us that he deserves to be policy lynched. So the fact that he took the claim away shouldn't have much to do w/ the reason he's voting for him. Especially since:You'd think that he'd leave his vote on his policy lynch then. It's not like he has some other great read that he really needs to not waste his vote. I don't know at all how I feel about the shitfest with Round's scum claim, but I don't think anything can be derived from this sequence JJD is looking at. To me this seems like SS simply hasn't had enough experience with this kind of situation, and changed his mind about the scum claim with the amount of analysis being poured into that play. Being open to changes in information is a very town-oriented attitude. *More on this when there is discussion on SS's switch from shiao to QP* On February 15 2014 23:04 thrawn2112 wrote: This is what I meant when I said "JJD has done nothing except to say he wants to kill people for reasons that don't have anything to do with lynching mafia." His whole filter is like that. When he talks about who he;s ok with lynching he only talks about lurker policy, or in grack's case troll policy lynching. JJD doesn't care at all about finding and lynching mafia. JarJar, can you please say if you are suspicious of anyone who isn't a lurker/troll? I totally agree with this post. On February 16 2014 04:28 IAmRobik wrote: Soooooo, it's a good thing I didn't access my computer last night or I would have spammed some dumb drunk shit. I agree that shiao looks super scummy and if he's town, it's 100% his fault if he gets mislynched. His "reads" are lackluster at best and his "anger" about getting "mislynched" is laughable. Vivax and roundabound, The 4 of you failed me. gumshoe, A lot is going to be expected of you. Please make the best use of your posts. There are a lot of really towny people in my eyes and just a few scummy ones, so you're gonna have to prove yourself. I really don't like this post. Yeah, Shiao wasn't great this game, but I expect more than "I think you're shitty, die". Not sure if scummy or giving up out of boredom... On February 16 2014 09:21 bumatlarge wrote: I'm cautious about how many people are jumping on Shiao. Even if I think he's the scummiest I've come across in the thread, the reasons aren't all that strong. Sure he has little content and doesn't seem to be improving them, but day 1 townies do this. Mattchew, I think this is what you usually do, but can you give a little more detail to who you are accusing? I wouldn't insult the game of mafia by calling them reads. You seem "ok with lynching X" about all of the time. The only thing I've liked about what you said so far is about sidespring. Do you have more on every other player in the game you've mentioned? Sketch as fuck. This reads as the most cautious scummy post I've ever read. I want to vote for X but I don't want to look bad when X flips green. Soft defends X while calling X scummy. Calls X a premature bandwagon but isn't suspicious of those who are in it. On February 17 2014 00:35 roundabound wrote: thrawn made a very good post on bumatlarge earlier on. Actually bum deserves another look based on how he tries to over explain the reasons why we are mafia. In fact he reaches to "more likely to be town" in his conclusions. ~rayn A good point. The following sequence is also interesting: On February 17 2014 00:49 roundabound wrote: sideprang: Hops on to the claim immediately for policy reasons. But see especially the red part. When the lynch does not gain momentum see what he does. He drops out his scumread/policy (which is weak in the first place) and suddenly wants to lynch someone else. Now this makes no sense, if he feels like we are mafia so strong, why not push the lynch then? He's trying to find a lynch, not mafia. ##unvote ##Vote: sidesprang On February 17 2014 01:29 roundabound wrote: You are dodging the issue. It does not matter if you unvoted first or whatever. You unvoted after VIVAX, Rob and thrawn clearly disagreed with the lynch. lol. You also clearly said "they are claiming mafia as mafia or deserve to be lynched even if they are town because of policy". It's a policy lynch and noone else's opinion should matter. You are making shit up, you clearly unvoted because other people who look town disagreed with the lynch and in the first place it should not even matter. scum. ~rayn On February 17 2014 01:55 roundabound wrote: Because your vote is on ShiaoPi before Mocsta's play (1). Then you vote for us, and give reasoning which implicates you are voting us for policy. You literally say we deserve do die regardless of our alignment (2). After three players who are amongst the strongest in this game disagree with the lynch you retract from the vote for no reasoning (2). Then you say you are okay with QP/Mordanis dying and vote for QP (1). 1) Before and after voting for us your mind changes from ShiaoPi -> QP/Mordanis. None of those people have posted in this timeframe. This makes no sense because there is no reason for you to suddenly think QP/Mord are more likely mafia than ShisoPi is because none of those people have posted between when you changed your mind. You give no reasoning for this change of mind. It makes no sense from town perspective. 2) Your reasoning for voting us is in the first place bullshit because you do not even think about the motive behind Mocsta's actions. This means you are voting for us as policy, which in itself is fine. What's not fine is that you retract from the vote when you realize the lynch is not going through (after people disagree). This makes no sense from town perspective because policy lynch is a policy lynch and you keep your vote on the policy lynch if you do it in the first place. I really don't agree with any of Round's points save the part about the vote switch. I don't think it is rational for SS to switch from Shiao to Round to QP. It seems to me that SS is afraid to take a firm stance, but out of inexperience rather than scummy self-protection. I do however think that Round was desperately trying to get back into people's town list, and pressuring SS was the best way for him/them to accomplish that. So the scum claim made Round look scummier and SS look townier. On February 15 2014 11:21 VIVAX420 wrote: This game: Last scum game: there is a very clear difference in how shiaopi plays scum and town. It does not take a lot of meta research to see it. I've never seen someone more metable actually. I think shiaopi might be a better lynch than side. Another meta case, and this one lead to a mislynch. I'm gonna look at this in more detail in the morning, but I'm feeling that vivax is super scummy right now. Overall reads from catchup: SS - town vivax - scum bumatlarge - scum Round - null JJD - null iRobocop - annoying | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 19 2014 03:16 IAmRobik wrote: Well that's pretty clear. roundabound = town thrawn = mafia My (IAmRobik) own conclusion from Thrawn's pg 3 filter: bum probably scum Could you explain why? I agree, but I'd like to hear why you think bum is scum. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
Both were primarily focused on Shiao, and aside from that tidbit I'd say DNP is null/town read bum, however, is very scummy. Aside from the post I talked about earlier, he's mostly just given fairly bland policy. E.G + Show Spoiler + On February 15 2014 05:12 bumatlarge wrote: Hi Gonna read the thread but two things 1) being apathetic to who are the hydras helps to read them. I've played with and against hydras, and it's a lot harder for them as scum then as town. Town hydras tend to not focus on interactions and have a more aloof sense of the game. Good scum hydras attempt to do the same, but where it gets funny is when they need to defend themselves. Then they let you know who's doing the talking lol 2) if a blue role needs to claim, just say blue, especially I you are boxer. This happened last game with a few people claiming boxers when I was a cop, and it kinda narrowed how open my claim would be. I would just keep quiet and do the setup math in your head until later. On February 15 2014 15:53 bumatlarge wrote: How are you both so certain this early into the game that mafia don't have a "good player" on their team. Give me a single good reason why going slow isn't better. Yall ignorant. Don't defend an awful line. On February 15 2014 16:49 bumatlarge wrote: I don't see the cons, but talking about feels like a waste. I don't like IML as town. As mafia it's great! On February 16 2014 02:35 bumatlarge wrote: That said, I'm still on the go slow plan. Gumshoe/replace isn't here, and until then we can afford to wait. On February 16 2014 09:21 bumatlarge wrote: I'm cautious about how many people are jumping on Shiao. Even if I think he's the scummiest I've come across in the thread, the reasons aren't all that strong. Sure he has little content and doesn't seem to be improving them, but day 1 townies do this. Mattchew, I think this is what you usually do, but can you give a little more detail to who you are accusing? I wouldn't insult the game of mafia by calling them reads. You seem "ok with lynching X" about all of the time. The only thing I've liked about what you said so far is about sidespring. Do you have more on every other player in the game you've mentioned? On February 16 2014 09:32 bumatlarge wrote: I hope you know this post is why people are voting you. Put it this way, you are making it really easy for mafia to vote you, and town won't be able to tell. QuantomPope seems to be fitting his meta that he had in the LSB Restart game, which lead him to be shot by a vig. He was a boon to my mafia team, and gave us a strong edge just because of how much a single misread town player trips up town from figuring the game out. You can't really accuse people for calling out bad play as town, so it keeps the game from developing which is ideal for mafia. You are currently in that boat. It is very easy to avoid getting lynched day 1 as long as you remain active and open. Look at Robot, I'm not a big fan of how he is approaching the game, but I would be surprised if he flips scum this game. It seems like you have a stronger read on Vivax then you do QuantomPope. Can you respond to what he has said. I would appreciate if you two(three?) would hash out what you think of each other. I'm in the same boat with your scum list, but because you don't go into much detail, I can't benefit from what you think! Lazy people get lynched dude  I know this first-hand.*Editor's interpretation: Hey, I think you seem like town, but you are an easy candidate for lynch, so we are going to lynch you In general, bum has come into the thread after ~3 days and completely failed to bring a fresh perspective. He has also done essentially no scumhunting aside from going after Round for claiming scum. He voted Shiao early, and then seemed to talk to Shiao as town, without any effort to find any scum. ## vote bumatlarge | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 19 2014 07:05 VIVAX420 wrote: SURE BRO. Here's a scummy meta case on Mordanis: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=331498&user=Mordanis&view=all See ya. (Actually, do compare the games). So I'm scum because I'm not playing this game like my first game ever ~2 years ago. Sweet case. Is this meta case #3 for you? Do you do anything other than meta? | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 19 2014 07:20 VIVAX420 wrote: Dude, wtf are you doing. You were on my ass since D1 and now you go vote for somebody else. One of your previous points vs me. Still not pushing a lynch on me. Now I post another meta case, this time even on you, and you start bickering but don't want to lynch me. Can you tell me how somebody could take that read of yours on me seriously? Sure, I'm pretty sure you're scum, but I'm more sure about my read on bum. As a hydra, every once in a while something you say is pretty decent, which is not the case with bum. Also, you have at least posted content, while bum has not. So you're hella scummy, but bum is scummier and cruft. | ||
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Mordanis
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On February 19 2014 11:49 roundabound wrote: Grack Do u think a townie would ignore discussing my case when doing a thread summary? ~moc For your reply you so desperately want: I've already said that I don't terribly mind being lynched early. I'd much rather get as much solid analysis as possible out and get out early so others can view my analysis without the nagging doubt of alignment than spend all my time convincing everyone I'm super duper confirmed town. With that in mind, should I spend the little time I have defending myself against a full-filter case or look at other people? Without spending too much time on this, I'd say that your observations were pretty accurate, that I'm playing a really shitty game. So really the only way I can convince you I'm not scum is to play better mafia. Better use of time + only way to argue against your case = the way I go. | ||
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Mordanis
United States893 Posts
On February 19 2014 10:27 bumatlarge wrote: Let's chat mord. I probably did get too hung up on Round, but I did everything I could to get a better understanding of ShiaoPi's play this game. No one questioned his views from a town standpoint, and i think you can see why I was trying to stall the lynch on him by the other post you call me scummy for. Nothing I did indicated I knew anything about ShiaoPi's alignment, and I have him every opportunity to explain himself. I'll take the blame for lynching a townie, but what ou are looking for in my posts require assumptions about my alignment. Look at my reasoning from a town viewpoint, and I can guarentee it makes sense. I'll answer anything I missed if you want. I'm going to try to figure out Matthew, but it may take me some time to do him justice. I suggest going slow again this cycle. I don't agree. You've now been a participant for nearly half the game, and I still don't really see any scumhunting. Even looking at your posting in the best light, you've really only tried (unsuccessfully) to determine if a lynch candidate could be town, and tried to lynch a player who claimed scum. This is why I think you are a great lynch candidate, because I think that you are very scummy and aren't helping anyways. | ||
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Mordanis
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On February 19 2014 12:15 roundabound wrote: Mordanis what's your take on cases presented on D2 other than yours? Do you think you can get bumatlarge lynched and if you do, why are you not pushing the case more or asking opinions on it? ~rayn I'm not pushing harder because I simply haven't had enough time at the computer to push harder. As for Matt, I think the case on him is quite strong. I'm going to have to read his filter and the cases posted against him in the next little bit, but for sure I don't want to rush a lynch this early into the cycle without hearing from him. We should probably avoid another 4 day cycle if everyone stops giving a shit, but long days => more information. | ||
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Mordanis
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How do you feel about bum? | ||
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Mordanis
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On February 19 2014 12:11 Mordanis wrote: For your reply you so desperately want: I've already said that I don't terribly mind being lynched early. I'd much rather get as much solid analysis as possible out and get out early so others can view my analysis without the nagging doubt of alignment than spend all my time convincing everyone I'm super duper confirmed town. With that in mind, should I spend the little time I have defending myself against a full-filter case or look at other people? Without spending too much time on this, I'd say that your observations were pretty accurate, that I'm playing a really shitty game. So really the only way I can convince you I'm not scum is to play better mafia. Better use of time + only way to argue against your case = the way I go. Already discussed this | ||
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On February 20 2014 06:55 VIVAX420 wrote: But actually, he's not the one I'd lynch today. But for now I don't trust the hydra in choosing a lynch given the displayed attitude. So who would you lynch today if you had your druthers | ||
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Also, I'm still suspicious of vivax, and the fact that they've been around a lot and given a lot of scum reads, but haven't voted is very interesting to me. I'm curious to see why they havent voted. | ||
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Mordanis
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I'm done with this cycle. Matt asked to be lynched, I'll oblige. ##Vote: Mattchew | ||
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On February 22 2014 04:50 Blazinghand wrote: You need to ##unvote to vote someone new. I don't get 2 votes? lame. | ||
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