EPTPYP: League of Legends Mafia
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1) for my own personal benefit I'd like to request the list which I'm sure someone has of number/role claims. 2) this is a game where the sign up list can and will be changed. Does anyone have a record of the sign ups list at the beginning of d1? If so that should be made public as more information to town is good and I'll bet money that scum has the list (assuming they don't suck) so we won't be giving them anything by making it public. More importantly I want that list public now so that in endgame 2v1 lylo we don't have some lazy townies who didn't pay any attention and will miss the modconfirmed scum because they couldn't be assed to do the work to find said scum. In a game of this size I'm sure that by endgame, no matter how well or poorly town as a whole does the best and most involved townies will be dead. ces't la vie. I'm going to be reading the thread, its my fiance's birthday and I've been partying with her all night but she is worn out and asleep now. I think I'll be able to read the whole thread tonight but we'll see. Is there anyone or anything I should be looking at particularly? | ||
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D1 sign up list On December 01 2013 01:06 geript wrote:
Might be worthwhile later. the current sign up list after n1 is:
Which hopefully means that there are no day time list switch powers. Based on the numbers of replacements I'm curious to look at those individuals in particular who have replaced in, with so many people replacing I find myself nervous about replacements in general and would like to work to clear/indict those slots first because of how little must have been offered by the originals and even more so because so many of the replacements are not known for terribly stellar town play; all five have the ability to play well but equally have the ability to play poorly. I've seen too many games where a replacement makes it to endgame and is lynched/let go because of their predecessor. My desire would be to get reads on the five replacements from the players who are known to play town well in this game I'd say marv, sandro, VE, SS and Rayn. I'd like reads from the five of you on the five replacement slots. My reads on the five I'm most curious of based mostly on filter diving and a little on thread context (not my preferred method of finding scum but I can't get my teeth into the thread somehow, its just too much when I wasn't there to think about stuff while it was happening). I looked at the lynch and went back to the filters. Kush I feel good about kush, he cared about the lynch and defended his town read. He didn't flip on that read even when said read attacked him for it. He stayed calm and collected in the discussion which is so not scum kush. There was a post of Kush's which felt lonely (okay I know this is silly, stick with me) and I don't think a scum kush would post it; this kid is an active player whatever else can be said about him and in his scum games he is all up in that scum qt. If I had to makes a guess on kush at this point in this game I'd say both that he is town and that he is playing better than usual. My only qualm is how diplomatic kush is playing, I'm choosing to believe (and I think the evidence supports) that it is a better town game from him but it may be a new scum style. On the five part scale kush is a 2 (1= confirmed town all the way down to 5 = preferred lynch) + Show Spoiler [Supporting points on the above:] + Bum read On December 04 2013 00:03 kushm4sta wrote: DO NOT LYNCH BUM. I think it's literally impossible for scum to think this way. His thought process is so freaking town. continues to defend Bum (with logic) On December 04 2013 01:11 kushm4sta wrote: case against bum: contradictions flinging vague shit Town do both of these things all the time. In the hypothetical situation that bum was town, I would expect behavior that was tryhard and scared. That comes from his level of experience and his personality. "Contradictions" and "flinging vague shit" are only scumtells when the player is not scared (a more experienced player) and not tryhard. Kush's loneliness On December 04 2013 07:26 kushm4sta wrote: bum so isn't scum. im literally the only person defending him.. LSB I don't know LSB (to my knowledge we've never played together) so I can't say as much about him as a player but his first few posts don't sit terribly well with me. Specifically his defensive reply to Rayn's very clear comment seemed out of place; that defensiveness suggests to me that if LSB is scum there is at least one scum in the top six picks. Not yet relevent but something to keep in mind. LSB follows this with a totally contradictory post the contradiction in which I'm ignoring in the interest of not bleeding from the ears, the post again rubs me the wrong way though it chastises town for banning out pro-scum roles. Along with this LSB says he WILL roleclaim and that everyone had better roleclaim OR ELSE. The bluster in those posts is strong and a blustery player is trying hard to put themselves in a position in town, not necessarily scummy but raises red flags. Bum mentions (in one of the posts in the spoiler under Kush's name) that he thinks LSB is better than he is playing in this game, the bluster means that LSB thinks so too. I like that LSB followed through with the folly that is his claiming plan but it hurts my brain to think that he thought enacting a claiming plan without getting town ready to act on this claiming plan was worthwhile. At best individual roleclaims mean nothing. At worst they inform scum as to how to act. LSB's single minded devotion to the mass claiming/number gathering is interesting. I like it. It needs to be done in a pyp game (just as the list managing needs to be done in this game particularly) town needs these things done and LSB doing them is pro town!! If LSB fails to do anything else and does not catch scum through his list analysis he is scum, the behavious he has exibited is that of a townie however it is easy to fake as scum and he hasn't done other things which scum cannot fake. However for the moment I'm happy to have a player approaching the game though the analytic paths. LSB is an old school player and his play reflects that old school mindset. I've written a lot on LSB because my thoughts were pretty varied. All in all I'd take him as town for now with a little mark next to his name to make sure to look into his participation in the future and whether he continues to focus only on mechanics. rating: 2.5 + Show Spoiler [citations] + Defensive reply contradictions On December 02 2013 09:27 LSB wrote: I wouldn't say it is totally wrong. Ever since town decided the best idea was to ban out the obvious mafia roles, which was a horrible idea because those would be easy mafia kills, roles do not = aliment. However, giving mafia the power roles free reign is an incredibly stupid idea and come day I will be roleclaiming and voting anyone who doesnt LSB's number focus On December 04 2013 03:02 LSB wrote: I'll just post it again to clear up confusion If you are vanilla town it is important for you to reveal what role you tried to take If you can deal damage it is important for you to reveal what role you tried to take If you are DT/Medic/Tracker it is highly suggested, but I will forgive you if you don't, to reveal what role you take We need to know if Janna, Heimerdinger, Karthus and other roles that have the ability to increase mafia KP are in the game. Koshi [2][1] - Viktor Kurumi [4][6] - Warwick VisceraEyes [5][4] - Lux jcarlsoniv [9][3] - Soft Blue claim, cannot deal damage Mig [12][1] JonnyLaw [14][11] Risen [15][15] - Karma StorrZerg [23][23] geript [24][24] Warwick? -> VT? austinmcc [6][3] Meapak_Ziphh [6][14] Sandroba - Fiora Kenpachi[8][15] - Blue Claim Rean [16][2] Lux-> VT bumatlarge [16][12] -> Soft Blue Claim Onegu [17][5] Soft Blue Claim, probably a power role. Claim was done by BC justanothertownie marvellosity [7][2] - Blue Claim gtrsrs [7][11] Kha'Zix -> VT OdinOfPergo [7][16] Karma -> VT Mocsta [1][5] ? ->VT supersoft [1][30] Oatsmaster [1][1] Cho'Gath ->VT raynpelikoneet [1][1] - Shen kushm4sta ticklishmusic Taric Roffles Coagulation jaybrundage [Tabbz] Ezreal? LSB -> Tryndamere Onegu Oh God! I want to lynch Onegu on this filter. And I'd hate myself for lynching him on this filter. I am so sorry for what I am about to say! Onegu's whole filter is a discussion of his son, the whole thing is a sympathy grab and bares no relevance to the game. He spends a lot of time apologizing and none playing. His only post is an I'll sheep Rayn post. Double donkey fuck. I hate this filter and I know its totally possible form it that Onegu is an honest townie. The thing is I also know that its as likely he is a dishonest scummer. I know nothing about Onegu: not a hard scum read but I wouldn't mind him being vig hit/lynched. He has a mark next to his name that says he had better shape the fuck up. I know he newbied his way to mafia victory in the past, he cannot be allowed to sympathy his way into endgame. rating: 4 + Show Spoiler [Onegu's one post] + On December 04 2013 05:00 Onegu wrote: So Im on page 66 rigjt now and it 3am. I promise I will catch up tomorrow, but deadline is in 7 hours. So I am right now confident in my ability to read rayn and believe he is town as he was the first person to really start scum hunting. So I am going to sheep him and consolidate, as close to where I am reading people said it was really important not to have outlander votes so people can analyze it. So I should be up before deadline amd get somemore reading in. ##Vote:bumatlarge Coag A little like the above, Coag has done nothing. Coag may do nothing as town or scum either way, he claimed the birthday card. Since birthdays are only one day I give him a chance to shape up. Assuming he participates well in the day 2 proceedings I'll forgive him for his less than stellar start. I hope he shapes up as I've gotten to like him recently, he did a rather good job as a host in the OMGus game I played and was generally a pleasant dude to be around; I'd like to get to see him play. Because I expect this kind of play from Coag at least a little I want to give him a 3 rather than a 4 but in reality I wouldn't be too torn up over his death so in the end his rating is 4 Promethelax cool kid, totes town. Probably better than you. You should listen to him. rated 1 | ||
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On December 04 2013 15:20 Mocsta wrote: (1) See LSB filter (2) First draft pick list is around page31 I think.. or alternatively filter OP 3rd post = Mid or Feed (3) I'm really struggling to read LSB in general, so if you want to put a fresh perspective that I would appreciate it. Otherwise, some Persons of Interest to consider: Kush, Jay, Jonnylaw, some say Geript or VE. I'll look into JL, JB and we'll see about the other two if I have time. If you are still around I'd like your thoughts on what I said about Kush and LSB. | ||
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To begin with I do have a history with Jay, I've played a few games with him. In the one where he played scum http://www.quicktopic.com/49/H/XzeY3JALfAC said "Jay - looking for a place to park his vote, far too confrontational and not carefree like town jay whatsoever, has been afk for a long time" in the obs qt and it was damn accurate. So in reading jay's filter I am looking for the confrontational v carefree thing. Aside: its how I read Hopeless1der too, you all should learn it. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=436086¤tpage=15#285 is pretty damn carefree. He is being challenged not only on his townieness but also his intelligence and he comes back with that little masterwork of posting including (this is my favourite part) the part of his screen shot that shows the Wikipedia entry for apostrophe open in another window. This kid is carefree as they come. Outside of the meta read Jay has posted some really god-awful stuff this for instance On December 01 2013 20:50 jaybrundage wrote: Yea I never played a PYP game before I thought we send in draft numbers another phase. I didn't realize we had to ban and send in draft. So far I think Rayn is town. I dont like marv. I have been in games with him where he plays an amazing scum. I would be totes fine with lynching him. He doesn't seem to care much and knowing how good a mafia player he is. He wont incriminate him self easily where Jay calls marv scum for being good scum and because he is playing badly here. Which, obviously, makes no fucking sense. Now I rather think a post that poorly thought through is more likely to come from town than scum. A scum writing that post would be thinking about how that sounded and would realize the asinine nature of it, I think a townie would be more likely to parataxically attach those two thoughts and post them as one post. Big points for Jay being town OR scum pulling something complex and stupid: His place on the draft order due to not sending in any numbers. Since I am of the opinion that it is waaaay more likely that a townie made a dumb-dumb than that the scum team planned a crazy out of this world get-jay-to-be-confirmed-town-by-not-picking-numbers plan I have to conclude that Jay is town. Rating: 1 with the caveat that if we flip scum with crazy draft picks he needs to be looked at again Look at his actual play and tell me you think that is scum play. I just don't see it. I want to see it because I'm getting bored of reading filters and concluding; probably town but I can't do much about the conclusion. I think he is town and I can't see why anyone who analysed his play would suggest he was scum. | ||
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On December 04 2013 16:47 VisceraEyes wrote: Mocsta was right - excessive smack-down on the field. Not a huge thing, just something I noticed at the time and didn't bring up because I was afraid I would talk myself into switching off Bum. Prom thank you for replacing in - having one less slot to worry about is going to really help things. You're very obviously town by your first post, so congratulations. Now try not to get killed please. With that, I'm going to bed. I'll do the filter thang tomorrow and either give you reads over the course of the phase or near the end before the next - depending on how excited I get by what I read I guess. The one at the top of pg 129? No I wasn't don't bullshit me. I wrote that in my head before I saw my role. | ||
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Not even a name I recognize. Given that he doesn't even have a mafia database entry I'll assume he is new.. As always anyone who knows anything about the individual who can add anything metawise would be greatly appreciated. According to an old Gonzaw heuristic I'd have to call JL scum, he stopped posting while getting boozed up. You can't trust a dude who stops posting while his guard is down. Based on his early posts I'll assume Johnnylaw is a LoL convert brought over by Wave. Dude knows his LoL (and I don't, so a lot of his early posts are not in a language I speak). DINGDINGDING we have a winner folks On December 01 2013 11:18 JonnyLaw wrote: This makes no sense. There's not a lot of pressure on you because you're flipping it on everyone else. Just fucking calm down, make your arguments and wait while we gain more information as people post, vote and draft. I get that you're making people talk and that will help us down the line but for now we have little information and ten pages of personal attacks and shit posting is clogging up the whole fucking thread. Get your shit together or I'm saying you are scum or at the least, not helping the town actively. The series of personal attacks and shit posting for ten pages gave me nothing yet. I'll post again after I see what scum ban. Holy double donkey dicks. Would lynch off of this post. 1. threat 2. it was a weak threat 3 that last sentence. You know what ten pages of shitposting gives a townie? I'll give you a hint, it rhymes with bum lead. 4. the whole thing is a soft grab for town points, its a 'ooh but bad thread atmosphere is bad' post with out doing anything to fix what it complains about. Scum love to agree with something being anti town while doing nothing to prevent it. So far this post is the scummiest thing I've read in this thread. Would lynch. This post is pretty awful to (its directed at bum) On December 01 2013 13:28 JonnyLaw wrote: Warwick's not a strong first pick. + Show Spoiler + At night, you may submit the name and champion name of a player This means we need to know which champion the player has successfully picked. Why pick trynd at all? Just so you know who has tryndamere? There's not a chance in hell I'm picking that champion. I plan to contribute to winning this game. Dealing damage to people above/below me does not help us win the game. I don't even understand. Actually, I must say fuck your list. I disagree strongly with most of the conclusions. I think you're scum as is. "I don't understand, therefore you are scum" = scummy "I don't understand, I would like to understand" = townie which is the above? Oh yes, the former. Johnnylaw is not making new points of his own, is arguing for and against nothings and keeps grabbing at town points while attacking town favoured plans. Note that he argues with the usefulness of the plan but does not provide a better plan, he is tearing down not bringing up. Corollary to the Chezinu rule, the kushmasta rule. On December 03 2013 06:25 JonnyLaw wrote: Okay, I was out all day yesterday. Two hours later I've finally caught up in the thread. gtrs - I dont like how his filter reads but he hasn't really given us much to lynch him either. I know he's capable of playing better as town so either he's busy, lazy or scum. None of these qualities help us win the game. Soniv - fine for now. Looks to be making an effort to push the game towards a goal. kushmasta - Like really? This guy comes into the thread and starts calling people scum in one liners and generally shitting the place up. He replaced OWB who completely shut down and hated playing scum in NMM L. The random tooscummytobescum post irritates me as well. The rest have longer filters and I need to evaluate them. Just reading through the last 20 pages hasn't left me with other strong feelings yet. I'll be checking filters and around for a while. twenty pages of reading twenty four hours after his last thread appearance and the only kinda scummy thing he picks up on is that kush is a weird ass dude. I could have told you that for free. He also says that gtsrs is playing the game. Which is not a conclusion. Everyone can see that gt is busy/lazy/scum JL doesn't provide any insight, he says he didn't like something and follows it with nothing until VE brings it up again at which time JL +1s like a champ. He does these quick summaries of people which I can't stand, many of you know my stance on list posts without content and JL has many posts which are just one continuous contentless list. A bit of an excuse since Sandro asked him to look at those particular filters but in reality he said nothing about the four players. Conclusion rating 4.5 my qualms with a JL lynch. The kid may be so new he doesn't see what he is doing and is unsure of how to contribute in a large game, lord knows its hard. He could be throwing around dog crap posts because he simply doesn't know how to make better posts, he seems relativly involved in the thread and has intereacted with many players by name and by idea. For now he looks like my first pressure for day two but I am not yet confidant I will want to lynch him. If I had to guess most likely scum out of the players I have filtered so far I'd take JL no questions asked. | ||
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On December 04 2013 17:19 Mocsta wrote: I really can't follow that Jay read. My only meta on him is from Nomination and my memory was that he was paranoid -- carefree doesn't ring a bell. Like, I get you are trying to paint a picture of carefree; but I dont see how that apostrophe post conveys that message? The pick selection was semi-discussed early game and holds some form of merit -- and there were 2 people that posted in the game that failed to submit #'s. Does this auto qualify both as town?? + then you get that hes AFK towards the end of the lynch, suddenly gets called out and magically appears to vote the leading bandwagon. I'm not sold on Jay being confirmed town in the slightest. My meta stuff is outdated it has been a long time since I played. Take it with a grain of salt. However you are taking two things and combining them. You should remember the three Ms of mafia (Mindset, mentality and meta) I coached you I'm sure I mentioned it to you somewhere. You are confusing Jay's town mindset: paranoid and his mentality: carefree. Jay's posts themselves are carefree, he isn't worried about things even though he is Best mislynch NA, he owns his badness and revels in it. He is also paranoid, he suspects everyone for everything. The two are NOT mutually exclusive. Jay is a doofus. When you have a doofus on your scum team you make sure they do the right thing. In scum chat you'll be talking about picks as this a PYP game and scum coordinate their numbers its a big thing for them. On the whole I'd say that yes, in fact, the two people who did not pick numbers are probably town. If at any point one flips scum the other has to be looked at much more closely though as that means scum were thinking about using the no-pick to look townie. I can't comment on timings because I wasn't here for them. Were Jay's actions scummy? Undoubtedly. Were his actions possible from a town jay? Equally undoubtedly. The kid can be a lurk machine. Who was the other player? | ||
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On December 04 2013 17:37 supersoft wrote: meh... and why do people always start posting their analysis at night?! I replaced in at night, I don't have a lot of choices. | ||
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Super, will I have to start by calling you scum to have you come have a nice conversation with me or will you do it because you wanna be best buddies and wreck scum? [/serious] | ||
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In particular I look forward to talking with those of you who will be useful. Please make that all of you. | ||
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While you are here tell me which parts of that case you found convincing and which you doubted. | ||
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In inventing consider that scum were most afraid of DT roles and you would do well to create them, though they can be boring to invent they are some of the best roles a town can have, even more so when scum has no framer/godfather powers. | ||
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On December 04 2013 18:45 geript wrote: As for primes big case on jay, not sure whether to not believe it or feel cockblocked. Haven't filtered you yet, I assume there is a good reason for those feelings. Explain it for me so I don't have to go filter diving you right now please. I don't have the energy to filter you right now (its 6am for me and I'm still up), I think I saw somewhere you were interested in lynching one of the J players, I thought it was JayB. Was it JL? | ||
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On December 04 2013 19:19 marvellosity wrote: Please provide evidence for this, as far as I'm aware (and quickly glancing through TL Mafia Database) this is simply totally untrue. Dessert mafia again. Jay chose to lurk through the game as scum, he said later that he had been planning on having an active town game but had to match his town meta as scum. Off to find quotes. Will return shortly. | ||
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On January 27 2013 10:33 jaybrundage wrote: Hey guys at the anniversary dinner ill have to read the obs qt later thos game was really frustrating cause i didnt actually have internet acess i was planning to play this game as aggressive town. The lurking wasntwasnt by choice wbg which actually says he did have real world problems and intended not to be lurky. That is the only game I really remember playing with him though so that must be where the misconception entered my mind. Will have to pursue some of his other games. | ||
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yeah fuck it. Next post is geript filter dive. Why not? Marv, I still think my point about jay holds. People come and go, they have lives. A decent amount of the time a delurk is just when someone has time to be in the thread. Comments on the authenticity of reading him based on not sending in numbers. I think that is the most important point in my Jay read and what really gets at the inherent reason he is town. | ||
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geript starts with all the tough guy posing, its interesting to note but not all that important right now. Its something to remember though as its clearly a persona gerpit is putting on. Reasons for both scum and town to do this. He comes out the gate with "no bans at all" which seems so totally nonsensical that I've been staring at that post for five minutes (part of the blame lays in how tired I am). Here are the possible reasonings I can imagine for posting that 1) is town and believes that no bans is beneficial to town in some way, impossible. 2) is scum and is trying to gain town cred by doing something so outlandish that 'scum could never do it' possible 3) is dumber than a monkey's fart. Unlikely, Conclusion A. Leans scummy for post on bans. His early attacks on JayB + Show Spoiler [seen here] + On November 30 2013 14:17 geript wrote: No, the only reason why you'd expect him to be honest about his claim is because you're scum. Just like how only mods can recognize a fake nuke and make a joke about it. You're scum. Conclusion B: leans back towards town for his creation of early disscussion The problem I have with this is that geript holds on to this thing which should be obviously not worth a damn to him (and everyone else) its an hour 0 pressure. Its based on almost nothing. But geript is in it like a hell hound. Got his teeth sunk in the meat of Jay's leg all deep like, I don't see it from a townie. A scum wants to leave fangs in over something dumb because its a way to look active. A town gives up bad game as bad when they realize its going no where. Conclusion C: goes further back the way of scum due to taking too long in letting go of bad reasoning to attack a player. Geript is talking about how roles don't matter. Geript who was in that PYP where sn0 got inventor and wrecked face with OP inventions. That same PYP where roles were key in a bunch of shit. Roles saved town in that game. Geript even got to shoot scum because of the power of the inventor role. His insistence that roles do not matter rings empty and false. Conclusion D: geript hates town winning the game. gerpit did post the sign up list order in the thread. A thing which is good and pro town and easy to do. It gains him town points but they are very tentative. I'm perturbed by geript's very sincere belief that there are six scum and that scum have two kp. Both are in his filter and not in the OP. I think both those numbers are a little off from what I'd expect in this size game but they make sense together; a conclusion no sane player of tl mafia would reach but something a host might do. geript puts players on ignore which is simply awful as town. It serves to benefit you as scum and do dick all if you are town. Kush will remember me yelling at him about this in ## recently. geript, don't ignore people or put them on ignore or anything. Its bad. geript hard defends Rayn d0 and really puts his foot down about it. He takes a hard stance which I rather like. Its odd, everything I'm seeing seems to objectively point to scum but I don't find it convincing. There is something in how geript is thinking that seems silly but not scummy maybe? I can't explain it right. He is ringing all the scum bells but it feels like he is ringing them for the wrong reasons. He has all this ill founded bravado that I [i]think would be hard for him to do as scum. He is very in your face and it seems townie. I like geript's day one play, he is all around the place. Starts on jay but doesn't stick. Has gotten over his bad tunnel. HIts oats. I also think [spoiler=this post] On December 03 2013 02:23 geript wrote: It's a quote from the first podcasts. Geez Marv get with the program. I think the question was how can I get that fun carefree frilly style and still be effective. As an addendum answer Kurumi noted how that style is very hard to mimic as scum. Especially since as scum you need people to listen to you. So it becomes obvious when you break from it. [/spoiler] on Kuru is surprisingly insightful. He is drawing from something out of game and making connections in game to give a town read. Its a hard read to back down from too. That posts makes gerpit likely town in my opinion. In general geript's thread presence and intentional interactions with many different players give me an early town read. Not one I'm terribly confidant in but I would not be happy with a day one lynch on him. I haven't gotten though his whole filter (I'm only up to those all caps posts about how marv should touch his penis) and I won't finish it right now. I'm exhausted and not sure I'm making much sense. Conclusion omega: geript is probably a townie playing poorly in the early game rather than a scummer. Would not be happy lynching him d1. As he is trying to contribute. My major problem with him as a town read is conclusion A. I'm having trouble reconciling that thought process with a townie. I may finish his filter later. For the moment he isn't a person of interest for me. For the moment sleep is a person of interest. I see you all tomorrow. [/b] | ||
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On December 04 2013 20:37 marvellosity wrote: I'm in no hurry, if i die somehow tonight you'll filter me, otherwise we'll be alive to talk about it tomorrow. Not rehashing my filter because you're lazy, dear. fair enough. Its mostly that I'm prioritizing people I don't have town reads on and ignoring people who are good night shots. I don't have to analyse dead people and I figure some combination of VE/SS/You/Rayn maybe me/austin/mig will be dead. If however many of those are flipped town I get to read their filters as buddies and assume they know things. If I die I don't have to read shit. Win win. | ||
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I'd still like reads on replacement slots from Supersoft, VE and Sandro. I know VE has not forgotten this and will be providing these reads soon. marv, austin and Rayn please comment on the validity of town reading Ticklish and Jay off of the fact that they forgot to send in picks during the number phase. I believe this is a valid heuristic and would like input on the subject. On December 04 2013 20:44 marvellosity wrote: Given the tone of the post, I'm not sure why you're taking it seriously at all? I think you are right marv, I wasn't in the game at the time and was ascribing a seriousness to the post which did not necessarily exist. However, since it may have existed geript could you please explain your reasoning for the post on zero bans. Thanks.I'm also interested in how you, geript, feel in general now that I have partially filtered you as you asked. As other people have said the Kuru self modkill is likely town. As a host I believe it would be unfair to allow a scum slot to remain in the game after a stunt like that so if he is replaced he is most likely town. Those of you who remember a BC/Palmar/Geript lylo will understand that kuru's slot cannot be brought to lylo with that reasoning for his townieness though. At some point either his slot has to die or shape up. Koshi whatever it you you are trying to do, assuming you are town, is awful. Stop it. It is severely degrading town atmosphere for no reason. The fact that I know you can be bettter than this only makes your play even more dubious. Shape up d2 or get lynched. On December 04 2013 21:23 supersoft wrote: i like your entrance. we will talk later ;-) why is Supersoft so disengaged from the thread. I don't remember ever seeing him play this way. He doesn't even have anything bad to say about me or my reads. I get a hinky feeling from his two posts since I've joined the game. Can anyone give me a recent example where Super was town and plays this way? Or scum and plays this way? As far as I can tell his current behaviour is a total derivation from his usual play as ether alignment but viewed on its own is somewhat meh. In writing this I had a revelation. It is night time. SS is not anywhere near as hinky as I though for those posts. Assuming he resumes play during the day all is well. Not deleting this part of my post though. Something others should keep in mind. I am adding my voice to those who are aware of Roffles from TL as a whole. He is known for being somewhat abrasive and not so useful. His play this game does not surprise be but it certainly doesn't gladden me. I wouldn't be all that sad if he was vigged but he is not at all alone in that category. On the same note, Onegu keeps grabbing for sympathy. Its sickening. I choose to believe that the things he says are true (if they aren't he is a disgusting individual using a handicapped son's ill health as an excuse in a mafia game) but as much as I am sorry for Onegu that his son is not well I'd like to never have to hear about it in this game again. In all callousness I don't give a damn about your son while we're playing this game. When the game is over or we are both dead you can talk to me about your family as much as you want. Right now, here, you need to stop excusing your absences while doing nothing and play the game to the best of your ability or ask to be replaced. If real life is so hard that you do not have time to post anything about the game or read the thread than replace and no hard feelings, that is exactly why replacements exist. If you choose to stay in the game though I, and others, will force you to play it. Onegu, I'd love for you to play with us but right now that isn't what you are doing. P.S. I hate the word 'sorry' Tl:dr an emotional appeal to Onegu to either replace out because irl is too much right now or to play the game. Conclusion: Onegu remains a 4. On December 05 2013 02:17 VisceraEyes wrote: Jay where were posts like that one like...all game long? Its is night one. Where should they have been? Since you see merit in the post please do me the favour of refuting it with logic and not caps lock emotions. I need this from you. On December 05 2013 03:39 VisceraEyes wrote: It was not a nitpick. I ASKED HIM A QUESTION. I admit it was phrased poorly, but it looked like he was fine with a bum lynch. So why vote Jay instead? See what I'm saying? Woahwoahwoah, take a step back cowboy. Let me lead you though a little dance 1. VE calls out Odin for focusing on bum but voting jay 2. VE says Odin is a town read of his 3. Kush notes that Odin's post did not do the scummy thing that VE claimed 4. VE gets fake mad at Kush with big ole caps lock 5. VE continues to pretend that his question wasn't bad and that he is town. yeah, you get where I'm going here but Kush makes a totally good and valid point. You. VE, do nothing to counter his point and nothing to suggest why it made any sense to pull out a quote of Odin's to question him on while he is not here even though Odin is a town read of yours and you are not questioning anyone else. On December 05 2013 01:26 gtrsrs wrote: i'm going to the gym. when i get back i'm going to take a shower and make breakfast. if my girlfriend is still asleep and nothing comes up by that point, i'll make my case for a lynch. if she's up, my case will have to wait until probably 3pm pst today. either way i'll do my best to have a cohesive lynch case by the end of today (dec 4th) i feel strongly about my read. if my case is strong enough to convince you to lynch my suspect, and i turn out wrong, i'd like to be lynched the next day please. i just simply don't feel strongly enough about anyone other than my target to make any conclusive assessments yet, yet i feel like you guys are putting a lot of pressure on lurkers to perform more (and rightly so). i will probably have my confidence shaken and be even more worthless if i'm wrong on this one thanks I'm so sorry Johhnylaw! I said you had the worst single post in the game. I lied. gtsrs has the worst post of the game (which I have read so far, there might be a hidden gem) Breakdown of why this post is awful and makes gtsrs red on my spreadsheet (if I had one he would be anyway) 1. pre excuses lurking 2. says he will make a case on a particular individual but does not name the individual, leaving room to make a case on the town wagon leader and claiming credit for an early read. 3. pre excuses that read flipping town 4. martyrs early all in all the above post is an attempt to do dick all. Take credit for leading a lynch. Be useless. Garner pity. would lynch rated a solid 4.5 On JayB his recent post on VE isa solidly town oriented piece. It gives, in my opinion, town points to Jay as he is clearly thinking about the situation in which this game exists in relation to other games in the past. He went out and found the quotes to fit his case and made interesting points. I don't happen to find anything he said particularly convincing but I'm happy he said it as it shows that he is in fact thinking critically about the game. I cannot understand what conclusion MZ reached about the post I just referenced to be so incensed by Koshi's minimal, but accurate, response to it. MZ please explain your reading of Jay's post that you found what Koshi said top be unlikely from town-Koshi. Kush you wanted recent good cases? I made a set of cases when I entered the game for Kush, JayB, LSB (less so) and geript being town while Onegu and Coag were on the scum side of null I also made cases for Johnnylaw and gtsrs being scum and half a scum case on VE in this post. My filter is short, you can find all of them. | ||
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2= likely town 3= null 4= willing to lynch 5= preferred lynch If you can't distill my reads from my posts you aren't reading them. Its night time I don't feel a need to lay out my top priority lynches in order for you. If I die I have an awesome filter for you to read. If I live we can talk about it when I push I lynch. | ||
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hi guys! | ||
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I'm willing to read into Rean if you are willing to respond to and interact with my cases/reads telling me what you agree with and what you disagree with and bringing new thoughts to the table. | ||
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On December 05 2013 05:43 VisceraEyes wrote: Okay fuck your request bitch. I'll filter who I wanted to originally then. Jesus Christ. No its a serious question, You don't get out of it by pretending to be mad. What is it about my play that has caused you to lodge your tongue in my rectum so thoroughly? Explain it to me, you aren't so lacking in confidence that you would follow my lead when I replaced in 20 hours ago and you've been here since the start without good reasons. Explain those reasons butt licker! | ||
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On December 05 2013 05:50 VisceraEyes wrote: The fact of the matter is that you just replaced and you have a more objective mindset than I do. I've been explicit about my fear of confirmation bias and if I can do ANYTHING to help you, my strongest townread in the game based on your entrance, I'm going to do it. I can wait to do MY filters until I have more fucking time Prom. I don't have fucking time to do it all. If you think I sound angry, it's not because I'm faking it. It's because you're jumping to conclusions, and I know you're better than that. Now do you want me to filter your choices or mine? Don't give me any "Oh he's trying to avoid giving us his own thoughts" bullshit Prom, answer my question. VE I'm actually being very reasonable. You haven't stated anywhere why you have such a strong town read on me and that is what my colourful language is expressing. You have been very into me and asking me to tell you what to do but haven't qualified why I am your strongest town read or done anything with that. Of course I'd like your thoughts on the filters I originally picked out and the ones your were thinking of. For now I'd like your thoughts on your filters +johhnylaw and jayB. Along with this I'd like a succinct answer about the Odin stuff. If I'm your strongest town read your choice to alienate me by yelling is silly. I don't understand it at all. JAT: I finished my Rean analysis. I'll post it when you have posted on my cases. Don't bitch at me about not fair, I replaced into a game 20 hours ago and have more content than anyone else. | ||
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On December 05 2013 06:11 marvellosity wrote: bitch please, you just spend 20 words to say what I say in 2. yeah I think Gonzaw might have died and decided to possess me. | ||
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Between jcarl and Johhnylaw which would you lynch? | ||
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On December 05 2013 06:59 justanothertownie wrote: Will you stop holding your read hostage now Prome? Yep, sorry I was out while you posted your responses (i.e. your +1s, you seriously barely disagreed with me on anything besides saying you didn't terribly like LSB nor think he should be given a free pass for his no scum hunting. Something I agree with implicitly in my post. Anywho Rean Another low content player. I really wish there weren't so many of these but ah well, its just night one. Rean starts by roleplaying some guy named doublelift who is an asshole. He stops the roleplaying pretty quickly though which I am not sure I really understand. There was no pressure on him for roleplaying and, given that he had asked the mods about it he clearly wanted to role play at least some. I take his early posting as alignment null but potentially interesting. Rean approaches the ban phase very openly but it is a time which is very easy for a scum player to be open. A scummer just has to look at the hero (is it champion in LoL?) list and go "I want that hero, better mention to town that scum would want that hero" in general its an easy time to be active and involved for both townies and scum. It is therefore an easy time to gauge later activity, when it is harder to say things as scum because there are less clear rights and wrongs. Rean has two very brazen posts in a row + Show Spoiler [1] + On November 30 2013 13:11 Rean wrote: I got this, dw. I'm good at yelling at people until they do as I say. I like yelling at people until they do as I say. On November 30 2013 13:39 Rean wrote: We ban based on the info we have because it's all we can do. these posts seem unlikely to be from mafia. They are an attempt by Rean to be in the middle of things and get his voice heard. The thing is that his voice is a parrot during this whole event sheeping the things Sandro said. All in all this early part of Rean's filter gives me a town lean. Rean later comments on the whole roleplaying bit from earlier On November 30 2013 15:06 Rean wrote: Can you guys stop shitting up this thread with bullshit discussions about my alignment based on me RPing as DL. It doesn't say shit about my alignment and discussing it is a waste of time, we should worry about bans instead. nice really. Doesn't seem to give a damn what people think and says this discussion is silly. I agree its impossible to draw conclusions from that early play and I think Rean simply trying to shut it down because of the silliness of it rather than fight about how he is townie adds some points to the town column. On December 04 2013 06:39 Rean wrote: I'm not actively reading the thread, just happened to be around at the time. And it really annoyed me that apparently it's okay to tell others to kill themselves over a fucking game. ATM I don't have any opinions on anyone, didn't really read that much of the thread. Prolly gonna find someone that looks town enough and go full sheep. I'm also a fan of this post. Rean was saying in BttB (I think, I just read marv's post) that he feels super pressured as scum and freaks out. Scum usually realize how damn silly it is to say I'ma sheep town dude +1+1 blah blah blah. I'm more used to seeing townies do this and,as its an attention grabber, not something I see a scared scum doing. From what he has posted I'll take a town lean on Rean. My major problems with him are how little he posted during d1 itself and even less in n1. He was very active during the pre-day phase when pressure on scum is minimal but hasn't done dick since. His play itself is not too concerning and if we were still in the middle of d1 I'd read him as pretty town. As it is he is a town lean. Overall: 2.5 rounding up or down based on how he acts and how much he posts during the coming cycle. | ||
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On December 05 2013 08:03 JonnyLaw wrote: Prome your case on me cannot ignore that early game league discussion. I was discussing with Bum the best champs to pick and ban because I thought it could help us win the game. I started this game trying to see how people play. I quickly realized that with a list of 30 players a lot of which already know each other from previous games this is difficult. Take for example when I "called kush a weird dude" I was quickly jumped on by people saying that's how kush should be playing. He came into the thread threw out a couple reads and then posts one liners the rest of the game. That seems suspicious to me. If that's how he plays then fine. -snip- Why do Rean, Onegu, Coag, Kenpachi and Gtrsr all get byes for lurking? This post is getting too long. I'll follow it up with the rest of my thoughts shortly. so two things about this, 1 yes I can and will ignore how the thread was progressing during that time. I was not in the thread and can't analyse what the thread was doing as a whole during its organic evolution. Instead I am looking at individuals separate from the thread. 2. To the bolded (his emphasis not mine): hehehehehehehehe. I've posted on all of those players besides Kenpachi (who even knew he was in the game? Not I) and what you are doing is shouting out a list of players and begging the thread which, right now is me, VE and marv, to attacka lurker for you. Of those I find Rean townie Coag scummy Onegu so unreadble as to be worth killing and gtsrs rather townie. Now if you want the thread to pursue one of those targets who you so ineptly try to accuse of something you can make a case on them. This post pushes you further into scum category for me. LSB is an easy target and has been talked to death, you didn't add anything to the case against him and, therefore, I do not find this case to give you townie points. Conclusion still scummy. | ||
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On December 05 2013 08:28 justanothertownie wrote: Hm, ok Prome. What you forgot to mention is that Rean was here most of the time and commented only on non game relevant things (almost instantly when they happened) but still claimed to not read the thread and excused himself like that. Reads to me like he is afraid to say something he can be hold responsible for in the long run - why hold back like that as town if he doesn't care how he looks anyways? But I get the feeling that points towards town for you too. If all those pople are town - how do we win this game? Yeah, I gave you many +1s. I dont deny that. If I had seen something I really really disagree with I would have said it before you had to ask me to comment. I wasn't in the game to see the timings. I see his posting as it is to be townie. Since I cannot get the feeling of the timings I leave my read based on what he has posted. His general posting while not terribly impressive or useful but they do strike me as rather fearless which is a townie trait. Mentality Meta Mindset. The three Ms of mafia. | ||
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On December 05 2013 08:39 JonnyLaw wrote: You're convinced LSB is town then? I find nothing gtrs has done to be town leaning. He wrote a bunch of posts about champions in league then wrote a case on jcarl that serves to defend himself. That's it. Either league abilities or attacking soniv. LSB = town? Nien. I am convinced that what LSB has done so far has been pro town and would not be hard to fake as scum. If he scum hunts well in next day he is town. If not he is scum. He is not someone I am interested in lynching d2. I am interested in lynching him d3 if he continues to provide only those things which are easy to provide as scum. The attack on soniv shows a thought process that, while not one I totally agree with, seems to be trying to find scum. Its a townie kind of way to look at the world. I didn't feel like he was trying to justify lynching soniv he was trying to find scum. | ||
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On December 05 2013 09:13 jcarlsoniv wrote: I highly disagree with this. He might not be trying to lynch me in particular. But it's a fairly easy case for him to start because bum was tunneling me, and he just flipped green. It's an easy transition for him to make. And the case was incredibly flimsy. Long, detailed, but full of fabrications and reading red from nothing. I don't know your personality well I've played one game with you that I can remember and it was a hydra game where I wrote you/wave off as town early because you were town. I liked that Guitars Are Us was looking into things based on your personality and what he saw as differing from that. Having played scum I believe that would be a hard case to write as scum because he has to set himself up to 1v1 you and be the expert on you. Also the weird overstepping paranoia around your role/character names is a townie trait, its just so out there and precise in its out-there-ness that it smells like strawberries. | ||
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On December 05 2013 09:28 geript wrote: Also, now that Warwick is out. I think it's a good time for everyone to claim their player and champion. I'm Uzi and I'm playing twitch. Why is that a good idea? There are a million hidden powers and it seems likely that at least one of them is also related to names/champions. I liked you explanation for NO BANS! so explain why we need FULL CLAIMS! Why is it ever a good idea to claim our person names? They have no relation to our roles or abilities and could be punishable by said hidden abilities (like Warwick's non-hidden one) | ||
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On December 05 2013 09:34 jcarlsoniv wrote: Except that he's talking about my personality as if he knows me on a personal level, which he certainly does not. He talks as if he really gets me and knows how I react to things I mean, that's somewhat fair, but at least I've been here, trying to do things. Making attempts, maybe incorrectly. Gatorserious comes back from inactivity and useless spam with a case that has an incredibly soft foundation based on the fact that he thinks he understands my interactions. And this is why I wish wave was in this game to refute/support those things since I know to trust his assessment of your personality. So you think scum gtrsrs attacked town Soniv based on personality traits which gtrsrs totally made up and have no foundation in reality? Is that more likely than town gtrsrs making a case on alignment Soniv based on something which he, gtrsrs believes to be true about Soniv despite the protestations of his target? If I'm correct in assuming that Guitars are Us came from LoL subforum and has played minimal mafia than you are the person he knows best in this player list. The fact that he turned on his most likely ally in the thread seems to point to someone not looking for allies. The above has been colour coded for your convenience/my amusement. | ||
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I am nervous about his play thus far but he is not worth being a top lynch pick by any means. | ||
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Can I expect more from you in the future? | ||
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On December 05 2013 11:05 jaybrundage wrote: Hmm I tried to find the game we played together. I swear we played 2 games together one with you and WBG in it and another with you guys being a hydra but i cant find them. I don't remember what name you guys were under. Can you help me find it? In regards to you being scum I think you are. You were extremely loud in the other game(s) I remember you tried to establish your towniness and tried to go gung-ho from day 1 making reads and following up and being a force in the thread I think it was you who observed me using smilies and tried to deduce whether it was scummy or not (lol) But you left an impression. This game however I barely remembered that you existed. If not for Sandro mentioning you I probably would of skated right by you. So Supes tell me are you scum and who are your scum buddies. Emilezola normal mini four | ||
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On December 05 2013 11:41 supersoft wrote: not sure, if you have a reading problem. I said i had no time to play the last 3 day. that has nothing to do with boredom or scummieness. But nvm you're scum, so it's perfectly fine for you to twist the facts. wp I disagree with your conclusion. What logic are you applying to jay to find him scummy? | ||
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goodluck town you beat those slimy skt newbs. | ||
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This game as a whole was pretty good. Neither team played very well bit they both played poorly together, which I liked. Wave, you and your team did a damn good job of hosting this game. I know how crazy a game of this size can be so I'm pleased at how well you all did. Town: you sucked. Scum: you sucked worse. Everyone: I had a good time playing and a good time obsing. Thanks for playing! Those of you who didn't play: fuck you for not playing! Geript and Odin I forgive you both because you have both shown interest in making things better in the future. | ||
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When I say that town and scum both sucked I'm also including myself in that crew. I just think its important for no body to go off and pat themselves on the back too much because no one played incredibly. We all could have played better. I didn't hear people talking about reading my filter in game but clearly you guys did. So thank you for paying attention and sorry for giving you shit. What mocsta said about me in scum qt is true. I work to sell myself higher than I'm worth. I find it makes me more effective when I tell everyone that I'm awesome. SS does this as well, though he may not admit it. It works to make good players easier to listen to for newer players, if you don't know who to listen to someone talking themselves up is at least worth looking at. Roffles: you were a large part of what was toxic in this game. I'm sure you know that. | ||
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On December 25 2013 17:51 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I slipped pretty hard. I thought I used my role well. The game was fun. I owe rayn a beer for the amount he defended me. Town won because scum ran out of viable people to call scummy and didn't have the kp to kill everyone we needed to. gg all You didn't slip as hard as mocsta did and he somehow didn't get lynched for it. This game was pretty great for that. | ||
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