EPTGoT Mafia: Lords and Liars - Page 5
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: this was obviously incorrect, and I wanted to see what clarity would say. When he said I get a few points for claiming my name because someone else might claim it i told him that was incorrect:Fuck it. I've reread strongandbig's filter and I think he's scum. Name claiming Lets start with the whole Clarity thing. I didn't like how it got blown up into a giant problem, but didn't really think much of it. However, rereading it seems somewhat scummy to nameclaim like that. Scum (at least some of them) have townie names, as evidenced by Yamato flipping Doran Martell. If, at the start of the game, you can gain some town credit by nameclaiming, this seems like a pretty good idea. If scum have some kind of KP that relies on nameclaiming, then it makes it a fucking excellent idea. This was the reason I was a bit suspicious of johnnywup at the start of the game. Nameclaiming is simply not a townie thing to do when you have zero knowledge about the setup. He subsequently made a big stink about how Clarity sent the message on to Oatsmaster, and I found Oats' behaviour in the whole ordeal really fucking scummy, so forgot about SnB's nameclaim starting the whole thing off. But I want some answers: SnB: why did you ignore all the risks of nameclaiming if you're town. Johnnywup, when I pressed him, claimed ignorance. You, however, are not a newbie and have played in at least 2 games I can think of where nameclaiming could get you killed (and in fact, in CT you had the very role to kill nameclaimers unless I am mistaking things). Additionally you claim it's a townie thing to do and should get you elected. You KNOW this is false. Why the lies? Original Message From strongandbig: Yeah I haven't heard from vivax either. Bee tee dubs the right answer was "it doesn't matter if you are hodor, if role name corresponds to alignment and scum don't have safe claims then the hosts are retarded and we should be acting as if they are not stupid". Basically, I was just fishing for reactions. I pm'd oats this: Original Message From strongandbig: I rolenameclaimed only to clarity. Seemed like a good idea at the time. Compartmentalize what info goes to what people. I don't really know how I can make a trap out of it though. and later this: Original Message From strongandbig: He didnt say much about it. Ima tell him to vote me because of it and see what he does. Well, basically once I start to think someone is scum, I can tell the other people what information I told them and not tell them I told you? Then if they kill me and claim my role or something you can catch them? Idk, the only way rolenameclaims matter is if the hosts were dumb and made role names correspond to alignment, which I doubt. It just seemed like fun to be sneaky? and yes i ignored the risks of name claiming. I didn't think that through, it seemed pretty out of the question that anyone would have a role which targeted my rolename. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: Worthless reads as a lord As a lord, we get this: Distancing himself from his own vote. Test balloon: lets see if we can get a decent town player lynched on a ridiculous pretext. If people wagon, then awesome, otherwise no harm no foul. Then his vote ends up on Onegu: This is one of the shoddiest votes I have ever seen, especially as the earlier posts were him actually defending Onegu: this is poor logic. i defended onegu because ryan's push on him was stupid, not because i had a town read on onegu. later i attacked onegu and voted for him because even when the pressure was taken off of him, he didn't use that space to do any scumhunting or anything pro-town. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: this was not my reasoning. I did not vote to lynch onegu because he was a useless lurker but because i thought he was the most likely to be scum of any of the then-current lynch candidates. my reasoning was, as I told vivax:So what made Onegu a worse lurker than jrkirby, FirmTofu, gumshoe, or really any of the other useless lurkers. Nothing. Onegu was, in fact, a less useless lurker. But he needed to toss his vote without letting it be accountable at all. onegu - i actually agree with the stuff that clarity said, he seemed excited pregame then disappeared. - he also didn't become less defensive or more involved when rayn took off the pressure for the "contradiction" he had been attacking him for at the start, if he was a townie - hasn't actually posted any reads other than that he thinks clarity isn't scum because of the pm thing. but yeah okay i'm glad you finally found the things that I did d2 that everyone else has been calling me scum for all day. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: um, my reasoning for not wanting to be lord again was that i would not be active. vivax already had voted for me i think, it would have been easy to be lord if i wanted it.Active when pressured Then on D2 when he is no longer lord, and just as people are starting to think seriously of shooting him dead at night, he comes in to save his ass with the case on Risen. His reason for not wanting to be lord is fucking phoney as hell: he wanted to reclaim his townie status, but did absolutely NOTHING towards that. Resulting in him basically disqualifying himself from the lord position, where he would not be able to lurk as much. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: Most of this has already been discussed, so I'll leave it at this. The Yamato connection Yamato on SnB: Neither of these seem like sincere efforts to push a lynch on SnB, and particularly the second one is complete nonsense: half a meta read because it IGNORES the fact that SnB's latest town games have been lurky sacks of uselessness as well. He was endgamed and ignored by scum in NWM, and modkilled for inactivity in PTP. Hardly a shining record to contrast with his lurky inactive scumgame. This read was easily discredited, but notice that SnB has no real interaction with yamato, despite SnB being yamato's main scumread. He just ignores it, because he knows yamato will never push the read. yeah except that yamato was setting up the same things that you're arguing now. i'm pretty sure he would have pushed the read if he didn't decide to claim scum. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: What we do have, is this: 2 minutes later comes the test balloon of lynching me for roleplaying, and another 5 minutes later his vote is on Onegu with NO explanation worth speaking of (except, he's lurking). What happened to this will to lynch Yamato? It vanished in thin air... in about 5 minutes flat. yeah i was about as serious about killing yamato there as i was about killing you for roleplaying (ie not at all). both of those were me being pissed at annoying people - yamato for his stupid activity read (which even you admit is a bad reason to be calling me scum), and you for playing in character and making it harder to actually read you. when i actually want to kill someone, i either vote them (ie onegu) or i write a big-ass case on them and yell at a bunch of people if i can't vote for them (ie risen and vivax. also johnnywup now). if i make a one-line post saying "hey let's kill this guy" or "you're being stupid we should kill you" there's no way a reasonable person would take that as a serious scumread from me. maybe that's how you or kushmasta give the thread your scumreads, but mine have some reasoning behind them. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: On D2 you'd think he'd have something to say about the red check on Yamato when he was so happy to report he had caught up on the thread, but no. He spouted off some nothingness that said very little in very many words. Avoid the contaminated scumbuddy like the plague! are you retarded? after i already told you why i didn't comment on the useless things? what would the purpose have been in commenting on the red check, we were lynching yamato for sure. On August 16 2013 04:44 Acrofales wrote: @all lords: please lynch. this case is the worst one on me yet. it is a combination of misunderstandings and half-truths | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On August 16 2013 06:10 Xatalos wrote: I'm very glad we chose Vivax over snb. Although could snb also be scum? I don't think anyone even opposed his lynch? Or did someone? Feels a bit weird to have 2 scum as the choices for today though. If Vivax is some other anti-town role, not so much though. Now I'm mostly interested to hear what Risen and Sharrant have to say about the kill list. And pick times as well. i opposed my lynch no one else really did although the argument could be made that the "lynch vivax" movement showed up because my scum teammates decided to push it to save me, so i don't think you can conclude anything from the "opposing my lynch" argument. it's impossible for anyone except scum to know whether people decided honestly to lynch vivax instead of me (because vivax is antitown and I am not) or if it was a calculated move by the scum team. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On August 16 2013 06:42 kushm4sta wrote: JUST CATCHING up on th ethread but i think this case is 1bazillion percent retarded thanks for the vote of confidence kush you guys heard it here first if kush flips scum im confirmed town trololol | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On August 16 2013 07:34 Risen wrote: This post is wrong. It's just so wrong for legitimate reasons not even some far out theory I'm coming up with. Why does a townie make a post calling out his town reads for mafia to look at and shoot? pretend he'd made the same post but with the bolds removed and the non-bolds put in red here like this On August 16 2013 06:47 Xatalos wrote: OK, it's time for pure gut reads. The bolded players I think are likely town. Please don't lynch/shoot any of them unless some good reason appears later on. The rest should be purged. I'm somewhat unsure about Grackaroni, rayn, Mocsta and Sharrant, but I think they're all more likely town than scum at the moment. Dandel Ion Onegu Sharrant s0lstice Vivax Chromatically Clarity_nl Grackaroni raynpelikoneet Koshi johnnywup Mocsta strongandbig Acrofoles kushm4sta Risen | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On August 16 2013 07:44 johnnywup wrote: S&B his point still stands no it doesnt it was a list of like five scum reads. okay then scum can shoot the other twenty people in the game OMG THEY KNOW HIS TOWN READS!! | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On August 16 2013 07:59 Risen wrote: If he had done that as him pointing out who he thought scum team was it would be different. There's a huge difference between casting suspicion on people and calling people town. He called all but five people town. Oh no. Scum knows the 20 least suspicious people in town now they can target their night kills. Seriously this is a stupid argument. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On August 16 2013 08:08 Risen wrote: Tbh I don't know how to refute this. I just know giving town reads is not something town-aligned people should do. Give scum reads, and your reasons for thinking they're scum, and that's it. That's what kush and johnny should do as well. I agree with the last part | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On August 17 2013 16:14 Clarity_nl wrote: redcheck on mocsta... why have scum let sharrant live? To be fair, town has been kinda steamrolling so they have to make a play I guess.. n4 three of us will likely die, and it'll be the active three.... So, solving this game, or getting close to solving this game today would be great. If I had to guess, snb is not claiming scum and more likely forgot to vote cause he was flustered cause he messed up and posted a pm to me in thread instead. That said.... I was hoping that would mean I got 1 out of 1 votes and therefore elected... I'll have to ask this to the hosts and see if someone doesn't a vote, what a majority means. This is what happened. I meant to vote clarity, but that fuckup happened and I forgot. I don't know why I am not modkilled for not voting except that the mods never replied to my question in thread about modkills so maybe they are not doing that. I have no way of proving what I'm saying, you guys have to make up your minds based on the rest of the game and what you rhink the scum motivation is for this, so I'm just not gonna keep talking about it. If you all want to lynch me or lord-KP me for it I've brought it on myself. I even got a reminder pm from the hosts at midnight, after I had gone to bed... Seriously fuck me sideways this game. I finally start giving a shit and vivax flips scum rb and then this shit happens... Anyway there are still about ten pages of thread I haven't read but I wanted to put this out there before I hit the treadmill so that people can get their responses into the thread before I start responding in earnest. I plan on continuing to push johnnywup today. I think there's a clear difference between the way he played in nuclear winter and this game, he was under early pressure both times but his response this time is way more scummy than that time and the pressure is different. I was going to push him for the lynch but we kind of have to resolve this mocsta-sharrant red check situation ASAP, so it might be better for johnnywup to be The Lord KP target tonight. If we could get some idea of whether the lords can kill him tonight it would be good. Also if any lords don't think he is the right target I want to argue with them. As for mocsta sharrant, they both look kind of bad - mocsta mostly because jrkirby's was so scummy, sharrant I liked his response to risers case but he really has done so little else that it's hard to get a town read on him - so I don't want to commit to which one to lynch first until I read their filters, then I will give you my opinion. My gut feeling arm is to lunch mocsta first, though - sharrant was right about Yamato, plus the scum rb just died so it makes sense that he could get a check off. But I want to read both filters before I commit. Anyway I apologize to the town and the hosts for ducking up majorly this time, and especially to clarity. Johnywup is scum. Peace~ | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Unless someone claimed something in the previous nine pages which gives us more KP to work with or we get a big case that everyone is persuaded by. Okay gym now trek. | ||
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strongandbig
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On August 18 2013 00:13 Xatalos wrote: This might have actually been the most pro-town action for him I guess? Saving us some KP and a lynch. Strategic self-modkill is right up there with ubsanctuoned editing of posts on the "cheating" list. | ||
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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strongandbig
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On August 18 2013 01:07 Dandel Ion wrote: dunno, i asked to end this game in a draw. if that doesn't happen, I'll suggest we withhold the lord kp tonight. cuz that's what we would've used. That doesn't work cause scum might lie about The Lord KP. And I put too much effort into not getting lunched for this game to end in a draw. | ||
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strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Let me say what I said to Clarity about Risen. I don't want to lynch him today. re: risen: he was the second actual vote onto vivax, I believe, at a point when I was still strongly leading in votes. He could have kept his vote on Sharrant and hoped the vivax momentum would not build and I would still be the inertia candidate. I would have called him scum for that but imo he was not getting nearly as much heat as he deserved for his tunnel. For him to actually switch his vote back onto me would have been more difficult, since he'd already unvoted me. Vivax was close to giving up at that point, although I think Risen's vote came before his lolclaim, so a bus is not completely out of the question. I still think Risen's filter looks scummy as fuck, especially day 1 and the entire sharrant tunnel where he ignored sharrant's answers to his question. but this vote switch is a pretty big deal, so i'm willing to officially move my read on risen from "certain scum" to "null, don't want to lynch right now". I'm not willing to give him a townread yet just for one vote, when I still really dislike his filter in general, but it's enough to move my read significantly. Unless I find a stronger scumread tonight, I think I will be pushing for a johnnywup lynch tomorrow. I want to kill jwup today. On August 18 2013 00:19 Sharrant wrote: Do tell. And I'm saying it again, I'm pretty sure Johnny is town. why. seriously. if you have a green check on him, there's no reason not to say it now. although you can't have a green check on account of both of your alignment checks have been red and you say you alternate between alignment and hp checks. anything short of that and i'm going to demand very detailed reasons for it. | ||
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strongandbig
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if he's scum | ||
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strongandbig
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Are we fairly certain we can kill johnnywup tonight? Sharrant afaik never answered me or explained his townread at all. If we aren't fairly certain we can kill him tonight with lord kp, then we should be lynching him. | ||
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