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On July 25 2013 22:55 cDgCorazon wrote:
This case is really so terrible. There's no way I "waffled" on the TAA vote. I didn't unvote him several times, and I started playing the second half of D2 like TAA was going to be the lynch. I don't understand where you are going with that.
Secondly, I did not call into question Getmoript's claim after TAA had claimed scum RB. While it doesn't really make sense to have 2 investigators, I'm more likely to believe Getmoript now that he was right about TAA. The roles look a bit more balanced with scum having a RB.
And then the last point you made is you trying to fish for reasons to make me look like scum. Try harder.
Oh come on, Cora. The case is all about not whether you believe Getmoript now. It was whether or not you were actually considering TAA as town/scum scenarios. I'm saying you didn't consider the TAA as town because you knew it wasn't going to happen.
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On July 25 2013 23:18 cDgCorazon wrote:How am I supposed to consider TAA town when his response to Getmoript claiming and calling him scum was: Show nested quote +On July 24 2013 06:21 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
claiming detective instead of making a case is cheating
What the fuck. What took you so long to vote TAA!?
This crap is 6 hours later:
[spoiler]On July 24 2013 12:15 cDgCorazon wrote:
Ok this is really stupid...a town RB, 2 invest, and a vigilante. Someone is lying.
##Unvote
I'm going either Getmoript or TAA.
On July 25 2013 01:06 cDgCorazon wrote:
##Vote: TAA
AND You're the 2nd to last vote on the guy.
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@JJD
I think TAA was supposed to be Corazon...
Tofu corrects it later. Because Getmoript jumped on Tofu immediately for that. See if you can follow the thread and find it.
I'm not sure what to make of the typo/mistake though.
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Fuck this. Isn't town in a strong position?
So I just need to ask, how confident are your one-for-one reads between for jrkirby and I. Because I'm not seeing a firm read on scum jrkirby.
On July 25 2013 12:26 jrkirby wrote:
Yes, his day 1 posting as a whole troubles me. But I really don't think it's damning.
I think this is what VE is basically saying?
The major difference is that jrkirby is really lurky and FiveTouch is all confirmed town.
FiveTouch, if you end up being scum I'm going to have to congratulate you for being one deep mastermind, as a hydra even.
We've got 8-2 or 7-1-2 currently. If we can hit one mafia in the Night and Day and head into Day 4 with 5-1 or 4-1-1 and at least 1 confirmed town and 2 mis-lynches to go. As long as you're confident that you can at least get 1 out of 2, it should be a good plan? Just don't be completely wrong and hit two towns and head into MYLO.
Be prepared to eat your words, austin.
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I wasn't going to say it. But I think it's already been said.
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EBWOP
Previous post about getmoript NK.
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@VE
I think I have from Marv
On July 25 2013 22:08 FiveTouch wrote:
If you shoot Firm, I'm pushing for your lynch.
Clearly he would not like jrkirby pushing for Tofu lynch. Are you disagreeing?
At this point, I'll repeat from an earlier post:
I would like austinmcc or you talk about scum-town scenario between me an jrkirby. Especially create a case for town me and scum jrkirby even if you are suspecting scum me and town jrkirby. If you can rule out town-town that would be good enough for me. If you can create this case, I'll be the target.
@Wave & Geript
You can too can set up a case for the kind of information you think you are going to get from the flips.
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@jrkirby
Tell me your reads about me on Day 1 and Day 2. What is convincing you that I am town?
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Countdown!
Someone please convince me or at least Onegu about the information we're going to get from town flip out of me is going to be worthwhile.
Onegu, if you decide to shoot me, give me a heads up so I can write up a final post on my other reads. Otherwise I'll hold them in reserve to see if I can improve them.
@ FiveTouch
+ Show Spoiler +
It makes sense in review as the probable scenario that getript should have foreseen and expected when making the claim.
I think that it is certainly worded for that interpretation.
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READs MOFOs
Upstanding Blueville
getmoript A hydra with a correct DT claim on TAA and pretty much clear town all the way through the game. There is almost no question that this guy is town and is most definitely Blue too.
FiveTouch The other hydra. I think Marv was my guardian angel for the longest time, although he is probably wrong that I couldn't make the counter arguments the way I did when under pressure, I probably wouldn't have had the creativity to try it as scum. Day 1 VT claim into close lynch into Night 1 Lurk and Early Day 1 RB'd claim is some crazy shit. Seriously, if you are red, I will bow down and worship your crazy masterminding ways.
OneguI pretty much cleared DocH on this one and then Onegu made that awfully dumb but town only Vig claim. But this can only be a town claim and matches DocH's behavior. Definitely a blue. Still, what the fuck Onegu.
Mr Third Party
Oatsmaster and Survivor.
Since the start of Day 2, I've placed Oatsmaster more and more into a third party role. Oatsmaster starts off as bored and disinterested and really telegraphs his uselessness in terms of NK to scum and sets up as mild lynchbait as well. When the balance of power shifts to town favor after day 2 lynch, Oatsmaster shifts into more scum hunting mode.
The Murky Purple
Color Coded to show probable alignments.
jrkirby
jrkirby says that he is both going to siggraph and is busy with work. Appears to mirror JJD's but is even more lurky. Ultimately the fearlessness of his reads while under the gun lands him on the towny side of the spectrum. Yet the spectre of the lurkiness still hangs over the guy. I don't think anything will help for the shot, but he promises to play more.
JarJarDinks
I have no idea why JJD thought getmoript was scum and he seems really slow to read the thread. I think he's a bit unclear with wording and arguments.
cDgCorazon
I made a case for shoot this guy earlier in the day and looking back maybe it is more because of how frustrating it was to read his filter. From questioning the Onegu claim to impulsively claiming RoleCop, Corazon seemed to bumble in all kinds of anti-town ways. Of the purples, I think cDgCorazon is the most likely to be scum. But combine the late entry into the game with self-professed poor town play and willingness of Marv to read this guy as almost braindead has soften my previous read.
The Big Read
The remaining players are my top scum reads. I know there will be some hint of OMGUS as both of these players are heavily targeting me, but I've bided my time long enough for the evidence to develop, and will be presenting it in a separate post.
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The Redville Conspirators
TheAwesomeAll
FirmTofu
austinmcc
The Narrative
The opening strategy of this scum team is to open with some fluffy messages between two of the scum members so there can be some distance between the team. When push comes to shove, the two scum members don't actually press hard into each other. When in doubt, the third safe and towny member will escort the two out of trouble and guide the pressure away.
In the mess of the first day, the safe towny member would seize opportunities against scummy towns. The other two will provide support if possible. Through this process, the scum will also attempt to gain the ear of town leadership and that's how they attempt to influence town agenda.
While seemingly distant and unrelated and always talking to different guys, the scum team is actually coordinated and won't have horrendous cases of miscommunication where they totally misunderstand each other's intent.
FirmTofu - TheAwesomeAll
This Day1 interaction is essentially a bait. They will look scummy, fluffy, and even a bit newbie. However, anyone wading into the mess can be ambushed by austinmcc if vulnerable enough. With the stuff of day 1 lynch basically burying the suspicions of the opening act.
Still, while distanced, the two players are still trying to support each other.
Familiarity
I think this is the first sign of a slip where TAA unveils unwarranted amount of knowledge about FirmTofu.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420356¤tpage=13#254
On July 22 2013 05:30 getmoript wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2013 05:24 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
on me. i dunno what to think of this. people are seriously afraid to call someone scum. Hes neither defending me or accusing me. Id like to ask rayne who he really thinks is scum, and if he really believes tofu isnt just a day1 townie whos afk a ton. Do you know fuck all about Tofu? Like have you played with him whatsoever?
The No-Lynch Rage
FirmTofu has the job of marshalling the votes for the lynch on the scum side. He names jrkirby and then pressures DocH, but conveniently distances TAA from the other two non-voters.
We have the scum team according to FirmTofu:
On July 22 2013 14:59 FirmTofu wrote:
Looks like I found the whole scumteam guys.
It's obviously DrH, TG, and jrkirby.
and again omits TAA from hard scrutiny later
On July 23 2013 08:35 FirmTofu wrote:
The whole bit where people attack Oats for not giving a shit is a waste of time. Whether you attack him or not, he isn't going to start suddenly giving a shit.
Vigi him if you have to. Stop wasting time talking to him.
For the lynch tomorrow, TG is the only viable choice. He's been scummy all game long and needs to be exterminated. His death would also provide us invaluable information about jrk and DrH, maybe even Oats.
As for where discussion should go..., I think we should be talking about people like TAA and JJD, maybe rayn as well. There are people who are currently sitting in the null-scum territory for me and are likely to scumslip when pressured. I'm going to go through their filters and see if I can find some dirt on them.
The Distant Support
While with no scum read on me, we have this gem of a post from TAA:
On July 24 2013 06:20 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Also i disagree with the whole "TG claimed RB so hes not scum" train. I think if you thought he was scum D1 you should still think thats the case, since claiming RB obviously implies youre some kind of blue role (yes even despite VT roleclaims on D1) which is exactly what a desperate scum will do to make it another day.
I think claiming RB is very much a null tell, it shouldnt change your position on TG too much.
If Getmoript had just waited a bit longer on his role-claim, it might not even needed to happen.
TAA Defense
When TAA was in trouble, FirmTofu enters the thread and proceeds to try to throw up as much distraction as possible. It looks like a delaying tactic to not talk about TAA and focus on the blue claims. Including questioning Getmoript's cop claim while never "really defending TAA."
Finally he starts looking at TAA and posts:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420356¤tpage=58#1147
Conveniently left out of his post filtering is the red:
On July 23 2013 20:09 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
rayns post mortem.
Main thing rayne was concerned with day 1 was fighting with firmtofu, calling each other scum.
Austincc thought rayn was town whereas oats was convinced rayn was scum.
Tangeng joined the the rayn is scum train of thought later, but wasnt half as convinced as rayn was.
Speculation: id guess oats is town because it would be really stupid to tunnel some townie and then shoot him
super speculation: oats might be vigi and shot rayne but i dont know where the mafia killpower went then.
Alternatively firmtofu might have been scum who didnt like the pressure. Happy wifom everyone
On July 23 2013 22:07 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
onegu i didnt respond to your case because its a very weak one. The first post you quoted i called firmtofu out for pretending to be very productive(or willing to be very productive) while not doing anything. That isnt a scum tell? in my book it is.
The latter post i tried to show what a facade getmoript was pulling, going full bad cop-good cop on us this game. His fake emotions and empty posts seemed scummy to me, really reminiscent of how iGrok played in a newbie mafia game. Player with a ton of experience making fluffy posts and talking a ton. He has kinda stopped making the flufposts so it mightve been just part of his day1 play. Still thinking about this one though.
On July 24 2013 06:16 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Its funny 5touch is defending TG again. I have a scum read on neither but gotta keep an eye on things like that.
On July 24 2013 06:20 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Also i disagree with the whole "TG claimed RB so hes not scum" train. I think if you thought he was scum D1 you should still think thats the case, since claiming RB obviously implies youre some kind of blue role (yes even despite VT roleclaims on D1) which is exactly what a desperate scum will do to make it another day.
I think claiming RB is very much a null tell, it shouldnt change your position on TG too much.
austinmcc - FirmTofu
austin provided cover on day one, but his influence was more obvious on day 2.
Day 2 TAA defense
austinmcc basically guided FirmTofu out of trouble after his failed defense of TAA.
At the end of the whole affair FirmTofu finishes with:
On July 24 2013 13:53 FirmTofu wrote:
I think you should all hold off on your accusations of me until the flip. I'm done answering these questions. Austin had the only good ones anyway.
crediting Austin.
But Austin never asked a single question. Look at Austin's filter. Austin basically explained everything and even pulled out another example game in support:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420356¤tpage=60#1193
TAA Vote
Both austinmcc and FirmTofu vote at the end of the run when it looks
austinmcc
Day one
Austin day one was offensive against Oatsmaster and me. Defensive for TAA and FirmTofu. Even had a "with that last post by XXXX I don't think he is scum anymore."
Based on the attack, I had austin on a town read on day one. After that austin basically coasted without producing too much venturous new material either night 1 or day 2.
Other stuff
Miscellaneous
Austin Reading
One weird thing is that austin said that I claimed VT during the night in
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=420356¤tpage=64#1276
I definitely claimed VT Day 1. I don't know what to make of this mistake, but since austin was exhorting FiveTouch to read me, I didn't expect him to make this mistake.
Tunneling
Both FirmTofu & austinmcc have tunneled me hard with nothing to dislodge their argument against me. I think this is what getript considers more of scum meta. I'm not too keen on this one. Although it does make sense to follow through on your scummy plans. But tunnelling seems a bit all-in.
Roleblock on Me
What the fuck. What the fuck.
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What are you thinking getmoript? I'd say if it's a good shot, then you take it. I think you we always do a no lynch to have the same effect as not taking a shot.
If you do this strategy, you're still dead tonight.
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ugh
I think we can always do a no lynch to have the same effect as not taking a shot.
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But the Vig shot is under Onegu control. He gets to choose who dies. I think you said before, it's sort of like a lynch, right?
But if you aren't confident about the vig shot, then it's a bad idea. The other downside is that you might give mafia two KP.
The upside to a vig shot is that if you do hit scum, you also have a lynch to work with the next day.
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Err I mean, you might give mafia two KP in a row.
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I'm ok with a delay of one day. It might get Onegu NK'd though. We have to keep the threat of shooting there.
If we want to we can treat the vig as a night lynch. If mafia-hit we can do a psuedo double lynch with the day lynch the following day. If a town kill, we can just no-lynch the following day and it'll just be like a mislynch.
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anyone have comments for my wall? of reads?
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I'm with jrkirby. Just shoot me.... now.
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zzzz we're really not going to do anything 
so now who gonna die?
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you still died getmoript!!!!!
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EPT
