EPTOn June 14 2013 13:34 goodkarma wrote:
I'm still leaning town on GM. There are far better candidates to shoot tonight.
The "he's emotional as scum" casepoint from BH was super-weak since I suspect he'd behave the same way regardless of alignment. He hasn't had the ironclad certainty I would expect from a scum GM. That being said, he needs to tell us who he'd prefer to have shot and not martyr himself. While in general martyring is a very scummy thing, I see the martyring coming from GM as also being townie. I remember how he played his scumgame, and I very highly doubt he'd make a play like that as scum. It makes him look atrocious, and scum GM would be a little more careful than that.
I'm looking at what happened and it blows my mind how little consolidation there was. I believe scum are among those who failed to consolidate: Syl, Shao, Stutters, and Oats.
Regarding Syl:
Syl has done nothing but sheep all game long. He clearly isn't interested in reading the thread. Somehow he still believes that when I proposed we vigi him it was a "lurker shot," when in fact it's that he has failed to make any real stance of his own all game. The closest he came was with Axle, who after a lack of interest, he opted not to pursue further. He felt strongly enough about it to vote for him, yet couldn't be bothered to push his case when it didn't immediately gain traction... This is a guy that's been skirting by on thread sentiment and shown almost no interest in solving the game. It also stood out to me how he would say he thinks BH is town, yet do nothing to stop him getting lynched. That is clearly scum-motivated behavior. He was in-thread near the deadline, so he could have easily voted GM if he indeed strongly felt that BH was town. He has in the past stated he'd rather have GM than BH lynched, so why wouldn't he try to do anything to stop his townread from dying? BH is known to have the ability to lead as town, which is something we sorely need... There was every reason for scum to want town BH to die over GM.
Regarding Shao:
Shao has shown what I perceived to be an active interest in the game. However, his latest vote makes literally no sense to me from a town perspective. Why on earth would you vote Syl, someone who's clearly not going to get lynched, last minute like that? I don't understand the town motivation for that. We really needed to lynch scum this cycle, and instead of consolidating, Shao votes Syl. It just doesn't make sense to me from a town perspective.
Regarding Stutters:
Stutters did little to take a stance on who he'd vote the entire day cycle. All I can find is he's "waiting for BH to get back" before placing his vote. This is hands-down the safest thing you could do as scum. Sit back and wait to see where thread sentiment goes before jumping on a candidate. That being said, I felt his read on Vayne was reasonable from a town perspective, as was his discussion of why he was so eager to vig me. That he literally didn't do anything at all for many hours and missed the deadline indicates to me he might have been legitimately busy, since town Stutters does shit like this. But he's now on my list of scum candidates, by process of elimination. There is definitely possible scum motive behind his actions.
Regarding Oats:
And then there's Oats. His play has my head spinning. He's non-stop wanted me lynched, defends BH with little justification, and now is asking that we choose between shooting me and GM. His only justification for GM is that he's bad, which hardly shows how he believes he's scum... He's spent half the game now spamming thread to lynch or shoot me while hardly discussing at all any other candidates. I'm having trouble visualizing how even as a world-class bad townie he could be playing like this. I may have WIFOM'ed myself in a corner believing that he's town as he's never been this brazen as scum. But when you fail to try to save the guy who you clearly have this townread on by consolidating, I just can't understand how any kind of townie would do that.
Looking at who was actually on the BH/GM wagons at the end of the day, I find that they all are in my town column. What I'm left with are those who've refused to consolidate. The scumteam is among:
Syl, Shao, Stutters, Oats
With the strength of my scumreads in that order.
We should be vigi'ing Syl today, and not GM.
I'm still leaning town on GM. There are far better candidates to shoot tonight.
The "he's emotional as scum" casepoint from BH was super-weak since I suspect he'd behave the same way regardless of alignment. He hasn't had the ironclad certainty I would expect from a scum GM. That being said, he needs to tell us who he'd prefer to have shot and not martyr himself. While in general martyring is a very scummy thing, I see the martyring coming from GM as also being townie. I remember how he played his scumgame, and I very highly doubt he'd make a play like that as scum. It makes him look atrocious, and scum GM would be a little more careful than that.
I'm looking at what happened and it blows my mind how little consolidation there was. I believe scum are among those who failed to consolidate: Syl, Shao, Stutters, and Oats.
Regarding Syl:
Syl has done nothing but sheep all game long. He clearly isn't interested in reading the thread. Somehow he still believes that when I proposed we vigi him it was a "lurker shot," when in fact it's that he has failed to make any real stance of his own all game. The closest he came was with Axle, who after a lack of interest, he opted not to pursue further. He felt strongly enough about it to vote for him, yet couldn't be bothered to push his case when it didn't immediately gain traction... This is a guy that's been skirting by on thread sentiment and shown almost no interest in solving the game. It also stood out to me how he would say he thinks BH is town, yet do nothing to stop him getting lynched. That is clearly scum-motivated behavior. He was in-thread near the deadline, so he could have easily voted GM if he indeed strongly felt that BH was town. He has in the past stated he'd rather have GM than BH lynched, so why wouldn't he try to do anything to stop his townread from dying? BH is known to have the ability to lead as town, which is something we sorely need... There was every reason for scum to want town BH to die over GM.
Regarding Shao:
Shao has shown what I perceived to be an active interest in the game. However, his latest vote makes literally no sense to me from a town perspective. Why on earth would you vote Syl, someone who's clearly not going to get lynched, last minute like that? I don't understand the town motivation for that. We really needed to lynch scum this cycle, and instead of consolidating, Shao votes Syl. It just doesn't make sense to me from a town perspective.
Regarding Stutters:
Stutters did little to take a stance on who he'd vote the entire day cycle. All I can find is he's "waiting for BH to get back" before placing his vote. This is hands-down the safest thing you could do as scum. Sit back and wait to see where thread sentiment goes before jumping on a candidate. That being said, I felt his read on Vayne was reasonable from a town perspective, as was his discussion of why he was so eager to vig me. That he literally didn't do anything at all for many hours and missed the deadline indicates to me he might have been legitimately busy, since town Stutters does shit like this. But he's now on my list of scum candidates, by process of elimination. There is definitely possible scum motive behind his actions.
Regarding Oats:
And then there's Oats. His play has my head spinning. He's non-stop wanted me lynched, defends BH with little justification, and now is asking that we choose between shooting me and GM. His only justification for GM is that he's bad, which hardly shows how he believes he's scum... He's spent half the game now spamming thread to lynch or shoot me while hardly discussing at all any other candidates. I'm having trouble visualizing how even as a world-class bad townie he could be playing like this. I may have WIFOM'ed myself in a corner believing that he's town as he's never been this brazen as scum. But when you fail to try to save the guy who you clearly have this townread on by consolidating, I just can't understand how any kind of townie would do that.
Looking at who was actually on the BH/GM wagons at the end of the day, I find that they all are in my town column. What I'm left with are those who've refused to consolidate. The scumteam is among:
Syl, Shao, Stutters, Oats
With the strength of my scumreads in that order.
We should be vigi'ing Syl today, and not GM.
My last minute votewagon went pretty bad, I admit that. My situation was I had like I don't know 45mins or sth prior to deadline. I wanted to let BH live but I did not want to lynch gravity as syl was my scumread. I had hoped for more people to be active, so I kept refreshing while I was writing my case on syl, in the end of course I did not make it in time. BUt the lack of activity did not help anyway as I could have probably just stated my intent in one liners with the persons to get them to think about syl as alternative.
I don't understand how you cannot see a town perspective though. It's quite obvious that I was unsatisfied with both leading wagons, so I started a third, bit late (lol) but yeah
