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On June 22 2013 22:22 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 22:02 Xatalos wrote:On June 22 2013 21:32 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 21:13 Xatalos wrote:On June 22 2013 12:05 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 11:29 kitaman27 wrote:On June 22 2013 11:18 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 11:06 kitaman27 wrote:On June 22 2013 11:04 Acrofales wrote:
I'm home! Haven't read anything yet, but after umpteen scumgames and a fairly longish break, I finally rolled town!
Also, in case this plan hasn't been proposed yet, I think everybody should say what character they made the role for. That way, if someone claims, someone else can back that shit up, or act as a lie detector. Or the scum can pick off the players that created their roles and they are free to use it as they wish or modify it with a fake claim. That's silly. So what? That limits them in who they can kill. Restricting scum is a good thing. You scum yourself? lol it doesn't limit who the scum can kill. Scum can kill whoever they want, but with your plan, they're not shooting blind. I don't even understand how your plan makes sense. Why can't we server as lie detectors after the claim, without all sharing who we made the role for? They're still shooting blind. They don't know what role they're shooting nor what the role actually is other than the name (and they still don't know who that is). But I do get your point that if claims happen we can verify. Just run the risk of this only happening after people are dead and the mafia covering for each other (if someone claims and nobody pipes up that they made the role, a mafia member can "come into the thread late" and claim making the role) Hmm. This plan has far more negatives than positives IMO. Mafia are basically in the dark only about one thing: blue powers. If they know who created which role, it becomes easier to snipe players if the need appears to fakeclaim (just snipe the player who created a specific role). On the other hand, it becomes impossible for them to act until a certain player has been eliminated. This might be useful in the early game, but come late game, every has-to-be-eliminated player should already be eliminated. This just makes it easier for them to plan their shots. In addition, isn't it more advantegeous to keep Mafia completely in the dark? "Fear of the unknown is the greatest fear." That should apply to Mafia as well. Btw, is that Lovetap thing just a joke or an actual power? This doesn't give them any more info, except about who created their power. So yes, if the need arises to fake claim, they will have to shoot that person first. However, it also does the following: 1. If all of mafia have roles that were created by townies, they cannot fake claim their role name (or stuff won't add up at the end of the game) 2. They cannot fake claim their actual role before whoever created their role is dead. An alternative is to claim your actual rolename right now. Fear of the unknown isn't mafia's greatest fear. It's fear of getting caught out as mafia. This helps with that. Also, who knows about the lovetap thing? It could be an actual power, inspired by ##fistbumb from the original PTP, or it could just be sk8r having read the original game and using that to derp around. Point 2 is actually... Partly a negative point. Maybe even mostly. Yes, they can't fakeclaim until they have shot the role creator, but in your plan, it only takes one shot to get 100% access to fakeclaiming that role. If nobody reveals, it's almost impossible for any Mafia to fakeclaim until end/lategame without incredible luck. And point 1 is really a no-point considering that fakeclaiming the name is incredibly easy once the role creator has been shot. Gotta check out ##fistbump now.. It's not a negative point at all. If you think this game will not, at one point, end up in a mass claim situation you clearly haven't played mass themed games before. What this extra information, before claims go flying gives us: 1. It forces mafia to be honest as long (although simply leaving them out of the know would do that too) 2. If someone dies, we know what role is open to a potential fakeclaim 3. If someone flips mafia, then we know the role he made is open to a potential fakeclaim by his mafia buddy. Points 2 and 3 are not available to us without the claim.
Points 2 and 3 are true, but IMO just not as valuable as making fakeclaiming more risky for Mafia. With reveals, everyone knows which role names are open for fakeclaiming. This helps Mafia significantly more than town. Everyone knows that a certain name is open for fakeclaiming, but it's only a *possibility* for fakeclaiming - there's no way to know if the claim is real or fake. Without reveals, Mafia can never know 100% if it's "safe" to fakeclaim a certain role name. There's always a more than 0% chance of being busted if a cornered Mafia needs to fakeclaim. And now if you're shot, for example, Mafia already have one solid role name to use for fakeclaiming with 0% chance of being caught. Of course it would look suspicious soon after your death, but the situation is vastly different at LYLO.
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On June 22 2013 23:20 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 22:22 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 22:02 Xatalos wrote:On June 22 2013 21:32 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 21:13 Xatalos wrote:On June 22 2013 12:05 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 11:29 kitaman27 wrote:On June 22 2013 11:18 Acrofales wrote:On June 22 2013 11:06 kitaman27 wrote:On June 22 2013 11:04 Acrofales wrote:
I'm home! Haven't read anything yet, but after umpteen scumgames and a fairly longish break, I finally rolled town!
Also, in case this plan hasn't been proposed yet, I think everybody should say what character they made the role for. That way, if someone claims, someone else can back that shit up, or act as a lie detector. Or the scum can pick off the players that created their roles and they are free to use it as they wish or modify it with a fake claim. That's silly. So what? That limits them in who they can kill. Restricting scum is a good thing. You scum yourself? lol it doesn't limit who the scum can kill. Scum can kill whoever they want, but with your plan, they're not shooting blind. I don't even understand how your plan makes sense. Why can't we server as lie detectors after the claim, without all sharing who we made the role for? They're still shooting blind. They don't know what role they're shooting nor what the role actually is other than the name (and they still don't know who that is). But I do get your point that if claims happen we can verify. Just run the risk of this only happening after people are dead and the mafia covering for each other (if someone claims and nobody pipes up that they made the role, a mafia member can "come into the thread late" and claim making the role) Hmm. This plan has far more negatives than positives IMO. Mafia are basically in the dark only about one thing: blue powers. If they know who created which role, it becomes easier to snipe players if the need appears to fakeclaim (just snipe the player who created a specific role). On the other hand, it becomes impossible for them to act until a certain player has been eliminated. This might be useful in the early game, but come late game, every has-to-be-eliminated player should already be eliminated. This just makes it easier for them to plan their shots. In addition, isn't it more advantegeous to keep Mafia completely in the dark? "Fear of the unknown is the greatest fear." That should apply to Mafia as well. Btw, is that Lovetap thing just a joke or an actual power? This doesn't give them any more info, except about who created their power. So yes, if the need arises to fake claim, they will have to shoot that person first. However, it also does the following: 1. If all of mafia have roles that were created by townies, they cannot fake claim their role name (or stuff won't add up at the end of the game) 2. They cannot fake claim their actual role before whoever created their role is dead. An alternative is to claim your actual rolename right now. Fear of the unknown isn't mafia's greatest fear. It's fear of getting caught out as mafia. This helps with that. Also, who knows about the lovetap thing? It could be an actual power, inspired by ##fistbumb from the original PTP, or it could just be sk8r having read the original game and using that to derp around. Point 2 is actually... Partly a negative point. Maybe even mostly. Yes, they can't fakeclaim until they have shot the role creator, but in your plan, it only takes one shot to get 100% access to fakeclaiming that role. If nobody reveals, it's almost impossible for any Mafia to fakeclaim until end/lategame without incredible luck. And point 1 is really a no-point considering that fakeclaiming the name is incredibly easy once the role creator has been shot. Gotta check out ##fistbump now.. It's not a negative point at all. If you think this game will not, at one point, end up in a mass claim situation you clearly haven't played mass themed games before. What this extra information, before claims go flying gives us: 1. It forces mafia to be honest as long (although simply leaving them out of the know would do that too) 2. If someone dies, we know what role is open to a potential fakeclaim 3. If someone flips mafia, then we know the role he made is open to a potential fakeclaim by his mafia buddy. Points 2 and 3 are not available to us without the claim. Points 2 and 3 are true, but IMO just not as valuable as making fakeclaiming more risky for Mafia. With reveals, everyone knows which role names are open for fakeclaiming. This helps Mafia significantly more than town. Everyone knows that a certain name is open for fakeclaiming, but it's only a *possibility* for fakeclaiming - there's no way to know if the claim is real or fake. Without reveals, Mafia can never know 100% if it's "safe" to fakeclaim a certain role name. There's always a more than 0% chance of being busted if a cornered Mafia needs to fakeclaim. And now if you're shot, for example, Mafia already have one solid role name to use for fakeclaiming with 0% chance of being caught. Of course it would look suspicious soon after your death, but the situation is vastly different at LYLO.
No. They can't claim Doctor, unless they are in fact Doctor. Otherwise someone just counterclaims the name. Of course, if mafia got Doctor (which, btw, I seriously doubt), they are free to claim whatever the hell they want if they kill me.
Anyway, back to the game: austin, you have anything to say about anybody who isn't zephir? What do you think of Kurumi's entry into the thread?
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In any case, this isn't the most urgent topic to discuss. And it's kind of a mess if/when some people reveal and some don't (more likely than everyone agreeing!).
Acrofales, you mentioned (FOSed?) Kurumi for lamenting the thread. And me for "going in the other direction" (not lamenting it?). What about WaveofShadow? Way more scummy than Kurumi in my eyes. He lamented the thread AND forcefully added a "tryhard" attitude to himself without really backing it up...
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On June 22 2013 11:54 Crossfire99 wrote:
##Pants: WaveofShadow
I'm going to bed now. I'm gone all day tomorrow and doubt that I will be able to post. I should be around Sunday, though.
Ugh. This is basically Crossfire99's whole contribution so far (not including his earlier one-liner). And it seems like it'll remain that way for the rest of D1. Not sure if such blatant lurking can even be called scummy, but it's at least definitely anti-town..
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On June 22 2013 23:43 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 11:54 Crossfire99 wrote:
##Pants: WaveofShadow
I'm going to bed now. I'm gone all day tomorrow and doubt that I will be able to post. I should be around Sunday, though. Ugh. This is basically Crossfire99's whole contribution so far (not including his earlier one-liner). And it seems like it'll remain that way for the rest of D1. Not sure if such blatant lurking can even be called scummy, but it's at least definitely anti-town..
He promised contribution on Sunday. It is now Saturday. Also, if Xfire is still as hilariously bad at scum as the last time I played with him, it'll be pretty easy.
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And, if you look at my filter. I am clearly not happy with the way WoS is playing. I even said so in my post about you...
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On June 22 2013 23:48 Acrofales wrote:
And, if you look at my filter. I am clearly not happy with the way WoS is playing. I even said so in my post about you...
Oh, ok. "I had a similar feeling about WOS." I misread that to mean that you had a similar feeling about WOS in some previous game compared to me in this game.
But, surely you have preferences (between Kurumi/WOS/me I guess)? That vote on strongandbig is just meaningless in every sense.
And.. It feels like the thread has been pretty inactive today (even with 16 players total). Some town reads have been possible to make so far, but no strong scumreads. I'd rather lynch WaveofShadow than a hard lurker atm, but consider that there are lots of blue roles, everyone. If you just lurk, you make a big target for power usage (just a friendly reminder  ).
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About half of the players have yet to do something, anything, today (in the next 24 hours left). No need to waste a lynch on a blatant lurker this time around, but no need to spare blue powers either  Every player should keep that in mind while lurking (or spamming or doing something else unhelpful).
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On June 22 2013 23:48 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 23:43 Xatalos wrote:On June 22 2013 11:54 Crossfire99 wrote:
##Pants: WaveofShadow
I'm going to bed now. I'm gone all day tomorrow and doubt that I will be able to post. I should be around Sunday, though. Ugh. This is basically Crossfire99's whole contribution so far (not including his earlier one-liner). And it seems like it'll remain that way for the rest of D1. Not sure if such blatant lurking can even be called scummy, but it's at least definitely anti-town.. He promised contribution on Sunday. It is now Saturday. Also, if Xfire is still as hilariously bad at scum as the last time I played with him, it'll be pretty easy.
Hmm. I really hate "promises" like that. "Hey, I'll just lurk my way through D1 and bandwagon someone at the end of the day! Thanks for your understanding." We'll see, I guess..
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On June 22 2013 21:23 Acrofales wrote:
In general, I am pretty suspicious of those who have come into the thread and lamented the pitiful state it is in (Kurumi), yet have shown absolutely NO inclination to improve it in any way, shape or form.
Yadda yadda
What could I do couple of hours into the game? Voted the most malicious player, remarked on bad atmosphere and moved on.
I am not going to post stuff that makes no sense just to look like I do stuff, I do stuff because I do stuff, not because I want to look like I do stuff.
Why did you claim who you made role for? You know that we are likely to have Assassin-type role, right?
On June 22 2013 20:34 strongandbig wrote:
Sk8rboi having his vote on bc is pretty weird ATM. If he's really read up on tlmafia like he says then he must have some idea what he's doing.
I think he's trying to behave like "I not scared noob I vote big shot vet hurr hurr" and get people to have town reads on him. I don't like that. Fos on sk8rboi.
Easiest explanation is: he is playing around or has a role revolving around voting people. Keep that somewhere when we have more evidence pointing at sk8r (if any).
For some reason geript taunts me with his posts so I am not going to quote him ever, sorry guys.
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Acro you voted me but what do you think of my first post? Y u vote me btw.
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On June 23 2013 01:05 strongandbig wrote:
Acro you voted me but what do you think of my first post? Y u vote me btw.
Voted for you because you're tricksy scum. You used to be easy to catch, but you've upped your game. Your first post picked on a pretty easy target and gave a rather dubious reason for calling him scum (or at least FoS'ing him).
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On June 22 2013 19:37 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 14:56 Kurumi wrote:
For a moment I thought I was still drunk after yesterday but this thread actually makes no sense.
No trolling for me I guess.
We're running the classic lynch, so the most votes person dies? Normal voting rules yeah
Is "normal voting rules strict majority? Or is it plurality?
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On June 22 2013 20:34 strongandbig wrote:
Sk8rboi having his vote on bc is pretty weird ATM. If he's really read up on tlmafia like he says then he must have some idea what he's doing.
I think he's trying to behave like "I not scared noob I vote big shot vet hurr hurr" and get people to have town reads on him. I don't like that. Fos on sk8rboi.
I never said I was a noob. I just don't have the meta advantage that the vets of this forum have. Or disadvantage, I read players based on their posts because I don't have that extra knowledge. So I can't be misled by meta.
Voting bc was just to see reactions.
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On June 23 2013 01:21 xxSK8rGUy277xx wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 20:34 strongandbig wrote:
Sk8rboi having his vote on bc is pretty weird ATM. If he's really read up on tlmafia like he says then he must have some idea what he's doing.
I think he's trying to behave like "I not scared noob I vote big shot vet hurr hurr" and get people to have town reads on him. I don't like that. Fos on sk8rboi. I never said I was a noob. I just don't have the meta advantage that the vets of this forum have. Or disadvantage, I read players based on their posts because I don't have that extra knowledge. So I can't be misled by meta. Voting bc was just to see reactions.
Anything you learned and feel like sharing?
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Oh apparently there's a voting threadlol.
Catching up.
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On June 23 2013 01:27 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 01:21 xxSK8rGUy277xx wrote:On June 22 2013 20:34 strongandbig wrote:
Sk8rboi having his vote on bc is pretty weird ATM. If he's really read up on tlmafia like he says then he must have some idea what he's doing.
I think he's trying to behave like "I not scared noob I vote big shot vet hurr hurr" and get people to have town reads on him. I don't like that. Fos on sk8rboi. I never said I was a noob. I just don't have the meta advantage that the vets of this forum have. Or disadvantage, I read players based on their posts because I don't have that extra knowledge. So I can't be misled by meta. Voting bc was just to see reactions. Anything you learned and feel like sharing?
Not any real evidence. Just some suspicions which I will keep to myself for now. Don't want to cause a mislynch because of a poor read. I want to keep my rating of 0% town lynches as town.
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On June 23 2013 01:16 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2013 01:05 strongandbig wrote:
Acro you voted me but what do you think of my first post? Y u vote me btw. Voted for you because you're tricksy scum. You used to be easy to catch, but you've upped your game. Your first post picked on a pretty easy target and gave a rather dubious reason for calling him scum (or at least FoS'ing him).
Hm. Didn't think you were serious with your vote (considering all the other FOS mentions and just "prolly scum" on strongandbig before voting).. No doubt I want to see more from him though.
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On June 23 2013 01:21 xxSK8rGUy277xx wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 20:34 strongandbig wrote:
Sk8rboi having his vote on bc is pretty weird ATM. If he's really read up on tlmafia like he says then he must have some idea what he's doing.
I think he's trying to behave like "I not scared noob I vote big shot vet hurr hurr" and get people to have town reads on him. I don't like that. Fos on sk8rboi. I never said I was a noob. I just don't have the meta advantage that the vets of this forum have. Or disadvantage, I read players based on their posts because I don't have that extra knowledge. So I can't be misled by meta. Voting bc was just to see reactions.
Yeah I don't feel any less justified in my prior interpretation.
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StrongandBig, WaveofShadow, and BC are the scums 100%. Sk8 for MVP.
Thank you, good night.
Also about my role, the player who wrote it wanted to gain an advantage on player roles. Everyone suspects something, but only he and I know what it does and now he knows the role he received and mine. Possibly more if he is scum.
I thought about not doing it, but then he still wins if he is scum by knowing i'm out there not using my abilities.
Meta-scum >
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EPT
