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On May 20 2013 07:17 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2013 07:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
What i am trying to say is this:
Try to look at this from his perspective. If he is scum, he clearly panicked and claimed his role because he thought he was gonna get lynched (as otherwise there is no reason to claim). He knows he needs to mason you on N1. That is a big big nono if you are town (which BH would know if he is scum and you town) as you might be able to catch not one, but more scum on that phase.
Why the fuck would BH claim mason if he is mafia and you are town? You say people do not call him a good scum player, even more reasons to not get in a one phase debate with you dontcha think? You're attributing a level of foresight and thought to someone who panic-claimed. see the issue? If you're panicking and roleclaiming when it absolutely isn't even necessary, it's highly unlikely you're thinking "if i do this, i'll have to mason marv night 1 and talk to him there and it'll be really difficult". Because if he was capable of making that logical train of thought in that moment he wouldn't have been claiming at all (as either alignment!)
And we come back to my original argument:
1) BH is town and you are town - makes sense, townies do dumb stuff/posts/claims more likely than mafia
2) BH is town and you are mafia - makes sense as above
3) BH is mafia and you are mafia - brilliant scum play, and btw, you need to post the mason logs before N1 ends
4) BH is mafia and you are town - mafia has time to think about their actions. claiming is an action that is well-thought out, at least if you are not a complete newb. Who is to say BH (if mafia) did not think about what he is doing before doing so? I see this #4 scenario is impossible, because he is hurting his team with his action.
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United Kingdom36160 Posts
On May 20 2013 07:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2013 07:17 marvellosity wrote:On May 20 2013 07:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
What i am trying to say is this:
Try to look at this from his perspective. If he is scum, he clearly panicked and claimed his role because he thought he was gonna get lynched (as otherwise there is no reason to claim). He knows he needs to mason you on N1. That is a big big nono if you are town (which BH would know if he is scum and you town) as you might be able to catch not one, but more scum on that phase.
Why the fuck would BH claim mason if he is mafia and you are town? You say people do not call him a good scum player, even more reasons to not get in a one phase debate with you dontcha think? You're attributing a level of foresight and thought to someone who panic-claimed. see the issue? If you're panicking and roleclaiming when it absolutely isn't even necessary, it's highly unlikely you're thinking "if i do this, i'll have to mason marv night 1 and talk to him there and it'll be really difficult". Because if he was capable of making that logical train of thought in that moment he wouldn't have been claiming at all (as either alignment!) And we come back to my original argument: 1) BH is town and you are town - makes sense, townies do dumb stuff/posts/claims more likely than mafia 2) BH is town and you are mafia - makes sense as above 3) BH is mafia and you are mafia - brilliant scum play, and btw, you need to post the mason logs before N1 ends 4) BH is mafia and you are town - mafia has time to think about their actions. claiming is an action that is well-thought out, at least if you are not a complete newb. Who is to say BH (if mafia) did not think about what he is doing before doing so? I see this #4 scenario is impossible, because he is hurting his team with his action.
this is where it's breaking down. with the greatest of respect to BH, who I don't actually think is a particularly terrible scumplayer, I also absolutely think he's capable of panicking as mafia and doing what he did, and you don't, and that's what it boils down to.
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the good news from this tete a tete is that it makes you look townie, as you're arguing it very genuinely.
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On May 20 2013 07:26 marvellosity wrote:
the good news from this tete a tete is that it makes you look townie, as you're arguing it very genuinely.
Don't worry, i'm probably gonna get killed if you are not.
But after all, i do not think BH would claim when he did if he was mafia and you were town.
Do you still think iamp is town?
Do you still think GK is town?
Dandel?
Those guys are really scummy for me.
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EBWOP:
But after all, i do not think BH would claim when he did if he was mafia and you were town.
..because he would at least have discussed with his team how to handle the situation if it seemed like a situation where there is no outs other than a claim.
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Very likely that iamp is town. He's my strongest townread.
GK and Dandel I'll work more on this nightphase.
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On May 20 2013 07:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:EBWOP: Show nested quote +But after all, i do not think BH would claim when he did if he was mafia and you were town. ..because he would at least have discussed with his team how to handle the situation if it seemed like a situation where there is no outs other than a claim.
not if he was panicking. see how circular this is? 
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On May 20 2013 07:32 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2013 07:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:EBWOP: But after all, i do not think BH would claim when he did if he was mafia and you were town. ..because he would at least have discussed with his team how to handle the situation if it seemed like a situation where there is no outs other than a claim. not if he was panicking. see how circular this is?
I understand what you mean. :D
I don't understand though how anyone would panic before discussing the matter in scumchat as scum if there is still ~24h left in the day and other viable candidates.
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Discussing the matter in scumchat would imply a lack of panic
:OOOOOO
Anyway, people I'm reasonably confident are town at this stage are me, iamp, DP, yamato, and probably you.
Secondary townreads are Vayne, Spicy, grush, maybe Wave?
Realistically anyone not in the initial few names are fair game, and the alive ones I've not mentioned are even more fair game.
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Actually no, i don't think you can both be mafia.
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i agree with your list, i would change iamp to BH.
DP i'd downgrade to secondary. he had a strong early game but now he is being less and less helpful.
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Dandel if you thought that sputnik should be vig shot and not lynched then why vote at the last second for the lynch?
On May 19 2013 21:00 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2013 05:45 marvellosity wrote:
The weirdest thing about Dandel that I noticed is when he gave a bunch of names he could lynch, sputnik wasn't one of them, when it seemed he would fit on the list he made. Becaue 1) I find him mildly amusing 2) he's hyper-lurking which should be dealt with by vigshootings/host KP
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On May 20 2013 07:50 Spicydinosaur wrote:Dandel if you thought that sputnik should be vig shot and not lynched then why vote at the last second for the lynch? Show nested quote +On May 19 2013 21:00 Dandel Ion wrote:On May 19 2013 05:45 marvellosity wrote:
The weirdest thing about Dandel that I noticed is when he gave a bunch of names he could lynch, sputnik wasn't one of them, when it seemed he would fit on the list he made. Becaue 1) I find him mildly amusing 2) he's hyper-lurking which should be dealt with by vigshootings/host KP
Do you think GK is scum?
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On May 20 2013 07:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2013 07:50 Spicydinosaur wrote:Dandel if you thought that sputnik should be vig shot and not lynched then why vote at the last second for the lynch? On May 19 2013 21:00 Dandel Ion wrote:On May 19 2013 05:45 marvellosity wrote:
The weirdest thing about Dandel that I noticed is when he gave a bunch of names he could lynch, sputnik wasn't one of them, when it seemed he would fit on the list he made. Becaue 1) I find him mildly amusing 2) he's hyper-lurking which should be dealt with by vigshootings/host KP Do you think GK is scum?
yeah i do. I think he's overemphasizing meta way too much and holds double standards. Take me and WoS for example.
On May 19 2013 02:15 goodkarma wrote:
WaveofShadow, on the other hand, is a different matter. From what I remember of his play in The Game, he played pretty horribly. As town he was wishy washy about his stances on most players, and when he was nearly lynched the only thing that really saved him was that he blueclaimed. Here, he seems to be a lot more sure of himself in places, but in a way that doesn't really make sense to me from a town perspective. Sputnik, who basically made one scummy post and lurked, is "sure scum" to him. And Grush is "sure town" for saying starsenses. This has already been discussed, but the contrast from his townplay is what stands out to me. Further, he seems to really like asking people for scumreads. His questions don't seem to really have any purpose other than to make him look more active. Look at his filter and see how many times he asks a variation of "Who you think is scum?" It's a pretty pointless thing to ask, given everyone here is going to be giving their scumreads anyways.
##Unvote
##Vote: WaveofShadow
Here he says that WoS is scum because he's more sure of himself now, than when he was when he was town, hence he's scum. If WoS was more wishy washy like he was in previous games, gf would be ok with that according to his own logic.
On May 19 2013 20:18 goodkarma wrote:
Spicydinosaur: What stands out most to me about spicy is that he has had a bit to say but he's had literally ZERO scumreads most of the game. He's pretty wishy-washy in general. One post that demonstrated this well he literally started (in discussing Solstice) by saying “I think this guy is very scummy.” And ends the post saying “I don’t think he’s scum.” Further, in his vote post he somehow manages to mix up the name of who he’s voting for. For sure this could be an honest mistake, but it definitely doesn’t demonstrate he’s very invested in the game. When you think someone’s scum, it’s generally burning in your mind as you’re writing up your post. That he could just mix things up, say “oops sorry” to the thread, and then get away with it is disturbing to me. This is the kind of guy you shouldn't let fly under the radar. In the newbie game that just finished that I observed, he had opinions on other players he thought were scummy. That just isn’t the case here. He’s like “this guy looks kinda bad,” or “this guy is a shitty townie,” but when it comes to who’s actually scum he kinda doesn’t have much to say until his botched up vote post.
Here he says im scum for basically the same reason as WoS, in that I'm not acting like i did in my previous game where I had better reads earlier on.
If this is where his analysis ends that would be at least consistent. He goes on later to state that being wishy washy is a complete scum trait. He's not consistent with his reasonings. Also he claims that in the newbie game i had suspects and evolving opinions. My reading on WoS can easily be considered an evolving opinion. One of my posts about WoS started off claiming he was scum but then explained he got better. How is that not an evolving opinion. If i called WoS scum first, and then in a second post said eh nvm, how would that be different.
On May 19 2013 20:38 goodkarma wrote:
As for spicy, he only discussed Solstice when you prodded him to. I disagree that he had that response worked on / mostly onhand as you seem to have speculated. I think he just made it up on the spot. And that his reponse was the wishy-washy kind you'd see from scum. I'd encourage you to look at this game, and then look at his last newbie game. He has opinions this game for sure, but his scumhunting has been pretty nonexistent. In said newbie game, he had suspects and keeped evolving opinions.
These thoughts and the ones i've had on him previously make me believe he's scum.
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Why the fuck was anyone voting for spicy before his WoS/Jarjar stuff?
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On May 20 2013 08:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Why the fuck was anyone voting for spicy before his WoS/Jarjar stuff?
Actually nobody was, but the lynch is 100% scum driven. rofl. and for what reasons.
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I'm trying to catch up on what I missed. Really curious how the vote switched off of JK although it makes sense it would wind up on sputnik at the end.
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Ebwop GK, not JK, damn Swype
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because noone was here telling what to do other than me. where were you?
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stutters what do you think of dandel
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EPT
