EPT- In the big read post sylencia shows something I would call self-centeredness, and not working towards achieving established goals.
Take for example my trolling. Sylencia talks lengthy about the justification for disappreciating it, mentions an example from an earlier game, but he says I'm a wildcard. From my point of view, this is absolutely not true. While I formulated my posts in weird manner, my intentions and opinions always shined through them, and most agree on this.
Then he mentions "flaws" in risk's play, but he does not attribute any interpretation to them. He only describes them, with no conclusion, moving into "but I feel that the votes are early"-defense, and saying he disappreciated CC's vote the most. That is no conclusion or comment on risk's play, that is only a description of people's reactions to risk.
My battery is running out so I will summarize the rest of the post like this:
It's summarizing, shows no clear direction. Not the engagement of a townie in pursuing his reads, but a huge "look, I'm making reads post, leave me alone. His vote on CC feels like a policy vote on a guy who pressure voted risk. - When I call him out for not commenting on risk's play or alignment, he says this:Ghor, since it's looking more trollish by the second, you could probably drop the third person at least or I'm not really going to be able to read your posts seriously enough. I don't even follow what you mean regarding what I said about risk + CC. As for why I haven't said if I thought risk's actions were scummy or not, that's because it's not exactly clear which way it goes. On one hand, you can say it's scummy because he says it was just looking for reactions but it looks more like no one followed what he was alluding to so he gave it up, but on the other hand it's hard to say he'd give it up so quickly and deny it as soon as he is questioned about it if he was scum because it's a lot more legit if you follow through with the case. Instead, he retracted it and it left him looking weak but that doesn't mean he's town. Happy?
Start with telling me how to write (but he seems to understand it pretty well). He first says an argument for risk being scummy, then mentions the same argument risk used, but ends up saying, that doesn't mean he's town. Well, why mention it then if it's the argument that's meant to say that he's not scum, to head over and say it doesn't mean it's town? - Next he says this:And at this point, no, he's played enough games where I don't see him making himself look suspicious 3 hours into the game. The case on him has its merits however I would rather first see more from the two I've heard least from today (Hopeless and CC) - moreso Hopeless because there's ever so slightly more from CC.
Ghor - now that I've said it what are your thoughts on risk then? Would you say he is scum or not? Would you end up backing a vote on him if the time came for it?
The defense "scum do not look suspicious, so risk is not scum". Then he asks me what I think of risk (along with hopeless) and I point out my earlier posts where I already said it. - When his scumreads hopeless and CC were around, sylencia wasn't there to milk information from them. He did attack me though.
- Sylencia was basically first to say that it's scummy to push for him with risk as scumread, when I also laid that out in the post where I talk about risk.
- Next point is: Except for his big, diluted read post, sylencia hardly writes about his reads on his own, but replies to a lot of people. He doesn't try to push the thread into a direction or let himself be heard. His posts are all: "I do this cause that and I stand here cause that, I would lynch this guy and this guy.
He says I'm scum, but never made a case,only complained about me trolling.
He says he would lynch CC, but never interacted with CC or made his change of read public before retreating from his lynch.
He says he would lynch hopeless, but didn't interact with him or push for his lynch. - High tendency to justify himself, summarizing posts, reactive, not active play. No spontaneous lashing out at and questioning of his scumreads.
Noir Mini Mafia: Chapter 1 - Page 3
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
 .I'm still not sure what to make of the risk vs hopeless situation, and I'll be busy very soon until tomorrow. I would like to advise to go through a few things (will do that myself once I have time, but I think it's where we have to look at). Still, quick rundown: Check everybody's scumreads before the lynch, especially for weak pushes or even absence (considered RoL's absence to be scummy, but he gave an excuse and promised activity for 4 days which seems rather townie). In that regard hopeless and risk still look equally bad to me cause they kinda dropped "casually" onto the sylencia lynch, and I would expect hopeless and CC to be more careful about sheeping their scumread's (me) case there (whereas hopeless said it was for self-preservation, will have to check if CC and hopeless gave out a sylencia read at all). I'll have to scrutiny CC some more in general cause I didn't really pay enough attention to him since the risk pressure thing, and I don't know why he thinks I'm scum. I would like to hear reasons for that. With that, I'll contribute more when I'm back and have more time. Good hunting. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
Well I will only say one thing right now: My reads were based on more than just calling people braindead (and you'll have to prove your points by quoting my posts. Hint: You probably can't). And you say I only OMGUS people, but risk actually didn't say I'm scum. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
@ CC Can you give a quick recap of why you find/found hopeless scummy? Do you find risk scummy? How would you prioritize your choices? @ risk You said you found that D2 post from me suspicious, can you specify what and why? Was that vote on CC indicative of suspicion or did you just want him to talk? I would also like to expand on why I still find you suspicious. In this post (~ 1:30 time) you say We're not lynching anyone else but hopeless, followed by a post telling him why he is scum (as opposed to trying to convince others). Several hours later you show exactly the opposite attitude, slowly starting to agree with the points against sylencia and not mentioning the only guy you thought should be lynched hours ago. Not even finding it suspicious that there's someone starting a counterbandwagon away from your top scumread, instead you sheep exactly that one? @ Hopeless Any opinion on the points against me by CC and my points against CC? Where do me and CC stand, relative to risk? | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
That's part of the reason I was more interested into lynching sylencia D1, cause I want to see more from you and hopeless to be able to make a better decision, whereas sylencia looked very scummy to me (but turned out to be lynchbait). You stating what you thought of sylencia is not enough. It's easy for scum to be right as opposed to a majority of townies who might be pushing for a mislynch. What matters is that you didn't fight the sylencia lynch in favour of the hopeless lynch when you should have, according to your earlier statement about hopeless , and instead seem to want to take credit for a townread on a dead townie now. Why do you find CC suspicious? | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
On April 05 2013 20:04 risk.nuke wrote: Both, I wanted to put more pressure on him because he didn't seem to take things seriously. I didn't like neither of the bolded statements. I was against the Sylencia lynch and I stated several times why I wasn't sure he was scum rather then bad townie. You didn't seem to find that townie but instead find my behavior highly suspicious. I think that's odd. Because the only legit reason you could feel that is if you had a strong townread on hopeless or disagreed with my arguments against him. Shortly before lynch: On April 04 2013 05:42 risk.nuke wrote: I think syl's absence makes him look worse, however he has posts with thoughts I can follow and I liked that, there were other posts I didn't like such as how slow he was to take a stand on lynches and also where he ended up however I'm not sure that's necessarily scumplay as opposed to just bad town play. On April 04 2013 06:03 risk.nuke wrote: I said I didn't want to lynch him, it's about the same time Ghor pulled his 180 on me. I want to lynch Hope, I would rather lynch RoL before I lynch Syl but I will vote Syl to ensure a lynch. That's what I think about lynching Syl. ARE YOU HAPPY? On April 04 2013 06:24 risk.nuke wrote: Ghor I wouldn't hammer VE either because VE is a townread. I would hammer a null-read rather then to see a no-lynch. Can you not see the difference in that? On April 04 2013 06:32 risk.nuke wrote: Mainly his reluctance to take a stand about the lynch and his relationship with Ghor. He's pretty much the only one he's taken a stance on and it in a way looks like tunneling hidden behind a claimed general dislike for Ghors writing. However I'm also not sure if a scum Syl would tunnel a person so blatantly poorly while being passive about voting him. If he was scum he should have had a teammate to tell him he's playing awefully and give him some advice. Did you say why you would lynch RoL over Syl? Why hopeless is a better lynch than syl (you told us your lynch priorities, but didn't seem to act according to them)? Find it suspicious that people started a counter bandwagon over obvious scum hopeless? All I see is you going like this: "Syl could be scum cause of x, syl could be town cause of y, I will vote syl not cause of these reasons, but only to ensure a lynch, I will mention these reasons anyway cause people ask me to". Now obviously, you will say "But Ghor, did you prefer a no-lynch instead?". No, of course not, but it's about your behaviour before the lynch, and your apparent opportunism towards the sylencia lynch and fear of being wrong, and the stuff you just said now that says you should look townie for opposing the lynch when you really didn't oppose it, but only gave your opinions about. "But Ghor, I wasn't confident" I'm sure you weren't, cause it conflicts with your objectives to notoppose a townie lynch, and assuming hopeless is town by now, being one of the main pushers of a town lynch was probably a worse option, but you could not simply jump on the sylencia wagon without justification. So you'd simply give out controversial opinions about sylencia to not look inconsistent with your earlier hopeless' superstrong scumread (by giving points in favour of scumlencia and justify a vote on him), but also giving out townie points to be able to justify that you never pushed sylencia before. On April 05 2013 20:24 risk.nuke wrote: Why have you ruled out the possibility both me and hope are town? I did as much as I could to make people vote hopeless, should I had reworded and spammed the case against him every 5 minutes? And I didn't just say I opposed a syl lynch, towncred plox. I specified arguments for why the arguments against him could be wrong. At the same time I didn't feel confident enough to just say shut up I am dead certain you are wrong. I was against the Sylencia lynch and I stated several times why I wasn't sure he was scum rather then bad townie. You didn't seem to find that townie but instead find my behavior highly suspicious. Seem like you do want towncred for it though. ______________________________________________________________________________________________________ So yeah, I back a risk lynch in favour over a hopeless lynch now. Sorry buddy :o] ##Vote risk.nuke | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
On April 03 2013 14:27 risk.nuke wrote: We're not lynching anyone other then hopeless. RoL you got to be joking if you think that we're going to lynch cheesecake first. While I agree with your posts and I had some thoughts in simmilar direction last night. It's still a weaker case then on hopeless. I don't like how you haven't talked about me since your vote and I would like you to comment further on me and hopeless. Hopeless is obvious scum and has pretty much given up by now. This is not how he plays as town. And Ghor's post are not hard to read. If you disregard the fact that he speaks in third person and often don't use capital letters they're actually very simple to read and even efficiently phrased. Sylencia. Who do you want to kill? On April 04 2013 01:27 risk.nuke wrote: Hopeless, my case on you is not meta based. Meta is generally only something I use to gather others to my case once it's been made. My problem with you is I called you out for not caring about scum hunting quite early, and despite that you didn't give a shit about trying to up your game, while you weren't under any pressure. Nor have you claimed busy. You just straight out was lurking and never scumhunting or caring about the game. Your only contributions were highly suspicious egging-on-from-the-shadows posts. My impression on you which I've gotten from games I've played with you before is you're an intelligent individual. So why have an intelligent townie not given a shit about scumhunting or making cases. Additionally later when you after ages bring up your theory. You come up with the WORST and MOST UNLIKELY possible theory for scumbuddies that only makes it seem like you're not reading the thread. Ghor have been sharper with his comments on me then anyone else in the thread. And additionally I am just about the most active player in the game. The only possible explanations are you're scum or a townie who's not putting in any time in the game. But then why haven't you come clean and admitted you haven't given a shit about the game because that is the only other possible explanation I might had believed. But even with that your egging on posts doesn't make sense. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
Where do you show to the thread that you even think RoL could be scum since you seemed to have preferred him over sylencia? There is zero effort from you to work towards the objectives you claimed to have. You could also expand on pointing out what you find weird about CC. Cause finding stuff weird and leaving it at that isn't the best way to follow a trail. Don't you have anything to ask to CC? | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
Will be away for ~1 hour. So don't do quick things you might regret. We have at least ~one more day. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
Risk, answer my points instead of telling me I'm full of shit. If you're town you have no reason to stop talking about CC if you find him weird, just cause I think you're scum. RoL, do you have any reads to offer instead of discussing lynch options at this point? | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
On April 05 2013 04:33 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Ghor, sup buddy? + Show Spoiler + Ghor's been focusing on 3 main people this game. Initially, Risk, who was the easiest target from D1. Then Syl. And Hopeless to a certain extent. Look how the Syl and Hopeless scumreads developed... On April 02 2013 23:11 Ghor wrote: Ghor not like sylencia last two post, he lie about me. Ghor contribute, ghor say what he think, what he like, what he not like, who capitalist are.what risk do wrong and why not hammer too quick. but sylencia play like capitalist swine, he talk about me wildcard cause ghor sound like foreign, but say i scummy for things not true. but that not only reason.it sound like omgus, bad. ghor had eye on sylencia early, ghor ask axle about people like sylencia who say privjet and go away. what make ghor suspicious in late posts is: Sylencia spend more time talking about everyone except main scumread.ghor suspect sylencia try park easy vote on cheesecake. ghor sees no reason to mention everyone else but not try convince others that cc scum. sylencia also describe lot of things, but not give interpretationi. too much description, not enough opinion. look scummy. only alignment-opinion in big post are cc and ve. he say risk make strange things, but no say what he think of it. he only say votes on risk too early, and say scum hammer him quickly cause of CC, but if sylencia think CC scum, then why fear his vote will help scum? sylencia say risk do odd thing, no say if scummy or not, sylencia fear risk getting hammered quickly -> sylencia think risk town. wishwash here, scummy part. risk this last post ghor also find scummy, only description, no opinion about lazer. look like sylencia feel forced to give pseudo opinion about people he asked about. Sylencia finds Ghor to be a wildcard and scummy. Ghor essentially says in the bolded is, "Sylencia lied about me. I contribute. I do townie things. Sylencia lie." He says that Syl was focusing on other people than his main scumread (me?). Syl was focusing on Ghor being scum in that post, not myself. Why is Syl focusing on Ghor instead of me scummy? It's not ---> Ghor is nervous about something. He then proceeds to tunnel Sylencia the entire day based on this fact. On April 03 2013 01:56 Ghor wrote: ghor think hopeless braindead if he thinks ghor teammate with risk. ghor pointed out fallacies with risk early, try get proper opinion on him from sylencia. All reasoning laid out, hopeless not absorb it. Hopeless, question: Ghor saw the scumslip you pointed out that was none.Ghor answered to your assessment, what do you deduce from it? (Ghor deduces it another example of hopeless amazing reading comprehension) Ghor now has a scumread on Hopeless. He thinks Risk / Ghor scumteam, huh? Wrong! I pointed out all of these fallacies. His scumread on Hopeless seems to be based on the fact that Hopeless is an idiot rather than scum. What's really interesting is that Ghor never budges his Syl case and rides it to majority. On April 03 2013 11:04 Ghor wrote: Ghor in conflict, ghor not sure what make of risk. ghor also like hopeless and sylencia as lynch choices. ghor wonders, why you say you saving scum sylencia (cause you probably want to imply your motive is not being disruptive). ghor very curious why say scum sylencia. not simply sylencia, or town sylencia. Keeps Risk and Hopeless as an option but still never considers them seriously. On April 03 2013 20:49 Ghor wrote: ghor want kill sylencia very much, ghor think he look more scummy with each post. this look terrible terrible from sylencia. ghor facepalm, this more than just connection read, this connection justification for later bad push against ghor. whole play look terrible. ghor not need make case, sylencia filter is case. but ghor maybe try to make good case later, if town not convinced. ##Unvote ##Vote Sylencia Ghors mind: Shit, he's going to hammer Hopeless and I'll look terrible. He also thinks I look terrible anyway. BETTER RIDE THIS SYL LYNCH HOME BABY! Summary: - Ghor initially thinks Syl is scum because he lied about him, and said a bunch of mean things. Syl was pressuring Ghor, and Ghor no like this. - Ghor thinks Hopeless could be scum because he is 'braindead' and thinks Ghor is scum with risk. Only has this read after VE and myself call him out. - For someone who called Syl "Too self-centered", he seems to be very careful about his image and quick to retaliate; people who are suspect of him are his top scumreads. ##Vote: Ghor I don't think Risk is scum with Ghor, for the record. Point 1: I thought Syl was scum for a multitude of reasons, as shown by my numerous cases. Point 2: Hopeless attacked both you and me for things that weren't true/resulted from reading mistakes. Since it persisted for longer time and he attacked me while I was pressuring sylencia and trying to get answers from him, I assumed it was malicious. Point 3: Didn't OMGUS risk.nuke, and the "careful about image thing" isn't conform with how I led the Sylencia lynch late in the day. So yeah, two points to falsify this view. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
Point 1 and 2 applied during day1 already. Point 3 is generalized and not true. And the fact that you didn't find me scummy for the same points D1 still applies. You say yourself you didn't find me scummy, so you're either saying that you didn't notice it, or you admit that you only call it out as scummy when it fits your needs. | ||
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Ghor
Russian Federation140 Posts
If someone would be so kind to get RoL to talk, cause currently I don't see much reason to believe that he's town, while he should actually post according to his free time now. Anyway, I'm off. | ||
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