EPTif you're somehow town yamato, never, ever again call me scum without any kind of reason.
TL Mafia LXI - Page 15
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
if you're somehow town yamato, never, ever again call me scum without any kind of reason. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
But idk, maybe yam is town, maybe he's scum. This game is way too hard. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
I'm looking at giggles and maybe hopeless, stutters | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 08 2013 00:58 kushm4sta wrote: we can lynch bc tomorrow when yamato flips town I'm not even sure about that. maybe stutters was bussing shiaopi (which is basically the reason I gave him a very tentative "maybe not scum" read during that night). Maybe geript is scum and BH is trolling us, maybe giggles is scum. And that's not even talking about hopeless who everyone seems to think is scum except me and BM | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
I don't know, I thought people calling other people scum with terrible reasoning was a scumtell, but the more you know | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 07 2013 03:53 Palmar wrote: "I don't think you've done anything like mafia would do, or acted like mafia, but you're probably mafia anyway" I don't even know how to argue with this. On May 07 2013 04:49 yamato77 wrote: BC is town because either you or him is confirmed town, because of what I've talked about his game, and right now I'm working under that assumption. I get confused when people make reads based on absolutely fucking nothing. If you think I'm scum WoS, please present a argument I can respond to and explain why you're wrong. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 08 2013 07:48 GiygaS wrote: Please explain why you put him in L-1 then, knowing full well that he said he wanted to hammer himself. Kush is probably town, I wouldn't bother. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 08 2013 21:58 kushm4sta wrote: palmar the thing is, your reason for thinking yamato is scum is even worse than his reason for thinking you were scum. He thinks you are scum therefore he must die? Are you kidding me? How fucking arrogant can you be bro? You do not look super town this game at all. I know I don't look like super town, are you not reading the game? That's why I'm specifically trying to explain to people why I am not scum, if I thought I looked super town, I would not bother with it, get that? And again, are you not reading the game, I have no problem with people calling me scum, it's because yamato conclusively, and even admitted himself, that he had no reason to call me scum, that's what bothers me. I want reasons, I asked him for reasons, I pulled his own quotes and presented them to him, and asked him what had changed. I'm not being arrogant, that's the last thing I can be this game, I'm being transparent and helpful. But I really don't understand why people keep trying to call me scum without providing any reasons for it. I did not think yamato was scum because he thought I was scum (although I do admit, I'm very prone to that when I'm town). I thought yamato was scum because he was trying to lynch me based on nothing. Did you read his quote about why BC is town? That's not even half-assed reasoning. On May 08 2013 21:58 kushm4sta wrote: I know you think you are the mafia bomb because of "your play d1 and your ability to influence the game" (which you brag about every fucking game btw) but you have not been a positive force on this game at all. I think there is a very good chance you are scum. After Hopeless and BC you are the next scummiest. All you do this game is call people terrible... seriously that is unacceptable hypocritical flaming but you do it constantly. In the context I used it this game I was actually trying to explain that I'm not that good at later in the game or with roles, but if it makes you feel better you can take it whatever way you want. It's been repeatedly shown that I'm generally not that great in later days of mafia, because I start lynching people that disagree with me or call me scum. I don't like being called scum when I'm town. Not to mention this is false, again, you're not reading the game. I've called WoS awful or mafia, and I called BC's day 1 play awful, I don't think I've attacked anyone else in that way. I did call yamato's reasoning terrible, but that's not saying he's terrible, it's pointing out to him that he doesn't have a case. Please show me all this hypocritical flaming. On May 08 2013 21:58 kushm4sta wrote: I actually would lynch you purely for punishment at this point. Town can take more potentnial mislynches if necessary. we are winning. Maybe kill 1 scum first then kill palmar for punishment? If we kill one scum first I probably don't care, so sure. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: This one is a point FOR town Palmar becuase I can't see them making the decision to bus Clarity this early when he was actually active, unless they realized his play was so shitty he'd be going down immediately. Yep, it's a point for town me because you know.. I'm town. Generally townies do townie things. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: Here his agreement with Rayn puts VE in the position he is in if scum. The bus is more likely to have begun here, but can't be sure of stuff yet. VE was looking scummy earlier on in the game to be fair to Palmar,but he was not a likely lynch that day. The push onto VE overall though looks really bad since trying to push a 3rd possibly-town wagon when two scum are up for lynch...well...... Yeah, I thought VE was scum, and you agree he looked bad early. I still thought he was scum by this day, and by extension I gave shiaopi a probably town read, not a big deal. I can't be right on everything, and very often I miss under-the-radar scum. I like lynching VE, and I was willing to throw my weight behind a clarity lynch too. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: This looks like the post where scum Palmar realizes his push is a bad idea. No, this is the post where I agree that Clarity lynch is a good one and since I have a very strong case on him (the same reason I said "sup scum" to him on day 1, just articulated). Think about it for a little while, if I'm scum palmar wouldn't I try to extract every little ounce of town-cred out of the clarity lynch? why would I bother with saying I still wanted to lynch VE? The truth is I thought VE was scum. I still think he was playing strange, but obviously his relative lack of leadership may have been, just like mine, based on his role. Do you think there is a hole in my reasoning for killing Clarity? Do you think this is fabricated evidence? Was it not new to the thread at the time I wrote it? Especially the part where I analyse his follow-up. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: On the topic of the TRN Mason QT. Says he forgot about it his story is somewhat corroborated by TRN...though I can't understand why you wouldn't interact at all with your masoner unless you worried about them picking up a read on you. The fact that Palmar uses the fact that TRN masoned him as evidence as to his towniness reads to me that he has no idea about TRN's play or the fact that he is new at the game (I picked him as town ages ago, I'm fairly sure others have as well) and so is worried about the potential for TRN outing him as scum when in fact TRN's chances of doing so as being new to Palmar's play are probably low. I'm not great at playing scum, one of my biggest strengths however is PM games. I've found most of my success where I can get intimate (hehe) with people in private. You're just going to have to take my word for this, but I honestly forgot about the mason thing. I was not very active on day 2, and TRN refused to explain why he picked me to be in the Mason QT, so I lost interest, leading to me forgetting it. I don't see how you can draw any alignment conclusive the fact I didn't really talk to TRN. Maybe we just don't work well together. He wanted to talk about topics I wasn't interested in at the time etc. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: SO here he mentions I was the one TRN brought up that he didn't feel like looking into. Ok, I get that, but just the day before he says this: Wouldn't this make me a suspect of his and someone he's likely to have read? Especially since I'm pretty sure I claimed miller before TRN's mason time ended and was super high on EVERYONE's suspicion list. as far as I understood the mason topic lasted 72 hours, and I think those were up. And yeah, you were at the time firmly in my scum/null group, but I wasn't really pursuing it at the time. I think I was pretty involved during the night you claimed miller, and if I recall correctly, I realized that your claim made sense and looked genuine. Now put yourself in scum-palmar's shoes. You basically have what equals to a guilty cop-check on your head and I could tunnel that until you die, hell I even gave you some shit for not being super-townie since you were a self-aware miller (though I do very much agree with your play of not claiming it at the start). But no, because I'm not actually scum, I just stepped back, looked at how you claimed and how you reacted to the pressure and decided you were town. I actually did the same thing yesterday, but yamato self-hammered in rage after quoting a post of mine where I was basically considering waffling on his lynch. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: Palmar then begins to buddy up to his previous scumread in VE to try and get BC lynched. Presumably this is due to his N1 and N2 checks, which makes sense and is a point for Palmar having told the truth. (The long con is definitely possible, but is that likely to Palmar's scumplay? I don't know him that well.) Thanks for making my case for me, the reason my narrative makes sense is that it is 100% true. I told the same thing to yamato. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: I called Palmar out for this earlier and he never responded; which important townies had Palmar's back at this point? I didn't count many despite his crusade for action against 'the cobbler.' mostly reyn, who was playing a pretty damn baller town game. at the time, if I recall correctly, thread sentiment was pretty favorable to me. I cba going back and finding out exactly who I had in mind. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: I REALLY didn't like this post at the time. We know there's 3rd party and 3 scum left here so we certainly did not have 'plenty of townies.' Everything he says about being a cop though isn't provable one way or the other as of yet at this point; the rb and his checks check out. I don't know I don't like the idea that he making mislynches feel better than they actually would have been but it's such a scummy thing to post knowing the math that I don't see scum doing it. Again, thanks for making my case for me. Most importantly here is my belief that CC was town, I was almost certain that his claim was true, and I think I never had any scumvibes in the game for him, so to me I was pretty sure we'd either get a scumlynch or a lurkerlynch->scumlynch (which is what happened). Remember, scumpalmar would've KNOWN that shiaopi was scum, so your theory of multiple mislynches makes no sense if I'm scum. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: Well knowing what we know now.... I don't if anything can be said about this since everyone more or less agreed Sylencia didn't look great, but to say Shiao looked TOWNY is a GROSS overstatement. I also remember asking at some point whoever found Shiao towny, WHY did they think so and no one ever answered. Hmm. The point here is, scumpalmar knows that sylencia flips green, and town immediately lynches shiaopi. Yes, I was wrong on shiaopi, but if I was scum, why would I bother calling someone from the scumteam who was about to be confirmed scum because of the lynch I was pushing (sylencia) town? It makes absolutely no sense. On May 01 2013 03:57 WaveofShadow wrote: Alright sadly I don't have much to conclude about this case. Imo the scum points outweigh the town points just based on his filter and he's had a cba attitude for much of the game. We can't even discern his alignment based on his checks either because he didn't follow the plan which looks scummy as well. If he is telling thr truth he must be either paranoid or insane (which would make him exactly the same as CC? Same role AND same alignment? Unlikely imo....) and if he's paranoid he's more or less useless, no? I dunno guys, help me out. I'm leaning scum overall but we have nother night of NKs ahead of us before we must act. The reason you can't conclude anything is that I'm not scum. I haven't done anything objectively scummy, I've made a few bad calls (VE scum, Shiaopi maybe town, yamato OMGUS, Role botch) and a few okay ones (rayn town, grush town, clarity scum etc). You want to lynch me because you think I'm a dick, which towards you I guess I somewhat have been. I just got annoyed when you wrote a case where you in multiple cases concluded that my story makes sense, or that what I did makes sense from a town standpoint and yet you come away thinking I'm scum. People have been doing this throughout this entire game. BC calling to vig me for no reason, yamato calling me scum because why not, sharrant trying to lynch me for botching my role (non-alignment indicative), Ace wanting to lynch me for claiming cop and you making a case that is probably a better case for town-palmar than scum-palmar and yet saying I'm scum for god-knows what reason. It's annoying and frustrating to repeatedly have to swat down cases that seem to be written backwards (palmar is scum and I must find the reason why), because they're so lacking in evidence. So please, explain to me why you still think I'm scum. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 09 2013 01:25 WaveofShadow wrote: Aw, here you go and actually put effort into something...I was so set to troll the rest of the night too. I don't understand how you can exude such an attitude of complete confidence despite your performance this game; it's that arrogance that kush outlined that absolutely infuriates me, including your propensity to compltely ignore or shrug off those points from people you deem 'terrible' and either not worth your time or not worth listening to. (This may just be referring to me in this case, but it's an attitude I see from a few players on mafia, BC included. Ace appears to be an exception.) I don't know where you get the complete confidence thing from, I'm pretty unsure how to proceed in this game, and I thought my recent waffling on yamato and posts like "this game is too hard" were pretty indicative of that. And I don't ignore people based on my perception of them, I ignore people that say things I don't think make sense. I actually think I'm one of the better long-term players when it comes to appreciating newer players, because I play quite actively and thus don't lose touch with the up and coming community. reyn hasn't played for that long (on my timescale) and I sheeped him all game long, because I agreed with things he said. On May 09 2013 01:25 WaveofShadow wrote: Despite the fact that you see me and my cases as terrible, I've been right about quite a few things this game (though nobody appears to acknowledge this---yet you're constantly bringing up things YOU were right about), and I also know who the JK is, and have for a little while now. There are many things that I have contributed that simply get bypassed because my way of figuring out the game doesn't fit within the brackets of what you would determine to be 'good play' yet apparently achieves the same result (or in this case, BETTER results if people ever listened to me). Do you really need endless appreciation from others? Do you want me to dive into your filter and find where you've been right? I don't think you're a terrible player, hell, the fact that you're alive with a guilty check means you cannot by definition be awful, no matter your alignment. It's not my job to push your ideas, it's your job. If you don't like that your posts get ignored, I'd suggest getting better at pushing your ideas, and if you're trying to convince me, specifically, a good start would be to stop yelling for my lynch. Do you want a pat on the back? Just do it yourself. Explain to us all why you're awesome and must be listened to. On May 09 2013 01:25 WaveofShadow wrote: I was unsure about your case originally when I wrote it, but if you'd read it wasn't necessarily a case to get you lynched, it was merely a summation of my thoughts on you, some points and counterpoints, and then I literally said "I dunno guys, help me out." AND NOBODY DID. Town is a team, and no one can be sure of their own cases/reads all of the time, not even you, yet many people treat their reads as G-d's word to fucking Moses. It was an opening for you or anyone else to say: "your case is shit and here's why." "Or I agree for such and such reasons" But nobody did so I was left with my own thoughts echoing in my head. Town is a team, but you also have to learn to recognize how to work with a team. Just to take a silly little example, giggles corrected someone's spelling of his name, and then said he was tired of "giggles". This obviously immediately caused everyone to call him giggles all the time, because that's how the culture works. I'm not sure whether or not giggles understood this, but he should have expected it. If you're not being listened to, it's your own fault. Everyone can become the center of attention, but you have to learn how to manipulate a thread into focusing on the things that you want it to be focused on, to do this you have to understand the culture in the thread, embrace it and use it to your advantage. I was extensively listened to even in my first games of mafia because I realized this from the get-go. We can have a discussion about this after the game, as it's one of the things I think I do well in mafia, ie: getting the thread to talk about what I want. People are always biased to their own thoughts. Don't be mad about it, use it. On May 09 2013 01:25 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm going to wipe all bias I have clean when I look into you over the next little bit, just as I did the first time. If you ignore it then despite what I find I will be pushing for your lynch tomorrow as I will therefore not be seeing you as an asset to town alive, only through the information gleaned by your death. Whether or not people listen to me on that will not matter to me. Whether or not you feel threatened by this does not matter to me. If you, or other people respond, perhaps we can actually begin to solve this game properly. You only lynch me if you think I'm scum. If you can come up with a legitimate reason why, I guess I'll be fine with you attacking me. But please, whenever you read things, make sure you read them both from the context of "scum-palmar" and "town-palmar". Because I found your earlier case in some places lacking in looking at the costs and benefits of my actions based on both town and scum. I'm not particularly threatened, I understand how this game works. But I'm not going to allow myself to be mislynched without explanation. I don't compromise, I don't self-hammer. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
I can tell you who I think should not be considered... if you think that helps? | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
| ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 09 2013 04:02 WaveofShadow wrote: Nope. Do you agree that either BC or Palmar have to die today? This is not a good perspective to have, you're limiting your options. It's entirely possible BC is town, although I'm just not sure at the moment. For example, it's not implausible to think the remaining scum could be somewhere in stutters/giggles/hopeless. | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 09 2013 04:03 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I'm not going to expand on this until Palmar answers me whether he still suspects BC. I don't want to influence his answer. You cannot influence my answer so don't worry about it. But it's gonna be a while as I'm going to read the entire filter of a few people, including BC | ||
|
Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
On May 09 2013 04:07 Artanis[Xp] wrote: If you're scum, showing my hand could lead to you giving the desired answer. Therefore I'd rather not comment on it at this point. That's entirely up to you, I just don't want the progress of discussion to be hindered waiting on what I have to say. Even if you think I'm scum, does it look like I've been saying things and giving opinions to please people this game? | ||
| ||
