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On February 26 2013 08:54 Oatsmaster wrote:
Cora, is your scum meta the same as your first game as town meta?
I wouldn't like to think that. While I lasted a long time in my first game as scum and was killed N1 in my first game as town (both expressing that I had a pro-town vibe, whether that was true or not), I used a lot more misdirection and was a lot more aggressive in my first game as scum than I was in my first game as town.
NMM 33 was not Syl's first game. His first game was NMM 32 (which I did not read so I did not mention it).
Where are you going with this?
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My point is that regardless on how someone plays, they are not scum because their meta matches their previous town game.
They are scum because either their meta is different from their town meta in a scummy way, or similar to their scum meta.
Syl, your activity and contribution to this game has been lackluster at best, please step it up if you are town :D
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On February 26 2013 09:04 Oatsmaster wrote:
My point is that regardless on how someone plays, they are not scum because their meta matches their previous town game.
They are scum because either their meta is different from their town meta in a scummy way, or similar to their scum meta.
Syl, your activity and contribution to this game has been lackluster at best, please step it up if you are town :D
First of all Oats, you said the same thing that makes Syl town made Marv scum (matching town meta = scum), which just makes it hilarious that you're backtracking on that now.
Anyways, my point is not that Syl is scum because his meta is the same as his town game. In all honesty, his performances as town have been really crap. Here's his record at mafia, copied and pasted from his profile:
Newbie Mini Mafia XXXII - Endgamed as VT
Newbie Mini Mafia XXXIII - Won as VT
Newbie Mini Mafia XXXIV - Won as Mafia Roleblocker
Newbie Mini Mafia XXXVII - Lost as VT
Themed Game Mafia - Lost as Rubick, the Grand Magus
This Town Ain't Big Enough Mafia - ???
Town Record: 1-3
Mafia Record: 1-0
My point was that in the three games that he has played with me, his town play has been very weak. It reflects in his record: 1-3. I'm not going to sugarcoat it, his lurky style is not beneficial towards town. So why does he continue to do it? That's what I do not understand. Wouldn't he be taking matters into his own hands to play better?
However, if you look at his scum play, it revolved around the same type of game as his town play. He won in his one game as scum. Why would he not do anything different if he was scum? If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right?
The fact that he continues to show the lurky, useless playstyle he has always shown points towards him being scum.
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And while we are on the topic of your suspicion towards Marv, would you like to reply to this?
+ Show Spoiler +On February 26 2013 06:17 cDgCorazon wrote:A few other things I would like to point out: Oats' play so far has been a bit shaky for me. I already pointed out the fact that he is being inconsistent towards Iamp and other players, but he hasn't made any clear effort to scumhunt. Most of his filter has been directing discussion and debates with others, but he hasn't brought in any clear direction with his posts. He has made several hints to him thinking players are scummy: Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 20:01 Oatsmaster wrote:
Acro is also somewhat scummy, cant really pin down what it is though :/ Show nested quote +On February 26 2013 01:17 Oatsmaster wrote:
Welcome to scumland Zarepath, at least in my book :D
The points where he has shown doubt and suspicion on another player (and not their arguments) have been thrown out there, but he hasn't put anything behind them. The one time where he expanded on one of these points: Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 11:23 Oatsmaster wrote:
I get a different feeling in this game than LIX.
He is not really stepping up here, even in LIX he didnt run for mayor until half of the first cycle was gone.
So therefore, I dont really think marv is helping town so far. So therefore he is scummy.
Acro's response basically explains how I feel about this: Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 12:13 Acrofales wrote:On February 25 2013 11:23 Oatsmaster wrote:
I get a different feeling in this game than LIX.
He is not really stepping up here, even in LIX he didnt run for mayor until half of the first cycle was gone.
So therefore, I dont really think marv is helping town so far. So therefore he is scummy.
This is completely contradictory. In LIX Marv didn't step up until later. He was town there. In this game, Marv has not stepped up in the first 4 (or so) hours of the game. Therefore Marv is scummy this game. This makes no sense to me. Oats, your reads so far make no sense. You scum throwing shitty cases around and trying to discredit strong players? The moment after Oats makes this illogical statement, he tries to get everyone to not think about it: Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 11:26 Oatsmaster wrote:
Anyway its pointless to pursue this further on this point, I dont think its a very strong scumtell for marv, but it isnt a towntell. Which makes me suspicous.
Also hapa get in the game, thrawn and marv just beat you to the exact same point.
And when he gets challenged on the point, he tries to throw the discussion elsewhere: Show nested quote +On February 25 2013 11:50 Oatsmaster wrote:
Thrawn I didnt say it wasnt a scumtell, I said it wasnt a strong scumtell.
Anyway stop discussing Marv, its getting nowhere.
Acro do you have any reads? He's trying to dodge the fact that he made an illogical argument. To me, that is a strong scum tell. He refuses to elaborate on why Marv playing like his town meta makes him scummy because he knows it is a bad argument. Why would scum try to avoid this? They need to make up arguments that are not true so that the town will not vote them off. Why would he make this silly argument in the first place if he wasn't scum? Why would he not own up to his mistake and take the blame for a bad argument and instead try to sidestep it? These are the questions I would love to see Oats answer.
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some of my earlier reads are now the opposite of what they were
i'm pretty sure that iamp/yamato/oats are town
I think there is probably scum among hapa/acro and i think it's way more likely that acro is scum
there are a few low contribution players I don't like but chief among them is zarepath
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Win rate has nothing to do with how good a player you are.
I refused to elaborate because it was too early to actually talk about it, I needed more posts from marv to solidify that read as either town or scum.
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On February 26 2013 09:30 thrawn2112 wrote:
some of my earlier reads are now the opposite of what they were
i'm pretty sure that iamp/yamato/oats are town
I think there is probably scum among hapa/acro and i think it's way more likely that acro is scum
there are a few low contribution players I don't like but chief among them is zarepath
Why is there scum in me/Hapa. Can we not both be scum?
Also, nice reasoning there, mr. mafia; throwing out names with, once again, no reasoning.
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On February 26 2013 09:33 Oatsmaster wrote:
Win rate has nothing to do with how good a player you are.
I refused to elaborate because it was too early to actually talk about it, I needed more posts from marv to solidify that read as either town or scum.
Why did you only ask to change the subject when the fallacy in your logic was discovered? Why have most of your reads been only suspicions and nothing concrete? Come on, you know that that was not my whole argument. Are you trying to dodge again?
You need to answer the core of my argument, not just the outside of it.
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Brunei Darussalam622 Posts
Just got back from work. I'll catch up now, and will be more active later tonight.
RIP Marv 
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What is the core of your argument, it looks to me like it was my backing down off marv in a suspicious way, in your eyes.
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On February 26 2013 09:38 Oatsmaster wrote:
What is the core of your argument, it looks to me like it was my backing down off marv in a suspicious way, in your eyes.
Another part of my argument was the fact that you called some people scum or said you have suspicion of them and then did not elaborate on it (Acro, Zare).
"Not having anything else to say" or "I need Marv to post more to get a better read" would've been a better way of saying it. The fact that you say it now instead of when you were pressured for it is scummy but you obviously have no choice here, so I won't hold it against you.
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Well I was still leaning scum on marv, but there was absolutely nothing in that push that would help town at that point of time.
I dont see why I need to elaborate when I am not trying to get them lynched YET.
When I am confident in my lynch choice, I will push them as hard as I can.
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Oats isn't scum Cora.
As per my question to deino, scum oats would not take town Marv head on.
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i would like to
do zare vs snarf
or
zare vs kier
i would like to give hapa some more time.
Is there anyone that is with me?
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All these inactive people.
We still have more than 40 hours though, no need to be hasty.
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On February 26 2013 09:50 iamperfection wrote:
i would like to
do zare vs snarf
or
zare vs kier
i would like to give hapa some more time.
Is there anyone that is with me?
Tell me again why Thrawn is town. His calling you out is not enough given the rest of his play. I have played town with him once and he played well. I read 2 other of his town games and they were also fine. This is not his townplay.
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On February 26 2013 10:17 Oatsmaster wrote:
All these inactive people.
We still have more than 40 hours though, no need to be hasty.
No, we have 20 hours.
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oh.
I am stupid and should read the OP.
yeah I would be comfortable with thrawn dying at this point.
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On February 26 2013 10:22 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2013 09:50 iamperfection wrote:
i would like to
do zare vs snarf
or
zare vs kier
i would like to give hapa some more time.
Is there anyone that is with me? Tell me again why Thrawn is town. His calling you out is not enough given the rest of his play. I have played town with him once and he played well. I read 2 other of his town games and they were also fine. This is not his townplay.
i just dont think he is stupid. call it gut or whatever but his last scum games he did not post at all like we are talking 4 or 5 posts.
is it possible he is scum yeah but i think there are better candidates and my gut says he is town.
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EPT
