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Witchcraft Mini Mafia - Page 12

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Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:49 GMT
#2162
On December 21 2012 09:47 Hapahauli wrote:
Djo, flinging shit at kush is not going to do much when it
a) looks really really desperate
b) Kush has a really really good case on you


I could put up a defense or an excellent case against Kush if I was not in a fucking airport.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:51 GMT
#2165
On December 17 2012 02:29 kushm4sta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 17 2012 02:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
On December 17 2012 02:24 kushm4sta wrote:
On December 17 2012 02:14 Eywa- wrote:
On December 17 2012 02:11 kushm4sta wrote:
@eywa I want you to pick another lynch. Here's why:
1 Scumreads are at their weakest d1. Lynching a town hapa would be terrible for town, because of how useful of an asset he can be.
2 No on agrees with you, so that lynch is just not going to happen today.

1. You're running an assumption that he is a town
2. If it doesn't happen today, then the town still has 3 more days to get something right before they lose.

I'm not running under that assumption. He is the strongest town player in this game that is a fact. (you suck dp).
If we lynch him, the next 3 days will be harder.
There is no where near enough evidence to call him scum. I have no idea what his scumplay looks like but he looks town to me. Originally I was concerned with his bad cases but then I realized what he was doing and it no longer seemed scummy.


Apparently, you are running that assumption?

that he is the strongest town player yes so he is a terrible idea for d1 lynch. not that he is town this game.

Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:51 GMT
#2166
On December 17 2012 02:29 kushm4sta wrote:
but i do think he's town this game lolol


lolol scumslip
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:55 GMT
#2169
On December 21 2012 09:50 Hapahauli wrote:
When will you have time to defend yourself then?


I don't plan on defending myself. I'll devote myself to get Kush lynched.
But I have at least 12 hours of flight then I have 10 hours more to get to my hometown.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:56 GMT
#2172
On December 21 2012 09:53 Hapahauli wrote:
Djo, calling a bunch of things scumslips that aren't scumslips is not productive.


It's scumslips. I know scum Kush, I know his meta and I know they are scumslips
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 00:58 GMT
#2173
On December 21 2012 09:56 kushm4sta wrote:
Djo before I made a case against you I wasn't your strongest scumread it seemed like.
Now that I made the case, I'm suddenly your biggest scumread again?

Also I find it weird that you can find all these quotes from me yet you can't even attempt to defend yourself?



I'm phone posting. And you gave yourself away in your filter, so I don't care if I cannot defend myself, they'll understand you are scum when I flip.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 01:03 GMT
#2179
On December 21 2012 09:59 Hapahauli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2012 09:56 Djodref wrote:
On December 21 2012 09:53 Hapahauli wrote:
Djo, calling a bunch of things scumslips that aren't scumslips is not productive.


It's scumslips. I know scum Kush, I know his meta and I know they are scumslips


If you knew anything about Kush's meta, you'd realize that he "scumslips" as town every other post.


If you really knew Kush scum meta, you'd realize that he is scum...
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 01:04 GMT
#2182
it's a matter of love ^^
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 01:06 GMT
#2183
Anyway, I have already posted why kush is scum. My cases still stand against him, and it's a matter of meta and love
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 01:07 GMT
#2185
I have to take my flight now !
Bon voyage !
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 21 2012 01:17 GMT
#2194
On December 21 2012 10:07 Hapahauli wrote:
Djo, this was just about the worst and scummiest way possible you could have approached this situation.

Enjoy your vacation, but I expect both a defense and a case (explaining why these are actually scumslips) when you get back.


I promise to explain everything. But you have everything at hand.
It's just meta and love...
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 05:42 GMT
#2276
Ok guys,

I'm finally home ! And I had to sleep as soon as I arrive.
Also I met a virgin, so I don't even think I'm gonna ever address the case against me.

I just want to say that, I just entered the thread and I didn't even catch up but kush is definitively being scummier and scummier here.

This was sarcasm

My point here is that Kush is getting a lot a leeway this game. He is still on my possible scum list.
And I just got mad that he waited to post his case that I was waiting from almost day 1 just before I had to take my plane. The timing is just too good.
I also got mad because Kush made some bad arguments and some good arguments, but you took all of them for their face value.
So I decided to behave exactly like Kush does, to show you that I'm town, because some of you have a town read on him for being a total jackass. I put a lot of effort into this game and I'm being called mafia with the first arguments brought by a jackass. So yeah, I went crazy...
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 05:49 GMT
#2282
On December 22 2012 14:43 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2012 14:42 Djodref wrote:
Ok guys,

I'm finally home ! And I had to sleep as soon as I arrive.
Also I met a virgin, so I don't even think I'm gonna ever address the case against me.

I just want to say that, I just entered the thread and I didn't even catch up but kush is definitively being scummier and scummier here.

This was sarcasm

My point here is that Kush is getting a lot a leeway this game. He is still on my possible scum list.
And I just got mad that he waited to post his case that I was waiting from almost day 1 just before I had to take my plane. The timing is just too good.
I also got mad because Kush made some bad arguments and some good arguments, but you took all of them for their face value.
So I decided to behave exactly like Kush does, to show you that I'm town, because some of you have a town read on him for being a total jackass. I put a lot of effort into this game and I'm being called mafia with the first arguments brought by a jackass. So yeah, I went crazy...


It's okay Djo, I'm defending you right now. Perty sure ur town brah.

Vote Eywa.

Scumteam is Eywa / Kush or Eywa / JX.


I need to catch-up with the thread first. I had Jx, drazak and then Eya/Kush as possible scum before grush came back green. So yeah, pretty sure that both scum are among JieXian, Eywa and Kush now.
Why Eywa above JieXian ?
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 05:58 GMT
#2287
On December 22 2012 14:45 kushm4sta wrote:
djo how was I a jackass to you? i never meant to be. I was not purposefully waiting for you to leave to write the case.

also i did not just meet a virgin I also had sex with her. just need to clarify that. Can you not understand how the sudden start of a new relationship plus finals week would be a huge time sink for me?


It's not being a jackass to me. But you have failed to address my cases against you nor present any arguments for a scum Djodref for a long time. That's what I meant for you being a jackass.
I can make a list of my arguments supporting a scum Jx, a scum Eywa and a scum Kush in 5 minutes. So I don't understand what time you were missing to do this before I was going to take my plane.
Intentional or not, I took it realle bad.

Jx
-tunnels Cheese and Hapa to avoid contributing
-defends DYH and tries to derail his lynch
-scumslip
-blue hunts by leading the discussion on speculation topics

Eywa
-tunnels Cheese to avoid contributing
-flames and disrupts the thread to create a bad town atmosphere where town can't share good arguments
-does not scumhunt
-scumslip

Kush
-avoids to scumhunt or contribute with his lurker obsession
-avoids questions and cases addressed to him
-tunnels djo all game to avoid speaking of the other players
-scumslip
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 06:11 GMT
#2289
On December 22 2012 15:01 kushm4sta wrote:
still going to bed but I will say one more thing.
well my case against you involved shit from you filter so i had to read through your filter. it took about an hour to do it, maybe more.


Yeah, but that also means that you have been calling me scum all game without knowing why.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 06:46 GMT
#2290
On December 22 2012 14:54 kushm4sta wrote:
##unvote
##vote eywa


happy cheesecake?

Did i mention I had sex yet?


Could you give us more reasoning for that vote ?
I wonder if it's scum you bussing Eywa or scum you diverting the Jx lynch or just town you...
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 07:50 GMT
#2291
+ Show Spoiler [the meta part] +
On December 21 2012 06:10 kushm4sta wrote:
PART 1 (more parts inc.)

I'm going to make this meta comparison easy for you guys:
here is a d1 megapost from town djo:

So this a djo case as town.
TOWM
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 04 2012 14:07 Djodref wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 04 2012 13:42 Djodref wrote:


Clarity



Have you guys noticed Clarity ?





I'm betting that you didn't really notice him because this guys is sure blending in

First of all, I would like to say that Clarity is non-committal with his reads. Please have a look at the different posts in the following spoiler.
+ Show Spoiler +
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 03 2012 18:43 Clarity_nl wrote:

Show nested quote +
On November 03 2012 16:06 Obzy wrote:
@Cheese
>:l The no newb cards comment seems specifically aimed at me. Not really a fan. I'm not wholly sure why he dropped his argument against debears so quickly - pointing out previous meta, etc, and then it just absolutely falls off the face of the planet. Why? (I disagree with this statement, by the way:


I don't think it's directed at you specifically, but it's interesting that you think it is.
The reason Cheese said to not drop the newbie card is because it's not town behavior. When you are town you want people to believe you, if you come out of the gate saying you're awful and no one should listen to you then that's anti-town.
It also prevents scum from using "omg sorry I'm just new!", the less excuses scum have available the better for town.


My reads at this point in time:

Obzy: Leaning slightly town. He hasn't quite come out of his shell yet but he seems genuinly interested in discussion and progressing.

@ Obzy
Do you think you can get over this "I'm new" thing and give us the best reads you've got? Instead of posting something that's obvious to everyone perhaps post something that stands out to you.
_

Rad: Null. He's being more careful than last game, lurking a bit more. He mentioned he would be more careful, but not in pregame, he did this after the role PMs were sent. He also seems really invested in helping Obzy out as he's the newest, the only one here who wasn't in XXIX.

@ Rad
Why the interest in Obzy? Are you going to use MLG as an excuse at any point this weekend?
_

Alsn: Leaning slightly scum, very little info about him though. He opened super aggressive this game, which is the opposite of how he played in the majority of XXIX. Perhaps the only reason he snapped at debears so hard is because debears said
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2012 10:04 debears wrote:
If I'm not here for lynch, its irl conflicts 99% of the time. Don't pull an Alsn


@ Alsn
Why the change in behavior from last game? What do you think of debears at this point?
_

Mr Cheesecake: Null. He went SUPER defensive when he was called out about making a ton of jokes, but that discussion got blown way out of proportion. The fact that he's acting more like the way he was in mafia QT XXIX than in the actual XXIX thread is indicative of town.

@ Cheese
You did have some jokes in the XXIX thread. Can you tell us if these were jokes for the sake of jokes or if you used them to push a scum agenda? An argument can be made for both.
_

Djodref: Leaning slightly scum, He was obsessed with policy. Everyone was ready to move on but he kept mentioning it over and over. He's also the person that blew up the whole *Cheese's scum joke* thing, which bogged us down for a couple of pages.

@ Djodref
If you had to lynch someone right now, would it be da0ud or someone else?
_

Debears: Null. Regardless of if he's scum or town, he is getting the ball rolling which is good for us. Problem is... that was what he was doing in XXIX as well and he was scum in that. Older games suggest this is simply his meta so there is no read to be made about his opening. What I'm curious about is if he's going to pull a vanishing act in D2 / D3 again.

@ Debears
What's your ready on Obzy?
_

Sylverfire: Null. Only have 3 real posts to read him on. He opened really aggressive onto debears, even though he's keeping the ball rolling, an odd choice. He showed up way late but Rad pointed out that he is sticking to the same schedule he's had in previous games.

@ Sylverfire
You've only shared your read on debears, is there anything else that stands out to you?
_


So with all that said, I only have two slight scumreads on Alsn and Djo, so I hope they defend themselves as soon as possible.
Even if we end up lynching da0ud for lurking, currently with 0 posts, we can at least gather as much information as possible
Hopefully this gets some discussion going, please comment on as much as possible in my post and point out any flaws.
Do no avoid answering the questions I addressed to you, it would be a very scummy thing to do.


This post is full of null reads or slight reads, it speaks for itself.

On November 03 2012 21:39 Clarity_nl wrote:
My two weak scumreads are still you and Alsn, but that's what they are... weak.
My post is simply to gather as much info as possible. I will end up making a case before the day is over, but I figured giving this thread a good kick would help.

Weak scumreads on Alsn on me

On November 04 2012 04:38 Clarity_nl wrote:
<snip>

I am no longer suspect of Alsn, at least not as much. Although he seems to have a hard on for debears and djo he's making decent points and trying to further conversation. Debears... I'm not quite sure. The stubbornness about sylver's post where he said he has a lot of fluff really shouldn't have been that big of a deal, he just couldn't let it go. Maybe Rad is on to something.

Drops Alsn and is wishy washy about debears


Then Clarity is also using double-standards, he has being reproaching Rad not to scumhunt but have you seen Clarity scumhunting ? You might argue that he has put pressure on daoud but he has conveniently done it while it was Saturday night in Hong Kong. And given daoud lurky habits, it's an easy target to attack.

Show nested quote +
On November 04 2012 05:02 Clarity_nl wrote:
Although caution can be a good thing Rad, you should be careful.
If you don't have enough information to make a read make sure to get more information.
It would be too easy for scum to go: "Ah, I dunno, don't really have any reads" You shouldn't be getting away with this as town.
I'm curious as to any cases you might make in the next 24 hours.


Clarity has been defensive when I was trying to give him advice after his post with his reads.

Show nested quote +
On November 03 2012 21:17 Djodref wrote:
Just a remark for Obsy and Clarity, lists can been seen as a scumtell. I know that newbies love them so it's a null tell for me right now. Let me explain.

Making list makes you look like as an active contributor while you are not really committing on any player. From a list post, it's easy to blend in and find some reasons to vote for the possible lynch candidates.

And I also think it would be better for you to focus on your scumreads rather than dispatch your attention. If you are town, of course


The point I really don't like in his reaction is the fact that he said that he didn't make a list.

Show nested quote +
On November 03 2012 21:23 Clarity_nl wrote:
Where did I make a list? Unless you're talking about my reads on everyone, which I don't see can ever be a bad thing.
You are the one who pointed out that it is a plurality lynch, and that we should not focus too deeply on a select few.
My "list" forces everyone to comment on it, and perhaps gain insight on others through my observations or sees a flaw in my logic and helps me out by pointing it out.

Yeah, I've read that lists are generally a mafia tell, or newbie town, but this is only the case if they do not contribute.
Are you saying that my post will not contribute?


Regarding the plurality lynch, we have individually to focus on our scum reads but town in general should not focus on only two players. By the way, you have failed to put pressure on me or Alsn, but we were your scum reads.

In conclusion

FoS Clarity






Now this is this game's equivalent:
SCUM
+ Show Spoiler +
On December 16 2012 12:50 Djodref wrote:


JieXan




First of all, I liked DYH latest case against him + Show Spoiler [for reference] +
On December 16 2012 07:32 DoYouHas wrote:
@DP - I think the optimal way to play is to do our best to get the witch hunter to miss. Losing 2 townies, good or bad, is always worse than losing 1. I don't think this is going to convince you, so I'm not going to bring it up again.



I'm feeling more comfortable with my vote on JX right now.

His initial post was rather scummy, the thing to note about it is that it looks constructed (the phrases used when talking about hapa and MrZ, "mindless babbling" & "relative non-chalance". What makes me think he is scum is the progression of his pushing MrZ.

A behavior read.
Show nested quote +
On December 15 2012 14:47 JieXian wrote:
Hi and sorry I'm late, I'm at +8GMT and I didn't wake up as early as DarthPunk

At first I was really confused (scummy read) about hapa's mindless babbling about 13-3, which ISN'T RELEVANT to anything at all because you can't change anything except stir the discussion towards the wrong direction.

Later I got a stronger read from DP from his ridiculous "pressuring" above all for a point that's completely moot

Djo why did you vote for Mr Zentor


But above all there's Mr Zentor's relative non-chalance to everything seems to trump everything else as doesn't seem to give a damn to anything as townies are well on their way to lynching one another

##Vote MrZentor

An unsupported meta read with some WIFOM.
Show nested quote +
On December 16 2012 01:06 JieXian wrote:
I was out the whole day man relax. You guys didn't understand my post.

I found what Dp and hapa was saying to be weird BUT I changed my mind as I kept on reading the thread (notice how those 2 points were quite early on)

Based on MrZentor's "uselessness" as you guys termed it, my meta read on him shows that he's acting differently but most of all, if he were scum, he'd have nothing else to do but sit and watch because dp and hapa were in the spotlight and not take any blame.

Meaning he doesn't need to participate and make/risk any reads. I mean take a look at everyone else that's posting, they are all reads (be it weak or strong or sheep reads)

Finally providing support for his meta read. Not conclusive enough considering he is ignoring paranoia (MrZ's most recent town game).
Show nested quote +
On December 16 2012 01:23 JieXian wrote:
tell me how zentor's behavior isn't weird as compared to 2 of his other town games

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=341663&user=137099
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=363625&user=137099

0 reads 0 risks this game, because town has been going the wrong way, because he doesn't need to.


This reads like he is trying to justify his stance on MrZ after the fact. Instead of finding MrZ scummy and looking into him, the presenting good reasons to vote him, JX voted him, then went in search of the reasons when pressured. This strikes me as scummy.

I already pointed out how his first post feels constructed, and if that is true and he spent time on that post, why didn't he spend time backing up his vote on MrZ right from the start?


Here is how he entered the thread casually spreading suspicion over Hapa and DP.

Show nested quote +
On December 15 2012 14:47 JieXian wrote:
Hi and sorry I'm late, I'm at +8GMT and I didn't wake up as early as DarthPunk

At first I was really confused (scummy read) about hapa's mindless babbling about 13-3, which ISN'T RELEVANT to anything at all because you can't change anything except stir the discussion towards the wrong direction.

Later I got a stronger read from DP from his ridiculous "pressuring" above all for a point that's completely moot

Djo why did you vote for Mr Zentor


But above all there's Mr Zentor's relative non-chalance to everything seems to trump everything else as doesn't seem to give a damn to anything as townies are well on their way to lynching one another

##Vote MrZentor


His point against Hapa is not so bad, but it's kind of nit picky. I'll pass him this one because I was really startled when Hapa brought it.
On the other hand, his points against DP and Zentor are bad. Regarding DP, in the early game, you have to pressure people for some trivia, and pressuring people is more a townie behavior than a mafia behavior, even if it's not totally true for DP.

The main point here is that he calls them townies in the same post. That's just a scumslip. because this refers to Hapa and DP.
So he enters the thread by spreading suspicion on them but calling them townies when he votes finally MrZ. So either he has a townread on them, in this case the first suspicions and points against them are totally useless and unwarranted for, either he is a mafia player that knows their alignment.

Let's take a look at the rest of his filter to decide what is more likely.

Show nested quote +
On December 16 2012 01:06 JieXian wrote:
I was out the whole day man relax. You guys didn't understand my post.

I found what Dp and hapa was saying to be weird BUT I changed my mind as I kept on reading the thread (notice how those 2 points were quite early on)

Based on MrZentor's "uselessness" as you guys termed it, my meta read on him shows that he's acting differently but most of all, if he were scum, he'd have nothing else to do but sit and watch because dp and hapa were in the spotlight and not take any blame.

Meaning he doesn't need to participate and make/risk any reads. I mean take a look at everyone else that's posting, they are all reads (be it weak or strong or sheep reads)


He doesn't really comment on the fact that he called them townies. And now he said that they were saying weird things, and not scummy things.

And then just proceeds to tunnel MrZ, which has not given us so much to work from.

Right now, I think that JieXan has the most chances to flip scum. Hence my vote.

##Vote Jiexan


READ BOTH there is a distinct difference. Even though he is incorrect in the town post, there is a lot more certainty in the tone of the case. Town djo thinks his cases are right. Scum djo knows they are wrong.


This post regarding my meta is bad. He doesn't even point out what the differences he supposedely see i my play.
This shows that Kush has serious confirmation bias towards me, regardless of his alignment.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 07:54 GMT
#2292
On December 21 2012 06:21 kushm4sta wrote:
K im just going to make this a series and publish it in installments.
Djo's behavior gets scummier and scummier the closer to the lynch it is.

This is about d1 lynch:
Show nested quote +
On December 16 2012 13:46 Djodref wrote:
For the moment, I want to lynch JieXan today. I wouldn't mind lynching MrZ or Kush as well, but I'm less confident in these lynches.

If we cannot consolidate on them, we have to lynch a lurker/inactive player. Here are now my candidates to a policy lynch
  • Morbidius
  • Eywa
  • threesr
  • Mr. Cheesecake
I have another game running and so I'm not going to participate here so much anymore because I need to put a lot of effort in this other game right now.


So he is ok with lynching SEVEN people.
Basically everyone except DYH ofc.


Once again, Kush is totally discarding the context of this post. At that point in time, there was so much inactivity in this thread that both DYH AND Drazak were not on my lurker list. Things were like that at that time, drazak and DYH were active in comparison of the other players. And yeah, the point of bringing a policy lynch is to force the lurkers to post.
Also please note that I mention JieXian, Kush and Eywa as possible lynches for today, and I'm going to eat my hat if one of them is not scum.
Kush's point is not valid here and I really saw red when CC went "this is damning".
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 08:01 GMT
#2293
On December 21 2012 06:37 kushm4sta wrote:
So this is what djo says in the conclusion of his megacase against me:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2012 07:50 Djodref wrote:
Kush is most certainly scum

I still do prefer a Eywa lynch for tomorrow. Because, yeah, kush being kush, there is still a small chance for him to be town. 1% town chance for Eywa right now, 5% town chance for Kush.

GG guys,

Y u no concede ?


That SAME day he posts this later:
Show nested quote +
On December 18 2012 16:01 Djodref wrote:
meh..

Right now, I would lynch Kush over DYH. I really think he has more chances to flip scum than DYH.
I really need to see more from DYH and drazak though...

Notice the reluctance against lynching DYH here. "meh" lol. Also he was SOOO sure about Ewya but completely sheeps hapa's reversal on the matter.


Regarding his first quote here, it's from a post that I was supposed to bring up just before the start of D2 but I was unable to wake up to post it. So I posted it first during a middle of a shitfest then again from my phone because I thought it didn't get any attention. As I was from my phone, I couldn't update my read on Eywa.
And yes, Eywa was starting to make sense and contributing at that time, so I was sharing Hapa's views on him before I wrote the post that you quoted first. It's totally reasonable to change your mind, the problem here is the time span, but it's because it was a repost that I couldn't update. And, once again, this is something that Kush didn't care to mention at all. So, yeah, he is framing me here.
Djodref
Profile Joined September 2012
France3332 Posts
December 22 2012 08:04 GMT
#2294
Oops my bad, Kush was posting my first edition of the post. Anyway, he did forget to mention that I prepared this post for the deadline. I posted this without taking the time to catch up with the thread...
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