Hero Mini Mafia - Page 135

Hapahauli

United States9305 Posts

December 20 2012 00:32 GMT

#2681

Hehe yeah maybe. Dat kita shot man.

No I'll be checking the thread every so often - it's a take-home final that's due at 10am tomorrow morning, but I'll probably finish it in a few hours.

Would you support the idea of a video, or would that be too unsportsmanlike? Being mislynched as town is just about the last thing I want to have happen to me.

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 00:33 GMT

#2682

I think you'd be standing on iffy ground with a video.

Hapahauli

United States9305 Posts

December 20 2012 00:34 GMT

#2683

Fair enough. I'll just type some stuff up tomorrow then.

OK DAMNIT FOCUS TIME. See you in a couple of hours

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 00:57 GMT

#2684

@ Hapa

I'm very interested in your opinion on Vivax

grush57

Korea (South)2582 Posts

December 20 2012 00:57 GMT

#2685

DO A VIDEO :D

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 01:02 GMT

#2686

On December 20 2012 09:57 Djodref wrote:
@ Hapa

I'm very interested in your opinion on Vivax

is this a Hapa-specific question, Djo?

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:20 GMT

#2687

not really in fact

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:21 GMT

#2688

But yeah, I'd like to see if Hapa would be able to come up with a case against Vivax or not.
It's always more difficult to come up with cases as scum...

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 01:22 GMT

#2689

Vivax would seem to be an odd target. He's playing classic pants-on-head townie. Why would a town OR a scum hapa make a case on him?

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:25 GMT

#2690

Not scum Hapa, but town Hapa should be more paranoid, no ?

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 01:26 GMT

#2691

because Vivax is pushing him so hard you mean?

Z-BosoN

Brazil2590 Posts

December 20 2012 01:30 GMT

#2692

Hey guys,
I'm having a busy day. Gonna be checking in sometime tonight

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:34 GMT

#2693

yeah, and also because of other stuff, like this post

On December 11 2012 21:24 Vivax wrote:
I've read Adams filter.

So basically, the case on him seems to be built on "the change of tone in his post".
That post with changed tone dabears mentioned was written one day after the last ones, so it's likely that he's writing like that cause he's not heated up like the day before.

That day, he finished into an OMGUS fight with dabears, where they basically both vote for each other cause they argue about having to vote for the people you lean scum on.
And this is where the matter stinks.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=384953&currentpage=9#171

This is dabeers post about Adam. OH SHIT HE'S SUSPICIOUS CAUSE HE'S NOT VOTING FOR THRAWN.
Look at the post, look at the voting thread, look at the reactions.
Adam voted before debears upon being accused by him of not voting thrawn, meanwhile, dabears accused Adam of something he himself did.
Only clarity so far has expressed criticism of this case against Adam, now I will, too.

1.The case is shit
2.The case is shit
3.The case is shit

Being this a shit case accepted by many people, I think there's scum trying to sheep in it.

and also this post

On December 17 2012 02:38 Vivax wrote:
What's off about VE is that he defended Tunkeg against some pretty strong cases before the Adam lynch,namely by marv.

+ Show Spoiler +

On December 12 2012 03:45 VisceraEyes wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 11 2012 17:18 Tunkeg wrote:

On December 11 2012 16:59 wherebugsgo wrote:

On December 11 2012 16:06 Tunkeg wrote:
Lol WBG. In these games you are linking to, and others games like it, haven't you been the one complaining about me posting readposts like that? And also me posting "useless" questions?
And now you say the same play you labeled as bad and useless actually was scumhunting?

If you want me lynched for meta fine. But don't try to convince the thread you were a fan of my previos play.

just because I think something is dumb doesn't mean I think it's scummy.

I don't recall ever seriously calling you scum in those games. Not to mention, in AC I was scum. Nice fail response, scum.

On December 11 2012 16:00 VisceraEyes wrote:
I changed my mind. I think jaybrundage is scum.

On December 10 2012 10:29 jaybrundage wrote:

On December 10 2012 09:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
Whatever happened to people going "LOL" after a video like in the olden days?

VE gimme your thoughts on thrash

After his first post on thrawn in which he says he’s suspicious, he asks my opinion of the matter. I gave it, and that’s the last that was heard about it. Why did he want my input? He never referenced anything I said, or even acknowledged that I said it. I believe that he was just trying to get someone to agree with him regarding thrawn.

On December 10 2012 10:37 jaybrundage wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:33 thrawn2112 wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:28 Adam4167 wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:24 thrawn2112 wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:19 Adam4167 wrote:

On December 10 2012 09:57 thrawn2112 wrote:
any answer I could possibly give would just betray the actual purpose behind that post, making whatever I hoped to accomplish with that post no longer possible

I think you better try to explain what you were hoping to accomplish here.

On November 01 2012 08:25 thrawn2112 wrote:
If a miller claims D1 I don't even know what my thought process would be for deciding if I believe them or not, so I'm hesitatingly saying that I disagree with the idea

I find this post sits in a stark contrast to your current play, and this is from one of your recent town games (ACME).

What's the stark contrast? I don't see how these things are even related. Are you trying to suggest I'm scum? because you went about it pretty subtly.

Town you from ACME says that you disagree with the idea of millers claiming, and that you don't even know what your thought process would be for deciding if its real or not. Why are you trying to put everyone else in a similar position of confusion?

If I wanted to call you scum, I would have. What I want to know is why you are doing what you are doing.

That's not even the issue. How am I putting anyone in a compromising decision about whether or not to believe the claim when millers aren't even self aware? I don't understand what accusation you're trying to make, it makes no sense in the context of what the OP has to say about millers.

Dude... Its not whether we believe you. Your lying simple. Not a single persons believes your claim its about why are you lying. For no damn reason. And what purpose would town have to do that. It only makes sense from a mafia perspective

It really makes me uncomfortable when someone else speaks for me, and in this post jaybrundage is telling thrawn that I don’t believe his claim. I didn’t believe his claim, but because I thought his claim was a joke considering that the OP is explicit in the fact that millers are not self-aware. Therefor, I thought his claim was funny. But I certainly didn’t think he was LYING about his claim with any malicious intent. It doesn’t make sense for me to think that he thought that I would believe that claim based on what the OP says.

But jaybrundage is telling thrawn in no uncertain terms that I, VisceraEyes, think that he’s lying about his claim for no reason. And that’s not the case.

He then goes on to say that “...It only makes sense from a mafia perspective.” But that’s not true either is it? If thrawn is to be believed, he did it as a joke and to “spark discussion” and “ignite conversation” and such. Which, if he’s town, is a reasonable (if misguided) motivation.

On December 10 2012 11:03 jaybrundage wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:56 Djodref wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:44 debears wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:07 Djodref wrote:

On December 10 2012 10:01 debears wrote:

On December 10 2012 09:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
Whatever happened to people going "LOL" after a video like in the olden days?

Ikr

Anyways Djo the video was a response to the question, but a fun way of doing it

Have you not seen the Matrix? Did you not watch the video?

Yes, I guess you were saying that your vote was not real with the video. What was your motivation with your first vote on thrawn ?
What is your real take on thrawn fakeclaim ?

To get the voting rally started of course. Break the ice son

And it's strange. It would make no sense from a town perspective. His PM can't tell him he's a miller, because they aren't self aware.

So from

town - he was joking and he knew millers weren't self aware. Just did it for shits and giggles

scum - he claimed miller without checking first. I just don't see a scum being that reckless, but i'm sure if he's town he'll put in a productive day 1.

Or, he could've knew someone would interpret him as a joking townie if he's scum. and the wifomwifomwfiom

I'm the first to vote in the voting thread

So you see thrawn as a joking town or a reckless scum (less likely) or scum using WIFOM. Okay...
I personally can see a motivation for a town player to fakeclaim like this (serious motivation) that would make sense but I'm waiting for him to explain it first so I can check it matches my expectation or not.

At the exception of thrawn, do you have any comment to make on other players in this early game ?

Hey Djo can you do us all a favor and type in your vote here when you decide to vote for someone one in the voting thread. It would help out alot and i rather not have to check it till the end of the day.

The thing that I don’t like about this post isn’t even that it’s self defeating in the fact that Djo had, in fact, voted in the game thread...which shows that he’s not only not reading the thread, but is closely watching the voting thread...the opposite of what he’d have you believe in the post quoted above. It’s not that. Look at what Djo is saying. He’s saying he believes thrawn was joking too, and is asking someone about their thoughts on anyone else.

So he’s ignored my response regarding thrawn. Now he’s insidiously trying to discredit Djo (calling out his not-really-ninja vote in the voting thread) rather than respond to his post requesting discussion outside of thrawn. It all starts to stink like scum pushing an agenda to me. Especially considering, in spite of all of this...

On December 11 2012 04:43 jaybrundage wrote:

On December 11 2012 01:35 Clarity_nl wrote:

On December 11 2012 01:32 jaybrundage wrote:

On December 10 2012 23:52 Clarity_nl wrote:
Hey marv, you've explain why we shouldn't vote a bunch of people (thrawn, jay, palmar) but do you have any reasons we should vote a someone?

On December 10 2012 22:04 marvellosity wrote:
On jay, I'm ok on how he explained his 'slips'. My only worry with jay is that he comes across as overly... compliant?:

"Glad someone is reading my posts. I felt like i wasnt get any feedback from them."
"I do appreciate you giving your reasoning behind your claim. It helps me understand you a bit."

I don't particularly think much of it atm, was just weird when I was reading them. I would say it was indicative of the fact he didn't want to ruffle feathers, but he's not been afraid to put himself out there, so it isn't that.

His response reminds me of my own scum game. I showed no emotion that game, I just tried to remain logical and not to ruffle anyone's feathers, thinking that if I kept that up eventually people would stay away from me because I answered every question and reasoned away any doubt.

@ Jay

I read some of the stuff in your linked games, and yes you lyched town D1 but I never saw you say anything remotely close to "well I guess I should be more careful of early bandwagons". Not during any of the games and not in the pre-games or post-games either.

The thing is, you say you don't want to jump on an "easy bandwagon" this game, but you do. All you don't do is you haven't voted for thrawn, but he's the only person you've put pressure on. So why mention it? It's an easy way out.

It seems like common sense. If I get on easy bandwagons as town. Shouldn't i avoid em?

Im not you I don't find it necessary or needed to call people dumb or idiots like some players here do. It is it that unexpected to show some respect to people : /

I call people dumb or idiots?

So other than Thrawn, who is an easy bandwagon to you so should be avoided, who stands out as scummy?

I didnt mean you specifically but some people in TL mafia do. I actually am starting to lean more neutral on Thrawn. In my early mind set I just couldnt see someone misclaiming as a joke, or risk getting them selves lynched. Im a little worried about our lurkers.

And i would prefer to see more posts out of ZBoston. Specifically ZBoston what do you think about Claritys case on me and some people soft defending me.

Also MunkE has had like 3 posts since his /in and every single one of them is mostly about WBG statistic. Do we really have to nitpick over something like that. WBG was mostly trying to bait Palmar out. Lets hear your thoughts on some cases

On Vivax its odd. He seems really interested in going after Thrawns claim and saying that Ve defended it as a joke. When its not a joke. Even when thrawn said his self it was just a joke. That he stubbornly. Refused to explain to generate discussion. I think he is concentrating on thrawns little joke to much to the exclusion of everything else. I can see him being scum.

##Vote Vivax
(Because some people get SOOOOO antsy if you dont follow your argument with your vote.)

....HE TAKES IT ALL BACK ANYWAY! That's right, after the whole song and dance about being SOO FRUSTRATED with how he wasn't being paid attention to, and how his motivations only make sense from scum perspective, and in the face of people he has SPECIFICALLY asked their opinion of disagreeing with him, and EVERYTHING....he takes it all back anyway. Because thrawn said it was a joke and it was to generate discussion. Cool. Die.

##Unvote: Vivax
##Vote: jaybrundage

I'm going to go reread Vivax now and see if I still think he's scum. This changes things, because I had intended to spend this time writing a case on Vivax...but after reading the votecount and realizing that this jayb wagon was for real, I thought I'd check into him first. I'm glad I did, but now jaybrundage is voting for Vivax as well. We'll see what a reread brings.

This is a huge derail if I've ever seen one...

VE you have nothing to comment on Tunkeg or anyone other than jay?

On December 11 2012 16:24 jaybrundage wrote:
Hm so the "easy" bandwagon rolls. I finished watching palmars video ( YOU'RE video was educational to say the least) although YOUR in need of a better way to record video it got really pixely when you scrolled. ha ha suck my grammar.

In response to my badly thought out posts. I was trying to put pressure on thrawn to explain his reasoning. While my threats may not of been great I did eventually got thrawn to explain himself. Its odd people say that I was going back and forth with my view of thrawn. And honestly i didnt know what the hell he was. However i did think it was anti town. But enough of that. Tmw i will reread some of the cases and give my thoughts on which one i will support.

However if i do get lynched which seems likely i would ask people whats the next step when i flip town. But ill do my best to prevent that from happening.

I'm curious, did you capitalize "you're" and "your" to demonstrate how much you don't understand how to use the two? :p

+ Show Spoiler +

haha I just found that really funny for some reason

So you want me to do dumb things is that what you are saying. I know you treat this game like a schooldebate, where winning the arguement is more important than actually being right. And I know you like to twist and turn stuff to make your arguements look good. But that don't fly with me, stick to facts (like: Tunkeg is not playing exactly like he did in this and this game), don't try to strengthen your arguements with lies (Like you now saying you think I was scumhunting in those games, when you clearly stated how useless it was back then).

If you stick with what is true you should be able to lynch me if I were scum. If you start presenting lies and twisting words you might get me lynched even though I am town.

This post right here is why I'm not interested in lynching Tunkeg today. wherebugsgo is very opinionated about the play of others, and isn't a bit shy about calling out their play if he sees it as "bad" or "dumb". This post by Tunkeg seems genuinely confused by Bugs' assertion that his play this game is unlike his play in other, town games because Bugs has, in the past, called his play "bad" and "dumb". It seems scum would be more pissed off at the contradiction than confused - that scum would incredulously OMGUS such an assertion because it's clearly in contrast with what he had said at the time.

His reads post reads EXACTLY like the "town" example Bugs provided, aside from the whole giving up and "me flipping town will confirm Palmar as town" nonsense...which could be contrived or honest - but frankly I'm not in the business of figuring out which today because I don't think Tunkeg is a good lynch today.

Tunkeg's filter isn't spectacular, but it's way better than like, Bluelightz for example...or grush. I'd be more interested in a grush or Bluelightz lynch than Tunkeg. Certainly jaybrundage and Adam. I'm not touching Tunkeg with a 10 foot pole today.

And Bugs, THAT is a derail bish.

Now, onto Adam.

I'd have expected a scum VE to profit of the situation by helping a player with a good reputation like marv to push his lynch and take away attention from the Adam lynch.

Him trying to lynch jay isn't compatible with theories involving both of them in a scum team either.Additionally, most people were mostly disinterested in a jay lynch, and that stinks of him being scum.
Bluelightz would have been an easy lynch to push at many timings, yet VE expressed his disbelief of him being scum, in spite of how easy of a mislynch he'd have been.

+ Show Spoiler +

On December 13 2012 03:08 VisceraEyes wrote:
Going back and reading it again, I don't like it very much. It's strewn with true statements (scum care about how they look more than town, Bluelightz calls X strange instead of scummy, etc) but has too many suppositions for my liking. For instance, why is Blue calling something strange instead of scummy alignment indicative? Why can't it just be strange? Why does the fact that he found further reasoning for voting Adam NECESSARILY mean that he cares about looking like a sheep? Why can he not have just found further corroborating evidence and posted it?

To be honest, I'm not sure what I think about Bluelightz myself, but your case isn't convincing me of much - only that Bluelightz is playing, as marv said, like Bluelightz. Sorry I didn't respond sooner, but work, lynch, sleep, etc. I liked it before the flip - not so much after the flip. Especially considering Adam put Blue as one of his "probable scum". Of the three people I mentioned at the top of this post, I think Blue is the least likely to flip scum. Not saying much considering I think jay and Bugs have VERY HIGH chances of flipping scum, but Blue's the least likely in my opinion.

Then the case about a clarity scum vigi, initially I didn't believe it either, but it was actually possible.

I'm not lynching VE today.
That said, I suggest that Djo and others should at least elaborate my points.

That leaves me with following targets:
Jay or BL today.
Marv maybe some other day.

and this post

On December 18 2012 01:36 Vivax wrote:
Essentially, no one said why the fuck we are lynching VE, so I think I'd provide a nice summary of his play.

He suspected Adam, confirmed clarity, made a case on me, made a case on jay, defended Tunkeg(!), voted Adam, shouted at Djo for the counterbandwagon, but was willing to switch to jay over Adam.
Adam dies.

Night:
I found a lie/mistake in his posts:

Show nested quote +

If I didn't overlook anything, he NEVER cared about bugs. He first mentions him when he agrees with Adams reads, and that's what he has to say about him:

Show nested quote +

And after Adam flipped scum, VE said that he has suspected Bugs before the flip. This at a timing where everybody became interested in him.
This might quite be a slip.

Then he defended BL against claritys case, posted some stuff against Bugs before he got lynched, and comes back 14 hours later to post a case against clarity with the scumvigi theory.
AND he overlooked that Marv got roleblocked that night + WBGs crumb:

Show nested quote +

8 hours later, he expresses his willingness to sheep Palmar and to lynch Tunkeg, Djo and Clarity.
However, he didn't care about Djo during the night when Bugs was being attacked, and he didn't care about the interactions of Tunkeg with bugs before trying to convince us of a scum vigi clarity. But these were the reasons he gave us for suspecting the two.

Out of nothing he writes a case against Z-Boson after that joke-slip he pointed out, expresses again doubts about Tunkeg being scum, then starts writing about jay and BL rubbing him wrong.

Overall, quite a solid lynch for today. The only townie things I could see would be his defence of Tunkeg and him telling Djo to stop starting a counterwagon.

Like, I wondered if he was trying to get town cred with the last post. I've made an extensive case against VE before and also I don't see why would be the town motivation for this post.

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 01:40 GMT

#2694

Because I'm lazy and I remembered I'd said it months ago somehow:

On July 14 2012 05:48 marvellosity wrote:
From what I know of town Vivax: makes stupid connection cases, bad logical leaps, active and try hard

From what I know of scum Vivax: lurky and summarises a lot of stuff. yes it's only one game that's what i got

I'm seeing more of scenario 1 at the moment

Vivax has done questionable things, but if he hadn't I'd ironically think he'd probably be scum. He's clearly pouring effort into this game even though it's horrendously unfocused, and there are many posts where he shows he's attentively read the thread or what people have said, mixed in with posts where it seems he hasn't read the thread at all.

I don't see much point talking about Vivax when he's pretty clearly town.

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:41 GMT

#2695

And also because of the fact that Vivax is quite disruptive...
I mean, I have a town read on Vivax right now, but there is still a slight possibility for him to be scum...
Same with Z-Bo, he has been pretty townie this game, but his play is a little too 'clean', and he does fly under the radar.

But this also speaks again a town Hapa.
In Hapa shoes, I would be much more paranoid than he is. Hapa is basically saying that we have to lynch BL and that's going to be GG...

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:47 GMT

#2696

On December 20 2012 10:40 marvellosity wrote:
Because I'm lazy and I remembered I'd said it months ago somehow:

Show nested quote +

Honestly, I rarely go read players other games...
I know it's really more likely for him to be town than scum. But, yeah, discussing a little about it doesn't really hurt. I don't want us to lose this game because we got lazy at the end.

Jay being totally inactive right now is a good corroboration fact for him to be scum, so I'm really confident in his lynch. But I'm not that confident that we are going to win this game if you mindlessly lynch Hapa and BL.

Djodref

France3332 Posts

December 20 2012 01:48 GMT

#2697

On December 20 2012 10:26 marvellosity wrote:
because Vivax is pushing him so hard you mean?

In fact, I like this part ^^

marvellosity

United Kingdom36156 Posts

December 20 2012 01:49 GMT

#2698

I agree that we shouldn't mindlessly lynch anyone. I'm not sure why town has been quiet today in particular, but generally we've had a very active town and I don't think we're prone to lynching without being quite sure. 2 out of 3 scum lynches in the first 3 days is testament to that.

thrawn2112

United States6918 Posts

December 20 2012 02:11 GMT

#2699

i'll say more stuff if yall want me to but idk what more there is to say. the game is pretty boring atm

certain things djo said about ve and they way djo posted lately makes me think there's no way he's scum. i cant really remember disagreeing with marv about anything in a long time. I had doubts about bl still but they were assuaged by what he's posted recently. grush is still somewhat of a question mark but tbh he's actually been pushing town objectives with almost all of his posts. i've had a town read on vivax for a long time but i don;t really spend too much time reading his posts.

hapa's spent most of his time defending himself and i dont like his accusation of bl. when he starts talking about his actual reads and stuff his posts get way shorter. i'm interpreting what jay is doing right now as trolling.

there is a good amount of associative evidence between the two.

+ Show Spoiler [associative case] +

hapa starts off the day considering both jay and ve for the lynch. he backs down at the claim then no longer wants to lynch jay. jay seemed willing to stop the ve lynch at all costs with the execption of voting for hapa. I pressed both of them on this during the lynch and if you want me to go through and make a formal post about it with quotes and everything I will.

grush57

Korea (South)2582 Posts

December 20 2012 02:46 GMT

#2700

Alright I'm gonna throw up a vote for jay for now.
##Vote: Jaybrundage

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