EPTChrono Trigger Mafia - Page 35
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On November 29 2012 00:44 Acrofales wrote: Hrmmm. What was your town read of GK based on at this point? In fact, explain Djodref as well. So far, you have managed to say you didn't have a town read on Oats (which I agreed with at the time, so I didn't think too much into it, but suspicious minds would say you were trying to manipulate town off the party)... and you didn't trust Syllo, without any further explanation. You then throw a seemingly random town read on GK out there. That is what I meant with trust, btw. Your usual meta is to be aggressive and angry at everybody. Your friendliness towards GK feels strange. This is how you justify it a couple of hours later: I feel I need something more to justify this weak-ass vote on a weak-ass candidate. I am not understanding your thought process this game, which is somewhat unusual, because you're usually far more transparent. Then comes the whole Sandroba ordeal. There are two ways of reading this: a townie who think Sandroba might be scum, but isn't sure... and scum waiting for Sandro to give him any reasonable opportunity to not bus his scumbuddy. Not much more to say on this issue. However, this is interesting: Post in question: This was one of the posts that set alarm bells off in my mind (and I believe some other players' minds too). I am thus completely and utterly confused: why did this give you a town read on him? How the hell do you go from "Chronicler provides a bad excuse to drop his plan and sheep the majority" to "town read"? And here we have some more buttfuck terrible reasoning: TC voted for Syllo when Syllo was building momentum and everybody else was losing it. You are a good player. You KNOW there would be scum on a wagon like that. Why is TC's complete throwaway reason a town tell? There's some other incongruencies: Pretty much the first mention of Kitaman in the game. While I don't think Kita's case was particularly strong and risk is justified in ridiculing it, I am surprised about him asserting that Kita is "scummy". This feels a lot like an OMGUS to just discredit the case off the bat. A case being wrong/bad doesn't make the poster scummy, it makes him wrong/bad. We never actually get to know why Kita was "scummy". What had Kita done at the time? In fact, for someone claiming a scum read on Kita, there is remarkably little interaction between the two. There is no explanation of the read, no attempt to learn more about Kita, nothing. Risk, why did you think Kita was scum? Do you still think so? Why? Further questions: Why did you want to be party leader on D3? I understand the "party was bad" reasoning, but regardless of alignment, you have enough brains to know you had 0 town cred and would never ever get elected in a million years. The decision to try to run just seems really really strange. I can think of a "desperate scum" motivation though. And given that scum was in a pretty bad shape after D1 and D2, desperation is a decent guess of the scum state of mind at that point. Your reason for not wanting to take Dieno along sounds incredibly forced. You honestly expect us to believe you thought that Dieno's HP would play a bigger role than the fact that he is about as close to confirmed town as we can get without flips? I know you have already been asked this by someone (Djodref I believe), but your answers were thoroughly unsatisfactory. Try again. I will compile this post in bite-size gulps for you: 1. Why did you have a town read on GK and Djodref during d1? 2. Please explain how the post you linked from TC gave you a town read on him? 3. Are you maintaining that Kita posting a trolly campaign made him scum in your mind? 4. Why did you want to be party leader D3? Why did you think this would be constructive? However, this was rather a long time ago. Since then I have gotten more suspicious. Firstly, when I claim 3P he starts really wanting to lynch me, up to the point of misrepresenting my words just to make me look scummy: What I said:+ Show Spoiler [backup votes] + On November 30 2012 02:15 Acrofales wrote: What happens if the elected party leader is killed before the event? Seems to me we probably need a backup. I suggest Keirathi as first choice (with preferred group the D1 party) and Clarity as second. Best to even include a 3rd (Syllo or Oats?) just to ensure Toad's single vote does not cause havoc. Also, I won't be switching to GK until I've read his filter (or probably after); I have started a couple of times, but it is long and makes heavy use of run-on sentences like this one, which means that it is really not easy to read. In any case, I think I prefer a risk.nuke lynch. He is being extremely uncooperative. Combine that with something that sounds like a bogus roleclaim and a really dodgy policy for his masonQT selection. A tent with a crystal ball makes me think of the prophet. Not sure he has a tent, but he is a fortune teller. Paraphrased in the context of D5: I want risk.nuke as a backup lynch in case there is some system that makes Toad unlynchable. What risk claims I said: On November 30 2012 02:18 risk.nuke wrote: Acro wants to kill me over confirmed scum. I see, you claimed to be pro-town third party right? What happened: risk dropped out of the thread and I had said what I had to say. I had no intention of lynching him over Toad and he was not being considered for a party in cycle 6. What risk claims happened: On November 30 2012 20:59 risk.nuke wrote: Very interesting that Prom and Acro attacked me hard when syllogism led them to believe he thought I was scum and dropped it like a stone when he stated he was merely suspicious of me. This can obviously be explained as paranoid townie behaviour who is heavily OMGUSing. However, paranoid OMGUSing is generally considered a scumtell. Note the complete lack of scumhunting. He doesn't even bother to call me (or Promethelax) scum. He just throws the suspicion out there in the hope that it sticks. The meta-read. Cycle 1: risk is active and I saw very little suspicious in his behaviour. Cycle 2 his reasoning for voting Sandro is rather strange, he gets called out for it and it still sounds strange. However, I don't consider this indicative of alignment, because it is not really indicative of bussing either. Cycle 3 risk's activity drops off. Possible explanation: Sandro dead, Toad caught, VE and SnB inactive. If there are 5 scum and risk is the 5th, I can totally get into the mindset of him feeling defeated and no longer interested in the game. In fact, the "feeling defeated and no longer interested in the game" was why his activity dropped off as an SK in Acme mafia. Now on to his other games. Here is bureaucracy, when called out why he was doing jack shit that game: On July 20 2012 02:37 risk.nuke wrote: lol, I can't believe you believe in your post. But back to that in a second. Well, why I'm doing jack shit right now. I know kurumi is scum and thanks to RoL beeing dumb he's still alive. And that is like having a pointy rock in my shoe. It's hard to motivate myself to focus on anyone else before it's gone. And it may be day 2 but we haven't had a lynch yet. So it's only day 2 by name. We do not have a lynch to look at for information. <snip> The next few days he does nothing, with this justification: On July 25 2012 07:19 risk.nuke wrote: What do you mean I've just been floating under the radar. I've not been playing irc mafia and got 20+page filter. I'm also am aware that I haven't really made cases but not because of lack of wanting to. I just haven't been able to motivate myself into doing it when people are already voicing their suspicion against my targets. If I don't need to convince them i don't need to make a case. And not making cases is not the same as not having reads. And he finally gets lynched. In the meantime he did NO scumhunting of his own and simply followed the flock of townies like a good little sheep. Now on to Liquid City: We get a similar justification for his lurk On October 08 2012 09:06 risk.nuke wrote: You say lurking but I atleast am more simmilar to afk. I'm on a break because nothing is happening in this game, the last 40 pages are useless and might well not have existed because too many are just waiting for it to come to an end. we have our lynch and there isn't anything else to it. Too me personally I can't be bothered to make a case for the lynch 3 days from now, I can't motivate myself for that. Not to mention that after the nightflips you will have better information hence making time spent scumhunting post nightflips more effective then before the flip. This is how I feel and that is all to it. And you might have been forced to be away and unable to scumhunt but you're here now and I'm telling you your case does not impress me the slightest. If this is the best you'll give us I'll lynch you because I know you can do alot better then those sorry lines for scumhunting. However, he comes back immediately with some scumhunting of his own and has OPINIONS about people. After excusing himself for lurking, he posts 4 pages of filter with actual content. He pushes people. He may have been wrong about Mattchew, but he was hard on his case for a little while. It was clear whom risk thought was scum. He also made his opinion of people killing the cop at what was apparently mylo (?) abundantly clear. This game: does anybody even know who risk.nuke has a scumread on? Anybody? Someone risk called scum in the last 5 days or so? I sure as hell couldn't find it in his filter. He dropped into the thread to vote for SnB and then buggered off again. How is this in any way similar to his town meta, where, even if he is not very active, he pushes his reads? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 03:50 austinmcc wrote: So the point was that you, who are almost certainly lying about AT LEAST one aspect of your role, could claim what you did, some/most of which you'd already claimed in thread. What is it you're trying to say? I have a hard time figuring out what you're accusing me of here. PS. I am not lying. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 04:35 austinmcc wrote: I'm trying to figure out what part of your stuff this game I don't believe. I know some of it is likely true, other bits false. Haven't checked Drazerk and Kita's full filters yet after looking through yours, but will work on that this evening. Yeah, I'm not accusing you of anything specific there, because...I don't know what to accuse you of yet. But you make it out like you did town this big favor by claiming where you'd used your actions so "you guys" can "solve the game." When in all likelihood, that's crap. A lot/all(?) your actions were in thread already, so you weren't handing down divine information that nobody knew. And you refuse to answer questions that town wants answered. I don't think anyone is buying what you're selling, but I don't like that you're trying to sell it anyway. 3 of the 7 actions I performed were in the thread. I admit that 3 of my other actions had no impact on the game, but the damage + jail on Toad needed claiming if there is any hope of scumhunting by finding incongruous actions. I fail to see why claiming my rolename and secondary wincon help town at all. You suspect me of lying anyway. Why will claiming magically confirm me as town-friendly? I have said I am town-friendly. I have acted town-friendly. Me talking about me helps absolutely nobody catch scummers. So read my filter by all means, conclude that me being on a scumteam with Toad and SnB would be mindbogglingly stupid. Conclude that me claiming to not want to be on a party as scum would be mindbogglingly stupid. Keep your suspicions about my ulterior motives (I don't see how my claiming would help you with those anyway), but get to scumhunting. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 03:46 austinmcc wrote: I call it counterattack because that's basically what it does, but it doesn't require the same cycle, and it's not actually "Counterattack". If I use that ability, it just looks at the last point at which I was dealt damage, and then splits my damage between all players who dealt me damage at that point. Until I'm damaged otherwise, you'd be eating the full 300 if you're being truthful about being the sole source of damage on me that night, as I haven't been hit since then. So.. austin has a shitload of KP with pretty much no condition except era? How does this match up with other town claimed abilities: 1. H1 can do less damage per shot and only if he hits himself first. 2. GK can do half the damage per shot and it takes 3 days to charge. 3. Hapa can do lots of damage (more than Austin), but is more likely to hit townies with most of it, even if his initial shot hits scum. 4. Adam has to play NK roulette in order to get a shot which does LESS damage. Or even scum claimed abilities: 1. Sandro can do 200 damage, spread out over 4 days. 2. SnB can hit for 250 damage, once per player per game and only if they are dumb enough to roleclaim. 3. Toad can do 100 damage per night (probably most similar in total amount of damage) There are only two abilities that can even approach that amount of damage: Drazerk's claimed EMP, which is almost certainly a lie and definitely a lie in how much damage it does. Kush's 1-shot dayvig. However, this is balanced by being 1-shot and having a risk of suiciding (although only if you use it as a complete derp like he did). I am having a hard time wrapping my head around giving town this amount of KP, which seems to top what scum can do. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On November 21 2012 14:10 Z-BosoN wrote: @Djodref I've never played with sandroba nor am I familiar with his meta. There are a lot of people here that are though (lots of vets), so I'm taking an overall town perspective. This is an assumption of course, but I think it's a fair one. Is this inline with Zbo's reasoning as town? He is willing to vote Sandro blindly on the assertion that "there are people who can figure Sandro out". Anybody familiar enough with Zbo's meta to tell me whether this is normal? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 05:50 syllogism wrote: I mean he claims using shield n2 on keirathi even though Dienosore took 445 damage n1 Also, Keirathi took 75 damage in cycle 4, same as GK and I, which I assume is linked to being in a failed party. Of course, this evidence is inconclusive, because we don't know whether he took damage cycle 2 or 3 that was blocked by the shield. However, it'd have to be exactly 75 damage to show up as it did. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
There are some posts that just don't sit right with me, but it could be the problem of English as a second language. His vote for Sandro D1 is not really indicative of alignment. His reasoning for the vote might be, but depends on meta. He never hopped off, but scum could easily have hopped off: Sandro wasn't getting elected. His vote for Toad on D2 is also not indicative of alignment. He spends most of the day tunneling TC and never leaves off his scum read, however it was clear that TC was not going to be lynched. Choices were basically Sandro and Toad and a non-Sandro vote is consistent with his D1 behaviour. After the lynch he makes a couple of posts accusing various people of being scum, but his activity drops off and he never follows up with actions. I will have to look at VE and SnB's filters to see if there's any associative tells, but Zbo's filter doesn't give me much to work with. At the moment I am liking the test. Austin healing H1 seems like a pretty good idea. H1 is an unlikely target for other protection and I think he's probably town. Lets see if he can get that heal. Back to deciding between CJ and risk which one is worse. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 06:35 Hopeless1der wrote: They don't as far as my role pm, but I'm currently VT and my flavor says my keg is empty. Being from the middle ages, I figure its the best place to get a refill. Alternatively my HP is too low. By my count I still have a fully charges shot left (and 1 HP remaining) but I'm not allowed to hit myself to unlock it and I don't know why. Lol. I guess saving H1 might not be a good idea. Case 1: austin is town. He heals H1. Scum nails H1 with 151+ damage. H1 dies and we know nothing. Case 2: austin is scum. He nails H1 with any damage at all. H1 dies and we know nothing. Test result: inconclusive. Only advantage is keeping scum KP off people like Syllo. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On November 22 2012 07:54 strongandbig wrote: fuck i was really happy that i was gonna get to play a themed game without drazerk in it but no I knew there was something bothering me about scum SnB+Drazerk. Why would SnB blow his scumbuddy's cover? I guess it's possible Drazerk was already planning on claiming and said so in the QT, so SnB just got in on the action. But it doesn't feel like that. It feels like this: On November 22 2012 08:09 strongandbig wrote: yeah I got to your post a couple minutes after I posted that is genuine. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
He does not mention Zbo/austin or risk.nuke at all. | ||
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Acrofales
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On December 06 2012 07:03 Hopeless1der wrote: @Acro Given that I have more than 1 HP (i.e. a little more difficult to kill), are you still against me getting the potential heal from austin? I'll claim my current HP before the deadline if it helps. If you feel scum would have to put significant effort into killing you, then I think you're a good target for healing by austin. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 07:15 CaveJohnson wrote: <snip> 12,000 BC (While dangerous we probably need to go there to weaken Lavos and actually win the game and I can guarantee a success with a Chipotle ham sandwhich with pancakes as bread drizzled with syrup) This sounds disgusting, but made me giggle. Does this depend on you being in the party? If so, it's not going to happen. Also, are you targetable this cycle? I want to mason chat you. You're bound to be more fun than anybody else here and the tactical value of my mason chat is near 0, so I might as well waste it on enabling skype convos with you WITHOUT Hassy. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
N1 - shoot 50 damage at CJ, could not RB 600AD N2 - RB risk, no damage. 1000 AD N3 - RB toad AND 50 damgae at CJ Future N4 - RB toad AND 50 damage at CJ EoT N5 - RB CJ, no damage Prehistory N6 - RB VE, no damage 600AD N7 - RB CJ, no damage Antiquity I can see no pattern based on era. Also no pattern based on "can only roleblock whom he damaged". Mind explaining a bit more? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
The claims: 1. Drazerk claims "Levitation", making him untargettable. He does not claim roleblocked. 2. Acro claims using an ability on Drazerk and being told it could not activate on Drazerk. 3. Kita claims he roleblocked Drazerk and it went through. Claims 1 and 2 cohere. Claim 3 cannot be true if these are true. Assume claim 3 is true, then there are two possibilities: 1. Levitation was activated in a previous cycle. However, then Drazerk would be untargettable and thus unable to be roleblocked. Direct contradiction with claim 3. Claim 1 must be false. However, if claim 1 is false, then claim 2 is false as well. 2. Drazerk was roleblocked and unable to cast Levitation. However, then he would've been notified of the roleblock and I would have been able to target him. Therefore claims 1 and 2 are false. While it is normal for me to expect Drazerk to be lying, the mod tells the truth. Greymist told me my action failed. He did not say I was roleblocked, just that my action failed. Drazerk being untargettable would be a pretty good explanation of that. However, I am not clear on how VE and Kita could be a scumteam together. There are really only two (outside) possibilities I can think of: 1. The scumteam decided really early on that using BioSC's abilities was not really worth it on the first 2 nights (after which they were never used again), and they fakeclaimed in order to distance VE and Kita from each other. This seems absurd. 2. BioSC targeted Dienosore, who used Slurp Slash on Kita. The random action that got redirected was the guessing game. Either this happened 2 nights in a row, or on N2 VE didn't send in an action and Kita took advantage of it to strengthen the distancing. While I can imagine BioSC targeting Dieno with it, I see no indication in Dieno's filter of him even considering Kita as a target for his shot. Additionally, Kita didn't claim the 50 damage. Which makes me wonder: why is Kita lying about his night actions? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 17:59 Promethelax wrote: that is to say only if the town is comfortable with me, after you act in me, as a party member. It is something to debate, which we need. You're doing that thing where you believe Drazerk. Rule 1 of playing with Drazerk. Unless he is modconfirmed town, mistrust everything he says. If he is modconfirmed town, only mistrust half. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17830 Posts
On December 06 2012 22:09 kitaman27 wrote: lol If I didn't target Cave with my roleblock, who did I target? So I was the strongest opponent to a scum sandroba election, I roleblocked a scum toad twice, I got targeted by VE's abilities, I roleblocked a scum VE, I mentioned multiple times that I thought VE was scum, I caught S&B in his fake claim, and I've been targeting Cave (and hopeless once n2) with my night hits. Clearly my strategy is to bus my entire team, shoot the troll, and hope Lavos can take out the 15+ remaining townies. @syllo, does a roleclaim benefit us right now? I'm clearly not scum, only the third party player is suspicious of me, and revealing how my role works provides the mafia team with extra information. Like I said before, I'd be willing to claim if Acro wants to come clean. At least that benefits town information wise. If you had read my post you would also have seen that I don't think you're scum. Doesn't mean I don't think you're lying. As for claiming, I don't know why you're trying to connect my claiming my identity to you claiming how your ability works. I don't really care about having the knowledge out there. I care about resolving things that don't make sense. Your claiming helps with the second part. My claiming anything further is only putting information in the thread for the sake of sating your curiosity. As for whom you roleblocked? Maybe you didn't roleblock anybody. You've only roleblocked 2 people who have claimed and not been counterclaimed. While you seem to have a roleblock, I am starting to doubt you have used it every night since N1. Did you breadcrumb your roleblocks before they happened? Because claiming roleblocks on scum posthumously is a pretty easy thing to do. I think you're probably 3P and your wincon may or may not be helpful to town. My guess is that it's not. However, it's probably not worth lynching you for, with risk.nuke pretty much claiming scum with his absence. @Syllo: you have not roleblocked someone who was untargettable and had your action fizzle. | ||
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