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Toad, if this is true, why did you bring up this game as a proof of your "ability to read town"? Is this really the game you think your reads were best? I know it can happen. HRM is probably the game I'd label with my best reads despite completely missing Drazerk. Just interested in why you would pick this game.
+ Show Spoiler [Toad vs. Marvel] +On November 22 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2012 01:14 Acrofales wrote:On November 22 2012 00:36 Oatsmaster wrote:kush makes me want to shout at him in every single post... Ok for now, I think the party leader should be toadesstern because He started off his post with a scumread, which shows effort in reading the thread instead of mindlessly posting without actually analysing anything like almost every player so far. His posts look really sincere and his logic is spot on On November 21 2012 17:13 Toadesstern wrote:
Oh and I forgot: Yeah we need to find someone to send d1 and that's all nice and fine but I don't think it's a good way to keep the talk all focused on only that.
Faking townreads as mafias is incredibly easy. Faking mafiareads as mafia is something that takes effort. If we're only going to talk about who we're going to send d1 we're giving mafia an incredibly easy time skating by.
I know it feels counterintuitive as clearly the shortterm "goal" is to send a good guy d1 but I think we should try and balance those issues out. After all, the goal in the longrun is to figure people out and we won't be able to do that by playing nice all day long. His posts look really hard to fake for scum and because of his reputation as being imba, I am voting Toadesstern ##Vote: Toadsstern You clearly don't know toad at all. You don't even know toad's reputation. 1. Toad is notoriously hard to read. He posts giant walls of text that ramble on as either alignment and gets into hissyfits with whoever he feels like (most notoriously bugs and VE) as either alignment. 2. If he is imba, he is imba as scum, not so much as town. Personal opinion here, but I haven't seen toad make the difference as town. Unlike some other players in this game. Now on to the beef of your post: why exactly do you feel his posts are hard to fake as scum? What specific quality makes you lean town on him? So far I am seeing you park your vote in a similar manner to Keirathi, for a similar reason. Last time I had to gather people I was some sort of mason who get's to invite people each and every night to join his QT resulting in the QT growing in number every cycle and having an incredibly powerfull town-circle. I think I picked something like 5 townies straight without a problem at all, including people like WBG who are notoriously hard to read according to most people here. The only mistake I made was when I gambled in lategame as we had 2 Kenpachi-like people (real Kenpachi and someone like Kenpachi) who didn't play the game while not being able to get a read on Marv as well. I picked Marv because I figured that if neither of those 2 Kenpachis is mafia we've lost anyways because one of them will get lynched at some point and it already was lylo. So yeah I think I'm pretty decent when it comes to that as well. I agree I'm by no way the best scumhunter around and I'm mostly working by process of elimination but that's because I trust in my townreads so heavily and they're never wrong. So yeah I think I'm the right guy for the job. On November 24 2012 23:19 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 23:14 Toadesstern wrote:On November 24 2012 23:03 marvellosity wrote:
Toad, it's funny how you've called me scum like 50 times, but the only explanation you've given at all is that me/my posting seems "off".
Sincerely,
Someone-not-terrible. I wouldn't say 50 times. And no the explanation I've given is that you're usually better than what you're showing. I really disliked your d1 performance. I really disliked the points you were pointing out d1, like when I was voting Kita and you kept on harping about it like you're some guy in his 2nd game who never had a game with me. I really dislike the fact that you're not so much involved early on, like you did in whatever-the-name-was-the-one-were-I-was-mason and turned out to be mafia as well. Can't say much about your d2 performace right now because again, I'm still catching up. I didn't want to go there, because it didn't seem worth it, but you've been straight out lying about LV all game. Mainly to make yourself look better. You excuse yourself in LV for inviting me into your mason chat as either "you were trolling" or there were 2 kenpachi-like people left to invite. This is simple false. You invited me BEFORE confirmed town EchelonTee, because I appeared so town to you, and BEFORE extremely townie newbie austinmcc. You invited me because your read on me was wrong and you thought it was the useful thing to do. Given I replaced in night 1 LV, and pushed a scum straight away who got modkilled, I was viewed as town from very early and that remained the case throughout the game. So saying "I wasn't so much involved early on" is once again a flat out lie. Just to dig the boot in, mafia (me/wiggles) left you alive that game, despite you were confirmed town, for many many cycles because you were so completely and utterly useless. Stop referring to games where you've managed to talk yourself into having a really rosy view of the outcome when in reality your read on me was 100% wrong and you got completely outplayed, and left alive by scum for being an irrelevance. And stop lying about it now. I giggled.
If you misrepresented your ability to read people, I am confused why you wanted to be party leader.
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On November 22 2012 03:10 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2012 03:04 Acrofales wrote:On November 22 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote:On November 22 2012 01:14 Acrofales wrote:On November 22 2012 00:36 Oatsmaster wrote:kush makes me want to shout at him in every single post... Ok for now, I think the party leader should be toadesstern because He started off his post with a scumread, which shows effort in reading the thread instead of mindlessly posting without actually analysing anything like almost every player so far. His posts look really sincere and his logic is spot on On November 21 2012 17:13 Toadesstern wrote:
Oh and I forgot: Yeah we need to find someone to send d1 and that's all nice and fine but I don't think it's a good way to keep the talk all focused on only that.
Faking townreads as mafias is incredibly easy. Faking mafiareads as mafia is something that takes effort. If we're only going to talk about who we're going to send d1 we're giving mafia an incredibly easy time skating by.
I know it feels counterintuitive as clearly the shortterm "goal" is to send a good guy d1 but I think we should try and balance those issues out. After all, the goal in the longrun is to figure people out and we won't be able to do that by playing nice all day long. His posts look really hard to fake for scum and because of his reputation as being imba, I am voting Toadesstern ##Vote: Toadsstern You clearly don't know toad at all. You don't even know toad's reputation. 1. Toad is notoriously hard to read. He posts giant walls of text that ramble on as either alignment and gets into hissyfits with whoever he feels like (most notoriously bugs and VE) as either alignment. 2. If he is imba, he is imba as scum, not so much as town. Personal opinion here, but I haven't seen toad make the difference as town. Unlike some other players in this game. Now on to the beef of your post: why exactly do you feel his posts are hard to fake as scum? What specific quality makes you lean town on him? So far I am seeing you park your vote in a similar manner to Keirathi, for a similar reason. Last time I had to gather people I was some sort of mason who get's to invite people each and every night to join his QT resulting in the QT growing in number every cycle and having an incredibly powerfull town-circle. I think I picked something like 5 townies straight without a problem at all, including people like WBG who are notoriously hard to read according to most people here. The only mistake I made was when I gambled in lategame as we had 2 Kenpachi-like people (real Kenpachi and someone like Kenpachi) who didn't play the game while not being able to get a read on Marv as well. I picked Marv because I figured that if neither of those 2 Kenpachis is mafia we've lost anyways because one of them will get lynched at some point and it already was lylo. So yeah I think I'm pretty decent when it comes to that as well. I agree I'm by no way the best scumhunter around and I'm mostly working by process of elimination but that's because I trust in my townreads so heavily and they're never wrong. So yeah I think I'm the right guy for the job. Not saying you're not. Just that I have reservations voting for you, and correcting the jubjubs as to your reputation. I've seen you play good as town. I've seen you play better as scum. I saw you are running and I like that. What makes you a better candidate than syllo or sandro? I don't think anyone in here can claim to be better than Syllo or sandro when it comes to reads if that's what you're asking. However unlike Syllo and Sandro I'm someone who's pretty talkactive and I will get people talking about reads. Syllo and Sandro both tend to be pretty lazy threadwise and I don't think that that's something we want for someone who's running for the d1 spot.
I got a bit sidetracked by Marv contesting Toad's play, but we're back on it. Toad can come up with no reason why he should run for party leader, so invents that "he will be active and get people to talk". I ask you, what does that have to do with being the party leader? About as much as Syllo being vegetarian, that's what.
So why does Toad want to be the party leader? Why? Because he's scum, of course.
Toad jumps into the thread with a big splash. Big talk about how he's going to scumhunt and a blurb on how Keirathi is scum for pretty much no reason at all. Now, lets look for the actual scumhunting:
.
.
.
Yeah, that was it. Lets use Toad's own words to emphasize this:
On November 21 2012 18:11 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2012 18:05 Keirathi wrote:On November 21 2012 17:51 Toadesstern wrote:On November 21 2012 17:43 Keirathi wrote:On November 21 2012 17:31 Toadesstern wrote:On November 21 2012 17:27 Keirathi wrote:On November 21 2012 17:19 Toadesstern wrote:On November 21 2012 17:17 Keirathi wrote:On November 21 2012 17:09 Toadesstern wrote:
This Keirathi guy is mafia.
Not because of what he's saying but because of what he's failing to provide: Reasoning as to why he'd post what he did so far.
There's simply no reason to get out here and tell people he's planning to heavily focus on reading one guy. Best case scenario is him being pointless, worst case scenario is him trying to look good by providing "something" while actually being pointless. I'd say we've got someone who's trying to get a cheap backdoor exit early on.
Really? I'm scum because the people I would be most willing to vote as leader are the people I'm most familiar with? Don't be ridiculous. no you're scum for pointing that out. That's a important difference. No, you're being dumb. I've played lots of games with marv, iamperfection, S&B, risk.nuke, Z-BosoN, etc. I 100% trust my ability to read them better than I trust my ability to read you or syllo or sandro, whom I've never played with. When it comes down to time for me to vote, I'm going to think "Ok, sandro might be town, and he's getting a lot of votes. But, I'm much more sure that marv is town because I'm way more familiar with how he plays. It makes sense for me to vote him." Plain and simple. If that makes me scum, then tough titties. And yet you still haven't understood what I'm saying. I'm not saying your reasoning is stupid. If you feel that way fine although I'd hope that you have more than just one guy you feel comfortable to read... I mean you just mentioned a bunch of people, yet you only mentioned Marv earlier, didn't you? The issue is that you get in here telling us about that. You're right, I guess I don't understand. How is explaining how I plan to use my vote scummy? As far as mostly talking about reading marv (at one point, I did mention that there were other people I was comfortable reading if I don't feel like marv should be elected party leader), its because even though I feel like I have a grasp on how to read them, I don't think they'll be likely party leader candidates. No matter how strong of a town read I have on, say, iamperfection, its just pretty damn unlikely that he gets elected as party leader day 1 when there are vets "running" for the position that most of the game is willing to sheep. The thing is that it gives us (read: everyone who's not you) nothing at all. Fine we got it but why are you telling us that you're planning to favor Marv? Are we supposed to talk about it? I highly doubt it. Then why did you tell us preemptively about it? It really looks like a cheap excuse to justify yourself and I'm having troubles figuring why you'd want to do that? That's why I said at best it's pointless, at worst it's a guy trying to contribute something while actually being pointless. Your early explanation sounds like a set-up for the next couple of hours of this cycle. Ah, okay I guess I understand what you're saying now, at least. People were discussing which vet they were going to vote for, so I said I would likely be voting for marv. Then someone asked "Why marv, isn't he going to be super-hard to read day 1?" Then I started going into the long reasons why. I didn't just come out and say it all; it was an answer to specific questions. Unless you just wanted me to ignore them, then :o Also: You gave two possibilities for my explanations: either useless, or trying to contribute while being useless. Notice neither one of those possibilities are "he's scum". A guy trying to contribute something while being useless is a mafiatreat, that's why I mentioned you.
Scum are trying to look like they're doing something without actually doing something all the time.
I couldn't have voiced your behaviour this game better myself! Rather than scumhunting we get an unjustified vote on Sandroba, but not immediately. No. First you SAY we should lynch Sandroba without giving any reasons for it. It's only about 30 hours later, when the wagon has properly left the station that you come back to vote. Still without a justification. And that is the SUM TOTAL of what Toad has done that even remotely approaches something that is not setup speculation, talking about himself or meaningless banter.
Until this, about 80 hours after the opening post telling everybody he'll be open, chatty and scumhunting:
+ Show Spoiler [Toad's scumhunting conclusions] +On November 25 2012 01:42 Toadesstern wrote:Okay done reading. Marv looks definitely better d2 so I'll ignore him for now. Sandroba looks the same way he did d2 so I still think he's the best way to go, not to mention that it's not that much time left. So much for the changes for d1 to d2. Drazerk looks like a madmen, like you guys said and well it's Drazerk.... Those people get shot and not lynched, it's as simple as that. A lynch on Drazerk is a (imo) random lynch as he could be doing that from both points of view and I don't have an idea what's going on in his head. Additionally I'd say that's probably not going to change that soon, which is why I'd say we let vigs deal with him, both to get rid of him and to make sure we don't have a Drazerk lynch that gives us 0 information while flipping like a dice role. The bad thing about lynching Drazerk is that anyone and their mom can hop on that lynch and say "herpa derp it's Drazerk, let's lynch him beacuse he's anti-town" and after the lynch we're in complete chaos because he either flipped red and everyone's pissed at those who thought he shouldn't be lynched because he's always like that or he's going to flip his chef / invoker thingie and people we don't get anything out of it because he was doing bullshit after all. TL; dr: Don't lynch that guy, shoot him. Completly ignore him in all other regards. Other than that I don't really like Chroniclers fashion of going after people. Can't help but feel that he thinks he needs to emphasize and point out very obvious things a lot. Could be me omgusing though, so I'd rather have some input from someone else about that. Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 01:31 Dienosore wrote:On November 24 2012 23:01 Toadesstern wrote:
screw that
##vote Sandro I mapped you voting for sandro a long time ago. Why do you feel the need to vote him again, and in such a lackadaisical manner? [...] I didn't. On the start of d2 I said I'd like to vote for Sandro, maybe marv, went to the trainstation and was basicly afk for 24 hours. Now I'm back and gave a heads up on my current thoughts. I usually don't feel the need to copy&paste what I said earlier if nothing changed but I can do that from now on if it you makes you feel better :p I actually haven't understood your map yet, like Marv said I've been mainly mentioning Sand and him d1&d2 so far, maybe Keir a little d1 but I think I made it very clear that that was on purpose to get something going and I don't see arrows between Marv and me. But than again who knows what arrow belongs to what person 
Summary: null on Marv, troll on Drazerk and no clue what he thinks about Chronicler. Still nothing on why Sandro is scum, other than that he had a vague town meta read on him until Syllo shut that down.
The sum total of Toad's contributions to this thread have been zip diddly squat, but he is here and posting. Quite a lot in fact. This is NOT the Toad I know as either town or scum, but I can't see any town motivation for playing this way.
There are some other small things in his filter, but the promise that he will spend the game scumhunting and then the absolute lack of it, despite 5 pages of filter, is, once again in Toad's own words:
Scum are trying to look like they're doing something without actually doing something all the time.
Thank you for describing your own gameplan so clearly!
##unvote
##vote Toadesstern
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On November 25 2012 04:35 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 04:34 kitaman27 wrote:On November 25 2012 04:32 marvellosity wrote:
Your shot was only worth 50 HP? Do you have multiple? Not saying. I'll put it another way. If your only ability is a 1-shot 50HP shot, that would be a complete load of bullcrap :p
Agreed.
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Marv, think about Toad. I am totes feeling a lynch on him. Gander through his filter please. He has been flying under the radar and has done absolutely fuckall this game.
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No clue why I addressed that to just Marv. He's currently the most vocal, but EVERYBODY should look at the absolute lack of any useful posts in Toad's filter.
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@Clarity: he voices his thoughts about himself. He speculates about setup. He is around, he is "contributing" and he is not sharing his reads at all. How is that being open?
@both: yes, I would absolutely lynch Toad over either Kita or Sandro. 4 hours is plenty of time.
My thoughts on both Kita and Sandroba are in my filter. I am not feeling the scum on either of them. I am feeling it in spades on Toad.
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On November 25 2012 04:59 goodkarma wrote:
But hasn't sandra been just as worthless? I'll have to re-read your filter but it doesn't quite add up to me why toad would so much more definitely be scum than sandroba on that basis.
Sandro upped and left. He is not here (or faking not being here). Sure, that is damning, because it's sandroba, but on exactly the same basis we could be lynching SnB, hopeless1der, Promethelax, VE, Adam or iamperfection.
Yes, we hold Sandroba to a higher standard... and Syllo has a meta-based scumread on him. However, I am not comfortable sheeping Syllo. If he's wrong, we're screwed and have absolutely nothing useful.
Toad, on the other hand has been here. He has been posting, quite actively at times. Yet, he has DONE jack shit. That is far more damning than going afk imho.
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On November 25 2012 05:02 Clarity_nl wrote:I'll read his filter a bit closer, one of his latest posts I like quite a bit, it's still not scumhunting though, I admit: + Show Spoiler +On November 25 2012 01:42 Toadesstern wrote:Okay done reading. Marv looks definitely better d2 so I'll ignore him for now. Sandroba looks the same way he did d2 so I still think he's the best way to go, not to mention that it's not that much time left. So much for the changes for d1 to d2. Drazerk looks like a madmen, like you guys said and well it's Drazerk.... Those people get shot and not lynched, it's as simple as that. A lynch on Drazerk is a (imo) random lynch as he could be doing that from both points of view and I don't have an idea what's going on in his head. Additionally I'd say that's probably not going to change that soon, which is why I'd say we let vigs deal with him, both to get rid of him and to make sure we don't have a Drazerk lynch that gives us 0 information while flipping like a dice role. The bad thing about lynching Drazerk is that anyone and their mom can hop on that lynch and say "herpa derp it's Drazerk, let's lynch him beacuse he's anti-town" and after the lynch we're in complete chaos because he either flipped red and everyone's pissed at those who thought he shouldn't be lynched because he's always like that or he's going to flip his chef / invoker thingie and people we don't get anything out of it because he was doing bullshit after all. TL; dr: Don't lynch that guy, shoot him. Completly ignore him in all other regards. Other than that I don't really like Chroniclers fashion of going after people. Can't help but feel that he thinks he needs to emphasize and point out very obvious things a lot. Could be me omgusing though, so I'd rather have some input from someone else about that. Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 01:31 Dienosore wrote:On November 24 2012 23:01 Toadesstern wrote:
screw that
##vote Sandro I mapped you voting for sandro a long time ago. Why do you feel the need to vote him again, and in such a lackadaisical manner? [...] I didn't. On the start of d2 I said I'd like to vote for Sandro, maybe marv, went to the trainstation and was basicly afk for 24 hours. Now I'm back and gave a heads up on my current thoughts. I usually don't feel the need to copy&paste what I said earlier if nothing changed but I can do that from now on if it you makes you feel better :p I actually haven't understood your map yet, like Marv said I've been mainly mentioning Sand and him d1&d2 so far, maybe Keir a little d1 but I think I made it very clear that that was on purpose to get something going and I don't see arrows between Marv and me. But than again who knows what arrow belongs to what person
Why do you like that? It's actually a terrible post. He says he's null on marv, troll on drazerk and gives some waffling account of that he wants other people to tell him what to think of chronicler. He calls Dienosore useless (or unintelligible at best).
Way to be COMPLETELY noncommittal.
What is there to like in that post? What I am still missing is an explanation for why he voted Sandro.
On November 24 2012 03:55 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2012 03:31 Acrofales wrote:On November 24 2012 03:16 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 24 2012 03:05 Acrofales wrote:
Okay, I went through Sandro's filter, and other than his absence at some key moments I cannot find anything scummy. He seems to be playing pretty standard for him, calling people town with no reason given. However, I am looking forward to him waking up and starting to play again.
Another thing to keep in mind is that from a game-setup point of view it is very very risky to put people like Sandro+Syllo on opposite alignments. Not quite as bad as Coag+Jackal (and the only game I've played with both of them DrH stuck both of them on the scumteam), but not something you can do without making a very serious consideration, as they are well-known for having each other's number. I don't want to let this weigh too heavily, because meta-speculation about the host is really dodgy ground, but I felt it was worth mentioning.
Syllo+Sand: do you have a recent (last half a year or so) game where you were opposite alignments? 3rd party doesn't count. So I take it you are not so familiar with his meta? Because both Toad and Adam seemed to give him scum reads on meta. I'm also disturbed on how syllo is reluctant to give a read on him. I've asked him twice at this time, and he still doesn't take a solid position. There are two newbies using the logic "syllo won the event ergo sand is scum" and that's going unopposed. I don't get why he's not taking a position against sand. I second that a game in which syllo and sand played together as opposite alignments would be quite instructive. That way we can tell just how accurate these vet reads being made are and I'll be more comfortable regarding people's reads. For the record I'm opposed to a sand lynch at this time, until more people comment on the cases on him, at least. Right now there are much better lynches, more into that in a bit. Only remotely normal game I remember Sandroba being scum is Liar mafia. His meta was blatantly obvious there, because he just plain didn't care about the game. That is not the impression I am getting from him. I have played with town Sandroba a couple of times now, and am getting a similar feeling. The main difference is that he has gone awol for long stretches of time. I don't like that at all, but admit real world stuff does come up and interfere with playing sometimes. I am uncomfortable lynching Sandroba with the ONLY thing I can hold against him is that he was afk when it counted. Adam states Sandroba is playing like he "don't-give-a-shit", which I disagree with. @Adam: please explain yourself a bit better. What makes you have this read? Toad doesn't have a meta read on Sandro at all. He has a "Syllo is town, therefore Sandro must be scum" read based on the party leader elections, which is pants-on-head retarded. nope I had a meta read on Sandro up until yesterday. He was way to "friendly" when talking to syllo imo which again is a reason I liked syllos conversation with him. Town Sandro usually isn't open at all and tries to net people, by being sneaking and laying traps, so I didn't like what he was showing on d1. Problem about meta reads is you can't explain them because as someone else stated I don't think reading an old game is anything like playing it. You've got to be in the game yourself you're referring to imo. I'm saying "had" because what sandro said today, especially him being pissed makes me rethink things a bit... but I'd still say he's mafia considering that I'm not and syllo's probably not either. Yeah I'd say mafia had their eggs in the basked.
This, and the fact that he thinks there is a scum in Syllo+Sandro, are the only reasons he gives for wanting to lynch Sandro. If Sandro flips town, it is impossible to peg Toad to this lynch.
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On November 25 2012 05:16 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 04:30 Warri wrote:sup guys Toad here. My internetprovider is down, I'm at a friends house, won't be back till tomorrow... Not a joke sry.
About voting me: Don't lynch me, I need someone who votes me though or I take a lot of dmg. Stupid posting / acting restriction being an attention whore Nobody noticed this ?
I did. And I ignored it for being useless. As should you.
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Oh, looks like Sandro is cruising for a modkill too.
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On November 25 2012 05:21 Djodref wrote:
Didn't Toad just say that he was playing like this on purpose ?
He needed someone to vote him. I think that's why he kept asking Acro for a vote.
Does it seem reasonable for anyone ? Why didn't he claim then ?
Toad is AWOL by the way...
Did you read my case? Do you agree? Disagree? Toad's vote for Kita without reasoning was on purpose (and that's what that exchange with Marv and me was about). For whatever strange reason. I guess that could be construed as an attempt at trapping someone, and thus as scumhunting, but I am unsure that was actually what he was trying to achieve. Maybe Marv got something else from that exchange.
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On November 25 2012 05:28 goodkarma wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 05:17 Acrofales wrote:On November 25 2012 05:02 Clarity_nl wrote:I'll read his filter a bit closer, one of his latest posts I like quite a bit, it's still not scumhunting though, I admit: + Show Spoiler +On November 25 2012 01:42 Toadesstern wrote:Okay done reading. Marv looks definitely better d2 so I'll ignore him for now. Sandroba looks the same way he did d2 so I still think he's the best way to go, not to mention that it's not that much time left. So much for the changes for d1 to d2. Drazerk looks like a madmen, like you guys said and well it's Drazerk.... Those people get shot and not lynched, it's as simple as that. A lynch on Drazerk is a (imo) random lynch as he could be doing that from both points of view and I don't have an idea what's going on in his head. Additionally I'd say that's probably not going to change that soon, which is why I'd say we let vigs deal with him, both to get rid of him and to make sure we don't have a Drazerk lynch that gives us 0 information while flipping like a dice role. The bad thing about lynching Drazerk is that anyone and their mom can hop on that lynch and say "herpa derp it's Drazerk, let's lynch him beacuse he's anti-town" and after the lynch we're in complete chaos because he either flipped red and everyone's pissed at those who thought he shouldn't be lynched because he's always like that or he's going to flip his chef / invoker thingie and people we don't get anything out of it because he was doing bullshit after all. TL; dr: Don't lynch that guy, shoot him. Completly ignore him in all other regards. Other than that I don't really like Chroniclers fashion of going after people. Can't help but feel that he thinks he needs to emphasize and point out very obvious things a lot. Could be me omgusing though, so I'd rather have some input from someone else about that. Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 01:31 Dienosore wrote:On November 24 2012 23:01 Toadesstern wrote:
screw that
##vote Sandro I mapped you voting for sandro a long time ago. Why do you feel the need to vote him again, and in such a lackadaisical manner? [...] I didn't. On the start of d2 I said I'd like to vote for Sandro, maybe marv, went to the trainstation and was basicly afk for 24 hours. Now I'm back and gave a heads up on my current thoughts. I usually don't feel the need to copy&paste what I said earlier if nothing changed but I can do that from now on if it you makes you feel better :p I actually haven't understood your map yet, like Marv said I've been mainly mentioning Sand and him d1&d2 so far, maybe Keir a little d1 but I think I made it very clear that that was on purpose to get something going and I don't see arrows between Marv and me. But than again who knows what arrow belongs to what person Why do you like that? It's actually a terrible post. He says he's null on marv, troll on drazerk and gives some waffling account of that he wants other people to tell him what to think of chronicler. He calls Dienosore useless (or unintelligible at best). Way to be COMPLETELY noncommittal. What is there to like in that post? What I am still missing is an explanation for why he voted Sandro. On November 24 2012 03:55 Toadesstern wrote:On November 24 2012 03:31 Acrofales wrote:On November 24 2012 03:16 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 24 2012 03:05 Acrofales wrote:
Okay, I went through Sandro's filter, and other than his absence at some key moments I cannot find anything scummy. He seems to be playing pretty standard for him, calling people town with no reason given. However, I am looking forward to him waking up and starting to play again.
Another thing to keep in mind is that from a game-setup point of view it is very very risky to put people like Sandro+Syllo on opposite alignments. Not quite as bad as Coag+Jackal (and the only game I've played with both of them DrH stuck both of them on the scumteam), but not something you can do without making a very serious consideration, as they are well-known for having each other's number. I don't want to let this weigh too heavily, because meta-speculation about the host is really dodgy ground, but I felt it was worth mentioning.
Syllo+Sand: do you have a recent (last half a year or so) game where you were opposite alignments? 3rd party doesn't count. So I take it you are not so familiar with his meta? Because both Toad and Adam seemed to give him scum reads on meta. I'm also disturbed on how syllo is reluctant to give a read on him. I've asked him twice at this time, and he still doesn't take a solid position. There are two newbies using the logic "syllo won the event ergo sand is scum" and that's going unopposed. I don't get why he's not taking a position against sand. I second that a game in which syllo and sand played together as opposite alignments would be quite instructive. That way we can tell just how accurate these vet reads being made are and I'll be more comfortable regarding people's reads. For the record I'm opposed to a sand lynch at this time, until more people comment on the cases on him, at least. Right now there are much better lynches, more into that in a bit. Only remotely normal game I remember Sandroba being scum is Liar mafia. His meta was blatantly obvious there, because he just plain didn't care about the game. That is not the impression I am getting from him. I have played with town Sandroba a couple of times now, and am getting a similar feeling. The main difference is that he has gone awol for long stretches of time. I don't like that at all, but admit real world stuff does come up and interfere with playing sometimes. I am uncomfortable lynching Sandroba with the ONLY thing I can hold against him is that he was afk when it counted. Adam states Sandroba is playing like he "don't-give-a-shit", which I disagree with. @Adam: please explain yourself a bit better. What makes you have this read? Toad doesn't have a meta read on Sandro at all. He has a "Syllo is town, therefore Sandro must be scum" read based on the party leader elections, which is pants-on-head retarded. nope I had a meta read on Sandro up until yesterday. He was way to "friendly" when talking to syllo imo which again is a reason I liked syllos conversation with him. Town Sandro usually isn't open at all and tries to net people, by being sneaking and laying traps, so I didn't like what he was showing on d1. Problem about meta reads is you can't explain them because as someone else stated I don't think reading an old game is anything like playing it. You've got to be in the game yourself you're referring to imo. I'm saying "had" because what sandro said today, especially him being pissed makes me rethink things a bit... but I'd still say he's mafia considering that I'm not and syllo's probably not either. Yeah I'd say mafia had their eggs in the basked. This, and the fact that he thinks there is a scum in Syllo+Sandro, are the only reasons he gives for wanting to lynch Sandro. If Sandro flips town, it is impossible to peg Toad to this lynch. So if we sheep you instead and vote for Toad, for reasons similar to why people are voting Sandro, how does that make us better off? If Toad flips town, isn't it the same kind of scenario? Or is it that sandro seems to have massive support, and that it must be mafia-influenced? With as little as Sandro has tried to establish himself as town this game, if he is scum I would fully expect his team would bus him, especially with Syllo on his lynch bandwagon.
I'm not telling you to sheep me, although I guess I would be honored. I am asking you to read my case, read Toad's filter and make up your own mind. I have voiced my opinion. I will try to sway the general public with lots of armwaving and explaining why Toad is scum, but in the end it's YOU who has to make up your mind.
So. Why do YOU think Sandro is scum. Fairly certain you're one of those people who is sheeping Syllo for no apparent reason other than Syllo says, so it must be so.
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Dredged it up. Turns out I was 100% right. Beeeehhhhhh
On November 23 2012 18:47 goodkarma wrote:
I am entirely opposed to troll(CaveJohnson) hunting at present. I am not as confident as some seem to be that, based off his current anti-town dialogue, he has demonstrated he in fact is mafia.
On the other hand, if Sandroba's meta (as stated by others here) is to be believed, he is a clear choice as a lynching candidate for today. He has gone into hardcore lurker mode, which normally is something I wouldn't consider a tell. However, as a player of his reputation that plays so well as town to disappear as he has, I deem voting to lynch him appropriate. I would like to hear what he has to say to explain his current complete lack of caring since very early this game. And until he does:
##Vote: Sandroba
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On November 25 2012 05:39 kitaman27 wrote:
Voting sandroba for now. 24 hours of inactivity is reasonable. 72 hours isn't.
I suggest a full role claim from him upon his return.
Still quite annoyed that prom hasn't showed up.
I am so far not seeing the scum in Prom. However, I am not seeing the town in Prom either, and that alone is causing me to be very cautious with him. His absence after that claim, though, bugs me too.
What do you think of Toad?
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On November 25 2012 05:41 Clarity_nl wrote:
Although I realize that if Sandro is scum he would be bussed by his teammates, that fact that there has been ZERO defense of him other than people calling the wagon stupid makes me very paranoid.
Why you disregard my defense of him?
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In fact, it's not just me. There are quite a number of people reluctant to vote him. And the "the wagon is retarded" defense IS a defense.
However, Toad is scum.
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On November 25 2012 05:52 CaveJohnson wrote:
Is toad a reverse fool?
also Hi sorry for my absence.
Where were you? Also, I asked questions about your claim. Kita asked questions about your claim. I think there's a general consensus that it's bollocks. Unsurprising. You need a new approach to shocking town.
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On November 25 2012 05:50 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 05:46 Djodref wrote:
If sandro was scum, why would he have stopped his campaign and gona AWOL when he started to get some traction ?
There are some better people to lynch.
Jumping on the Toad wagon !!!?
##Unvote
Vote Toad I already addressed this. There are two motivations for scum to run for election. 1) Run to win and make town fail the mission. 2) Convenient excuse to not scumhunt, just drop out later.
Those excuses work for pretty much everybody except Sandro or Syllo. When you have a high profile like that, you cannot graciously drop out, as we saw yesterday.
I am inclined to believe Sandro when he says RL got in the way. However, RL is not town or scum. His subsequent behaviour has not made sense. But Toad is scummier.
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On November 25 2012 05:59 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 05:56 Hapahauli wrote:
Sandro looks to be heading to a modkill, and for those of you voting for him, it's worth it to consider another voting option as to not waste the lynch for today. Toad perhaps. You're the second to mention a modkill on Sandro. Did I miss something?
He hasn't voted.
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On November 25 2012 06:06 CaveJohnson wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2012 05:57 goodkarma wrote:On November 25 2012 05:52 CaveJohnson wrote:
Is toad a reverse fool?
also Hi sorry for my absence. Don't apologize. We've come to expect you to contribute nothing of value. Maybe provide an actual opinion and vote? That would be nice. Probably do it closer to the deadline. Which ever wagon I join will be hampered just by my presence.
Yadda yadda yadda. Kita claims he shot you and you took less damage than you should have, yet he took none. Which one of you is lying?
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EPT
