Newbie Mini Mafia XXVII
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kushm4sta
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kushm4sta
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On September 14 2012 02:35 Hapahauli wrote: There are players from all sorts of timezones involved in games on the forum - it's no trouble at all =) actually I thinly it's bad because people are sleeping during Lynch deadline, which is a big help for mafia because town can't change their minds at the last second . | ||
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On September 15 2012 16:37 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: Meh, if Jacob's in I can't resist. You're going down :p /in Not really a good attitude to have beacuse you are both probably going to be on the same team.. | ||
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#1 They make the game shittier regardless of if they are scum. #2 They are 100% null reads all game long. You ask them a question and of course they aren't going to responsd because they post like 1 thing a day and dont even read the thread. #3 It gives scum safe people to accuse. Most of the time they aren't mafia but in the 2 games I played both of them had semi-lurker mafia. Lurker Policy: LYNCH ALL LURKERS, semilurkers at the top of the lynch list if we don't have a very strong scumread to bandwagon. | ||
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On September 18 2012 11:00 thrawn2112 wrote: Yeah I agree, there's not much else to add other than that lurkers are assholes and they are going to lurk whether there is strong support of a lurker lynch policy or not... especially in these newbie games. So on to more important matters, here's an idea: last person in the thread gets lynched discuss? Terrible idea? Since we prob have liek 3 different time zones. Biggest lurker gets lynched is a better plan but still not that great. A lot of noobs are pretty lost about what to do day 1. Here are my suggestions for discussion topics: 1 discuss lurker policy. I know you are bored with it or whatever, thrawn, but for peopel to say how they feel about lurkers and if they want to lynch them or let them lurk (both are viable strategies imo) gives us a baseline for FOSing people that go back on their lurker policy. Like what if a scum says lynch all lurkers, then one of the scumbuddies turns out to be the biggest lurker. That puts him in a bad position that he could avoid without lurker policy discussion. 2 I think we should discuss a plan for how to spend time. Here is my proposed plan: Freely making cases against anyone you think is scum in the first 24 hours of the day, then focusing on a couple of the biggest bandwagons in the second 24 hours. Do you like this plan or do you have a better one? I would a more systematic scumhunt this game though. 3 Give an introduction of yourself. How experienced are you? Are you a total noob or have you obsed some games? Very important IMO is will you be around for lynch time? That's 9 pm normal time btw if you are new. How active do you plan on being. Honestly I think once a day is okay IF your posts are good. An intro for myself is coming. | ||
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No fluff zone: posting habits I probably will post a lot because I have no life. I work but my work is basically a study hall so I will be posting on my phone at work. That is why sometimes my spelling and formatting will be ass. experience I have 2 games played and I have won both games and never killed. So far I am unkilled and undefeated and I want to continue my streak so I will be tryharding this game, but not tryharding enough so I'm the best town and mafia kills me. Call it selfish but I dont want to die... @thrawn I know you have 3 games undefeated but you got killed by scum therefore you aren't as cool as me. I am looking to step up my play this game. Last game was quite humbling for me. I made a lot of bad calls, and d1 caused a mislynch >< IM SORRY CUBU So I'm going to try to be more careful and have better analysis this game. Lynch time I will be around on my phone at least. I think deciding on a lynch at the last minute is a really powerful tool for town beacuse it makes scum panic and do stupid things. However that's really not possible with this mess of time zones we got going on here. | ||
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On September 18 2012 11:44 thrawn2112 wrote: Also, wtf kush. "Honestly I think once a day is okay IF your posts are good" after you talk about how much you hate lurkers? If you write 1 post a day but it's a brilliant epic post then that's cool with me. I can be realistic about people's busy schedules. And that is WAY better than a few little posts with no content. .. and I'm looking at you STUTTERS, DRAZAK, and ESPECIALLY CUBU who were all town last game but pretty trash town. I'll write you an intro. Hey everyone this is kush. Judging off his username I suspcet he is a fellow lover of the ganja, which probably explains a lot of his posts. He says whatever comes to mind, and in the games I played with him he said a lot of very scummy sounding things as a townie. So basically expect to be confused. He likes going for crazy ballsy plays which often is the reason why I always thought he was town, as scum would have to be crazy to do those things. And I like to attention whore esp day 1. and If you accuse me of being scum I will omgus and start a flame war with you just because im really sensitive and hate being called scum. drazak knows what I'm talking about. Im trying to play better this game though so f u thrawn. | ||
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On September 18 2012 11:11 RemedySC wrote: Lurkers are a minor annoyance sure, but I think just lynching based on lurker status could end up hurting us more so as the game progresses. Lets focus on getting a mafia lynch for the first day. remedy getting a good scum read d1 is impossible. It's the easiest thing ever for scum to look like town day 1. Unless we have no lurkers, we should lynch the biggest lurker or the scumiest semilurker but please not someone active. | ||
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Ok so let me explain that statement. I'm saying lurkers are automatic 100% null reads. They could be town they could be scum. The problem with leaving lurkers to fester day after day is that it gives scum someone safe to FOS and say they want to lynch. The problem is not in actually killing the lurkers, which is what I want to do, but leaving them for half of the town to be mad at and waste discussion on day after day. Which leads me to my next point: I agree with thrawn that lurker lynch candidates should NOT be discussed until later in the day when we are deciding who gets the lynch. I think that is a policy all town should agree on. Lurkers by their very nature make no or very little content to discuss. | ||
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On September 18 2012 12:36 thrawn2112 wrote: He did give a reasonable response to my post... but kush I'd like to ask you, how would you feel about specifically me only posting once per cycle? I'm always terrified of thrawn scum because, as I said before, I think it would be really hard to see through your meta. But having said that, I know that you have limited time, because you have been talking about it for quite a while and way before this game even started. So I would understand you posting once a day, I woudl not think it was scummy. I'm still watching you extra close though... every move you make every vow you break every smile you fake every claim you stake ill be watching you. afk im going to bed. | ||
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what I said about flame wars.. that is what I did in the last two previous games. for instance drazak accused me really hard and I basically just called him a bad player again and again. I am trying to avoid that this game though. I really hate waking up to people fosing me...feels bad | ||
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@Sonic: Yeah that was based on mine, but I dont think to make a list and say "answer these or you're scum" is very productive. What I put up was just some suggestions for newer players to have something to talk about. I notice newbies never really know what to say d1. @Thrawn: I don't think sonic's survey is particularly scummy. He did the same thing last game. He was scum last game, sure, but I think it's just his MO for day one, scum or town. Also here is why I think sonic is town. I'm putting my reasoning in spoilers because admittedly it's pretty dumb: [spoiler]He was scum for the last 2 games. Do you really think marv would make him scum 3rd game in a row? It's possible but just feels unlikely to me.[/spoiler] | ||
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Atreides CUBU (sigh this again...) I'm afk for a while do to class. | ||
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On September 18 2012 23:54 Sharrant wrote: + Show Spoiler + On September 18 2012 10:48 kushm4sta wrote: I am so fucking sick of lurkers from last game. #1 They make the game shittier regardless of if they are scum. #2 They are 100% null reads all game long. You ask them a question and of course they aren't going to responsd because they post like 1 thing a day and dont even read the thread. #3 It gives scum safe people to accuse. Most of the time they aren't mafia but in the 2 games I played both of them had semi-lurker mafia. Lurker Policy: LYNCH ALL LURKERS, semilurkers at the top of the lynch list if we don't have a very strong scumread to bandwagon. This seems like reasonable logic. They do generally cause null reads on themselves. However, with point #3, we're making it so the mafia don't have to accuse them. We're already killing them for the mafia (provided lurkers are not mafia, but that's iffy either way). This is not a scummy post in my opinion, but this does help mafia and the SK provided they are active. On September 18 2012 11:31 kushm4sta wrote: Sup guys I am kushmasta IRL name jake. I live in maine and go to college for chemical engineering. (think all that random shit you learned in chemistry applied to real world situations). No fluff zone: posting habits I probably will post a lot because I have no life. I work but my work is basically a study hall so I will be posting on my phone at work. That is why sometimes my spelling and formatting will be ass. experience I have 2 games played and I have won both games and never killed. So far I am unkilled and undefeated and I want to continue my streak so I will be tryharding this game, but not tryharding enough so I'm the best town and mafia kills me. Call it selfish but I dont want to die... @thrawn I know you have 3 games undefeated but you got killed by scum therefore you aren't as cool as me. I am looking to step up my play this game. Last game was quite humbling for me. I made a lot of bad calls, and d1 caused a mislynch >< IM SORRY CUBU So I'm going to try to be more careful and have better analysis this game. Lynch time I will be around on my phone at least. I think deciding on a lynch at the last minute is a really powerful tool for town beacuse it makes scum panic and do stupid things. However that's really not possible with this mess of time zones we got going on here. Self preservation isn't necessarily scummy, blues require some amount of it to. Maybe it's something akin to ladder anxiety (my record is perfect, it must stay perfect!), or maybe he's giving himself a way out of not posting good reads. If you get killed by the mafia, you get killed by the mafia, you should be trying to contribute in the best way possible before that. In some cases that just be by trying to survive until you have information, and in others that might be putting out your best effort for scum hunting and just hoping they don't kill you. A numbers game says the latter is more likely. Underlined part seems sincere to me, makes me suspect townie. On September 18 2012 12:00 kushm4sta wrote: If you write 1 post a day but it's a brilliant epic post then that's cool with me. I can be realistic about people's busy schedules. And that is WAY better than a few little posts with no content. .. and I'm looking at you STUTTERS, DRAZAK, and ESPECIALLY CUBU who were all town last game but pretty trash town. And I like to attention whore esp day 1. and If you accuse me of being scum I will omgus and start a flame war with you just because im really sensitive and hate being called scum. drazak knows what I'm talking about. Im trying to play better this game though so f u thrawn. Reverses his stance on 1 post per day, first post was about how set he was to lynch anyone who single posts per day. Then suddenly goes after Stutters/Draz/Cubu. The "especially Cubu" makes his previous apology (the one that gave me a bit of a town read) smack of insincerity. Follow this up with the whole "OMGUS+flamewar", I'd generally just chalk it down to bad play (apparently he did this as town twice) but with everything else it makes me think scummy. On September 18 2012 20:27 kushm4sta wrote: @stutters I want to improve my play because last game I sucked quite hard. anyone can attest to that lol. I also don't want to be the best town because getting nk sucks imo. I like being around for the end of the game. I'm just being honest. but thanks for accusing me because it makes it less likely that ill be nk, since scum usually kill the towniest person. what I said about flame wars.. that is what I did in the last two previous games. for instance drazak accused me really hard and I basically just called him a bad player again and again. I am trying to avoid that this game though. I really hate waking up to people fosing me...feels bad Keeps on about NKs, and how badly he doesn't want to be NKed. It just rubs me the wrong way. Like he's trying his best to make it sound like town, but has no idea what a town player would talk about. On September 18 2012 20:56 kushm4sta wrote: In regards to thrawn's attack on sonic for his survey: @Sonic: Yeah that was based on mine, but I dont think to make a list and say "answer these or you're scum" is very productive. What I put up was just some suggestions for newer players to have something to talk about. I notice newbies never really know what to say d1. @Thrawn: I don't think sonic's survey is particularly scummy. He did the same thing last game. He was scum last game, sure, but I think it's just his MO for day one, scum or town. Also here is why I think sonic is town. I'm putting my reasoning in spoilers because admittedly it's pretty dumb: He was scum for the last 2 games. Do you really think marv would make him scum 3rd game in a row? It's possible but just feels unlikely to me. It's just as likely as anyone else being scum assuming the roles were determined off of random chance. That's such a weak thing to say that I wonder why you even included it. I think it's far too early to have a really good read on the situation, but the way he's played so far screams scum to me, but not mafia. Right now, my main read is on Kush, and it's that he's not mafia, and he's not town. I feel he is, in fact, the serial killer. If I were going to be really specific, I'd wager a serial killer that took detection immunity, and thus is the reason he's so worried about being NK'ed. So since we've had a few FoS's but no votes, allow me to cast the first vote ##Vote:kushm4sta Other reads I have right now aren't too strong, I have a weak idea that Thrawn and debears are town, and I'm bouncing back and forth between weak town and weak scum on SDM. I'd like to think he's town because so far he's amused me. Drazak is still undecided in my mind until he posts more. Defense of Sharrant's case against me Good...scumhunting...dude.. there I didn't flame. 1 You call me insincere because at first I say sorry cubu for bandwagoning him last game, then I call him out for lurking? I am not going to make a case against him for lurking, but I think a COUPLE words saying so and so are lurking we still need a post is fine. And yeah I will say cubu played really really bad last game. I wont apologize for saying that. I'm still sorry for lynching him. I was not trying to start a flame war for with cubu, I was just trying to get him to post. I think encouraging lurkers to post by calling them out or asking them questions is productive. Making cases against lurkers is not productive. 2 Keeps on about NKs, and how badly he doesn't want to be NKed. It just rubs me the wrong way. Like he's trying his best to make it sound like town, but has no idea what a town player would talk about. I "keep on about NKs" only because people are calling me out for that statement and I want to defend myself. I will stop talking about NK if you stop. But since you brought it up again let me talk more about my stance on nks: + Show Spoiler + I'm pretty sure last game sonic said it's honorable to be nked, I disagree with this statement because you significantly depreciate your value as town if you do not preserve that value till the end of the game. I think getting NKed indicates bad play for town, because you are making yourself a target. Why did I even bring it up? Bad idea probably judging by the reaction, but I wanted to give you guys some insight into my personal strategy, 3 Reverses his stance on 1 post per day, first post was about how set he was to lynch anyone who single posts per day. I never reversed my stance on anything. 1 post a day is not lurking if its a long post. Lynch lurkers, yes, but 1 post a day does not make you a lurker. @sharron Is there anything else you want me to address or is that it? Also please give more effort to organize your posts better. Singling out the different arguments made against me was quite hard. | ||
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On September 19 2012 02:37 thrawn2112 wrote: Hey kush I've yet to see you mention anything in the thread that looks scummy Beacuse my time is spent defending myself. Also im typing something give me time. | ||
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On September 19 2012 01:56 KillingTime wrote: + Show Spoiler + Thrawn - I don't think it is a major point, it is a short post - if someone thinks that FOS's are valuable day one, then please tell me why. I thought the discussions about Sonic's "survey" and Thrawns " lynch question" were dumb, which were the main things in the thread at that time. I think the other things that are on this page are more worth discussing though: I agree that Kush's statements about not wanting to die were dumb and anti-town. I haven't voted him yet though because a) I think the serial killer case, while I can follow the logic, is a huge overreach when we don't even know whether we have a serial killer. It would be equally plausible to argue that kush was trying to attract attention to himself with that kind of remark. b) Kush made a significant number of dumb comments at the start of XXVI and turned out to be town. That doesn't excuse these comments, but they are not enough on their own to make me think he is scum. I like sonic's last post on Debears though - For now my feeling is that Debears is mafia trying to blend into the thread. Debears who do you think is scum? For now: ##Vote:debears You dont like FOS is valuable d1? Well sorry I do. ##FOS Killingtime VOTE means you are willing to lynch someone. FOS just means you want to investigate them more. Like right now even though your latest post makes me go wtf that doesn't mean I would be comfortable with lynching you at this moment. You spend a paragraph saying that calling me the serial killer is a huge overreach, then you give your theories on it. If it's an overreach then why are you making wifom arguments about it? It looks like you are trying to fill space without contributing content. Then you agree with sonic, instead of making your own case. And vote for debears, completely based on 1 post from someone else and your "feeling" that he is trying to blend in. So you effectively set up two possible bandwagons you can ride on, myself and debears, without actually contributing anything yourself. Debears who do you think is scum? Did you read all his posts or just the last one? He has already said FOS sonic, and given some reasons although they were pretty shitty. To summarize: I am FOSing you because of your lack of content, your bandwagoning, and your last question to debears, which shifts the focus back to him about a stupid question he already answered. | ||
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I looked at this guy's filter again. And yeah it's fishy as hell. So now I'm less suspicious of killingtime, more suspicious of debears. First thing isn't it da bears not de bears?? His initial dickriding of thrawn strikes me as something that could just be indicative of newbie play. It's more productive to make cases against scum than cases for town, especially out of the blue when no one is even accusing the townie. But the latter is easier so it is very possible this is just a newb mistake. But in his latest post he simultaneously continues the dick ride and defends his right to dickride. Incoming possible scumslip: However, if you look at the motivations from a townie and mafia perspective, it doesn't make sense as a mafia post. There's little reward for the risk as mafia. Here's what I showed earlier. 1) Thrawn as town - prevent the lurker discussion from going overboard. Present an idea that should provoke an "you're an idiot" response from town members (with a long shot of some mafia jumping on him about the idea). 2) Thrawn as mafia - Put up an idea that a thinking town would "not" take seriously, make himself look suspcicious. Possibly lynch the most inactive player if it works. People really need to learn to specify antecedents btw. After about an hour of rereading I figured out that what he is actually saying here is that thrawn's retarded idea to lynch the last person who posts makes him town. He purports himself an expert on the "mafia perspective" even though this is his first game. I would like more explanation about this line specifically: 1) Thrawn as town - prevent the lurker discussion from going overboard. Present an idea that should provoke an "you're an idiot" response from town members (with a long shot of some mafia jumping on him about the idea). What do you mean mafia would "jump on him about the idea?" As in they would like or get mad at him for it? Are you saying that thinking that idea is bad makes you scum? | ||
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Let me direct everyone's attention to the end of debears last post: On September 19 2012 03:30 debears wrote: The post in thrawn's defense is already helping the town by presenting a discussion about my alignment. We are now making specific accusations. We can look at bandwagons as we get closer to lynch now. However, Sonic, I am still having trouble understanding why there isn't any logic in what thrawn and I do. 1 Only scum would pretend to be glad he was accused scum. He says the town is being helped by the discussion about his alignment. It's like him saying see I cant be scum because I'm happy about being accused. Seems desperate. 2 "Im still having trouble understanding why there isn't any logic in what thrawn and I do." HUH?? What is it that thrawn and you do? Kill townies at night? Why are you so incessant on grouping you and thrawn togther. | ||
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Even if you are town debears could still be scum. Have you ever heard of buddying? I read about it in some guide. Scum will pick a strong townie to buddy with so that the townie will defend him. They will pick someone who looks liek town so that they can seem like as well by attaching themselves. It's a common tactic for newbie scum. | ||
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Before you jump down my throat I know it's too early to call scum teams and this is pure speculation. | ||
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if anything it was an exaggeration and not a lie. I don't want to spend a lot of time discussing my scumteam theories, because while I think they help in looking for cases, they do not constitute a case. but I don't like being called a liar so here goes. drazak is connected by saying killing is more suspicious than debears. he says they can't both be mafia so therefore debears isn't mafia. That is the classic mafia defense..defending a teammate by attacking the attacker. and you have defended debears. So that was the basis for that comment. Is it a real case against you? no. Is it a lie though? also no. | ||
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Does this make you happy? ebwop Each of you are not defending each of you but you are each defending 1 of you. Why are being so defensive over what to me seems like semantics? | ||
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Wtf is sharrant talking about with this roleclaim? He thinks debears is mafia and wants him to roleclaim that he is mafia? Huh? @sharrant Can you explain this statement? If you mean you want him to roleclaim as blue that is pretty scummy. BTW I'm not as convinced that you are scum as thrawn and sonic so don't get all pissy with me. | ||
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look for a substantial post from me at like 10 pm. I will break down debears latest post and expand on my argument about why I think he's scummy. the second half of d1 is approaching and I think we should solidify our bandwagons instead of accusing people like thrawn who are just not gonna get lynched today. also why are so many people already voting sharron? His play is really stupid with the roleclaim call, but stupid play doesn't make you mafia. you think first time mafia would really be so confidently retarded like that? | ||
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On September 19 2012 09:46 thrawn2112 wrote: Because like you said we're halfway into d1 and it's time to start voting. Would he make a big mistake as first time mafia? Maybe? Who knows? The point is it happened. You also gotta look at his vote for debears. Ignore what your read on debears is and just look at that post. It's so washy washy.... Combine that with the role claim nonsense and that's why I'm voting for him. So wait I misunderstood. This is just his first game on TL not his first game. But he could be talking about IRL mafia. @Sharront Is this your first game of forum mafia? Thrawn I think you are referring to when sharrant voted for debears right after saying he's not the most suspicious person. People are misunderstanding how some people use ##vote. They use it like ##fos basically and just change their vote a bunch of times throughout the day. I do not think there is anything inherently scummy in that. | ||
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Case against debears recent post. On September 19 2012 07:21 debears wrote: + Show Spoiler + First thing, SDM Sonic Death Monkey Sweden. September 19 2012 05:13. Posts 355 Reading thrawn's explanations and looking back at Debears filter it's possible he understood thrawn's plan That was what I was going for. Obviously, I poorly worded that part cuz it didn't get through. Also, at the time I made the thrawn defense post, I did not want to repeat what every1 else was saying. I saw that you were criticizing thrawn for doing something similar and it looked odd to me. Thus, I decided to question you. Once you kept saying you didn't see the logic, I tried to explain it. @Kush Why are you trying so hard to associate drazak, thrawn, and me. Understandly, my earlier posts would link me and thrawn. However, drazak does not come anywhere into play. Look at my filter there is one post about drazak. + Show Spoiler + debears United States. September 18 2012 22:42. Posts 8 PM Profile Quote Edit # filter To me, thrawn is giving a town read at this point. + Show Spoiler + A couple of you (SDM for instance) are concentrating at how stupid an idea lynching the last person is. Let's look at motivations for this: 1) Thrawn as town - prevent the lurker discussion from going overboard. Present an idea that should provoke an "you're an idiot" response from town members (with a long shot of some mafia jumping on him about the idea). 2) Thrawn as mafia - Put up an idea that a thinking town would take seriously, make himself look suspcicious. Possibly lynch the most inactive player if it works. The idea has far superior town motives. remember that Thrawn didn't linger on the idea. He dropped it after the responses were pretty clear on it. SDM did + Show Spoiler + I think Thrawn has sufficiently answered the question. I also believe that thrawn's defense of kush earlier was not indicative of scum. + Show Spoiler + The argument that Remedy was more of a shot in the dark, seeing as all of us hate lurkers. Thrawn dismissed a possibly dumb argument before a giant flame war started (kush did give warning earlier). I also support thrawn's logic with drazak: + Show Spoiler + Thrawn is currently not timid about calling people out within reason. To add to the argument, drazak's post also sounds indecisive. might, maybe, probably, think. While that alone is not anywhere near enough to condemn someone, it does raise suspicion on drazak. @sharrant and kush I find it odd how both are you are playing right now. Kush is lieing (and btw my main critic was SDM and not KillingTime). And this: + Show Spoiler + Sharrant Canada. September 19 2012 05:58. Posts 8 PM Profile Quote # filter On September 19 2012 05:26 thrawn2112 wrote: Show nested quote + Well that bolded part is just a straight up lie. I don't see how drazak fits into your theory... I was the first one to call drazak out on his unreasonably defensive post and I've never defended him. So once again, is the only reason you think I'm scum because of your debears association case? Show nested quote + Ok Sharrant that is a ridiculous vote. You start out saying "debears isn't really the most suspicious person to me" and say his defense of me "was weird, but not a strong tell either way in my opinion." Then you vote for him and say "there's a good chance he flips scum" and you're "not convinced he's mafia" after saying his defense of me was a null read. So, what exactly is your read on him and if you don't have a read then why are you voting for him? All I see is a bunch of "he may be scum" and "he is a null read." That's a ridiculous vote? You pick choice words out to discredit what I said, and try to make it personal. I'm fairly convinced the two of you are mafia after that. You know who I think is most suspicious, that hasn't been a secret. This has been mentioned in every post that Kush is my number one target, but that's not going anywhere. I think you should re-read my post. Several times even. Yes, his defense of you wasn't particularly strong either way in and of itself, that's what I said. That's one moment of his play, and you jumped all over that. So Kush is number one on your list. Makes sense that you would vote for him yet: + Show Spoiler + At the same time, debears isn't really the most suspicious person to me, his defense of Thrawn could be scummy, or it might not be. It was weird, but not a strong tell either way in my opinion. However, there is getting to be a large web of people involved with debears either way. ##unvote Kushm4sta ##vote debears So I'm not the most suspicious, yet I"m the one you vote for. And, not only that, you are going after me. Funny how you agree with kush, the person you most suspect for mafia, on that. And another thing that raised my eyebrows was how quickly you gave up on attacking kush although you still think he is sk: + Show Spoiler + Sharrant Canada. September 19 2012 03:14. Posts 8 PM Profile Quote # filter On September 19 2012 02:09 kushm4sta wrote: Defense of Sharrant's case against me Good...scumhunting...dude.. there I didn't flame. 1 You call me insincere because at first I say sorry cubu for bandwagoning him last game, then I call him out for lurking? I am not going to make a case against him for lurking, but I think a COUPLE words saying so and so are lurking we still need a post is fine. And yeah I will say cubu played really really bad last game. I wont apologize for saying that. I'm still sorry for lynching him. I was not trying to start a flame war for with cubu, I was just trying to get him to post. I think encouraging lurkers to post by calling them out or asking them questions is productive. Making cases against lurkers is not productive. It was just a couple of words, but it is all in the wording. It was the whole underlined, bolded, italicized call out of him. I agree that lurkers need a kick in the pants to start posting more. I'd like to see more posts from Cubu, Stutters, and Killing Time specifically. You've taken a few steps on the road to seeming town to me, but it's a long journey for you, I'm still sticking with my first call. 2 Show nested quote + I "keep on about NKs" only because people are calling me out for that statement and I want to defend myself. I will stop talking about NK if you stop. But since you brought it up again let me talk more about my stance on nks: + Show Spoiler + And if you're afraid to make yourself a target, then you don't put up as much as you can. NKs provide can provide just as much information as lynches can. On the first read through of your post, I was more convinced of your townieness. But your "I only talk about NKs because you guys talk about! But I'm going to talk about it again, and then say how it was a bad idea to talk about it in the first place." that's put me in an odd spot. It sends real mixed signals to me. 3 Show nested quote + I never reversed my stance on anything. 1 post a day is not lurking if its a long post. Lynch lurkers, yes, but 1 post a day does not make you a lurker. @sharron Is there anything else you want me to address or is that it? Also please give more effort to organize your posts better. Singling out the different arguments made against me was quite hard. I'll take this one as a misinterpretation of your wording earlier. You have the benefit of the doubt there, I retract that point from before. I think my post was more than adequately formatted, every point I called you on was bolded, every town read you gave was underlined, each point was addressed immediately afterwards, and was followed by a concise conclusion. If you have a suggestion on how to better format my posts, do tell. You've gained some leniency, in that I know have more of a doubt that you might just be a townie who just sort of blurts out whatever they're thinking, but my vote stays on you for now until you post your own scum reads. But I appreciate that you are remaining civil, I think it helps the town out more. KillingTime, you're starting to come up on my radar more and more. You seem to be riding coat tails, and posting a recap, rather than analysis of events, and then you come out swinging at debears based off of very, very little. People I would like to hear more from: debears, KillingTime, Rethos, Jacob You're all up there because I would like to get a better read on you, or I'd like to know more about your opinions. People I need to hear more from: Atreides, Cubu, Drazak, Remedy, Stutters And you're all up here because you're either suspicious, or lurking. My current suspicions are Kush (SK, possibly blue or self important green), KillingTime/debears (One of these two is mafia I think, more likely KT), Stutters (Maf, low content, low posts) We need to operate under the impression that among ourselves is not just the mafia, but a serial killer. It changes reads on people by an incredible amount. There's too many strategies open to an idependant killer if we don't also try to address them in our scum hunting. You basically stated that you are leaving kush alone. Yet you hide it in a mass of text about formatting. The rest of the post is you telling people who need to post. I liked the kush SK notion, but your current activity isn't making much sense. There are several points in this post where debears directly copies thrawn's arguments without backing them up. @Kush Why are you trying so hard to associate drazak, thrawn, and me. Understandly, my earlier posts would link me and thrawn. However, drazak does not come anywhere into play. Look at my filter there is one post about drazak. I'm not trying hard. I wrote one sentence bringing up that possibility, people asked me about it, and I answered them. If anything I was trying hard to get people to drop it. This is beating a dead horse to a bloody pulp. Either he didn't read my posts, or he is doing it on purpose. Scum loves shit like this because they can get a lot of scumhunt mileage over something that contributes nothing. (Kind of like getting on someone's ass for voting instead of fosing..) Basically he is copying thrawns argument directly without expanding on it or even explaining it, and he doesn't acknowledge my answers to thrawn. Kush is lieing. I'm lying about? Again this is a repeat of something thrawn said. With nothing to back it up or anything. Just randomly throwing down some baseless suspicion.The dick riding has continued, only instead of actually defending thrawn, he just copies all his claims and leaves out of the logic behind them. | ||
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I'm not going to vote yet. Day 1 scum reads are pretty bad. They are necessary, definitely, but it seems like they are just wrong more often than not. This leads me to the unpopular topic: How do people feel about lynching a lurker. I would much rather lynch a lurker day 1 than let them sit there with his automatic null read forever. And who would we lynch instead? A possible active townie who is just playing bad? Think about this, we have serious lurkers in CUBU and ATREIDES. We have semi lurkers in REMEDY and STUTTERS. How sure are you that Sharrant is mafia? Personally I'm not sure enough to vote for him over a lurker. | ||
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On September 19 2012 11:44 RemedySC wrote: Being active shouldn't exclude someone from a possible lynch candidate, so I still have my suspicions, but i'll leave those for later. Day 1, in a game with lurkers, I think being active should exclude someone from being lynched. Lynching an active poster day 1 usually results in lynching a townie, this is common mafia knowledge. Our reads of active players will get better. Our reads on lurkers will remain the same. | ||
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I would be open to changing my vote to cubu. | ||
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Going to bed now. | ||
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On September 19 2012 12:10 thrawn2112 wrote: kush what do you think about killing? he's been pretty lurky and has displayed some scummy behavior. I think he is very scummy and honestly the only reason I let up on him was because he accused debears who I thought was more scummy. | ||
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On September 19 2012 15:52 Stutters695 wrote: I'm really not sure about Kush. He's hard to read. He's active however so I'd like to see him contribute more and get a better read on him. One major question for him: Why were you honest about this? Telling everyone you're going to avoid getting night-killed so you can maintain a pointless streak serves no purpose from a town perspective. All it does is provide excuses for you for any potential bad play and if you're town waste time on unnecessary discussion. You also say: He says he isn't sure enough to vote Sharrant over a lurker, but he's willing to vote debears. What makes you think he is a better scum lynch than removing a lurker or lynching Scharrant. bringing up the nk shit again....ok. i think its bad play to make yourself a nk target because you are worthless if you are this super strong townie d1, then get nk n1. I think thrawn is a good player but he definitely fell into this trap last game. he made himself a target and his death told us nothing. I only bring this up again to save stutters the task of reading through my filter. ok second question: why do I want to lynch debears over sharrant...I talk about this a lot. basically i see scum motivation in debears bad play but not in sharrants bad play. why am I willing to vote for debears over a lurker? honestly I would probably rather lynch a lurker over him, just because I think d1 reads I'm general are ass. We were voting for our biggest scumread, though, just to see what bandwagons were viable. also voting for a lurker at that point would have been stupid because we don't even know which lurker we would consolidate on. cubu is lurking even harder than last game. | ||
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My ideal situation is: push debears up to L-1, get him to roleclaim, then if I am satisfied with his answer, vote up either KillingTime or Stutters. Here's what this line of reasoning looks like me. It looks like you are scum and your motivation here is to get someone to roleclaim. Then you back that up with a lurker vote. Except killing really isn't a lurker. And for some reason you ignore the huge lurker cubu. | ||
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On September 20 2012 00:16 Sharrant wrote: And if that happened, you guys would auto lynch me and the guy who came in with the lurker vote. It'd be suicide. Killing one townie (even a blue) is not worth one mafia, let alone 2. KT definitely has been lurking, he only just made a few posts with no substance. So if I'm mafia, my plan is akin to gamethrowing. I'd be killing two mafia to kill a single person that 3 other people agree is suspicious enough to warrant a vote. THAT MAKES NO SENSE. I'll gladly tell you after my plan fails or succeeds what it was. Hell, at this point it's almost worth dropping just because it's going to get me lynched at this pace. ANTECEDENTS PEOPLE....... And if that happened, you guys would auto lynch me and the guy who came in with the lurker vote. What is "that"? No idea what this sentence means. No idea what your "plan" is (all I know is it's stupid) No idea who you are saying would be lynched or who would be mafia. Sounds like a bunch of wifom speculation. | ||
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On September 20 2012 00:24 RemedySC wrote: + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2012 19:46 kushm4sta wrote: ok second question: why do I want to lynch debears over sharrant...I talk about this a lot. basically i see scum motivation in debears bad play but not in sharrants bad play. Can you go into more depth about what you see as scum motivation? Most of your argument is in this post. - + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2012 03:11 kushm4sta wrote: ##FOS Debears I looked at this guy's filter again. And yeah it's fishy as hell. So now I'm less suspicious of killingtime, more suspicious of debears. First thing isn't it da bears not de bears?? His initial dickriding of thrawn strikes me as something that could just be indicative of newbie play. It's more productive to make cases against scum than cases for town, especially out of the blue when no one is even accusing the townie. But the latter is easier so it is very possible this is just a newb mistake. But in his latest post he simultaneously continues the dick ride and defends his right to dickride. Incoming possible scumslip: People really need to learn to specify antecedents btw. After about an hour of rereading I figured out that what he is actually saying here is that thrawn's retarded idea to lynch the last person who posts makes him town. He purports himself an expert on the "mafia perspective" even though this is his first game. I would like more explanation about this line specifically: What do you mean mafia would "jump on him about the idea?" As in they would like or get mad at him for it? Are you saying that thinking that idea is bad makes you scum? It is pretty much information that had been mentioned before, so can you elaborate more? Sure remedy. I will speak more about the mafia motivation. Debear's buddying is something see mafia motivation in. Buddying is a known trait of scum do and it serves many purposes. 1 Gives them safe reads by copying a known or confirmed town. 2 Wins the favor of the strong town to avoid accusal by that town. ie buddy up with thrawn so he won't accuse me 3 Makes them look more innocent by association with a confirmed innocent. I read about buddying in a guide somewhere. It is known to be something that inexperienced mafia do. Sharrant's roleclaim/serial killer retardation is bad play I think. It makes no sense to me. I do not see the motivation for it as town, but I also don't see the motivation for it as scum. | ||
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I'm still not understanding how your actions magically prove your innocence. what is L-1? Isn't he already that? | ||
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I'm not a serious lynch candidate today. At this point your vote just unfocuses the town. You don't even say why you are voting for me. Your case against me was made a really long time ago. Also it is real weak. And you blast me for the weakness of my cases? You are actually one of the biggest lurkers at this point btw. | ||
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question I really want answered from sharrant: is this your first game of forum mafia? I asked him before but he didn't answer. | ||
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Also guys if we are going to have an choice to lynch a lurker, which one shall it be? Cubu's filter is just enough to prevent modkill. | ||
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On September 20 2012 02:00 RemedySC wrote: Kush, you seem way too intent on lynching a lurker. Why does it have to be a lurker? You say my vote unfocuses the town. Why would my vote on you unfocus the town? Your defense seems to be that my vote would just bring confusion. Right now we are trying to figure out who to lynch. That is what town needs to be talking about now, not random suspicions. Why do I want to lynch a lurker? Because sharrant doesn't seem scummy enough to be a better vote than a lurker. I would rather lynch a lurker d1 than have to waste a later vote on a lurker. I do not want there to be the presence of a town lurker for mafia to safely vote for again and again. Are we just going to let cubu lurk all game, posting 1 shitty thing a day, and pray that he's not scum? | ||
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Lynching someone active d1 almost always results in lynching a townie! Can i present an alternative bandwagon for the people who think he's probably town: CUBU... He is winning the race for biggest lurker. At least if he is town we can lynch and not feel so bad if he flips green. On September 19 2012 20:25 Cubu wrote: Oh and sorry for lurking, but i am really busy with assignments. I gotta write four 2k word essays by next week. So basically he is saying that he will continue to lurk throughout the whole game. Until next week is a long time. We have 3 options. 1 We lynch him now as a policy lynch. 2 We let him live and continue to argue lurker policy until we lynch him. 3 We ignore him and just rely on the 75% chance he is town. Our read of sharrant will get better. Our read of drazak will remain null. I'm unvoting debears but I still suspect him. Just that bandwagon isn't happening anymore and I would rather lynch a lurker anyway. ##unvote debears ##vote cubu | ||
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Scummy by not talking about what is going on in the game at all. This recent post... wtf you spend the entire time talking about what you say you shouldn't talk about. Dropping it for now as there are bigger fish to fry today. Still suspicious. Then why are you continuing to ride my ass instead of frying those fishes? You really want me to talk more about the nk? Like seriously you are bringing up the nk shit again? Now? Can you please fucking vote please?? | ||
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On September 20 2012 04:01 RemedySC wrote: Also why would the town feel less badly about Cubu turning up green than sharrant? Everyone else seems to have a good indication that he is mafia. Are you trying to protect him? Why would a green cubu lynch feel better than green sharrant lynch? Because lurkers are bad for town. Sharrant is very active and does a lot of scumhunting. That helps town. Seems pretty self explanatory to me. I said from the beginning that unless we have a really good scum read that we could agree on I think we should lynch a lurker. For me sharrant is not a good scumread. His recent posts definitely have made him more scummy in my eyes. Certain stuff he just won't let go for some reason... like to let it go would admit to his guilt. Also all that talk about mods and not understanding the game. It's not clear to me what he didn't understand and what he was planning on doing in the first place. However it just doesn't make sense to me that a first time forum mafia player rolling scum would put himself out like that | ||
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Killing is not that much of a lurker. He's not lurker enough to even be considered a lurker IMO. Killing is scummy looking to me, but he looked that way last game too. | ||
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to the people saying keep the vote cuba are you fucking kidding me or what? either they are both mafia or they are both town. You think they are both mafia and sharrant is stupid enough to give up both mafia... sharrant vote and cubu vote just seems totally ridiculous to me. ##unvote we need an alternate bandwagon and we need it fast. I like debears if people really don't want to lynch a lurker. I like another lurker as the best choice though I'm not sure which one I would pick now. drazak maybe? I want to here what other people think. we need an epic swift band wagon of justice or we are going to get a no lynch | ||
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##vote drazzak | ||
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drazak I didn't even think drazak is scummy. I just voted for him now because of the last minute omg we need to vote for someone confusion. 1 he is not that scummy. a lot of scumhunting and nothing that strikes me as a huge scumslip 2 he's not even a lurker. I thought he was more of a lurker but I just went through his filter and I would not consider him a lurker. killingtime i was in the process of reading his filter just now, but i just realized the deadline already passed. so fail. | ||
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On September 20 2012 09:16 Atreides- wrote: The instant bandwagon against him is pretty interesting, and it's obvious now that the mafia had a strong hand in it. No? What caused that instant bandwagon was sharrant telling everybody that he and cubu were masons. suddenly our 2 bandwagons went to shit and town had to insta pick another because time was almost up. | ||
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On September 20 2012 09:22 thrawn2112 wrote: Kush, you have been a big "we must lynch the biggest lurker" advocate. Based on that last line you were writing that post before you saw the drazak flip right? So not only did you not follow your own policy in your final vote (there are lurkier people than drazak), you also voted for someone that you didn't think is scummy. On top of all of that your drazak vote was even worse than drazak's sharrant vote. Time to go read through your filter. sighhh... yes that post was before i saw the flip. i was in the process of looking through killing's filter to try to figure out if i would rather vote for him. Cubu was the biggest lurker and i think it's obvious after sharrant's roleclaim that we shouldn't lynch him anymore. who is the next biggest lurker? no one comes to mind really and i didn't have time to find out esp not on my cell phone. drazak seemed like the only option at the time. | ||
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this all happened at the last minute you have to realize. i did not have time to weigh my options. all i knew was that i didn't want to vote for cubu anymore. | ||
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@ thrawn you are the one who pushed a lynch on the active, obviously town, mason. you are the one who right after said it might still be a good idea to lynch cubu. you are the one who shoudl feel bad. goodnight. | ||
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On September 20 2012 09:40 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: Why would you say that? Basically everyone made it clear they were open for voting on Killing. No! When i voted for drazak everyone made it clear they wanted to vote for drazak... page 21... sharrant, CONFIRMED TOWN, as far as I am concerned at this point, says My biggest lurker lynch candidate is Drazak, by far. then sdm votes drazzak. drazak says some scummy shit. this was the stuff i read at the time, not his filter. then thrawn says So killing/drazak but I say drazak. then i say ok looks like drazzak is the bandwagon then ##vote drazzak | ||
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@sonic you keep saying that you want to wait for a response from sharrant before you post this epic wall of text case. What exactly do you want him to address. Maybe you said it before but this thread recently has blown up. Is there a secific question you want him to answer or an issue you want him to address? All this sharrant doubt seems really stupid to me. The only way sharrant is scum is if cubu is also scum. Therefore if sharrant was scum, a blue could identify one of them and boom we would have 2 scum. It makes no sense for scum to roleclaim mason like that. | ||
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I have not read any of the recent posts yet. I mean i skimmed it for the big stuff, like the new guy confirming mason (big shocker there). I've seen sonic and thrawn accuse me of disappearing before the lynch so I'd like to address that. When I voted for drazak at that time I thought ok drazak is going to be lynched tonight. Too late to examine other bandwagons.. bye drazak. My point is I didn't think at the time there was a chance at anyone else. Then people start talking about killing. Thrawn asks me to give my thoughts about drazak vs killing. As soon as I see that post I start working on my response. But the problem I haven't really looked into drazak or killing for a long time so I'm not familiar with their filters. I read drazak's filter and write my response to that. I thought drazak was not as big of a lurker as I remembered and he didn't look that scummy to me. Then I start reading killing's filter. I was very prepared to switch my vote. Killing did not seem that suspicious to me, but he sure seemed more suspicious than drazak. I was going to finish reading killing's filter, and then write why I think he is a better lynch. Except as I go to write about killing, I realize the deadline has already passed. Fuck me, I think to myself, and I post my incomplete post. Here it is: On September 20 2012 09:09 kushm4sta wrote: My thoughts on killing vs drazak. drazak I didn't even think drazak is scummy. I just voted for him now because of the last minute omg we need to vote for someone confusion. 1 he is not that scummy. a lot of scumhunting and nothing that strikes me as a huge scumslip 2 he's not even a lurker. I thought he was more of a lurker but I just went through his filter and I would not consider him a lurker. killingtime i was in the process of reading his filter just now, but i just realized the deadline already passed. so fail. Now let me clarify something: killingtime is not my strongest scumread. I just thought he was probably a better option than drazak. So no I did not "go poof." I lost track of time. Yes I should have been more attentive to the thread, but I thought the drazak bandwagon was more unstoppable than it was. | ||
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But right now here's where i am. For now, debears is my top scumread. He was since yesterday and yeah nothing has changed. Need to read his newer posts though. Thrawn seems significantly off his meta. Anyone who has played with him before recognize this? He's angrier, more accusatory. And I think a lot of his reads are uncharacteristically bad. | ||
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On September 19 2012 03:23 drazak wrote: I like how people keep saying they need to hear more form me when I basically said my posting schedule for today, kind of cracks me up and makes me wonder if people are actually reading others posts, or just skimming them. So, the first thing I'd like to bring up is that Killingtime said that he doesn't think FoS is good on day one. So killingtime, how would you get information d1? Would you just lurk in the shadows and look for someone slip up on their own without bring pressured? FOS forces someone to be pressured into giving an answer, the same as voting for someone. If you don't FOS or vote for people oN D!, you're not doing anything to advance town's agenda. So basically what I'm getting at is: ##FOS Killingtime Hey diude, what're your top 2 scum picks? Who are your top two town reads? Do you have anyone you'd like to look at more? As far as looking at Debears goes, I think it's a dead end, I'd definitely like to see his response, but I don't think your reasoning was very good kush, you yourself have show how saying something would look from each perspecting, which is exactly what Debears was doing. IN addition, it's an examination of motives, which is important, everyone has a motive. I don't really have any questions or other comments, I'll let you know if I do. If I missed some questions aimed at me, let me know, I wish there was a better way to look at a filter of posts that mention me, you know? | ||
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anyway that's what I learned from last game when all of my feel reads were wrong. kush out | ||
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On September 21 2012 04:15 thrawn2112 wrote: No offense to kush but kush's scumteam theory was completely awful. What I see is you coming in and sheeping onto an insubstantial case in order to get a mislynch on me, drazak and (maybe) debears. That scumteam idea is such a weak argument I find it hard to believe a town player would honestly use it. Which leads me to wonder why kush brough it up in the first place, but I'm still unsure of kush because I have a hard time serparating crazy scum things he could have said with crazy town things he always said in previous games. No offense to thrawn but thrawns everything theories are completely awful. What do I think of your atreides theory? HUH is what I think. I read his posts. I read your posts regarding his posts. I read them again. and again and again. I still dont get it. You are saying he said he didn't know about no lynch but did know about no lynch. Just confused the fuck out of me. What did he even do wrong...why does that make him mafia. Atriedes just strikes as a big noob basically. He says stupid shit that makes no sense, but that doesn't make him mafia. | ||
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Nothing I have said is scummy! I've just been trying to be honest with my intentions and what I'm thinking. I will stand by any statement I make as genuine, even if it's not completely thought out. Yes I say what's on my mind stop saying that is scummy. | ||
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Your two main arguments against him. 1 He sheeped on my retarded scumteam notion. I don't like this read because it seems like the case here is stupidity = scum. Not everyone is as enlightened as you about the uselessness of association cases. Are they bad? Yes I agree with that but I don't think making them is a scumtell. 2 His useless vote for me. I don't see the scum motivation in this, since both our bandwagons were town. He is not following the town plan of consolidating our bandwagon, but we never made that plan concrete really. He didn't believe in the sharrant case. He has been consistently against lynching lurkers, so that's why he wouldn't vote for cubu. | ||
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K guys I did the legwork on this monster of a filter. Tell me what you think. 1 Being active when he said he'd be lurking On September 14 2012 07:26 thrawn2112 wrote: i do have internet, i just have to walk/ride a long ass time to get it. Thrawn was quite reluctant to join this game. Before the game started he warned us that he would be lurking more than usual. Except that hasn't happened. In fact, he has been extremely active. Imagine this, thrawn, in his 4th game, finally gets mafia, the role he has dreamt of ever since he learned about the game. That is something that could spur activity. 2 His multitude of paper thin cases. These are his accusations throughout the game so far. 1 fos sonic for making a survey 2 fos killing for saying he doesn't like FOS 3 vote sharrant for saying a bunch of different stupid shit Yet debears does not earn an fos even though he gives them out like candy... then d2 4 fos debears for copying his arguments (d1 it was ok d2 it's not?) 5 atreides he tells me I need to look at for being confused about no lynch 6 remedy who is suddenly out of no where his TOP scumread. Thrawn's case: he made a commented on a stupid scumteam thought I had. Also he didn't vote for a bandwagon d1. And that's his "biggest read"... Here is him yelling at killingtime for making a thin case: On September 19 2012 02:06 thrawn2112 wrote: Killing are you for real? You make a post devoid of content which I call you out for, then in your next post you actually start talking about current discussion but then you make a vote for someone based on a single sentence of justification? But less than an hour earlier thrawn makes a case also based on only 1 sentence of justification: On September 19 2012 01:16 thrawn2112 wrote: ##Fos KillingTime Nice contribution to the thread. Do you really think that's something worth talking about when there are already lots of other discussions going on? 3 His total lapse of logic after sharrant role claims. On September 20 2012 06:57 thrawn2112 wrote: So, I don't know if I should trust this mason claim or not, but what does everyone think about this plan: So maybe we should lynch cubu, and if cubu flips mason well then at least we have a confirmed town player (sharrant) and we haven't lost a useful poster. If Cubu doesn't flip mason then we atuo lynch sharrant D2. What does everyone think about this plan huh? Well what I think is that you are fishing to see if town will follow this madness. Cubu is basically confirmed town and you want to lynch him anyway. 4 the real story of d1 Thrawn is on my ass about a redirection of a killing lynch onto drazak. Well that did not happen. The real redirection, which no one has even talked about, is from debears to sharrant. Debears had a majority vote. Thrawn defends debears, pushes sharrant, and suddenly sharrant has the majority vote. | ||
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I can see scenarios where scum or sk got blocked, or they both nk the same person. But until we actually see evidence of SK we should treat this game like there is no sk. | ||
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I think he's implying that he got roleblocked. | ||
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He's was our JK. | ||
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On September 21 2012 07:40 kushm4sta wrote: #fos thrawn K guys I did the legwork on this monster of a filter. Tell me what you think. 1 Being active when he said he'd be lurking Thrawn was quite reluctant to join this game. Before the game started he warned us that he would be lurking more than usual. Except that hasn't happened. In fact, he has been extremely active. Imagine this, thrawn, in his 4th game, finally gets mafia, the role he has dreamt of ever since he learned about the game. That is something that could spur activity. Obviously regardless of my alignment I am in a position to be posting up the same amount that's been my meta so far. I did not think I would have computer access this game but that has changed. Your argument is basically that before the game even started I lied about how much posting I could do somehow knowing or hoping against odds that I would be mafia and I could use that to trick people into making a false meta read. Well I don't know the specifics of your situation. I'm assuming some brokeback mountain type scenario, in which you can get to a computer if you really want to but it's kind of a bother. A mafia roll might give you that nudge to make you put in the extra effort to be more active. 2 His multitude of paper thin cases. These are his accusations throughout the game so far. 1 fos sonic for making a survey That happened at the very start of the game. Of course any accusation at that point is going to be weak. The accusation was based on me seeing a simialar action from when he was scum in our last game. I didn't see the point of the surveys. Last game as scum he proposed that people make read lists which I thought that was a scummy tactic. He was scum that game leading me to think he was doing a similar thing in this one. When bringing up these cases, I didn't focus on any in particular. That is because it's not the cases themselves that are really suspect. It's how freely you accuse so many different people, and most of your cases are based on very little. 2 fos killing for saying he doesn't like FOS I didn't fos him for him saying he didn't like FOS. I fos'd him for coming into the thread at a point when people were alread makking and sharing reads and he made a fluff post. 3 vote sharrant for saying a bunch of different stupid shit bunch of stupid shit = making a vote for debears based on a paragraph of reasoning and saying he wants to force debears to role claim. Later I stuck to my vote because he was talking about a secret plan that he wasn't willing to share with us. I assumed he was suggesting he was a blue role and I even tried to think through what possible things a blue player could do in that situation and I came up with nothing so his claim that he had a plan seemed like a complete lie. Although I disagree with it, I do not think that suspecting sharrant was scummy. Definitely your most justified read. Yet debears does not earn an fos even though he gives them out like candy... then d2 4 fos debears for copying his arguments (d1 it was ok d2 it's not?) First you say i am supicisous for not fosing debears and when I do it makes me suspicious? It's that you did fos him n1 for doing the same thing he did d1. Why not fos him d1 then? 5 atreides he tells me I need to look at for being confused about no lynch I don't see what's scummy about that I looked this over and I understand your argument better now. Correct me if I'm wrong but he said he was afk yet he was there 1 minute after lynch. Is that it? And I do see the scumhunt logic in that. 6 remedy who is suddenly out of no where his TOP scumread. Thrawn's case: he made a commented on a stupid scumteam thought I had. Also he didn't vote for a bandwagon d1. And that's his "biggest read"... I've already told you that my case on remedy isn't because he agreed with a stupid post. here and also read my post right after it. About your case against remedy: I disagree that voting for me is a scumtell. As for the second part of your argument, are you saying that his one comment about the probably scumteam means that he was willing to lynch 2 confirmed town? I do not see the connection. Just because he comments on the plausibility of a scumteam doesn't team he's ready to lynch all of them. Here is him yelling at killingtime for making a thin case: But less than an hour earlier thrawn makes a case also based on only 1 sentence of justification: Yes it's hypocritical but that doesnt mean scum So if it added to your suspicion of killingtime, why can't it add to my suspicion of you? Pointing out a scumtrait in someone else does not make you immune to being accused for that trait. 3 His total lapse of logic after sharrant role claims. What does everyone think about this plan huh? Well what I think is that you are fishing to see if town will follow this madness. Cubu is basically confirmed town and you want to lynch him anyway. I didn't try to push it much further than that. I think it was stutters who pointed out what the worst possible outcome of that plan was and I dropped it after that and started contributing to the lurker lynch discussion Of course you wouldn't push it more than that. You wanted to see how willing town was to go along with it. When you realized we weren't willing, you dropped it immediately. 4 the real story of d1 Thrawn is on my ass about a redirection of a killing lynch onto drazak. Well that did not happen. The real redirection, which no one has even talked about, is from debears to sharrant. Where did I accuse you of redirecting from killing to drazak? You accused me of voting for drazak even though I admitted to killing being the better lynch. Not exactly redirection though, you're right. Debears had a majority vote. Thrawn defends debears, pushes sharrant, and suddenly sharrant has the majority vote. That's an association case so it's assuming that at bare minimum, debears is confirmed scum in order for me to be scum. Remember the first game we played together? Shadysands got town to change their vote from mafia to town. I'm suggesting you may have done something similar. It's just that we had a majority on debears, and then for some reason that majority just disappeared, and I'm wondering why. | ||
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Thrawn: im waiting for other people's input. I have to say though claiming roleblock like that seems pretty town to me. 1 I dont think it's a lie and 2 why would scum share that information. I don't know what to think about it honestly. Debears: I read through this guy's filter, tried to expand my case against him to be more than just "thrawn copycat," but I came up with nothing to say. I mean his recent play doesn't impress me but it doesn't set off any whistles either. There are a lot of people who have been very off my radar and I need to give them a closer look. Killingtime mainly but there are others. | ||
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all he did was turn this thread into scum paradise basically. | ||
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On September 21 2012 23:53 JacobStrangelove wrote: Also Kush you seem extra annoyed, I would almost say you are over doing yourself. Kush is currently one of my largest active scum reads. His meta seems to be himself plus a bit extra, however as it was mentioned before we probably should focus more on the lurkers incase we lose a active town(we have so few of these or even posibilities for these). (note: kush was pushing on someone I see as an town in the form of thrawn{also kush if you could answer my previous argument it would be good}) K sorry guys I didn't realize that no one is allowed to doubt thrawn. His penis... it's just too strong. | ||
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On September 21 2012 14:34 JacobStrangelove wrote: Ok this was my kush case from last night (the one that I was unsure about) I will post it in a spoiler so you can see what I was thinking. + Show Spoiler + I’m getting more and more tired again however I will move onto kush. I don’t think anybody denies kush is hard to read. But I will list the things of meta that I know about kush. He posts a lot he tends to be spazzy and is highly illogical. That said don’t know what his mafia meta is like (I imagine it would be similar) and he seems to be more so strange than usual. For one he is more bi-polar than usual. (last game he was pretty sure on his reads and I had to force him to change) I am tired to I will just copy paste. I am looking to step up my play this game. Last game was quite humbling for me. I made a lot of bad calls, and d1 caused a mislynch >< IM SORRY CUBU Very next post If you write 1 post a day but it's a brilliant epic post then that's cool with me. I can be realistic about people's busy schedules. And that is WAY better than a few little posts with no content. .. and I'm looking at you STUTTERS, DRAZAK, and ESPECIALLY CUBU who were all town last game but pretty trash town. While this isn’t a read it goes from Sorry to YOU’RE TRASH. But I will get to the actual reads now. Oh lol, just ran into this by kush. You call me insincere because at first I say sorry cubu for bandwagoning him last game, then I call him out for lurking? I am not going to make a case against him for lurking, but I think a COUPLE words saying so and so are lurking we still need a post is fine. And yeah I will say cubu played really really bad last game. I wont apologize for saying that. I'm still sorry for lynching him. I was not trying to start a flame war for with cubu, I was just trying to get him to post. I think encouraging lurkers to post by calling them out or asking them questions is productive. Making cases against lurkers is not productive. (this part is from today) So with this I kinda stopped because his filter was large and I needed sleep, I still didn’t end up sleeping for a while after but in anycase. Ok this is where I left off my kush thoughts however now I will continue from a point I can analise just before the mason claim. Before the mason claim you write this. Then when he realises another bandwagon is needed he says He dropped his killing idea entirely he said it was because he didn’t have time to read killings filter but assuming he didn’t leave there is a hour gap at least before the vote. Killings filter isn’t that large. and if he thought he was scummy before surely he wouldn't need to read that much filter to catch up... Also he says this When just before he mentioned Drazak maybe? There must be some reason for this... He probably made a hint at a bandwagon and then pretended he jumped on it 100% bandwagon style because he “had no say in the matter” He didn’t jump on the bandwagon he planted the seed... He said to go for drazak over killing, The only mention I could find before this was sharrent saying he would go for drazak but then saying killing or drazak. So my theory is kush sees this jumps on drazak with the one line instead of killing (why?) Are they both scum? Who knows but in anycase it worked sonic went on drazak and sharrent went on drazak. Sharrent was on him already but he is almost 100% confirmed town now, sonic is confirmed town and kush looks to be the one who jumped in on the flow of things. /Flame on + Show Spoiler + We were town buds last game but this game I don't respect you at all. You are mostly afk basically for the first day. You make posts but they have a sum total of 0 content. You circumlocute, you say some obvious shit. The only thing that is keeping me from suspecting you is the fact that you also made no sense last game. I don't know maybe you should stop playing for a while until you learn the english language? I didn't read drazak's filter until I saw the post from thrawn telling me to give my thoughts on killing and drazak. Yes I bandwagoned on him. Partly because I remembered him being a bigger lurker than he actually was. I had looked at killing's filter previously, and I thought it was not that scummy. Let me go through my thought process chronologically. Sharrant claims him and cubu masons. me: O fuck well I have no idea who to vote for right now. Who is the next biggest lurker? I don't really know since no one was even close to as much of a lurker as cubu. Maybe drazak. I remember him being one of the lurker lynch candidates. A bunch of other people vote drazak. me: k i guess drazak is the lurker lynch we are going with. vote drazak. Then I semi afk but still glance at the thread now and then. Because if someone makes a compelling case for someone else and people vote change, I am willing to vote change with them (because I'm not wed to voting for drazak in any way). I notice that thrawn asks me to share my thoughts on killing vs drazak. NOTE: I don't know when I saw this post. Honestly I was not watching the clock. I was doing other things and looking back at the thread periodically. Thrawn made the post with about 45 minutes left until lynch time. I read through both filters, and was going to say "yup drazak doesn't look that scummy, thrawn looks scummier, i would totally be down for a vote change. Then I realize that its' already past the deadline. | ||
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I read through both filters, and was going to say "yup drazak doesn't look that scummy, killing looks scummier, i would totally be down for a vote change. Then I realize that its' already past the deadline. | ||
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On September 22 2012 01:02 thrawn2112 wrote: Well obviously if he were mafia he lied about being bored. It'd be just another lie after the several he made in the span of like 10 minutes. Why would he leave the game if he wasn't bored? | ||
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On September 22 2012 01:17 thrawn2112 wrote: because I had just outed him as mafia. sounds like cheating to me but that is at the mod's discretion So just that suspicion was enough to make him say oh fuck the only way out of this is to quit from the game and pretend im bored? That doesn't seem likely to me. | ||
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In newbie xxv (I think) scum dandel ion offered to leave. This was because he felt he was too busy to properly defend himself as mafia, not because he thought it was the only escape from suspicion. So whether town or mafia I think rethos really was bored. He was not bored pregame when he drew a cat. He was not bored d1 when he was very active and made a vote count. That I agree with. He became bored, though, and that accounts for his long afk. If you accept that he was actually bored, the case against him falls apart. It makes sense that he lied about wanting to test lurker leniency, because he didn't want to admit to his boredom. Also it fit his point about not pressuring the lurkers enough. | ||
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Mafia does not leave games as a tactic. | ||
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Is there a chance he is scum? I doubt it but of course there is a chance. I'm saying that I think bored mafia is more likely than mafia that uses faked boredom into quitting the game as a scum strategy. | ||
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Why do I think he's not scum? because scum are less likely to.get bored. because being bored gives him a reason to lie about testing towns lurker leniency. | ||
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1 he left because he was actually bored, not as scum tactic. 2 if he was actually bored, his lie makes sense. the nature of boredom Think about what happens when you get bored of a game. you stop playing it as frequently. you get bored sometimes before you even realize you are bored. you come back to try to play the game and you realize...damn I'm bored. He was not bored day 1...he became bored and that is what caused his long afk. Why didn't he admit to being bored when he first came back? because he didnt want to admit it to himself yet. why did he lie about it? he had no reason to be afk so he might as well say something that reinforced his anti lurker message. | ||
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I'm dropping it. | ||
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your case against remedy is just lack of scumhunting right? I think its true that he's all accusation and no argumentation. I want to look onto that more, then ask him to expand on his reasoning for some of.his accusations and see what he comes up with. | ||
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1 Remedy's useless vote parked on me d1. Bad town yes, scum no. I don't see the scum motivation behind it, especially since both our bandwagons were town. 2 His comment on my drazak, thrawn, debears scumteam idea. The idea itself was worth nothing.. just something like hmmm here's something to ponder. His comment was similar. It's not like he based any cases on the scumteam idea. Well he doesn't make cases really at all. But yeah I don't consider his comment regarding that scumteam a big tell. | ||
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He gives an excuse for lurking during the next few days, but he also allows himself the possibility of posting (phone posts). ##FOS stutters | ||
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A lot of the cases he has been trying to bandwagon just make no sense to me, and I know other people feel the same. It's like he finds any instance of bad play and tries to turn it into a bandwagon. Look at these two quotes: This regarding my case against him. You either haven't grasped the logic of a lot of my cases (specifically the remedy which till now you'e ignored my request for you to give a read on him) or you're scum. (The only case I didn't understand was the atreides one. Because it was convoluted as fuck.) Are you still high or are you scum? These two quotes, the "or are you scum" quotes I would expect from an aggressive newb, but thrawn's meta is none of those things. @thrawn what is the purpose of these questions? Are they jokes or what? Here is my original case against him with his reply then my reply to his reply. The only feedback I got was from jacob who accused me because I accused thrawn. He didn't even mention the case itself. + Show Spoiler + | ||
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I haven't come into the thread baked saying random shit today.... and I'm not the only one who thinks your insistence on rethos' guilt is crazy. | ||
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I do agree with a lot of your post though. He says rethos follows the bad townie mold, but so does remedy in almost exactly the same way. I think their bad scum hunting is pretty much a null tell on both of them though. It makes sense that a first time player would be bad at scum hunting. He does dismiss the case against rethos, and just basically says well he looked town before that part, then he looked wtf. MOVING ON. I don't know exactly why dandel doesn't think it's worth his time to defend himself. Maybe he feels like his opinion doesn't hold much value on the matter because it's obviously biased. But I also see his point of view that we were in an argument where the same things were being repeated again and again and he didn't think it was productive. Not sure about the vig shot. Is it a bad strategy to save town a lynch by killing a lurker? I haven't really thought but i think it could be a good idea. What if the vig waits till the end to use it but he is killed then it goes to waste? I don't think mentioning that is scummy. | ||
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I am not dead set in this. However, I'm not fucking voting for dandel. ##vote stutters | ||
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Also I don't want to vote for you because I suspect you but I still think there's a good chance you might be town and to lose a town thrawn at this point would be really bad. I want to be more sure of your alignment before I vote for you. | ||
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l2english please | ||
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On September 22 2012 11:02 JacobStrangelove wrote: + Show Spoiler + Ok I woke, up. On September 22 2012 00:43 kushm4sta wrote: /Flame on + Show Spoiler + We were town buds last game but this game I don't respect you at all. You are mostly afk basically for the first day. You make posts but they have a sum total of 0 content. You circumlocute, you say some obvious shit. The only thing that is keeping me from suspecting you is the fact that you also made no sense last game. I don't know maybe you should stop playing for a while until you learn the english language? Ouch... you really do take OMGUS to a new level. I am going to wait a minute so I don’t do the same. Yes we were town buddies last game, this is part of the reason I thought you were just acting like your normal self at the start. But you are acting like your normal self + annoyed and angry. You mentioned a test before did it really go that badly? Yes I was mostly afk by my standards, but my standards were still posting more than most people while busy with assignments. Why would I try to post as much as I can? If I were mafia I would have remained low key. Also part of the reason I messed up was because I am committed to this game. Even when I was completely exhausted(and frustrated) I make several posts because I wanted to be in this game (although I was tired to the point where I was miss reading stuff) That tired as mafia I would never post in this thread it would be insane. I am going to ignore the part about making no sense last game and needing to learn English as that will only get me angry. My point is you seem to be far more emotional and frustrated without reason... Thrawn might be scum, but the fact is you were pushing on someone who also had the potential to be the best poster (with our two confirmed town afk) However incase you are town it would be detrimental to lose you (same with thrawn) so I will move onto the lurkers. I have to admit Thawns logic isn’t completely easy to follow sometimes and his case on atreides did seem odd. But I will update my thoughts on the Daniel Ion case Rethos was scummy before he lied scummier after lying and almost impossible to read after he is gone... One thing I will say is Thrawn and kush are going in circles... Daniel points this out however at the same time he tries to get the focus off that onto his remedy case. On September 22 2012 06:15 Dandel Ion wrote: This isn't constructive. Talk about something else pls. Like my Remedy case. I like my Remedy case. Who else likes my Remedy case? Who doesn't like my Remedy case? Pls include reasons. While I will talk about this it is just something that stood out. I could have confirmation bias though. Also while with reason he goes on Remedy that was also the biggest bandwagon before he was underfire. However onto remedy. Yes he sheeps onto bad plans especially ones that would get multiple town killed. He also wasn’t around in a crucial time and comes in 9 min late(I am paraphrasing some of what thrawn wrote) However one hole I found in his case so far is ________________________________________ On September 21 2012 09:42 RemedySC wrote: Okay, I don't think mafia got lucky in killing a blue. Looks like other than the Sharrant read, Sonic's biggest read was Atreides-, Debears, and Killing. All three have had good arguments made against them. Possibly they they thought Sonic might have more info. ________________________________________ Remedy this post sets off my scum alarms. I son't have any evidence (and neither do you) why mafia would have killed sonic other than that he was really townish and I don't think anyone suspected him. So when you start talking about how they might have killed him because of his reads it just makes me think there's some manipulation going on behind his nightkill and your post. Now you seemed to miss this On September 21 2012 09:44 RemedySC wrote: EBWOP - I mean I think Mafia got lucky that Sonic was a blue. Still suspicious but not as suspicious, also here On September 21 2012 13:01 RemedySC wrote: You know, I could see sonic role blocking you. His power also allows him to save someone, if his strongest town read was you, then he would use it on you. He could have been trying to make thrawn look less like town, because if mafia did block him (and he didn’t lie about it) then thrawn is more likely to be town. On September 21 2012 14:43 RemedySC wrote: Just re-read this post and want to address it. I acknowledged an idea, that is all. Nothing ever came of it afterwards. He draws attention to an idea but nothing happens with it (because no town jumps on?) In other words I do think regent looks scummy. So does now Daniel ion though. Who looks worse? Rethos made a very impressive slip though, but should we give Daniel the time for him to convince him he is town? However now I move onto stutters. Twice consistently he comes in after someone calls him out. Three posts in what 48 hours? I have posted cases about him in the past for not lurking when he said he had time ect… and he sheeps onto drazak along with most people though. It’s a pity it’s harder to find stuff with him because he has lurked so much. I know there is something else I was going to say but I forgot… On September 22 2012 04:00 thrawn2112 wrote: Lol in my first mafia game as town I got really baked and then I lurked in the thread taking notes and making theories. I took a nap, woke up and proceeded to make the mother of all scummy-sounding posting sprees. So if you're town then my advice is: don't play this game high, don't even read the thread. So you believe the boredom claim no matter if he is town or scum right? Is there a reason for you doubting he's scum or is it just a gut feeling? Yeah don’t get baked, don’t work on 4 hours sleep, and don’t get drunk. *goes to get drunk* I said it before and I will say it again. The measure of a lurker is not his post count, it's not his word count. It's matter of contribution to the scumhunt. Jacob is an active lurker, and that reeks of scum. Can anyone even remember a stance jacob has taken? Remedy, killing, stutters, atreides, I can remember something about all of them without even looking at their filter. Jacob has been all about the bandwagon, and the half hearted accusations. This is the second post against me.. where is the vote? Not even a fucking FOS. Why would I try to post as much as I can? If I were mafia I would have remained low key. Also part of the reason I messed up was because I am committed to this game. Even when I was completely exhausted(and frustrated) I make several posts because I wanted to be in this game (although I was tired to the point where I was miss reading stuff) That tired as mafia I would never post in this thread it would be insane. No one is even accusing you, yet you feel the need to defend yourself. Your defense of yourself for no reason paraphrased: you missed things in the thread because you were tired, and this proves you aren't mafia because mafia would never post when they are tired. That would be "INSANE." Not really. Especially if they weren't under any town pressure like you. And you saying it would be insane just seems like you are exaggerating an untrue argument to make yourself look more town. However incase you are town it would be detrimental to lose you (same with thrawn) so I will move onto the lurkers. @jacob So according to this statement, we shouldn't be scumhunting active people? In the next part of the post he casts suspicion on dandel for trying to get people to focus on remedy. But the suspicion is so soooo slight. Read the part where he suspects dandel for shifting focus to remedy. His suspicion has the force of a feather. Then he suspects remedy, yes the same remedy he chides dandel for investigating. In other words I do think regent looks scummy. So does now Daniel ion though. Who looks worse? Rethos made a very impressive slip though, but should we give Daniel the time for him to convince him he is town? However now I move onto stutters. Here is my jacob impersonation: This guys kinda scummy, so is this guy. Who is scummier? Should we let them convince us who is scummier? Well this well is dry time to move on. So far he has made no definitive statements, and he's already moved on to his 4th suspicion, stutters. And here he reiterates the scumminess of stutters afk timings. To accuse stutters right now makes sense, but it is also safe as fuck. Everyone is suspicious of stutters. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I have 1 game experience with jacob, and he can be hard to understand. But this is the same jacob as in last game. I don't know who obsed last game but killing you were there till the end. Do you concur? | ||
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##unvote ##vote jacob | ||
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Why is it a sure thing that 1 scum voted for drazak? How sure are we about the sharrant mason claim actually? I know before I said blah blah 100% why are we even talking about it, but recently i've been thinking. I only thought it was very unlikely they were scum because of the risk. Then their towniness was confirmed by the chat log timestamps. Does it actually confirm them because I pretty much just saw the timestamps and took other people's word for it without even looking at them. | ||
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Why are you focusing on that phrase I said like 2 days ago and how would it make me scum? To all the other thrawn suspectors, and it seems like there are more now, why would scum thrawn go through the trouble of doing the timestamp analysis? No one likes my case against Jacob??? i thought it was really good wtf | ||
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There is always at least 1 scum voting for the bandwagon. Bandwagon 2-6 one of those are usually scum. That leaves me thrawn and stutter. I know im town. At the moment I think thrawn is probably town. No one is biting on my jacob case. Screw you guys because I think he is scummy as fuck. So I'm changing my vote for stutters. Mostly I want to make him the main bandwagon so we can avoid this retarded dandel lynch. ##unvote ##vote stutters | ||
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Also I don't think my vote is going to change unless everyone decides to vote switch to jacob because I reallly really really really like him as scum and I think my case against him is amazing. | ||
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from what I remember the case boils down to he doesn't support his suspicions with arguments he voted for a non bandwagon d1 anything else? cause that's looking mighty weak | ||
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I'm not totally into the stutters lynch. he had the same exact afk pattern last game, so the more I remember last game, the more his lurkeryness looks like a null read. what does make me want to vote for stutters is thrawn's point about at least 1 scum being on the drazak lynch bandwagon...I checked on all the games I played and sure enough it's true. so is you believe that theory, a lynch on stutters would be quite valuable even if he flips town. that having been said, I think there is a good chance he will flip town. simply because the case against him directly is mostly about his ask timings, and that is a pretty null read for me considering his meta. the cases thrawn and killing just made against remedy actually do look quite strong. "i could have easily gone for cubu or drazak". I missed that when reading his filter but it does.sound like a scumslip. it sounds like he is saying going for me supports his innocence because wasn't a bandwagon. but town doesn't pick who they are going to accuse by how it males.them look. | ||
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the case.against stutters is.mostly about his afk timings | ||
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town doesn't pick who they accuse.by how it's going to make them look | ||
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remedy, stutters, dandel | ||
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##unvote vote remedysc boldifying is really hard on the phone so I hope you guys appreciate the effort that took. | ||
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##vote remedysc I will.move.back to stutters if I have to to save dandel | ||
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On September 23 2012 06:56 Dandel Ion wrote: For the record, currently my biggest scumread is actually debears. But that might not matter, because the flip could change that easily. How would the flip change your scumread on debears? could you not be vague like that? also this bandwagon on remedy.. it kind of spooks me how there was no resistance to it at all. | ||
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remedy lynch is based on feel reads and presumed scumslips. he doesn't care about who gets lynched... how the fuck does that make him scum? anyone want to swtich back to stutters? | ||
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Now we know there are only 3 possible scum that voted for him. stutters myself and you. if you believe in that theory, how can you not lynxh stutters... unless you are the mafia who voted | ||
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and fuck hapahuli if he thinks that's a scumtell. I.don't even care | ||
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2 thrawn them my reads. I have been hesitant because no one wants to.vote for.my reads | ||
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if no one is scum.. well that is possible but its also an extreme rarity. | ||
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however would it really be so hard for mafia to do those things? | ||
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that is what the cases against remedy are. that along with what I would describe as newbish play. that does not make scum. also how easy was that bandwagon. it happened almost instantly and their was no resistance. no one held onto their original vote or even tried to. | ||
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##unvote remedysc ##vote stutters anyone coming? | ||
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because at least 1 scum voted for drazak bandwagon. stutters voted for him, remedy didn't | ||
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thrawn is scum kush is scum mason claim is false no scum voted for drazak | ||
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me or thrawn? do you buy this theory that at least 1 scum voted for drazak? how sure are you the mason claim is true? | ||
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What caused you to drop your suspicion of dandel/rethos? Because it came totally out of the blue. Your plan originally was to vote for dandel then change your vote to stutters if it became clear dandel wasn't getting lynched. Why did you abandon your plan for remedy? What do you think of my jacob case? You haven't said a single word about it. Here is a link. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=367548¤tpage=40#797 Note that at the end I meant to say this is NOT the jacob from last game. | ||
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@jacob I don't understand why if I'm scum that also makes killing scum. because I defended him is that it? I never defended him really. its just that he never striked me as particularly scummy. also he has done some sharply town things. I will address those in my next post. to address your argument against me: I can't read your post while I write this so if I miss something point it out and I will be happy to address it. best post you made all game, by faaaar. so let me first congratulate you on that. You say I change my mind a lot. I have changed my mind about things but I have been honest about doing so. Truth and honesty and more important to me than the appearance of consistency. maybe it seems like im more fickle than most people but this is only because I'm constantly and as soon as I think something I will post that thought. Your second argument is that my town reads have been right. first let me say thank you. I am pretty awesome I agree. It's no mystery how made those reads though. I don't think doing stupid shit is a scumtell. It's as simple as that. and I have been proven right. People seem to forget that this is a newb game and for a lot of people it's their first game. I remember my first game... I roleclaimed jk day 1 because someone fosed me. | ||
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He initiates the plan to check the mason chat. this doesn't guarantee him town. but I read his filter and honestly it just does not seem that suspicious to me. granted he has been quite afk. I would say its a town leaning null read atm. | ||
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On September 23 2012 23:15 JacobStrangelove wrote: That will really move the thread forward won't it... yeah it will if you listen to it. thrawn so you are convinced by Jacob's walls of text huh? well I'm not. out of no where he starts posting these long posts. I think it is a defense mechanism. also look at his method. It seems like he decides who he is going to he suspicious of then just goes through their filter post by post grappling onto anything that he thinks could be seen as scummy. that's not a good way to make cases and that's not how he made them last game. | ||
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On September 21 2012 18:50 KillingTime wrote: If lynch lurkers is a decent policy - then Lynching liars, (even bad ones) is an essential policy ( from what I have read). I am sort of null on you because I don't see how your posts today help mafia or town at all but I can come up with plausible scenarios why both would do this - just totally barf worthy. I am not great at his game yet, but I am going to be annoyed if this is another game where d1 &2 are dominated by terrible town play. I am still going to look later and see if I can find a better scum - but for now. Vote##: rethos @killing why would you want to policy lynch someone who wad getting replaced? I feel like you agree that rethos wasnt scum but you are willing to Lynch him anyway. | ||
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what the fuck.... I also didn't realize this | ||
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On September 24 2012 01:06 KillingTime wrote: Btw guys - have been reading these huge walls of text.. Not sure what I think yet about them. On September 24 2012 04:08 KillingTime wrote: Quickly: I suspect atleast one of kush/you/jacob are scum. I don't know which - I haven't had time to read the huge posts made post lynch yet or really give these longer filters justice. so at 1 you claim to be reading the huge walls of text but at 4 you claim you haven't read them yet. Explain this contradiction please. | ||
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granted killings low activity level gives us less to analyze. could he be scum? yeah. am I willing to bet this game on it by lynching him next? no | ||
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I do think his idea about the no lynch may be good. I haven't really thought it out yet though. Also thrawn's roleblock claim, double role block claim now. Does this make him more town or scum or what... Who rbed him town or scum? Could he be lying and what risk would be involved in lying? | ||
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On September 24 2012 09:11 JacobStrangelove wrote: So either thrawn is Sk or we don't have one (just so you know this was a joke) maybe I'm just a dumb American but I don't get you joke | ||
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what the fuck is going on with thrawn's double rb claim? RB PLEASE ROLECLAIM IF YOU EXIST. Also if anyone else got roleblocked please claim. I'm going to assume that there is no town rb. One of the following is true 1 Scum is roleblocking town thrawn. 2 Scum thrawn knows there is no scum rb or chooses not to use it. So he is trying to take advantage of that role vacancy by pretending that scum is roleblocking him. 2 is actually a good idea but it almost seems too conspiracy theoryish to be true. Are there other opinions on this because it's quite possible I'm missing something. | ||
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Assuming there are though, 4 to 3 if we mislynch 3 to 3 when they nk. 3 to 2 if vig shoots scum. Town can still win. Therefore vig do not claim. | ||
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On September 25 2012 00:24 Dandel Ion wrote: Do you agree that if jacob is scum, thrawn is too (and vice versa)? Not necessarily. I have too many null reads to have association theories like that. Null reads debears atreides killing time Town reads Sharky (game mvp) Dandel (rethos leaving the game like that still strikes me as hella town) Scum reads Jacob Thrawn If so, why don't you want to go for thrawn, who people already are willing to vote for? Are you going to push for Jacob instead? Thrawn is big scumread from just the content of his posts. I was reading his posts today and thinking to myself fuck this guy looks scum. Except that roleblock thing is bugging me a lot. It's not as simple as he lied about it. The simplest answer is usually right, and I think ,just regarding the roleblock situation, it's way simpler that thrawn is town and getting rb than his scumteam is capitalizing on the lack of scum roleblock to make thrawn look town. Could the scumteam be doing that? Yes, and thrawn even mentioned that during his first game a ton of fake roleblocks happened. My second shred of doubt comes from me thinking about thrawn's meta. I actually don't know his meta that well I realized. I have played 2 games with him. The first game was easy mode and ended pretty early, due to dandel's terribad mafia play. In the second game nk the first night. The way he is perfectly willing to throw out one case and jump to another though, it looks so scummy. Aggressively wishy washy. Also that whole stutters fiasco. It seems like he wanted to look like he would lynch stutters but actually didn't want to lynch him. And then when stutters turns out town suddenly his "mafia always bandwagons on d1 lynch" theory is thrown out. As soon as dandel was looking like it wasn't going to happen, he started a bandwagon for remedy after one post from killing suspecting but not voting for remedy. So thrawn is still a scumread but I am more sure of jacob, because of my aforementioned doubts about thrawn. And I would rather lynch jacob. | ||
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That tired as mafia I would never post in this thread it would be INSANE. Is that why you are taking scum notes? So you don't slip up when you are tired? Taking notes is just an inherently scummy thing to do. Town doesn't have to try hard to keep their story straight. Also jacob still you need to answer my question. What the fuck was that thrawn joke you posted right after the flip about? Please explain it I don't have your sophisticated European sense of humor. Also dandel is in both your supposed scumteams? You don't even tell us what those scumteams are. Also you have never even put any heat on dandel. Summary of my case against jacob; Extremely wishy washy early game, contributing no original ideas. Arguments are built like: suspect first, squeeze out a case later. Sudden walls of text as a defense mechanism. Not matching last game's meta. He was not a tunneler last game at all. His post lengths were consistent throughout the entire game. | ||
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Also I think my case is good/ | ||
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You asked for a summary I gave you one. | ||
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On September 24 2012 21:13 JacobStrangelove wrote: + Show Spoiler + Currently I think thrawn is town, but as pointed out this is highly feel read based so I am doing my re-evaluation. Page 1, Pregame posts. + Show Spoiler + On September 13 2012 12:42 thrawn2112 wrote: ugh i wish i could (/in) but i only get internet for like 2 minutes a day at most lol On September 14 2012 07:26 thrawn2112 wrote: west texas i do have internet, i just have to walk/ride a long ass time to get it. On September 15 2012 07:18 thrawn2112 wrote: ok i can't resist at the risk of being lynched based on meta, i'm /in hi kush From our most active member? Now if he does have to walk a long time to get it then it is more likely that he would put the motivation in as someone that isn’t town. Situation could have changed though will need to check + Show Spoiler + On September 18 2012 11:00 thrawn2112 wrote: Yeah I agree, there's not much else to add other than that lurkers are assholes and they are going to lurk whether there is strong support of a lurker lynch policy or not... especially in these newbie games. So on to more important matters, here's an idea: last person in the thread gets lynched discuss? Now this was stupid, however the main point is he gets people of lurker’s quickly. Either he knows his scum mates will lurk, thinks he doesn’t have much time, or wants to get the thread moving. I think there is more reason to get the thread moving but I might have confirmation bias on this one. To save space his next post says lurker talk should be only one post or so and says plans are easy for scum to hide in. Town points here. He then basically Fos’s drazak. Ok the sonic/thrawn debate + Show Spoiler + On September 18 2012 15:37 thrawn2112 wrote: Ok sonic this is even scummier than your "hey everyone should be making lists" tactics in XXVI. Some of those questions (1 and 2) you cant reasonably expect people to give solid/infallible predictions about, or at least not predictions accurate enough for you to lynch them later based on a discrepency between the prediction and their actual activity level, and the other questions you don't need people to answer them in order to get the information you want. 6 is just silly. I don't see the point at all of that survey other than to appear useful which imo it isn't.. and that's the same thing you were doing with the lists in xxvi. In other words he starts going hard out on sonic, this might not mean anything either way but I am putting it here to see when he changes his mind. However he goes at sonic for posting a list of usless questions but then says this. + Show Spoiler + Seems hypocritical considering talking about the last one in the thread would only create a useless case and people saying it is bad. Page two + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2012 02:02 thrawn2112 wrote: Sonic the reason why I don't buy that your survey was you as town making a joke is becuase of the line "not answering will make you look scummy." That looks like you were seriously expecting a response from everyone and that you didn't want the survey to be taken lightly. It's been pointed out that we are kinda doing the same thing (accusing each other because of us presenting bad ideas for town to respond to) however the situations aren't that similar. You yourself have pointed out that my idea was so extremly dumb that it couldn't have been a genuine question. My explanation of that question is that it was scum bait... do you really think that it's more likely that I threw it out as scum trying to get town to agree to it? And your survey as I've already said didn't look like a joke and it fit your past scum actions of presenting fluffly ideas for town to follow so you could appear like a useful townie. I will give you a little bit of slack because I did lead you on by answering that it was in fact a serious question, so I can see why you as town would think that I was either giving an extremely terrible idea as town which isn't likely, or that I was saying something dumb as scum which I guess you could've seen as more likely. However seeing the lengths you went to to use that post against me, when it was obviously a really dumb idea regardless of my alignment, I still think you were attacking me with scum motives. In one of your recent posts you attacked someone for defending me, which makes sense if you are town and seeing debears post as a scum trying to protect their fellow scum partner. So overall, your position on my scum-o-meter is a little lower than it was but you're still up there. Now here is interesting, both were said to be scum bait (sonic flips town) But he says neither town nor scum would use it so it must be scum bait. (at least that is what I gathered) But Scum could use it to distract town and and claim the same thing that sonic just claimed. (Second filter read on thrawn, still feels more town and arguments could go either way but I see why I shouldn’t trust him blindly...*cough sonic last game *cough*) My motivation for his filter is dropping off... this could be because I don’t feel he is scum and there is no excitement. Again this is just a feel read so I must continue. + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2012 04:20 thrawn2112 wrote: Pre Edit: just saw that he posted some stuff about rethos, so my current read on him is that he's done nothing that I see as scummy and he has participated in discussion and brought some original ideas into the mix. So overall I'm saying he's looking town. His defense of me was a little to lengthy and aggressive to be normal but I don't know why he'd do that as town or mafia. This is actually interesting though, thinks rethos is town. I wonder if he jumped on my rethos is scum argument after realising a bus was almost necessary. (This is speculation so I will need to see how it follows thoughout the thread.) + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2012 05:09 thrawn2112 wrote: It's odd but not odd enough to influence my read on him in either direction. Basically it this point it tells me nothing other than that it tells me nothing. Still going with town. You say I'm a player who is willing to go after suspicious stuff... well yeah, that's the point of the game. But then when I give a town read, all the sudden that automatically makes myself and that player a team? That's your prerogative but it's an extremely weak case. Is there anything other than that about me which you find suspicious? Because if not then that's a very weak FOS. Follows up by saying it’s a weak argument on him. Yes it is but we need to look at every time he mentions rethos imo. I will do this because something I noticed in my notes file (I do this because I have adhd need some way to keep on track {did it last game as well I have notes for that I think, no turns out I saved over them (for this game) but I am sure I mentioned it in my filter somewhere from last game}) But my notes say Oh a side note if I am wrong completely, and I find thrawn to be scum kush is town killing is town and sharky and sharrent are town. That would leave dbears, dandel and thrawn. (at this point atalias wasn’t in the discussion much which is something I need to look into) this isn’t much though out(could be bussing etc..) but this is why I am checking the interactions of my possible scum teams as circumstantial evidence. To save time (still on page 2 of 11) he then goes on the whole role call thing which he should have imo. Again talks with rethos but don’t have a read on rethos and isn’t talking about that. So far hasn’t given a read on rethos but the interaction doesnt’ look that strange. Rethos just asking questions and thrawn just replying. Page three More role claim argument don’t see any particular scum motivation. Turns out he can’t fish. I can’t find anything in particular but he has gone at sonic (flips town) sharrent (flips town) killing (unsure) and drazak (flips town) + Show Spoiler + On September 20 2012 07:30 thrawn2112 wrote: I would go with drazak. Previously my lurker lynch back up was killing but drazak made that retarted vote. I've also had earlier supicions of him maily because of his first post, where he goes out of his way to defend accusations against him that haven't even happend yet. So killing/drazak but I say drazak. vote count? Changes his mind and goes for drazak, by itself fair enough but then after flip. + Show Spoiler + On September 20 2012 07:59 thrawn2112 wrote: One thing that seems very very strange is how nobody has voted for killing this entire game, yet lots of people have said he's very scummy and he was even a proposed lynch candidate a few times. . There could possibly be some derailment going on everytime a killing lynch is mentioned. If you've got insight into the drazak/killing/cubu/sharrant choice now is the time to speak up. Ok so he goes not with killing because of one vote post then goes at the fact nobody voted for killing? This is a scummy move actually because he could back up the fact that he switched because he pointed it out. (he points this out after day 2 sometime I think.) Or this would be scummy if he said it after the flip, still scummy that he mentions it before though, he might have known the result and acted accordingly. So far this is probably the most interesting thing I have come across. *nedstark voice* “Storm is coming” able to keep working on it though as I alt tabbed the filter. Oh.. a side problem of no internet is I can’t quote properly. So maybe we should lynch cubu, and if cubu flips mason well then at least we have a confirmed town player (sharrant) and we haven't lost a useful poster. If Cubu doesn't flip mason then we atuo lynch sharrant D2. In the outcome that cubu is mason, then like others have said about him earlier we aren't losing a player who is willing to scumhunt or contribute or say anything at all. And yeah mafia will have a good target for their nightkills (sharrant) but if there's a medic or a jailkeeper, and I think it's likely that there will be at least one of those, then they can save sharrant from nk's at their own discretion. I am on page four but I left it for a while so not entirely sure where I left off. This is more scummy, lynch someone who could end up confirmed town? Lynching someone else gets you the chance of finding scum and opens the possibility of either getting two confirmed town, or two confirmed scum. Oh turns out I missed this first time round. I guess leaving the computer helped. With this I think page 4 is done. (side note: I am getting more of a hunt feeling now but still not sure Unlike kush I am not finding every second post with scum intent) Why do you think his mason status is such a sure thing? Ok this is slightly odd, he seemed to have doubts as well about it now it is suddenly sure. Then next post does a massive why the mason claim is a fabrication thing. Here's why I think the mason claim is fabricated. (I would link it all but I can’t quote or spoiler properly with no connection) someone asked if people are allowed to post links to their mason qt, if not are they allowed to post the text contents of the qt? Now this is back to serious town points. Surely having the mason qt text wouldn’t be something the mafia would suggest. The only reason I can see why he would have asked it is if he was town and wanted to be sure. He then after time zones and such believes him. Continuing on. (I will look at atreides filter after this (thrawn currently arguing that atreides is scum) and if atreides actually does seem scum town points. Next he lies(or misunderstands and thinks Debears is still sheeping him when it was the other way around) about posting before debears. Almost going to go unicycle so hopefully internet is on by then (we have found an undercover area to do it in fyi) Will be back in several hours. (hour trip in and back with time for unicycling in the middle ^^) Ok debears just posted his case on thrawn, haven’t read it yet and still won’t read it as I don’t want it effecting my perception until after I post this. Ok he seems to be very careful in making sure sharrant and sharky are masons. For me this is town points. Making completely sure without doubt. Most of his next post are him answering my questions so I will leave these out for obvious reasons. Hold on I think I got lost again... I shouldn’t have left for so long. Onto page 6 + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2012 07:46 thrawn2112 wrote: Kush those points againt me are either meaningless or huge misrepresentations of what actually happened. I'll post my response in a bit. You either haven't grasped the logic of a lot of my cases (specifically the remedy which till now you'e ignored my request for you to give a read on him) or you're scum. Accuses kush for not following his logic and says because of that he is scum, (remedy flips town) just interesting going though this. Next is a massive quote that goes back and forth between thrawn and kush. But more importantly comes the role block post. Now several things could be going on here. First it is obvious town didn’t role block him because sharrent got a rb. (unless mafia rb’s sharrent?) So assuming mafia pulled the role block, I imagine there are three possible options. One mafia role blocked him, two mafia roleblocked themselves, three mafia roleblocked the Sk. Thrawn has been blocked twice (nobody else claimed they were blocked) and no sk Shot. Admittedly I find this unlikely but not at all impossible. + Show Spoiler + I saying a got a message saying exactly "you were roleblocked." Thought I'd post it so that A) if the roleblock came from a town player they will know I'm at being honest and B) If it came from a mafia then town will have more information. In either case it gives everyone more info to work with. Maybe not now but at some point in the future.... in my first game mafia started making up a bunch of fake "I got roleblocked" claims and town was able to see through them because people had been saying the exact times they got roleblocked throughout the game. I don't see why I would get roleblocked though. Sonic the JK could have done it but I don't think so because I think he had a town read on me. That leaves only the possibilities that there's a town roleblocker who did it or the mafia did it but I have no information or theories about that so kinda useless to speculate further. Completely leaves out the possibility of mafia Rb’s themselves. Lol ran into him responding to a question about this post + Show Spoiler + Uh, saying that drazak and I defended each other is a lie. In fact it's the exact opposite of the truth. You have to admit that is a very confusing sentence. I will start generalinzing what he says for time purposes, starts going a rethos after I do with what I think is a perfectly reasonable argument. + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2012 18:16 thrawn2112 wrote: Lol which one of your mason buddies in the qt told you to write this post? My vote today was going to be remedy but this series of posts from rethos makes me consider lynching him regardless of him asking for a replacement. Mason buddys? I never quite made sense of this tbh. + Show Spoiler + If it came from a town player it was because they thought I was scum, or they were a jk thinking I was town. If it came from mafia, I think they suspect me of being one of the more powerful blue roles and they were trying to stop me from performing an action based upon the reads I was making during N1. Avoids the topic of mafia roleblocking mafia. While I am finding a lot of things that could possibly be scummy considering the size of the filter I should be finding more. Most is just observations and comments that it could be either way (that I am making) while there are a few solid posts I will admit. After I read debears case I will probably quickly post my thoughts again. He seems town on feel read, seems mostly town in his posting style however I am not 100% convinced on him like I used to be, (although def wouldn’t lynch him) + Show Spoiler + On September 22 2012 03:19 thrawn2112 wrote: Here's what happened: First he lies about having a lurking plan: "Believe it or not I was actually making a test to see how much leniancy lurkers get in this game" (not a plan a townie with any sense would use) and then he lies about the lie: "To be clear my defense against lurking is not "hey I did it on purpose", it's "hey I will not be lurking anymore now"" (saying "I will not be lurking anymore" ..... how does that = boredom?) then he goes back to saying the first lie was true: "So basically there is a problem with this game (all newbie games? I don't know) that is that people are not pressuring lurkers at all. Mainly they are giving them little slaps on the hand like (hey you have not posted in a while). I wanted to actually attract attention to that. And I think I actually succedded." then he says all the previous lies actually were lies and that instead he's bored "Actually no.. I am sorry to all of you. But it really seems that playing mafia is really not for me. I got bored and did not want to post any more. Now I am trying to catch up and can't get bring myself to it. Yes I lied about having this weird plan of lurking intentionally. I lurked because I did not have motivation to do anything." How does that more sense than coming out and being truthful about being bored right off the bat? This makes so much sense... now if I am wrong and thrawn is scum then I would associate him with dandel. (why you may ask) Well I posted before about how dandel is almost the only person left to accosiate with thrawn and the possibilities of a bus aren’t unlikely. (considering he almost had to bus rethos) However you can see that this is a very weak case however I will post this now as this relates to a revelation I had on the train on the way home (that I will post at the end of this) I do not think this is the case but it I am wrong then this is probably the case. Notice the time stamps on kush, not the first time he has done this I might add but it makes more sense the correct way around. I will never trust a timing read again... I have to admit I look at a heap of timings but stutters was town so... + Show Spoiler + On September 22 2012 13:53 thrawn2112 wrote: I've been looking at the final vote count. I think it's very very safe to assume that at least 1 mafia voted for drazak. The people who voted for drazak are: Sharrant, Sonic Death Monkey, kushm4sta, thrawn2112, Stutters695. So then I removed sharrant, sonic, and myself, which leaves kush and stutters. Out of those two I think it's more likely stutters is scum. And when I look at their votes, kush made that retarded "ok looks like drazzak is the bandwagon then" vote. Originally it looked suspicious but consider this... why the fuck would a mafia player bandwagon onto a townie lynch and then use such a terrible phrase? Especially to even include the word bandwagon? That imo, is a colossal error that I don't think anyone would be capable of. (well maybe yourharry would find some way to rationalize it) So, that leaves stutters who already looks suspicious, both for lurking, and because of how he stops lurking to pop in the thread once someone calls him out. So if all the follwoing is true, Stutters has to be scum 1: At least 1 mafia voted for drazak 2: There are no holes we've overlooked in sharrant's mason claim 3: My reasoning about kush's vote is extremely likely to be correct (4: and an additional one for people other than myself would be that thrawn is town) For me of course 4 is 100 true. 2 is so close to 100 percent true it may as well be 100 percent. Then I think 3 is the next most likely and 1 is probably the part of the theory I have the most hesitations about. However I think 1 and 3 are solid enough. So in other words I think stutters is a pretty damn good lynch option. Not only for all the reasons just mentioned but also because he's a huge lurker. Something I am going to pick you up on though, stutters wasn’t scum, that leaves you and kush, you have a town read on kush... this makes no sense. Page 9 + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2012 01:21 thrawn2112 wrote: Who would you rather the wagon be? I see you come into the thread with a scumread that other people thought was scummy at the time, (most especially myself) debears attacks you and you immediately go after him even to the point of voting for him. Then two people go for stutters and it's time to change your vote to stutters? Is debears still your top read? Don't you even want to try to see if you can push your case? This relates to my revelation that I am posting at the end. There is a whole lot of stutters remedy stuff that because of the flip I don’t see the need of going into. Well that was a quick page... + Show Spoiler + This sent me into a fit of laughter again. Sorry I know that is fluffy of me but still amusing. + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2012 09:13 thrawn2112 wrote: Also according to my logic case kush is scum, or the mason claim is false, or no scum voted drazak, or I hallucinated while reading my role pm Then why is kush town to you blahsasdfsadf... I guess I will find out in later posts. + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2012 10:48 thrawn2112 wrote: I don't know why a scum kush would have tried so hard to change everyone's vote to stutters(green). Remedy(green) was already looking very likely to be lynched yet kush fought hard to change people's votes. Oh hey the very next post... I have to admit this is like the one hole in my argument against kush. However I found so much scummy stuff though. 20 pages? I am assuming most of this is because it is not spoilered. And Thrawn writes long posts. + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2012 16:15 thrawn2112 wrote: First, kush's case against jacob and whatever I think while reading his filter: The first accusation you make is that he's an active lurker (a weird phrase but I know what you mean) and that he doesn't take stances. So I'm gonna talk about some of his reads. Here's the first read he makes: (here) It comes in at a time when sonic and I were going at it pretty strongly and his opinion on the issue is, well I don't really know. He doesn't give it. He does sorta talk about the issue but does not come out and say if he thinks either sonic or I look more scummy, and in his next post he has this to say about the issue: "I am going to stay mostly away from the thrawn kush sonic debacle for the moment it’s not as clear as it should be." Jacob what was so unclear about it that caused you to not want to discuss it? Later in that same post he talks about the debears/thrawn issue and ends up saying this: "Both are plausible I will need more time to work out which is which" but he doesn't end up posting that read. Those are the two most dramatic issues of the start of the game but he doesn't want to talk about them or he needs more time to work them out but ends up not doing so. What I remember most from jacob's posting was the rethos stuff. So, rethos comes into the thread saying that he had a lurking plan. Jacob asks him this:"Wait you were lurking on purpose? That is your entire reason for lurking? "Hey guys don't lynch me I was lurking on purpose" Why would you do that? What do you gain from it? (apart from a social life) Please elaborate". He does question rethos but if there is any suspicion contained in those questions it is very faint. Then after rethos responds jacob makes this post and he never commits too strongly to believing or disbelieving rethos. It's a bunch of sentences and each contain very slight reads that are in contradiction with the read of the other sentences. He finally commits to a scum read on rethos in this post: He points out that rethos lied several times. This was something that I pointed out first, and something that jacob did not even seem to think was happening before I posted about it. And at the end of the post there's the "if's he's town" part where he could be leaving himself an out. Here are some posts that are representative of what I'm talking about when I say his posts don't contain reads: So.... did what stutters did make him suspicious or not? Another similar post: Once again I by the time I finish reading the post I have no idea what his final read was. Go read his filter and a lot of it's similar to the two above quotes. After reading a jacob post you are left with a often weak and sometimes dizzying notion of what jacob's actual read is. When he gives reads a lot of times he'll throw in one of these: (but here's something that could make my read the opposite of what it is) Another one of your points about him is that it's not the same jacob from last game. I went through his filter from that game and he does ramble on a lot but he does no where near the amount of providing himself outs for his reads. So yeah I'd say jacob looks scummy. I will post this and actually go though this here. I was going to do this after I finished my cases but because of what happened I am going though everyones filters -_- I mentioned this before but I was very busy the first days, I was still able to post a fair amount but the quality as you said wasn’t that great. It was unclear just because you were going back and forth about lists and fluff for mafia when you were creating it as well. I didn’t bother discussing it because I figured it would become clear later on when I had more time anyway. You go at my accusations on rethos being faint, I think I already mentioned that this is typical when I run into something that doesn’t make sense. I ask a lot of questions. Yeah you pointed out the lying thing first (although this is probably the only thing you pointed out you said first that you actually did say first) however my strongest town read at the time points out an argument I take notice. Already mentioned the stutters thing that did make him suspicious. Etc.. + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2012 19:31 thrawn2112 wrote: That case does influence my read of jacob to be more townish than I previously thought. Not because of the quality of the arguments (i'll let you know what I think about the actual case when I finish reading it) but because of the sheer amount of work he put into it and how he is actually very clear with his accusations which was my (and kush's) problem with his previous posting. I'm starting to think that the interactions and accusations between me/jacob/kush (all varying degrees of the more active posters in the thread) suggests that there could be a large portion of mafia among the lurkers. I mentioned this before but just so you know the reason I am suddenly clearer and putting more effort in is because I am not in the clear by way of commitments. (as in irl commitments) He goes at killing but after reading killings filter he is only really scummy if associated with kush. + Show Spoiler + On September 24 2012 07:34 thrawn2112 wrote: Can you post the mason qt again? I don't doubt you're mason but at this point I want to consider every possibility. So please post it as soon as you humanly can. Seems to want to be extra sure, after being sure many times. Ok it’s last page so I only partly read it as it is what just happened. So now my hurm thrawn is a little stranger than I thought but considering the amount of filter he has you would expect more slips and he says a lot of town things as well case is over. Also thrawn still feels town. ^ that’s my read. I will discuss something. First kush number one scum read. Second killing when associated with kush. On par dandel at the moment (will get to this) Then thrawn. However... if killing actually isn’t associated in anyway with kush then I would say thrawns filter is actually a little more scummy. BUT killing lurked (so harder to find stuff) he also was more non committal (if I remember) so I will vote killing to save thrawn if it comes down to that because he is much more scummy with the strong accosiation case I have and it is close without it. However here is my revelation. (dun du dun) Dandel is in both my scum teams. Same as what happened last game with sonic. Kush killing dandel seems to make sense from the perspective if kush defending dandel and going at stutters/remedy only. If I am wrong then Thrawn/dandel/debears? While I think it is less likely thrawn could have read the situation as being to suspicious not to go at dandel (when he was rethos) and started bussing him. So in other words before I read Atreides filter Kush Dandel/killing Thrawn/everyone else. now I will look at the recent developments... this post basically seems like a calculated soft bus from jacob. Thrawn lynch was not as popular when jacob wrote this but it looks like it's designed to allow jacob to turn on him if he has to. Kind of like sowing the first seeds of doubt. | ||
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VOTE THRAWN | ||
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On September 25 2012 05:42 thrawn2112 wrote: If I get lynched then come back to this post There will be 7 people left. Subtract sharky. (sharky for mason) So the list is: 'jacob kush atreides dandel killing debears' And don't be stupid, there are probably not less than 3 scum. 2 scum would be ridiculously unfair out of 13 players and 3 has always been standard in newbies. There have been 4 votes for me from: 'kush dandel atreides debears' and since you take away the mason, and me after lynch, 3 scum will be in that original list of 6 meaning at least 1 of them absolutely for sure is among the list of kush, dandel, atreides, and debears. So if I get lynched then look at those guys. And that means right now I know at least one of them is scum. apart from Jacob this is the most words I've seen for such little meaning. This is just obvious math thrawn, but you say it all dramatic like you figured.something out. | ||
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On September 25 2012 07:12 thrawn2112 wrote: ##Vote: Dandel lon My top two scum reads at this point are rethos and dandel lon they are the same person? | ||
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By lynch time all must vote for same person. | ||
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I'm saying you were planning on not being active, but you were super active. I suggested a possibility is that rolling mafia motivated this activity. No it's not a slam dunk but its not the only argument against you either. | ||
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On September 25 2012 12:00 JacobStrangelove wrote: hey I said I was going before didn't you check the thread? Just because you come in right before I leave and then accuse me of leaving doesn't help... im not accusing you of leaving. im encouraging it. | ||
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On September 25 2012 10:52 JacobStrangelove wrote: Myself (lol) I thought I nailed kush with my case and was going to be shot before I could post the rest but I now realise that if I was shot then that would confirm him scum. I did think sharrent was a large possibility though so either him or me. I think a thrawn quote is applicable here. Are you scum or are you retarded? How could you think you were going to be killed... | ||
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You never suggested even in the most general terms WHY you ended up not lurking. | ||
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On September 25 2012 21:01 JacobStrangelove wrote: Also he does flip scum, It could be an amazing bus (considering I am the only one defending him there are at least 2 mafia on board(or 3 from my point of view but not everyone has voted I don’t think) with an association case on me. In that situation I doubt there is anything I could do... No it would not be "an amazing bus." It would be a completely necessary bus from a mafia perspective. Thrawn flips red and 2 people were against lynching him...it becomes beyond obvious. See your level of reasoning is just non existent. It's like you are purposefully making yourself dumber than you are. For all my flaming I don't think you are dumb. Yes I think you suck at English but I don't think you are dumb. I think you are acting. | ||
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What I mean is you accuse someone new every hour hoping to get people to jump him. And when they don't you switch to someone else easy as that and try again. The only people.you haven't accused directly are Jacob and me. I forget who called you the boy who cried wolf but it's quite apt. | ||
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debears seemed scummy as fuck at first but eventually my read of him was just watered down to null by all his normal nonscummy posts. also fuck you thrawn for that light dat bowl comment. | ||
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His.argument against you, I disagree with a lot of it but I definitely agree with the boy who cried.wolf part. If.he is mafia then he is first time mafia and he has been doing a really good town impersonation for his first game. if sharky isn't coming back then a vote change isn't even possible is it? he made it seem like he's not.coming back. | ||
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even though he is a huge flamer. | ||
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we know sharky is town. therefore if we all vote for debears and he is scum, then scum can just votechange and fuck us because sharky is on thrawn. also thrawn is scummier imo. | ||
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I.think this is right that mafia votechange could fuck us (maybe not if we have a Vig). but no one has done the logic work to figure this out so just ducking vote thrawn | ||
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I.am serioisly afraid of.votechange. if we don't have Vig we lose the game just because your vote isn't on thrawn (if you are town) so its.duly noted you didn't want to vote for thrawn. cool.story. now.Jacob vote thrawn for safety you have no reason not to | ||
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You guys are really... smart and you should all be.. proud of yourselves. Town mvp was sharrant. His reads were actually scary good but he shouldn't have been fooled by our busing. My biggest scumtell was how last game I got like every read wrong and this game I knew that every single town who turned was gonna be town. It's like I couldn't resist making myself look like some mafia genius. Trying to get everyone to vote for stutters at the last second... everyone thought that made me town for some reason. Actually I did that after making this huge scumslip by mistake: also this bandwagon on remedy.. it kind of spooks me how there was no resistance to it at all. I figured if I made a huge deal about it, it would cover that scumslip and it did. I was terrified of stutters dying due to thrawn's theory (which turned out to be perfectly correct btw). I wanted to make it look like I wanted him dead but I did not want him to die. Our strategy was to constantly bus each other and it worked very well. It should have seemed fake to you guys how Jacob and I became mortal enemies for basically no reason. First newbie game mafia victory in a long time and perfect victory at that. I am very proud of my scumteam, especially debears who no one suspected all midgame, and it's his first game of mafia ever. | ||
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On September 26 2012 10:02 Dandel Ion wrote: Kush I had a townread on under the assumption he had a brain, but it seems I was wrong. My bad really, I should've known better from our last game... Translation: kush mindfucked me hard and now I gotta protect my fragile ego. | ||
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On September 26 2012 11:54 thrawn2112 wrote: I've only read the first two. I liked the 2nd more than the first but the ending was just kinda.... depressing? Not really in a bad way... just ..... idk. Made me feel weird I've heard the ones by his son are ass, is it true? I know kevin j anderson wrote some of it and I read a lot of his star wars stuff in middle school and liked em. (not as much as the stuff by timothy zahn if you get the reference in my username) the ending of the first one was pretty random and bad IMO. Why do all sci fi books have bad endings? | ||
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2) "I don't even care." He doesn't give a shit about who gets lynched. 3) Why is he doing all this in-spite of the postgame comments in Newbie XXVI? 4) Why is he so angry (again)? There's no reason for him to be this pissed off. 2 I didn't mean i don't care about who gets lynched. I meant I don't care about what you think. I know you think that's an impossibility. 3 I didn't read those. 4 My mood swings a lot regardless of if I'm scum I think. It's called marijuana and it's a drug I do a lot. Hapahauli, you were sure I was scum last game when I wasn't so yeah. kush 1 hapahauli 0 as far as im concerned. And you completely disregard our ownage busing strategy. | ||
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I would have used my town cache to push the lynch away from debears onto probably killing.. Still perfect victory. | ||
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On September 26 2012 13:42 Hapahauli wrote: Also, weed shouldn't make you angry o_O being high doesn't coming down does and when I drop f bombs it doesn't mean I'm mad. If I say fuck you thrawn that does not mean I'm mad at him. It means I'm trying to be friendly. Are we not allowed to say fuck? | ||
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everyone join next game | ||
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