EPTTL Mafia LVII
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
Does the Suicide Bomber go through Assassin's night kill immunity? | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
3291 Posts
Things to note is the change to permanent 2kp, as well as the addition of vigilante as a possible scum role. BM I'm interested on how any town circle would work with the existence of the suicide bomber. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
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Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote: My general stance is that every blue should ultimately do what they want. The environment of this game should not be about confirming blues and then doing what they say. Just because someone is innocent does not make them right in their convictions or accusations so it isn't of too much help really except for process of elimination. If a town plan arises I'm not gonna be a part of it but I advice blue players to use their own judgment. Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. Don't bother asking me for my reads because I will never post a list of reads and I hate it when other people post "reads". Thanks. What do you mean by "reads"? Are you talking specifically about general lists opposed to focused discussion on a certain player? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote: I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:09 DoYouHas wrote: Well, as per usual I like lynching lurkers day 1 if a scummier option doesn't present itself. Blues should do as they see fit. Discussion in that area only gives scum more points of reference for blue hunting. In the past L has assured me that this is always the correct course of action, sooo ##Vote: Bill Murray No, I will be holding you especially to a higher standard of posting. Stupid throwaway votes like this just give scum more room to spam / hide. Pick something better to talk about. What do you think about Toad's aggression against me, like less than 30 minutes into the game? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote: Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? On September 04 2012 08:03 Toadesstern wrote: because of that one post? Of course not. Well your sentiment seems to be that you do indeed think I'm scum. Using my posts written prior to your retort (quoted above), can you show how you came to this conclusion? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:02 Hapahauli wrote: Errr... well I wasn't planning on anyone taking that image seriously. I hate town circles. They're distracting to discussion and give people easy outs to "look" townie by "contributing" as opposed to scumhunting. I hate blue-oriented discussion in general really - it makes it easier for mafia to snipe blue roles by testing player reactions. Hell the idea of publicly determining blue actions is silly, considering it gives mafia the one information advantage that town has over mafia. Could you clarify what you mean by this point? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:22 DoYouHas wrote: slOosh, my vote is neither stupid nor a throwaway. I have a friend who I consider a better player than me who has told me that getting BM out of the game quickly is always a good thing. It is meta as hell but it isn't stupid. Toad's aggression towards you is completely null. You seem to be playing into your town meta so far, but I really won't know for sure until your first/second case. Your comment on Toad's aggression doesn't really mean much since he explained himself. What is my town meta and how am I playing to it? | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:32 Hapahauli wrote: Mafia don't know what blues are going to do. Mafia's not going to know who the medic is saving or the blue is checking on a nightly basis, and can't play around their actions. Why should we publicly telegraph blue actions and give away the information advantage that blues hold? Alright, just making sure, specifically directing blue actions is stupid. We should however publicly claim all rb and shots. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:36 DoYouHas wrote: Your town meta from when I have played with you is to herd the rest of the town. Pointing out information (like with the 2kp thing) and taking issue with not just the content of posts but the style. You try to make the town play how YOU want them to play. The rest of your meta doesn't really come into play until cases start being made. I am making note that you just used me to defend yourself though, which I do not like. And Toad's aggression isn't null because he explained it. It is null because it is. Either alignment has plenty of cause to go after you like Toad did. Scum could want to start the mudslinging early and look aggressive and confident. Town may have just not liked what you wrote. Where did I do that? And your response to Toad's aggression is itself null for you, regardless of what it is for him. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote: Finished with page 12. What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote: Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote: Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 11:12 Z-BosoN wrote: @slOosh Very well, seems reasonable. Thanks for clearing that up. What is your take on Darthpunk? Nothing particularly scummy. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On his side its raw gutsyness, and as people have pointed out if it's a scum strat then it ends up with a D2 lynch on him, or even a N1 vig shot; it is unlikely that he would pull this off to kill a town Mattchew as I don't think anyone can wriggle out of the subsequent backlash lynch. A 1-1 on Mattchew is stupid, especially if it could end up him (BC) lynched first, which would make it a 1 for nothing. On Mattchew's side is the self-aware miller claim. If millers were self-aware, they would out themselves, and it would strengthen his claim. If they aren't self-aware as they usually aren't, he would be safe until someone flipped nosy neighbor, in which case his lie would be exposed and he lynched. In a big game like this, potentially worth it. Unlikely that both are town as it would mean a lying townie. Unlikely that both are scum cause it's so sub-optimal. I'd lynch Matt first on the basis that BC's demeanor seems more honest than Mattchew's. I mean, some guy is screaming his head off that you are a liar, and if you know that your role PM is "Nosy Neighbour" then the other guy (BC) must be an idiot or a liar. Mattchew isn't treating him like an idiot, nor is he treating him like a liar. The response is off (I base this off my experience fake claiming in Bureaucracy Mafia). If we get ... news of something otherwise, it's easy enough to switch. But even without it behavior analysis should be enough. Dunno why you haven't thought of voting him though BC. ##Vote: Mattchew | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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Fact is (most likely) that scum got caught with their pants down and panicked. You can probably pick off some scum from the voting frenzy after Palmar's announcement. Then it would be incredibly uncomfortable to start talking about scum buddy Mattchew, so you do next best thing, which is lurk. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 06 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Everyone shut up about Ottoxlol and let him cool down. There are much better targets, i.e. people who lurked the whole time after dropping their singular vote. I.e. DYH. And that maverick guy comes to mind. Fact is (most likely) that scum got caught with their pants down and panicked. You can probably pick off some scum from the voting frenzy after Palmar's announcement. Then it would be incredibly uncomfortable to start talking about scum buddy Mattchew, so you do next best thing, which is lurk. On September 06 2012 07:54 BlackMamba24 wrote: sloOsh says people who dropped a vote and then lurked are scum. That's exactly what he did. Ottoxlol is indefensible. Why are people still talking about Maverick? My attack on him was a misunderstanding, pay attention. I voted before the announcement. Furthermore, you would notice that DYH also voted before announcement yet I think him a good target as well. I admit not reading clearly after the frenzy because it looks like a big pile of nothingness. Like, I think Ottoxlol is just really ignorant townie and people just getting upset because he is stubborn, and then scum just lurk or join in critiquing him. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 04 2012 08:41 slOosh wrote: Where did I do that? And your response to Toad's aggression is itself null for you, regardless of what it is for him. On September 06 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Everyone shut up about Ottoxlol and let him cool down. There are much better targets, i.e. people who lurked the whole time after dropping their singular vote. I.e. DYH. And that maverick guy comes to mind. Fact is (most likely) that scum got caught with their pants down and panicked. You can probably pick off some scum from the voting frenzy after Palmar's announcement. Then it would be incredibly uncomfortable to start talking about scum buddy Mattchew, so you do next best thing, which is lurk. He is ignoring me when there is no reason to. His posting indicates that he places some value in my posting ("I think slOosh put it best" as justification for lynch) yet when I call him out like that he doesn't try to come to an agreement with me. Rather he ignores it completely. We have a history of like ~5 games together and we value each other's reads. In this game there is a clear contradiction - "slOosh has good reasoning for voting Mattchew that I agree with, but I'm going to ignore the fact that he thinks I'm scum". The post that stuck out to me as "is it hunch or is it objective?" was his vote on Mattchew: On September 04 2012 14:22 DoYouHas wrote: @Hopeless - Forumite is right, if Mattchew was tracked to a night kill we would lynch him in spite of the claim. The coincidence is too high. Also, assuming we have trackers (which would be the only reliable way to verify the claim) you are spending 1-2 night actions from a valuable info-role confirming a townie (which would then have to somehow be conveyed to the rest of the town) instead of scumhunting. A self-aware miller role claiming this early serves one function, to get the WIFOM circus rolling and possibly tie up night actions. I don't see a blue or green role claiming nosy neighbor. It increases the chances the town will lynch you if you are blue. And as a green (whether VT or NN) you wouldn't want to tie up the town's discussion with WIFOM on the unlikely chance that later in the game you will be mis-attributed with a NK (not to mention you could claim NN then). I'm pretty comfortable getting behind the Mattchew bandwagon. ##Unvote ##Vote: Mattchew This came when BC was screaming that Mattchew was a liar. A liar. A liar. However he approaches it from a "does it make sense to claim as a self-aware miller?" perspective, which makes me believe that this is scum overcompensating for an otherwise very clear cut vote. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 06 2012 09:44 DarthPunk wrote: Also Is there any way that DH/BC are not town? I was around when the interplay between the two went down and the simplest explanation being the best: BC sees matt's claim and has asked the mod already if NN are self aware. Matt is lying ergo he is scum. DH and others do not have this information and ask BC for evidence based on something other than what he has publicly stated, which was that he was making an assumption. After some discussion it is clear that BC pushing for a matt mislynch in this way would be incredibly short sighted and that the situation would be resolved upon confirmation of the role. Both town reacting differently based on the different information available to them. Simplest explanation is the best. I toyed with the idea and it is most likely that they are town, for if it was scum orchestrated they would have done a much, MUCH better job at capitalizing. Instead, the Mattchew claim sundered town and put immense pressure on the scum team. Could BC have gone rogue to sack his whole team in order to gain towncred? No. DH I was thinking his suspicions on BC both before the announcement and after the flip, but his general demeanor shows he cares about town and getting stuff right, making the prior stuff more likely paranoia / extra-critical thinking. | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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On September 06 2012 10:08 DoYouHas wrote: @slOosh - IIRC getting into back and forths with you has ended up in my being lynched as townie twice. I dropped out of our discussion after I had my read on you. I know what it will take to change that read, and it doesn't involve me interacting with you. I do think it is kind of amusing that you have tried prying at me because you know what my meta is better than anyone else in this game, while I haven't bothered dealing with you because I know yours better than almost anyone. If anything this strengthens my case. Either you think me scum or town. I infer from the posts in thread that you think I'm town. If indeed you think this, then you should be concerned that I think you are scum. There is a blaring contradiction in your words and your actions. Now will you actually address my posts? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 06 2012 10:41 DoYouHas wrote: I did think you were town early on in the game and I liked your post when you voted for Mattchew, hence why I cited it. I am much less sure currently. Your inactivity for one thing (yes I get that I'm in a glass house on this one) has me doubting as last game you played an extremely lurky and lazy scum. It could very well be that your initial activity was an overcompensation for that and now you have fallen back into that scum meta. I don't know, but I'm willing to wait it out and make that call when I have more to look at. As I said in your quoted post, I know what I'm looking for, and no, you don't get to know what that is. And just looking at our past, you honestly think that directly defending myself against you is the correct path? Defending myself does nothing to get you off my back, in fact, it has gotten me lynched twice as a townie (needed restating). What does actually get you off my back? Making cases and contributing. I suppose this question does deserve answering though: "What is my town meta and how am I playing to it?" = "DYH, please elaborate to the rest of the thread just how townie I am." Otto is the clear choice for the town's next action, whether that be vig or lynch. I'm trying to work on the next step. Ahh ... Ok I understand now. Hah the irony ... this is indeed what I did to you in SMVII(?) - get paranoid, lurk and then call you out. The question I asked on the meta was because I thought you could be bluffing with the town read. Alright gonna go clear my mind and reread your filter. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
Misinterpretation On September 06 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote: Everyone shut up about Ottoxlol and let him cool down. There are much better targets, i.e. people who lurked the whole time after dropping their singular vote. I.e. DYH. And that maverick guy comes to mind. I dropped maverick's name because I recall his post was very vague, and hesitant to actually call out names. The other posts that mention Maverick are: On September 06 2012 07:50 grush57 wrote: K. Medics on Toad and BC and BM. Vigi kill in the pool of scummy people/ scummylurkers. Ex: Ottox, Maverick, Do you has. On September 06 2012 07:35 Bill Murray wrote: Forumite's defense is really good. He's off my scumlist. I just filtered mav. TBH, maverick is looking more like town. i mean he's openly defending himself vs me and Dr.H Seems really inactive, however, so I'm not calling off a potential vig shot there... *looks at austin* Though, I'd still rather someone shoot Gravan, at this point. On September 06 2012 07:54 BlackMamba24 wrote: sloOsh says people who dropped a vote and then lurked are scum. That's exactly what he did. Ottoxlol is indefensible. Why are people still talking about Maverick? My attack on him was a misunderstanding, pay attention. There are three misinterpretations in this post. One I've pointed out here. The second is that he makes it out like there was a long drawn out futile discussion on Maverick, when in fact the only mentions of him are the three quotes above. Hardly "people still talking". Third is that he spins it in a way to suggest we are not paying attention. None of us actually mention BM24 as the cause of our reads or anything like that, yet that is how he takes it. It doesn't matter if it was a misunderstanding or not, because the reads are independent of what he thinks. Contradictions On September 06 2012 07:56 BlackMamba24 wrote: and why is sloOsh parroting Bill Murray's reads when Bill Murray's reads are incomprehensibly bad This refers to my post saying DYH and mav should be shot (1st quote in this post) On September 06 2012 07:35 Bill Murray wrote: I just filtered mav. TBH, maverick is looking more like town. On September 06 2012 09:06 BlackMamba24 wrote: we should lynch doyouhas too, this is a post that was definitely posted in the scum qt a few times my intuition is flaring up like crazy over this Claims he holds: He says BM has bad reads, and I am parrotting them. BM thinks mav is town, which I'm not parroting. BM and I both think that DYH is scum and so does he. However BM has bad reads and I am parroting those bad reads. Flat out contradictions that only serve to discredit our posting, even though he agrees with them. I thought that his weird play was just an extra portion of paranoia and something of a personal playstyle. However, a closer look shows that he does have a driving agenda of discrediting people and misrepresenting situations. His vehement attack on BC / defense of Mattchew and subsequent questioning of BC's alignment post flip also support this. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 06 2012 13:40 BlackMamba24 wrote: yeah that was all really messed up, sorry. I was angry because it seemed to me that everyone was ready to just let ottox slide, you never really gave any reason for anything you said. You voted for Mattchew pre-palmar (still doesn't give you any town cred) and then didn't post until the night comes. I don't really think you're in a position to point fingers at people for lurking considering that. What's wrong with questioning BloodyC0bblers alignment, do you know his alignment? Because I don't. You are right with the lurking - I got caught up with my little thing with DYH and haven't been lucid with my full reasonings behind each accusation. I do not however think it warrants misinterpretation or discrediting like that. There is nothing wrong about questioning BC's alignment, but you flat out said the Mattchew thing is alignment-inconclusive. This is beyond what I consider "healthy" paranoia, but that may be because you know what scum BC is capable of. Additionally I still don't see where you say "my read of Maverick was a misunderstanding", nor how that is the logical flow of reading the related posts. | ||
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slOosh
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On September 04 2012 13:17 Maverick32x wrote: Hey guys- got a chance to catch up and I have a couple thoughts. First- Not totally comfortable voting Mattchew at this point.. I understand the potential for lying about the role claim.. and I'm not a big fan of role claiming in general... HOWEVER- I'd like to reiterate BlackMamba's post that said something to the tune of "ITT- Townies arguing with Townies" because I find that people are so quick to blame each other for stupid stuff that we end up wasting the first couple days with literally zero reason for voting someone besides "They drew a picture".... That being said- I'd like to draw a little bit of attention to the first voter for whom I feel like I can make an actual observation on- Toadesstern. The reason I want to focus on that is just because of the speed at which he strikes out just makes me wonder why that's beneficial from a town perspective? And I'm just wondering if he just wanted to try to promote chaos right away?? Also- consistently attacking other posters seems to be a trend.... First is hesitation to actually call out names - he points out several things he has problems with but doesn't attach names to them, but remains vague. With his read on Toad, it isn't direct but roundabout. It invites suspicion on him but doesn't actually make any claims for himself. He has in mind things that are scummy tells "constantly attacking other posters", but doesn't draw a conclusion, yet still posts it so that others can draw conclusions from them. You see that all throughout his filter. "I find *this trait* suspicious, but I'm not going to call out anyone who is guilty of this as scum." I'm comparing it to his Newbie Game where he is getting into the nitty gritty of things, and even his opening post On August 29 2012 01:34 Maverick32x wrote: If there is room.. I'd like to get in on this... work has been REALLY slow lately and I'm done with class for a couple months, so figured I'd play a couple games : ) suggests he is eager to play and he has the time to do so. | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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Because I'm seeing new town learning as he goes along. You can see how his post reflect the thread information at the time (indication that he is reading), and making what you consider bad arguments is alignment null. His case against BM is very reasonable - as a new player what would you do when you see someone dropping strings of 8 1-liners and being vague in general, and people ignoring him? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 07 2012 01:07 slOosh wrote: I'm seeing new town learning as he goes along. You can see how his post reflect the thread information at the time (indication that he is reading) This I consider somewhat of a newbie town trait - if you read the thread and you are bound to absorb information and regurgitate it, and from what I see in each of his posts, you can see how a town can say what he is saying considering the precursor posts. (e.g. Ottoxlol argues about possiblility of Matt as assassin and the thought permeates to some people, and he picks it up and says what he thinks). Or more simply put, he is reading the thread and his posts reflect current going ons (regardless of how effective his good/bad posts filter is). I think for him it's best to see what his current thoughts are on people like Miltonkram, Hapa, Maverick to get a clearer understanding of his playstyle. | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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On September 06 2012 08:32 Forumite wrote: I think the reasoning goes "Too obnoxious to be scum". Why do you think he´s scum? Prior to this he posted On September 06 2012 08:26 Forumite wrote: My reads: Maverick32x (Scum) Everyone else (Null) And yet this is his only effort to remedy his null Ottoxlol read. A filter filled with questions that do not develop into reads indicates apathy. | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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Times his Toad case right Mattchew starts getting suspected. Defends Mattchew before the announcement. Starts attacking Ottoxlol. Flip flops and calls him possible town for no reason. "I can see him flip town" doesn't help us make the correct lynch, it only looks like he wants to get no blame for supporting a townie mislynch. ##Vote: BroodKingEXE | ||
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slOosh
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Gravan you should be posting more thoughts so people can get a better read of you. SnB, ShiaoPi, Shady Sands and Rewok are all people I had to double check the filter list because they lurk too much. You guys should be posting more as well. | ||
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slOosh
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slOosh
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Dear lurking town: stop it. If anything scum team are hiding because they don't have much thread presence. You are giving them room to hide. I don't care if you are blue, cause roles don't win games. I guess a bunch of them could be assassins or something. But that's stupid too ... | ||
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slOosh
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Furthermore, that doesn't even include the validity of the claim itself. Consider his claim true. Then GK delivered 1KP to BC. Then GK must have bombed into BM24 (as a vig shot on him or bombing into Ottoxlol is near impossible). 1KP is missing and must have been protected via medic / jailkeep, who chose to protect someone other than BC / BM24. Scum thought it is a good idea to 1KP to BC, Bomb BM24, and 1KP to someone else. It is much more likely that he is a liar and we should just lynch him. | ||
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slOosh
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On September 09 2012 03:12 Z-BosoN wrote: Why are you so intent on not lynching grush? Do you think his play has been pro-town or are you familiar with his town meta? Actually I don't understand this post at all. You are saying a grush lynch is better, but it is not not going to happen? So... BKE is a better lynch, with grush being a better lynch? wtf do you mean He wants to lynch Grush but its so close to deadline that he doesn't think its feasible to switch over properly. | ||
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slOosh
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On September 09 2012 03:18 Z-BosoN wrote: Wait, if instead GK bombed BC, wouldn't a watcher see GK if he's watching BC? Doesn't bombing count as visiting? Scum can visit up to 2 people since 1 for their role and 1 for factional KP. So GK could have delivered a KP on the same night as he bombed, and if tracked would show 2 people. | ||
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On September 09 2012 03:19 Forumite wrote: At page 61 and catching up. I had a thought: What if scum only have their suicide-bomber kill 2 players with his ability and one of their nightkills, while the others hold their powers? They wouldn´t risk exposing anyone to watchers and trackers, while still getting a decent amount of nightkills. They lose 1 of their 2 nightly KP, save their Vigilante bullets for later, and don´t mind missing a roleblock use because it´s only the medic that they could gain anything from roleblocking. With Matt dying D1, I could see scum getting nervous and doing something like this. tl;dr: The lack of roleblocks and missing scum nightkill is because scum didn´t use all their abilities last night. Dunno what information you haven't yet read, but if scum are gonna use a suicide bomber they are gonna make sure it counts, especially because they lost Matt D1. Think simple. BKEXE is a liar. | ||
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On September 09 2012 05:13 austinmcc wrote: EBWOP: by "easiest fakeclaim," I mean he could have claimed to vig ottoxlol, or protect some random person that didn't get killed. Instead he chose to claim something that directly interacted with a guy we know was a target last night, and that someone might have been on, and that causes us to do NK math. Any claim that ends in town doing NK math seems much more ... difficult, because then later stuff can prove/disprove you very easily. This basically boils down to "if I were scum I'd do a better job" which is not a good reason. I mean we've seen Mattchew fakeclaim, and you could have defended him on the same basis "if I were scum I would have double checked that they were not self aware". The fact is there is no good claim to make because the NK were pretty straightforward. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
So Scum decided 1KP on BC was a good idea? ... GK probably bombed ... so ... Gah I'm just gonna wait till tomorrow NK to figure it out. By then vigs should have used their second bullet and should claim. Gonna go cool off first. | ||
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slOosh
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Vig, decide for yourself what you want to do with your second bullet. Cross reference what you take out of the BKEXE mislynch with the Mattchew lynch and a lurker list. | ||
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slOosh
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BM, you can check out Dwarf Mini for my latest (2nd time excluding Bureaucracy) scum game. I played in Mad Men, Movie Star Mini and Pick Your Poison as town (was innocent child in PYP). Only normal blue role I got was medic in Newbie III. Rest have been in setup games. Oh I think I was JK in Movie star. | ||
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slOosh
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On September 09 2012 06:42 imallinson wrote: I've been out all day and caught up with the thread on the bus home. The day is almost over so sorry if this is a bit hasty. I'm not buying BKE's watcher claim. First a few assumptions I'm making: 1) Mafia has one vig thus had effectively three kp night one not including GK's bomb. 2) Mafia used all their kp. Someone suggested they saved some to out blues but that seems like it would only work if pressure was being put on that blue so I think it's unlikely. 3) Mafia did not shoot Ottox. If BKE is watcher then GK must have bombed BM and shot BC without a double stack. Therefore we are missing two kp. The only way for this to happen is a combination of a medic/jailer getting a lucky save, a scum shot hit an assassin or the jailer rb'd a scum. To me this seems very unlikely because BC seems like the better bomb target and barring a medic saving BKE he should be dead. Also missing two kp feels really fishy to me. One getting blocked I could understand but two seems a little far fetched given the information available at the time (that no one apart from the two dead people seemed that town). What made you assume that mafia had a vig? | ||
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slOosh
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On September 10 2012 11:26 strongandbig wrote: slooooooo-o-o-o-o-o-oooosh why are you not playing like you normally do when you are town yoru not doing thissssss are you sucm or an assssassin? Because this isn't a normal game. All the lynches have been complete blowouts and half the town are lurking. It's harder to corral people toward good lynches when everyone is sheeping / lurking. I'm not even kidding. I can't even bounce ideas off properly. That said I think imallinson might be a good lynch and I'm asking to either strengthen my case or decide he isn't a good lynch. imallinson I would also like your read on Forumite. | ||
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On September 10 2012 12:34 strongandbig wrote: it could be because i'm really tired but what's the case on imallinson? I don't see it in his filter and i'm not sure if someone's actually made it yet What's your read on him? Stop dodging. | ||
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On September 10 2012 21:58 Forumite wrote: I haven´t read the last few pages. What I get from rereading the Matt situation is that Z-boson looks very bad. He was avoiding talking about Matt except to softdefend and provides distraction cases until several people had all voted Matt. He then says he´s voting Matt but doesn´t while, providing a very wishy-washy reason for the vote. ##Vote: Z-boson This shows that Forumite doesn't care about the game. This is his very first mention of Z-boson, he is picking a target that is easy to hop onto, the reasons for scuminness could have been cited D2 but never were and he was not present for any of the discussion concerning him D2. Furthermore, he has not even drawn anything from the discussion as the only behavior he mentions is from D1. Couple this with several more instances of him not reading and general apathy to the game, appearing only when people start suspecting him. ##Vote: Forumite | ||
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On September 08 2012 23:41 austinmcc wrote: This. GK as suicide bomber could still deliver a kill. And if you're scum and you lose mattchew D1, you're suiciding GK N1, you're 100% gonna use him as a shooter because he can't get caught delivering a kill, he's gonna be dead. We're basically narrowed down to BM24 being double stacked and BKE lying OR BM24 single shot, BKE watcher, and a medic save. Unless mafia shot Ottoxlol, which seems...unlikely. I take that as a vig shot on Ottox. More likely that he was roleblocked rather than hold off shot / target saved by medic or JK. Still don't like imallinson and will probably build a case on him after today, but Forumite is just blaring out at this point. | ||
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On September 11 2012 08:44 Maverick32x wrote: Ok, I just want to start off by saying I suspect Forumite is mafia and I will be voting for him. That being said- the amount of bandwagoning that just occurred for him to be our prime suspect is disturbing. If Forumite is NOT mafia, we NEED to focus on the people who are not contributing to a case- and start putting some pressure on them because they are just allowing us to kill each other and are just going to sit back the entire time. Sl00sh's weak "that doesn't show he cares" case is such a knee-jerk reaction to a single post. Hopeless1der: Bandwagons- despite forumite asserting that he suppported someone that hopeless was suspecting (Z-boson). Rewok- gimme a break. Imallinson- your weak vote is pretty damning. etc. etc.. Not sure if lazy town or scum. Refer to my post for Forumite reasoning. Guys I want to lynch Maverick. 1) He wants to wait for a Forumite flip before he starts focusing on the people "causing" the lynches. 2) He hasn't contributed anything to the Forumite case, nor the Z-boson case himself. 3) He spends the last cycle talking about lynching lurkers and totally dropped it this cycle. I'm wondering if a voteswitch will rustle up enough friction to catch some scum. What do you think Toad? | ||
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On September 11 2012 13:19 Maverick32x wrote: 1) I'm voting Z-Boson... 2)- I made a whole post on forumite.... 3)- Yup. I think my post did rustle up some friction.... Oh ok. Could you post the part where you present evidence that suggests Forumite is scum? | ||
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And Maverick, I understand your frustration that the lynches are basically one person going "I choose X" and then 10 lurkers popping out of nowhere saying "yea X is good choice" and going back to lurking. But that's what we have to deal with because our blues are stupidly lurking giving scum places to hide. Really, right now scum gameplan is probably lay low but not too much as to get caught until they can snipe off all the big town voices / blues protecting them. Otherwise they can't really come out since their history looks like utter crap. I mean same thing with Mattchew, only a handful of people decided to act before the announcement. Post announcement everyone followed suit and you can't distinguish scum easily. And scum will continue to do it because a stupid / lazy town is letting them do it. You will probably get the same exact feeling no matter who is getting lynched. | ||
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This game is so annoying. ShaioPi I want you to answer this one before deadline: Mav - do you think he is scum? imallinson: any reason why you decided to snip out the timestamps in this post? On September 12 2012 00:09 imallinson wrote: Z-Boson The main thing that seems really off is this: I, along with everyone else it seems, don't see why this is relevant. He is trying to say lynching a blue is ok if we have another spare. I read that as him knowing BKE was blue and trying to justify lynching him. That screams scum to me. Then we get onto this: followed an hour later by: This sudden flip from thinking BM is confirmed town to scum in the space of an hour makes no sense to me. In fact thinking BM was confirmed town in the first place makes no sense in itself. Forumite still seems off to me but ZB's posting screams scum, much more so than Forumite's. How he handled the BKE thing was just plain weird and anti-town and the flip on BM makes no sense from a town perspective either. ##Unvote ##Vote: Z-Boson Because you straight up lie in quoting Z-boson's two quotes which have a whole day between this post and this post? | ||
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On September 12 2012 09:50 ShiaoPi wrote: @sloosh: I had him pegged as scum the day before ( even pulled out half a case), but his last post is feeling a lot like being a stupid townie. Not completely exonerating him, but lessened my suspicions. I would be concerned with toad, simply because he is still alive ( could change this night anyway) and also of bm it is hard enough to follow his train of thought, but lynching him always seems to end in coin flip cause of his trolling. Unsure about whom to lynch next day Have general people you think you will look into? | ||
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What do you think about strongandbig? | ||
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I'm pretty sure that was both mafia KP and I don't understand why anyone would assume that any vigs we have would still have bullets left in this lurker infested town. On September 12 2012 10:32 grush57 wrote: Either him or Toad is scum. Hey Grush, what is your current read of strongandbig & Toad? Gravan Seriously, this is the laziest post ever. In an explosive contrast between Toad and Z-boson, all he drops is a meaningless post. This is scum who is getting lazy because town has been lynching each other (everyone on Ottoxlol, BKEXE, lynch between Z-Boson & Forumite). On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote: Z-Boson is highly suspicious. On September 12 2012 04:56 Gravan wrote: To be a bit more clear: Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him. On September 12 2012 06:50 Gravan wrote: I chose forumite over Z-Boson and Bill Murray because I am uncertain about them in general (as you chose to ignore). I also believe (also as you chose to ignore) that Forumite is scum because of the methods he is using as a 'defence', in addition to the reasons (such as flip-floppiness) presented in the strong cases posted here already. With someone who might be scum that you are uncertain of, wouldn't you want to pursue a better read of them? Why would you lurk more when that is clearly what town is suffering from? Furthermore, everyone should check out imallinson's case here (as well as his newer case). Not only is it clear that there is a contradiction that he says Toad needs to be looked at (calling him scum in all but name) but he backtracks and doesn't call him scum, but the fact is that this Toad he found worth inspection is totally lacking from his filter at all. I believe we have let him get by because of highly polarized lynches. Well not this time. ##Vote: Gravan | ||
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On September 12 2012 07:50 Maverick32x wrote: Shady Sands- just scummy. Hard defends Shiao. Argues with Hapa (town). DISAPPEARS when the vote comes. <- So similar to the play style of ShiaoPi and there seems to be some really slight buddying occurring. He continues to live in "Matthchew" land and never seems to snap into the current thread which kind of shows me a lack of understanding. His most recent attack on Gravan to be honest is just an attempt to push an early vote while scum is being successful. Hey Mav, why isn't Gravan on your scummy-lurker list? | ||
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Let's lynch Graven. | ||
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On September 14 2012 01:20 strongandbig wrote: I don't have a town read on gravan like I do on grush and billmurray, so I'd be willing to consolidate on him, but the case on him just feels too "wtf where is he" without enough "also this is why he's scum." How does any part of my case call him out for lurking? On September 13 2012 12:39 slOosh wrote: Gravan Seriously, this is the laziest post ever. In an explosive contrast between Toad and Z-boson, all he drops is a meaningless post. This is scum who is getting lazy because town has been lynching each other (everyone on Ottoxlol, BKEXE, lynch between Z-Boson & Forumite). With someone who might be scum that you are uncertain of, wouldn't you want to pursue a better read of them? Why would you lurk more when that is clearly what town is suffering from? Furthermore, everyone should check out imallinson's case here (as well as his newer case). Not only is it clear that there is a contradiction that he says Toad needs to be looked at (calling him scum in all but name) but he backtracks and doesn't call him scum, but the fact is that this Toad he found worth inspection is totally lacking from his filter at all. I believe we have let him get by because of highly polarized lynches. Well not this time. ##Vote: Gravan | ||
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On September 14 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote: You're more into a vet than sloOsh is for me. But that really doesn't matter anymore. I already said the moment foru flipped green that assumption of mine got either completely smashed or too complicated to figure out because we don't know if we have assassins to begin with. So I don't really want to talk about it as it's incredible pointless right now. Yes it is, now help us hunt scum. | ||
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On September 14 2012 05:42 Toadesstern wrote: Yeah it's between Grav and Mav for me. Leaning on Grav right now. Mementoss is not going to get lynched and I don't want him to get lynched right now, probably not even tomorrow. Don't think a mafia would so violently tell everybody how I'm looking stupid when he in fact knows that I'm town. A mafia usually wants to be on the right side of things if possible without killing his allies and therefore I'd assume mafias to be the ones going easy on me or actually defending me in front of other people to look good later on. Now way I'm going to get him lynched :p So you are saying you think MMT is town now? | ||
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On September 14 2012 05:52 Toadesstern wrote: well I'm at least doubting his scuminess to a point that I want Grav and Mav lynched first. But your posting says otherwise. On September 14 2012 05:33 Toadesstern wrote: Just stop it, go scumhunt somewhere else. You won't find something at my place. This is a clear town read. You would never say this to scum. | ||
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On September 11 2012 01:21 Toadesstern wrote: Let's be honest here: I think if we lynch into one of either Forumite, S&B, BM or Z-Boson we're going to hit "not-townie" all the way. On September 14 2012 00:48 Toadesstern wrote: Yeah I'd be willing to lynch anyone out of Gravan, Mementoss and Mav today (so far). But I'm willing to sheep someone else today, for the good of town! Something is definitely out of order here. It's like you don't care who get's lynched. How did your scum reads change so drastically? | ||
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On September 14 2012 06:18 Toadesstern wrote: I explained that like 3 times. Do you want me to quote it or are you going to search for it yourself? On September 13 2012 19:57 Toadesstern wrote: I said either BM or Foru are mafia later on. Something like d2, n2 or d3 I guess? So that one would be the more updated read on BM but not sure if that still holds. It was based on the "there has to be a mafia vet" assumption and forumite flipping green (=neither red nor black) pretty much destroyed that, or at least it now has an interesting twist to it: As far as I know we don't actually know whether we've got Assassins in this game or not. If we have some it's highly likely that BM and S&B are those Assassins because hosts don't usually give 3rd party roles to new guys because they're hard to play. If that's the case we obviously don't have a mafia within those 2. If we don't have Assassins to begin with we probably still have a mafia within those 2. Not sure I want to take that gamble today. On September 14 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote: You're more into a vet than sloOsh is for me. But that really doesn't matter anymore. I already said the moment foru flipped green that assumption of mine got either completely smashed or too complicated to figure out because we don't know if we have assassins to begin with. So I don't really want to talk about it as it's incredible pointless right now. This is all I found: You say speculation on Assassins is pointless but you use the possibility of their existence to excuse BM and SnB from your scum reads. So either you believe they exist or you are justifying your actions after teh fact. | ||
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On September 14 2012 06:23 Gravan wrote: I am lying because you've interpreted what "actively lurking" means differently than I have? That is a difference in semantics, not lying. You keep mentioning my "lies", and how there is this apparently strong evidence towards me being scummy, but you really are not making a case. You're just pointing the finger at me, picking apart what I say, and calling it scummy. Toad then pops in, mindlessly agrees, and continues talking on to talk about a different lynch topic. Does nobody else see something wrong here? Stop playing coy. Out with it. Are you calling Toad scum? | ||
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What Maverick did just now was a very very town thing. Feigning activity and making cases is easy. Calling the runner up lynch candidate town when you have the most votes is not. The only motivation to do that is that you are town, and you think this person is town. You can see that he doesn't value his specific survival over the town's interests. His case really shows his thinking process and also clarifies past contradictions (e.g. he left out Graven from his scum reads) - consistency like this is hard to setup as scum. Gravan ... it's really weird with him. As Maverick points out he is playing consistently (regardless of quality). I remember thinking he was newbie town making lots of mistakes, and it could be he is scummy because of this. Also strange is the nature of the maverick counter wagon. Still thinking this one through. ShiaoPi: his treatment of Mav is townish. Timezones are timezones. Select stuff in his filter make me think he is town and explain his actions but will not divulge unless there is a large enough body of evidence against him. This leaves me with two people: SnB has not cared at all about the past two lynches. You can see from his filter that he jumps on the Forumite lynch with little to contribute while also discrediting Rewok. He jumps on the maverick lynch with little to add and also makes sure people know that everyone could be scum ("MMT made the case on Mav but you never know maybe he is scum"). His latest posts are pure setup speculation. He treats Toad very strangely - I'm not sure if he thinks Toad might be scum and hunting for reactions or he is pretending to engage in meaningful conversation. Toad is someone who has flared up upon a proper reread of the Z-Boson mad hatter business. I originally thought him town after our little spat at the start of the game. However if you reread his filter carefully, you will notice that he uses "vet balance" to get Forumite lynched, but after that he says "oh I guess I was wrong, oh well". He seemed to taunt Z-boson near deadline and called for vig shots on him even if he was town because he would die anyway. I know I said mafia wouldn't kill a potential mad hatter but I forgot that there is a very good chance of a roleblocker in the game, as we still don't know about austin's 2nd shot. I find the explanations for his dismissal of SnB and BM to be beyond just strange, as he is ignoring possible scum on raw setup speculation. Thoughts please, we need to get this lynch right. | ||
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SnB and Toad are not as easily excused as they have many games under their belt and are capable of so much more, and yet are completely apathetic and are not contributing to finding and lynching scum. | ||
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On September 14 2012 20:12 Shady Sands wrote: Good point. But I think we should still lynch Grav first, and Mav later. My read on Mav has slipped into scum territory after his soft defense of Gravan. I don't understand why he would try so hard to cast Grav's actions in the light of being a newbie town... then at the very end say Grav is either town or scum trying to look newbie, and he can't tell which. Soft defense at its finest. SnB's point is awful and you have fallen into confirmation bias at this point. If you are gonna go calling all town actions as "very smart play", then you disperse doubt and mistrust between players. I'm finding him to be much more likely to flip scum. And you also look terrible for getting so jumpy that I'm shifting my view. If I think the lynch candidates are all town of course I'm going to look elsewhere. Need to review later when I get time but right now my lynch preference is SnB, then SS then Gravan. ##Unvote: Gravan ##Vote: Shady Sands On September 14 2012 17:48 Bill Murray wrote: How am I getting ignored, when you even talking about Rewok to Sloosh comes from MY case on him? Cause I think you are town? What? | ||
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StrongandBig On September 05 2012 00:29 strongandbig wrote: lol. If matt was going to defend himself he would have said something by now other than "hey guys maybe I'm a VT trying to draw scum shots lol". I've played a bunch of games with Mattchew recently and based on those, I think this is him as scum. For example, if I were going to fakeclaim miller as scum, I would do it very differently. However, you have to remember a couple things about Mattchew: - he's lazy as fuck as scum, except in themed games - he's pretty aggressive as town a lot of the time. The example I was thinking about was from him in TL Mafia LV, where he and I were both town. He lied about taking a shot, and then when I suggested that it made no sense for him to take a scum shot and he might have been vigged, he attacked me like a moron for the rest of the game. Unlike that, in this game his lie doesn't have any follow-up. If it was a planned-out pro-town lie, which I imagine is what he'll pretend it is, he would have been all over the first few people to attack him. Instead he just disappeared. It seems much more likely that what he did was the same thing I did in deathnote - claimed miller without first asking the hosts whether millers are self-aware, and got caught for it. The difference is, I did it in a game with a closed setup. ##vote: mattchew This is his Mattchew vote. Review the context and look at how everyone else votes. They are all one liners saying "he is a liar ##Vote Mattchew". StrongandBig takes his time to really get into the nitty gritty and dwells on the point when it is totally unnecessary. There is no serious opposition to the votes - making your stance on Mattchew extremely clear is not something town would see as something necessary. This is scum bussing a teammate mentality - get as much credit by being as clear as possible. There are many posts in his filter that are mere speculation and wishy washy - nothing that shows scumhunting: On September 05 2012 00:41 strongandbig wrote: One last thing - I wanted to mention some things I saw in BC's filter. Reading through the thread I was pretty confounded by how assertive he was towards DrH, but it makes sense if he was told by Palmar that he couldn't let the thread know Palmar had modconfirmed that nosy neighbors aren't self-aware. The other thing is about the repeated not-reading-mattchew's-actual-post and saying he was trying to get blues to claim. I don't really know what to make of this, other than it kind of shows BC is just skimming. We can pretty safely assume that BC isn't the same alignment as Mattchew, so that means he's probably town unless Matt flips assassin; but this still seems kind of odd to me, especially since the thread wasn't extremely long at the point BC called out Mattchew. I haven't played many games with BC so I don't know whether this is a scum tell for him, or if he's just always lazy as town, but hopefully someone who has played more games with him can drop some meta for us. Look how many times he states how uncertain he is on the issue. Then why bring it up? Why bother telling everyone in the thread "BC looks kinda weird but I'm not sure"? Read Mafia XXX - this is a scum trait, emphasizing uncertainty. Why as town would you want people to know how unsure you are? You can see he isn't trying to get a better read of BC since he doesn't post anything else on him. Compare this to a post from his filter in Mad Men Mafia On August 05 2012 00:37 strongandbig wrote: that's a drastic oversimplification, biosc. Here's why I think wbg is scum: When he's town he explains things, doesn't gambit, and doesn't draw attention to himself for no reason with stunts. In this game, he hasn't explained himself in a satisfactory way - and the explanations he has given don't hold up whatsoever. His reasons for outing the masons don't hold up. If he wanted mafia to have to wifom before shooting him, there was really no reason he needed to claim mason; he could have just played super townie, which he is definitely capable of doing, and then called for medic protection. His claim to be "pressuring" ve by outing him doesn't match his thread behavior, where he didn't pressure ve at all or even make him post more than once or twice. And his claim to be "deterring potential scum masons from masoning people in the future" doesn't hold up either, unless everyone agrees to out more masons in the future; in order for this tactic to work he would have to persuade everyone that outing masons is good in general and he hasn't even tried to do that. Additionally, I would count this "instantly outing masons" thing as a gambit of the second order - and bugs has frequently said not to gambit as town. It's not in his town meta. Next, both with the outing of the masons and with his self-voting, public insults, and flame-war with erandorr, he's drawing attention to himself in a way that isn't consistent with his town play. Finally, there's the grush thing. Usually when town-wbg tries to lead a lynch, it's with reasons and explanation as well as the insults. This one had jack shit of that until he was pushed on it, and then when he was pushed on it the best he could come up with was more insults plus an example of one game where grush trolled. Yeah so that's why wbg is scum. Vote for him. Look how sure and assertive he is. He brings out clear arguments and doesn't once say "oh I'm not sure". This is also a D1 lynch involving strong personalities. On September 09 2012 02:25 strongandbig wrote: I don't think grush is scum. As far as I can tell the case on him from toad started off as "grush is trying harder to look/be townie than he usually does, therefore he must be scum." The alternative explanation is that maybe he's just trying harder to look/be townie? I played/obsed the recent PTP game, where grush survived until almost the end - that game, trolly as it was, was the towniest grush has ever been. I'm still not entirely sold on BKE, but I feel much better about him than about Grush. The claim, I don't know about. It's a very easy claim for mafia to make, and we can't prove it false or true, especially since he'll be able to claim roleblocked. There's the fact that if he checked the person who was suicide bombed he should be dead, but I give zero weight to the argument that's been made by some people that his claim is too weird to be made by mafia. If the claim is fake, it's possible that he was the one who delivered the KP on BC - or one of the two if he was double stacked - and the claim is designed to be safe against trackers and real watchers. Anyway, I don't think we should ignore the case on him just because he claimed a PR. I agree with whoever it was up above who said that if we do that, then scum can just always claim PRs and get free extra life by claiming to be roleblocked. So I'm back to the original core of the case against him - his scummy shift in position on Mattchew before and after Palmar's post in the thread. Sure it's not 100% a sure thing, but I like that case better than the case on Grush, and so ##vote: broodkingexe pre-edit Reading over Austin's post right above mine it looks like some decent arguments on z-boson as well - big lists, not following up on his own stuff, inconsistency, etc. Also someone to consider. Another post where he tries to take no responsibility for his votes. Notice how many times he has to let everyone know that he isn't sure. Additionally is mentioning other people's cases to push the idea - this allows people to start mislynches but he takes no responsibility. Scum trait. He doesn't even actually read Z-Boson's filter until called out. On September 11 2012 07:26 strongandbig wrote: I... don't really like this logic. This implies that your own instinct is pointing at someone other than Forumite - who would that be? That said, some logic I do like is the case on Forumite. It's not just that he's been way less "pro-town" and "invested" than usual this game, although that's the biggest part of the case; but I still think there are some sketchy things in his filter - that first "don't lynch vets" post still rankles considering it came from someone who is pretty vet-ish. ##vote: Forumite Again, we see he hops on a wagon, not offering anything new. If you notice he never mentions Rewok after the flip - why wouldn't you pursue something like that? He finds something off about the post, but just says "I don't like it". So many times in his filter "I don't like this or that" but never "this looks like scum". On September 14 2012 01:20 strongandbig wrote: I'm voting for maverickx. Out of the cases so far, the one on him (redone recently by mementoss) has by far the most meat to it. I don't have a town read on gravan like I do on grush and billmurray, so I'd be willing to consolidate on him, but the case on him just feels too "wtf where is he" without enough "also this is why he's scum." I think compared to those two, mementoss isn't a great lynch for today since he seems to have started giving a fuck. However, that could just be him being scum and realizing that he has to start giving a fuck or die. But I think mav is the best lynch out of those today. ##vote: maverickx Again, hopping on another person's wagon, but also letting everyone know that the person whose wagon he is joining could be scum. He is setting up mislynches. If you think he could be scum then you would question it at the time, you don't need to wait for a townie flip to start pursuing it. On September 14 2012 14:06 strongandbig wrote: We should be killing Mav today. He hasn't made a real read all game, and now comes out with a town-case on Gravan. We still don't have any scumhunting out of him, and town cases are easy for scum to make. I think he saw the writing on the wall and this is a ploy, and we shouldn't fall for it. It's not a case where the only motive was town; it's also very smart scum play, regardless of Gravan's alignment. A push on Gravan by Mav would just be dismissed, so this is his top option. I've pointed it out before and I'll do it again. First, the bold line is EXTREMELY hypocritical as seen from my case. Second, how is he so sure a push on Gravan be dismissed? He is twisting the situation to make mav look like scum no matter what. And this is the first time that he seems to care about the lynch, so I'm thinking that one of the candidates is a scum buddy (prob Gravan) that he is trying to save with a counter wagon. The best vote for today is StrongandBig. I realize this case is coming late but that is because Mav's posts and stuff that follow were late in the day. I will vote StrongandBig and check back nearer deadline if enough people can see it. I strongly think mav is a bad lynch at this point. Both Gravan and Shady Sands are better lynches than him. ##Unvote: Shady Sands ##Vote: StrongandBig | ||
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On September 15 2012 03:05 Kreb wrote: Ooooh, I like that one sloosh. Had given up on getting anything on S&B. You are very late though.... He was always at the back of my mind but there are so many lurkers that he just got lucky and put near the back of the line. Start putting votes on him we still have 4 hours you never know. | ||
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On September 15 2012 06:41 Maverick32x wrote: Ok, WOW- I'm switching to either Strong or Shady. They are scum. I dont know if I only have 20 minutes left or not, (just got home from work) but I will attempt to get some evidence out real quick. I will be voting for whoever has the most votes right now, and I will type furiously to get my case together. Cool, put it on SnB, I already did the legwork. | ||
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On September 15 2012 06:49 Mementoss wrote: Also I was wondering, when you intially switched off of Gravan, you being the one who made the case, why did you switch, what changed your mind? I've always been on the fence of newbie town or terribad scum - basically for me it's hard to differentiate between poor play and scum play. I switched because if I look at it from a perspective of a new new newbie town, it's feasible and also the Mav thing brought out some stuff. I had the opportunity so I did. | ||
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slOosh
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Shady Sands looks pretty bad. To be honest I haven't read his filter that cleanly but that one post where he echoes snb was just terrible and I gotta go back and look at it. Still think Rewok and Gravan are newbie town. Would prefer if we don't lynch them for a while. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
Shady you should be working your hardest right now to present a good lynch candidate for tomorrow. People should be looking into snb's filter and people's relation with him to find more connections. Uhh ... yea I can't do any more reading right now. Oh yea Toad you look extra terrible for weird interactions with snb if I recall. You should present a good lynch candidate for tomorrow as well. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 15 2012 07:32 Hopeless1der wrote: Can I has a cookie? You get biggest cookie. But please don't get lazy I can't do all the work. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 13 2012 12:39 slOosh wrote: Hey Grush, what is your current read of strongandbig & Toad? Funny how this keeps coming up. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 15 2012 07:51 grush57 wrote: Hmm, the way he handled the auto confirm is a bit suspicous, and he like soft attacked Toad, so maybe botha re scum. Not too sure if I'm understanding correctly. Could you post the quotes that show this and specify the auto confirm thing a bit more? | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 15 2012 07:52 Kreb wrote: S&B was buddying Toad a bit at the start though. Not sure why you'd buddy a mafia teammate.... Easy / planned dialogue, feigning contribution, avoiding connections for late game etc. Gotta look at what he is trying to achieve with it. Alright I think this is my last post of the night. Please don't let thread die. Otherwise we might repeat the D1 lynch -> D2 / D3 mislynch business again. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 14 2012 12:14 slOosh wrote: Guhh ... why do you guys wait until now to play properly? What Maverick did just now was a very very town thing. Feigning activity and making cases is easy. Calling the runner up lynch candidate town when you have the most votes is not. The only motivation to do that is that you are town, and you think this person is town. You can see that he doesn't value his specific survival over the town's interests. His case really shows his thinking process and also clarifies past contradictions (e.g. he left out Graven from his scum reads) - consistency like this is hard to setup as scum. Gravan ... it's really weird with him. As Maverick points out he is playing consistently (regardless of quality). I remember thinking he was newbie town making lots of mistakes, and it could be he is scummy because of this. Also strange is the nature of the maverick counter wagon. Still thinking this one through. ShiaoPi: his treatment of Mav is townish. Timezones are timezones. Select stuff in his filter make me think he is town and explain his actions but will not divulge unless there is a large enough body of evidence against him. This leaves me with two people: SnB has not cared at all about the past two lynches. You can see from his filter that he jumps on the Forumite lynch with little to contribute while also discrediting Rewok. He jumps on the maverick lynch with little to add and also makes sure people know that everyone could be scum ("MMT made the case on Mav but you never know maybe he is scum"). His latest posts are pure setup speculation. He treats Toad very strangely - I'm not sure if he thinks Toad might be scum and hunting for reactions or he is pretending to engage in meaningful conversation. Toad is someone who has flared up upon a proper reread of the Z-Boson mad hatter business. I originally thought him town after our little spat at the start of the game. However if you reread his filter carefully, you will notice that he uses "vet balance" to get Forumite lynched, but after that he says "oh I guess I was wrong, oh well". He seemed to taunt Z-boson near deadline and called for vig shots on him even if he was town because he would die anyway. I know I said mafia wouldn't kill a potential mad hatter but I forgot that there is a very good chance of a roleblocker in the game, as we still don't know about austin's 2nd shot. I find the explanations for his dismissal of SnB and BM to be beyond just strange, as he is ignoring possible scum on raw setup speculation. Thoughts please, we need to get this lynch right. On September 14 2012 20:13 Shady Sands wrote: These are my top lynch candidates at the moment: Gravan Maverick I also have a strong townread on SnB, and my previous townread on sloosh is slipping into null territory after his weak list above. Yea I dunno how you gonna backtrack on this one Shady. "weak list" you say? It's not something you can really respond to that well, so here's the followup question. On September 15 2012 08:06 Shady Sands wrote: Since I thought at the time that Gravan was scum, anyone who came out before a lynch was inevitable on Gravan and made noises about lynching him earned town points in my book. Now that S&B has flipped scum, I retract that and I think Gravan is just a bad town who other scum tried to latch upon. Grav's behavior, in particular, over the past few hours has been very townie and returns my read on him to null. Can you point out said posts, and how they are "very townie", and only return him to null? Cause I think you're bluffing. And scum. And tomorrow's lynch. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
On September 16 2012 04:56 Shady Sands wrote: ebwop meant to say over the final day of the heated D4 lynch. Toad was ambivalent to who got lynched that day, which makes sense if you think of him as scum and all of the prospective candidates at the time (me, Grav, MMT) as town. Also that's some heavy confirmation bias once again. Also you left out Maverick. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
Also just noticed Mementoss' huge case. Unfortunately I won't have time to read thoroughly and comment before deadline (don't think there are any medics so I'm sure I'm going out this cycle) but I agree with the general points presented. | ||
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
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slOosh
3291 Posts
I also dunno how the SnB lynch went down but that was fun. | ||
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