|
To be a bit more clear:
Bill Murray's posting is very difficult to read, and he claims to have had more knowledge than he really ought to have had. That said, he has apparently been playing mafia for a while so he could also have just made a good read.
Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him.
|
On September 12 2012 05:10 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote:
At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics):
Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows?
Z-Boson is highly suspicious.
Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy.
I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh.
##Vote Forumite. This is exactly why I'm defensive, not about posts that disagree with me, but about posts like this. You sheep don't bother making real cases, don't bother commenting on the real cases, and just follow along the trend. Forumite's suspicious? Yes I very much think so. He's made few cases and has been, like you, very casual about his votes. I fail to see how, at the moment, BM doesn't seem more suspicious than him, however. And I'm bothered by the fact that no one has bothered giving me any reasons as to why they think my case on BM sucks and doesn't deserve merit. Aside from imallinson, all we are getting is two-liner "this guy is suspicious" posts, and this makes scum feel comfortable blending in, because they don't have to bother scumhunting. Why is this bad? Because scum can't genuinely scumhunt and are bound to make mistakes. Thus, I strongly feel they must be forced to scumhunt, but that's not gonna happen with these kind of posts. Anyways, I'm done ranting. I hope people can agree with me here...
See, all I did was say that you're "highly suspicious". No case, nothing. It could, maybe, just be that I am fishing around a little - hoping to get a line or two from you in response or whatever. What I get, instead, is a full paragraph using phrasing like "I fail to see how, at the moment, BM doesn't seem more suspicious than him, however." - this isn't something I said or even implied.
As for "I'm bothered by the fact that no one has bothered giving me any reasons as to why they think my case on BM sucks...", haha, welcome to the club champ  . I wonder if this could be because BM is scum, that the cases/words against him are being downplayed by scum? In any case, I really think the reads on BM (including mine, as stated) are all over the place.
On September 12 2012 05:17 Z-BosoN wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 05:02 mkfuba07 wrote:On September 12 2012 04:46 Z-BosoN wrote:Oh, nothing against me, huh? On September 12 2012 04:21 Mementoss wrote:On September 12 2012 04:18 Kreb wrote:On September 12 2012 04:04 Z-BosoN wrote:On September 12 2012 03:51 Forumite wrote:On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote:On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote:
I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth.
The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote:
And there goes D3.
Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote:
Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now?
Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson?
Why do you want me to die?
Make an effort to explain yourself.For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler +On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote:First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler +On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote:Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote:On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote:
I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase: On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote:
Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again?
Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote:
Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him.
I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote:
Hello folks ^^
I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone.
A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker.
Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite+ Show Spoiler +Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote:
There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote:
Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep.
For now:
##Vote: Mattchew
He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BMShow nested quote +On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote:
Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me:
We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads.
But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment?
I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me.
In the next post: + Show Spoiler +On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote:
Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched.
What can we conclude if he flips scum or town?
In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch?
My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum.
If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched.
Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game.
@Shiaopi
Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote:
No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? , He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum. - Well, I´d hope Bill Murray would at least lead a lynch on a scum sometime during this game. He´s been hanging back, most importantly during yesterdays mislynch. - I´m giving the game the time I can give, but it´s a bloody big game. Lots to read through. 1) At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore, even if that´s because the scum killed the most active posters. - 2) Why Z-boson? I can´t tell, there´s a lot of scumsense and odd posts, but nothing huge and damning. There´s no single thing I can point to that is definetly a scum move, but several that make me suspect there´s a scum motivation somewhere. It´s a big game and the two flipped scum died very, very early, so unfortunately this is the best I can do for now. I´ve gotten a scumread on Z-boson and it´s one of the few that hasn´t changed through the game. I´ve flip-flopped on almost everyone else, but my read on him has been off for a long time. It could just be tunneling of course. 1) This is good then? Not to flatter myself, but you propose to kill the most active poster atm. Liking the silence? This is another pretty good reason why I dont wanna vote Boson lol. He puts so many words in peoples mouthes. I have no idea how "At least the thread doesn´t grow that fast anymore" becomes "you propose to kill the most active poster atm". At thats hardly the first time, he hits on everything, left and right. I somehow have a hard time believing a mafia wouldnt be more...... tactical than that. Dafuq. This if anything IS a real to vote Boson. If you believe he is putting words in peoples mouths, you believe he is pushing scum agenda by doing the following:1) Confusing town 2) Making someone look guilty of something that wasn't said or implied 3) Creates useless discussion based on the fact of putting words in peoples mouths I felt it was implied. I think you went a bit overboard on the semantics of "Putting words into peoples mouths". He means I'm giving people arguments to work with. I understood this, because if you have read the game, that's exactly what I'm doing. You, for some reason, think that means 1) 2) and 3). Since I cannot fathom how it could POSSIBLY mean 1) 2) and 3) granted how I've been posting, I felt that this was implied, granted kreb's statement was entirely towards me. So the only conclusion I can draw from your comment is that you have not yet read the game carefully enough. Please do so, and share your thoughts on mav. Sorry for the aggressiveness, I'm pissed at how some people are behaving here and how that's going unnoticed. If - as Kreb said - you were putting words into peoples' mouths, then momentoss's reaction is completely justified. Putting words into peoples' mouths IS used by scum in all the ways he mentioned. He never once said that you were doing so, he only said that if Kreb thinks you're doing so, then he's interpreting it in the completely wrong way. I agree with him entirely. This is the second time you've reacted over-defensively to something rather inconsequential. The first was when two people voted for you and you claimed there were five. This was in the middle of the massive wagon building onto Forumite. 8 people vote Forumite, 2 vote you, suddenly it's "OMG where are these votes coming from? This wagon on me is so big and sudden without a case!" Why so defensive? Refer to the above post I answered Gravan with. Because they were completely unjustified. I had two votes, but there were 3-5 people saying "Z-BosoN is my top scumread" and that's it. This is shit, we are in day three and we were better off in day one with the cases being made. Also because I took the time to make the BM case and few people have even responded. Look at my answer to imallinson's case on me to confirm this - I'm not defensive. I am, however, trying to make people stop this hardcore sheeping. Like I said, this is the best environment scum can thrive in, because they don't need to bother themselves making real scumreads and thus not needing to risk making mistakes.
As for this, I think we can all agree (even those guilty of it, including me today) that we really need to stop this. Regardless of how anybody's read on Z-Boson we do need to start actively and individually scumhunting for the reasons he stated.
|
On September 12 2012 05:39 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 04:27 Hopeless1der wrote:If you're going to respond, could you not cherry pick?
Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson?
Why do you want me to die?
Make an effort to explain yourself.
I don´t know, stuff you´ve done. I´m not as sure on you as on Z-boson and BM though, and sometimes I get the feeling you are more likely town. I have 80 minutes left in the game, why do you want me to spend it on making a case on you? Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 04:37 Mementoss wrote:On September 12 2012 04:35 Z-BosoN wrote:Also, eagerly awaiting your case on mav: On September 11 2012 22:12 Mementoss wrote:
I am at work and don't have much time. Catching up is hard, from my reading so far I think Maverick is scum and will vote him I read the most recent case on forumite but I just don't see it. Hopefully I can finish filling in the gaps of reading tonight and actually post a worthy post of why maverick is scum. I'm hoping I can make deadline today busy day. When I posted this I was at page 40. I'm at page 59 now. So I still have half the game to catch up on. At this point it won't change whose going to get lynched, but I still have to find out who is scum so I can be helpful day4 Mementoss is SCUM SCUM SCUM! Noone cares about Mav, so stop wasting your vote and actually put it on someone that might get lynched tonight. There are only 3 candidates: Forumite
Z-Boson
Bill MurrayPut it on one of them, or I´ll scream at vigis to kill you tonight! Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote:
At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics):
Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows?
Z-Boson is highly suspicious.
Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy.
I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh.
##Vote Forumite. Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 04:56 Gravan wrote:
To be a bit more clear:
Bill Murray's posting is very difficult to read, and he claims to have had more knowledge than he really ought to have had. That said, he has apparently been playing mafia for a while so he could also have just made a good read.
Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him. FML You explain how all three candidates are scummy, and then vote the one with the biggest wagon. You are SCUM! too.
This kind of posts only strengthens the need to vote for you, in my mind. Down to the wire, all you are doing is pointing as many fingers as you can, as aggressively as you can (in big red letters, hehe), with the bare minimum amount of evidence or effort. It seems desperate instead of simply defensive.
Why not try to clear your name and answer the accusations about yourself as best you can in an attempt to lift votes off you (no matter how futile, at this late hour)? Hopeless (the first person in the game to point a serious finger at you) has even given you this opportunity on a silver platter. Yet, all you continue to do is dodge and slip around, shouting at other people and being selective in your question answering and case-making.
|
I forgot to mention that you straight-up threatened Mementoss.
|
On September 12 2012 05:53 Gravan wrote:
I forgot to mention that you straight-up threatened Mementoss.
While soft-defending Mav. Something to remember for when you flip, Scum.
|
On September 12 2012 06:03 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2012 05:48 Gravan wrote:
Why not try to clear your name and answer the accusations about yourself as best you can in an attempt to lift votes off you (no matter how futile, at this late hour)? Hopeless (the first person in the game to point a serious finger at you) has even given you this opportunity on a silver platter. Yet, all you continue to do is dodge and slip around, shouting at other people and being selective in your question answering and case-making. You haven´t been reading the thread, have you? There are no concrete evidence against me, and the only accusations are based on meta or low activity. There is no way to respond to that! You and Mementoss need to be shot tonight. Your two votes, one jumping on the wagon and one avoiding the wagon, are the two most incriminating responses to the current lynch, and that´s saying a lot.
When people started pointing fingers at me for lurking and being non-contributive, I made an effort to rectify that. Now, I may not be a model player of the game, but I did try. If you're trying to contribute more, well - shouting for vigilante hits and calling people scum (note: not just pointing out suspicious activity, jumping straight to the conclusion of scum) without a case or a reference to anything other than a single post - that just isn't proper contributing.
As for mementoss wagoning, I am just going to point out that your logic here could be a little flawed. While he is jumping on the bandwagon, he was swapped into the game quite recently and does have a lot of reading to catch up on. Voting is mandatory as you might recall. With that in mind, I am willing to give him this single vote as a grace period - if that excuse keeps coming up, I'll be forced to look at him using it as scum-cover.
You haven't - presumably because you have been trying to sneak under the radar. I will say no more on this matter unless something very convincing comes up.
|
On September 12 2012 06:30 Shady Sands wrote:
FYI--I still think Forumite is scum. However, as he posts more and more like this above, my read on him gets townier and townier. I don't share the opinion that Z-Boson or BM are scum yet, but I do believe they are worth watching.
My main scumreads right now are Gravan and MMToss.
Why? Because both came in at the eleventh hour and wagoned on Forumite late... plus their reads on Z-B or BM were woefully lacking for entering at such a late point in the debate.
IF they want to wagon forumite at this hour, town Gravan and town MMToss would at least put some thought into why they chose him over ZB and BM. But they didn't. That's the biggest scumtell of today--lurkers who try to look active but don't actually "show their work" with regards to their reads.
It's a bit late for a wagon so I will say this: town, please look into vigi-shooting one of these two tonight if Forumite flips green.
Just throwing this out there, but you have posted:
On September 10 2012 04:00 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2012 03:54 austinmcc wrote:B-B-B-BONUS FIND! While reading through Forumite, there's this: On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote:
Hello folks ^^
I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone.
A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker.
Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? Again, Z-BosoN so concerned with watchers. What do watchers see? What counts as visiting? How many watchers are in the game? Why is he so concerned with watchers? Cuz he's doing something that could get watched. And again, leaning assassin now because he's putting that in thread rather than into QT. Hmmm, interesting.
On September 11 2012 08:33 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 07:58 Forumite wrote:On September 11 2012 07:48 imallinson wrote:On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote:
And there goes D3.
Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? Currently you are looking the most scummy. If you do flip town I'd say the best bet for scum would be Z-Boson. You've voted for him but haven't put much of a reason for people to follow you. It´s more than what happened during the Matt lynch, but it´s hard to put down as a case. I´ll see if I find any concrete evidence while rereading. It´s tough because there are a few I´m leaning town on, or at least put down as town for now, but there are soooooo many players that look a bit scummy. I often get really paranoid when things go bad, or even when things go well. First off, sorry for the Hapa misread. I placed too much stock on his XXIII meta and expected similarly brilliant (cheating) play from him. (kidding about the cheating Hapa, I love you man.) Second, Forumite's neck is on the chopping block and all he's done is make weak reads and flip flop everywhere. Look at the above post. It smacks of an attempt to respond while giving excuses for his lack of legit scum-reads. Going through his filter, all I see is WIFOM and a few bad cases; plus his first few posts (before he asked Palmar about Mattchew) look like he was trying to WIFOM watcher/trackers into complete inaction on Mattchew. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. Without further ado, ## Unvote
## Vote Forumite
During this entire day cycle. Which is one more post that myself, up until the last hour or so. While it certainly is true that the bulk of my posting has been right before the vote, you have contributed less than I have. The only claim you have over me is that you stated your position of Forumite earlier, then lurked.
|
I chose forumite over Z-Boson and Bill Murray because I am uncertain about them in general (as you chose to ignore). I also believe (also as you chose to ignore) that Forumite is scum because of the methods he is using as a 'defence', in addition to the reasons (such as flip-floppiness) presented in the strong cases posted here already.
|
On September 13 2012 05:19 Z-BosoN wrote:Guys, I will have to go soon, and won't be able to post through the night. However, I don't want to die tonight, because I'm starting to get some decent scum reads, so I'm actually gonna claim here. I am a Mad Hatter And I absolutely know Toad is scum. His goodbye post, claiming that he is townie in supposedly a "Good-bye" post. His disappearance in day 3. His switch from grush + gravan to me and BM out of nowhere. His reluctance to post in D3. His flimsiness on forumite. His bullshit straight above. I'm not gonna bother making a whole case on this, because there is one thing that makes me go from 80% scum to 100%. I'm not gonna go into details, but if you want you can find it out for yourselves. I did a SHITTON of reading on N1 and N2, reading as carefully as I possibly could, turning on my hidden message finder mode. It is insanely subtle, but fuck yea, I saw it. Anyways, hats off to you wrote it, but what I don't understand is why you didn't go after him, knowing what you knew. When both me and hapa were on his tail after that post, you could have very well given us support... So yea, trust me when I say this, toad is absolutely 100% scum. Anyways, I've always thought him scum ever since that N1 post, and my bomb has always been, and will be tonight as well, on him. Thus, I am at no fear of death, because mafia wouldn't make this 1:1 trade, not in a million years. Of course Toad is going to throw is bullshit at us once again, saying how I'm making this up, how that's impossible because he's townie, etc... but trust me when you say this - he's in fact bullshitting us, he's scum. If you want to confirm it for yourselves, just read the posts in N1/N2 super-carefully, and you'll see what I mean, especially in them nested quotes. To the rest of you little lurking scum shitheads, I'll find you.
An aggressive play.
|
Reasons stacked against me: Lurking, not pursuing cases (after anything I tried to say was shut down hard and not commented on by anyone), my night one post about my suspicions about Matt being an assassin (which is repeatedly brought up as a soft defence) [something Mav also did]:
On September 05 2012 00:41 Maverick32x wrote:
Well, I must of skimmed past the FoS on me from Bill Murray, so I'll weigh in a bit.
The reason I was hesitant to jump on Matt was because 'bad play' doesn't equal Scum play. And our goal is to hunt Scum, not hunt bad players. That being said, lying goes a bit beyond 'bad' and starts to seem more scummy.
@Broodking- I re-read your post like 10 times and I have no idea what point you're trying to make...
On September 04 2012 13:17 Maverick32x wrote:
Hey guys- got a chance to catch up and I have a couple thoughts.
First- Not totally comfortable voting Mattchew at this point.. I understand the potential for lying about the role claim.. and I'm not a big fan of role claiming in general... HOWEVER- I'd like to reiterate BlackMamba's post that said something to the tune of "ITT- Townies arguing with Townies" because I find that people are so quick to blame each other for stupid stuff that we end up wasting the first couple days with literally zero reason for voting someone besides "They drew a picture"....
That being said- I'd like to draw a little bit of attention to the first voter for whom I feel like I can make an actual observation on- Toadesstern.
The reason I want to focus on that is just because of the speed at which he strikes out just makes me wonder why that's beneficial from a town perspective? And I'm just wondering if he just wanted to try to promote chaos right away?? Also- consistently attacking other posters seems to be a trend....
Brief Interjection:
On September 13 2012 23:21 DarthPunk wrote:Gravan - His filter is short and doesn't contain much . He seems to comment on the by play and never actually scum hunts. His Strongest scum reads were - Forumite and Z - Boson Who have both flipped green. His play is scummy and he is lurking but the same could be said for many players in this game. He jumped on the Forumite lynch late. The rational behind his vote seemed to be simple repetition of the case made by others. This seems to be a theme with him. With one exception. Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 09:38 Gravan wrote:First, the straightforward part. It seems to me that Matt is most likely an assassin, or a very careless player. As many have said before me, there is no case for him to do what he did from a town perspective. To me, it seems that if he were mafia or town, we would likely have seen at least some kind of attempt at an explanation - either to strengthen his fellow mafia by giving them 'towncred' as they jump on his bandwagon or to try to convince us we are making a mistake as a town blue. As an assassin, he could just be seeing his end and giving up - this is of course moot if he decides to put in his piece later. Since he is apparently not a random newbie (who is a random newb, anyway ?), and clearly likes to be an active player, it shouts assasinto me. Since it is day 1 and we only have so much information, we essentially have to lynch him anyway (even if we were nearly certain he is an assassin. At this time, I'll be throwing my vote his way. The post where I make my comments on the information currently present (as in, not to do with the matt bandwagon) is coming up later. I just wanted to put down somehing somewhat solid so thanI can start to develop a post hostory, watery as it might be. His assertion that matt was actually an Assassin seems to be his greatest personal input into the game. He was called on it immediately of course, and thus he backs away from any defense of matt at a rate of knots and votes for him anyway. He does actually put effort into a case on BM but it is quickly rebuked by Z -Boson and others and he then get's into a rather protracy.ted defense. Mild OMGUS on Shady and that's about it. Not much to go on. Definitely scummy but nothing concrete. TLDR; Seems to go along with the majority and has put little input into the game aside from Two major exceptions Defending mattchew then backing down and voting for him. A weak case on BM He jumps onto the Forumite mislynch late and gives very weak reasoning. Generally scummy and lurking.
I did not 'back down and vote for him' - my vote was already unofficially on him (as I stated) before I posted my 'soft defence'.
Continuing on:
I am an 'active lurker' (along with Hopeless, Rewok, ShioPi, Shady), I have voted along popular lines (again, something else Hopeless, Rewok did). I have also not been a great contributer (also guilty: Rewok, Mementoss).
So, fine, you say. There are a few other good lynch targets, but we think you are still the best one, you say. This would be okay, I think, if there were some kind of actual case putting me more forward as a guilty candidate than any of the others. There isn't though. Shady and imallinson have been driving my lynch on the basis of my soft defence and Shady's "why not Gravan?" questioning. While I understand that I haven't been that useful, there really is scant evidence against me.
I did post quite a bit about the BKE lynch (something that is being ignored), before kinda dissapearing recently.
Other than Bill Murray (who is essentially posting useless garbage at this point, ranging from how 'confirmed town' he is, to 'what a great spot we are in') and Mementoss (lurking still despite having had time to catch up at this point) there hasn't been any kind of drive to post anyone else. I suspect that, were I not in this game, Grush would be the popular lynch tonight. Because the town is generally sheepy, and, I think, the mafia have gained a heavy influence on the vote. This is just a baseless suspicion, but something I think that the town needs to start to actively try to combat before it is too late.
I guess what I am trying to get at is, there are many other people who are just as lynchable as I am - I just stand out a little bit more because of one post that can be construed as scummy. I think that the only reason the vote is primarily focused on me at the moment is because the bandwagon began earlier on me than it did on anyone else (started by the mafia, I have no doubt) and it is easy to point at my D1 post about Matt, as well as my general lurkiness.
Now, onto Shady:
He says this:
On September 09 2012 13:32 Shady Sands wrote:
Basically, a lurker playing off his meta is a little less pressing a concern than someone who actively goes around and shits up the thread while making themselves unreadable. Why? Scum will never kill them, so they'll end up surviving. As the game draws closer and closer to MYLO/LYLO that player becomes more and more damaging to town. I made that mistake with Chez in Normal Mini III and I'm not making it again here.
Then proceeds to leave Grush and BM alone. He also argued heavily for a lynch against hapa On September 09 2012 19:22 Shady Sands wrote:Anyhow, what does everyone think about Hapa? To recap: Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 13:31 DarthPunk wrote:On September 09 2012 13:17 Hapahauli wrote:On September 09 2012 13:15 Shady Sands wrote:On September 09 2012 12:59 Hapahauli wrote:On September 09 2012 12:53 Shady Sands wrote:On September 09 2012 12:49 Hapahauli wrote:
And as far as I'm concerned Shady, you've posted jack-shit in terms of your reads.
Put-up or shut-up. Right, because nearly starting a counter-wagon to the BKE mislynch on grush57 does not qualify as a read. And in case you're wondering, right you and him are my top scumreads. You made a case on GRush - if you think that's an actual read, you either haven't seen GRush play or you're smoking something that I want real bad right now. Cases and reads are equivalent. If you think they're different, then, you, sir, are the drug addict. So you made a read on Grush. You started a counter-wagon against someone who is traditionally the easiest mislynch in the game - someone who is going to behave just like that regardless of alignment. Yay for reads that matter! Still waiting for an answer to this btw: On September 09 2012 12:52 Hapahauli wrote:On September 09 2012 12:14 Shady Sands wrote:On September 09 2012 12:02 DarthPunk wrote:On September 09 2012 11:50 Shady Sands wrote:On September 09 2012 11:47 Hapahauli wrote:On September 09 2012 11:42 Shady Sands wrote:On September 09 2012 11:17 Hapahauli wrote:I retract my vigi-shot call on Rewok. He mentions the "lynch for blood" stuff earlier in his filter, and I'm willing to chalk it up to bad town. His giant wall-o-text posts giving everyone null-reads actually reads town to me - seems like a genuine attempt to contribute, despite being useless. However, I do think we should look into vigi-shotting ShiaoPi. Shiao is hardcore lurking in comparison to his other games as VT. Absolutely no content in Shaio's filter, and there are a couple of posts that fingerpoint like mad:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=361826¤tpage=47#929
Shaio originally wasn't posting because of "internet concerns." I believed Shiao at the time, but now it's becoming a habit. Why are you calling for a vig shot on Shiao for lurking and no call for a vig shot on me for lurking? I'm fingerpointing too. Do you think you're a better vig shot than Shaio? Do tell. I asked you first, Hapa. Please answer Yeah Hapa. Stop answering questions with questions. You have been extremely selective with your scum reads this game. I would also like to know why shaio over shady. Also how could you see Ottox as not scummy and BKE with a plausible watcher claim guaranteed scum. I am going to take a close look at your filter and XXI. Something is off about you. I agree. Hapa's usually a pretty good scumhunter. His posts on Ottox in particular are just strange; almost inviting a vigi hit on Ottox but backing away enough to give himself plausible deniability. Town Hapa (in Newbie Mini XXIII) didn't play like this. Oh haha I missed this - weren't you ranting for pages about me cheating in that game and getting lucky? Sounds like someone twisting meta to their own advantage. So you felt that Ottox was town despite the fact he was scummy as shit. And you think Grush is town Despite looking scummy as shit. But you were 100% positive on BKE and tunnelled him all of day 2 without changing your read or your case because he 'flip-flopped' on Matt. DESPITE HIS CLAIM and with several of us making counter arguments? Based on Flip flopping on Matt. On September 04 2012 17:08 DarthPunk wrote:
On September 04 2012 16:21 Z-BosoN wrote:
All right, regarding the BC/Mattchew situation:
First of all, this post is wrong:
You are right, his fakeclaim doesn't prove he is mafia on its own. However, HIM ASKING FOR CLAIMS DOES. Why would a townie fakeclaim and attempt to get all blues to claim ? No townie day 1 should ever be this fuckign stupid. Even if he gets caught as mafia (as I have caught him) had anyone or if anyone proceeds to claim and a bunch of retard blues out themselves mafia is instantly ahead.
IIRC, he asked for people with the same role - noisy neighbor - to claim, not blues.
BC is making this main assumption:
No miller/neighbor is self aware in any game ever except odd pyp/ptp like setups as it defeats the purpose of the role. This game holds true to the same rule as normal games for the mechanic.
To put it simply, this is the main argument going on: how can he know he is a noisy neighbor if they are unaware?. Am I correct?
You have made it clear that you are 100% sure that this game does not include self-aware millers.
As a normal person, one could not make this assumption, as it would be statistical. Say 90% of games don't include self-aware millers. I have read the OP, and nowhere does it say that millers aren't self-aware, so you must have other reasons to know this, because no matter what, you say it is not an assumption.
The fact that you keep insisting would be ridiculous if you weren't indeed 100% certain, because, like sloosh said, you would most likely be lynched if he showed up town, making it a double town loss.
Did I get anything wrong here?
If not, ##Vote Mattchew
So you rail against all the reasoning behind the mattchew vote, say that there is zero evidence that he is lying and that it is based purely on conjecture, and then vote for him without adding anything to the case against him? Then you vote for him, completely contradicting the fact that you clearly state it is based on an assumption? o_0 I posted this on day one. You ignored it. Z - boson was similarly guilty. If you thought BKE was scum based on his interactions around Matt then you should have found Z - Boson suspicious also. And yet you don't mention him at all UNTIL Austin brings him up. On September 09 2012 05:38 Hapahauli wrote:
@ austinmcc
Okay admittedly I'm a bit biased because of my meta-read, and I sat down to take a look at your case again.
The one thing I want some answers from Z-Boson is his ##Vote post:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=361826¤tpage=21#413
I just don't understand what he's saying here. It's as if he criticizes the reasoning for voting Mattchew, then turns around and votes Mattchew. You repeat what I posted day one and what Austin had been saying. It is suspicious as hell and yet you continue to tunnel BKE. And state that Z - Boson is town. You are being very selective on who you believe is scum/town and it is based on no shared thought processes from what I can see. This + Hapa flipflopping on Ottox, while remaining adamant about BKE based on the same reasoning that led him to flip-flop on Ottox himself. If Palmar has put a vet in the scumteam, Hapa looks like the biggest candidate.
He attributes his low posting time to being busy:
On September 09 2012 19:26 Shady Sands wrote:
On September 09 2012 19:22 Kreb wrote:
On September 09 2012 18:40 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2012 18:11 Kreb wrote:On September 09 2012 15:10 Bill Murray wrote:On September 09 2012 07:09 slOosh wrote:
I don't even.
So Scum decided 1KP on BC was a good idea? ...
GK probably bombed ... so ...
Gah I'm just gonna wait till tomorrow NK to figure it out. By then vigs should have used their second bullet and should claim.
Gonna go cool off first. Notice the capitalization of scum, and him seeming to have too much knowledge. Couple that with IIoA and I'm a little suspicious. I didnt get this at least. From that post you make out that he seems to know too much. How? To me he is just speculating, which might not be worthy of a post to begin with but doesnt seem scummy to me. Kreb, BM is just trolling. Can you look at the DP/me/Hapa exchange in the past few pages and give us your thoughts?
Well, I didnt ask him about the "lulz gay" post (troll post). I asked him about him finding someone suspicious, which doesnt seem like trolling to me.
Anyway. Hapa apparently was a pretty big part in the mislynch against BKE, and then afterwards comes out strong with vig call on ShiaoPi. My first feeling is it would be pretty ballsy for a mafia to that (which is obviously a good reason to do it as mafia yea yea I get that). But continuing down the discussion I do think he seems quite (emotianlly?) invested in his scumhunting and his frustration is relevant for someone who is feeling he is being questioned more than he might deserve.
Apart from that, a lot of your argument seems to be based on meta. His read on Shiao, your read on him not questioning you for your supposed off-what-you-normally-do-meta. I cant really comment on much of that since I dont have any meta reads at all on any of you.
In addition I do like and agree with your reasonign on Grush. Giving him "free pass" is a bad idea to me because of what the situation might turn into should we get closer to mylo/lylo with him still in it. If we're gonna have to do a 75/25 guess on him at some point anyway we might as well do it earlier since it gives us an extra cycle to discuss whatever target we might go on should we give Grush a pass. A lot of this is apparently about meta too, but people seem to agree his play is always trollish/anti-townish so I'll go with that for now.
And since we're talking meta anyway, whats the reason for your meta to be so off from your normal? I did see you mentioning a being busy at work in an earlier post, but not sure if thats the whole reason..
Emotional involvement is a null tell. Scum get angry just as much as town (thank you Blazinghand). My read on Hapa basically boils down to two things:
1) Hapa is playing off his meta while ignoring my shift on meta.
2) Hapa is being very selective/arbitrary in his scumhunting, and so far has led us to mislynch someone. Note that neither part of #2 is scummy on its own, but when taken together, are a clear scumtell.
As for my own quietness, I honestly was busy. Will still be busy tomorrow and the next few days.
On September 13 2012 20:40 Shady Sands wrote:
Back in thread. My activity level in this game has been slower because of IRL commitments (my day job involves finding investment projects for rich Chinese families, so they can get US green cards)--playing mafia actually takes a lot of careful reading... writing blogs is (comparatively) something I can do in my spare time.
Yet has been previously active and still updates his blog.
He started this bandwagon on me based on nothing, except forumite's green flip (something mafia would have known about beforehand).
On September 12 2012 06:30 Shady Sands wrote:
FYI--I still think Forumite is scum. However, as he posts more and more like this above, my read on him gets townier and townier. I don't share the opinion that Z-Boson or BM are scum yet, but I do believe they are worth watching.
My main scumreads right now are Gravan and MMToss.
Why? Because both came in at the eleventh hour and wagoned on Forumite late... plus their reads on Z-B or BM were woefully lacking for entering at such a late point in the debate.
IF they want to wagon forumite at this hour, town Gravan and town MMToss would at least put some thought into why they chose him over ZB and BM. But they didn't. That's the biggest scumtell of today--lurkers who try to look active but don't actually "show their work" with regards to their reads.
It's a bit late for a wagon so I will say this: town, please look into vigi-shooting one of these two tonight if Forumite flips green.
Calls out for a vig hit with no further evidence:
On September 12 2012 07:03 Shady Sands wrote:
Vig please hit Gravan or MMToss.
Going to flip a coin right now between them... and
## Vote Gravan
Will check in once night is over.
Then trys to keep the votes on me with deflective posts like:
On September 13 2012 22:20 Shady Sands wrote:
On September 13 2012 21:26 Bill Murray wrote:
Also, Mementoss is where my vote is going to go. DYH was my first suspect, and Mementoss, since coming into the game, has a WHOPPING 3 POSTS. One says "hi", the 2nd is griefing/disruptive, and the 3rd is an excuse.
Why not gravan?
On September 13 2012 23:18 Shady Sands wrote:
On September 13 2012 22:58 DarthPunk wrote:
On September 13 2012 22:36 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 22:31 Bill Murray wrote:
Why not respond to any of my points?
the guy has 3 posts since he replaced in days upon days ago, one of them is one word, and the most recent is an excuse to be lurking. Why not Gravan is my question. I have a scumread on MMToss too, but he can wait until tomorrow. Why not Gravan is my question today.
Why not MMToss? I am going to read both of their (short) filters again and see what I come up with. Toad. It seems as if you have a town read on BM now? The interplay between you both is going way over my head.
Gravan's actively lurking; MMToss is completely lurking. Active lurking > completely lurking as a scumread in my book; also active lurking has more potential to disrupt town scumhunt than completely lurking.
Also note that he also fits his own description of "active lurker".
As a final aside, imallinson is critical of Mav's scumreads being based on lurkers, and is now voting on me on that very basis.
[B]On September 12 2012 21:12 imallinson wrote: Show nested quote +[B]On September 12 2012 07:50 Maverick32x wrote:
Okay.
Just read through the latest lynch... I was planning on dropping my notes but it just would look cluttered so I'm going to settle with the people that I'm REALLY sure are mafia and give my explanation for it. I am ranking them in the order of my confidence in my read.
My top 3 are tied for number 1 reads.
ShiaoPi - Scummy. Really scummy. DISAPPEARS when the vote comes. <- this is copied straight out of my notes that I was taking.... Honestly.. just read through his filter/posts!! There is no way this guy is town. 0. No chance. I think he voted Z-Boson because he knew it would be a throw-away vote.
Shady Sands- just scummy. Hard defends Shiao. Argues with Hapa (town). DISAPPEARS when the vote comes. <- So similar to the play style of ShiaoPi and there seems to be some really slight buddying occurring. He continues to live in "Matthchew" land and never seems to snap into the current thread which kind of shows me a lack of understanding. His most recent attack on Gravan to be honest is just an attempt to push an early vote while scum is being successful.
Rewok- side steps responsibility constantly. He has ONE PAGE OF FILTER. (@!#*(@!* So either awful town, or scum.
DoYouHas Mementoss- Totally uninvolved. Voted me besides it having zero impact on the game.
Scummy. His ONE saving grace is that he repped DoYouHas... the only problem with that is DoYouHas was kind of scummy.... and Mementoss is doing just about nothing to save that... Also Shady's 'coin flip' indicates that one of his options is scum... and its Mementoss.
Toadesstern- Random poker talk? Discusses roles bit. Rustles up the forumite case based off a different game. Makes an interesting accusation that either Grush OR sandy is scum… makes me think Grush is likely town and Shadey is scum based on my reads above. Defends Shady shortly after that "Or" post and soft attacks him same post indicating some sort of ambivalence about being too closely connected. DISAPPEARS when its voting time, even though he kind of was a major advocate of the Forumite lynch at the start.....
slosh- posts late. Softly attacks forumite. References past games a lot. Afks most of the game when discussions are getting active. Gets active on Forumite then gone. He references that scum's plan is likely to lay low.. which is exactly what he is doing.
So there you have it. It will take a miracle from God to get me to vote anyone but those top 3. The bottom 3 have some leverage to work with, but not much. Does anyone else find this post really off. His 'top 3 scum reads' is just a list of lurkers there isn't anything substantive to go on. By now there should be more to build a case on than 'disappearing around the vote'.
As OMGUS-y as it is, I have a mafia read on Shady. He posted nothing (and didn't even vote) D1, has been a bandwagon starter since, and has done relatively little to contribute other than to keep votes sticking onto the popular voting target.
|
On September 14 2012 05:22 Shady Sands wrote:Gravan's above post is anti-town defensive play at its scummy worst. In addition to my prior charges against him, now I can say he's lying as well: First off, he says I'm actively lurking. I'm not. Actively lurking would be posting heavily and having a 10 or 15 page filter without substance. I'm simply lurking. I even say it myself that my activity level is low. Second, he says I started a bandwagon on him based on Forumite's green flip. That's an oversimplification. I started the wagon on Gravan because he piled onto Forumite when the case on Forumite was all but assured, using other people's analysis as his own reasoning, in an attempt to look contributory. The fact that Forumite flipped green is just icing on the cake. Grav's trying to twist the truth here; don't fall for it. Third, the vig hit was called out because of my case on Gravan before the Day post came around. Gravan even quotes it in his post. Show nested quote +It's a bit late for a wagon so I will say this: town, please look into vigi-shooting one of these two tonight if Forumite flips green. Again, don't fall for Grav's lies. I already called for a vig hit there with evidence, so why should I clutter up the thread and repeat what I wrote? Fourth, of course I'm going to keep the heat on Gravan: he is the scummiest read I have, so shouldn't I be trying to get my top scumread lynched? -- Now, onto his defense: Grav posts a lot about how he shares a ton of characteristics with many other people. This is a non-defense. How does sharing a bunch of scummy characteristics with other people make you less likely to be a scum? Then says that people who are voting for him specifically are voting because: Show nested quote +I think that the only reason the vote is primarily focused on me at the moment is because the bandwagon began earlier on me than it did on anyone else (started by the mafia, I have no doubt) and it is easy to point at my D1 post about Matt, as well as my general lurkiness. Hang on a second: Grav wasn't the first wagon: the wagon on MMToss started at the same time as his did. (Another lie.) Second, the other reasons are all great reasons to vote for Grav specifically: The D1 post about Matt--soft defense of someone that was later a scum caught trying to fakeclaim. The active lurkiness--both of those reasons, if you believe them, should put Grav at the top of your list of scum reads. And to those reasons which he himself admits to, we can also add the reason of lying. Lynch Grav, the actively lurking, OMGUS-ing, lying, soft-defending, scum.
I am lying because you've interpreted what "actively lurking" means differently than I have? That is a difference in semantics, not lying.
You keep mentioning my "lies", and how there is this apparently strong evidence towards me being scummy, but you really are not making a case.
You're just pointing the finger at me, picking apart what I say, and calling it scummy.
Toad then pops in, mindlessly agrees, and continues talking on to talk about a different lynch topic.
On September 14 2012 05:36 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 05:27 Shady Sands wrote:On September 14 2012 04:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 14 2012 04:25 Mementoss wrote:
I have two questions about the night:
Why is sloosh and toad still alive day 4?
Why was MKFuba killed? Are you reading the game? Or did you just forget that we had someone claim having a bomb on me? They shot Z-Boson, the guy who claimed Mad hatter who placed a bomb on me to get a free kill (hinthint: I was supposed to be the free kill). Why should they shoot the guy who is supposed to be a free kill on top of having the bomb do the job? Unless of course they didn't believe the claim, which can't be because if that's the case they could have just shot me without having to shoot Z-Boson. Furthermore the kills seemed to be rashly rearranged to fit the changed situation with Z-Boson claiming. I really don't get what you're asking here. Also this is nothing special. I'm awesome at playing mafia yet I'm only an average town-player. Mafia left me alive in *whatever the name was* although I was a modconfirmed town mason in that game. But again, a lot of people are paranoid about me, even if I end up being innocent-child-like confirmed. Not saying it's that strong this game but you've got to be really paranoid to consider me a mafia after what happened yesterday. I usually get shot either n1 or survive until lylo. Pretty much nothing inbetween exists in the history of Toad-games so far. You should put your paranoia somewhere else. Maybe something good will come out of it if you target someone else. Toad, look at Grav and tell me how you don't see a scum. I very much think he's scum. I like my vote on Mementoss better for the moment though. If only for the reason that I no longer want to lynch Mementoss first.
Does nobody else see something wrong here?
|
On September 14 2012 06:41 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 06:23 Gravan wrote:On September 14 2012 05:22 Shady Sands wrote:Gravan's above post is anti-town defensive play at its scummy worst. In addition to my prior charges against him, now I can say he's lying as well: First off, he says I'm actively lurking. I'm not. Actively lurking would be posting heavily and having a 10 or 15 page filter without substance. I'm simply lurking. I even say it myself that my activity level is low. Second, he says I started a bandwagon on him based on Forumite's green flip. That's an oversimplification. I started the wagon on Gravan because he piled onto Forumite when the case on Forumite was all but assured, using other people's analysis as his own reasoning, in an attempt to look contributory. The fact that Forumite flipped green is just icing on the cake. Grav's trying to twist the truth here; don't fall for it. Third, the vig hit was called out because of my case on Gravan before the Day post came around. Gravan even quotes it in his post. It's a bit late for a wagon so I will say this: town, please look into vigi-shooting one of these two tonight if Forumite flips green. Vig please hit Gravan or MMToss. Again, don't fall for Grav's lies. I already called for a vig hit there with evidence, so why should I clutter up the thread and repeat what I wrote? Fourth, of course I'm going to keep the heat on Gravan: he is the scummiest read I have, so shouldn't I be trying to get my top scumread lynched? -- Now, onto his defense: Grav posts a lot about how he shares a ton of characteristics with many other people. This is a non-defense. How does sharing a bunch of scummy characteristics with other people make you less likely to be a scum? Then says that people who are voting for him specifically are voting because: I think that the only reason the vote is primarily focused on me at the moment is because the bandwagon began earlier on me than it did on anyone else (started by the mafia, I have no doubt) and it is easy to point at my D1 post about Matt, as well as my general lurkiness. Hang on a second: Grav wasn't the first wagon: the wagon on MMToss started at the same time as his did. (Another lie.) Second, the other reasons are all great reasons to vote for Grav specifically: The D1 post about Matt--soft defense of someone that was later a scum caught trying to fakeclaim. The active lurkiness--both of those reasons, if you believe them, should put Grav at the top of your list of scum reads. Also: On September 14 2012 07:03 Mementoss wrote:On September 14 2012 06:41 slOosh wrote:On September 14 2012 06:23 Gravan wrote:On September 14 2012 05:22 Shady Sands wrote:Gravan's above post is anti-town defensive play at its scummy worst. In addition to my prior charges against him, now I can say he's lying as well: First off, he says I'm actively lurking. I'm not. Actively lurking would be posting heavily and having a 10 or 15 page filter without substance. I'm simply lurking. I even say it myself that my activity level is low. Second, he says I started a bandwagon on him based on Forumite's green flip. That's an oversimplification. I started the wagon on Gravan because he piled onto Forumite when the case on Forumite was all but assured, using other people's analysis as his own reasoning, in an attempt to look contributory. The fact that Forumite flipped green is just icing on the cake. Grav's trying to twist the truth here; don't fall for it. Third, the vig hit was called out because of my case on Gravan before the Day post came around. Gravan even quotes it in his post. It's a bit late for a wagon so I will say this: town, please look into vigi-shooting one of these two tonight if Forumite flips green. Vig please hit Gravan or MMToss. Again, don't fall for Grav's lies. I already called for a vig hit there with evidence, so why should I clutter up the thread and repeat what I wrote? Fourth, of course I'm going to keep the heat on Gravan: he is the scummiest read I have, so shouldn't I be trying to get my top scumread lynched? -- Now, onto his defense: Grav posts a lot about how he shares a ton of characteristics with many other people. This is a non-defense. How does sharing a bunch of scummy characteristics with other people make you less likely to be a scum? Then says that people who are voting for him specifically are voting because: I think that the only reason the vote is primarily focused on me at the moment is because the bandwagon began earlier on me than it did on anyone else (started by the mafia, I have no doubt) and it is easy to point at my D1 post about Matt, as well as my general lurkiness. Hang on a second: Grav wasn't the first wagon: the wagon on MMToss started at the same time as his did. (Another lie.) Second, the other reasons are all great reasons to vote for Grav specifically: The D1 post about Matt--soft defense of someone that was later a scum caught trying to fakeclaim. The active lurkiness--both of those reasons, if you believe them, should put Grav at the top of your list of scum reads. And to those reasons which he himself admits to, we can also add the reason of lying. Lynch Grav, the actively lurking, OMGUS-ing, lying, soft-defending, scum. I am lying because you've interpreted what "actively lurking" means differently than I have? That is a difference in semantics, not lying. You keep mentioning my "lies", and how there is this apparently strong evidence towards me being scummy, but you really are not making a case.You're just pointing the finger at me, picking apart what I say, and calling it scummy. Toad then pops in, mindlessly agrees, and continues talking on to talk about a different lynch topic. On September 14 2012 05:36 Toadesstern wrote:On September 14 2012 05:27 Shady Sands wrote:On September 14 2012 04:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 14 2012 04:25 Mementoss wrote:
I have two questions about the night:
Why is sloosh and toad still alive day 4?
Why was MKFuba killed? Are you reading the game? Or did you just forget that we had someone claim having a bomb on me? They shot Z-Boson, the guy who claimed Mad hatter who placed a bomb on me to get a free kill (hinthint: I was supposed to be the free kill). Why should they shoot the guy who is supposed to be a free kill on top of having the bomb do the job? Unless of course they didn't believe the claim, which can't be because if that's the case they could have just shot me without having to shoot Z-Boson. Furthermore the kills seemed to be rashly rearranged to fit the changed situation with Z-Boson claiming. I really don't get what you're asking here. Also this is nothing special. I'm awesome at playing mafia yet I'm only an average town-player. Mafia left me alive in *whatever the name was* although I was a modconfirmed town mason in that game. But again, a lot of people are paranoid about me, even if I end up being innocent-child-like confirmed. Not saying it's that strong this game but you've got to be really paranoid to consider me a mafia after what happened yesterday. I usually get shot either n1 or survive until lylo. Pretty much nothing inbetween exists in the history of Toad-games so far. You should put your paranoia somewhere else. Maybe something good will come out of it if you target someone else. Toad, look at Grav and tell me how you don't see a scum. I very much think he's scum. I like my vote on Mementoss better for the moment though. If only for the reason that I no longer want to lynch Mementoss first. Does nobody else see something wrong here? Stop playing coy. Out with it. Are you calling Toad scum? Gravan conviently dissapears. lol Really? I have been gone, what, a few hours? And to those reasons which he himself admits to, we can also add the reason of lying. Lynch Grav, the actively lurking, OMGUS-ing, lying, soft-defending, scum. I am lying because you've interpreted what "actively lurking" means differently than I have? That is a difference in semantics, not lying. You keep mentioning my "lies", and how there is this apparently strong evidence towards me being scummy, but you really are not making a case.You're just pointing the finger at me, picking apart what I say, and calling it scummy. Toad then pops in, mindlessly agrees, and continues talking on to talk about a different lynch topic. On September 14 2012 05:36 Toadesstern wrote:On September 14 2012 05:27 Shady Sands wrote:On September 14 2012 04:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 14 2012 04:25 Mementoss wrote:
I have two questions about the night:
Why is sloosh and toad still alive day 4?
Why was MKFuba killed? Are you reading the game? Or did you just forget that we had someone claim having a bomb on me? They shot Z-Boson, the guy who claimed Mad hatter who placed a bomb on me to get a free kill (hinthint: I was supposed to be the free kill). Why should they shoot the guy who is supposed to be a free kill on top of having the bomb do the job? Unless of course they didn't believe the claim, which can't be because if that's the case they could have just shot me without having to shoot Z-Boson. Furthermore the kills seemed to be rashly rearranged to fit the changed situation with Z-Boson claiming. I really don't get what you're asking here. Also this is nothing special. I'm awesome at playing mafia yet I'm only an average town-player. Mafia left me alive in *whatever the name was* although I was a modconfirmed town mason in that game. But again, a lot of people are paranoid about me, even if I end up being innocent-child-like confirmed. Not saying it's that strong this game but you've got to be really paranoid to consider me a mafia after what happened yesterday. I usually get shot either n1 or survive until lylo. Pretty much nothing inbetween exists in the history of Toad-games so far. You should put your paranoia somewhere else. Maybe something good will come out of it if you target someone else. Toad, look at Grav and tell me how you don't see a scum. I very much think he's scum. I like my vote on Mementoss better for the moment though. If only for the reason that I no longer want to lynch Mementoss first. Does nobody else see something wrong here? Stop playing coy. Out with it. Are you calling Toad scum?
I am trying to incite some discussion on the topic. I am still reading through toad's filter and I find it very difficult to get a read on him. He spends a lot of time arguing meta and boasting about how great he is at mafia, but he also appears to contribute.
Really, I just want to point out that, if you guys do lynch me, when I flip green, to take a good hard look at Toad's interactions with Shady - something I am currently doing.
|
Hey, Toad - mind posting your reads? Backed up with some content? You've been posting actively, but I haven't noticed much in the way of actual scumhunting today - just agreeing, and generally being happy with any of the lynches going on.
|
This is ridiculous. Nobody else is being looked at except for Maverick and I. The case against me is, quite frankly, weak - it is based on a poor day one post and a low-activity level. My activity level when I actually had time (the BKE lynch) was quite a bit higher - this is completely ignored.
By the logic presented here, we should be lynching Rewok before me (has contributed less, similar shifty day one posts). Or, at the very least, if the lynch is SET on me, other targets should be considered for the same reasons. Why is there a shift to pseudo-policy lynching on day four?
In the last few pages, Shady Sands has contributed nothing. He repeadedly says "Why not Gravan" as if there is no burden of proof on the accuser. This isn't a proper lynch; this is a scum driven lynch hunt, or a very confused and sheepy town mindlessly following Shady.
His attempts at keeping the lynch on me are absolutley baseless - he is abusing the fact that this town likes to sheep.
Point #1:
On September 14 2012 20:09 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 12:14 slOosh wrote:
Guhh ... why do you guys wait until now to play properly?
What Maverick did just now was a very very town thing. Feigning activity and making cases is easy. Calling the runner up lynch candidate town when you have the most votes is not. The only motivation to do that is that you are town, and you think this person is town. You can see that he doesn't value his specific survival over the town's interests. His case really shows his thinking process and also clarifies past contradictions (e.g. he left out Graven from his scum reads) - consistency like this is hard to setup as scum.
Gravan ... it's really weird with him. As Maverick points out he is playing consistently (regardless of quality). I remember thinking he was newbie town making lots of mistakes, and it could be he is scummy because of this. Also strange is the nature of the maverick counter wagon. Still thinking this one through.
ShiaoPi: his treatment of Mav is townish. Timezones are timezones. Select stuff in his filter make me think he is town and explain his actions but will not divulge unless there is a large enough body of evidence against him.
This leaves me with two people:
SnB has not cared at all about the past two lynches. You can see from his filter that he jumps on the Forumite lynch with little to contribute while also discrediting Rewok. He jumps on the maverick lynch with little to add and also makes sure people know that everyone could be scum ("MMT made the case on Mav but you never know maybe he is scum"). His latest posts are pure setup speculation. He treats Toad very strangely - I'm not sure if he thinks Toad might be scum and hunting for reactions or he is pretending to engage in meaningful conversation.
Toad is someone who has flared up upon a proper reread of the Z-Boson mad hatter business. I originally thought him town after our little spat at the start of the game. However if you reread his filter carefully, you will notice that he uses "vet balance" to get Forumite lynched, but after that he says "oh I guess I was wrong, oh well". He seemed to taunt Z-boson near deadline and called for vig shots on him even if he was town because he would die anyway. I know I said mafia wouldn't kill a potential mad hatter but I forgot that there is a very good chance of a roleblocker in the game, as we still don't know about austin's 2nd shot. I find the explanations for his dismissal of SnB and BM to be beyond just strange, as he is ignoring possible scum on raw setup speculation.
Thoughts please, we need to get this lynch right. Sloosh, I don't get your read on Gravan. Why is your view shifting to town? Also, why are you making town less focused and urging town to examine different candidates with less than 24 hours to go in the votecycle? Are you deliberately trying to spread the votes out so you and your scumbuddies can wagon better?
Tries to close alternate lynching discussion.
Point #2:
On September 14 2012 20:16 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 20:13 Bill Murray wrote:
As for ACTIVE players, I'd like to lynch Kreb. He flip flopped saying I'm town, then went to wanting to lynch me and grush... over our PLAYSTYLE? Seems like scum pushing policy as opposed to having any semblance of logic. He also wants to lynch Gravan, who, while I suspected early is still primarily a policy lynch... but days after it should have occurred, if it was going to. It just seems like he's sheeping the reads he picks up on in the thread on townies/Power Roles.
in Kreb's scumhunting case, you don't see him focus on 1 candidate as a town role would, but rather highlight players black like scum would, as per hunting assassins. He does put players like myself and Gravan in red.
Another point is his interaction with Austin. He was getting information off Austin in response to his read on me (which he flipflopped on in 10 minutes? get real), and Toad. It just feels really fishy. Sometimes, words fall short.
Would love to lynch Kreb
BM, I'm not sure why you're so certain that Grav is a policy lynch. As I've said before, he lies, he actively lurks, he sheeped a mislynch with super-poor reasoning--what else do you want? Furthermore, even if your view is that Kreb is scum, let Kreb wait until tomorrow. Today is for Grav, and we lynch the bastard.
I have not lied anywhere. Once again, the evidence for this is simply lacking - he is trying to make a case with a goal in mind, not make a case based on strong evidence.
Point #3:
On September 14 2012 21:49 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 21:46 Toadesstern wrote:
I read it and he's right you are.
I doubt you'd be rolefishing so openly as mafia though.
Obviously a mafia would want to know whether the townie (assuming you are mafia and BM is town) is right or just found some bullshit to figure out if a kill is on *supposed to be blue* is needed or good. I'd say a mafia is going to read the filter or tell his buddies about it so that they read it (because people are lazy).
Townies sadly end up rolefishing quite a lot in games because they think that will somehow improve their reads on someone or they think that everything somehow makes sense once you figured that out.
So I'm not giving to much into you rolefishing although you are. Toad, how am I rolefishing? I've been pushing a Grav wagon for 20+ hours now, and BM said we shouldn't lynch Grav because he is blue. I went in and asked why he thought Grav was blue, because if BM doesn't give me any reasons why he thinks Grav is blue AKA not scum, then how can I persuade BM that Grav is scum?
He role fishes, then hurriedly tries to hide it by repeating, over and over again, his question at Bill Murray.
Seriously guys, this is straight-up silly.
|
My best guess is that the scum Shady is suicidally trying to get me lynched (reading his posts, he is absolutely hell-bent and immovable on lynching me) so that mafia can gently bus him tomorrow. This way they'll be able to blend in by casting suspicions on him and a day will be wasted.
|
On September 15 2012 01:36 imallinson wrote:
@Gravan
Why do you keep insisting that the case against you is only based on day 1 and lurking when that isn't true. Also Shady isn't the only one to make a case against you.
Then what is it? Really? What are the strong points out there?
|
On September 15 2012 01:54 imallinson wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2012 01:51 Gravan wrote:On September 15 2012 01:36 imallinson wrote:
@Gravan
Why do you keep insisting that the case against you is only based on day 1 and lurking when that isn't true. Also Shady isn't the only one to make a case against you. Then what is it? Really? What are the strong points out there? Well I'd like to know about this. + Show Spoiler +On September 13 2012 03:04 imallinson wrote:I was really suspicious of him night 1, he was one of my top scum reads due then. I kind of forgot about him after that because he started actually contributing a bit and the BKE case was much stronger. The way he dealt with the day 3 voting has made me suspicious of him again. Before the start of day 3 he says how much he dislikes the meta arguments + Show Spoiler +On September 10 2012 03:52 Gravan wrote:
There is a lot of "in this game x player played like this" or, "y is a veteran, therefore the following is probable...". While I think these are fine as supporting arguments (since past tendencies/experience are relevant things to consider) I feel like all this talk of veterans and meta play is clouding and overtaking what people have actually said and how people have actually been playing. . The first thing we get day 3 is this + Show Spoiler +On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote:
At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics):
Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows?
Z-Boson is highly suspicious.
Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy.
I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh.
##Vote Forumite. On September 12 2012 04:56 Gravan wrote:
To be a bit more clear:
Bill Murray's posting is very difficult to read, and he claims to have had more knowledge than he really ought to have had. That said, he has apparently been playing mafia for a while so he could also have just made a good read.
Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him. which seems to be the opposite of what he said in the previous post. If you look at what BM, Z-Boson and Forumite actually posted this game BM is by far the most scummy looking. It's only if you look at the meta argument that this changes. Yet Gravan votes for Forumite anyway. I look at that and see someone who tried to look like they were contributing in the first post then trying to hide and sheep the popular vote in the second which seems awfully scummy. Why were you so against meta lynches before day 3 but happy to lynch forumite based on toad's meta argument?
On September 15 2012 01:54 imallinson wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2012 01:51 Gravan wrote:On September 15 2012 01:36 imallinson wrote:
@Gravan
Why do you keep insisting that the case against you is only based on day 1 and lurking when that isn't true. Also Shady isn't the only one to make a case against you. Then what is it? Really? What are the strong points out there? Well I'd like to know about this. + Show Spoiler +On September 13 2012 03:04 imallinson wrote:I was really suspicious of him night 1, he was one of my top scum reads due then. I kind of forgot about him after that because he started actually contributing a bit and the BKE case was much stronger. The way he dealt with the day 3 voting has made me suspicious of him again. Before the start of day 3 he says how much he dislikes the meta arguments + Show Spoiler +On September 10 2012 03:52 Gravan wrote:
There is a lot of "in this game x player played like this" or, "y is a veteran, therefore the following is probable...". While I think these are fine as supporting arguments (since past tendencies/experience are relevant things to consider) I feel like all this talk of veterans and meta play is clouding and overtaking what people have actually said and how people have actually been playing. . The first thing we get day 3 is this + Show Spoiler +On September 12 2012 04:54 Gravan wrote:
At this point, my viewpoint is as follows (on the big topics):
Bill Murray is still suspicious, but, really, who the fuck knows?
Z-Boson is highly suspicious.
Forumite is highly suspicious, and very shifty. For somebody who is posting somewhat regularily, he hasn't done too much to defend himself other than point as many fingers as he can as quickly as he can - something that seems really scummy.
I wish we had another day to talk about this, heh.
##Vote Forumite. On September 12 2012 04:56 Gravan wrote:
To be a bit more clear:
Bill Murray's posting is very difficult to read, and he claims to have had more knowledge than he really ought to have had. That said, he has apparently been playing mafia for a while so he could also have just made a good read.
Z-Boson is far too defensive for my liking - it seems like he thinks that every post that isn't in agreement with him, or that pulls the discussion away from his posts, is targeted at him. which seems to be the opposite of what he said in the previous post. If you look at what BM, Z-Boson and Forumite actually posted this game BM is by far the most scummy looking. It's only if you look at the meta argument that this changes. Yet Gravan votes for Forumite anyway. I look at that and see someone who tried to look like they were contributing in the first post then trying to hide and sheep the popular vote in the second which seems awfully scummy. Why were you so against meta lynches before day 3 but happy to lynch forumite based on toad's meta argument?
Well, I don't like meta lynches alone. They are great as a supporting arguments (a position I have stated before). What really sold me on Forumite, though, was the way he defended himself. I am all for pointing fingers (aka building cases) when you are on the chopping block - but he took it to an extreme I considered scummy.
He used giant red text, and apparently thought half the thread was scum. His reads changed as people shut down his old ones. I thought he was trying to waste as much time as possible before dying - I thought he was trying to go out with a bang.
What finally did it for me (combined with the meta argument) is when Hopeless asked:
On September 11 2012 23:56 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 23:16 Forumite wrote:
I dislike most of the case (Z-boson's case on BM), especially him calling BM out for lying, often a "lie" is the player simply forgetting something instead of scum-motivated. What I do agree with is that it´s very bad of BM to have been gone during the BKE lynch. My opinion of BM is that he doesn´t try to help. We want him to be a town leader and all he does is short posts, cryptic or irrelevant passages, FoS on me, taking back FoS on me, saying he actually always suspected me, back and forth.
The old cases on me during N1 were weak, and both BM and Toades said so, so I didn´t do much about them except resolving to get more active, and yet it´s those same reasons that are used to get me lynched today. =/ - You want BILL MURRAY to be the leader? The voice of reason, a beacon for us to rally around? Are you kidding me? - Where is this so called activity? Why is it that my posts are never responded to? Am I lurking to hard? For the last time: Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 07:24 Forumite wrote:
And there goes D3.
Come on guys, ignore the wagon for a while, where are the other scum? When I flip town, who is your next target? I´ve been away a few hours and the only thing that´s happened is that everyone´s said they want to lynch me. Doesn´t anyone have something else to add? Show nested quote +On September 11 2012 01:09 Hopeless1der wrote:
Forumite, could you perhaps flesh things out a bit more on Z-Boson, besides his interactions regarding Mattchew? Why is he a better lynch than you right now?
Forumite, Why should we lynch Z-Boson?
Why do you want me to die?
Make an effort to explain yourself.For reference, a case on Forumite that is not based on Meta: + Show Spoiler +On September 07 2012 02:43 Hopeless1der wrote:First, my original case on Forumite: + Show Spoiler +On September 04 2012 13:18 Hopeless1der wrote:Supposing we table the nosy-neighbor discussion(which appears to still be going strong), I would like to point out my take on Forumite: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. "We're lynching you anyway" Not cool. First, I disagree with the notion that revealing yourself as a nosy neighbor is scummy. Oh wait, Forumite didn't really say that. He didn't really say much of anything here if you ask me, but back to the point of "lynching you anyways", I don't like the blanket statements from Forumite. Here's another one: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:46 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:42 BlackMamba24 wrote:On September 04 2012 09:27 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:07 BlackMamba24 wrote:
I mean that blues should do what they feel is best with their own judgment and ignore any direction from the "town" Sorry, I should have been more specific. I wondered about this phrase: On September 04 2012 07:55 BlackMamba24 wrote:
Never lynch someone just because they wouldn't claim to the town leader or whatever, that's asinine, asiten, asieleven, asitwelve, etc. What is there to explain? There's a difference between lynching someone for not backing themselves up after they're caught lying or whatever and lynching someone because they don't trust the town circle. It sounded weird. It´s common for the voteleader to be lynched unless he claims (convincingly). As an aside, "It sounded weird" is not a phrase I like to see. Immediately makes me suspicious. Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 09:55 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:43 Mattchew wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. Because there is no town benefit to me hiding this information. and for all everyone knows I could be a blue role trying to avoid being incorrectly tracked as well if I get tracked to a dead person atleast there will be something to think about before mislynching me Lying to town as a blue is a bad idea. If you fakeclaim nosy neighbor to fool scum, then you risk getting lynched by town. You are still going to draw a few trackers during the first few nights, just to make sure that you are really visiting people at random with no effect, so because of this you might actually be hurting town by distracting blues. Why are trackers going to be inclined to 'verify' a nosy neighbor claim? Even if Mattchew is scum, he just needs to do something and his claim is still up in the air. Why is Forumite trying to manipulate our blues? There's also the point about lying as a blue. How about lying in general to the town? There isn't any value in this statement. Town is supposedly harmed because our Trackers have to make sure Mattchew is really visiting random people with no effect. And then they get a confirmed townie out of the exchange. Wait, how does that hurt us again?
Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. Dat Over-reaction: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 07:42 slOosh wrote:
Cool ... you wanna talk about something else? Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? And then of course slo0sh himself points out: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:17 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 10:00 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Let me rephrase: What is your problem with Toades play in this game? You were reacting very strongly to a random vote coming right at the beginning of the game. I reacted strongly because there was no grounds for the vote / read. I still have a problem with the fact that he keeps emphasizing the uselessness of the post (it isn't, because as clearly seen that people can miss setup information), which I take as soft discrediting of my posts in general. I'm not claiming my opening post is super useful, but to call it useless is unwarranted. That said I can see this coming from a town perspective, so my problem with his play thus far is a matter of taste rather than alignment. On September 04 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote:On September 04 2012 09:55 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 09:05 Forumite wrote:Finished with page 12. On September 04 2012 08:01 slOosh wrote:On September 04 2012 07:58 Toadesstern wrote:On September 04 2012 07:56 slOosh wrote:
Hapa, what is your idea of a town circle and how does it help us find / lynch / kill scum?
Toad - How is that useless stuff that has nothing to do with the game? The setup changed and maybe people haven't read the updates. I've asked you once and I'll do it again, what else do you want to talk about? I don't know what you want to talk about. I'm talking about your useless post being useless. Well BlackMamba's recent post just shows that people can miss information. My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not. Do you think I'm scum by my first post? What is your problem with Toades? Do you think he´s deliberately disruptive? What makes you think I think that? Um... this: " My post has already proven itself useful, and your opening post which tries to discredit mine has not" You are saying that he tries to discredit you ---> you think he tried to discredit you ---> if he tried to discredit you, you are saying he wanted to do this and is being deliberately disruptive. Why not just straight answer the question without adding another one? There is a difference in someone discrediting me and someone being deliberately disruptive. Forumite phrased the question in a way that seemingly put words in my mouth as I said the former but not the latter (or never intended to so I checked with my question). Specifically the last paragraph is what I want noted. Then again, slo0sh addressed the 'strong reaction' in the first part of that quote, but I don't think slo0sh reacted 'strongly' at all. Forumite is just stirring the pot here and not really being helpful to me. He looks like he's pushing discussion, but slo0sh was taking care of that all on his own. We didn't need Forumite to prompt him.
I see a lot of roundabout advice from Forumite on why claiming self-aware miller is terrible and how our blues are screwed for it. But nowhere does he tell us that Mattchew is scummy, just that he'll still be suspicious no matter what. His prodding at slo0sh dead-ended pretty quickly and he's ducked out of the thread after making this post: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 10:01 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 10:00 Z-BosoN wrote:
Hello folks ^^
I would appreciate it if someone could clear some things up, since I've never played in this setup yet. Right now I've noticed this new mechanic: visiting someone.
A nosy neighbor will randomly visit someone. This will be caught up by the town watcher and/or tracker.
Now what I don't understand: if a medic saves someone, or if a roleblocker blocks some, or if a Suicide Bomber plants a bomb somewhere, or if a goon tks someone, will they also "visit" this person? Yes, all nightactions, including mafia nightkills, can be detected by watchers and trackers. I´ve never seen you before. Have you been on TL-mafia long? What do you think about the game so far? I don't think his posts have contributed anything to getting scum lynched, and I think it is because Forumite is scum. ##Vote: Forumite+ Show Spoiler +Pregame answer for Rewok, I got curious when going through Forumite's filter: On September 03 2012 01:49 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 00:51 Rewok wrote:
There's a word for arguing for arguments sake but I can't remember it. Anybody want to help me out? No there isn't! + Show Spoiler + Eristic My followup, continuing my journey through his filter: His entire reasoning for voting matt is to sheep BC: Show nested quote +On September 04 2012 21:11 Forumite wrote:
Still catching up with the posts made while I was asleep.
For now:
##Vote: Mattchew
He´s a scummy liar and I´m 100% behind BC for calling him out. He didn't even read the entire thread through...He initially just tossed his vote in there because BC was so sure of himself, but that wasn't really the case. How do I know this? Because in his next post, he's defending his 'out of place' vote in the spoilered post below: + Show Spoiler +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. Why do people fakevote, then say "lol, I never really voted!" It´s irritating. Making a vote in this thread might not count but I think it´s bad form. Similarly it´s bad to stealthvote in the other thread without confirming it here. If you want to pressurevote, do it for real. @BMShow nested quote +On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. With Matt looking more and more scummy, do you still accuse me of fishing for his role? Your FoS seem to rely on Matt being a townie, which he´s probably not. Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 09:48 Rewok wrote:
Been keeping up my reading. Here's how the situation seems to me:
We're voting Mattchew today. Pretty much no getting out of that. If he turns up scum, Ottox and a few others could be on the chopping block. If he's town, we've got a whole new set of reads.
But it seems to me that our whole strategy hinges on how Mattchew turns up after he's killed. Is there any way we can get another read / another kill set up for D1? One which doesn't hinge on Mattchew's alignment?
I'm asking because you guys are way more familiar with the way TL mafia runs. One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. More specifically, pulling from the spoilered post above: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
Reading through the thread, my vote on Matt looks kind of odd. I made it after I got a PM-confirmation from Palmar but before I saw Palmars post in the thread. It didn't look strange. Feel free the check the timestamps, his vote came after Palmar confirmed the lie. Forumite says he got mod confirmation anyways, but to what avail? This is a defensive statement when there is nothing to defend against. This is scummy behavior. Why did he have to sheep BC if he had mod confirmation? More scummy behavior. Next, he's reading things between lines that I have a hard time seeing. Read BM's post and show me how you came out of that thinking "Well BM is accusing me of bluefishing": Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 05:57 Bill Murray wrote:On September 04 2012 09:36 Forumite wrote:On September 04 2012 09:12 Mattchew wrote:
I am a nosy neighbor. Anyone else with this role should insta-claim as well.
The reason people policy lynch people like BM and Grush is because they get by into later in the game because they are unreadable. This is because they barely actually play the game and if you end up in lylo with one of them left, you've basically already lost. I completely understand anyone wanting to policy lynch them, but we should also not allow them to be off the hook for some sort of scum read during the day.
That being said, I remember thinking to myself that I don't hate BM's play in the last few games I have been in with him. I do not want to policy lynch today.
Why would you claim this? You eliminated yourself as a possible blue from scums list of townies, and it´s not like you doing this eliminates you as a scum suspect. If someone see you visiting a player who dies the we´re lynching you anyway. check this scummy post from forumite 1) misreads the setup 2) attacks him with a smirk for the claim, which looks scummy as shit 3) takes the visiting thing a step further, saying "if they die" which clears a ton of scum roles... forumite is scum with a role FoS: Forumite Forumite's response to BM: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
I don´t get it. Matt was looking very strange for claiming when there was no benefit in claiming. I was talking to him to try and get a better read. Yes, if Matt was blue then I might have exposed him, but I wasn´t worried about that, I was thinking Matt was either NN or scum. Next is him stifling active discussion and being wishy-washy: Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 11:17 Forumite wrote:
One lynch at a time. Once Matt is dead, we shut up during the night, and then try to figure out what his flip means tomorrow. We can´t lynch more than one target at a time, so we lynch the scummiest one and worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later. He's kind of hedging his bets on what Matt's flip is going to be. This is a step back from when Matt was a scummy liar in his previous post. So what if we can't lynch more than one target at a time? I disagree with the concept of shutting up at night, but I don't necessarily see that as scum motivated. What is scummy is that we can "worry about finding the rest of the scumteam later." This isn't shutting up at night, this is shutting up in general. Rewok phrased his question poorly as an "alternative D1 target", but the basic concept of CONTINUE TO SCUMHUNT is completely valid to me.
In the next post: + Show Spoiler +On September 05 2012 21:19 Forumite wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 12:43 Z-BosoN wrote:
Allright, Mattchew is set to be lynched.
What can we conclude if he flips scum or town?
In the unlikely event that he will flip town, will we have enough evidence to go for a BC lynch?
My take is, if he flips town, BC's suspicions will go way up, but I don't agree with insta-lynch. We all agreed that fakeclaiming is not something a blue role would do, and is most likely coming from scum.
If he flips scum, then we will take a long hard look at the people who insist that he shouldn't be lynched.
Ox, as of now, is my top candidate for a lynch. He's been so obnoxious and so annoying regarding the whole Mattchew business that he looks the most suspicious up to now. He also has been of zero usefulness this entire game.
@Shiaopi
Your meta is a little off from Dwarf Mafia, where you were town and had much more contribuitive posts in day 1. When will your internet be fixed? Basically that, if Matt flips town, then BC could be anything, but if Matt flips scum then BC is most likely town, and everyone who defended Matt until Palmars confirmation looks kind of bad. People who defend Matt after Palmars confirmation look bad for creating a disruption over something that is allready decided, that Matt lied and needs to die, but I think most scum jumped on the bandwagon long ago. If Matt is an Assassin then we get rid of both the 3rd Party in return for 2 townies dead. Not a good trade, but I think it´s unlikely that Matt is an assassin. There´s no point in not defending yourself to the end as a 3rd Party, while scum often shut up to avoid giving away any of their buddies. Show nested quote +On September 05 2012 14:38 Bill Murray wrote:
No, Forumite. I don't see how you get that whatsoever. I see you as being scum with Mattchew for not jumping on voting him there. Isn´t that a different accusation? Before you accuse me of trying to get Matt to claim (meaning that you thought I was scum and Matt town), and now you say I´m scum together with Matt. To answer why I didn´t vote Matt early, at the time I was weighing on what Matt was and engaged him in conversation to get a better read, but until Palmar confirmed how Nosy Neighbors works, there wasn´t enough on Matt for me to throw down a vote. Matt was suspicious for claiming NN, but there were no proof that he was really lying at the time. Why should I vote someone who claims a town role unless I have a good reason to think he´s lying? , He basically says that if Matt flips red (which he has) then everyone looks kind of bad sometimes because of disruption and bussing something something waffle. Don't count on finding scum using Matt's flip is the message I got from that. This, in addition to his "find scum later" response to rewok reads very scummy to me. He also pushes his luck with BM regarding the bluefishing, which I don't think actually happened and Forumite is twisting the situation to make BM look bad. For the most part, he's shut up other than to call Mav scum and neglect to address the ottoxlol issue. This is null since he said he'd wanted to shut up at night, but with everything else, I'm reading heavily into Forumite being scum.
And forumite didn't really give a satisfactory response. It reinforced my idea that he was trying to muck up the thread on his way out.
|
On September 15 2012 04:12 Rewok wrote:
We're really bad at this game this time.
Vote: Gravan
Seriously Rewok, what is your deal?
You are nothing but a sheep. You aren't even attempting at rationalising this vote.
|
It angers me that Rewok can do this every night, yet when I do it I get singled out on it.
|
This strengthens my paranoia about the vote being mafia controlled, and town are just pulling led along.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
