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On August 06 2012 23:10 YourHarry wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 22:44 iamperfection wrote:On August 06 2012 22:42 YourHarry wrote:On August 06 2012 18:54 Promethelax wrote:On August 06 2012 16:50 YourHarry wrote:
Shit LOL messed up the quotes. Oh well, more work for you guys. I'm pretty sure this post is a joke but this does not show a town mentality ##FoS: that dude, Harry or whatever+ Show Spoiler +I'm high as balls. I don't know how much of this makes sense. If you need a translator ask tomorrow This is scummy. Discuss. Care to enlighten us on why? Also you didnt vote right. He is sure that my post was a joke, but still suspects that I am scum at the same time. Scum Harry may intentionally mess up the quotes to make it more difficult for town, in which case I won't be joking. Town Harry would accidentally mess up the quotes and joke about not fixing the quotes. So it seems to be a forced argument to show commitment and throw fake "reads" out there. This is scummy because scums have harder time coming up with genuine reads because they have to build a case on someone they know is town.
Your quote mishap seems pretty anti town. You were too lazy to fix your post or you're scum. Either way, you weren't helping town as much as you could.
Also, your discussion of fake reads is suspicious because you have voted for 2 different people with little to no evidence while FOSing 2 more. Seems to be the same thing you're accusing promo of.
FOS YourHarry
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Also, I like perfection's read on sideni. Would like to hear sideni defend himself.
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Good posting so far Town! Still waiting on Sideni and Tolerance to post, as well as Synystyr to post something significant. My FOS on Synystyr still stands.
@ mkfuba07 -
On August 06 2012 18:19 mkfuba07 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 13:42 Hapahauli wrote:On August 06 2012 11:30 mkfuba07 wrote:
Alright. A bit of policy talk first:
Blindly doing anything is a poor decision. If we're going to catch the correct people, it has to be based on reasoning and not the potential threat of a lurker. By the end of D1, we should have some read on most of the posters. It's much smarter to make a comparatively informed decision regarding someone we have interacted with than a random selection from those who have said very little.
I think policy lynchings (or safeties) are a bad idea in general. It not only limits the amount of logical reasoning involved, but it gives scum the means of avoiding suspicion, hiding in the holes we've created for them. Force them to defend themselves and we'll force information out of them. While I agree that blind policy lynching in its purest form is bad (i.e. lynching someone ONLY because they're lurking), I believe policy can be a good guideline to prevent mislynch. For example, given two equally "suspicious" players (one active and one "lurky"), I would be much more inclined to lynch the lurker, on the basis that in newbie games, active mafia are a rarity. Newbie mafia are usually incredibly lurky - especially Day 1 when they are still figuring out how to post. If they're both equally scummy, then wouldn't there be an equal chance of each being mafia? In that case wouldn't we gain more information from the flip of an active player than an inactive one?
I argue that new players are naturally inclined to see active players (especially those that can't defend themselves but are willing to post) as scummy instead of helpless townies. As a result, with two even scum reads (one active and one lurking), it's better to pick the one who's posted less, because they have a greater chance of being scummy given mafia general tendency.
Anywho, this is all semantics, but I hope you atleast agree that we should be focusing on less-active players Day 1. Looking through the last few games of Newbie Mafia's, I haven't seen a single situation where an active D1 poster getting lynched ended up flipping red.
@ Promethelax: Welcome to the thread! I found one of your posts fairly interesting in regards to the policy discussion:
On August 06 2012 18:54 Promethelax wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 16:25 YourHarry wrote:
Lynching a player based on inactivity is good on multiple grounds.
1. It encourages discussion, whether or not the player is scum. Discussion should be good for town.
2. Scums tend to lurk. Case in point: XIX
3. Having an inactive town around is a potential mod-kill that could mean losing the game, e.g. in LYLO.
1. True! 2. Did you read that game? I had town by the nose by virtue of not lurking.3. No! Bad YourHarry, lynching a townie is always bad. Lynching a bad townie hurts town because we lose a townie.
It's worth saying that while I'm pushing the anti-lurker policy, I was also a very active mafia in Newbie XXI. However, I believe it is near impossible to reliably lynch active-maifa with on D1 with no information. It's a much better idea to go after easy targets, and then use the flips to determine allignments among active players. Even in Newbie XXI, I had no visible "scumslips" and my game in the early days was consistent, but it was still possible to infer that I was Mafia in the later days based on my attitudes towards players as well as my lynch actions taken as a whole.
Also, the great thing about policy is that it can always be changed on a whim! If everyone posts actively, we can quickly scrap this and have a productive base to start the scum-hunt!
@ YourHarry:
On August 06 2012 16:31 YourHarry wrote:
Hapha
Thanks for schooling me last game. Although I did point out that you didn't start the game with one of your long ass analysis on why someone is scum, until I pointed this out. And even for the rest of the game, the frequency of your long ass analysis was significantly lacking compared to the first game we played together.
This time, I have my eyes on you.
<3
You bring up an interesting point regarding analysis, and one of the things I learned last game was how ineffective my Wall-O-Texts were at getting people lynched. As townie in XX, I had difficulty pushing my cases because people didn't have the patience to read my posts! (Plus they took HOURS to write T_T)
I had much more success pushing my "suspicions" as Mafia in XIX when I pointed them out in smaller posts that people actually had the patience to read. You will see the occasional Wall-O-Text from me, but expect the word-for-word length of my analysis to be shorter this game. However, I assure you my analysis will not be lacking in content!
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@Hapa
Don't be so quick to vote me after one post  I was merely implying that activity is not indicative of alignment and shouldn't be taken into account in a case, yet.
@Dandel
My read on Golbat is that he's neutral leaning scum. Scum like to cause discord amongst the town, and there's really no need for attacks on reading comprehension without a good reason. He's just trying to stir shit up. He wants to lynch lurkers as well, which may be the start of a defense to as why he shouldn't be lynched d1.
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On August 07 2012 01:21 Synystyr wrote:@Hapa Don't be so quick to vote me after one post I was merely implying that activity is not indicative of alignment and shouldn't be taken into account in a case, yet. @Dandel My read on Golbat is that he's neutral leaning scum. Scum like to cause discord amongst the town, and there's really no need for attacks on reading comprehension without a good reason. He's just trying to stir shit up. He wants to lynch lurkers as well, which may be the start of a defense to as why he shouldn't be lynched d1.
I didn't vote you yet Synystyr, just an FOS is all. But what's with the passive finger-pointing? In the first post, you mention that "I could be active scum" trying to clear myself - what's the townie motive behind that?
Secondly, that reasoning on Golbat is terribad: he's trying to stir shit up and focus on lurkers (good townie behavior), and therefore he's setting up to defend himself and therefore he's scum?! Yeah ok buddy.
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I'm just being cautious. Golbat hasn't been too productive as far as I can tell, which isn't a town move, so I'm leaning scum. It's still early so I'm not pushing for anything yet though.
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So how is Golbat not beeing productive? Surely you can tell us why you think so instead of throwing out your "cautious" accusations. Has Golbat been less productive than you so far?
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On August 07 2012 01:28 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On August 07 2012 01:21 Synystyr wrote:@Hapa Don't be so quick to vote me after one post I was merely implying that activity is not indicative of alignment and shouldn't be taken into account in a case, yet. @Dandel My read on Golbat is that he's neutral leaning scum. Scum like to cause discord amongst the town, and there's really no need for attacks on reading comprehension without a good reason. He's just trying to stir shit up. He wants to lynch lurkers as well, which may be the start of a defense to as why he shouldn't be lynched d1. I didn't vote you yet Synystyr, just an FOS is all. But what's with the passive finger-pointing? In the first post, you mention that "I could be active scum" trying to clear myself - what's the townie motive behind that? Secondly, that reasoning on Golbat is terribad: he's trying to stir shit up and focus on lurkers (good townie behavior), and therefore he's setting up to defend himself and therefore he's scum?! Yeah ok buddy.
Well you could be scum. I don't think it's bad to point out that, just because something looks towny, it can't be scum-motivated too.
He did not actually attack you, or even imply to direct his post towards you. It seemed to me like he was talking more in general. Yet you're getting pretty defensive, pretty fast.
Synystyr, now that you're here, post some more plox.
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On August 07 2012 01:41 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On August 07 2012 01:28 Hapahauli wrote:On August 07 2012 01:21 Synystyr wrote:@Hapa Don't be so quick to vote me after one post I was merely implying that activity is not indicative of alignment and shouldn't be taken into account in a case, yet. @Dandel My read on Golbat is that he's neutral leaning scum. Scum like to cause discord amongst the town, and there's really no need for attacks on reading comprehension without a good reason. He's just trying to stir shit up. He wants to lynch lurkers as well, which may be the start of a defense to as why he shouldn't be lynched d1. I didn't vote you yet Synystyr, just an FOS is all. But what's with the passive finger-pointing? In the first post, you mention that "I could be active scum" trying to clear myself - what's the townie motive behind that? Secondly, that reasoning on Golbat is terribad: he's trying to stir shit up and focus on lurkers (good townie behavior), and therefore he's setting up to defend himself and therefore he's scum?! Yeah ok buddy. Well you could be scum. I don't think it's bad to point out that, just because something looks towny, it can't be scum-motivated too. He did not actually attack you, or even imply to direct his post towards you. It seemed to me like he was talking more in general. Yet you're getting pretty defensive, pretty fast. Synystyr, now that you're here, post some more plox.
I agree, from your perspective I could be mafia. However, I'm calling attention as to how Synyster decides to cast suspicion. His post literally says nothing, and it reads as a passive fingerpoint to me. As for my "defensiveness," I don't make any effort to defend myself - I'm simply pointing out scummy behavior, and this one just so happens to involve my name.
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Hi all,
sorry for my first post. I don't feel it contributed much, although it has elicited an interesting/hilarious response from YH.
Let me introduce myself, my name is Promethelax and I am town.
My strengths in mafia games are my ability to build strong cases and to post in an active and pro-town manner.
My weaknesses include using the words town and townie too much in my posts and often failing to explain things that seem self-evident to me.
I am very excited to be in this game and I'll be at my computer for another hour or so.
For those of you interested in active scum/passive scum Hapa and I both played excellent active scum games XIX and XXI, respectively, and will be active regardless of alignment.
YH was town in XXI and played as inexplicably as he is playing here. He voted for three people on D1 and unvoted one of them about a million times (rereading his filter I can't tell how many were because he wrote them wrong and how many were because he changed his mind). All three of his targets were town.
Hapa: thanks for getting the discussion going. How do you feel about Golbat?
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Golbat's main contribution has been noticing my early flub. That points to an being an active townie or a mafia jumping on an early mistake. Worth watching but not explicitly a suspect.
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Lvdr: Who else do yo have suspicions of and why?
(not counting liking what my boy perfection said)
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On August 07 2012 01:40 Hapahauli wrote:
So how is Golbat not beeing productive? Surely you can tell us why you think so instead of throwing out your "cautious" accusations. Has Golbat been less productive than you so far?
Meant to quote this on my last post. I still find synyster more questionable than golbat.
It is still quite early.
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Synyster seems to fit the 'post just enough' mafia profile. His defenses have involved a lot of passive accusing against his attackers.
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On August 07 2012 02:07 Promethelax wrote:
YH was town in XXI and played as inexplicably as he is playing here. He voted for three people on D1 and unvoted one of them about a million times (rereading his filter I can't tell how many were because he wrote them wrong and how many were because he changed his mind). All three of his targets were town.
After reading this game, I'm convinced YourHarry has a secret DT role, the reverse DT.
Everyone he attacks is town, people he says are town are mafia.
He even breadcrumbed it in his in-post:
Hi guys, I am in as the detective
+ Show Spoiler +This post was not serious, pls ignore.
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On August 06 2012 23:50 Golbat wrote:
HARRY. DOWN BOY, DOWN. BAD DOG.
But forreal. 4 posts in a row is unnecessary
At the moment, I'm suspicious of three-ish people. I'll have cases written up on them probably within 8 hours.
Right now, however I need to go beat tuition money out of my high school guidance counselor, and then go suit shopping. I have no clue when i'll be back, or if I'll be able to post in between. See you laters.
<3
I'd like to bring attention to this post: it is neither a scum or a town tell but if you promise to make reads you had better do it. Golbat I want to hear what you think about people and I will be happy to vote you if you do not provide these cases, I know irl things can get in the way so I don't expect them at this moment but I do expect them within this day.
goodluck on your tuition moneys.
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On August 07 2012 02:30 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On August 07 2012 02:07 Promethelax wrote:
YH was town in XXI and played as inexplicably as he is playing here. He voted for three people on D1 and unvoted one of them about a million times (rereading his filter I can't tell how many were because he wrote them wrong and how many were because he changed his mind). All three of his targets were town.
After reading this game, I'm convinced YourHarry has a secret DT role, the reverse DT. Everyone he attacks is town, people he says are town are mafia. He even breadcrumbed it in his in-post: + Show Spoiler +This post was not serious, pls ignore.
not going to lie, I laughed. But this is a waste of time and space. How do you feel about him and his play? Is Harry town, null or scum in your eyes and why?
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sorry for third post, missed Lvdr up there:
that seems like a decent point. Thanks for bringing it to my attention and I will have to go back and look at Syn.
I had another point about Golbat in the above post. This point is made out of WIFOM. Feel free to ignore it.+ Show Spoiler +If 1. Golbat is scum, 2. YH is in this game and 3. I am town Golbat defending me against YH could be a good idea to buy him town cred with someone he knows is an active and experienced (for a newbie game) poster /speculation, feel free to ignore this, I probably will
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Prome- What do you think of hapa? Seems solidly town, but a gf play could be devastating, esp given that he has been an active and successful scum before.
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On August 07 2012 02:30 Lvdr wrote:
Synyster seems to fit the 'post just enough' mafia profile. His defenses have involved a lot of passive accusing against his attackers.
What I don't get about Synyster is why he'd have to make posts justifying his own behavior, when we're not even halfway through Day 1. But then the excuses about "caution" could just be a convenient excuse for continued passive accusations.
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EPT
