EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXII - Page 8
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
On August 06 2012 05:59 Obvious.660 wrote: This is also the impression I got from his last post. Town Jingle never struck me as one to sit back and watch the town burn itself to the ground, so I can only say it's just more evidence against him. I don't know, I didn't play with him previously. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
You might think that it does seem like an aweful OMGUS vote after I have been vividly arguing with DarthPunk but OMGUS isn't about WHO you vote, it's about HOW you vote them. A vote is only OMGUS if you're voting them BECAUSE they voted you. If you vote them for a well-thought-out reason, even if they also voted you, then it's not OMGUS. Let's first go through the reasons why I wanted to vote him anyway: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=353315¤tpage=48#945 1. During the Zork lynch discussion DarthPunk repeatedly soft-defended Zork, pushed Mordanis as lynch candidate and proposed to lynch aRyuujin instead of Zork. 2. He switches votes very conveniently at around the same time when Zork fake claims medic. I believe that scum decided in their QT to concede to the Zork lynch. Instead of really defending himself against my accusations DarthPunk makes a huge WIFOM explanation and decides to paint me scummy by saying I set him up with a trap. He denies me any kind of town motivation for pointing out Zork's scumslip. Yet he was happy to give Zork the benefit of doubt until last minute even though many people pointed out his scum behaviour. I see a clear scum motivation for his behaviour: 1. Save Zork and mislynch Mordanis (or aRyuujin at least) instead 2. When there is no way to save Zork, switch the vote before Zork's claim to get a bit of town cred 3. Discredit me as I am the most active power behind his lynch and mislynch me instead With him being called out as scum by several people DarthPunk is just flailing around desperately trying to shift the attention to someone, anyone besides himself. He didn't even give us any other reads besides me. I can only repeat it: This is no pro town play! DarthPunk, I'd really like to congratulate you for writing the best case on yourself -> your own filter! So why lynch DarthPunk before Jingle? After all this discussion I am even more convinced of him being scum than I am of Jingle. I made the case on Jingle because there was no town motivation for his awful play. If he isn't just simply bad he must be scum. However this case against DarthPunk is based on his clear scum motivation and not based on the lack of town motivation. To make it clear: If I am 99% convinced that Jingle is scum, than I am 100% convinced that DarthPunk is scum. In my opinion we can not let him get away with this! ##Unvote ##Vote DarthPunk | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
Once again I would like to bring something to your attention. When we were all set on lynching Jingle, everyone was agreeing (besides DarthPunk). It was such an easy vote. Anything wrong with easy votes? Well, day 1 and day 2 votes were easy. What did we get? Town. Oh yeah, day 3 was really difficult. What did we get? Scum! Although some may brush this off as WIFOM (because scum clearly could bus their own member etc), this is one more reason for me to prefer a DarthPunk lynch than a Jingle lynch. aRyuujin made an awesome case and I agree with him that there might be a tiny chance that Jingle is not scum but DarthPunk IS SCUM and therefore has to be lynched today! | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
On August 06 2012 15:35 DarthPunk wrote: @Jingle. I have a town read on you because you are experiencing exactly what I am experiencing. If the same people that are trying to mislynch you are also trying to mislynch me. I assume you must be town. If you think there is an ulterior motive for me believing you to be town and that that is enough reason to vote for me, so be it. That being said. I will continue to post cases and defend myself but I am sheeping shadys vote no matter what this cycle. If shady votes for me I will vote for myself etc. The reason for this is that the situation is bad at the moment. a mess really. I will sheep the vote of the confirmed town. Whilst still contributing as much as possible. If I had to vote for someone right now it would be aRyuujin he had less than a pages worth of filter but has LEAPT into action now more than one person is considering voting for him. I mean read his filter. the contrast is obvious. You want to just simply sheep Shady? Why give up your own reads and your right to decide whom to vote? This post just screams for more town cred. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
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Ange777
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On August 06 2012 16:00 goodkarma wrote: It appears that the Darthpunk lynch is gaining momentum. And now there's side-tangents that include alan too... I'm still against lynching Darthpunk today. Can someone kindly explain to me why he's 100% scum? Ange's arguement against him was summarized as: 1) Correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall Darthpunk's "defense" of Zork amounting to he felt Zork was some kind of lurker. And if we were to lynch solely based off that reasoning we should lynch aRyuujin. I don't recall much further "defense" than that, and that seems like a reasonable arguement if he was looking at it solely from the lurker standpoint. 2) I find Darthpunk's claim that he hadn't seen Zork's post before his post FAR MORE BELIEVABLE than that in QT scum were like "let's have Darthpunk change vote and bus Zork TWO MINUTES AFTER he incriminates himself." I'd expect a move like this to be planned out hours ahead of time so that Darthpunk could change his vote way ahead of time and avoid suspicion... Thanks aRyuujin for your most recent case post. It's a dramatic improvement from earlier . One thing on your case against Darthpunk I'd like to specifically address, though, is your implication that NK'ing Mordanis benefited Darthpunk. Any such discussion of why scum NK'ed a specific person I feel is too much WIFOM to really bring up. I could come up with other realistic reasons why they might have NK'ed Mordanis. The first that comes to mind is they wanted to get someone they were pretty sure wouldn't be medic saved...If someone could summarize a specific case point that shows Darthpunk's guilt that I haven't discussed here please let me know. I wanted to give Darthpunk a chance to defend himself, as I feel his defense is just as important as what was said in the case against him to get a good read of the situation. But after his defense, I don't feel the evidence is there to say he's a sure scum, especially compared to Jingle. Jingle has been spending his posting time calling us tunneling sheep, which is hardly a compelling arguement -_- I understand the need for town to stay united, and will coincide my vote with Shady's to secure the lynch for Darth IF IT COMES TO THAT, but I honestly hope it doesn't. I feel we're getting ahead of ourselves. Almost everyone is in agreement that Jingle is scum, so why are we now voting Darth? If there's some compelling arguement for lynching him I've overlooked, please enlighten me. @goodkarma: What you quoted is not my entire case. It is the behaviour which made him scummy but the reason why I want to vote him is the scum motivation behind it. On August 06 2012 07:10 Ange777 wrote: I see a clear scum motivation for his behaviour: 1. Save Zork and mislynch Mordanis (or aRyuujin at least) instead 2. When there is no way to save Zork, switch the vote before Zork's claim to get a bit of town cred 3. Discredit me as I am the most active power behind his lynch and mislynch me Even if you give DarthPunk the benefit of doubt that he really did believe Zork was a lurker I really don't see why he would put Zork and aRyuujin in one category. To me, aRyuujin seems like a bored town who can't bother himself to post more active. His most recent activity fits that perfectly. Which is why I will not vote for aRyuujin. Scum doesn't always show themselves with some damning piece of evidence. (And even if they do as in Zork's slip not everyone accepts it ... ) You have to instead think about why someone would do this or that and whether it is scum motivated or if there is a town motivation for it. Therefore I'd like you to weigh once more whether you really think that there might be a town motivation for DarthPunk's behaviour or whether a scum DarthPunk would make so much more sense. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
Why is aRyuujin now your strongest scum read DarthPunk? I thought that's me? What changed? You could not get the bandwagon on me to start and now you're trying again with the one player who should be the easiest to get a lynch on because of his previous lack of activity? | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
On August 06 2012 07:31 DarthPunk wrote: OK all 3 of those points I have covered already. If you are refusing to see the reasoning behind it. Now you are saying that because I did not present cases that you asked for I am scum? I said I would be out of the thread for 12 hours as I was sleeping. So you ask me a question after i have said that and use my lack of response that you were aware of as I said I was sleeping I did not make this case because you were away which I had seen. Stop making up bad excuses to discredit me. so now there is no motivation for jingles play? you have said that there was scum motivation for jingles play for the past 2 days and now there is no motivation? You realise that was my issue with the jingle case right? Jingle has played so badly that I fail to see any kind of town motivation. There are two options: He really just IS that bad or he must be scum. You on the other hand have played clearly with scum motivation. Therefore naturally I prefer to lynch you. If that was your issue with the case on Jingle than congrats, I am agreeing with you on this point. 1. if not for you baiting me. I would NEVER have said anything in order to 'save zork' 2. I did not see zorks claim. I was simply fulfilling my promise to stop a no lynch. 3. I know I am town. So if as town I am put into a situation where I was clearly trapped. Then I am obviously going to come after that person. addendum: So now that I know what you are up to I will say this. TOWN: when I flip green can you please do something about this guy. I don't mind dying as long as it helps us win the game. For the last time, I did not bait you. What is wrong with asking someone for the reasons why they don't want to vote for a case? And why would you obviously come after me? Town should not be afraid of dying because they are town, not scum. You don't need to be afraid if one person comes after you instead you should continue to hunt scum. That is a town indicator. So what did you do? You first came after me when I accused you, than after aRyuujin accused you you switched to him. You are indeed flailing around and throwing mud at all your accusers. Scum. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
On August 06 2012 16:57 DarthPunk wrote: Is there anything else? i fail to see a blatant revelation that explains your position. seems like a weak case to go with the other weak cases to join an increasingly easy bandwagon You are getting sulky. The easy bandwagon would have been Jingle. When we had the consensus to lynch him, there was no posting at all from town for the entire first half of day 3. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
Please reconsider your vote. At the moment neither aRyuujin nor I am willing to concede in a Jingle lynch as we believe that DarthPunk is a more sure scum lynch than a Jingle lynch is. @Jingle: If you really want to show your "town side", than play! Give us another read except for DarthPunk, preferably one that includes a solid case and not just a one-liner vote and snippy comments. | ||
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Ange777
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@alan: Where are you? | ||
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Ange777
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Ange777
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If in doubt, go back and read it! Unfortunately I need to leave now but I'll be back 1-2 hours before deadline. | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
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Ange777
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Ange777
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Ange777
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On August 07 2012 00:18 JingleHell wrote: And here's a WIFOM filled hypothetical for you, since you like those. Think about this. If I flipped red, which I know I won't, DP would be tomorrow's lynch for attempting to defend me. At least according to precedent. If I flip green, which I will, DP has foreknowledge of how I'll flip and is trying to make people who target me look scummy, which is scum behavior. I am reconsidering my read for the last scum. Re-reading filters. | ||
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Ange777
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