Normal Mini Mafia II - Page 4

On July 12 2012 06:42 Zephirdd wrote:
Well, fuck me. Either I have the whole scum team in MrZentor-sloOsh-Bluelightz, or I got nothing.

Basically, the very first few interactions from MrZentor are soft-defenses of sloOsh and Bluelightz, or something that is not related to the game at all.

The first time he attacks someone is on the Sinensis 1st post, and he has gone on tunneling him the whole freaking game.

He has also defended prplhz in order to push that Sinensis lynch. Defending a town and attacking another is pretty much the simplest way to play scum(remember I'm assuming mrzentor/sloosh/blz as scums), since it IS a null tell. The problem here is who he defends and who he attacks, and how.

At the time, prplhz had made 4-5 terrible posts, while Sinensis made one, I said before and I'll keep saying it, prplhz case was much better than Sinensis' "first post case". That's not an issue.

A issue arises on this post:

This is a completely neutral-ground post. This is a post made from a perspective of "omg two townies are fighting eachother. Let's calm them down." The issue here is, Sinensis was being abrasive and stubborn and that was a perfect chance to attack him for it. He believed Sinensis was scum and kept believing it throughout day 2. Why didn't he attack him on the first chance he got?

I can't answer that from a town perspective. The answer I have is "because he knew these were two townies fighting". This is an instinctive post to be done in order to blend in and feel townie, but it makes no sense from the ground he is standing.


At night 1, he has posted this:

What is this? This is a scum list. A list of three players he considers to be the scum team. At the time, there was suspicion being cast over VE. He had Sinensis as his lynch target day 1. He admitted himself that he thought marv was playing so well he could be a scum manipulating town. This is a scum list, done on night 1, before marv confirmed himself.

Why would a town player make a scum list on night 1? There are a few reasons. Gauge reactions, look awesome if all three of them flip scum after the game.

Why would a scum player make a list on night 1? Create confusion, make a little ground to attack all of them later on the game.

Now, this post in itself isn't an issue. The issue is this post made on day 2(post marv confirmation):

This post reads "Oh, that's not actually a scum list". But when you come back to night 2, he says:


So wait, that actually WAS a scum list!

Even if it wasn't, there is absolutely no reason for a town player to create a list and not say what it is.

This list thing is a huge contradiction that does not make sense from a town perspective.

His day 2 is to tunnel Sinensis HARD, on the basis of the very first post made by Sinensis. And THEN he makes a case on Sinensis, except he didn't make the case and stood on neutral ground when he had his first chance. Why? Because he didn't have to push hard Sinensis' lynch on day1, when three townies are the lynch candidates.

He's afraid of "copying" bluelightz' case because he doesn't want to be accused of copying a case. Why would a town player say that?
As a town, no matter the pressure on me, I'll push for a candidate with someone's else case if I feel it's correct.

Finally, the way he pushes Sinensis is in an extremely anti-town way. He isn't looking for evidence, he is picking straws from his posts to create a case.

As an example, take me creating this case. I asked a few questions, and these helped me build up the case(specifically the part of the list). Instead, MrZentor only throws the case and says it's correct. He doesn't ask Sinensis for connections(I feel every town player should force connections whenever possible), he doesn't ask for Sinensis for his thought process. He looked at his first post and decided "I will push this guy". He does not consider the possibility of Sinensis being town until night 2, after a fuckload of pressure.

MrZentor is scum.
sloOsh's interactions with him and his lynch yesterday(after what he promised) makes him scum too. For more, check out my counter-case on him which shows he is making a forged case on me.

Out of the remaining candidates, I feel Bluelightz is the most likely to be scum at this point. His whole play this game was "afk, make case on X, throw random comment, rinse and repeat". Unfortunately, he is the one I'm most unsure of; It would make a lot of sense if he were though.

That's all I can say.

Basically, the very first few interactions from MrZentor are soft-defenses of sloOsh and Bluelightz, or something that is not related to the game at all.

The first time he attacks someone is on the Sinensis 1st post, and he has gone on tunneling him the whole freaking game.

He has also defended prplhz in order to push that Sinensis lynch. Defending a town and attacking another is pretty much the simplest way to play scum(remember I'm assuming mrzentor/sloosh/blz as scums), since it IS a null tell. The problem here is who he defends and who he attacks, and how.

At the time, prplhz had made 4-5 terrible posts, while Sinensis made one, I said before and I'll keep saying it, prplhz case was much better than Sinensis' "first post case". That's not an issue.

This is a completely neutral-ground post. This is a post made from a perspective of "omg two townies are fighting eachother. Let's calm them down." The issue here is, Sinensis was being abrasive and stubborn and that was a perfect chance to attack him for it. He believed Sinensis was scum and kept believing it throughout day 2. Why didn't he attack him on the first chance he got?

What is this? This is a scum list. A list of three players he considers to be the scum team. At the time, there was suspicion being cast over VE. He had Sinensis as his lynch target day 1. He admitted himself that he thought marv was playing so well he could be a scum manipulating town. This is a scum list, done on night 1, before marv confirmed himself.

Why would a town player make a scum list on night 1? There are a few reasons. Gauge reactions, look awesome if all three of them flip scum after the game.

Why would a scum player make a list on night 1? Create confusion, make a little ground to attack all of them later on the game.

This post reads "Oh, that's not actually a scum list".

His day 2 is to tunnel Sinensis HARD, on the basis of the very first post made by Sinensis. And THEN he makes a case on Sinensis, except he didn't make the case and stood on neutral ground when he had his first chance. Why? Because he didn't have to push hard Sinensis' lynch on day1, when three townies are the lynch candidates.

He's afraid of "copying" bluelightz' case because he doesn't want to be accused of copying a case. Why would a town player say that?
As a town, no matter the pressure on me, I'll push for a candidate with someone's else case if I feel it's correct.

Finally, the way he pushes Sinensis is in an extremely anti-town way. He isn't looking for evidence, he is picking straws from his posts to create a case.

+ Show Spoiler +

On July 12 2012 09:57 MrZentor wrote:
Ugh, I'm way too tired to respond to that now. >.<

* Point 1 - Sinensis push
Early Day1, MrZentor points out Sinensis' first post. Based on that post, he proceeds to spend the whole day pushing for his lynch. Sounds legit right?
The issue is on the moment me and Sinensis fight eachother. Sinensis does something really, really terrible which is blatantly ignoring my post.

That is something that a town player should push for someone's lynch. Nothing is 100% and it's possible that Sinensis is town even after doing that; It is however something that should be pushed for when you believe that person is scum.

This is an incredibly neutral ground post. He is trying to stop our brawl - seems like the right thing for a town player to do right? For a town player that does not want to push either lynch, that is. MrZentor, however, wanted to push Sinensis. So why did he simply ignore his newest posts and kept pushing for that single first post?

This is a new point, and I now realize it's actually important.
He has 29 posts on day 1, a day with about 17 pages of posting.

He has a candidate for a lynch, and he firmly believes he is scum.
He does not actively push for the lynch of his candidate. Why? Why a town player that believes X is scum is not trying to pursue other players into the lynch of his candidate?
A scum player, however, loves to do that. Creates a little suspicion, claims credit on the wagon, and just skims by the day unnoticed. "He is scum hunting!" a player would think, but under further analysis you can see he won't try to pursue for the lynch as he should. Ask questions, create material from his lynch candidate. He is fine sitting on that one-post case and complaining about people switching around - when he himself didn't actively try to keep people into his candidate.

* Point 3 - The List
(I'll use his answer to this point as well, it's relevant)
He posts a scum list on Night 1. "Sinensis, Marv, VE".
On Day 2, when questioned, he posts this:

This is not a transparent post. Anyone reading this will interpret he is saying that the "list" is not a list.

Anyone reading this will interpret he is saying that the "list" is not a list.

the "list" is not a list.