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On June 30 2012 01:21 Oberyn wrote:You know, Grey can kill our 8/8 beast as well with: He has 3 lands out, so he can destroy one of the 8/8 beasts each turn (although it would be considered a scum claim). Well....although in the very off chance Grey is town and Nova scum it could be another "fail-safe" plan to destroy Nova's beast (other than my and WBG's spellbomb)
I have more things to deal with the 8/8 creatures even in case of of the failure of the spellbombs for some reason :p
About your S&B + Fulla + Zealos post:
First of all, Zealos is the guy who has 3 untapped lands a couple of hours prior to the deadline, so I'd consider that pretty unhelpful and pretty unopen as well.
I get what you're talking about when talking about Fulla and I agree in general.
The timing of S&B's tapping looked the most weird. While Greymist tapped everything and said he's playing his style no matter what pretty early. S&B did that AFTER he knew what was going on. But I'd say Zealos looks equally bad right now considering he's not willing to help us because he doesn't want to lose lousy HP.
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Am I getting the 3 colorless mana or not?
Fulla has 1 (not getting into the other thread for whatever reason) and Obe has how much left? I still don't think you'll need the island at all because you don''t want to cast the spellbomb today eather way. Nor do you want to cast that spell of yours.
I'm not really feeling like changing everything 2,5 hours prior to the deadline when I am waiting something like 70 hours for people to start a conversation on something and only NOW something's starting. So I don't even care about what was posted most recently...
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On June 30 2012 04:57 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Since there were some things unclear about the blocking phase: After thinking about it, activated abilities on creatures will still work during the block phase. I would however much appreciate it if you announced them as soon as possible so people have a chance to respond. Though waiting until the deadline is allowed, it is considered uncourteous and I will delay moving to the main phase by 15 minutes should something come in at the last second.
If there are any complaints about this change, please PM them to me rather than discussing it in thread.
Fulla said he can't post in the other thread for whatever reason and asked people to quote what he said in here in the other thread.
Gonzaw did that but we're not sure if that's possible. Is it?
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1)On June 30 2012 02:39 Fulla wrote:
I can't get Into the other thread guys. Could someone please post this for me?
##tap mountain. ##Cast helpfulness. ##Give mana to obe
2)On June 30 2012 04:01 Oberyn wrote:
##Use (3 colorless mana), Cast Helpfulness x 3, Target: WereBugs-Go
3)On June 30 2012 04:04 WereBugs-Go wrote:
##Use: (3 colorless mana)
##Cast: Myr Enforcer
In case it's possible
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On June 30 2012 08:37 GreYMisT wrote:
I have marked Zealos for death by slivers.
Would you mind marking me for death as well?
That way I might survive a little longer if you somehow turn out to be town.
On June 30 2012 08:19 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 08:14 Oberyn wrote:On June 30 2012 08:07 Mattchew wrote:
The reason i suggested that is because I have a scum read on zealos and I don't think he would be bussing his teammate this early. I could be wrong about Zealos and S&B and then I will admit stupidity and then sheep ob and zeal, but I doubt I will have to do this. I am in the same boat with Greymist. I think he's a bad candidate for killing. Explain this please. Why is Greymist a bad candidate for killing? (or were you talking about someone else?) I already did. Greymist has posted EXTREMELY openly throughout this entire game. Do you see him lying anywhere or withholding info? Because I don't. Yes he wants to kill everyone, but Palmar does too as town, so I don't think this is a bad town strat.
Yeah but he never posted something of importance or a read until we forced him 70hours nonstop. Greymist knows better than this. He's not some guy like fulla who might or might now know how to play the game.
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On June 30 2012 09:55 strongandbig wrote:
Hey Marv
What do you think of Gonzaw and Greymist?
Haven't seen marv in 3 days 
The only post he did is that one when he said "I don't have a clue what's going on" and that's it. So much for my not talking training.
I guess it's kinda hard to do something when you don't know the game and everybody keeps talking about the mechanics of this game.
also
##I'm attacking Greymist
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wtf happened? oO
Is this supposed to be some wifom because they couldn't kill gonzaw and didn't want to attack me / Nova because that'd confirm me or because it would confirm nova (either way lol)? I can't think of this being effective unless we screw up big time. I'd say either way, this is supposed to confuse us SOMEHOW.
Therefore I'd say we don't talk / think about that at all. Surely mafia wants us to talk / think about it for some reason. We're given a free circle. Let's use that circle without even getting into wifom.
If someone else already said something like that sorry. I'm just now catching up. Also I have to kill one of my monsters... I'm still not drawing lands and if I kill one I can draw to more cards.
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On July 01 2012 08:56 Fulla wrote:
I'm willing to just drop it. But I'm really looking at the people who weren't active past 24 hours.
How does the mafia attack work?
Do both players need to agree? Or or is only one designated at the controller? That person but pm you?G
usually it's "one of mafia has to PM a host" and it's enough. At least that's how KP in normal games work, you don't need to get to the same conclusion as mafia. So even if they would argue and have different opinions on their target they would have send in something and that way someone would have get shot. Probably Artanis would have made some call to decide it like "whoever pm'ed me first get's to make the decision" but as we don't have KP noone pm'ed something at all. Either Mafia is retarded and forgot about it although they had full 24hours or they did that on purpose to confuse us.
Either way we don't get something out of it because if they forgot about it that's a nulltell (could be something like "duuuude. I thought you send the kill in like you did last night"). Or they did it on purpose and want us to talk about it. Therefore I'd say we drop it and be happy about it.
I have two different explanations for it as well but it's feeling incredible paranoid at this time and as mentioned I don't think it's wise to talk wifom when there's roughly a 50% chance they want us to talk wifom in the first place.
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Can i haz my 2 cards before I go to bed? I just destroyed my own myr in the hope to finally draw something usefull...
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I'm about to sacrifice my spellbomb out of furstration to draw another card...
I'm having another anti-rogue 8/8-trample-thingie-card on my hand in case I get another land and we have the spellbomb from gonzaw. Thoughts?... I can't really do shit if I stay on 3 lands nonstop.
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EBWOP
Sorry... was about to do a couple of PM's for SSB mafia :p
Quoting this for the sake of having everything in the same filter.
On July 01 2012 09:35 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 09:18 Oberyn wrote:On July 01 2012 09:13 WereBugs-Go wrote:
I'm about to sacrifice my spellbomb out of furstration to draw another card...
I'm having another anti-rogue 8/8-trample-thingie-card on my hand in case I get another land and we have the spellbomb from gonzaw. Thoughts?... I can't really do shit if I stay on 3 lands nonstop.
Wait don't do anything yet. What's that card you have? I don't really want you to sacrifice the "anti-rogue 8/8-trample-thingie-card" just now, in case Nova is actually scum. yeah that's the thing I'm considering right now... I've got 2 more explanations as well, while one of them is pretty unlikely. 1) You are mafia. However I think mafia (including you in this case) would have shot nova in that case anyways and said something like "well they probably didn't shoot me [Obe] to kill me [Obe] in one hit the next cycle" (8+12 dmg rather than 8+10). Unless of course they want us to wifom. That's the one that I consider the most unlikely of all the explanations I can think of, although it's possible because frankly I don't think mafia would waste a hit like that when we'll still consider you scummy if you survive tomorrow. 2) It's a weird attempt to cause wifom to safe Greymist somehow like "see they didn't shoot WBG / Obe / Nova, there's GOT to be a mafia in there" The problem here is as mentioned if they simply forgot it there is no info to be found anyways. If they did that on purpose they want us to discuss it for some reason but there's a lot of possible explanations. Some of those explanations would be acts of desperation (saving Greymist), some would mean they were not able to shoot into Nova / me because they feared that would give away information (shooting me when nova is the guy with an 8/8 trample thingie for example) and therefore makes one of our townreads mafia and some are just complete random.
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I didn't even put in Skullclamp in my deck. Artanis put it in there lol.
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Re and stop with this clusterfuck. The mafia not shooting was supposed to confuse us, as I already mentionend at least 3 times...
The only purpose of that was to cast doubt on us and therefore start the "maybe we should lynch someone else/someone else first" discussion. I'm going to attack Greymist this turn and I hope people do the same. The worst we can do is change everything we've got, because although we don't know why exactly mafia did not shoot we can be sure they did it for some reason. Therefore I'm not letting it influence me and I'll just do what I was going to do before that happened => attacking Greymist. Once he flipped red we can talk about what scenario makes sense and who could be the 2nd mafia.
If we have a guy or two who are most likely going to flip mafia and a shitton of other possible solutions for the 2nd mafia we "lynch" into the guy we're sure on, not the 2nd guy that might be mafia because it makes sense considering the connections between those two if the first is mafia. We're not lynching for "connections" unless we have a flip. It's simple as that.
Again Greymist, Kita and I are the vets in this game.
Lynching Grey makes sense from a mafia-Balance point of view.
Lynching Grey makes sense from a MTG-Balance point of view.
Lynching Grey makes sense from a "what happened in this game" point of view.
So even if you don't think he's more scummy than people like Zealos or Matt or whoever else this should be something to consider. If a guy like Grey is considered to be equally scummy like a guy like Zealos that's way more telling for Grey because he knows how to play the game and shouldn't be considered scummy in the first place unless of course there is a reason to appear scummy (like being scum for example?)
We're not lynching for stupid behavior unless we know the guy is smart. Greymist is smart and he's behaving completly anti-town. Now don't give me that "well would a mafia do that? I don't think so" shit because yeah a mafia would / could do that as well as a last resort of a defence and Greymist was under a lot of pressure from the very beginning. It started with a little pressure, reaction fishing and stuff from me d1 to see what's going to happen and to finally start a conversation but his answeres were so bad other people realized that as well, even before I started explaining what I did on d2.
Again, Greymist knows how to play mafia and he knows how to play MTG (apparently), yet he's the one guy that refused to do something at all. Sure Fulla and Zealos for example did the very same but as mentioned (I'm quoting myself here):We're not lynching for stupid behavior unless we know the guy is smart. and I can't be sure wether or not Fulla and Zealos are smart and know how to play mafia at all.
Greymist does know how to play the game and he completly refuses to do so.
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On July 01 2012 21:33 Nova_Terra wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2012 19:27 Oberyn wrote:On July 01 2012 19:23 Nova_Terra wrote:On July 01 2012 05:03 GreYMisT wrote:
The scum in this game are strongandbig/Matthew. Go ahead and kill me for the following reasons.
1. So you guys stop wasting time and energy
2. So you can get a reality check into your system and catch actual scum
3. So I get to see gonzaw wrong
You sir are the new Risk.Nuke. Well done.
On a non mafia note I am ashamed that my brother was introduced through this game and your spam. I'm starting to agree with this ( the part about s&b and mattchew) You know....I like that. People posting what they think of the thread "as they go by reading it" makes it very transparent of them. If they just said "okay I'll read the thread", then wait a couple of hours before posting their thoughts, then if they were scum they could easily read the whole thread, capture all the events that happened, and think what the best response would be based on that (taking everything into account). If they had to post "as they read it", then they take away that ability, and they may fuck up by saying something and then realizing they should have said something else; meaning they would most likely not do that at all...which means that the people that do it are more likely town. So Nova, keep doing that to see your thought process (specially when the juicy stuff comes). I realize you are not reading this (and reading the thread instead) so whatever. However props to you for doing that, it makes me feel better about you for now (and that the whole no-night-kill was staged) Show nested quote +On June 28 2012 15:17 Nova_Terra wrote:
Also I thing sitting back and thinking about opinions is bullshit truthfully, opinions and thoughts should be stated as soon as they are thought of, they should be raw and unrefined and can be explained later. That's more chances for scum to slip up and townieness to shine. I still don't think that shitting up the threa is a bad thing unless there is endless filler. Also zealos is town, no way he woulda told us to move past the night kill first as scum (at least if I'm town)
Are you talking about that post over here from page 47:On July 01 2012 10:48 Zealos wrote:
I'm really inclined to say ignore the non-shot and continue as normal. Presuming the missing shot was deliberate, it was designed to cause chaos. Lets not let it.
Because I did this post on page 46:On July 01 2012 08:51 WereBugs-Go wrote:
wtf happened? oO
Is this supposed to be some wifom because they couldn't kill gonzaw and didn't want to attack me / Nova because that'd confirm me or because it would confirm nova (either way lol)? I can't think of this being effective unless we screw up big time. I'd say either way, this is supposed to confuse us SOMEHOW.
Therefore I'd say we don't talk / think about that at all. Surely mafia wants us to talk / think about it for some reason. We're given a free circle. Let's use that circle without even getting into wifom.
If someone else already said something like that sorry. I'm just now catching up. Also I have to kill one of my monsters... I'm still not drawing lands and if I kill one I can draw to more cards.
Does your "I guess that confirms Zealos" argument still hold anything of value?
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On July 01 2012 22:04 Fulla wrote:
@Were I am actually experienced in mafia and would say I'm good. That's up to you to decide ofcourse
Forum based is very to me thou. I can barely keep up with the amount obe posts let alone everyone else. When you play it online in real time it becomes 90% trolling and laying low to stay alive. I'm trying to adapt and speak more. Bare with me :-)
did you try to stay low to stay alive? That sounds like a mafia strategy in real time mafia and you're trying to change that?
Or is it a general strategy that townies do as well? oO
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On July 02 2012 00:05 Nova_Terra wrote:
Guys i can play giant growth as well as my rootwallas ability, Should i cast it on Oberyns avatar so nobody goes OMFG NOVA SO STRONK?
I don't know, you tell me.
Obe is the guy who is telling people that you're mafia and from what I see he'd rather attack you than Greymist. And you want to buff him?
Don't forget the global card this turn: Noone can block, so the trample is completly wayne because even if you boost a 1/1 creature that creature will do it's dmg this turn and will do it's +dmg from your giants growth as obes 8/8 creature would do.
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Also here's another thing. Yeah I said I don't want us to talk about this no-shot but I really think it was weird for the purpose of being weird.
This shot is troublesome for the Nova, Obe and myself as we're doubting our townreads because we're asking ourselfes "why didn't they shoot at least one of Nova+WBG" and I think that's the purpose of this no-shot. I'm talking about this because of Obe's case on Nova. I think it is somewhat weak, Nova might or might not end up being mafia but I think this only started because of the no-shot, so here we go:
- Let's assume I am modconfirmed town for a second, I think obe is town and I got a slight townread on nova. That's what I said the most recent cycle. What does that mean for me? Surely Obe didn't get shot because they want to kill him with a 2nd hit instead of leaving him alive with 2HP. But why didn't they shoot me? Probably because that would have made Nova look bad because they didn't shoot him although he has a 8/8 trample thingie. So from my point of view this no-shot should trigger a "wtf, I was wrong on Nova and he's actually mafia" reaction.
- Same goes the other way arround. Let's assume I am nova, I am a modconfirmed town, I think obe is town and I got a slight townread on WBG. Pretty sure he said something like that as well. It's a slightly different situation because shooting me could make sense from his point of view because I'm a Toad+Marv hydra and that's scary as well but a no-shot should instantly trigger the same "wtf, I was wrong on WBG and he's actually mafia" reaction if he's town.
- And if Obe is town having a townread on Nova and myself, it should trigger a "wtf, either WBG or Nova has to be mafia, there's no other reason for not shooting into one of them" and frankly he just said he thinks very strongly that Nova is mafia yesterday after that shot.
Those conclusions are logical and they should come to my / Novas / Gonzaws mind instantly. I can see Obe thought of it as he clearly thinks Nova is mafia right now. I know I thought about it as well but didn't mention it because I didn't want to start the wifom-talk and Nova either was as smart as I am or he didn't realize it.
Funny thing is: It's again a reason to attack Greymist. This no-shot does nothing but casting doubt between us 3 while it has nothing to do with Greymist. It pushes us into thinking "well that means this guy HAS to be mafia" and I think that's what's going on. If Greymist somehow magically flips town, fine we can talk about this and one of us 3 has to be mafia but right now I'd say mafia did something unlogically (not shooting) to push us into trying to figure out what could be the most logical solution to this problem, thus defending Greymist by mislynching into one of our townreads because of that no-shot.
This is all way to convenient to be true. There is a shitton of "information" we could get from that no-shot but only one explanation can be true. A lot of it is stuff like "well that guy has to be mafia then I guess" but I can't think of a scenario that involves Greymist. We're killing Greymist today and killing the 2nd mafia tomorrow. If Greymist somehow really flips town we're searching for mafia in Nov, Obe or myself but if Grey is really mafia the other 3 names are all town.
That's it from me for a while. On my way to my place again and probably won't post something for the next 16 hours or something like that. Have to start SSB mafia later when I'm back (24:00 my time) and I won't have time to post in here between starting that game and sleeping I guess.
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Hallo, marv here. As you may have noticed I've been pretty absent. I didn't quite realise how heavy the Magic stuff was gonna be and despite trying pretty hard to keep track of what was what I just got more lost. So I've basically left it to Toad, and Toad is pretty awesome so you're in good hands.
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On July 02 2012 01:25 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 01:00 WereBugs-Go wrote:Also here's another thing. Yeah I said I don't want us to talk about this no-shot but I really think it was weird for the purpose of being weird. This shot is troublesome for the Nova, Obe and myself as we're doubting our townreads because we're asking ourselfes "why didn't they shoot at least one of Nova+WBG" and I think that's the purpose of this no-shot. I'm talking about this because of Obe's case on Nova. I think it is somewhat weak, Nova might or might not end up being mafia but I think this only started because of the no-shot, so here we go: - Let's assume I am modconfirmed town for a second, I think obe is town and I got a slight townread on nova. That's what I said the most recent cycle. What does that mean for me? Surely Obe didn't get shot because they want to kill him with a 2nd hit instead of leaving him alive with 2HP. But why didn't they shoot me? Probably because that would have made Nova look bad because they didn't shoot him although he has a 8/8 trample thingie. So from my point of view this no-shot should trigger a "wtf, I was wrong on Nova and he's actually mafia" reaction.
- Same goes the other way arround. Let's assume I am nova, I am a modconfirmed town, I think obe is town and I got a slight townread on WBG. Pretty sure he said something like that as well. It's a slightly different situation because shooting me could make sense from his point of view because I'm a Toad+Marv hydra and that's scary as well but a no-shot should instantly trigger the same "wtf, I was wrong on WBG and he's actually mafia" reaction if he's town.
- And if Obe is town having a townread on Nova and myself, it should trigger a "wtf, either WBG or Nova has to be mafia, there's no other reason for not shooting into one of them" and frankly he just said he thinks very strongly that Nova is mafia yesterday after that shot.
Those conclusions are logical and they should come to my / Novas / Gonzaws mind instantly. I can see Obe thought of it as he clearly thinks Nova is mafia right now. I know I thought about it as well but didn't mention it because I didn't want to start the wifom-talk and Nova either was as smart as I am or he didn't realize it. Funny thing is: It's again a reason to attack Greymist. This no-shot does nothing but casting doubt between us 3 while it has nothing to do with Greymist. It pushes us into thinking "well that means this guy HAS to be mafia" and I think that's what's going on. If Greymist somehow magically flips town, fine we can talk about this and one of us 3 has to be mafia but right now I'd say mafia did something unlogically (not shooting) to push us into trying to figure out what could be the most logical solution to this problem, thus defending Greymist by mislynching into one of our townreads because of that no-shot. This is all way to convenient to be true. There is a shitton of "information" we could get from that no-shot but only one explanation can be true. A lot of it is stuff like "well that guy has to be mafia then I guess" but I can't think of a scenario that involves Greymist. We're killing Greymist today and killing the 2nd mafia tomorrow. If Greymist somehow really flips town we're searching for mafia in Nov, Obe or myself but if Grey is really mafia the other 3 names are all town. That's it from me for a while. On my way to my place again and probably won't post something for the next 16 hours or something like that. Have to start SSB mafia later when I'm back (24:00 my time) and I won't have time to post in here between starting that game and sleeping I guess. Two things: 1. why couldn't mafia have thrown around the same amount of doubt by attacking a lurker or someone under suspicion? 2. It doesn't seem like Nova came to that same conclusion. Under your analysis what does that mean?
They could have, but not shooting at all is a stronger "wtf just happened"-moment than shooting someone town didn't think would end up being shot.
On July 02 2012 02:38 Nova_Terra wrote:
WBG why do you come to the conclusion that if grey flips town one of me you or obe is scum?
If Greymist ends up flipping town I doubt they would have not shot unless of course they really forgot about it. So far I'm sticking with: "As long as I think Grey is mafia and don't have something that tells me otherwise I'm pretty sure they tried to cast doubt."
If Grey is SOMEHOW a townie there is no reason not to shoot into either you or me unless one of us is mafia and mafia doesn't want to tell us which one of us is mafia. Picture the following situation:
Obe dead and confirmed town by that point, Greymist dead and confirmed town, I got shot by mafia or am already dead because of mafia and confirmed town. What might that mean about you? You're looking bad, because mafia tried not to shoot me.
Same goes the other way around.
I don't think it's going to come to that situation because I'm pretty sure Greymist is mafia but I still thought about it.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=207912&type=card)
