EPTYou forget, what is dead cannot die!
Hopefully I won't die so fast this time :/
Bastard Mafia 2
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
You forget, what is dead cannot die! Hopefully I won't die so fast this time :/ | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 11 2012 04:47 FourFace wrote: /in be afraid, be very afraid ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/flmSl.png) | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
A mother hen, days after Easter, finds some Peeps in the compost heap at the farm. Convinced that her lifetime of devoted, loving care for her eggs - only to have each of what she's convinced were her children taken from her before they could return her love - were at last rewarded, she brings them back to the nest. The next morning she wakes to find the yellow, gooey remnants of her melted offspring coating her chest. As she jumps in front of the tractor later that day, she shouts, "I'm sorry I was a bad mother!" The end, no moral. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
There very well could be a "planar" dragon. Also more people sign up for this!! | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I'd like to re-propose my earlier policy lynch. Having Drazerk in this game is like having ace in a normal game, he's way more powerful of a threat than its worth when he's town. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
FWIW, I don't think the "posting parts of your pm from the mods" rule is relevant here at all. AFAIK that rule was put in place to stop people from breaking games by comparing specific wording of PMs, it definitely doesn't outlaw roleclaiming at all. That said, if the hosts think it would break the setup then that's too bad, but we can't do it. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I'm with fourface - it seems a little bit suspicious to me that you would try to say "yeah I didn't post it that other game because I was scum but this game I'm town so go me." If you actually played that way, you would be giving yourself away every time you decide not to post that same thing, everyone will think you're scum. I think you're smart enough to know this. Therefore, there must be some times when you are scum but post that same little thing. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 04:28 Drazerk wrote: so we can play a normal game trollolololol | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 04:46 Drazerk wrote: Also I feel this is needed If you join House Chezinu I will policy lynch you that is all What about self-declared allies of house chezinu? Like KB and Nisani? Also, AFAIK this application process is private, so how would you know that people have joined the Chezinu faction? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Also hey Marv. I was gonna invite you to our Noob 6 reunion here but sending PMs on a phone is hard. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 06:53 Drazerk wrote: Also I don't plan on surviving the night but to die as a martyr to my cause If there's one thing I've learned from Holy Roman mafia, it's that this is a dangerous claim to make. I'm 100% serious right now, guys. Drazerk claimed repeatedly in HR mafia that he was going to die soon because Caller would modkill him or whatever. We let him slide out of being a subject of scrutiny because he said he only would be in the game for a limited amount of time. Drazerk, if your only reason to believe that you will die soon is "that you are right about who is scum so scum will shoot you", then if you don't get us some scum soon you will be killed. If you have some other reason to say that you will die soon, then be explicit about it. But we let you get away with this before. You're not slithering out this time. (btw if there's a second thing I learned from holy roman mafia, it's that no one should make Acrofales the king.) | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 07:31 Acrofales wrote: Yeah, insofar as I can figure out, killing the MA would be a bad thing for town. I have no clue what he or the king are supposed to do. I am not going to discuss this further at night either. In fact, I'm going to bed. I kind of get not wanting to talk about this at night, but for when you get back - why do you say this? What makes you think the monarchist is town aligned? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 14:27 BioSC wrote: Do you have a link/proof? For those of us bastards not in the loop? Not doubting you, just want as much info as possible. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=14201741 and also http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=11960700 So older ppl can definitely correct me, but as far as I can tell "house chezinu" was originally an imaginary scum faction that was invented by WBG or someone in PYP: interesting. I think he recruited people into their QT and then they infiltrated the other scum factions. It's pretty confusing and I'm too tired to figure out exactly what happened. Then "house chezinu" was used as an external town faction in Aperture mafia, where they had a QT which they used productively to confirm each other as town. So this could be nonsense, but I expect that the Chezinu QT this time around has both scum and town in it. Or at least, we can't rule out the possibility. We should look carefully at people who either want to stifle discussion of Chezinu, or who claim not to be affiliated with it but seem to know too much about it. I don't see townies would want to keep it secret, but scum could conceivably want to use it to become "confirmed" to the townies in it. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 22:47 Drazerk wrote: You're aware the mason circle in aperture was a cult right? However, house chezinu was not a cult. I don't see why you're so worried about this being a cult. Announcing their existence publicly would make no sense whatsoever, IMO. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 17 2012 14:05 EchelonTee wrote: Hey guys. Vanilla Townie here. ET, you said you're not sending your alignment anywhere - is this claim a lie then? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 00:21 EchelonTee wrote: Probably, HiroPro is going to continue trolling and not give useful info, or come out and say "oh that was all a fake just to see how people would react". Really though, if there ends up being a super elaborate House Chezinu thing, then unless it literally changes my alignment, I can't think of that many possibilities where it's bad if I "join". Only things that come to mind are maybe somehow control my vote, Drazerk suggested something about "they recruit you to cult but don't change alignment", which I don't get, stuff like that, but this is all just idle speculation lol. Talismania, where are you? I need more sanity plox You think Hiro's been playing games with us? That would be pretty unfortunate. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:22 FourFace wrote: Ohh we got a voting thread Hope I live to use it. MEDICS SAVEE MEEEE!!! What an odd thing to say. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:23 Drazerk wrote: Why are we all asking for medic saves? You guys suck lol I would ask for a medic save too if it made them less likely to protect you :p But in all seriousness, fourface what reason do you have to believe you would be the target of a shot? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 10:40 xsksc wrote: Umm, no, Nisani. Point 3 in a nutshell is his "live and let live" attitude, considering he knows nothing about their alignment, looks very 3rd party-esque. Being diplomatic is one thing, deciding to not play against or even discuss them on n0 is another matter. That's a pretty good way to put it, IMO. It's not a town attitude. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
However, I also don't see how posting cases and getting more information out in the thread can be a bad thing, so here's my case on Drazerk. On June 17 2012 04:28 Drazerk wrote: From this point on I am now ignoring any post that has anything to do with House Chezinu I advice everyone else does the same so we can play a normal game I see this as an attempt to shut down discussion. More information is good for Town; why in the world would it be a good idea to not talk about something like Chezinu? Note that Drazerk doesn't attempt to re-channel discussion in a way that would help the town. It seems like people are generally in agreement that Hiro's gambit was a good way to generate town discussion on N0. Drazerk was generally the anti-Hiro in this story. On June 17 2012 06:28 Drazerk wrote: I believe there is no scum team more on this idea never That's what the scum team wants us to think. They would like to hide in the fact that there was no scum team in the last bastard game, but there's no reason to believe that there isn't a scum team this game - and it may be dangerous to do so. And then there's like a jillion posts about the whole "cult" thing. There was never any reason to believe that Chezinu is a cult, but Drazerk really strongly clings to this idea. So this all fits into a scum agenda. At first, they want everyone to ignore the chezinu house, because they want to get a member into it and use it to influence people. Then when it becomes the subject of discussion anyway, they move to trying to discredit it by asserting it's scum. Finally, just look at Drazerk's filter. It's four freaking pages of content-less one-line posts. He's not taking anything seriously enough to do anything other than assert his opinion on it. That doesn't smell like town to me. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 15:06 Drazerk wrote: S+B how is that a real case? you're using evidence we know now to incriminate past beliefs which seems pretty questionable to me but i'll give you a break as my play style leads to myself being an easy band wagon the same way kenpachi is. Also with Talismania forcing everyone to make a case except himself its bad cases like this that need to be looked at and questioned as I just got a huge third party vibe from S+B who just wants to survive. The only new information we gained is that you are wrong about the cult thing. That's not at all the center point of my case. Trying to shut down discussion is like the main mafia agenda bro. You were trying to get people to stop talking about chezinu before we had any idea whether it was pro town or not. And seriously? You're saying you're like Kenpachi? Drazerk, you're not kenpachi. He gets away with posting trolling and content less one-liners because it's all he ever does and he doesn't give a fuck about the game most of the time. You are capable of being much more helpful than that. Plus, you actually care about the game. What I see from you this game is a pattern of trying to avoid being the subject of scrutiny. "I'm going to die soon" "I'm going on a tunnelling spree against this chezinu thing trololo" "I'm an easy bandwagon because I play like kenpachi" "Ignore Me!!!" If you really are town, then stop trying to play like Kenpachi. Your response to my case makes me think you are even scummier, with the "I'm an easy bandwagon like kenpachi" thing, but at least the post itself was more than one line and contained some actual reasoning. Post more like that, except not scummy. and as for your third party accusation, that also fits into the pattern of slipperiness. Just because in the last game there was a lot of third party, it makes "your case is bad, you must be third party" an easy thing to throw around. The fact that you're trying to switch focus from your alignment to mine does not make you look any better. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 02:32 Acrofales wrote: Why do you think S&B is 3P? Why is BioSC scum? Why do you think FF made a case on ET if they are scum together? Early D1 bus? Or are you trying to say either one could be scum and you don't know which? He thinks I'm third party because he doesn't agree with my case against him, as far as I can tell. And also because I went along with Talismania's attempt to get people to post cases? Anyway not for any good reason. Oh and Drazerk, I disagree when you say "town fuck up, scum don't." Scum fuck up. That's why so many TL scum have been uber-lurking lately. If we don't make it uncomfortable for them, then they'll get away with it this time too. Anyway even if they don't fuck up, getting them to talk is the only way we can figure out who is pushing the scum agenda. (hint it's you) | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
You could be earning yourself a ban for actively playing against your win condition and you wouldn't even know about it. I really hope you're lying right now. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 03:01 Drazerk wrote: I can only be playing as town If I am scum it helps me survive and become more pro town If I am third party it helps me survive and become more pro town What if your role is "keep target player alive" and you lead his lynch? What if you're a lyncher and you defend your target? For someone who keeps saying "we need to consider all the scenarios" you seem to have considered none of the scenarios. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I think you're lying, because if you're not then you really do deserve a ban. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Either way, since he's willing to do it publicly and take the consequences, I suggest you go for it. Also Talismania. Why am I on your shooting candidates list? You said earlier that I was a "risky shot", meaning (I think) that you're not sure what your read is on me. As far as I can tell there has not yet been a case presented against me. A few people have posted comments that they "think I'm third party" or that my case against Drazerk looks "forced." Well I'm not, and I genuinely believe that Drazerk's play so far has been anti-town. If people disagree with my case, then fine, but I've pointed out specific posts where Drazerk is attempting to promote a scum agenda and to get out of the spotlight. If you're going to shoot me, I ask that you at least post a case on me or give me some chance to defend myself or show that I'm town. Like, seriously I have no clue right now why I'm on your shooting list. Other than Drazerk, who is basically omgus'ing me because I'm pushing him, I haven't seen anyone say why I'm scum. And let me answer Drazerk's specific point while I'm at it - no, I am not a third party assassin or whatever. I was trying to think of situations where you can play towny, survive until the end of the game, and not win. Plus - you have not answered my point! Those were perfectly valid examples of cases where playing "as normal town" and not reading your role PM would be playing directly counter to your win condition. Last, I continue to insist that the only reason you think I'm third party is because I'm attacking you, but your play this game has shown a blatant disregard for trying to help the town. Honestly, do you not see the fact that you have to get killed before lylo for the town to win as a sign of shitty town play? The first priority for townies should be to establish their own innocence by playing pro-town. Not to troll so much that they can get away with it as scum by having a "consistent meta." | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I think Decon is town, since he was willing to use his power if Talismania had said what he said originally. So either: Talismania is town, Drazerk is not town, or both of those things. Unfortunately, neither of Drazerk and Talismania is really confirmed until the other one dies. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 07:12 talismania wrote: Strongandbig you were on there for no other reason than what I posted in my impressions list. I also wanted to see if anyone reacted but no one did (I had to force reactions out of people). You ARE a risky shot because if you're town then I'd be shooting a productive townie. Talk to me a bit about some of the other candidates that have come up for lynch discussion. Who do you think is scummy besides drazerk? Etc. Don't worry I'll publicly say who I'm going to shoot before I do it and give them time to respond. Well, Maju's filter is pretty tiny and mostly filled with Chezinu discussion. I don't necessarily find that too scummy; in a weird setup like this there's a chance that figuring it out can help town. What I do find scummy in his filter is that he posts so much less after the "safe" topic of Chezinu is taken off the table. Also, being worried that town powers are imba is a small scum tell imo - townies wouldn't worry about that because they have no idea what powers scum has, but scum knows what powers they are and is going to compare them to the powers they think town has, and may complain if they think town is OP. Maju did that when Decon claimed his role. Fourface has a shitty troll filter like Drazerk. The difference is, I know Drazerk is smart and can really play this game, which is why I'm hounding him and expecting more from him. Someone already pointed this out, but it does look pretty hypocritical that fourface attacked ET for posting a lot about setup when he did the exact same thing himself. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 07:32 Drazerk wrote: You gotta admit I'd be insane to come forward and do that if I had read my role PM and it said scum  Seriously man, all gaming aside - you earned a lot of respect from me for your play in holy roman mafia, but if you really did not read your role PM and proceeded to play most of a cycle of this game, that respect is all gone. To me that's the ultimate statement of "I don't give a fuck about this game, I just like spamming shit and annoying people on the internet." | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 07:34 deconduo wrote: As I said I'm pretty sure all 3 of us are town, assuming talis actually uses his shot before we all die of old age. There is a good chance all three are town. However - none of you are 100% confirmed, which you could be. I was just thinking about this again. Look at it using logic. If one of the statements is false, then knowing that the overall statement is false, gives us literally no information about the other two statements. Based on the way you all acted around the time of the statement, I think you are town. However, either Talismania or Drazerk could be scum. Look at their actions: - Drazerk was being a troll and a moron, and hadn't read his PM apparently. Therefore, his actions give us no information about his alignment. - Talismania wouldn't just post the thing you wanted him to, even though it was painfully obvious what was going on. Other than that, I think Talismania is probably town, but he or Drazerk could still be scum. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 07:41 deconduo wrote: If you think we learned nothing you really need to learn how to play mafia. We learned something decon, but that was not the best way to use that power. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I don't even know why you bother talking about "meta" at all, with the ridiculous amount you post it's basically impossible to find any earlier games from you through the TL search. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 08:46 Drazerk wrote: Hmmm What if we are all town? Then we would have won already | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I went to get dinner. I would prefer that you shoot Maju, but it's a very weak preference. Both of them have been focusing mostly on things other than scumhunting, and each made one "case" or "pressure" (maju on ET, KB on BioSC). Really the main thing differentiating them right now is that Maju was thinking about game balance from a scum point of view, which I generally see as a weak scum tell. My phone is out of batteries, so it'll be a while until I can post again - I'm leaving the lab and heading home now. Just in case you wanted to ask any more questions. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 19 2012 10:03 EchelonTee wrote: Yeah, sorry for the outburst. Just happy. I know I called you scum or something like that once, but I'm not very interested in you atm. We should look at people who soft defended Maju, but the fact that he only has one(?) partner means it might not be easy to find an easy connection. There was 1KP last night and it was never accounted for. If you're town, it'd probably be best to claim it so we have pertinent information; since no one claimed, I am going to currently assume that a neutral or another anti-town faction was shot. His PM says they don't get KP on night 0. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
The extra win loss thing seems pretty persuasive that nisani isn't maju's partner. It seems like we have a decent chance to take out an entire scum team day 1 so I'm gonna be voting based on who might be maju's partner. Right now that looks to be most likely xk or dropbear. Between the two of them I'm voting for dropbear, both look scummy but I don't think scum would be openly defending each other yet. ##vote: dropbear | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
You're from the UK so I'll put it this way: my chthonic deities, my vast nibbling niebelung will nibble on you yet! | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Does anyone want to do some looking into deopbear's past games? For some people this kind of outburst is townie, for other people it's null, but I'm at work and don't really have time to heck that out. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Read the thread We want nisani to die if he's telling the truth we don't want a bulletproof townie to take the claim And why the fuck would you claim now before your sanity is confirmed.... | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 20 2012 03:06 talismania wrote: Uh. How does vengeful townie work again? I was under the impression that dropbear was supposed to die. Or else a vote manipulation power was employed. The night post seems pretty clear that the king decided the lunch. My guess would be that our votes don't matter until the monarchist activist dies? Anyway maybe the ex-king will enlighten us? Unless there's some reason not to claim or whatever. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 20 2012 04:41 talismania wrote: Oh shit I just realized what you probably are. You talking about Nisani? Seriously? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
This is pending a response to my question above. If the answer is "his vote was too late" then I'm wrong. If there is no answer then I think I'm right. I also think fourface gets informed who the king is each day, and knows kb was the king and that's why he keeps insisting that the king dies, which is retarded. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 20 2012 05:28 strongandbig wrote: on the final vote count it says KB was still voting for Nisani. Why did his vote change not count? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 20 2012 08:55 Zephirdd wrote: My mistake. Take is as if he had voted for himself in the end. Yeah so I think I'm right. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 21 2012 01:23 talismania wrote: Ok a note on the king/setup business. If KB was king, he knew he was king. There can't have been any of this "he didn't know he was king" stuff because his role PM outright says that he gets told who the king is. My new theory is that the king's vote doesn't outright determine the vote, but the king gets to choose whose vote does. In this world, the king was cool with getting rid of dropbear and saw that kb was definitely going to vote for him, therefore he picked KB. Then at the last minute KB tried to get nisani killed with the switch onto himself (KB probably figured nisani for the MA and was trying to meet his wincon, it's really the only explanation for that switch) but ended up dying. _____________ @Drazerk I am powerless now but I still would be a decent night kill because I'm not getting lynched anytime soon and I'm driving a lot of discussion. ______________ BioSC you look hilariously scummy. _______________ @ghost... what? I kinda believed his claim since the part about hiropro made complete sense given how paranoid fourface was about hiro at the beginning of D1. What are you? Good point on his role PM, I didn't notice that. That could be a correct explanation of how the king works. I would say its too convoluted, but so far everything points towards "more convoluted than the last bastard mafia" as the driving theme for this game. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 21 2012 04:17 DropBear wrote: This is post from strongandbig is a huge bandwagon. No reason, just that oh hey that guy seems to be getting votes I'll jump on him. He was talking up Drazerk as his big target then all of a sudden switches to me. Look how much he talks about how he doesn't trust Drazerk. Now all of a sudden he votes for me? No reasoning given whatsoever. This is dodgy as all hell and I have a huge FoS on him right now. Other than his short case on Drazerk he hasn't really said much at all and bandwagoned very blatantly. I still think Nisani should die as well. I've been over this. Voting Nisani. I would also get behind a strongandbig lynch if it came to it. I also propose that we completely ignore Acrofales from now on. He has been blindly tunnelling me, a townie, plus he just shot a detective. Well played sir. Lol bro. Omgus much? At that time, I was looking to vote for maju's partner and I didn't think it was nisani. Nisani had the most votes so I had to vote for someone else with votes - either you or xkscxc. As I explained in the post I quoted, I think it's more likely to be you than xk. You shouldn't just always vote for your number one scum read if it's not a realistic lynch possibility. That just lets scum more easily coordinate the vote. Plus you're conveniently ignoring the fact that Drazerk got magic mod-ghost town cred between my case on him and the time I voted. No, I don't think he is confirmed, but it makes me at least uncertain about him. Oh yeah also I still don't believe your roleclaim. Care to reconsider? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 00:51 Drazerk wrote: Also S+B I disagree one of you needs to die What, to confirm that there's not a third scum team in the game, with zero KP? Lol, Drazerk u scummy bastard. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Since it makes no sense whatsoever that we would be scum, we must be telling the truth. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 18 2012 02:23 strongandbig wrote: You think Hiro's been playing games with us? That would be pretty unfortunate. Yugioh is the "King of Games." My next post in the thread indicated that this was a breadcrumb: I quoted fourface, but you should agree that what he was saying was more stupid than "odd." What was "odd" was what I said, because it was a breadcrumb. Then here's where I breadcrumbed my own role name: On June 19 2012 21:38 strongandbig wrote: Oh and Drazerk you may have everyone else fooled, but not me! You're from the UK so I'll put it this way: my chthonic deities, my vast nibbling niebelung will nibble on you yet! Chthonic deities are underground god-like or demon-like creatures of immense power. Specifically, in this case, a Balrog. The reference was to a quote from the mayor of London, who is a British Conservative. This is a Bread Crumb. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 02:07 Drazerk wrote: Scum make gambits I do it all the time... What I mean is it doesn't make sense for us to be scum in terms simply of game mechanics; there haven't been enough KP. First, 3 repeating nightly scum KP in a 15 player game would be ridiculous. There might be another third party with one-time KP, but the game would go way too fast if scum could kill a third of the town every night. Second, there was only one scum KP last night, plus Acro's claimed vig shot. Third, why the fuck would Hiro organize a massclaim for us to claim to be linked, if we were scum? There was no need to do so, except to try and help catch more scum. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 02:07 Drazerk wrote: Scum make gambits I do it all the time... Whatever, you're just pissed that I was tunneling you and attacking you for not reading your role PM. If you had a "third-party" read on me (never actually saying you thought I was scum), and you had a town read on Hiro, then why in the world would you suddenly want to waste a day cycle and lynch one of us? Other than just being a dick to us? I actually want town to win and I've been trying to help you guys out, because like Ghost said the faster the game ends the more likely I am to stay alive. Do you really think it's more important to be a dick to me, rather than lynch Nisani, who refuses to cooperate with town, or DropBear, who almost certainly made up his roleclaim (don't forget, he claimed that his role was "green" not "blue", despite having a power), or anyone else who actually might be the other part of the scum team that we actually know exists? Ugh, Drazerk... sigh. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 02:53 talismania wrote: One small point, if we do lynch (hell if we even have the power to lynch) DropBear at some point, one of the strongandbig/hiropro should be the last vote on him. If he's telling the truth I don't want to accidentally lose two town players and be in a weird situation where the third parties get to decide which team wins. Preeeeeetty sure that would be us playing against our win condition. Drazerk: you said above tha part of the point of lynching one of us was to get scum to shoot the other one, since we would be confirmed non town. If one of us gets lynched we are relying on scum to decide not to shoot us, so no I am not okay with us. And I will say one more time - there is zero chance of us pulling some kind of gambit! Like, what would a scum team with no KP do? Here how about this - if the game doesn't end when we find maju's partner then I'm okay with you lynching me or hiro. But right now we have mod confirmation that there is a scum out there with a KP from Maju's flip. There is literally zero chance that hiro or I are on maju's team, since he only had one partner and we have proven that we are linked, because we each were told the other one's role name in our role PMs. So by claiming like this, we have reduced by two the pool of people you have to look through to find the person controlling the last scum KP. Can we at least agree on that much? Also - acro never said he wanted to lynch one of us today, don't misrepresent things. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Hyaach, I believe he is the roleblocker. I think if he's really Tyrion lannister then he probably isn't scum, since it wouldn't match the flavor of the other scum member, but I could be wrong or he could be lying. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
He is almost certainly just trolololing though. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 05:25 Acrofales wrote: So basically we're being trolled by the mods here. There is a 3rd party (I can see no reason for town to use this role), who can completely annul the town KP and nobody knows who will decide the lynch except that 3rd party. Basically Nisani could give the KP to xksksksks tomorrow, then DropBear the day after and we'd be fucked. I don't see much choice but to lynch him today, or roleblock him ad infinitum (which relies on Hyaach being town). I was about to say we could let Hyaach roleblock him forever but then scum could just kill Hyaach and we'd bever be able to lynch anyone again. I guess we should kill nisani... | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 22 2012 07:12 ghost_403 wrote: I really don't like xaard's stance on 4F's fake roleclaim. Again, if someone claimed my role, I would be all over that. He says almost nothing about it at all for the majority of the cycle. Why wouldn't you push someone who claimed your role? I just don't buy it. I think xberk scummier than DropBear at the moment. What I'd really like to hear is their thoughts on each other. Those are always enlightening. That's a really good point actually. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Someone explain to me please why I would risk my life to help town? Town cred is only useful to me to avoid getting either hiro or myself lynched. But if one of us died to the vengeful townie it's exactly as bad for us as one of us getting lynched. Like, I want town to win, I guess, because they're already so far ahead so the game will end faster, and also because scum won the last game I played, which was annoying. But I don't see how risking my life to help town is in line with my win condition. To Acro: I'm afraid of two things. First, that there might be some anti-survivor third party out there with KP, probably ghost, since otherwise it seems weird that there would be a bulletproof survivor and two linked survivors. Second, that scum might decide to be a dick and say "if I'm not going to win neither will you trololol" and kill hiro once I'm dead. Sure it's not the biggest risk, but I really don't see the upside. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 23 2012 00:51 Acrofales wrote: Well, if he doesn't make it for the deadline he gets modkilled. I'm okay with that too  According to zephirdd he already voted for himself. I'm voting for xkcd now as a placeholder, these plans sound good but I'll check in at lunchtime to see if they've changed at all. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
No I don't think this is true but it's something to think about. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Actually I'm probably wrong, on more thought. It wouldn't make sense. Nevermind. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
My theory is that Forumite trolled us with the setup in two more ways than we thought. Troll number one: he didn't actually randomize the roles. Instead, he just put the roles in order on the signup list: third party, town, scum. This leads directly to troll number two: Drazerk is not the Vanilla Townie. Instead, he is the Vanilla Townie. This is what Forumite wouldn't answer: he wouldn't confirm to me that the colors on the rolenames in the OP were alignment indicative, and the OP itself only says that the "roles" are present, not the "roles and alignments". I also think that the reference to the third party planer dragon in the OP is a hint to the vanilla townie thing - Maju's scum buddy probably has "scum" somewhere in the name, since in Maju's role PM it said they win when "scum outnumber the remaining town" or something like that, but the only reference in the PM to Maju being on the "scum" faction was that acronym. I have a few pieces of supporting evidence for this claim. First, Drazerk's play; I've made my opinions clear on that pretty much the whole game. Second, how defensive he was when I started attacking him on day 1. Third, his attempts to get us to treat him as if he was confirmed by the Phoenix Wright check, when it actually said nothing at all about his alignment. I think that the Vanilla Townie is probably an anti-town role, and that it either has limited KP or Drazerk has been saving his KP in order to confuse us (the VisceraEyes school of serial killing). Actually, I think that it's similar to KB's role, with a wincon that involves killing off other third party players and another wincon that involves surviving until the end of the game (and thus having town lose). This theory would also require Ghost/Fourface to be the last scum. I'll let you guys evaluate this yourself, but I think it makes sense. Bulletproof survivor is a pretty good claim for scum to make, since if he was going to get hit by a bullet at night he would lose anyway so it's no risk to him to claim it. Additionally, I can't see fourface's claim of insane bulletproof DT making any sense from a neutral-third-party point of view. There are several easy ways to get information about this theory. If there are two KP tonight and one of them hits either Hiro or myself, then I'm definitely correct. If there aren't, then we can just scumhunt normally; if we find the mafia and it's not Ghost then I'm clearly wrong, and if Ghost is the mafia and the game doesn't end then we lynch Drazerk. Finally, Drazerk would you please post this again: On June 20 2012 03:15 Drazerk wrote: ##I had fun I want to see if you get a response from the hosts. There's a chance that the hosts don't tell him how many players he has to outlive, and he can ask them by posting this. Alternatively if there's some other reason you posted this please do tell us. Either way this last bit isn't really key to the main theory. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Either Hyaach is scum and held his kp so we would shoot ghost or xkcd is scum and lying about being detective. But since we already know who was framed and xkcd claims he checked biosc to confirm his sanity, this makes everything straightforward. Guess this puts the kibosh on my crazy "Forumite just went down the list in order" theory. Anyway doesn't this mean that town wins, barring some fourface-level dumbass town play going on here? Scum feel like conceding? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 24 2012 08:52 Drazerk wrote: If i have learnt one thing over the years it is that people who say this are normally scum Way to comment on the relevant issues and questions confronting the town, bro. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Seriously if that's true you should be banned for a game or two. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
drazeeeeerrrrk! stop making me angryyy! | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
##vote: xkasdf | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 25 2012 02:38 ghost_403 wrote: Acro put together a pretty good case on xderp. And I agree on it, but I think it misses out on the most scummy thing that xegad has done (namely because he hadn't done it at that point). If you are a DT with a red check, and people want to lynch you, why wouldn't you be pushing your red check? He lied about his claim. There's no way a town DT would act the way he has in this situation. ##vote xfrac I don't agree - if he's scum he would also be pushing the fake red check. A town dt would know that by dying he can push his read with 100% effectiveness. That said we should still kill xsfhqwgads because of what I said above. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Here's something interesting though - all the claimed and revealed town or third party roles come from previous games on TL mafia except for Sherlock Holmes and Marceline the Vampire Queen. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Alternatively maybe scum hasn't recruited the traitor yet so he doesn't know if the game is going to end when he dies. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
We have the same win conditions as each other... it's confirmed in our role PM. We are mod confirmed survivor to one another, if one of us is neutral then the other one is also. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
DOOO IIIITTT | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Specifically, why I think that Drazerk is another third party out to get us. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
There is a very good chance to take the only scum KP out of the picture completely. If you kill me off you are not only potentially fucking over me and hiro, if Drazerk or someone else does have a hidden KP, but you're also potentially sacrificing a townie. If xskc or Hyaach are scum, which is almost certainly the case, then they have no reason to hold their KP any more, since we will clearly be lynching both of them before ghost. You are also opening the door to scenarios in which town loses a winnable game. If there is a recruited traitor in your town team then you lynch me, and there's a NK, then it becomes 4-2-2. At that point ghost and hiro no longer have any reason to vote with town, since you have shown that you don't give a fuck about our interests even though we've been playing allied with you the whole game. Town loses right then. If it turns out the scum is in your "confirmed" posse, then if you lynch me, xs, and Hyaach you lose, assuming there are nks after each lynch. Tldr | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
There is a very good chance to take the only scum KP out of the picture completely. If you kill me off you are not only potentially fucking over me and hiro, if Drazerk or someone else does have a hidden KP, but you're also potentially sacrificing a townie. If xskc or Hyaach are scum, which is almost certainly the case, then they have no reason to hold their KP any more, since we will clearly be lynching both of them before ghost. You are also opening the door to scenarios in which town loses a winnable game. If there is a recruited traitor in your town team then you lynch me, and there's a NK, then it becomes 4-2-2. At that point ghost and hiro no longer have any reason to vote with town, since you have shown that you don't give a fuck about our interests even though we've been playing allied with you the whole game. Town loses right then. If it turns out the scum is in your "confirmed" posse, then if you lynch me, xs, and Hyaach you lose, assuming there are nks after each lynch. Tldr, you're making the same dipshit mistake you did in holy roman mafia, by using mechanics instead of scumhunting and by not killing the obvious scum staring you in the face. Don't do it again. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Also are you claiming here? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Which is for me or hiro to stay alive. How is this hard to understand? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Town doesn't lose the game at 1v1v3 if two of the three vote with the townie. Here's my scenario for a traitor. You lynch xks or Hyaach now and they flip scum but the game doesn't end. There is a night kill, so you know that someone other than me and hiro is scum. It's 4v1v3 and you have two chances to find the traitor. Alternatively if xks is town but Hyaach is scum, then after you kill him it's LYLO and you have to find the traitor. In either of these situations killing me first takes away a crucial day and straight up makes you lose if Hyaach is scum and not xks. You're also mis representing what I'm saying a lot of the time. If xks and Hyaach are both town then it's because Hyaach is a miller. If that's the case then you're at LYLO again after you kill them both, and have one more chance to find the scum. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 25 2012 18:05 Drazerk wrote: Well its much better than a no brain sacrificial lamb vote at any rate and I've been paranoid about the mason pair considering just how broken that role really is and I can't imagine anyone using it without some major drawback involved. S+B wants to stay alive the most so I want to kill him first so... ##vote strongandbig If scum was hanging on their KP last night they are basically forced to do it again anyway so it shouldn't matter that much delaying the sacrificial lambs This is super fishy. Why would scum hold their KP again tonight? | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 25 2012 22:30 xsksc wrote: I don't see why you care about dying, you still win when Hiro lives right? Nobody has a reason to kill him, or they'd have done it already...besides why should we care if you win or not? The fact you're so paranoid about dying just gives us more reason to kill you lol. Christ, how many fucking times do I have to explain this? My win condition is for me or hiro to survive. I will not do anything the goes against that, and letting myself get lynched clearly goes against that. Especially since unless it's mod confirmed that there is no third-party-hunting role in the game, letting myself get lynched opens the door to me losing, when I would win if I survived. Also why are you discounting the possibility that Hyaach is a miller? There doesn't have to be a framer still in the game for your check to be wrong. Look guys no one has any reason to believe I'm anything other than what I say I am. The only evidence anyone has put forward is "he doesn't want to die lol", which is directly my wincon. The only reason acro has for trying to kill me is "numbers", but numbers dictate you need to be trying to kill scum. By getting rid of the scum KP you give yourselves a lot more time to work through everything else, if the game even continues. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 26 2012 03:36 Drazerk wrote: A check on S+B / hiro is worthless We already have a DT check on me so its also worthless What dt check on you? And a dt check on either of us would come back as "not anti-town." You could even rng which one of us to check so if we have a magical modconfirmed-not-in-the-game framer they wouldn't know who to check! | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
It was in my little pony mafia. I just used the TL search engine but restricted it to mafia subgroup. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
As for yours, I'll check it out when I get a chance but maybe you're fake claiming also, but I haven't looked into it yet. Do your own friggen dirty work. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
On June 26 2012 16:03 Acrofales wrote: Lets just agree to disagree. I don't think you're right and I think it is a really fucked up reason to think someone's scummy. It's speculation about the mindset of the mod when he made the game. There's plenty of other reasons to suspect xsksc. I don't like Hyaach's absense at all either. xsksc: other than the red check, what makes Hyaach scum? Hyaach: what makes xsksc scum? Gogogo! Sorry, that came across as harsher than I intended. I just got really tired of having to explain the same thing over and over again yesterday. Of course we shouldn't find xk to be scum just based on the role name thing, since this is a bastard game and it's entirely possible that his name is the only one that doesn't fit the pattern just to troll us. I just think that given we find him to be potential scum, it's a useful piece of info, especially since it turned out to be correct that ghost was faking a role name. Anyway we should 100% for sure by lynching either xk or Hyaach tomorrow, and hopefully no one will be trying to distract us again with other lynches. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Acrofales for traitor anyone? ##vote: hyaach | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
And after that he started being all "trololol let's stop trying to lynch one of the obvious scum here and kill a third party instead!" Like look at his switch from me to ghost, he just wanted to kill any third party, he didn't actually care about finding scum. He didn't even bother to make cases. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
If not then LYLO is tomorrow. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I was pretty sure Hyaach actually was the last scum, but I thought acrofales or drazerk was traitor... I thought there was no way so much anti-town could really be town... T_T Yeah Hiro you played way more pro-town than I did lol. After the Chezinu stuff I thought you were either going to get shot or lynched, hence the badass breadcrumbs I put together. My plan was to tunnel Drazerk, that way I get to (a) look town, (b) not threaten the mafia and get shot, and (c) get to yell at Drazerk. :p | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
Also also I think Drazerk should be warned on the banlist thread for not reading his role PM. I know I was tunneling him anyway but this is post-game 100% honest, I don't think that should be okay with people. But that's up to the hosts so this is the last I'll say of it. | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
I really thought the planar dragon reference in the OP was a hint that the "vanilla townie" might not be all it seemed... | ||
|
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
| ||
| ||
