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On May 26 2012 08:26 VisceraEyes wrote:
Well, the timing of his lapse into normal posting was troubling...like, the thread was in shambles because of me and bugs and his answer was.....to stop posting concisely and shit up the thread further?
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Like...I don't know, it doesn't make sense. Also his absolute certainty that Bugs being town like ALL game mystifies me considering the lengths bugs has gone to to not talk about his reads and shit.
Mattchew duped me in LIII, so I am not confident in my ability to read him well. I'm not inclined to lynch him though.
As you're aware, I already posted myself how 'convenient' it could be for Matt to speak in MTG and 'ride to the rescue' by posting normally. So I am aware of the possibility. At the moment I don't think it's the case though.
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On May 26 2012 08:34 Acid~ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 07:16 wherebugsgo wrote:
We should kill Acid as well cause he kept trying to find any excuse possible to get away from the zealos lynch. Killing me for making a bad read will not help the town. Let's vig Katina and then we can lynch one of you or VE. I made my case on why at least one of you is scum, I'll dig it up and repost it in the morning if need be.
Please do, I'd be interested to hear it
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On May 26 2012 08:36 wherebugsgo wrote:
might I add that I don't believe Katina's scum play is incredibly strong?
Her town play is very very strong. She emulates Foolishness, and honestly she does it incredibly well.
When we were scum in Arkham City together you recall how she played? That was her first game and for the most part she just stayed under the radar. That's what she's been trying to do this game.
In games where as town she gets accused, Katina is willing to get her hands dirty. Sure, she doesn't respond nearly as much as other players, but she at the very least DOES respond. She doesn't try to feign that her posts are of quality when they're not, such as in this case.
I'm not convinced that she's scum but I'd much rather kill katina over most of the other players in the game right now, probably even tunkeg. Acid goes first IMO though, he's almost definitely scum.
Do you have a case on Acid anywhere? Or do you fancy summarising for me the points that show Acid is definitely scum?
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wbg, Acid case/summary plz?
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Tunkeg, if you spent half the time scumhunting as talking about arguing, we'd actually be getting somewhere 
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On May 26 2012 08:56 Tunkeg wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 08:52 marvellosity wrote:Tunkeg, if you spent half the time scumhunting as talking about arguing, we'd actually be getting somewhere True. I'll try to calmdown by tomorrow and be of any use.
That'd be pretty cool.
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Is wbg still your main scumread VE?
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Right, 2 more apart from him.
I'll tell you partly why I get a town-read from Matt. We had our little tete a tete when I said he could be scum etc for his posting and coming back to normality.
imo if he was scum, he wouldn't have lost his rag at my prodding and sworn at me a bunch of times.
It seems a genuinely town reaction.
It would have had to have been a faked scum reaction to swear at me like that, and it was totally unreasonable and I do not believe Matt is totally unreasonable even when he is making plays.
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On May 26 2012 09:06 VisceraEyes wrote:
Well, I mean it would be all to easy to fake an angry reaction - anger is the easiest thing to fake, you just have to throw a few curse words in there and that's that. The question is: do you believe the reaction was genuine IN CONTEXT. Like, do you think he had any reason to be as angry as he did? Because believing the reaction is genuine is one thing, but it has to make sense too in order for it to be genuine. Does Matt's "genuine frustration" seem understandable to you?
No, no, it's not just throwing in curse words. iirc, he said "shut the fuck up" to me twice and called me a dipshit. That's not just an angry reaction, that's specifically swearing at me in a way that he would know would be mod-warnable.
If Matt is scum and did that I think it's pretty damn low, and I don't think he is.
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As in, it's only justifiable as a genuine reaction to his disbelief that I'd think like that. I can be pretty sarcasmo.
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No, I didn't miss the point - you're asking me to look at it from one point of view, and I find it pointless to do so when the point of view I am looking at gives me a decisive opinion already.
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On May 26 2012 09:13 VisceraEyes wrote:
I mean, you missed the point, but that's okay...I'll just go reread the exchange myself.
What do you think about Katina, marv? Bugs and I have made our opinions known on the implications of Zealos' flip regarding Katina, but I don't recall your input.
I'm not sure what to make of Katina's non-response to the claim issue. She could be an apathetic townie, but I'm really not sure. I've struggled with Katina. I quote below my 2 main thoughts / thought processes on her.
Specifically if you're interested in Katina you should look at my 2nd post.
On May 25 2012 01:42 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On May 25 2012 01:24 Nova_Terra wrote:Then theres a couple worthless short defenses of herself. then this wonderful gem: ..... Not only is this completely stupid to have not seemed to read the thread, she says that my spam is similar to a game i played mafia in But wait, i was just in a game with you where i was town AND I SPAMMED So now shes just throwing shit to try to get a nice mislynch, doesnt matter if it makes sense as long as it casts suspicion, amirite katina On May 23 2012 06:52 Katina wrote:On May 23 2012 06:48 wherebugsgo wrote:
Regardless of his alignment nova seems to post a lot. Over the span of a week in games where he was scum and town he had 8-10 pages of filter in both.
Only his first game seems to be an anomaly with 5 pages after 9-10 days but that's still quite a lot (especially for a newbie game)
So why is it, Katina, that you're trying to pass off Nova's spam as exclusively a scum trait? I'm not. I'm just saying he has done it before. Yay, Nova, a case! I've quoted the part I find particularly compelling. You see, you have a veteran player who knows how to play the game, and yet is lurky. This is at least forgiveable if when they do turn up, they say something of note. But here it's: Nova spams! And her response to wbg is even worse - "I know it's not alignment indicative, I'm just saying he spammed before". Her filter is short enough that when she contributes with the weakest sauce possible, it's superbad. What does everyone else think?
On May 25 2012 22:46 marvellosity wrote:
I am starting to think one of Katina and Nova_Terra has to be scum.
Why you may ask?
It all hinges on Katina. In LI, she was one of only two players who pegged Toad AND VE as scum. Great read. In Liar Mafia, she pretty much nailed all the mafia at some stage. In short, she has good reads.
In this game, this leads to the following possibilities:
1. She is town and correct about Nova.
2. She is mafia pushing a fake case on Nova.
Personally I feel Katina's presented case is fairly weak, relying on 'spam' as a central point, despite admitting to wbg it was not alignment indicative. This is why I am at the moment discounting
3. She is town and incorrect about Nova.
I know this sounds paradoxical. I just feel that a town Katina would not both be incorrect and pushing a weak case.
Personally I feel like option 2 is the most likely, in conjunction with her general apathy for the thread.
I would like everyone to seriously think about this and give me their thoughts.
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On May 26 2012 09:16 VisceraEyes wrote:
I mean, I can't accept that with my new Zen mindstate - we look at things from different viewpoints to see if the "decisive opinion" we've already arrived at still makes sense.
.....kay?
I had done already (because actually I like to be thorough) and I did provoke him more than once with my sarcasm. This lines up with my previous view.
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Well, I thought you'd just drop it, but as you didn't I had to respond ^^
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Tunkeg: the problem I have with that case on Mattchew is that I can easily provide the town narrative for it as well.
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On May 26 2012 09:32 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Tunkeg: the problem I have with that case on Mattchew is that I can easily provide the town narrative for it as well. There's a town and scum narrative for virtually every action that can take place. Simply being able to provide both doesn't exclude the possibility of either.
Of course. But his posting I found consistent on the matter. If we took your view literally everyone would be suspicious all the time. The burden of proof lies with proving someone is scum, and my point is that in this instance I can easily read all those posts from townie Matt.
The Occam's Razor answer is that Matt was deeply uneasy about lynching a dt claim.
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EBWOP: just to provide a counter-example:
when I looked at Zealos' meta. As town he absolutely rejected placing fast votes, wanting time to think and analyse before placing votes.
Here he threw out 2 votes immediately in 2 posts.
Occam's razor says the two games he is playing different alignments.
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On May 26 2012 09:39 Tunkeg wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 09:31 marvellosity wrote:
Tunkeg: the problem I have with that case on Mattchew is that I can easily provide the town narrative for it as well. Probably. But from my point of view it seems scummy. I think he wanted to play the concerned town role, but I think he overdid it. If he was dead certain Zealos was town and had indicated it before I might have bought it. But remember his vote was on Zealos just before the DT claim, so he should be in doubt. And I don't think a doubting townie would push this much for either side, he would vote, give his reason and let it play out.
Okay, fair enough that you think that but I don't subscribe to it.
His vote was on Zealos despite previously it being on zelblade and saying he wasn't at all sure on Zealos. He moved it to Zealos with the comment that he was doing so because VE/me/wbg believed him to be scum. This was not a strong read on Zealos. It makes sense to me that Zealos DT claiming was easily enough for his opinion to sway back.
People get very, very passionate about blue claims.
Hell, in LIII I was town and I absolutely crusaded for VE's lynch after he blue-claimed day 1. Turns out I got him lynched, turns out VE was in fact blue, turns out I was townie.
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I'm not exactly sure. The fact that he was the counter-wagon clouds things a little. Right now I gotta go to bed. Plenty to muse over for tomorrow ^^
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On May 26 2012 16:48 Mattchew wrote:As for Tunkeg's case, it is literally just a recapping of what I did before the lynch (taking 1 post out of order) and then having only 1 opinion on 1 post (which was a question to the mods). Also, he brings up this post + Show Spoiler +On May 26 2012 03:08 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 02:56 marvellosity wrote:
No, you're a liar, like you've been lying all game.
This is Mafia LI all over again.
Day 2 VE is under heavy fire. Comes out with a blue claim while bussing his team-mate. Team-mate gets infinite town credit (had the game not ended).
This is what is happening here. Whichever of Zealos or Hiro gets lynched, the other is going to get massive town credit. It's so see through.
heres where im baffled about you voting zealos, if he's scum like you think, hiro is scum too. if hes not scum, your lynching our detective, while you coulda been lynching a red-checked hiro To which I still don't have an answer from marv and maybe I'm wrong but I feel like I make sense. Marv basically says that he thinks Hiro is scum in both scenario's yet votes Zealos.
Sorry Matt, I forgot to reply. Basically my theory is that Hiro is scum and they were bussing to get whoever wasn't lynched town credit. But as others have pointed out, this does not have to be the case by any means, it's just what's in my mind at the moment.
I voted Zealos because he was the scum regardless of my little bussing theory. I had 2,3 or however many cases on why Zealos was scum and none on HiroPro, so naturally I was going to vote for Zealos.
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EPT
