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On May 08 2012 06:32 Mementoss wrote: Also cheers to I10f, Nova_Terra, and Paqman for wasting there votes!
Aka, voting someone who has no chance of getting lynched and not trying to actively push that player, or convince anyone else why they are scum/to vote them. I guess having your vote have no influence on the outcome at all is good for keeping away from a WIFOM vote analysis paper trail. >_>
So you're telling me that I should have taken my vote off someone I think is scum and sheep/wagonhop/board the train on someone I didn't think was that much scummy? No thanks, I want to win.
I made a case, the only problem was that it was 11 at night, I had to wake up early to take a college exam, and had class the rest of the day. Obviously I didn't have time to push it.
layabout your hard defense of kenpachi is yucky. Also, he's allowed to purposely play anti-town just because he's KP? (Sounds familiar, BM @ LIII) layabout isn't that the reason you pushed BM's lynch? Yeah don't even get on my ass about KP.
I don't believe that he's been sooooooo busy to play, yet he's spamming the thread with so many 1-liners and "coincidentally" shows up after I put out my case on him and vote. I also don't believe that he's asked for a replacement because, guess what, there isn't anyone signed up to be a replacement.
I didn't waste my vote. I didn't think NT was that much scummy anymore and I'm not going to lynch someone that I'm not confident is scum. If I was scum I could have easily left my vote on him, especially since I was THE FIRST PERSON TO EVEN VOTE NT, and I could have easily gotten away with it. Kenpachi's my scummiest read and if pressuring him makes me scum, that's coolbeans. I just wont understand your logic.
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ebwop: I wasn't on when the blubb train started. I apologize MT for not lynching a townie.
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+ Show Spoiler [blubb train in a nutshell] +
And there is all the people who voted and their in-thread vote. Now we won't have to dig through all the one-liners and spam that cluttered the thread during that time.
Out of all those voters, layabout and jdub look like the most suspicious to me. I'll post a little something on layabout and why I think he's suspicious in a bit.
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layabout, and why he's getting my Finger of Suspicion.
#1 I'll begin with a link to his case against blubby: here In that post, layabout makes no mention whatsoever of DYH's case against blubb. Not even a little comment, even though he made it 4 hours after DYH. I think that it's pretty obvious DYH's case on blubb influenced layabout to make his own. So I looked into it more.
What struck me as really odd, was the fact that he had no FoS, no read, nothing at all on blubb prior to DYH's case. In fact, layabout's only mention of blubb is when SA asks him what he thinks about blubb, seen here: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 03:18 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 03:10 SomethingAwesome wrote: I'm beginnging to like you Lay. Now find me scum! =)
What do you think about blubb? I think he is fishy... here: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 19:50 blubbdavid wrote:I see, Blazinghand is switching cases so it looks like he doesn't sheep l10f. Well, jdup has made a good post regarding layabout's behaviour On May 06 2012 08:46 johnnywup wrote: I think it is condemning, scum over-reacts to things like that (at least i think, ive never actually played scum). Of course laya didn't know kat would be modkilled, which is why it is condemning. If we didn't know kat's flip, it wouldn't be bad for either of them. It's just a townie pushing his reads on another person he thinks is townie, right? Since kat flipped, no. I don't know, the flip makes me think laya is more scummy. It took scum by surprise that Kat was modkilled. This is a strange thing to assert when as a townie you do not know who scum are and if they thought that Katina was coming back or not. Also when he votes for me he emphasises that it is to get me to answer his question. Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 20:32 blubbdavid wrote:layabout is scum. The question is: why would scum push BM? layabout was pushing BM so hard it was not even funny. Ok: layabaout, why were you so fucking desperate in pushing BM? till then, ##vote layaboutOn May 06 2012 19:51 Blazinghand wrote:On May 06 2012 19:50 blubbdavid wrote: I see, Blazinghand is switching cases so it looks like he doesn't sheep l10f. you wanna mess + Show Spoiler + He begins by saying that i am scum. If he believes this then surely that should be the reason for his vote. By saying that he wants a response he gives himself a way to back out of pushing me. If he truly believes that i am scum then he would have no reason to do this.
In which he makes no opinion and takes no stance whatsoever.
#2 And here are two little points that need to be noted: + Show Spoiler [P1] +On May 04 2012 07:35 layabout wrote: BH you are just bitter because you blew your own leg off after you tried to rocket jump with the wrong boots on.
I think killing something awesome could be a good move. If we still have no candidates when i get up then i think we should just lynch BM. What he's saying is that he wants to kill SomethingAwesome, but he's too damn lazy to build a case or make a push on him. He's also practically asking everyone to do the scumhunting for him while he sits back and chills. He doesn't make a read, take a stance, or form an opinion on SA. The only time he ever mentions SA is if he is defending himself.
+ Show Spoiler [P2] +On May 06 2012 00:55 layabout wrote: we should kill Palmar tomorrow Later on, he posts this little baby. Again, just like with SomethingAwesome, he makes the suggestion of wanting to kill Palmar. He made no case on Palmar besides the little comment. When asked why, he posts this: On May 06 2012 09:23 layabout wrote: @Mementoss i thought we should lynch Palmar over "any other lurker" because he showed basically no interest in the lynch at all. Palmar is lazy as scum but when he town he usually bothers to do ... "stuff". Of course, he had his reasons for it: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 03:50 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 03:28 Blazinghand wrote:On May 07 2012 03:00 layabout wrote: BH is also criticising me for saying that we should kill the player that he decided to shoot.
False. I am criticizing you for saying we should kill Palmar, and not posting a case against him until 9 hours, after daybreak. Did you actually read my case? On May 07 2012 03:00 layabout wrote: have i missed anything? Yes, my criticism is based on HOW you did what you did, not what you did. Is it really typical layabout play to make a 1-sentence accusation halfway through the night then not follow up with a case until after daybreak? Cause I had some respect for your town play... Yesterday, between the hours of (UK time) 5pm and 1 am i was otherwise engaged. + Show Spoiler +. I posted that "we should kill Palmar" when i heard a knock at the door. Now try think of a way to write that without it sounding lame. And I'm willing to give him benefit of the doubt, mainly because there are other reasons to think he is scum.
#3 Just about more than half of layabout's posts consist only defending himself. His only other notable thing is when he puts attention and calls out jdub: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 10:00 layabout wrote:@papapanda, The number of players that make sense is far smaller than you appear to think it is. You should treasure the ones that do. Johnnywub:skim through his filter from Area 53 mafia http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128&user=99700These are some of his comments (+1 from host) after the game. + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 09:18 iGrok wrote: Johnny is probably town MVP. Matt is scum MVP.
Also, well done by scum not to give up when St.Daniel got modkilled. On May 05 2012 09:06 johnnywup wrote: it was too late, i was away and it was 5:01. also fml i feel so shitty now. I had decent reads but I can't convey reads for shit. On May 05 2012 09:28 johnnywup wrote: im sorry i failed you town On May 05 2012 09:35 johnnywup wrote: bleh i feel so guilty for this game. if i conveyed my reads a little better or something i dont know but bleh On May 05 2012 09:41 johnnywup wrote: i thought you were scum mattchew and thats primarily because you allowed an ottox lynch with 2 confirmed scum. but no one listened to me so ugh On May 05 2012 09:49 johnnywup wrote: matt, the timing didn't make sense as town which was my second biggest issue. but no one listened to me. urghh The key things to note are that Johnny: - Posts a lot, this does not necessarily mean that we should expect him to have a massive filter but he does put a lot of time, thought and energy into the game as town.
- He is concerned about communicating his ideas to others and convincing them
- He is working to improve his town game
- He feels like he owes town something
I see no signs of his town game so far. johnnywub is sitting back and watching the thread. When i called him out he instantly de-lurked, said nothing, and left. + Show Spoiler [Today's post's] +On May 07 2012 04:45 johnnywup wrote: I'll be completely honest, I've been addicted to that 999 game so I haven't been posting much.
Also I don't want any gold stars. i looked at a filter, saw something odd, pointed it out. that's what all town should be doing. Speaking of which I'm gonna look over some filters now. I'll report back when I have something substantial On May 07 2012 04:52 johnnywup wrote:lol i love how NT says "it would be correct to be shooting into the lurker crowd" while lurking himself On May 07 2012 04:54 johnnywup wrote: i just noticed that from your post and thought it was interesting. i guess it is rehashing. I'm just agreeing that it's strange and scummy On May 07 2012 05:02 johnnywup wrote: Paqman Marv BH and Mementoss are all saying the same thing at approximately the same time? weird, maybe you just agree with one another and want to quote it as if you found it yourself? O_o
But even then, he makes no stance. He doesn't pressure jdub, doesn't make some sort fos, does nothing except call him out for lurking. I would say that that is his only other contributing post. Read through his filter and it becomes apparent that he puts more effort into defending himself than hunting scum.
#4 The next thing I want to bring up is how quickly he comes to defend Kenpachi. + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 21:48 layabout wrote: If blubbdavid Nova_Terra and Paqman are the remaining scum then kenpachi has got all of them.
On May 07 2012 21:51 layabout wrote: frogg we are not lynching kenpachi.
don't be silly. On May 07 2012 22:12 layabout wrote:I would love to know how you felt that this: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 04:37 Nova_Terra wrote: Next, Kenpachi Absolutely worthless, if you consider his connection case useful i dunno what to say Vote: Kenpachi On May 07 2012 13:19 PaqMan wrote:Just found out that I'm probably going to miss the lynch. I guess it doesn't bother anyone how fast a wagon formed on NT? I don't feel comfortable putting my vote back onto him. Hence this quote: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:11 Kenpachi wrote:On May 06 2012 06:48 Blazinghand wrote:Yeah, I shot Palmar. He looked like scum to me. I gave him the benefit of the doubt D1 but he didn't contribute and was silent, as scum Palmar tends to be. Here's my crumb: On May 06 2012 03:27 Blazinghand wrote: Man this situation just makes me want to eat my own heart Type "eat heart of" into google search (but don't hit enter) and it'll suggest "eat heart of palm" Palm -> Palmar, my target. rofl are you kidding me His only post since D2 started. He ninja-voted D1, isn't contributing and the few posts he has are very lackluster. From what I understand Kenpachi is a veteran, yet he's been the least helpful out of everyone (excluding Froggynoddy, who is inactive). Also this gem: + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 06:31 Kenpachi wrote:ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING ME? DO YOU NOT NOTICE THE TREND HERE? NT i thought at first was not mafia but then layabout cames along and throws in POLICY LYNCH TIME NO NO NO WTF? NO i believe layabout and NT are mafia together because NT NT had aroused suspicions in thread andended in hotshit. He was completely saved by something so stupid. layabout, as his buttbuddy saves him with such a weak push that only the newbs are following. by experience, policy lynch almost always never works. its a scare tactic, not an actual method used to lynch people, especially day 1 i also believe marvellosity is mafia with them because he said NT is scummy and changes his mind like nothing happened Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 02:43 marvellosity wrote: At the moment Nova looks the scummiest for reasons already expanded upon by others. The fact that so little of anything has occurred today makes Nova's stance that he doesn't want to air his tentative reads all the worse.
Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 05:53 marvellosity wrote: Sold, I don't have a solid scumread on anyone and BM is just useless and anti-town no matter his alignment.
such a contradiction, they were made about 3 hours apart. BM is a potent player and everyone knows that. I feel day 1 lynching a veteran is the worst thing you can do. If i were mafia, id put BM near the top of my priority list just because of his sheer experience. He made his scum reads and calls out who he believes to be the remaining scum team. But he doesn't push for their lynch or pressure them or anything at all. As of now I think Kenpachi is a better option than NT. ##Vote KenpachiI'm hoping I'll make it back before the deadline but I'm not too sure. was the best lynch to support? Why dont you have a look through here and tell me what you learn about kenpachi's play? Then address the cases on the people that should get lynched: Blubbdavid or Nova_Terra or might get mislynched: layabout. On May 07 2012 22:26 layabout wrote:EBWOP*So you are saying that it doesn't matter if your logic for voting on day1 is weak/contradictory/scummy because we have limited information? Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 22:19 froggynoddy wrote:On May 07 2012 22:15 layabout wrote:On May 07 2012 22:07 froggynoddy wrote:EBWOP: was reading through blubb's and then NT's filter's, (NT's attack of him seems odd: did he explain wtf he meant by that?!?) as former being your vote and the latter having the most votes. I'd rather blub defended himself as it will give us more to work with but a lot of what you've said, Laya, seem to be a criticism of blubb's Day 1 vote logic, which as we all know is bound to be weak. Most of our votes were bound to be wrong, and all of our logic to be hugely flawed due to limited evidence. So you are saying that it doesn't matter if your logic for voting on day1 is weak/contracitory/scummy because we have limited information? No, I'm saying that its less likely of being alignment indicative then actual thread activity at this point. But Kenpachi has been more "active" than froggnoddy, Eiii, l10f, ghost_403 johnnywub, grush, mementoss, sinensis and papaganda. He might not even have PC acess at the momnet That post^ is complete BS that I don't even understand how he could have possibly came to that conclusion. The only person he's been more active than is froggynoddy, and even then Froggy's posts have way more quality than KP's does. On May 07 2012 22:35 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 22:26 froggynoddy wrote:On May 07 2012 22:12 layabout wrote:I would love to know how you felt that this: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 04:37 Nova_Terra wrote: Next, Kenpachi Absolutely worthless, if you consider his connection case useful i dunno what to say Vote: Kenpachi On May 07 2012 13:19 PaqMan wrote:Just found out that I'm probably going to miss the lynch. I guess it doesn't bother anyone how fast a wagon formed on NT? I don't feel comfortable putting my vote back onto him. Hence this quote: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:11 Kenpachi wrote:On May 06 2012 06:48 Blazinghand wrote:Yeah, I shot Palmar. He looked like scum to me. I gave him the benefit of the doubt D1 but he didn't contribute and was silent, as scum Palmar tends to be. Here's my crumb: On May 06 2012 03:27 Blazinghand wrote: Man this situation just makes me want to eat my own heart Type "eat heart of" into google search (but don't hit enter) and it'll suggest "eat heart of palm" Palm -> Palmar, my target. rofl are you kidding me His only post since D2 started. He ninja-voted D1, isn't contributing and the few posts he has are very lackluster. From what I understand Kenpachi is a veteran, yet he's been the least helpful out of everyone (excluding Froggynoddy, who is inactive). Also this gem: + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 06:31 Kenpachi wrote:ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING ME? DO YOU NOT NOTICE THE TREND HERE? NT i thought at first was not mafia but then layabout cames along and throws in POLICY LYNCH TIME NO NO NO WTF? NO i believe layabout and NT are mafia together because NT NT had aroused suspicions in thread andended in hotshit. He was completely saved by something so stupid. layabout, as his buttbuddy saves him with such a weak push that only the newbs are following. by experience, policy lynch almost always never works. its a scare tactic, not an actual method used to lynch people, especially day 1 i also believe marvellosity is mafia with them because he said NT is scummy and changes his mind like nothing happened Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 02:43 marvellosity wrote: At the moment Nova looks the scummiest for reasons already expanded upon by others. The fact that so little of anything has occurred today makes Nova's stance that he doesn't want to air his tentative reads all the worse.
Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 05:53 marvellosity wrote: Sold, I don't have a solid scumread on anyone and BM is just useless and anti-town no matter his alignment.
such a contradiction, they were made about 3 hours apart. BM is a potent player and everyone knows that. I feel day 1 lynching a veteran is the worst thing you can do. If i were mafia, id put BM near the top of my priority list just because of his sheer experience. He made his scum reads and calls out who he believes to be the remaining scum team. But he doesn't push for their lynch or pressure them or anything at all. As of now I think Kenpachi is a better option than NT. ##Vote KenpachiI'm hoping I'll make it back before the deadline but I'm not too sure. was the best lynch to support? Why dont you have a look through here and tell me what you learn about kenpachi's play? Then address the cases on the people that should get lynched: Blubbdavid or Nova_Terra or might get mislynched: layabout. Ok, so... are you trying to show me that because he plays like this both as town and scum we should excuse untowny behaviour? I don't like that as an argument as untowny behaviour should always be punished. That being said I understand that perhaps this would be a better job for any vigs we have left. It just seems unlikely unless we do unless we have a pyro. I will keep reading through threads and see if anything convinces me. As I said, other than what I think about lynching into inactives, NT's weird post (see above post) and your hard defence on Katina seem like the strongest indications of scumminess imo. It was more of an "inactivity from a player that's always inactive is meaningless". There is also some merit to the notion that scum will try to lynch Kenpachi.I am not sure what you are trying to say but blue pyro's are trackers not not vigis. Again, you cannot be freaking serious. You pushed for BM's lynch, am I correct? S O HOW ARE YOU DEFENDING KP WHEN KP'S PLAY MATCHES EXACTLY LIKE BM! lurk, lurk, lurk, inactive, spam one-liners, purposely not contribute, purposely play anti-town. KP said that he's so busy he cannot possibly play, but he could have EASILY come up with a small read/fos/case on someone. Instead, he wastes what little time he has to shit up the thread. KP is the most anti-town player in the game right now, and you're defending him hard. Remind me why you wanted BM lynched.
#5 + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 07:04 Bill Murray wrote: well, layabout hopping on the lynch makes me really suspect him he would normally leave me around if he's town of my wagon, i would like you all to lynch layabout On May 08 2012 04:22 blubbdavid wrote: layabout is scum, SA is town I will not move my vote from layabout -snipped-
Hmm. The victims of our mislynches both suggest to lynch layabout. And so far we're ignoring them.
Why I believe layabout to be scum boils down to;
1) Has nothing on blubb, but as soon as DYH pushes a case and lynch on him, layabout makes a weak case and pushes it forward as if he had been suspecting him for a while.
2) layabout does not create his own scumreads, does not establish his own opinions, and does not make his own stance. He has other people do the work for him, and then he starts pushing reads. Basically, he's not scum hunting.
3) All of layabout's "good, quality posts" are the only ones where he is defending himself, not doing any actual scumhunting.
4) People previously thought his analysis on Kat was an attempt at soft-defending. But after individually separating his posts, we can all clearly see how hard he is defending Kenpachi. KP's play is awfully similar to BM's.
5) I'm restating this one because I feel it's one of the stronger points against layabout: He does not actively hunt scum. All he does is push other people's reads.
I retract my FoS on him. I'm confident that layabout is scum and I want him lynched tomorrow.
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ebwop: reason why I posted my case now instead of waiting until D3 is that I usually don't get back from my classes until a few minutes after deadline.
Also, if I die tonight I want everyone to lynch him.
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On May 08 2012 12:44 Sinensis wrote: If either layabout, NT, or ghost isn't dead by morning I will be disappointed.
I completely agree with this. layabout should be the top priority for vigi imo.
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+ Show Spoiler [layabout case] +On May 08 2012 11:56 PaqMan wrote:layabout, and why he's getting my Finger of Suspicion. #1I'll begin with a link to his case against blubby: hereIn that post, layabout makes no mention whatsoever of DYH's case against blubb. Not even a little comment, even though he made it 4 hours after DYH. I think that it's pretty obvious DYH's case on blubb influenced layabout to make his own. So I looked into it more. What struck me as really odd, was the fact that he had no FoS, no read, nothing at all on blubb prior to DYH's case. In fact, layabout's only mention of blubb is when SA asks him what he thinks about blubb, seen here: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 03:18 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 03:10 SomethingAwesome wrote: I'm beginnging to like you Lay. Now find me scum! =)
What do you think about blubb? I think he is fishy... here: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 19:50 blubbdavid wrote:I see, Blazinghand is switching cases so it looks like he doesn't sheep l10f. Well, jdup has made a good post regarding layabout's behaviour On May 06 2012 08:46 johnnywup wrote: I think it is condemning, scum over-reacts to things like that (at least i think, ive never actually played scum). Of course laya didn't know kat would be modkilled, which is why it is condemning. If we didn't know kat's flip, it wouldn't be bad for either of them. It's just a townie pushing his reads on another person he thinks is townie, right? Since kat flipped, no. I don't know, the flip makes me think laya is more scummy. It took scum by surprise that Kat was modkilled. This is a strange thing to assert when as a townie you do not know who scum are and if they thought that Katina was coming back or not. Also when he votes for me he emphasises that it is to get me to answer his question. Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 20:32 blubbdavid wrote:layabout is scum. The question is: why would scum push BM? layabout was pushing BM so hard it was not even funny. Ok: layabaout, why were you so fucking desperate in pushing BM? till then, ##vote layaboutOn May 06 2012 19:51 Blazinghand wrote:On May 06 2012 19:50 blubbdavid wrote: I see, Blazinghand is switching cases so it looks like he doesn't sheep l10f. you wanna mess + Show Spoiler +http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILc0cYkKqFs He begins by saying that i am scum. If he believes this then surely that should be the reason for his vote. By saying that he wants a response he gives himself a way to back out of pushing me. If he truly believes that i am scum then he would have no reason to do this. In which he makes no opinion and takes no stance whatsoever. #2And here are two little points that need to be noted: + Show Spoiler [P1] +On May 04 2012 07:35 layabout wrote: BH you are just bitter because you blew your own leg off after you tried to rocket jump with the wrong boots on.
I think killing something awesome could be a good move. If we still have no candidates when i get up then i think we should just lynch BM. What he's saying is that he wants to kill SomethingAwesome, but he's too damn lazy to build a case or make a push on him. He's also practically asking everyone to do the scumhunting for him while he sits back and chills. He doesn't make a read, take a stance, or form an opinion on SA. The only time he ever mentions SA is if he is defending himself. + Show Spoiler [P2] +On May 06 2012 00:55 layabout wrote: we should kill Palmar tomorrow Later on, he posts this little baby. Again, just like with SomethingAwesome, he makes the suggestion of wanting to kill Palmar. He made no case on Palmar besides the little comment. When asked why, he posts this: On May 06 2012 09:23 layabout wrote: @Mementoss i thought we should lynch Palmar over "any other lurker" because he showed basically no interest in the lynch at all. Palmar is lazy as scum but when he town he usually bothers to do ... "stuff". Of course, he had his reasons for it: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 03:50 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 03:28 Blazinghand wrote:On May 07 2012 03:00 layabout wrote: BH is also criticising me for saying that we should kill the player that he decided to shoot.
False. I am criticizing you for saying we should kill Palmar, and not posting a case against him until 9 hours, after daybreak. Did you actually read my case? On May 07 2012 03:00 layabout wrote: have i missed anything? Yes, my criticism is based on HOW you did what you did, not what you did. Is it really typical layabout play to make a 1-sentence accusation halfway through the night then not follow up with a case until after daybreak? Cause I had some respect for your town play... Yesterday, between the hours of (UK time) 5pm and 1 am i was otherwise engaged. + Show Spoiler +. I posted that "we should kill Palmar" when i heard a knock at the door. Now try think of a way to write that without it sounding lame. And I'm willing to give him benefit of the doubt, mainly because there are other reasons to think he is scum. #3Just about more than half of layabout's posts consist only defending himself. His only other notable thing is when he puts attention and calls out jdub: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 10:00 layabout wrote:@papapanda, The number of players that make sense is far smaller than you appear to think it is. You should treasure the ones that do. Johnnywub:skim through his filter from Area 53 mafia http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128&user=99700These are some of his comments (+1 from host) after the game. + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 09:18 iGrok wrote: Johnny is probably town MVP. Matt is scum MVP.
Also, well done by scum not to give up when St.Daniel got modkilled. On May 05 2012 09:06 johnnywup wrote: it was too late, i was away and it was 5:01. also fml i feel so shitty now. I had decent reads but I can't convey reads for shit. On May 05 2012 09:28 johnnywup wrote: im sorry i failed you town On May 05 2012 09:35 johnnywup wrote: bleh i feel so guilty for this game. if i conveyed my reads a little better or something i dont know but bleh On May 05 2012 09:41 johnnywup wrote: i thought you were scum mattchew and thats primarily because you allowed an ottox lynch with 2 confirmed scum. but no one listened to me so ugh On May 05 2012 09:49 johnnywup wrote: matt, the timing didn't make sense as town which was my second biggest issue. but no one listened to me. urghh The key things to note are that Johnny: - Posts a lot, this does not necessarily mean that we should expect him to have a massive filter but he does put a lot of time, thought and energy into the game as town.
- He is concerned about communicating his ideas to others and convincing them
- He is working to improve his town game
- He feels like he owes town something
I see no signs of his town game so far. johnnywub is sitting back and watching the thread. When i called him out he instantly de-lurked, said nothing, and left. + Show Spoiler [Today's post's] +On May 07 2012 04:45 johnnywup wrote: I'll be completely honest, I've been addicted to that 999 game so I haven't been posting much.
Also I don't want any gold stars. i looked at a filter, saw something odd, pointed it out. that's what all town should be doing. Speaking of which I'm gonna look over some filters now. I'll report back when I have something substantial On May 07 2012 04:52 johnnywup wrote:lol i love how NT says "it would be correct to be shooting into the lurker crowd" while lurking himself On May 07 2012 04:54 johnnywup wrote: i just noticed that from your post and thought it was interesting. i guess it is rehashing. I'm just agreeing that it's strange and scummy On May 07 2012 05:02 johnnywup wrote: Paqman Marv BH and Mementoss are all saying the same thing at approximately the same time? weird, maybe you just agree with one another and want to quote it as if you found it yourself? O_o But even then, he makes no stance. He doesn't pressure jdub, doesn't make some sort fos, does nothing except call him out for lurking. I would say that that is his only other contributing post. Read through his filter and it becomes apparent that he puts more effort into defending himself than hunting scum. #4The next thing I want to bring up is how quickly he comes to defend Kenpachi. + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 21:48 layabout wrote: If blubbdavid Nova_Terra and Paqman are the remaining scum then kenpachi has got all of them.
On May 07 2012 21:51 layabout wrote: frogg we are not lynching kenpachi.
don't be silly. On May 07 2012 22:12 layabout wrote:I would love to know how you felt that this: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 04:37 Nova_Terra wrote: Next, Kenpachi Absolutely worthless, if you consider his connection case useful i dunno what to say Vote: Kenpachi On May 07 2012 13:19 PaqMan wrote:Just found out that I'm probably going to miss the lynch. I guess it doesn't bother anyone how fast a wagon formed on NT? I don't feel comfortable putting my vote back onto him. Hence this quote: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:11 Kenpachi wrote:On May 06 2012 06:48 Blazinghand wrote:Yeah, I shot Palmar. He looked like scum to me. I gave him the benefit of the doubt D1 but he didn't contribute and was silent, as scum Palmar tends to be. Here's my crumb: On May 06 2012 03:27 Blazinghand wrote: Man this situation just makes me want to eat my own heart Type "eat heart of" into google search (but don't hit enter) and it'll suggest "eat heart of palm" Palm -> Palmar, my target. rofl are you kidding me His only post since D2 started. He ninja-voted D1, isn't contributing and the few posts he has are very lackluster. From what I understand Kenpachi is a veteran, yet he's been the least helpful out of everyone (excluding Froggynoddy, who is inactive). Also this gem: + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 06:31 Kenpachi wrote:ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING ME? DO YOU NOT NOTICE THE TREND HERE? NT i thought at first was not mafia but then layabout cames along and throws in POLICY LYNCH TIME NO NO NO WTF? NO i believe layabout and NT are mafia together because NT NT had aroused suspicions in thread andended in hotshit. He was completely saved by something so stupid. layabout, as his buttbuddy saves him with such a weak push that only the newbs are following. by experience, policy lynch almost always never works. its a scare tactic, not an actual method used to lynch people, especially day 1 i also believe marvellosity is mafia with them because he said NT is scummy and changes his mind like nothing happened Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 02:43 marvellosity wrote: At the moment Nova looks the scummiest for reasons already expanded upon by others. The fact that so little of anything has occurred today makes Nova's stance that he doesn't want to air his tentative reads all the worse.
Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 05:53 marvellosity wrote: Sold, I don't have a solid scumread on anyone and BM is just useless and anti-town no matter his alignment.
such a contradiction, they were made about 3 hours apart. BM is a potent player and everyone knows that. I feel day 1 lynching a veteran is the worst thing you can do. If i were mafia, id put BM near the top of my priority list just because of his sheer experience. He made his scum reads and calls out who he believes to be the remaining scum team. But he doesn't push for their lynch or pressure them or anything at all. As of now I think Kenpachi is a better option than NT. ##Vote KenpachiI'm hoping I'll make it back before the deadline but I'm not too sure. was the best lynch to support? Why dont you have a look through here and tell me what you learn about kenpachi's play? Then address the cases on the people that should get lynched: Blubbdavid or Nova_Terra or might get mislynched: layabout. On May 07 2012 22:26 layabout wrote:EBWOP*So you are saying that it doesn't matter if your logic for voting on day1 is weak/contradictory/scummy because we have limited information? Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 22:19 froggynoddy wrote:On May 07 2012 22:15 layabout wrote:On May 07 2012 22:07 froggynoddy wrote:EBWOP: was reading through blubb's and then NT's filter's, (NT's attack of him seems odd: did he explain wtf he meant by that?!?) as former being your vote and the latter having the most votes. I'd rather blub defended himself as it will give us more to work with but a lot of what you've said, Laya, seem to be a criticism of blubb's Day 1 vote logic, which as we all know is bound to be weak. Most of our votes were bound to be wrong, and all of our logic to be hugely flawed due to limited evidence. So you are saying that it doesn't matter if your logic for voting on day1 is weak/contracitory/scummy because we have limited information? No, I'm saying that its less likely of being alignment indicative then actual thread activity at this point. But Kenpachi has been more "active" than froggnoddy, Eiii, l10f, ghost_403 johnnywub, grush, mementoss, sinensis and papaganda. He might not even have PC acess at the momnet That post^ is complete BS that I don't even understand how he could have possibly came to that conclusion. The only person he's been more active than is froggynoddy, and even then Froggy's posts have way more quality than KP's does. On May 07 2012 22:35 layabout wrote:Show nested quote +On May 07 2012 22:26 froggynoddy wrote:On May 07 2012 22:12 layabout wrote:I would love to know how you felt that this: + Show Spoiler +On May 07 2012 04:37 Nova_Terra wrote: Next, Kenpachi Absolutely worthless, if you consider his connection case useful i dunno what to say Vote: Kenpachi On May 07 2012 13:19 PaqMan wrote:Just found out that I'm probably going to miss the lynch. I guess it doesn't bother anyone how fast a wagon formed on NT? I don't feel comfortable putting my vote back onto him. Hence this quote: Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:11 Kenpachi wrote:On May 06 2012 06:48 Blazinghand wrote:Yeah, I shot Palmar. He looked like scum to me. I gave him the benefit of the doubt D1 but he didn't contribute and was silent, as scum Palmar tends to be. Here's my crumb: On May 06 2012 03:27 Blazinghand wrote: Man this situation just makes me want to eat my own heart Type "eat heart of" into google search (but don't hit enter) and it'll suggest "eat heart of palm" Palm -> Palmar, my target. rofl are you kidding me His only post since D2 started. He ninja-voted D1, isn't contributing and the few posts he has are very lackluster. From what I understand Kenpachi is a veteran, yet he's been the least helpful out of everyone (excluding Froggynoddy, who is inactive). Also this gem: + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 06:31 Kenpachi wrote:ARE YOU GUYS KIDDING ME? DO YOU NOT NOTICE THE TREND HERE? NT i thought at first was not mafia but then layabout cames along and throws in POLICY LYNCH TIME NO NO NO WTF? NO i believe layabout and NT are mafia together because NT NT had aroused suspicions in thread andended in hotshit. He was completely saved by something so stupid. layabout, as his buttbuddy saves him with such a weak push that only the newbs are following. by experience, policy lynch almost always never works. its a scare tactic, not an actual method used to lynch people, especially day 1 i also believe marvellosity is mafia with them because he said NT is scummy and changes his mind like nothing happened Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 02:43 marvellosity wrote: At the moment Nova looks the scummiest for reasons already expanded upon by others. The fact that so little of anything has occurred today makes Nova's stance that he doesn't want to air his tentative reads all the worse.
Show nested quote +On May 05 2012 05:53 marvellosity wrote: Sold, I don't have a solid scumread on anyone and BM is just useless and anti-town no matter his alignment.
such a contradiction, they were made about 3 hours apart. BM is a potent player and everyone knows that. I feel day 1 lynching a veteran is the worst thing you can do. If i were mafia, id put BM near the top of my priority list just because of his sheer experience. He made his scum reads and calls out who he believes to be the remaining scum team. But he doesn't push for their lynch or pressure them or anything at all. As of now I think Kenpachi is a better option than NT. ##Vote KenpachiI'm hoping I'll make it back before the deadline but I'm not too sure. was the best lynch to support? Why dont you have a look through here and tell me what you learn about kenpachi's play? Then address the cases on the people that should get lynched: Blubbdavid or Nova_Terra or might get mislynched: layabout. Ok, so... are you trying to show me that because he plays like this both as town and scum we should excuse untowny behaviour? I don't like that as an argument as untowny behaviour should always be punished. That being said I understand that perhaps this would be a better job for any vigs we have left. It just seems unlikely unless we do unless we have a pyro. I will keep reading through threads and see if anything convinces me. As I said, other than what I think about lynching into inactives, NT's weird post (see above post) and your hard defence on Katina seem like the strongest indications of scumminess imo. It was more of an "inactivity from a player that's always inactive is meaningless". There is also some merit to the notion that scum will try to lynch Kenpachi.I am not sure what you are trying to say but blue pyro's are trackers not not vigis. Again, you cannot be freaking serious. You pushed for BM's lynch, am I correct? S O HOW ARE YOU DEFENDING KP WHEN KP'S PLAY MATCHES EXACTLY LIKE BM! lurk, lurk, lurk, inactive, spam one-liners, purposely not contribute, purposely play anti-town. KP said that he's so busy he cannot possibly play, but he could have EASILY come up with a small read/fos/case on someone. Instead, he wastes what little time he has to shit up the thread. KP is the most anti-town player in the game right now, and you're defending him hard. Remind me why you wanted BM lynched.
#5 + Show Spoiler +On May 05 2012 07:04 Bill Murray wrote: well, layabout hopping on the lynch makes me really suspect him he would normally leave me around if he's town of my wagon, i would like you all to lynch layabout On May 08 2012 04:22 blubbdavid wrote: layabout is scum, SA is town I will not move my vote from layabout -snipped- Hmm. The victims of our mislynches both suggest to lynch layabout. And so far we're ignoring them.
Why I believe layabout to be scum boils down to; 1) Has nothing on blubb, but as soon as DYH pushes a case and lynch on him, layabout makes a weak case and pushes it forward as if he had been suspecting him for a while. 2) layabout does not create his own scumreads, does not establish his own opinions, and does not make his own stance. He has other people do the work for him, and then he starts pushing reads. Basically, he's not scum hunting. 3) All of layabout's "good, quality posts" are the only ones where he is defending himself, not doing any actual scumhunting. 4) People previously thought his analysis on Kat was an attempt at soft-defending. But after individually separating his posts, we can all clearly see how hard he is defending Kenpachi. KP's play is awfully similar to BM's. 5) I'm restating this one because I feel it's one of the stronger points against layabout: He does not actively hunt scum. All he does is push other people's reads.
I retract my FoS on him. I'm confident that layabout is scum and I want him lynched tomorrow.
+ Show Spoiler [layabout's defense] +On May 09 2012 01:34 layabout wrote: I am just gonna hope i get shot so i don't have to explain myself. Again.
I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself.
Kenpachi flipped scum? Lol. Guess who was hard defending KP? Layabout layabout pushed for BM's lynch. KP played just like BM, except layabout was immediately against lynching KP.
##Vote layabout
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I just got home. I'll look more into NT but I really want people to read the case against layabout and tell me what they think of him.
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marvel I want you to tell me why you don't think layabout isn't scum, or why you think NT is scummier than laya.
still reading into NT.
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The argument that NT "bussed" Kenpachi is so invalid. He made it known that he wanted KP dead more than 4 days ago. If anyone should look suspicious for bussing it should be me. Which I'm really really surprised no one has even mentioned that.
NT has so many ugly little one-liners and zero contributions. I read through his entire filter (it was an eyesore).
Ask yourselves, "If NT was scum, what does he achieve for playing the way that he currently is?" He doesn't push forth any sort of scum agenda and his actions don't make much sense from a scum point-of-view. How is NT helping scum by playing the way he that he is? He isn't.
The cases and pushes against NT look awfully similar to the blubb train and I want to avoid that. I think NT is just an idiot town (no offense dude, not trying to be rude). I don't want to lynch NT while layabout is alive.
I think my case against layabout + the reasons to believe layabout is scum are far far far greater than NT's. THE ONLY RESPONSE layabout made was this: + Show Spoiler +On May 09 2012 01:34 layabout wrote: I am just gonna hope i get shot so i don't have to explain myself. Again.
I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself. I have lost track of how many times i have had to repeat myself.
Because all of my points are valid and true. I am totally confident that layabout is scum.
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On May 09 2012 08:14 layabout wrote: I have a very busy day tomorrow, and i will try to do what i can.
I will try to share my important reads and i will respond to the case that Paqman has made. (you should be able to spot the errors if you try to look at it objectively.)
You have no idea how pissed off i am that i choose BM as the policy lynch or that i complained about players not putting in effort, or that i said we shouldn't lynch katina or that the case i pushed Johnnywub and blubb given what has happened.
You never said we shouldn't lynch katina, you never made a read on him. You never pushed a case on jdub, you called him out for lurking and that was it.
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I don't think you read my case.. The only thing that you might have repeated was about Palmar. My case pointed out the fact that all you've done is push other people's scum reads, that you haven't been scumhunting, that most of your filter is only made up of you defending yourself, and that you put way more effort into creating those defenses instead of actively hunting scum.
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ebwop: throw in the fact that you were hard-defending your scumbuddy KP. Which is weird because the same reasons that you wanted BM lynched could have been applied to KP.
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The whole situation on NT looks very much like ottox in LIII.
I'm aware that it's not much of a justifiable reason but I feel that NT is just horrible/bad. Look at it from a scum point of view and tell me what is NT accomplishing? Nothing at all except setting his own ass on fire.
Look at layabout with a scum point of view and his entire filter is incriminating. He's contradicting himself everywhere. He's pushing other peoples reads instead of making his own, even when asked. He doesn't make & push his own reads. He isn't actively hunting scum. He's so preoccupied with defending himself. He puts way more effort into writing quarter-page posts instead of hunting scum. He isn't contributing to town. If you look at the bigger picture, everything he's done has been pro-scum.
Overall, Nova has done nothing to suggest to me that he isn't scum. He has a long filter with no scumhunting, but plenty of throwaway accusations. He contradicts himself. Your accusations can also very easily be applied to layabout.
So tell me, if NT has done nothing to show you that he isn't scum, what has layabout done?
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look at layabout from a scum point of view and tell me what he has accomplished/is accomplishing for his scum team? 1- pushed a mislynch on BM. 2- pushed a mislynch on blubb. 3- no contribution to town 4-no individual/personal reads, allowing him to sit back and chill 5- pushes forth other people's reads 6- doesn't have to actively hunt for his own teammates because he's too busy writing intricate defenses.
compare that to the actions NT has made.
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On May 09 2012 08:55 marvellosity wrote: I see the possibility that layabout is just a frustrated townie who has been goaded into defending himself too much.
Frustrated how? because people kept bringing up the same argument against him?
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How does that "frustration" play into any of the reasons he is scum.
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