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My defense against BJ
On April 24 2012 18:40 BlazingJitsu wrote:Examining the VE wagon, the vote for him that stands out the most is Ottoxlol's vote. Let's take a look: + Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
He has 5 votes right now against marv's 6.
Is he a good player?
He argued we shouldn't give any info to the scum then claim he's a JK.
If he did not claim and we lynch marv or anyone, then scum wouldnt kill him because he had votes.
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
##Vote: VisceraEyes
This is a bullshit reason for voting VisceraEyes. If we take a look at it at it's core, he's basically saying "VE played in a sub-optimal way" as the basis for his case, but take a look at how he finishes his little case summary: Yes. VE is good -> if VE is town he shouldn't have claimed. Why is this bullshit reasoning?
Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 16:36 Ottoxlol wrote:
This contradiction is enough for me to vote VE, everyone saying he is a good player, if he is indeed town JK he shouldn't have played this way. So I trust you guys on that he is good also that means he is a scum.
He closes off his case by trying to abdicate responsibility for it. He knows VE is going to flip town, and he wants to blame other people when it happens without sounding inconsistent. I see, scum Ottox would post this I aggree.
Now, on its own, maybe this wouldn't be so bad. I mean, it's scummy as fuck, but maybe we have bigger targets, like Marv? Well, let's take a look on what Ottoxlol has been doing to "scumhunt" since D1: + Show Spoiler +On April 24 2012 15:52 Ottoxlol wrote:
I havent finished reading everything, but so far I had an idea
I thought I will write down the VE voters relationships maybe we can figure something out.
Sentinel attacked BM
Ottox did not attack anyone from this grp
marv attacked Zeph
BM defending Zeph and marv
laya attacking marv, defending zeph
Zeph attacking BM, and marv
I think this will not make a strong read, but I try
If Sentinel is scummy, we should investigate Zeph and vice versa
If laya is scummy we should investigate Zeph and vice versa
If marv is scummy we should investigate BM and vice versa
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So my read is there are 0 or 2 scums in the VE voter group, maybe we can use this later
This is Ottoxlol trying to push people who were on the VE wagon with some unhelpful WIFOM. Paying close attention to this post, you'll realize he doesn't actually push anyone as scum. This is unhelpful shitty dick play. This is scum play that he set up D1. This is Ottoxlol trying to pool the proverbial wool over the town's eyes by trying to appear helpful. I wrote that I don't have a good read that's why i did not push. I started to look into the names that came up and I felt none of them was convincing so I made a post that maybe can help others. How is that anti-town?
Ottoxlol, you didn't want to take responsibility for your vote on VE, and you don't want to take responsibility for pushing others on his wagon. Your posts are waffling, unhelpful, and scummy. You can read my posts, I still stand beside my reasoning. Especially after he started yelling and spewing up random names. I pushed him because I sincerely thought he was scum. No one came up with anything that swayed me.
##vote: OttoxlolCome at me bro
-Blazinghand
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On April 24 2012 00:19 BlazingJitsu wrote:
Well guys all I have to say is you should have listened to me and we should have lynched Marv. You have my deepest assurance that over the course of the next 72 hours I will stop at nothing to get Marv lynched. It should have been obvious that VE was playing crappy town play. It was obvious to me. It was obvious to Risen. In fact, it's interesting how obvious it was to people who put any decent thought into it or were intelligent, thoughtful people, that this was the case.
All of you who had your votes on people that weren't Marv, you also allowed this to happen. You allowed a delicious mixture of jubjubs and scum to lead us down a path of idiocy. I typically try not to beat people up over this sort of thing, but it's so blatantly obvious that Marv is scum.
You did not make a good enough case against Marv and you did not defend VE. So you were not that confident.
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On April 24 2012 20:05 BlazingJitsu wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 19:45 Ottoxlol wrote:On April 24 2012 00:19 BlazingJitsu wrote:
Well guys all I have to say is you should have listened to me and we should have lynched Marv. You have my deepest assurance that over the course of the next 72 hours I will stop at nothing to get Marv lynched. It should have been obvious that VE was playing crappy town play. It was obvious to me. It was obvious to Risen. In fact, it's interesting how obvious it was to people who put any decent thought into it or were intelligent, thoughtful people, that this was the case.
All of you who had your votes on people that weren't Marv, you also allowed this to happen. You allowed a delicious mixture of jubjubs and scum to lead us down a path of idiocy. I typically try not to beat people up over this sort of thing, but it's so blatantly obvious that Marv is scum.
You did not make a good enough case against Marv and you did not defend VE. So you were not that confident. lol this kid
-Blazinghand
Nice comment bro, so are you speechless? VE did not respond to anything, making us believe he's scum or doesn't give a hoots about the game. You seem very engaged, I suggest you come up with something good why did u switched from tunneling marv. You did accuse me, I respond, you did not.
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LOL I don't understand your case.
You say the reason I'm scum because the way i voted VE. First I made a case about why VE is playing badly about the massvigclaim plan, then when he claimed, I stated my reasoning why he shouldn't have, and because you guys said he's the best player ever it's obvious that he is scum. I stated why a scum VE would claim and asked him why did he think the claim was good play. He did not respond, started accusing every second player and yelling, then rqd.
I blame my vote on VE's bad play and lack of interest.
You still did not respond why is this strong enough to switch from tunneling marv.
Stating my posts are worthless, when you did not help town at all (not defending VE when you claim it was obv he's town, not stating a single good case that would rally ppl from VE), is the nail in your coffin.
#vote BlazingJitsu
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And insulting the other instead of arguing will help a lot, good tactic. Next you will claim JK right?
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On April 24 2012 20:58 BlazingJitsu wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On April 24 2012 20:37 Ottoxlol wrote:
You say the reason I'm scum because the way i voted VE. First I made a case about why VE is playing badly about the massvigclaim plan, then when he claimed, I stated my reasoning why he shouldn't have, and because you guys said he's the best player ever it's obvious that he is scum. I stated why a scum VE would claim and asked him why did he think the claim was good play. He did not respond, started accusing every second player and yelling, then rqd.
WRONG. First you made a case in which you said that your vote was PREDICATED on other people's statements in which you ABDICATED responsibility. Then (and hey! you forgot to address this part in your post!) after the flips, you decided to do a totally nocomittal push of the other people on the VE wagon in a way that you could point at the post and say "look I'm justified in hopping on this wagon" later in the day. And now that you're called out for your scum tactics you're afraid and lonely. I already explained this in my previous posts, if you choose to ignore it I hope others will notice so thanks
+ Show Spoiler +On April 24 2012 20:37 Ottoxlol wrote:
You still did not respond why is this strong enough to switch from tunneling marv. You really don't get it, do you? You know why I just voted you now as opposed to, say, during N1 or D1? Because during N1 and D1 you hadn't followed up on your waffling, blame-shifting VE vote (and subsequent blue flip) with a shitty waffling catch-all shit-fling at the other wagon members. You see, Marv WAS the best target up until you made your "hey guys there are 0 or 2 scum on the wagon" post a few hours ago. Now, it's you by a nose. I already explained this in my previous posts, if you choose to ignore it I hope others will notice so thanks
Show nested quote +On April 24 2012 20:37 Ottoxlol wrote:
Stating my posts are worthless, when you did not help town at all (not defending VE when you claim it was obv he's town, not stating a single good case that would rally ppl from VE), is the nail in your coffin.
#vote BlazingJitsu Your posts ARE worthless. I pushed Marv D1 and I'm proud of the fact. There's no pride in your posting. only waffling. This case against me is the only REAL post you've made all game and anyone who looks at your filter will see that. Not true. I engaged in the massvigclaim debate. I had a strong case against VE, I pushed it. You had a half assed case on marv and tunneled on it all day, did not care for any other thing going on contrary to your claim that you knew VE was town. If you're proud of that (letting a fellow townie get lynched) then you are scum.
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I did not do anything to hunt scum?
LOOK AT MY FILTER. I had questions, inspected every single claim and post looking for inconsistencies. I made a case against VE, pushed it. I was wrong, but why is that not scum hunting?
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I have no strong reads, thats why i did not pushed anyone. This is I think the 3rd time I posted this in an hour, please read.
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[QUOTE]On April 24 2012 21:29 Mementoss wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +On April 23 2012 10:38 Ottoxlol wrote:
It seems like the ppl doesnt read the whole thread.
My case against VE was simple.
He told us never give up any information to the scum, then proceed to a bad claim that ensures his early death as a blue. This is bad play, hes the best player ever so he would not do that if he is indeed town JK. I tried to ask him about this decision tell me what did I miss or what was his idea what would happen, no answer. He ignored my 6 posts directed towards him, then after the votes started to pile up on him he tried defending himself, I told him what am i interested in, he talked about the massvigclaim after we already closed it and had nothing to do with his lynch. He did not read my posts, failed to comprehend them and when I asked him to explain his play he start writing in all caps, and ragequitting. Like a scum VE.
The timing was strange too, the claim was around the time BM ninja voted.
I did not vote on him because of his bad play, I voted him because he did not answer to my accusations or questions just gave up like a little girl.
He says statements that have the potential to explain why it could have been scummy actions but he never explains why its scummy. Such as: "The timing was strange", wait what, how? Also, you did not vote on him based on bad play? Then why the fuck did you talk about it so much in all your posts directed to him? It musta had somewhat of a good influence on your voting towards him.
My other posts explained why the timing was strange. If scum VE wants to claim he claims when he's pressured and an easy wagon appears. I said the bad play can mean 2 things, either he's town or a scum (wow that was surprising). If he would have answered why he thought it was good as townie or at least not give up I would have considered that he's not trying to escape the lynch with a fakeclaim, but he tried something that was not optimal. If you look at my filter you can see, I asked about him because before his claim I had only a little suspicion on him
+ Show Spoiler +On April 22 2012 23:27 Ottoxlol wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 23:05 Mattchew wrote:
If you want to vote for VE because he is not playing Jailkeeper the way you would, you are a jubjub. If you can think of a good reason that a scum VE would logically claim there, or at all on day 1, please present that. Scum VE failed at logic at the plan discussion phase, then proceeded to avoid answering to my questions 5 times in a row. Since he still did not explained why it is good for us that he claimed, I don't see how can this be anything but anti-town. Scum would claim this if they want to avoid a d1 lynch and a nice wagon appears that not too suspicious to jump on. Like the BM train. I wonder how many scums are on that. If i were a vig i would definitely shoot there.
Well you dodged matthews question. So that makes you scum by your own logic? You say its anti-town, or bad town, you don't say its scummy, or why its scummy. Just its bad for town. You note that scum would do this to avoid a day 1 lynch, but wait, VE didn't do that, he had barely any pressure on him when he claimed, he had 3 votes to Marvs 6. So this is just wrong. Also you say that scum would want to jump on the BM wagon, well at the time BM wagon as you call it was barely even moving. I think it had 2-3 votes.
What? I did not say why is it scummy? Reread. I was arguing if he's playing a bad townie play or a scummy scum play, this choice of words further proves my previous reply that I wanted him to respond, to explain his play.VE had 5 votes against marv's 6. This is also in one of my posts, this was why I argued he shouldnt have claimed because scum was very unlikely to night kill the second highest vote. He claimed right after BM voted for him -> ninja vote ez wagon.
Basically your avoiding giving a detailed opinion on who is scum and why they are scum at all costs. You give handy suggestions like vigs shoot into BM voters. Or your little WIFOM earlier, but that is it.
I don't, I had a case d1 about VE, I pushed it. It was a big fail. If I have a strong read I will post it.
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I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong.
Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts.
Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there
layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town
Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution
Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too.
We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched.
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So your case is that I can't make a case? Please make a case before calling me out.
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On April 24 2012 23:29 ghost_403 wrote:
StDaniel is en route to being modkilled. If he comes back and does nothing, I will discuss him as a possible lynch candidate. Since he's not even playing, there's no point in pushing for his lynch.
@marv: Ottoxlol's posting history shows him posting outside the TLMafia subforum, so I'm leaning newbie on him. However, some of the stuff that I've seen him do in thread has made me think he's "newbie scum" as opposed to "newbie town". BJ's (lol) case addresses some of that. I really need to work on reading newbie towns, so that is something I think I would like to work on.
Can you quote what of BJ's stuff made sense to you? I addressed all of it I think, but if something is still not clear i would like to explain.
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On April 25 2012 00:27 Mattchew wrote:
Lurkers: Janaan, St Daniel, Broodking Exe, Bill Murray, Sentinel
Scum-reads - Zeph, Ottox (will probably post more about this later today or tomorrow)
Also, Risen has not improved in a way that allows me to use meta anymore to defend him. He did adamantly try and protect he best townie (and a blue) from lynch however. I can't see a reason for scum doing this, but then again that might be EXACTLY why he did it. idk, but he is probably the scummiest after the other 6.
On April 24 2012 22:21 Ottoxlol wrote:
I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong.
Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts.
Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there
layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town
Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution
Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too.
We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched.
How's the first post any better then the second?
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Ok, post it when you got it drawn. I feel like the pressure is on me because I did not make any useful post d2, and i feel its really unfair when no one really did so.
I am thinking on the line of who should we lynch that gives us info. VE wagon seemed like a good start to look at, I made 3 pairs who seems to defend each other/attack the same persons. If we lynch anyone from that we can get information about the other half of the pair.
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On April 22 2012 02:44 layabout wrote:
I think marvel looks bad because he was around in the first couple of hours of the game, he was willing to make comments in the thread but he was unwilling to share an opinion. Every player should have an opinion about what is best, and the only players who would fear to share them are mafia, since telling and possibly helping town to do what you think is best for town is not in your best interests.
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What? So we shouldn't look at what happened 3 days ago?
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On April 25 2012 00:57 Ottoxlol wrote:
I am thinking on the line of who should we lynch that gives us info. VE wagon seemed like a good start to look at, I made 3 pairs who seems to defend each other/attack the same persons. If we lynch anyone from that we can get information about the other half of the pair.
This. Anyone have a better plan?
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On April 24 2012 22:21 Ottoxlol wrote:
I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong.
Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts.
Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there
layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town
Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution
Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too.
We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched.
Still BM.
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On April 25 2012 01:43 Mementoss wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 01:40 Ottoxlol wrote:On April 25 2012 00:57 Ottoxlol wrote:
I am thinking on the line of who should we lynch that gives us info. VE wagon seemed like a good start to look at, I made 3 pairs who seems to defend each other/attack the same persons. If we lynch anyone from that we can get information about the other half of the pair. This. Anyone have a better plan? Well this is a scum tell if I ever heard one. We lynch who we think is scum. If they are scum, that automatically gives us information. We don't lynch for information. You could easily be scum saying, if we lynch this guy it gives us information on this guy. Wasting 2 days of lynch into townies.
Ok, you clearly did not got my reasoning. Of course we lynch for scum, this is the plan to what to do with that information.
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On April 25 2012 01:45 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2012 01:44 Ottoxlol wrote:On April 24 2012 22:21 Ottoxlol wrote:
I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong.
Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts.
Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there
layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town
Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution
Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too.
We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched. Still BM. Ok, so your stance is we should lynch BM because ... he's been lurking? Do you have anything to say about the Zephirdd/Sentinel cases?
They lurk too, but less then BM. I'm fine with any of them lynched.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ejfdd.png)
