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On April 11 2012 18:14 VisceraEyes wrote:BH is definitely looking bad to me. The last game we were in together (as town) he took AS active of a stance as I did in trying to lead town (at least, when he showed up he did  ). I've said before that I think he looks different this game, and I'm pretty sure by now that it's because he's scum. I want zelblade to post more. I want a lot of people to post more. gonzaw isn't one of them. What do you agree with in Toad's case Gonzaw? What part of it resonates with you? Is it the part where he calls himself confirmed town seventeen times or is it the part where he says I have a read on him in spite of saying he's unreadable? Because that's literally all his case is. Literally. I'm sorry I wasn't as active as you liked D1, and I've promised that wouldn't be the case since I've returned...and since I've returned that has been the case. I don't know what else you expect from me except to find scum, and that's what I've done. I fucking guarantee Toad is scum. What else do you want from me Gonzaw? What else do you want from me ANYONE IN TOWN? This wagon on me is dumb, and got way big way fast. Scum ARE on it. I don't know how many, but it's a decent cross-section of town and I'm not on it, so scum are most assuredly on my wagon already. I attest that one is Toad and if his stupidity persists, Bugs too.
I find both your and Toad's case bad.
I think I (and some other players) mentioned better things that makes both of you scum, but neither of you mention them at all and only stick to your "cases".
When confronted about it, both of you get "angry" and divert the attention to something else (mostly FoSing or shitting me). Both of you are fucking the thread up, and your cases against each other are pretty bad.
If you were town you would have noticed something wrong, you would have changed your behaviour, you would have analysed Toad further and comment on other things mentioned about him, etc.
On April 11 2012 20:04 VisceraEyes wrote:
Gonzaw, your case on Toad is right on the fucking money. I couldn't agree with your case more. There's just one little thing about it I dislike. A trifle really. I'm not scum with him.
:OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Seriously though - your case on me is summed up thusly:
1) I'm not as active as you're used to seeing
2) I hadn't commented on your case on Toad.
My Responses:
1) I'm sorry I was busy on Easter. I overestimated the amount of time I'd be at home over the course of that day. If you want to be suspicious of me for not being as active as I usually am, then at least cut me some leeway when I actually do come back. I'm trying guy, and I thought that much was clear.
2) Here's the thing about that: I DIDN'T WANT TO DIE OVERNIGHT! FUCK man, I've been N1 killed or D1 killed every game I've played in for what seems like a quarter of a year. Tired of that shit man! So yes, I withheld my customary N1 reads because I was afraid they'd influence the night-kills. It was a SCUMMY (there I said it) and SELFISH act of self-preservation that I do NOT regret because I'm here now to comment on your Toad case...where I felt if I'd shared my reads overnight, the way I customarily do in grand fashion, I would have died.
Now, your case on Toad. His posting is very similar to 48, and he's exhibiting some of the same kinds of tactics (claiming confirmed town, gigantic walls that say nothing). You never really commented on it, but in my case I mentioned how he spent 3 paragraphs in his response and even more in further posts responding to Katina's accusation and vote: someone who by his estimation wasn't even really calling him scum in the first place. That's an awfully defensive position for someone who was NOT called scum. You called my case shitty. I suspect you didn't read it. My sadness is....vast.
I'm NOT interested in a gonzaw lynch today. Don't even think about it.
1)Not, you were pretty active, I already said it, here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=325046¤tpage=23#445
But you weren't aggressive, you weren't confident, you were all over the place being kind of "cheerful" and just trying to blend in. That's not how you play town at all.
2)You already FoSed Toad, why the hell would you withhold your thoughts about my case or what everybody else where saying about him? That doesn't make sense.
You also didn't mention it once D2 started, you completely ignored it
Your case against Toad on D1/N1 was pretty bad; and yours against him this day isn't very good either.
I already explained why your D1/N1 case is bad.
Your D2 case was not good either.
You focus on Toad being "sure" of what happened last night. Hey, I was pretty "sure" about it too, ET vigged michael and another vig vigged ST. It's speculation, but pretty apparent, and it would take new evidence to shatter that point of view. There's nothing scummy with what he did there.
Then you just defend yourself, and dwell on the "nobody is confirmed town" point. That doesn't make him scum either, it makes him overconfident (or appearing to be so) and annoying, no matter his alignment.
That's it; also you mention that Toad's case on you is bad, and conclude he's scum. Sorry, but that's a case as bad as Toad's one on me.
I'm stuck at page 61 thought and saw you made a new case, so I'll check it out.
However, even if that was the summum of all cases, it doesn't take away what you did (or failed to do) in D1/N1/beginning of D2.
On April 11 2012 21:56 zelblade wrote:
I agree that johnnywup is suspicious. But can we please focus on getting the whole VE/WBG/Toad thing settled first? I am fine with discussion on scummy people, since limiting discussion to just this incident is bad, but can we please stop trying to push the lynch today somewhere else?
The point isn't to create a new lynch. The point is for people to just post their thoughts and pressure other players.
Imagine everybody thinks johnny is scum, yet nobody does shit because we "have to focus on VE/Toad". Then johnny goes this whole day unnoticed and free to do whatever he likes because he's not being pressured.
Even if we don't vote for someone, discussion about him is still healthy, and is needed if we want to win this game.
Anyways zel, I posted some thoughts about you, any comments on that?
Program to determine misslynches:
GMarshall allowed me to post it, so here it is:
http://www.mediafire.com/?83f52bck4t134lm
Here is the code of the program, this is the one you should manipulate if you want to change scums KP, or the number of townies/scum:
http://www.mediafire.com/?5qnc5uscoagzrpw
Here are the other modules where the shit is done (if you want to check them or not, it's your choice):
http://www.mediafire.com/?9ea50rs58ij89ja
http://www.mediafire.com/?xf4p130qez5me5x
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On April 12 2012 02:18 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:18 Tunkeg wrote:On April 12 2012 02:15 marvellosity wrote:On April 12 2012 02:14 Tunkeg wrote:On April 12 2012 02:11 Mementoss wrote:On April 12 2012 02:07 Tunkeg wrote:On April 12 2012 01:38 Katina wrote:On April 11 2012 23:40 Tunkeg wrote:
Here is the scumteam and how they play the game now:
Viscera "Oh I am fucked anyways time to make some accusations on my scummate BH" Eyes
Adam "I will stab VE in the back and accuse BH for town cred" 4167
Ka " I love VE so much, don't kill him" tina
Blazing "I don't give a fuck about what you geezers are doing" Hand.
I am totally in Toads corner on this one. I am as certain as I have ever been i na mafia game --> VE is scum. Toad is bad at finding scum, I am bad at finding scum, but when we team up we are a beast. In Arkham City we hit scum everyday together. You can say we are T and T = TNT.
My post on why VE is scum comming up! Hi, I was saw this and thought it was interesting. If you have been reading the thread you would see that I think VE is scum and I would be more than happy with a VE or Toad lynch today. Hmm, my bad. You don't love him afterall, must be my jealous heart. I still think you are scum though... Ladies and Gentleman, logic at its finest Retardation at it's worst. Where did I say that I think Katina is scum because she loves VE? I said I think she is scum. Now I am back to ignoring you. If you are being stupid and try to twist anything I say I will respond you though. I will also stop ignoring you if I find you scummy, and not just completely useless... So instead of a stupid reason for thinking kita is scum, you in fact have no reason at all? Excellent. So you think my reason for BH being scum is that he gives a fuck about the rest of the scumccrew, and my reason for thinking adam is scum is because he is backstapping VE? Are you serious. You god damn nitpicking bastards, are you stupid or just enjoy arguing about nonsense? If you're not going to say why you think someone is scum, then don't bother saying it. It doesn't contribute ANYTHING, it serves as a pointless distraction. Understand?
I can say what the fuck I like, you got that?
Why would I make cases on all four of them at once? I want to kill the one I suspect the most, and that is VE? Its called focusing. And we need to focus on the target we think is most scummy to have a chance to succeed, otherwise scum will sway this lynch over onto a townie.
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On April 12 2012 02:22 Tunkeg wrote:
I can say what the fuck I like, you got that?
1.) Play nice. This is a refined game, I expect you all to behave like Gentlemen (or Ladies, as the case may be). I will not hesitate to modkill or outright ban you for excessive behavior.
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Meant to quote that 2nd bit, but you get the picture.
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On April 12 2012 02:19 Mementoss wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:12 Toadesstern wrote:On April 12 2012 02:06 Mementoss wrote:
Toad - "Yes that's an educated guess but I am pretty sure we don't have mafia tripplestacking ST and 4 townies shooting each other and frankly that's what VE says I am not considering. Sure it's possible but how in the world would someone think about such a scenario?
Because he needs to think of such a stupid scenario for a vote on me to make sense at all."
Toad just a heads up I don't think this ever happened. The WIFOM was desperate, and making stuff up/exhagherating to defend yourself is also desperate. No it's not. If you don't think it ever happend you've got to admit that I am the guy who asked people to protect Jackal after all. Just answer me this question: Do you honestly think I'd do that as mafia if I was about to one-shoot Jackal? Do you really think I'd take that risk considering Jackal is a vet and people are probably already going to medic either him or wbg this game? This is not wifom. This is about what makes sense and what does not. This is about occam's razor. VE is the guy who told people NOT TO protect Jackal at any cost. I am the guy who told people to protect Jackal as well and not only wbg / VE. Jackal flipped, pretty likely to be shot with a single bullet. You really think that lynching me is the right move? Pretty sure michael and sputnik were vigged. What you say is all WIFOM though, honestly think of this, you could be mafia, who said that, and then killed him so you could use this medic thing to defend yourself. Then killed Midnight who put a case against VE, so that you could make yoru case about VE and use all this WIFOM to your advantage. It easily could be the exact opposite, and be what you said. That is the problem with WIFOM, that is why it is useless in most cases. Really, why would the medic protect Jackal? It made no sense, he was lurking hard, and there were plenty of other good candidates he could chose. Also with a 1/30 chance, it's doubtful medic would come into play day 1. It looks like Mafia picked people who they knew were decent but were pretty under the radar to kill to avoid running into a medic block. Just my opinion, and why I don't take WIFOM all that serious. Too many possibilities.
Ok I am going to make this clear. I don't care about you thinking it's Wifom because everything in this game is.
I want you to take a stance. I want you to TELL ME what you think is reasonable.
Do you think I am mafia telling people that they should shoot Jackal, to shoot him with a single bullet that night risking to lose a KP and possibly have Jackal life to tell the thread he absorbed a hit and having a medic who is pretty sure that he protected a townie that night?
Or do you think VE is mafia telling people not to protect Jackal at any cost to shoot him with a single bullet that night?
I want you to take a stance here. What do you think seems to be the reasonable, easy explanation for what happened yesterday.
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On April 12 2012 02:29 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:19 Mementoss wrote:On April 12 2012 02:12 Toadesstern wrote:On April 12 2012 02:06 Mementoss wrote:
Toad - "Yes that's an educated guess but I am pretty sure we don't have mafia tripplestacking ST and 4 townies shooting each other and frankly that's what VE says I am not considering. Sure it's possible but how in the world would someone think about such a scenario?
Because he needs to think of such a stupid scenario for a vote on me to make sense at all."
Toad just a heads up I don't think this ever happened. The WIFOM was desperate, and making stuff up/exhagherating to defend yourself is also desperate. No it's not. If you don't think it ever happend you've got to admit that I am the guy who asked people to protect Jackal after all. Just answer me this question: Do you honestly think I'd do that as mafia if I was about to one-shoot Jackal? Do you really think I'd take that risk considering Jackal is a vet and people are probably already going to medic either him or wbg this game? This is not wifom. This is about what makes sense and what does not. This is about occam's razor. VE is the guy who told people NOT TO protect Jackal at any cost. I am the guy who told people to protect Jackal as well and not only wbg / VE. Jackal flipped, pretty likely to be shot with a single bullet. You really think that lynching me is the right move? Pretty sure michael and sputnik were vigged. What you say is all WIFOM though, honestly think of this, you could be mafia, who said that, and then killed him so you could use this medic thing to defend yourself. Then killed Midnight who put a case against VE, so that you could make yoru case about VE and use all this WIFOM to your advantage. It easily could be the exact opposite, and be what you said. That is the problem with WIFOM, that is why it is useless in most cases. Really, why would the medic protect Jackal? It made no sense, he was lurking hard, and there were plenty of other good candidates he could chose. Also with a 1/30 chance, it's doubtful medic would come into play day 1. It looks like Mafia picked people who they knew were decent but were pretty under the radar to kill to avoid running into a medic block. Just my opinion, and why I don't take WIFOM all that serious. Too many possibilities. Ok I am going to make this clear. I don't care about you thinking it's Wifom because everything in this game is. I want you to take a stance. I want you to TELL ME what you think is reasonable. Do you think I am mafia telling people that they should protect Jackal, to shoot him with a single bullet that night risking to lose a KP and possibly have Jackal life to tell the thread he absorbed a hit and having a medic who is pretty sure that he protected a townie that night? Or do you think VE is mafia telling people not to protect Jackal at any cost to shoot him with a single bullet that night? I want you to take a stance here. What do you think seems to be the reasonable, easy explanation for what happened yesterday.
EBWOP :p
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On April 12 2012 02:29 Toadesstern wrote:
Ok I am going to make this clear. I don't care about you thinking it's Wifom because everything in this game is.
I want you to take a stance. I want you to TELL ME what you think is reasonable.
Do you think I am mafia telling people that they should shoot Jackal, to shoot him with a single bullet that night risking to lose a KP and possibly have Jackal life to tell the thread he absorbed a hit and having a medic who is pretty sure that he protected a townie that night?
Or do you think VE is mafia telling people not to protect Jackal at any cost to shoot him with a single bullet that night?
I want you to take a stance here. What do you think seems to be the reasonable, easy explanation for what happened yesterday.
This is not relevant.
You were under scrutiny in the thread. If you were scum maybe you counted on the medics not listening to you, so you could hit Jackal and then claim "confirmed town" because you "told" medics to save him.
It's the same as if you asked a DT to check a scumbuddy of yours. "Why would I tell a DT to check a scumbuddy of mine?" You did just to gain town cred once he flips, and in fact you didn't actually want the DT to check him and you knew your previous reputation would make the DT not listen to you.
Same thing here with Jackal and the medics.
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And again, about people complaining about me calling myself confirmed.
I'm sorry I do that and it reads as "I am a townie you moron and you should know because of X, Y or Z". Check my Storm, AC or L filter. All three games as a townie. All three games called multiple people confirmed.
I just don't understand how anyone would think lynching Toad because of the nighthits would be a good move. Neither Gonzaw nore VE checked what happened because clearly they were so fast to vote me. They checked the nighpost really quick and proceeded to vote me pretty much instantly without a second of a thought, without a reread or anything.
I could possibly understand gonzaw doing that as he clearly is tunneling me. Instavoting me like that without even explaining a thing is bad and I can see gonzaw do that as both townie and a mafia (hint: He is a mafia).
But there is no reason for VE to instantly vote for me without even thinking about what happend, without having anything on me unless he wants to desperatly get people on me to get a quick bandwagon so people don't talk about him as clearly there were a hand full of people considering him before I made my big post as well
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On April 12 2012 02:41 Toadesstern wrote:
And again, about people complaining about me calling myself confirmed.
I'm sorry I do that and it reads as "I am a townie you moron and you should know because of X, Y or Z". Check my Storm, AC or L filter. All three games as a townie. All three games called multiple people confirmed.
I just don't understand how anyone would think lynching Toad because of the nighthits would be a good move. Neither Gonzaw nore VE checked what happened because clearly they were so fast to vote me. They checked the nighpost really quick and proceeded to vote me pretty much instantly without a second of a thought, without a reread or anything.
I could possibly understand gonzaw doing that as he clearly is tunneling me. Instavoting me like that without even explaining a thing is bad and I can see gonzaw do that as both townie and a mafia (hint: He is a mafia).
But there is no reason for VE to instantly vote for me without even thinking about what happend, without having anything on me unless he wants to desperatly get people on me to get a quick bandwagon so people don't talk about him as clearly there were a hand full of people considering him before I made my big post as well
VE's post on you has put him through hell. His case against you has trained the eyes of the entire town on him as well. "He's just trying to start a bandwagon" is terrible logic.
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On April 12 2012 02:34 gonzaw wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:29 Toadesstern wrote:
Ok I am going to make this clear. I don't care about you thinking it's Wifom because everything in this game is.
I want you to take a stance. I want you to TELL ME what you think is reasonable.
Do you think I am mafia telling people that they should shoot Jackal, to shoot him with a single bullet that night risking to lose a KP and possibly have Jackal life to tell the thread he absorbed a hit and having a medic who is pretty sure that he protected a townie that night?
Or do you think VE is mafia telling people not to protect Jackal at any cost to shoot him with a single bullet that night?
I want you to take a stance here. What do you think seems to be the reasonable, easy explanation for what happened yesterday. This is not relevant. You were under scrutiny in the thread. If you were scum maybe you counted on the medics not listening to you, so you could hit Jackal and then claim "confirmed town" because you "told" medics to save him. It's the same as if you asked a DT to check a scumbuddy of yours. "Why would I tell a DT to check a scumbuddy of mine?" You did just to gain town cred once he flips, and in fact you didn't actually want the DT to check him and you knew your previous reputation would make the DT not listen to you. Same thing here with Jackal and the medics.
How was I unter scrutiny in the thread? You and Katina were the only 2 people you said they think I am scummy, everyone else said it's bullshit a null at worst and a townread at best.
And again, I don't actually count Katina as honestly thinking I am scum. He posted I am scum d1 very early while only saying I am posting walls of text just to disappear for the next 48 hours. No vote changed, pretty much nothing posted.
You were the only one who kept saying I am mafia Gonzaw. I repeat, the ONLY ONE. I don't think there's a reason people should not be willing to listen to me at all.
VE basicly said "NOONE PROTECT ANYONE BUT WBG AND ME" knowing that mafia won't shoot wbg.
I said screw that, consider other people like Jackal, myself and people like that as well. You really think that sounds so stupid that people would think "naaaahm I'm totally going to do what VE said and only protect VE or wbg" ?
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On April 12 2012 02:41 Toadesstern wrote:
And again, about people complaining about me calling myself confirmed.
I'm sorry I do that and it reads as "I am a townie you moron and you should know because of X, Y or Z". Check my Storm, AC or L filter. All three games as a townie. All three games called multiple people confirmed.
I just don't understand how anyone would think lynching Toad because of the nighthits would be a good move. Neither Gonzaw nore VE checked what happened because clearly they were so fast to vote me. They checked the nighpost really quick and proceeded to vote me pretty much instantly without a second of a thought, without a reread or anything.
I could possibly understand gonzaw doing that as he clearly is tunneling me. Instavoting me like that without even explaining a thing is bad and I can see gonzaw do that as both townie and a mafia (hint: He is a mafia).
But there is no reason for VE to instantly vote for me without even thinking about what happend, without having anything on me unless he wants to desperatly get people on me to get a quick bandwagon so people don't talk about him as clearly there were a hand full of people considering him before I made my big post as well
Ehmm, I mentioned what happened.
I clearly said I thought Jackal shot ST (and ET shot michael), and scum shot the other 3.
Why? Speculation. Maybe they were considered good players but were not under suspicion.
Jackal is a vet game and scum seem to fear him when he rolls town, no strange ideas for his death here.
Midnight and sloosh as considered good "new" players; and again they weren't being suspected, and scum may have even thought they were blue by their lack of activity through most parts of D1/N1.
Those are the reasons I think they were killed. Nothing to do with "oh Toad said Jackal should be medic protected so we should kill Jackal to make Toad look like town (if he's mafia) or to make him look slightly town but then FoS him for bringing WIFOM (if he's town)". I don't think mafia ever do that, they just hit the players not suspected and that are making sense or could make sense in the future.
Also, I repeat this for the 10th time, present a valid case against me. I'm inclined to vote for you now, at least VE had a mental switch back there and started making sense for a while, and then produced a good case against you, although it's kind of a rehashing of my previous points >_>
(I still haven't read the whole thread by now though, I'm by page 63 )
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Actually guys, I've got this. I've thought it through, and this is pretty much the only way.
I'm Undercover Investigator Charles Williamson. I got a Guilty back on Toad last night, hence the instantaneous vote.
This is why I called for medic protection.
This is why I've been whining about dying N1.
This is why I said I'd be the "atmosphere police" this game.
My sanity is in question obviously, but I feel like Toad is acting scummy as shit and I'm probably Sane.
Thread thinkers, votes off me. Votes on the claimed scum plz. Scum and knaves who are sheeping Toad because you don't want to read the thread, feel free to continue voting for me and prepare for ultimate disappointment. We'll start killing you in order of scumminess as soon as Toad is done.
GG scum.
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For fucks sake
##Unvote: VisceraEyes
I'll try to make more sense of this later
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On April 11 2012 23:37 ghost_403 wrote:
Also, holy crap has johnny been lurking.
sorry i was asleep  ?
Wow what a shitstorm. One of toad or VE is scum almost for sure, possibly both (but less likely). I don't think we can afford a mislynch today without putting ourselves in an awful spot.
Also katina looks super fucking scummy.
And Toad is defending himself so much it looks scummy. Like, defending yourself is one thing but going so far? Focus more on cases and less on your own skin imo. I know I haven't given that many reads but I'm not as big of a "player" in this game. I don't have as "concrete" reads as you do, with handfulls of evidence. Anyways, I'm backing off VE for now as I have been given a shred of doubt in his guilt. At least until this shitstorm ends and a conclusion is (generally) reached.
##unvote VisceraEyes
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EBWOP: The "shred of doubt" was pre-claim, and that claim has given me even more doubt in VE's guilt, so yeah, definitely off that boat for now.
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@VE:
![[image loading]](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Du1SdnzRPAQ/TZTGILgtwJI/AAAAAAAAAvQ/tZJnQXX1tdw/s1600/surprise.gif)
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On April 12 2012 02:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
Actually guys, I've got this. I've thought it through, and this is pretty much the only way.
I'm Undercover Investigator Charles Williamson. I got a Guilty back on Toad last night, hence the instantaneous vote.
This is why I called for medic protection.
This is why I've been whining about dying N1.
This is why I said I'd be the "atmosphere police" this game.
My sanity is in question obviously, but I feel like Toad is acting scummy as shit and I'm probably Sane.
Thread thinkers, votes off me. Votes on the claimed scum plz. Scum and knaves who are sheeping Toad because you don't want to read the thread, feel free to continue voting for me and prepare for ultimate disappointment. We'll start killing you in order of scumminess as soon as Toad is done.
GG scum.
Lynch this guy. Right now. DT fakeclaim. A DT does not know if he is sane, insane, paranoid or naive. There is no way he can figure out what that a check on me means at this point in this game. This is bullshit.
No way VE would claim like that. Not to mention that I am not red lol
It's 14 hours in the day and he claims? Anyone remember RoL from Storm? This is a scumclaim.
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On April 12 2012 02:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
Actually guys, I've got this. I've thought it through, and this is pretty much the only way.
I'm Undercover Investigator Charles Williamson. I got a Guilty back on Toad last night, hence the instantaneous vote.
This is why I called for medic protection.
This is why I've been whining about dying N1.
This is why I said I'd be the "atmosphere police" this game.
My sanity is in question obviously, but I feel like Toad is acting scummy as shit and I'm probably Sane.
Thread thinkers, votes off me. Votes on the claimed scum plz. Scum and knaves who are sheeping Toad because you don't want to read the thread, feel free to continue voting for me and prepare for ultimate disappointment. We'll start killing you in order of scumminess as soon as Toad is done.
GG scum.
This has got to be the biggest load of balls I've read. 
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United Kingdom36156 Posts
On April 12 2012 02:50 VisceraEyes wrote:
Actually guys, I've got this. I've thought it through, and this is pretty much the only way.
I'm Undercover Investigator Charles Williamson. I got a Guilty back on Toad last night, hence the instantaneous vote.
This is why I called for medic protection.
This is why I've been whining about dying N1.
This is why I said I'd be the "atmosphere police" this game.
My sanity is in question obviously, but I feel like Toad is acting scummy as shit and I'm probably Sane.
Thread thinkers, votes off me. Votes on the claimed scum plz. Scum and knaves who are sheeping Toad because you don't want to read the thread, feel free to continue voting for me and prepare for ultimate disappointment. We'll start killing you in order of scumminess as soon as Toad is done.
GG scum.
Why are you probably sane?
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The claim actually has me a lot less confident in my vote on Toad. It makes me more suspicious on VE. Makes no sense, be back later.
...Fuck
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EPT
