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On January 10 2012 21:56 Cwave wrote:
Why i ask is because i find it a given you post protown stuff as ... town.
To articulate it and stress it that you are gonna be pro-town leads me to believe you are forcing yourself to do pro-town stuff.
You should read Steamship Mafia Day 1. If townies only posted pro-town stuff, this game would be so much easier.
On January 10 2012 22:10 syllogism wrote:Tyrran: is this the reason you find jackal scummy? Show nested quote + Jackal 58 for being overly agressive on pamar with no real case behind it, and Palmar because i found your case solid. Now that Palmar flipped demon, you still think he is a good lynch today? Sorry, there is no way you can honestly believe that.
What I did not like on Jackal filter is that he hardly gave any reasoning for his hyper agression. He tunnelled on palmar, and did not even had the sligthtest reaction when MrWiggle made a solid case on Palmar. This is wy he looks scummy to me. It was better towards the end of day 2, and Palmar flipped scum, so i was about to let go on him, but then he does exactly the same thing on dirkzor day 2.
Should you ask me if we should lynch him now, I'd answer no. Both Cwave and risk are more scummy. Yet I want to keep an eye on him.
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My comment in bold.
On January 11 2012 03:38 Dirkzor wrote:Tyrran is the one I want to lynch most at the moment. I think he is on palmars team due to this: + Show Spoiler +On January 04 2012 23:32 Tyrran wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2011 22:23 Palmar wrote:
yo
##Signup
If I get the angel with a wraithcannon, I'll make syllo disappear n1. that's a promise. Show nested quote +On January 04 2012 21:07 syllogism wrote:
We should probably lynch palmar today, he appears to be some sort of scum and hating his life right now I dunno what's going on between these two, but we should just ignore this for now. Was trying to avoid the same shitstorm that happenned day 1, when a seemingly harmless claim led us to lynch 2 blue on day 1. This is only my second game here, I wanted it to go off a better start than day 1.On January 06 2012 19:04 Tyrran wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2012 11:14 Refallen wrote:
I'm thinking Jackal is town this game. At least, he appears to be taking a different route than on TLXLVIII when he was scum. Plus I don't think any scum would risk trying to outright lynch Palmar without a really detailed case.
I disagree with you here. From the few games I've read Palmar seems to be a efficient scum hunter.Bussing Palmar is therefore an good scum strat. Almost EVERY SINGLE one of Jackal post were attacking palmar. And he NEVER had more than 1 line of justification. He did not even refer to MrWiggles case. That is scummy play for me. Also note that as there is 2 scum faction, they can perfectly both be scum, one angel and one demon. I'll be looking at both of them today. Palmar need to step up his game, and Jackal needs to start become useful. He is defending palmar when there is no real reason to defend him. The first post compares a post pre-game to a post made in-game. In both posts he defends Palmar without really appearing to defend him. I'm attacking Jackal on his over agression, which i still dont like (see my post earlier). I'm also attacking out for attacking you the same way. He later changes his opinion on palmar. and in the same post call jackal scum and votes for erandorr Notice how i also call palmar and Erandorr scum. Voting for Erandorr was the obvious thing to do here since we were obviously not going to lynch palmar nor Jackal. Combine this with palmars change of opinion on Wiggles a few hours earlier it appears suspicious. I don't think its unlikely that demonteam realized that palmar will get lynched/killed at some point soon. Palmar gives up lynching wiggles (no support at that time) and his teammates start bussing him. So everyone that voted vor Erandorr and said palmar was likely scum is Demon ? That's only like half the players of this game. In the end I'll just quote how Tyrran have taken no stance on anybody he have written a case on. Note: These quotes are cut, but they are all the last part of Posts by Tyrran. Show nested quote +So reffallen, can you please explain why you thought it is not optimal for angels to kill demons ? I dont see much drawback for them doing this. Also it's your turn to step and and post. Who do you think is most scum rigth now ? Show nested quote +You seems to hold a grudge against him because he called you fishy early day 1. Why do you focus so much on him, and not on Blazinghand who actually voted against you ?
On the other hand, i would also like to see you post more Cwave. You seems to have an excel file where you write your read on us. Tell me, who do you think we should lynch today, why ? Show nested quote +Cwave, you are someone who seems towns, but in reality you did not help much at all until now. While you migth be a timid town, I also think it is likely you are scum player. Please answer this : Is there anyone you really think is scum ? Someone you would be fine pushing for lynch ? Who ? Why ? You seem to spend a lot of time analysing people. Please prove us that you are town by trying to get scummy people lynched. I've said it several time now, I'm mostly suspicious about Cwave, on which i made a case earlier, and i spend several post trying to pressure him, and Risk.nuke, which i explained when Syllo asked me to give my thougth on him.
I've also explained day 1, that I'm not a fan of casting votes early, which creates the risk of scum hammering someone, ending the day and reducing the discution time we have.
So rigth now, the two most popular cases are risk.nuke and RoL. If we rephrase the main critisism against him, it can be summarized by :
* He is inactive
* He pushed for a bad plan.
I dont think he realized his plan was bad. A scum woudnt have insisted as much when it became clear that it was not going to be adopted by town. His action are more like the one of some people that had worked hard on a plan, and was too obsessed with it that he couldnt see its flaws. I also agree with layabout that his plan was not blatantly anti town (see post above mine).
So as you ask me to take a stance, I will be voting for Risk.nuke. At this point he is more likely to flip scum than Cwave IHMO. I'm waiting for tomorrow to ensure we enjoy another 24 hour of discussions.
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So I come back from work/gym , and we have allready lynched risk.nuke. It would have been the case anyway since i intended to vote for him anyway, but its kinda dumb to cut on the discussion time. Well, time to move on and read some more filters.
@Jackal58 : Why " lets see if there is a reason " . Hammering risk.nuke will not tell you anything about Dirkzor. Did you learn anything. Also, why do you excuse yourself before he even flips ? Either you think he is scummy and vote for him or you explain why he isnt scummy. But dont vote for him for no reason.
On January 12 2012 02:16 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 02:10 layabout wrote:On January 12 2012 02:08 Jackal58 wrote:On January 12 2012 01:25 syllogism wrote:
Because he was going to be lynched anyway and it appears that the night is accordingly longer? Considering that I personally would have liked to hammer yesterday, I wouldn't read too much into that. Jackal's tone however seems off though. Specifically his random apology. Did he apologize to erandorr yesterday? No. Does he ever apologize when lynching someone? I doubt it. Ya I believe I have apologized for being impulsive before. And wrong. And no I didn't apologize to Erandorr because Erandorr was max derp. If it makes you feel better next time I vote for somebody I'll post DIE MOTHERFUCKER along with it. Why did risk.nuke deserve an apology from you? For my impulsiveness. I had no intentions of voting for him until I saw Diz's post voting for Tyrran.
Why is dirkzor voting for me a sign that it is time to kill risk ? Also, please explain to me why you think so hard that dizkor is
scum. Yes you where rigth about Palmar, but your play makes me think your an angel.
@Dizkor : People makes a case of me being inactive and not interested and you see me scum while refering to a post where i say who i think we should lynch. That makes a lot of sense.
Time to defend myself too, my comment in bold.
On January 11 2012 15:51 Spaackle wrote:So, after reading through Tyrran's thread, he's starring to look pretty scummy to me. He's posted much less than most others in this game, and his posts are long and full of fluff. He seems to spend a lot of time trying to tell other players how to play when he could be giving analysis or answering questions. He also contradicts himself a few times. Posts that really stand out to me: + Show Spoiler +What makes you think that angels will want to target the blues ? They are pretty much immune to blues, appart from the seer which will be desintegrated by the Angel of Death if he ever claim ( or i guess you could banish him, but then he would be pretty useless). So angel will just randomly shoot into townies, who knows, they migth even get a lucky shot on a demon, they migth also kill townies with dark power if they are not banished.
Secondly you suppose that Demons are going to want to use their banish defensively. If they want to do this, then Demons will just banish the Demon Hunter ( which will NEVER EVER be targeted by angels, because he basically works for them). If they have corrupted someone, they can also banish the sage, and just enjoy they extra vote ! They are not going to banish someone in order to 'protect' him.
Your plan gives HUGE information to both scum faction, and town actually gains very little from it. I dont like it. I think it favors Demons way too much ( because they can protect themself way more easely using their power knowing who the blues are), it also helps angels a bit ( they can kill the seer, they do not risk killing the demon hunter by mistake). But town is definitively the big loser in your plan. And Okay, i misread and missed the color only claim part. My bad, gotta go back some new googles.
Your plan is therefore much better than i initially thougth. I still have an issue with how you are going to deal with corruption. Angels are not the only one that need to prevent a voting block from forming, we need to prevent it too. On one hand you say that corrupted town should claim, but on the other hand you also advise multiple claim. What does town gain form multiple corruption claim ? While i agree that this migth confuse scum, If the angels are in doubt on how to get rid of corrupted townies, how are we going to know how to deal with it ? These posts are a glaring contradictions to each other. Tyrran points out several large flaws in RoL's plan. However, when RoL clears up the color claim issue, suddenly these flaws aren't so bad anymore. If you read correctly, nearly all my critisism where based on the fact that agel and demons would know the rolme of each blue. If they only claim blue and do not tell their role, my previous critisism do not hold anymoreTo me this represents a bit of wishy-washiness on Tyrran's part. He's very opposed to RoL's plan one minute, then thinks it's not too bad the next. Because i misunderstood it the first time There's Also this bit: Show nested quote +Angels are not the only one that need to prevent a voting block from forming, we need to prevent it too. By we, does Tyrran mean town? Or is there some special we only him and RoL know about? Yes i meant town. What else would make sense ?This post caught my eye too: Show nested quote +Well I dont see how this could have gone better :D. One demon dead ( GJ DemonHunter or Angel Acolyte, whoever got him) and no unrevealed death. Perfect N1 for town. Here are some initial thought about what happened N1 :
On January 09 2012 12:14 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
I agree that it was most likely Palmar that sent me to purgatory, as I can't see any town player choosing to protect me over syllo, and I can't see town trying to use it for the roleblock on me instead of protecting someone. What I am more confused about is why he would do that.
Agreed. Syllo was one of the most valuable town assets day 1, channeler sending him to purgatory was the best and obvious move. Palmar maybe thougth you were AoD, and/or DemonHunter. He also maybe tried to protect you.
The fact that there were no ???? flip leaves us with 4 probability:
AoD targeted Syllo. This is unlikely. It was clear in the thread that the banish was going to be used defensively, and Syllogism was one of the most obvious target. I' not sure why angels would target him other than them being bad.
AoD targeted HarbingerOfDoom. This is a possibility. I'm not sure why they would choose him over BH, Wiggles, layabout tho
Syllo is the AoD. This is unlikely, he has been very active for town during day 1. Yet, we cannot ignore this possibility. I dont want him lynched today, but if he is banished again N2, and once again the AoD do not kill, then we will have to consider him as a lynch.
HoD is the AoD. This is a possibility too, but i'm not sure about it. I'll try to find some time to read his filter today.
Questions to discuss day 2 :
What do you guys think of Syllo and HoD ? Are they summy too you. Do you think they were liekly target for the AoD?
With no ???? flip, RoL plan could still be put into motion. What do you think about it? this is one of theposts that I really think paints Tyrran as a scum. He starts by congratulating the DH for the kill, then starts listing possibilities. His possibilities state what could have happened, but Tyrran doesnt really ever state what he thinks happened. Just "well maybe this or that." This noncommittal post also really highlights just how wishy-washy Tyrran has been this whole game. First of all, i did say day one taht i would give my thougth on the nigth actions, so I posted them. You say I remain vague, but with at the time, i dont see how i could commit on either HoD or Syllo. And i still say what i think : Either HoD is AoD or was the target, other options are unlikely. Yes its still non commital, but I still do say what i think happened.Tyrran, wha do you have to say for yourself?
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On January 12 2012 05:06 Dirkzor wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 04:56 syllogism wrote:And yes, he was completely disinterested in the lynch on day 2. That seemed particularly damning; I even had to ask him 3 times until I got his opinion on Tyrran out of him and even then the answer was I don't think I'm willing to lynch him just yet. But that could change, I'm not going to say I can't be talked into lynching him so he can just lurk the entire day safely. That Risk wrote that made him less suspicious in my book then Tyrrans "Yes risk is scum lets lynch him" post. Tyrran just wanted another one to be lynched while risk actually took a stance. A stance that was also contradicting to the generel feeling in the thread. That is to me more townie then what Tyrran did.
Also i gave specific reasons of why i found risk scummy when syllo asked me. Its not like I jumped on a random wagon.
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Fine with me, expect a full case during the first 24 hours of day3.
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On January 12 2012 05:51 syllogism wrote:
No, I meant during the night. That is to say on Thursday as it's relatively late in France.
My bad, I thougth nigth would end thursday morning. Sure, i'll post during night then.
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Okay, I've been asked to make a case, So i'm going to explain here why HarbingerofDoom, despite his name, is an angel. Yes he has been active, and has been tunneling me. Some people migth think that this may him looks town. However, in a three faction game, and especially in this setup, the main goal of ANY faction, is to get rid of the other faction. Therefore, it is quite important for bot angels and demon to scumhunt and get the other faction lynched.
I'm going to add something else about the setup that everyone should have realized: Demons wins by corrupting town and lynching angels, Angels win by killing everyone. This means that each time a VT is lynched, it is a failure for demons as well, not only for town. They lose a potential corrupt target, and more importantly they failed to prevent angels from getting closer of winning. Angels on the other hand do not care. Sure they would have prefered to get a demon or blue, but they still have chances to get them with slay and stalk.
So my conclusion here is while it is important to properly scumhunt as Demon, Angels can just tunnel someone and be fine with it. If they get their target lynched : best case they killed a blue/demon, worst case a townie, but they are still one step closer to victory.
Im not going to focus on Jackal, but the same holds for him :
HoD and Jackal have done nothing but tunnelling this game. HoD on me, Jackal on Palmar then Dirzkor.
Not only that, but they had NO INTEREST at all about the player that was getting lyched.
Here are some example :
Day 1 : main Target are risk/palmar/Erandorr
On January 07 2012 07:47 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:Well, it appears as though xsksc is no longer playing this game, as his last post was: January 04 2012 23:24. I don't like lynching lurkers, but from what I know of Erandorr, his lurking makes him likely to be scum, and I do like lynching scum. Barring him showing an actual commitment to playing, I would be fine with lynching him. On risk.nuke, his playstyle seems to vary a good deal between games, so I am not sold on him being scum yet and would certainly like to hear a bit more from him before deciding whether or not I think he is worth a lynch. TyrranTyrran's play seems very different from his play in steamship where he was town. He is being much less aggressive so far, and usually people are more aggressive as town than they are as scum. I think he would make a fine lynch for the day. My only qualm with lynching him is that he hasn't interacted with other players much so far, so his flip will be less revealing, but I like our odds of hitting scum here. My vote will be on him for now. His steamship filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=282366&user=57176His filter so far this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=298603&user=57176##Vote: Tyrran
Yup, lynch are fine. TUNNEL TYRRAN.
Day 2 : Its obvious lycnh are going to be risk or RoL
On January 11 2012 14:02 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
Anyway, I got the chance to spend some time today doing a bunch of rereading, and after doing so I will not be voting for RoL nor Risk today. Maybe I'm being dense, but I really don't see them as being leading candidates for flipping scum. If I end up having to choose between the two to avoid a no lynch, I favor lynching Risk over RoL, but I'd prefer to lynch neither.
[...]
Geez that post came out longer than I expected. Ending with a vote on Tyrran, of course.
##Vote: Tyrran
Every day i'm tunnelling...
Secondly, his post are full of contradiction, which are for me one of the biggest scumtell.
On January 07 2012 07:47 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:Well, it appears as though xsksc is no longer playing this game, as his last post was: January 04 2012 23:24. I don't like lynching lurkers, but from what I know of Erandorr, his lurking makes him likely to be scum, and I do like lynching scum. Barring him showing an actual commitment to playing, I would be fine with lynching him. On risk.nuke, his playstyle seems to vary a good deal between games, so I am not sold on him being scum yet and would certainly like to hear a bit more from him before deciding whether or not I think he is worth a lynch. TyrranTyrran's play seems very different from his play in steamship where he was town. He is being much less aggressive so far, and usually people are more aggressive as town than they are as scum. I think he would make a fine lynch for the day. My only qualm with lynching him is that he hasn't interacted with other players much so far, so his flip will be less revealing, but I like our odds of hitting scum here. My vote will be on him for now. His steamship filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=282366&user=57176His filter so far this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=298603&user=57176##Vote: Tyrran
On January 09 2012 05:03 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:...because I was leaning scum on Erandorr and was not on Risk. I didn't comment more on it because I was busy yesterday as I had to get shit ready for my girlfriend's birthday party/then was at it. For those wondering why I had a null read on risk, here is what Syllo said about him earlier this game: Show nested quote +Where is the active and opinionated and aggressive risk.nuke of Election mafia who posted a lot and certainly didn't just repeat what others had said, right or wrong? Here is me asking about him in Steamship: Show nested quote +@risk.nuke
Last game I played with you you were extremely aggressive early on. This game you haven't attacked anyone yet, or even directly addressed someone. Any particular reason why you were active and aggressive last time, and are thus far being passive this game? Notice any similarities? Fun fact, he was town in steamship.
So he tunnels me based on a 1-game Meta, but still admits that meta lynch are unreliable. Wut ?
On January 08 2012 06:41 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
Unfortunately I will not be around for the lynch deadline. As stated previously, I am also fine with an Erandorr lynch, so I will be switching my vote to him now as I don't want a no-lynch to occur. Sorry, no birthday sympathy from me. He has shown no commitment to this game, and it is my understanding that this makes him very likely to be scum.
Of course he doesnt want a no-lynch to occurs, that's pretty mach the only bad outcome for angels at the end of day 1. Secondly, notice the "it is my understanding". He was the one to call for a Erandorr lynch based on meta. Yet this makes him look like he wasnt.
Thirdly : His reaction after Nigth one is strange, and deceptive.
I think you all remember on how his being the AoD is a possibility. Well his reaction after
On January 09 2012 10:42 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
I was sent to purgatory? What in the fuck? Also, no unrevealed flip? So either syllo = angel of death (seems unlikely to me, but possible) or angel of death targeted him or me (seems much more likely, and probably him if I had to bet).
Why does being sent to purgatory bother him? I mean, any regular townie would have been happy to be sent to purgatory as it makes you immune to any nigth actions. So this post alone makes me think that HoD is at least a blue, more likely and angel.
On January 10 2012 03:52 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2012 19:58 syllogism wrote:
I'm pretty sure palmar sent HoD to purgatory because he thought he was likely an angel. We of course can't draw any conclusions from that, but as noted before HoD's play has been somewhat suspicious so far. Anyway, either the angel of death attempted to hit me or the angel is HoD (or both!)
It's also fairly likely that Palmar was a demon hunter hit because demon Demonic Twister's power protects against slay/stalk but not against demon hunter. Palmar had an important role, so it's somewhat likely that they would use it on him. I'm not sure if the twister can use the ability on himself, but right considering Palmar was by far attracting the most attention, that might change things depending on who the twister is. The only reason why it matters who hit Palmar is because the other possibility is that the demon hunter hit an angel who did not die, in which case we could discuss whether him claiming would be worthwhile. Probably not and his likely target would be risk nuke anyway.
Risk.nuke still looks like the best lynch. The case against him still stands and quite a few people were against his lynch without adequately explaining why. They obviously can't all be his team mates, but it's hard to believe there would be that many townies unwilling to lynch him in that situation and be perfectly fine with lynching erandorr. His behaviour hasn't improved at all and that vt claim right before day post doesn't seem like something a townie would do. Syllo, you're pretty smart, so please tell me why on earth you think Palmar would banish me to purgatory if he thought I was an angel? Let's look at the scenarios: 1) I am the Angelic Observer - sending me to purgatory does nothing for the demons. 2) I am the Acolyte - unless I for some reason decide to go after a demon instead of a blue, does nothing for the demons. If I do go after blues, doing this hurts the demons. 3) I am the Angel of Death - I would never hit Palmar when I could get town to use up a lynch on him as lynching is the only anti-angel kp. Also leading a scum lynch can get some town cred. So one demon (Palmar) is safe. Another demon can be twisted, so now 2 are safe. Note, so far this also applies to the acolyte even if the acolyte is targeting a demon. So now blocking the angel of death is only useful if the third demon is also a likely target for a scum night kill. I don't see how any of those are a better choice than targeting someone you think is a blue, especially if you have no idea which I am and are taking the 1/3 chance of a remotely useful roleblock. As I stated, I think it is much more likely he thought I was blue than an angel.
Okay, this post is just full of bullshit. I can see plenty of reason for demon to roleblock angels.
His post focus on why demons would try to save palmar. The goal of demons is not only to save themself, they also have to prevent angels to win. Banishing them is a good move in this regard as they have a high chance of reducing their KP ( as I stated before, any angel hit, be it town or demon,is actually bad for demon).
Secondly you once again makes it sound like angels do not want to target demons. This is plain wrong. They want to get rid of demons. Demons are at least as dangerous for angels than blues. Channeler and courrier have the same ability to RB them, and twister is an anti angel doctor. On the other hand, going for blue gives the risk of killing the demon hunter which is basically working for them early game.
You also make it look like angels would not target palmar because he could be lynched day 2. I do not agree. If they have a strong demon read on someone, i think angels would go for it. For once because they cannot be sure that he will be lynched next day ( it could very well have been risk or RoL over palmar again), and secondly because they was no corrupted town yet, finding a blue would be difficult.
So because his plays correspond perfectly on how I think angels would play, because he contradict himself, and because he keeps telling shit about angel strategy, I think he is an angel himself. And I think we shoud lynch him tomorrow.
Anyway, my lunch break was a bit longer that it should have been, will be back later tonigth.
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On January 13 2012 05:22 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
3 demons, 1 town, 3 angels, not 2 angels. Unrealistic, yes. But just proving the point that demons don't mind townies being dead. Also shows that even if they don't get angels killed early on, as long as they stay alive any death brings them closer to winning. Nowhere does it say if the hit/lynch is on vanilla town - just on town in general, but if you think their corruption being slightly more likely to fail is their primary concern, I think you are quite mistaken. The longer this game goes on with the demon hunter and sage alive, the more likely they are to lose, regardless of their ability to corrupt. They can't kill those people themselves, so they either need to mislynch them, or hope the angels hit them. Assuming the angels use their acolyte to try to kill people with dark powers, which I assure you they will, the proportion of blues will go down, not up. Yes, the sage can't be killed with that, but he can be killed by the AoD, and I doubt the demons would mind the demon hunter or channeler ending up dead.
You stress they need those players alive to count for their win condition, which is true, but you ignore the other half of their win condition. They/their corrupted minions need to outnumber the remaining players in the game. So they want the number of remaining players to be as small as possible.
tl;dr: Holy fuck they don't need to corrupt anyone to win this game, and they want to survive while everyone else dies, not make this game last a bajillion days.
First of all : "Assuming the angels use their acolyte to try to kill people with dark powers, which I assure you they will " If this isnt a angel claim, then i dont know what it is. Do what you want with your acolyte, but I really do not see why blues are priority target and demons/corrupted town are not. Killing the DH early would be really bad for angels. Killing a corrupted town however is really good for them. Why wouldnt they try to reduce the demons voting power ?
Secondly : Wtf if this tl:dr ? Demons should win without using corrupt ? Are you going to argue next that Angels should win wihtout killing anyone ? I look forward to you hosting a normal game where scum has no KP and town has vigs because " well scum can just survive while everyone else dies".
Thirdly : On January 13 2012 15:11 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:
Trolololol.
This is your ultimate argument ? That my case against you did not fullfill the Syllogism's standard and therefore is, I quote : "Trolololol". Well, that sure makes you look town.
Lastly : So Syllo is not AoD. Would the AoD have targeted Syllo N1 ? If you consider that 1) Syllo was very likely getting banished and 2) Syllo was pushing for lynching 3 non angel target ( palmar(Demon), Erandorr(VT), Risk(VT), ). There was absolutely no reason for AoD to shoot him N1. So either you are AoD, or he shot you. The only reason he would have shot you is by shooting randomly ( as you had no reason to be killed prior to any other player), meaning there was a 1/10th of a chance that you would get hit.
So it boils down to this: Either you are AoD, or you got shot which had about 10% chance of happening. Well, math says that there is 90% chance you are AoD.
Conclusion : You keep telling non sense, you claim angel, you decide to go troll morde, logic says you are AoD. You should be lynched today.
##Vote HoD
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@Blazinghand : Is there anyone other than RoL that you would like to lynch ? What is your stance on HoD and Dirkzor ?
@Jackal: You mention that HoD is a good lynch. Why do you think so ?
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Okay so it seems i was wrong about HoD. I'm going to unvote him . Unless someone counter claims which is extremely unlikely due to breadcrumbs. Looks like he got extremely lucky on night one. I'm going to be busy this WE, but i'll try to find some time to read some filters
##Unvote HoD
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On January 15 2012 07:07 Blazinghand wrote:
I'm not really sure why demons would conceal that. We'll know if he was the channneller or not tonight.
If RoL really was an angel, him claiming Channeler would probably mean that tey knew no one would counter claim, i.e MrWiggle was the real town channeler. I wouldnt expect any banishment tonight :/
This really sucks for us because it means we have no way of defending ourself against the AoD.
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On January 16 2012 06:02 Zephirdd wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 05:16 syllogism wrote:
If you are town, you should examine the wagon on you before you claimed and what people were saying. Actually I'm now reading it a bit and this is somewhat changing my view on things OH ARE YOU? Wanna know what happens when the DH shots someone and HoD was jailed? We lost a DT check for nothing because you made excuses for reasons for HoD's claim to be false. Demons will try to create a case over HoD as he is the one town they fear, and Angels will try to protect him because he is useful and any lynch that is not an Angel is excellent for them because that's the only way to kill Angels. And ta-daa, you got the Angel connection you needed from me. But hey that doesn't matters, because tonight you will get your "Not Angel" read, syllo-seer, but that probably doesn't matter as well because if Angels have half a brain they realized you are the Seer last night from your "I DUN WANNA DIE" thing. BAM Acolyte on you, AoD on someone else, DH on Spaackle(hopefully) and suddenly Angels won the game because town will look at this and lynch me and HoD. I swear I wish I was Angel, because this game is so fucking easy for them right now. I don't even wanna begin on the fact that many of your actions also make sense if you were a Demon, even though I can't see you as Demon after the Palmar shit. I still find it hard to understand why can't you believe that Palmar jailed HoD night 1, the Channeler jailed you night 1 and the Angels targetted you night 1. Or even that Palmar and Angels both targetted you and for some godforsaken reason the Channeler jailed HoD. These are already two cases that explain the night actions that I pointed out earlier but people seemed fine to ignore. I said it a few times and I'll say it again: I SUCK at reading people. I analyze facts. Fact is that Spaackle was one of the only connections with the goddamn flipped scum this game. Fact is that you forced things to look like HoD was a goddamn Angel even when he claimed the ONE role he couldn't as an Angel: IF he said a Demon was actually green, the Demons would push him to death because they would know he was an Angel, and we probably wouldn't even realize that. He had a fucking breadcrumb for his target against what others thought yet you still believed that he was an Angel. AGH hopefully I can turn this shit around after the night actions. The corrupted town hopefully will check me and see my innocence, and as I'm pretty sure he is seen as town right now, I'm sure he'll be able to convince people. I have my guess as to who the CTown is, but if I told you right now then that would make AoD's job that much easier, right? Good day.
And why do you think angel would have sot syllo day one ? Syllo was pushing for three non angel lynch. He had identified no angel at the time. He was basically working for the angels! Why would they shoot him ? to generate WIFOM ? That doesnt make much sense to me.
Concerning HoD, I agree I'm puzzled at his Sage Claim. I agree that he played very strangely (not to say scummy) this game, but i dont want to completely ignore his claim. I'm waiting for the nigth actions to resolve.
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On January 16 2012 20:30 Blazinghand wrote:
The other thing this means is that town has 5 votes, angels have 2 votes, and the demons have 3 votes, including mine.
This means that the town cannot win a vote today unless we have the help of one of the scum teams. I have some nominal control over my vote until the demons mess with it, meaning that assuming they're afraid of WIFOM or something, they probably won't actually manipulate my vote since they're afraid of giving something away. Their goal is to kill an angel or the DH today and get up to 4 votes out of 8 or 7 tomorrow, controlling the town vote.
;_; i'm unclear on where to go here guys
By lynching any scum, we are helping the other team. Rigth now, as it has been stated before, our best chance to win is to lynch an angel and hope that the DT manage to kill a demon.
I'm afraid Syllo was seer, and with no angel check, we are in trouble. You said you had a non-dark sense last nigth. Now that you have claimed, I think you should tell us who it is. It cant be the DT, and HoD is likely the sage ( either that or the angeglic observer). There are at least two ( possibly 3) angels left, and 2 VT left. A non dark read is an at least 50% chance of being an angel. While not enough for lynching, I think we should have a close look at your non dark sense.
Concerning the layabout case. Even if HoD is the observer and not the sage, layabout being twisted is a very strong Demon tell. But we can deal with him at night ( Demons have no protection against DH). For the lynch, let's focus on a angel.
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On January 17 2012 08:29 Refallen wrote:
Meant to point to HoD's post not layabout's. And yes it is impossible because there was only one ??? Flip when the two of them claimed. Roll's claim was stealing wiggles role. Also explains why wiggles died, observer probably saw him banishing syllo, so he became a target. With the only ??? Flip confirmed at that time, now HoD is confirmed to be sage by virtue of there being no counter-claim. The only scenario that HoD could be lying was that syllo is the sage, and angels got really fucking lucky on killing him before day starts, because once there is a counterclaim HoD was gonna be lynched for sure.
The observer do not know who performed an action on a given player, neither does he know what action was performed on a given player.It doesnt explain at all why MrWiggle was the target.
Next, if we admit ( and while likely, it's stil not 100%) certain that HoD is sage? Why wouldnt you be scum ?
You pushed twice for lynching the layabout, because HoD claimed he was twisted. Next you want to lycnh Dirzkor: At first you claim he is scum for defending palmar, secondly you claim he is scumbuddy with RoL ( who you are certain he is scum, without any proof). In both case you are trying to focus on demons while it is obvious at this point that town should kill angels.
Also that would make RoL/palmar/Dirzkor demons, and not Layabout. Do you think this is likely?
I think you migth very well be an angel. You bussed RoL, and you want to makes us beleive he was scum because this would make you look good.
@HoD : Who do you think is the most likely to be the AoD? I'm still not sold on you being sage, but I'd like to hear your advice.
@BH : You should really reveal your non dark sense. I stated above that he would be a good target for investigation.
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How are you still making meta game cases so far into the game ? But that is not the matter now.
I'm thinking of voting for refallen. I've explained before that his case against dirzkor no longer hold, and still he wanted him lynched. PLus he was pushing for demon lynch, which is the most angel tell IMHO. I also dont think the demon hunter would act this way. The DH should have known that we need to lynch angels and not demons as of now.
His filter has nothing to dissuade me from voting for him. Your argument for not voting him is only based on the list of people pushing for him. That's not enough for me. Right now, I think he is a better lynch over dirzkor.
##vote Refallen
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On January 18 2012 07:16 HarbingerOfDoom wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 07:14 Tyrran wrote:How are you still making meta game cases so far into the game ? But that is not the matter now. I'm thinking of voting for refallen. I've explained before that his case against dirzkor no longer hold, and still he wanted him lynched. PLus he was pushing for demon lynch, which is the most angel tell IMHO. I also dont think the demon hunter would act this way. The DH should have known that we need to lynch angels and not demons as of now. His filter has nothing to dissuade me from voting for him. Your argument for not voting him is only based on the list of people pushing for him. That's not enough for me. Right now, I think he is a better lynch over dirzkor. ##vote Refallen Holy fuck, unvoting to avoid corrupted town insta-hammer. Goddammit, be careful man.
Demons insta hammering Refallen would mean they have a Angel read on him. It doesnt make sense for them to hammer someone hey think is VT. The only reason i should be afraid to vote for him is if i think he was DH, and I dont think it is possible.
Why are you protecting him so much ? Why do you think he's not an angel ?
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GG town.
Here is our QT http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/wYqKvV4BBQX.
Me and Palmar played really bad Day 1 which made us easy target early ( even tho i survived for a bit longer than I thought mainly due to the fact that refallent thougth I was Angel).
Losing Palmar Day one was a huge hit, because we had no effective way to deal with the Demon hunter afterwards. If we had managed to hammer Refallen, the game migth have ended differently.
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EPT
