EPTElection Mafia
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Refallen
452 Posts
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Refallen
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I have 2 questions for the veterans who are running; which I'll like them to answer. 1. How effectively can you scumhunt with the mayor/pardoner position as compared to as a regular townie? 2. If you were scum, how damaging would it be for town if you got the mayor/pardoner position, in your own opinion? Lastly, comparing these two questions, do you think the benefits of you being in the mayor/pardoner position if you were town outweigh the cons if it turns out you get the position as mafia? Sorry if I'm being incoherent, really tired right now. | ||
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On December 13 2011 03:08 Spaackle wrote: For the lurkers in the thread, maybe a couple questions would get some activity: 1. What do you think of the No Pardon, No Exception rule? 2. Give your specific impressions of the campaigns so far, especially the major ones. Remember, the more you get into the game you're playing, the more fun it is! :D 1. Definitely agree with this. As many people have already said, the pardoner role essentially negates a day, and wastes time for town. It is also because of this reason that whoever ends up the pardoner would probably be a good target to lynch if there's any doubt at all about his town-niness, especially when it gets closer to the endgame. 2. I think Radfield and syllomar are both town. prplhz, you said this I will be voting for the person who stays active, transparent and makes the most sense to me today, and I recommend everybody else does this too. I will not vote for anybody based on what they've done in other games, if you want my vote you need to perform now, not yesterday. There are probably people who are more likely to do this than others, but my mind is open. but then you moved on, quite quickly, to vote for palmar/syllo instead, here. Actually screw that, I'll likely vote for Arctocod unless I get major scum vibe from them. I think that they combined are easily the best scum hunters in this game so I don't want them dead. I'll advise everybody else to vote for them too, I'd like to see Radfield/ProfessorBadass as Pardoner though. I don't really know about GreYMisT, he's supposedly good but I don't think I've ever seen him in action. what prompted this? | ||
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And yes, why do you think I'm mafia rad? | ||
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Because I admittedly have been lurking; some family stuff happened, so I haven't been free yesterday. And it's morning over here, I just woke up. I'll be happy to contribute more or answer any questions you may have though. Right now, I'm skimming the thread and trying to find a vote, and for now I think I'll be sheeping Arctocod. | ||
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Also, the major scumread I have is evantrees, and specifically, this post by him On December 14 2011 10:11 kitaman27 wrote: Show nested quote + The cause of Arctocod's withdraw will not be revealed Kidnapped! Debating on voting for ProfessorBadass but there is this post... On December 12 2011 14:44 ProfessorBadass wrote: Well first thing's first: Palmar is scum. Palmar and I have a long history of never rolling the same alignment. Since I am Town this game Palmar must indeed be scum. Also I am running for Mayor. and for now for lynch, for fun? ##Vote Nisani201 This seems really scummy to me; especially the last sentence. Is he implying that the lynch is for fun? I'll be voting for evantrees too. | ||
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On December 14 2011 12:06 ProfessorBadass wrote: Holy hell all the non-posters just flooded out to vote Spaackle. wtf Sorry, really didn't have time to do anything than a quick skim or two of the thread and I just decided to bandwagon him. I understand that this seems like a scummy thing to do but honestly with everyone pushing for a lynch I thought that getting on the bandwagon would be the most beneficial for town (see TL Mafia XLVIII for when no-lynches happen and screws town up lolol) | ||
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On December 14 2011 12:09 Radfield wrote: Refallen there is no chance of a mislynch in this game. Whoever gets the most votes dies. Oh okay, I didn't know that. And sorry, I'll stop talking about the other game. I realise I'm not exactly appearing the most pro-town now and I would like to remedy that. However, I find it hard to come up with original content, especially when I missed most of day 1 and thus could not get involved in the 20+ pages of discussion that happened then. It seems like whenever I think of something it has already been addressed in the thread. | ||
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On December 14 2011 18:49 Cwave wrote: Another weird event: Refallen votes Spaackle outside of the vote deadline. But he also voted twice for Spaackle. Refallen Vote Filter Care to explain Refallen? Are you paying attention or did your scummy friends tell you to go for Spaackle and you forgot you had voted before? Was speed reading through the thread and panicked I guess. Don't see how that makes me scum. | ||
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On December 15 2011 12:27 GiygaS wrote: I guess this is really the only thing to decide, me or Arc as secretary/surgeon? To figure this out we should try and get an idea of what the fuck secretary will do... I'm guessing it's like Surgeon general but can assign a vig instead. Just my thoughts. I think Arc should be the secretary, since the surgeon role is probably simpler, and we don't even know what the SoD does. Probably Arc would be experienced enough to do a better job of the SoD. Also, now that prplhz is dead (and was clearly town in day 1 imo), what can we say about people who suspected him in day 1, which iirc included Sheth? | ||
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On December 15 2011 03:22 zeks wrote: DTs please review the lists for Spaackle lynch and ProfessorBA election vote The idea that the list of those who had voted for ProfBA to be pardoner has to have some mafia in it is something I've seen more than one person espousing in the thread so I just want to say that I completely disagree with this line of thinking right now. Firstly, as ProfBA has pointed out, he was the natural choice of pardoner after palmar/syllo votes were nulled. And he was even there at that time to immediately step up and say "I am the natural choice," something that I am sure many people agreed with. There is simply no reason for mafia to need to vote ProfBA to get him to office (note that I'm not actually saying that ProfBA is scum/town or anything, but just illustrating the fact that the idea that scum votes must be on ProfBA is false, since even if he was scum, the mafia didn't need to vote for him because of the lack of another viable candidate as well as ProfBA actively going for the pardoner role.) So no, if anything I think the Radfield list is more likely to contain scum. What do you guys think? | ||
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Also, I am getting suspicious of Sheth. + Show Spoiler + First off, I know this is nothing conclusive, but I'm really suprised Arcto / Rad ./ ProfBA the veterans didn't come up with this. So, last night we had a few interesting things occur. One, was the "Town Vig shot" on Eiii. And then we had the 2 deaths announced at the end, where xsksc and prplhz were killed. Also, Arcto claims that there was a mafia shot on him and that he lived through it. Arctocod says "we were shot last night, amazing. So now we "Know" where the 3 KP of the mafia were used. As long as we assume Arctocod is town, which I do. It was used on xsksc + prplhz + arcto. Makes sense right?! Wrong. Why would mafia waste a KP that come on, lets be honest shouldn't be used singly on Arcto. There are other options here that I've thought of. So let me discuss them. If instead of this, one of xsksc / prplhz was killed by another vigilante and Arcto was double stacked and still saved. Which I find unlikely, but not impossible. Or a newbie medic, despite us yelling to save Arcto chose to save someone else and magically got it correct and Arcto is just lieing. Also pretty much impossible. With Arcto now claiming to be shot and no one else coming out with "I was shot at night" or no one else dead, we can assume he really was shot. This has been pretty simple logic so far and not at all what I'm trying to get at. The major points I'm saying so far is that Mafia using 1 KP on Arctocod was a stupid move. Theres no way around it. One option of this stupid move was just that were dealing with "Newbie" mafia. I suppose some other options include that the ability to make Arctocod step down, took 1 KP is possible. However I think thats unlikely. After thinking this all through last night I was thinking to myself what if the kill that Giygas / Arcto used was actually a mafia KP. I think theres a chance that Giygas is a "Mafia Vig" who is doing this simply for town cred. This leads to a whole new area of thought where you have to wonder how legitimate Arcto is and if Mafia had this whole situation planned out for a while. I don't really want to get in to that here. I want to go more into why I think this was a Mafia Vig Shot. As we all know, last night Arctocod recieved a package, a letter asking who to hit with a "Letter bomb" I'm just calling it that because someone already did. It ended up killing Eiii a blue townie. This letter bomb wasn't used as a group town ability simply as a "Giygas / Arctocod" ability. And it was sent to Arctocod while they were looking at Eiii quite harshly I believe. This part I'm not completely sure of, but I think its possible Giygas could geuss that Arctocod wasn't pressuing a mafia at the time so he would get a good townie to kill. This would explain the one thing that was bugging me while I slept. Why did Arctocod get a KP used on him? I think its possible Giygas's power did this. I can definetly see a power in this game like "Mafia Terrorist" Once per game you may exchance a Mafia KP for sending a private PM to one player and this player will appear to have been shot at night and saved and then sending a second private PM that will detonate killing chosen player". This is basically the power that Giygas used, minus the few things that make it mafia. This power would simply makes a Mafia player look like a legit town vigilante. I think its definetly a possiblility, almost likely considering I think its either this or Mafia has no veterans and just chose to waste one hit on Arcto. This could have been watched and obviously was going to be protected so I can't even see newbies making this mistake. Or something else I haven't thought of yet. Especially this post here. He makes a really convoluted case on Giygas here, a pretty much confirmed townie, and was pushing him several posts before that too. This was really weird to me, because Sheth seems to be from his previous postings a pretty logical player, so I find it suspicious he's trying to concoct a case on Giygas. | ||
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On December 16 2011 09:56 VisceraEyes wrote: I read Sheth's case as more townie paranoia than a scummy attempt to sow distrust and confusion. Your mileage may vary. That might very well be true, as a mafia wouldn't probably try to push the confirmed townie and instead try to get someone more suspicious; good point, I forgot about that. | ||
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Hope I've addressed your points. | ||
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(And also didn't we establish that giygas should be surgeon and arc to be SoD?) | ||
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On December 17 2011 02:26 Jitsu wrote: Why would we need ProfBA to use his pardon as a way to prove innocence? We voted him in as the pardoner. Nothing is saying he isn't the mafia alignment though. We voted him in as pardoner in hardly the most relaxed of circumstances. And upon reflection there appears to be some suspicions based around him (see Arctocod). So yes, we do need some proof that he's not mafia, though using a pardon is hardly a smart way of going about that. Anyway, I'm heading to bed. | ||
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evan claim when the night is over if you're a powerrole, no sense to do it during the night. I want to take a closer look at Sheth, and maybe Radfield too. | ||
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On December 18 2011 23:28 Radfield wrote: Damn, I was writing up a post with the pertinent quote of ProfBad, but somehow lost it. It wasn't particularly useful anyways, so I'll just write the coles notes version instead: * risk.nuke is likely town, simply due to the energy that ProfBad put into discrediting him, and trying to get him lynched. * ProfBad made 2 real cases, both in the same post, on risk.nuke and cwave. However the case on Cwave is pretty weak, and he never mentions him again to my knowledge. * Prof is willing to bus his teammates, as he consistently calls out Dropbear(Bum-GF) early game. However calling out the godfather is pretty common scum-play, as you want to encourage enough suspicion to draw DT checks. *Calls out nyczbrandon's posts a couple times, but writes them off as bad townie. * Fights against Dues-ex for mayor position, argues over a few other things as well. Added with a few other things, Dues is likely town. * Zeks also looks better based on his interactions with ProfBad. Basically calling out the pardoner push as scum driven, and ProfBad calling him a dumbass  Bum basically said very little, but posted his suspicions against both evantrees and refallen. However he quickly retracted his suspicion against Refallen, but it was done in such a way that Refallen may be town. Not sure yet. So, the vote list for ProfessorBadass as Pardoner. Seems highly unlikely to me that there would be zero scum on this wagon. I would in fact think scum would get on early to try and jolt it into action. GreYMisT, GiygaS, Refallen, Radfield Assuming you believe me to be town(and apparantly green?!) where does that leave us? + Show Spoiler + I'll tell you where it leaves me, the same place I have been for a while. Greymist is scum I'm not 100% sure you're town yet. However, I do agree that there are much more viable lynch targets than you, especially for the double lynch tomorrow. And I'm town  | ||
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On December 19 2011 03:02 GreYMisT wrote: Just noting this for now, notice how dues (supersoft) said earlier that he is very good at telling my town from my scum, and because of this he would research me. Now notice how he waits for both arcticod and radfield to voice their suspicions before he posts. If he is so sure I am "95%" scum and he has as good of reads as he claims, why not say this earlier instead of waiting for Arcto and rad? Hardly a point, and you're not exactly helping your case by saying how two very good players think you're scum (one confirmed town, too). I explained my reasoning earlier about the suggestion for MrZentor as secretary of defense. Remember at that time I thought it was a public rolecheck. I suggested Zentor because: A. He already claimed his role in thread, allowing us to check if he was Lyning or not. B. putting someone in who had already claimed would protect other blues from exposure C. I did not believe any powers were associated with this role Also, this did not make sense at all. The most definite clear choices for the Secretary of Defense and Surgeon were definitely Arc and Giygas, bar none. Your premise of how putting in Zentor would protect other blues is ridiculous. How would that work? Lastly, I for one thought that Zentor's claimed ability was very very believable. Also, evantrees you need to stop nitpicking on minor issues like vote formatting. Lastly, we really shouldn't be discussing modkills here. What's the point of that? For now, I'm leaning towards lynching Greymist. | ||
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Also, I don't see how suspecting Radfield = anti-town, as Greymist tried to make a case on. | ||
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Also, Cwave, stop tunneling me with that retarded point. Like I said, I really did not have time to vote in day 1. | ||
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Day 1 - zeks - MrZentor (claimed blue?) - prplhz (VT) And then he bandwagoned spaackle, which is fine, except that he flipped blue too. Day 2 - really convoluted case on Giygas (who by the way I think most of us can say is definitely town) - really resistant on voting for ProfBadass until it seems like his lynching is inevitable (then jumped on the bandwagon and said how Greymist & Jitsu actually posted logic as an excuse? to vote ProfBadass) All these things when taken in isolation probably dosen't mean much, but I have a bad feeling when it all comes from the same person. | ||
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I'm not sure yet; Sheth has been active in defending himself, and he hasn't given me outright mafia tells like Curu, so I'm looking for better lynch targets. What do you think of Sheth? | ||
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I'm not sure if that'll change my decision. When the pardon is used, I think Mafia automatically gains, since now we've wasted a Day cycle while Mafia can go on killing people at night. If someone were to suggest ProfBadass to use his pardons as a way to prove his innocence, I wouldn't sign off on that. I'll probably still vote ProfBadass, based on Arc's analysis. Sheth, do you agree that if it comes down to a lynch between risk.nuke and ProfBadass, it is a much better choice to lynch ProfBadass, seeing as how he is a pardoner? Ok, less aggressive than I originally remembered, but at the very least I was edging for his lynch... I guess? | ||
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On December 21 2011 11:18 TotallyNotTwoPeople wrote: How do you have a good town read on a guy with a filter that doesn't even reach page 2? Please, quote what makes you think he is town. Even though some of his posts has been accusing Palmar/Radfield of being scum and defending them, I think if you read the entirety of his filter, there seems to be a common theme in the sense that this is a guy who likes to form his own opinion instead of sheeping the other vets, and is wary of trusting the vets too much. Quotes like Now spaackle has turned up innocent, and a blue too. If I was to redo my lynch, would I lynch spaackle again? The answer is yes. Though I was uncertain, he was the best option at that time, better than MrZentor. For the information of those who were not there near voting deadline, the two leading votegetters were MrZentor and spaackle. MrZentor had "softclaimed" blue so to speak. That left us spaackle. We had to vote and lynch for information. Certainly, we took an "easy lynch" so to speak, but the risk was worth it if we managed to catch a scum. Though we failed, it is expected as day 1 mafia lynches are rare apparently. Look, I know we made a mistake. Still, this post says nothing except "I was so sure spaackle was townie and I was right" If another townie made this, what would you think of it? When you call people out town, you are automatically correct? Firstly, BOTH ProfBadass and Radfield agreed he was a good lynch. And while you said spaackle was town, it was a sentence throwaway that was easily missed and not justified. Radfield gave his reasoning so we switched away from MrZentor. Secondly, spaackle continued posting after you went to bed. He could and did post stuff that affected people's reads on him. I'm disappointed. This post would feel scummy coming from a vet if it wasn't for the fact I feel you are basically confirmed right now. dosen't seem like he's showing any fear, which I think is protown. Kind of like Sheth, he's been pretty active about asking people to post cases and will follow his own lynch targets instead of sheeping people. That's the feeling I got from him. (Also since we're both from Singapore it's highly likely that he's asleep and won't be able to defend himself and for the past 8 hours, since it's early morning here.) | ||
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And I voted comprissent because out of the three choices given, (two if you look at deus-ex's posts), I feel like cascades is a townie. Nor do I think that, seeing as how most people have a null read on me at best, should I be doing eyebrow-raising things like voting for someone else altogether at this late hour. | ||
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On December 21 2011 12:04 zeks wrote: You can justify all your actions. Town players have absolutely nothing to hide. As long as you provide the right reasoning then you should have nothing to be afraid of Yes, but I obviously haven't done a good job of that, seeing as how most people have a null read on me at best. Admittedly, it's my fault. I shouldn't be acting scummy and wasting town's time discussing/defending instead of the real scum. | ||
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Was pretty suspicious of Sheth and made my feelings known. | ||
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On December 22 2011 13:08 zeks wrote: Sorry for the triple post, but I imagine the voting is to go like this today for election: 1. jaj22 - Radfield 5. Comprissent - Radfield 6. TotallyNotTwoPeople - Radfield 8. Refallen - Radfield 9. Cwave - Radfield 10. zeks - Radfield 12. risk.nuke - Radfield 18. Jitsu - Radfield 3. GreYMisT - Zeks 4. DEUS-ex-MAFIA - Zeks 11. MrZentor - Zeks 19. Radfield - Zeks 24. cascades - Zeks I'm pretty sure this way it'll be fool proof for the 2 scum to try to influence election. If everyone could review this and tell me what you think that would be great thanks. Going to sign off for the night if nothing comes up Also I think this is a great idea, we should do it. | ||
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On December 20 2011 22:04 Cwave wrote:
Thats 2 confirmed scum, 3 unconfirmed 5 dead confirmed blue and 2 alive blue(Giygas), Greymist(unless there where no doctors at the start of the game but thats a very slim chance). 1 dead confirmed town(arctocod) and 1 confirmed alive(myself) and 4 potential townies(Deus, Zeks, Radfield, Liquid'Zeth, ) That leaves jaj22, nyczbrandon, Comprissent, TotallyNotTwoPeople, Refallen, evantrees, Jitsu, cascades for 3 scum spots. 3 out of these 8 have a high potential to be scum and for now, Nyc is my prima suspect unless he puts up a good case why he shouldnt hang from a tree. Cwave, this post interested me, especially the part about Liquid`Sheth being probably town. What made you think he was town? | ||
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On December 22 2011 21:25 cascades wrote: @Refallen you were convinced that I was town yesterday, does that make you mafia? All I read from Sheth's filter is that he believes nycz is the right lynch. He could have easily jumped on the premade comprissent bandwagon instead of me, with a good case that actually garnered more votes. Today's election is fairly easy, should be Radfield and a confirmed townie like Zeks. Honestly cascades, I thought you were a townie all the way. Except for the fact that Sheth was trying so hard not to vote for you. You say he could have easily jumped on the comprissent bandwagon and probably that's true, but maybe he didn't want to be seen as bandwagoning and thus Mafia? Also, I know Radfield is seen widely as most probably town, but has there been any thought in electing Zeks and another blue who has roleclaimed? (wait, are there any eligible for voting this cycle?) | ||
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On December 22 2011 22:09 jaj22 wrote: Oh, I missed: 5. Refallen with a suspiciously late/low-reasoning vote on Comprissent. Again, end of day/night falls at a very inconvenient time for people living here in Singapore. I literally have to wake up at 9am and immediately catch up on the thread, and then start voting for someone. In this case, I just followed up on deus-ex's suggestion to choose among three candidates, when I didn't think cascades was scum. | ||
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On December 22 2011 23:38 jaj22 wrote: @Refallen: In that case, I strongly recommend that in future that you try to get a vote in during the previous (real) day, or at the very least, indicate your preferred lynch candidates. For today we can only do the latter. Looks like even Radfield is taking his own towncred for granted today, although it wouldn't surprise me if his botched medic claim is fictional. Zentor seems like a good choice for election now that he's 100% confirmed, except that he's dangerously close to a modkill, so unless he shows up soon I don't see better candidates than Radfield/Zeks. I have a pretty strong town read on risk.nuke but I suspect too many people disagree. I agree that it's mostly my fault, and I'll try to do better. And yes, as I said earlier, I feel like we should be electing one of our confirmed townies instead of Radfield. As for my preferred lynch candidates at the moment, I don't have any. But Radfield's town-iness has taken a hit in my eyes after the last few posts, especially with how he's, as you said, taking town for granted. Obviously, cascades, who was a town read for me yesterday, also had his town-iness take a hit because of how Sheth was defending him and how Sheth flipped red. I still am far from sure that he is mafia, but if I had to pick a lynch today, I would choose to lynch him bar some more defense from him. I think Cwave and risk.nuke are town. Also, lastly, I've been trying to work my head around why evantrees died last night. Surely mafia had a better target, especially since evantrees already used his one-time power? People who were much more active? | ||
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Sorry, not Cwave, meant to type Jitsu. | ||
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Why Radfield is town by Zeks 1. He claimed roleblock for (3?) straight days. Did anyone come out to counter claim the role block? No. Did we ever see a second vote appear on any voting list from his mayor power? No. ...I forgot about that point. Ok, he's town. | ||
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Also, I rather vig shoots Jitsu than cascades at this point. | ||
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I don't think TnTP is scum, he made a case defending me when He could easily have just pushed me harder and no one would have found that suspicious. That said, voting cascades today. | ||
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Radfield for obv reasons (roleblocked, none claimed) TnTP mostly for his case defending me when he could easily have built up more pressure Greymist for obv reasons Jaj also seems more town than the upper three. | ||
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1. How he defended me, a really easy bandwagon lynch target, who by the way, is hard for mafia to kill at night because I'm a vet. 2. His consistently solid reasonings and posts throughout the games. I am confused at why you picked TnTP here deus, do you not think he is town? | ||
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(will be the last post I make for awhile, heading to bed over here in Taiwan. Will check thread briefly tomorrow morning, hopefully will have time to analyse & post) To end off, I'm aware that I have provided an avenue for people to attack me as scummy by posting the list earlier (something I need to fix in my upcoming games, why do people think I'm scum when I'm trying to actively post as town?) I could probably have done better as scum by just not posting for the rest of the day so as not to attract too much attention to myself, ala what everyone else is doing, but I chose to throw my thoughts out there and put myself in the spotlight, so to speak. I hope you all can identify this clearly as town like behaviour. | ||
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Also I am surprised we glossed over the third party option so quickly, but maybe that's because I don't know the strength of a double-lynch for town so late in the game. | ||
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You also haven't explained why you wanted to lie. | ||
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And TnTP I only win with town, I'm town. First time I ever heard of a third party in a mafia game actually. | ||
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Furthermore it is becoming apparent that I am way too passive in playing this game. Im going to try a more aggressive approach in Purgatory. Any last thoughts are appreciated, mafia is really fun, I'm really enjoying this game. | ||
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