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On December 14 2011 00:52 xtfftc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 21:31 ey215 wrote:On December 13 2011 16:50 xtfftc wrote:
BH went after Tunkeg. Lazy townie then. Ad Hominem much? So instead of addressing issues you declare Vel's a "lazy townie" and ignore any points he has or had not made? To make sure I kept unbiased I tried to stay clear of layabout making a case against you and even defended you. The best you can come up with to a townie who obviously has been paying attention and active throughout the game is "lazy townie"? That's not an answer to the questions about you. That's trying to make it look irrelevant just because you deem it to be so. It's also scummy as all get out. I have already addressed all of the points he's made. His questions are a demonstration that he hasn't bothered reading my posts on layabout. He also refused to answer my question, even though I reminded him about it (unless you consider his fluffy "Either it's an elegant bus (which I doubt, with only 2 scum left) or he's got a good read on you and you're trying to get out of it." satisfactory. I don't.) Some of the townies have been way too lazy to engage in a discussion and provide analysis all game long - but when the posts in questions are literally in the last 2-3 pages of the thread, ignoring them like this is insulting. I even posted him links to everything relevant on this very page. How am I supposed not to get frustrated? If he wants to write a case on me or anything, great, go for it. If he has any questions, I'll answer them. But repeating things that I have already answered to that clearly indicated that he hasn't bothered putting the work in...
fine
you are misusing LAL
you nitpick him cherrypicking your quotes except that what he left out was just more wifom logic that nobody should be paying attention to anyway
there's one part of your response that MAY have merit and that's the last part regarding adam4167
but yeah no i'm not impressed.
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ebwop: as tunkeg brought up on day 2 (and you would know if you were reading the thread) LAL isn't referring to faulty cases and you're trying to apply it here. wilfully ignoring what's been brought up already or just lazy, i'm not sure which
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wait a minute, are you seriously saying that a QUESTION MARK excuses you trying to manipulate a false policy lynch? That's hilarious. I can't take you seriously anymore. (hint: I don't buy this crap at all, and now I really DO think you're lying)
There's no double standard. He's said over and over and over that you aren't providing explanation - you aren't.
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And I did comment on him omitting words earlier. Apparently you ignored that.
Not that I should be shocked because if you ignore it it means you get to spam up the thread more
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Lying re: this crap LAL argument you decided to try and push, because it doesn't make any sense at all.
Going to go take a final but I'll be back later tonight
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well that was a retardedly easy test
On December 14 2011 03:54 xtfftc wrote:
There's a question mark in "Lynch All Liars?" for a reason. I raised a point for everyone to discuss: would a town player really try to twist "more likely" said in a certain context into "best read". Like always, I was trying to facilitate a discussion. See, we're not talking about a case in this situation. We are talking about deliberately taking one's words and turning them into something else. I provided quotes to demonstrate what he did but you still haven't commented on it.
Here, I'll post it for you again.
this is what i'm talking about. "Hey let me invoke LAL on something that doesn't qualify as LAL".
i see in your quotes: "three scummiest" "more likely to be scum" "his team (...) more likely"
this implies that you sure as hell think he's scum. layabout's already explained that your vote was 100% completely useless day 2.
why were you happy to go along with the BKEXE wagon on day 3 rather than "make a statement" again
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On December 14 2011 06:01 xtfftc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 05:29 Velinath wrote:well that was a retardedly easy test On December 14 2011 03:54 xtfftc wrote:
There's a question mark in "Lynch All Liars?" for a reason. I raised a point for everyone to discuss: would a town player really try to twist "more likely" said in a certain context into "best read". Like always, I was trying to facilitate a discussion. See, we're not talking about a case in this situation. We are talking about deliberately taking one's words and turning them into something else. I provided quotes to demonstrate what he did but you still haven't commented on it.
Here, I'll post it for you again.
this is what i'm talking about. "Hey let me invoke LAL on something that doesn't qualify as LAL". (1)I did not invoke LAL. It was a response to layabout being childish in the thread ("liar liar liar", and with bold even). This is just the way you are reading it. Next?
so you just didn't explain it well i guess, whatever
Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 05:29 Velinath wrote:
i see in your quotes: "three scummiest" "more likely to be scum" "his team (...) more likely" (2)"three scummiest" does not equal "best read". (3)"more likely" does not equal "best read". Next?
i didn't say the words "best read" anywhere. you're putting words in my mouth. cute, but come on, try harder than that.
Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 05:29 Velinath wrote:
this implies that you sure as hell think he's scum. (4)In this very same post I mentioned the five people I was suspicious of at the time (Jay, EY, xsk, BKE, Adam). Clearly I did not indicate that I was "sure as hell". Next?
I could use the same reasoning to ask why you voted ey215 then.
Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 05:29 Velinath wrote:
layabout's already explained that your vote was 100% completely useless day 2. (5)And I have already addressed this plenty of times, even before layabout joined the game: it was to make a point. (6)My vote would have been equally useless on Jay as he was dead at the time. (7)And neither of you has provided any reason why would placing my vote on EY instead of Jay benefit me as mafia. Next?
5) a point that didn't mean anything, as layabout said the vote was completely useless, you could have accomplished just as much by just reminding us of the need for scumhunting without the excess voting
6) i'll pass on this one because you finally made a reasonable point
7) cast suspicion on ey215, a town player by my reads and filtering
Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 05:29 Velinath wrote:
why were you happy to go along with the BKEXE wagon on day 3 rather than "make a statement" again (8)The point I made on Day 2 was that we need to discuss other candidates than the main lynch target. At the time when I voted on Day 3 there was a serious discussion going on already.
that doesn't justify wagon sheeping a townie, which is what you did
This is 8 points you have to address. Could you please answer all of them and use quotes if necessary.
And for everyone else reading the thread, ask yourselves this question (if you haven't already): how does voting/not voting for someone who is 100% sure to be lynched change anything? If not voting for Jay is a reason to call someone mafia, doesn't this make it way too easy for mafia to blend in by simply doing what the rest of the town does?
you could have just as easily said "hey these are my other reads"
you even said:
In conclusion, most of the town has sheeped on BKE (with Veli, Adam and to a lesser extent Tunkeg being the exceptions). I feel like there wasn't a proper attempt to change the direction of the lynch until late Day 3 and I agree that the third mafia player may have simply abandoned Jay and BKE to save himself/herself.
As I was re-reading his earlier posts just now, I reached the same conclusion as before: bad townie. After Bbyte's lynch he finally stepped it up and started posting stuff and it became obvious that he was struggling to come up with his analysis. This was similar to Jay, with the main difference being that Jay posted much more filler during Day 1. But both couldn't keep it up when they were forced to provide their reads. I have yet to post on how BKE himself has posted on the other players but for now I don't see many promising leads. I'd sayu that the mafia is hiding amongst the quieter players but perhaps I'm seeing things this way simply because those who have posted a lot on BKE are my town reads anyway.
WHY WOULD YOU VOTE FOR SOMEONE YOU BELIEVE TO BE TOWN. No word twisting here. You simply said "Hey, I think he's a townie, but here's my vote on him anyway". That is in no way a good idea. Ever. In fact the only reason to lynch a townie knowingly is if you are scum.
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On December 14 2011 06:02 xtfftc wrote:And I'm still waiting on: Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 04:57 xtfftc wrote:On December 14 2011 04:38 Velinath wrote:
That's hilarious. I can't take you seriously anymore. (hint: I don't buy this crap at all, and now I really DO think you're lying) So before you DIDN'T think that I was lying? This makes it 9. I'm done for tonight and you seem to have done well at your test, so I''m sure you'll have enough time to address all of my concerns.
already explained this. it's even on this page. it's like i have to scream at you to make a point. that was SPECIFICALLY in reference to your LAL stuff. which you FINALLY got around to explaining how you meant it in a clear enough manner that it would make sense to anyone else in the thread. irrelevant now, i suppose, but just goes to show how much attention you're paying
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I'm also going to ask at this point that other people start posting. We are almost halfway through Day 4 and so far it's been largely dominated by layabout (earlier), xtfftc, and myself. Where is everyone?
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Actually, while I'm here:
On December 08 2011 04:56 xtfftc wrote:
Town does not vote to punish bad play. Town votes to lynch mafia.
(he says, to a vote that lynched a mafia)
As I was re-reading his earlier posts just now, I reached the same conclusion as before: bad townie. After Bbyte's lynch he finally stepped it up and started posting stuff and it became obvious that he was struggling to come up with his analysis. This was similar to Jay, with the main difference being that Jay posted much more filler during Day 1. But both couldn't keep it up when they were forced to provide their reads. I have yet to post on how BKE himself has posted on the other players but for now I don't see many promising leads. I'd sayu that the mafia is hiding amongst the quieter players but perhaps I'm seeing things this way simply because those who have posted a lot on BKE are my town reads anyway.
(his reasoning for lynching a townie - and even he says that he expects BKEXE to be a townie - day 3. Emphasis mine.)
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I would like to know what your opinion is as far as what I brought up in my last post, regarding his stance on "never vote townies" and then voting for someone who he believed to be town.
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On December 14 2011 07:32 ey215 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 07:24 Velinath wrote:
I would like to know what your opinion is as far as what I brought up in my last post, regarding his stance on "never vote townies" and then voting for someone who he believed to be town. It's a contradiction he needs to give an answer to the town for. I however don't think it's a definitive scum tell. I'd like to see his answer before drawing a specific conclusion. My vote may be based on how he answers those allegations. If he's scum number two who do you think is the third?
Third scum might be Bluelightz (who still hasn't contributed - and it seems that EB's case on Hassybaby from Day 1 has fallen by the wayside, despite it being a fairly good case). I have nearly zero post content to draw from for Bluelightz though.. I don't think it's layabout because bussing with only 2 scum left in the game would be utterly retarded, and I feel that Tunkeg has played a town game thus far. As I have stated I have a strong town read on you and I also believe BH to be town based on filter.
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On December 14 2011 08:11 Tunkeg wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 07:42 layabout wrote:On December 14 2011 07:31 Tunkeg wrote:On December 14 2011 06:21 Velinath wrote:
I'm also going to ask at this point that other people start posting. We are almost halfway through Day 4 and so far it's been largely dominated by layabout (earlier), xtfftc, and myself. Where is everyone? I'll speak for myself here. I think the entire thread have taken a bad turn after layabout came into play. All he have done is make shitty cases and OMGUS'ing anyone arguing with him. I think he himself is playing an utterly crappy game (if he is town), he is purposly misinterpreting what other writes, twisting and turning every word that is written and his dickish behaviour wants me to straight up punch him in the face. He acts like he is so fucking great at this game, and keep referencing other games and how this game should be played. At the moment I get pissed off just by opening the thread and reading anything he writes, and therefor I find it hard to contribute anything usefull. I'll give him this though, if he is scum he is doing a good job, creating a crappy townenvironment and distracting the town with his shit. I know this is an increadible OMGUS post, and I know it will probably make me look bad, but I don't care, I can't coexist with layabout anyways. So please feel free to jump on me, cause atm I am the third best lynch town can make (green townie who is having a hard time contributing). I will give layabout the benefit of the doubt, I think he is scum and not a crappy asshole of a town... ##Vote: layaboutyour case is just so good! (/sarcasm) you have really proved through analysis that all of my behaviour suggests that i am mafia (/more sarcasm) your also insulting... which is of course the best way to present a legitimate argument (/immature and slightly hypocritical rebuttal) please come up with something to support your vote pssst i referenced ver because i felt it was relevant and that his analysis really puts the behaviours i have drawn attention to into context, reading through and understanding the guides/analysis on tl that can help new players to improve. Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 07:44 layabout wrote:
EBWOP below vote layabout are my comments My case against you is not great. But it is the only way for me to proceed in this game. I can't play this game with you in it. To be frank I don't care wheather you are mafia or town at this point, I can't play this game with you in it. So basicly town needs to get rid of one of us. If we are both town, well then we fucked this game up together. And yeah I am insulting, cause I am an asshole to other assholes. It is ok to apply pressure, and it is ok to be playing an aggressive game, going total asshole is not ok IMO. The only support I am going to provide for my vote is that I want you out of the game, scum or no scum. Of course if someone have a great case on someone, or if a uncontradicted blue comes up with a scum to lynch I will vote for them. I will not sabotage town.
Not going to lie, I'm not happy to see this "let's OMGUS off the deep end" thing from you. Look over what's been said on xtfftc - specifically his obvious contradictions - and I'd like to hear from you on what you think of those.
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On December 14 2011 09:44 Bluelightz wrote:sorry  just didnt feel like posting (>_<)
you do realize you're judged on your posting in this game right, and lurking makes you look TERRIBLE?
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then why didn't you say that? you never directly stated that you thought BKEXE was scum. instead you said the mafia was "hiding amongst the quieter players". hell of a general statement.
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On December 14 2011 15:12 xtfftc wrote:
BH, I don't believe that Tunkeg is mafia. If you want me to, I'll post a proper explanation in the afternoon but I'm sure I've talked about it before. And if it's up to lynching him and me, it would be better to go for me and then layabout after I flip. Lynching him would leave us in a similar situation tomorrow as we are today.
For reasons stated many times before,
##Vote: layabout
Tunkeg trying to distract attention from someone I believe to be scum by OMGUSing his original accuser and making it into "Vote him or me" seems scummy to me
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On December 14 2011 15:18 xtfftc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 15:15 Velinath wrote:On December 14 2011 15:12 xtfftc wrote:
BH, I don't believe that Tunkeg is mafia. If you want me to, I'll post a proper explanation in the afternoon but I'm sure I've talked about it before. And if it's up to lynching him and me, it would be better to go for me and then layabout after I flip. Lynching him would leave us in a similar situation tomorrow as we are today.
For reasons stated many times before,
##Vote: layabout Tunkeg trying to distract attention from someone I believe to be scum by OMGUSing his original accuser and making it into "Vote him or me" seems scummy to me Wait, am I the scum OMGUSing layabhout?! I was on xsk FROM DAY 1. He was even my vote until I switched on Bbyte. The only person OMGUSing is layabout: this is the very thing he did in this thread, an OMGUS on me and Tunkeg.
tunkeg is OMGUSing, go read the last page
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(eg: Tunkeg seems scummy to me now too, maximum chainsaw defense)
So in other words, I think I've solved the game. Let's lynch you, then we're down to 1 scum. Cop investigates Tunkeg, posts results in thread next day, town wins.
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Oh, for fuck's sake. Blind BH-sheeping? Really?
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On December 14 2011 15:57 Bluelightz wrote:
sorry BH, didnt notice your case till now so,
##Vote: Tunkeg
BH, is there any other of his posts that make you have a scumread on him?
also, after looking @ BHs case m mind is decided for this day
Bluelightz,
please provide some original reasoning for a vote you put forward. Voting blindly based on one post is silly.
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EPT
