Team Mini Mafia III BCE - Page 2

Post a Reply

Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 05 2011 20:15 GMT

#249

yes, nighttime is not town time. No reason to generate discussion or information that we can't act on yet.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 05 2011 21:52 GMT

#265

I mean we townies can't act on it. Except blues, but I'm all for leaving the blues to act on their own.

Giving out information during night 1 really hurt town in experimental mini mafia (I was scum that game). We had a medic claim, another blue claim, I forget what else, but me and my scumbuddies were laughing it up in our IRC as town shot themselves in one foot then the other. KJ might remember better.

The gist of my thought is: any info you give out at night can be used against town, and can't be used by town until morning. So wait until morning. Take this time to go over the thread with your partner or something.

However if anyone really wants to go on being vocal and jolly go right ahead, it certainly will give me more to analyze.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 05:53 GMT

#302

I learned today in no uncertain terms that I have better things to do with my time at work than forum games

I'm glad to see at least some conversation occurring.

@Nemesis: I am really looking forward to reading your analysis of me. As I have already mentioned a few times, I'm wary of you at the moment, and I hope my suspicions will be either allayed or confirmed by you posting something of substance. If you come to the conclusion that I'm town, I'd actually rather see an analysis on someone else though. I'm going to suggest a few people below.

@Deconduo: I understand that, if there is a cop, it would be nice for the cop to not have to worry about dying before passing on the info they have collected. However, I think we're better off going with your original suggestion of assuming no blue roles, and just scumhunting normally.

If there is a cop and the cop finds a red, I think it's worth just claiming at that point. There's only two mafia teams total afterall, if we get one we're halfway there. If the cop only finds greens, I don't think getting a green list is necessarily worth the trouble/risk of doing the hypocop. That's all my opinion anyway, I'd like to hear KJ on this too though.

BTW, I missed the same rule in the OP as KJ regarding claiming role block. I didn't realize that greens would also be notified. In any case, subversion's claim doesn't mean anything for now. If we have another claim tomorrow (different team), that will be much more interesting.

Here are my top lynch candidates.

Orgolove
Every single post has been an apology for being busy, or a criticism of what the town is doing (or both). He even criticized me for wanting quiet at night when he himself refused to pressure vote or help town with activity. For what it's worth, his first post has a classic scumtell (I did the same thing in experimental mini mafia and RoL picked up on it) -- he sympathizes with town by pointing out a disadvantage given by the setup. Doesn't mean much on it's own, but it is strangely common for scum to do this exact thing. His 6 total posts for your reading pleasure:
+ Show Spoiler +

On January 04 2011 17:29 orgolove wrote:
I apologize for being busy.

So we're having a day 1 lynch without any starting information huh. An open setup with unknown roleblockers gives a disadvantage to the town, but as the saying goes, "a challenge means god's afraid of your progress"

All right, lets see.
...

Looking at the past two pages, there's nothing to analyze. There's only been two votes, and the only discussion has been whether to lynch inactives.

no. Bad idea. In a game such as this, planning to lynch an inactive just allows the reds to guide the discussion to whichever inactive green they know isn't a part of them and leads to the town's disadvantage.

I'm not going to post any votes until there's something more concrete to go on.

On January 05 2011 23:02 orgolove wrote:
I apologize - my schedule is really off right now.

I promise I'll be here more often.

Gmarshal (.5)
Deconduo
Aidnai
Subversion

Huh - wait a minute - town had nothing to go on. Why did you guys vote?

On January 05 2011 23:02 orgolove wrote:
I mean, what made you vote for Beneather?

On January 06 2011 01:10 orgolove wrote:
>>>> Vote for inactives strategy is... not beneficial at all for the town, to say the least. The reds can subtly direct to whoever they would know is not a red and yet inactive. :/ We as town have no information, and reds can use that to lynch a green. If we don't have any information, pressuring is fine.. but just hitting someone because they're inactive is not a good strategy at all. This is why I also like the mayor idea for the first day, as it gives a way for town to get useful info on day 1...

On January 06 2011 21:20 orgolove wrote:
kingjames' post sounds like a kneejerk reaction due to the potentially losing the bandwagon. -_-

And I'm surprised people hasn't picked up on the scumminess of aidnai's suggestion that the town shouldn't discuss anything during the night. First he says it's sad that there's such lack of activity, then he encourages town to stay inactive? Discussion is the only weapon for townies with no information. Whether it is done during the night or during the day doesn't make any difference - this just looks like a subtle effort by a red to sabotage the town's efforts.

On January 07 2011 07:16 orgolove wrote:

Show nested quote +

Right.

Did you not read my post immediately afterwards? It was still in the middle of the season, and I was unable to log on before the deadline to place my vote. Since then I've tried as well as anyone to contribute and make sense of this discussion, from which there really wasn't any.

Focusing on inactivity won't help the town, and I'm surprised you, of all people, are choosing to do that, especially without any response to deconduo's suggestion.

@deconduo: what exactly do you mean by hypocop?

Major points:
-Missed the day 1 vote!
-He is continuously pointing out why this or that doesn't help town, without once attempting to actually help the town himself by doing the things he himself suggests.
-Says "Discussion is the only weapon for townies with no information", has 6 total posts in the thread (since the first day post)
-Criticizes me for discouraging discussion at night, when he discouraged it during day (says 'nothing to analyze' and 'not going to vote...').

Subversion
As KJ and meapak have pointed out, this claim is an easy fake claim for mafia if they don't have a roleblocker. Coupled with his lackluster posts and afk-ness looks pretty bad imo. His posts (I tried to fix his quotes so it wouldn't mess up mine):
+ Show Spoiler +

On January 04 2011 16:25 Subversion wrote:

Show nested quote +

On January 04 2011 10:46 Nemesis wrote:
Ok I just got here. Just to share my ideas with the current plans.

On January 04 2011 00:51 deconduo wrote:
Would a good idea be to work off the assumption we are in setup #2? Basically we assume that there are no blues, and if we do have a DT or medic its a bonus. That way we focus more on scumhunting rather than relying on a DT/medic to form a circle that might not be there at all.

I wouldn't make any assumptions as to what setup we are going with. We should consider all the possible setups. But yes, we should focus more on scumhunting than relying on forming circles based on blue roles.

On January 04 2011 00:37 LSB wrote:
Well... Activity isn't going to magically create itself. So...

All right, in many games there was an uneventful first day. Lets not make this one of those games.

A few things to talk about:

Should we lynch an inactive day one? Assuming of course, there is no good alternative
Plans for the roles

Inactives:
A big problem in every mafia game is inactivity. I don't want another drag_ being able to squeak by with barely any posts. We should immediately show it is not okay to be inactive.

Inactive players hurt the town as they waste lynches down the road as the town will need to try to separate the mafia from the inactives.

We should therefore push to lynch an inactive day one. This will force the assassins to discuss and not be able to turtle, increasing the chance they will slip up.
The key is that we have to make sure the town knows it is not okay to just simply sit back and not do anything. This way, hopefully everyone will be active and we won't need to lynch an inactive.

Plan
Firstly. DO NOT CLAIM
DO NOT CLAIM

Good now that we got that out of the way, some other ideas.

Generic Blue Activity plan
One plan that would work is to use the blue roles to promote activity in the town.
The DTs should check the inactive people and the lurkers, as it is incredibly difficult if not impossible to tell the difference between a bored townie and a lurking mafia.
The Medics should protect active players, this way the mafia won't be able to take out the people who are contributing the most to town, so people won't be scared of trying to put forth their opinions.

Although, I myself do not like inactives, our goal is to lynch mafia. So unless we can't come up with any good target to lynch by the end of the day, then I don't advocate the lynching of inactives, but lynching them might be a good idea if we have nothing else to go on.

As for dts checking inactive people(if we do indeed have dts), I think that might be a lot better plan than lynching inactives as we would be wasting town's greatest weapon. Lynching inactives is basically the same as RNG, a random chance of lynching scum. The only good thing is it prevents inactivity and encourages acitivity.

i dont really see what the point is of DTs checking inactives if its publicly announced. Surely then mafia will just make sure they're not inactive to avoid being detected?

On January 05 2011 09:00 Subversion wrote:

Show nested quote +

On January 05 2011 01:22 LSB wrote:

On January 04 2011 16:25 Subversion wrote:

On January 04 2011 10:46 Nemesis wrote:
Ok I just got here. Just to share my ideas with the current plans.

On January 04 2011 00:37 LSB wrote:
Well... Activity isn't going to magically create itself. So...

All right, in many games there was an uneventful first day. Lets not make this one of those games.

A few things to talk about:

Should we lynch an inactive day one? Assuming of course, there is no good alternative
Plans for the roles

i dont really see what the point is of DTs checking inactives if its publicly announced. Surely then mafia will just make sure they're not inactive to avoid being detected?

Exactly. That's the plan.
That way the mafia will forced to stay active where it is easier to find them.
You can't analyze an inactive mafia. But you can analyze one that talks

Oh okay, soz, that actually makes a lot of sense.

Ugh this Day 1 vote is really just.. meh. Really not much to go on. For now I'm going with:

##Vote Beneather/BC

My main reasoning here is that Beneather seems reluctant to say anything without BC being here to give him advice. Seems like a scummy junior would be scared of exposing himself without a senior to run his posts by. Also, BC yet to make an appearance.

On January 05 2011 09:00 Subversion wrote:
omg, somehow completely fucked something up in the above post, sorry for the random screwed up quotes =/

also need to bold my vote

##Vote Beneather/BC

On January 05 2011 09:44 Subversion wrote:
Oh okay, soz, that actually makes a lot of sense.

Ugh this Day 1 vote is really just.. meh. Really not much to go on. For now I'm going with:

##Vote Beneather/BC

My main reasoning here is that Beneather seems reluctant to say anything without BC being here to give him advice. Seems like a scummy junior would be scared of exposing himself without a senior to run his posts by. Also, BC yet to make an appearance.

That's pretty much the whole post, except I also just said thanks to LSB for clarifying the check inactives plan, and why its good.

On January 06 2011 14:39 Subversion wrote:
Morning everyone.

Since mafia already knows, I've been roleblocked

As for other teams that are being discussed, meapak/ace have given reasons for low activity. If the inactivity continues, we should look again a little closer, but I have not seen anything scummy yet. Gmarshal/mango looks about 90% green to me (although KJ disagrees lol). Something feels off about nemesis, but until he posts something substantial, I will wait to build my case.

Orgolove is top lynch target today. Subversion is not a bad target, but I would actually like to see if we get another roleblock claim (from someone else) tomorrow.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 06:02 GMT

#303

Here's my vote:
##Vote Team 9: Flamewheel/Orgolove

And for kicks, the link to the post where RoL analyzes me doing the same scumtell as orgolove.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=172696&currentpage=10#181

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 07:03 GMT

#305

That's all well and good subversion, but would you care to contribute thoughts on some of the other people in the game? Instead of lurking until the pressure is on and then defending yourself?

Please tell us what you think of my analysis of orgolove. Or if you prefer, analyze someone else that you think is scum.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 15:16 GMT

#310

So the idea is lynch Subversion, he flips blue, then IF we have a cop, we also have medic who will protect the cop. But, if the cop claims, he will be roleblocked from then on right? unless the cop has already found a red, I really doubt he'll find anything after claiming (rules allow same target consecutive nights). Again, if the cop already found a red, push a lynch, and if you can't get it, claim.

Also, remember to vote! I want orgo to see the votes stacking up so both he and his team have to respond.

@mango: you're being a little silly. Mafia don't want all the attention, they don't want to actually contribute, and it's hard for them to point fingers and mean it because they know everyone else is innocent. It should be pretty obvious that KJ/me are not mafia. I'm also not worried about deconduo at the moment, but I suppose that could change.

Meapak is due back soon I believe. Meapak -- I know you're looking at subversion, but could I convince you to vote orgo today so we can see if someone else gets roleblocked tomorrow? I think orgo is a better lynch in any case.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 18:29 GMT

#312

orgolove posted in the other game about an hour ago, so he's definitely around...

@mango again, talk to foolishness about deconduo, me, and orgolove. I am fairly confident that your team is town aligned, and foolishness should be a great resource to you/us.

Actually, everyone do your best to bounce thoughts off your senior. They're basically 'playing' this game as a helpful service to us, so show some appreciation and don't let it go to waste.

I feel like we haven't heard from nemesis in a long while, despite a promised analysis from him

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 20:09 GMT

#314

^^GMarshal: I answered last time you asked dude

On January 06 2011 06:52 aidnai wrote:
I mean we townies can't act on it. Except blues, but I'm all for leaving the blues to act on their own.

Giving out information during night 1 really hurt town in experimental mini mafia (I was scum that game). We had a medic claim, another blue claim, I forget what else, but me and my scumbuddies were laughing it up in our IRC as town shot themselves in one foot then the other. KJ might remember better.

The gist of my thought is: any info you give out at night can be used against town, and can't be used by town until morning. So wait until morning. Take this time to go over the thread with your partner or something.

However if anyone really wants to go on being vocal and jolly go right ahead, it certainly will give me more to analyze.

Do you have a more specific question about my reasoning?

We have I think 7 hours left? Votes so far:
orgolove/Flamewheel: 2.5
GMarshal (0.5)
Meapak_Ziphh
aidnai

aidnai/KingJames01: 1
orgolove

Subversion: 0
~~Meapak_Ziphh~~

Not yet voted: Nemesis, Subversion, Deconduo, TheMango (0.5)

As I have mentioned before, I'm really keen to see what nemesis and subversion will contribute today.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 23:06 GMT

#317

Nemesis, two things concern me about your post. One, you left out some really important posts I made that are certainly not 'non-committal'. Two, you have no mention of orgolove, even though he's the top lynch candidate right now, he's the lynch I'm pushing, and he's the only other person that voted for me besides you. You say I "still seems to be trying to push suspicion onto Subversion based on the roleblock claim" which shows you read my analysis post of orgolove, so don't ignore it please.

However, I will not be deterred from the task at hand. Orgolove has posted again in the other game, so I know for a fact he's read my analysis and knows the votes are mounting over here. I'm having a hard time imagining a pro-town reason for not contributing to discussion in this thread, and not defending yourself from a lynch...

4 hours left? Votes so far:
orgolove/Flamewheel: 2.5
GMarshal (0.5)
Meapak_Ziphh
aidnai

aidnai/KingJames01: 2
orgolove
Nemesis

Subversion: 0
~~Meapak_Ziphh~~

Not yet voted: Subversion, Deconduo, TheMango (0.5)

I'm counting on you deconduo. TheMango, you heard anything from foolishness yet?

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 07 2011 23:58 GMT

#322

KJ made a mistake about the rules, that's all. I had the same wrong assumption as KJ actually (that subversion was claiming blue), until flamewheel pointed out that he could be green and still know he was blocked. I wish KJ would come back and post some more, both to clear us a little and because I want his take on a few players, but I know he's pretty busy...

Look at the rest of his posts too. When everyone was saying "not enough to analyze" or talking about lynching inactives, KJ was one of the first to post an analysis (of GM/Foolishness/mango). He also did his best (along with me) to avoid Beneather's lynch. No reason to do that as a scum...just afk ftw in that situation (I mean, beneather gave us all of five minutes to respond to his pre-death post).

Anyway, a defense coming from me won't mean much, so I'll leave it to you to figure out.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 08 2011 00:52 GMT

#328

Meapak, you leave the votes tied. If/when subversion comes along and votes, where do you imagine his vote will go?

From my perspective, the two scum are between orgolove, nemesis, and subversion.
We have imo a stronger case against orgolove than anyone else.
If we wait on subversion and we get another roleblock claim, we either have both mafia caught lying or subversion is telling the truth.

I understand that I'm being scrutinized because I'm attracting attention. It happens to every town leader. But please, remember mafia don't want attention. They want to blend in...

Meapak, there's only two hours left, and it would be pretty miraculous if you were actually able to swing the vote to subversion. If you're gonna insist on voting for him instead of playing along with me, will you at least provide the pretty good read (on subversion) Ace told us about?

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 08 2011 03:52 GMT

#333

Hmm... subversion never even voted?
I'll give you a hint RoL, we lynched orgolove/flamewheel. I'm stuck hitting f5 until I find out if we got scum or not, so...wanna just flip him and skip the flavor text?

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 08 2011 04:04 GMT

#336

FML

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 08 2011 04:26 GMT

#338

Ok, so, there's a 50/50 chance that we have a DT in our setup. If we have one PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE check me, and help me out tomorrow.

I don't think I'll be killed tonight, since i'll be a lynch target tomorrow anyway. Remember, being wrong doesn't make me scum, and nothing I've done makes sense for scum.

Orgo let us down. I guess he didn't care about town winning this game, as I see it, he did have a responsibility to show up and DO SOMETHING to show he was town.

I guess meapak's concern about no one showing up to defend orgo was a good intuition. But on the flip side, when RoL accused me in Experimental mini, my mafia buddies completely ignored it. Even when it picked up steam, they did nothing. I only avoided the lynch because RoL was replaced and pandain (a townie) decided to defend me.

I'm going to halt town leadership activities for now. Someone else please step up, I don't even want to nominate someone. I think there's a good chance we have a DT, if I get checked i'll be clear in the morning.

Mafia still have a quandry on their hands with the roleblock thing. If they roleblocked subversion, they cannot use their roleblock on anyone else without proving subversion's innocence. If subversion is mafia, they don't have a roleblock anyway to stop a DT from checking me. So I'm hopeful...

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 04:45 GMT

#342

I'm doing the f5 thing again lol... anyone else around or care at all?

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 05:17 GMT

#343

cricket, cricket....

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 08:55 GMT

#349

goodbye deconduo.

I was thinking/hoping that deconduo was the DT. I really like the way he played this game, he definitely drew a blue snipe attempt in my opinion. I am extremely surprised to see him flip green.

Do we have a DT? did I get checked?

I think I understand what flamewheel was talking about here

On January 08 2011 10:48 flamewheel wrote:
I'll help Meapak along in that since orgolove isn't around, and probably won't be for the foreseeable future. I'm not going to really lay it out, but take a look at Subversion's day 1 voting post. Take a look at his reasoning for the vote, and ask yourself if it makes sense.

For reference, here's subversion's reasoning:

On January 05 2011 09:44 Subversion wrote:
...
##Vote Beneather/BC

My main reasoning here is that Beneather seems reluctant to say anything without BC being here to give him advice. Seems like a scummy junior would be scared of exposing himself without a senior to run his posts by. Also, BC yet to make an appearance.
...

Does this reasoning make sense? It does, right? but why did Subversion come up with this reason? Is it possible that he was experiencing that same feeling himself? My idea is that Subversion was posting what was on his mind, just applying it to Beneather/BC instead of himself. Any other thoughts on this?

Thanks for the day extension RoL

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 19:10 GMT

#354

Ace, why haven't you analyzed my posts? you're main case against me is

1- KJ didn't push subversion hard enough (he's been afk/inactive)
2- Aidnai was on the wagon for two innocents (so was gmarshal AND deconduo)

You took a lot of time and effort to make a nice big post to convince everyone to lynch me, but it's like you didn't read my posts or make any attempt to do behavioural analysis.

The only reason your team has escaped scrutiny so far is because you both gave reasons for being inactive. But I'm rethinking this right now.

I'm currently considering Meapak/Nemesis scum team. Something I need to think through is why would they risk fakeclaiming... well, if subversion was telling the truth all along, then we are almost certainly in setup 2. I've asked a DT to check/claim, Ace asked for either the medic or DT to claim, it's been day for a while now and no one has claimed, so more than likely there are no blues -> safe to fake claim. Subversion is an easy target, probably won't even show up to defend himself.

Going back and re-reading now, if anyone chimes in while i'm re-reading, that'd be nice.

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 19:18 GMT

#356

you still haven't figured out that senior members don't have a vote? lol

aidnai

United States1159 Posts

January 09 2011 19:59 GMT

#360

If mafia are confident enough that we have setup 2 to fake roleclaim, there's no need to roleblock anyone. That's frighteningly obvious I thought....

Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All

Please or register to reply.