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Haunted Mafia - Page 45

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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DoctorHelvetica
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States15034 Posts
October 13 2010 00:11 GMT
#881
Please wait until the night cycle to send in your night actions. You have 3 hours and 50 minutes until the night begins.

If you have not voted you must vote or be modkilled
RIP Aaliyah
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
October 13 2010 00:11 GMT
#882
you STILL haven't changed that spreadsheet. wow.

once again, i never "defended lankill" beyond saying to you that YOU fucked up in calling him out on things when he still hasn't made a single post in the game.

if orgo is this loose with his spreadsheet after being called out on his inconsistencies like 12 hours ago (including this specific one), then i do not know how useful it is at all for anyone.
Lexpar
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
1813 Posts
October 13 2010 00:11 GMT
#883
Pandain and bumatlarge you've yet to defend your arguments.

Pandain:

Everyone vote heaven on earth. I think he's really the only good "lynch" today. Either that or Masq, because from there we find out alot on Veldril anyway. But I would prefer Heaven on Earth over masq because we can find out whether the jack o lantern i sactually a clue or not.


I want everyone who voted Veldril to change their vote ASAP unless they pm me a reason, or state so in thread. I'd prefer Masq do to. We got this. However, stay on until the end would be preffered in the unlikely case we don't have enough time


bumatlarge:
3. The vote lists will help us massively on fishing out opposing faction

The first two points have been discussed to death, so make your own observations there. I underestimated what Bill said regarding the sides. I failed to realize that the objective of either side is to kill the other team, regardless of towns numbers. It's almost as if town and mafia roles are reversed, since town just need to outnumber the remaining 8 scum. That means that either side cant win until much later if they lose one member... which is assumed they will if the other faction is smart.

If the two candidates for lynch (masq/veldril) contain at least one scum, we can be certain that right now on the lists contain a good number of scum from the opposite faction, depending on what they are. We just need mafia/vamps to kill each other decisively. If they don't they risk the other faction rising ahead. Therefore both teams need to rely on end game tactics.

Heh, it's almost as if we don't need to do anything if scum are good players. We just need to follow clues and go with the flow.

Masq is my vote, and if hes scum, then we can sift through the current list of masq people for his opposite faction.


Me:
I'm not sure I understand your guys argument. Everyone should bandwagon with you so that once he's lynched and revealed to be a baddie, we'll know with certainty that everyone who didn't vote to lynch him was on his team? This seems like an incredibly polarized point of view. Please explain yourselves pan/bum.


I still don't understand why hes suggesting that doing what he says, because everyone who dosen't is obviously baddie, is a foolproof idea. I'm willing to bet a big chunk of people voting for masq/vel did so out of not wanting to "waste" their vote on someone else, and going with whoever had the highest votes at the time. What are the odds these guys are gonna log on now and change their vote in the last 4 hours? Because they're lazy or maybe work nights, we condemn them to being on a baddie team?
orgolove
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Vatican City State1650 Posts
October 13 2010 00:15 GMT
#884
On October 13 2010 09:11 annul wrote:
you STILL haven't changed that spreadsheet. wow.

once again, i never "defended lankill" beyond saying to you that YOU fucked up in calling him out on things when he still hasn't made a single post in the game.

if orgo is this loose with his spreadsheet after being called out on his inconsistencies like 12 hours ago (including this specific one), then i do not know how useful it is at all for anyone.


Lol, I'm making a compilation of every action - regardless of source. If you disagree with it, then don't use it.
초대 갓, 이영호 | First God, Lee Young Ho
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
October 13 2010 00:18 GMT
#885
i never defended lankill. hence, you are lying in the spreadsheet.

i attacked you for lying. there is a big difference.
orgolove
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Vatican City State1650 Posts
October 13 2010 00:18 GMT
#886
Oh, and I did fix anything people pointed out. Doesn't mean I'm going to remove things just because someone doesn't like it though
초대 갓, 이영호 | First God, Lee Young Ho
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
October 13 2010 00:20 GMT
#887
On October 13 2010 09:07 annul wrote:
masq is scum

veldril is scum

the entire debate is whether it is smarter to vote veldril or masq tonight. who is more dangerous to keep alive.

most who view it like this will say veldril.


This is a horrible way of looking at it. Let's see whats wrong with this.
1.You assume both are scum.
Whats wrong:
How is this certain? Or one could argue, likely. Just because Masq got defended by Veldril does not mean they are on the same team. It may lend credence to that, but the point remains certain we do not know which team: town or scum. If you think both are scum it doesn't matter, that's not the point. The point is that we don't know the alignments of EITHER of them for certain.
2. "The entire debate is whether it is smarter to vote veldril or masq tonight.. who is more dangerous to keep alive. Most people who view it like this will say Veldril
Whats wrong:
First of all, it would be worse to vote Veldril because from voting Masq we gleam vital info on Veldril, while the vise versa does not(aka, we will not gain that much info from lynching Veldril.) And as for smarter, why, wouldn't the clue for Masq be more obvious and evident than the clue for Veldril, and that clue can honestly apply for many people. The contrary does not hold up towards Masq, that clue can really only point towards him. As for voting who is more dangerous, thats a stupid reason. We could always vote Ver because he's never lost a game(I think), but then we could lose a very helpful pro town person. Who's to say whos dangerous, how do you decide that. Usually that indicates a higher skill, but then thats worse for town if they're pro town and lynched.

Please, people, think logically.
youngminii
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Australia7514 Posts
October 13 2010 00:24 GMT
#888
IIOA

why do you think killing masq gives us info on veldril but killing veldril doesn't give us info on masq?
lalala
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
October 13 2010 00:26 GMT
#889
you are not going to fix blatant lies? grats, well done, your input is worthless.

and pandain: masq is scum because of the clue on night 0. how this is even a point of contention is beyond me. veldril is scum due to his actions in this thread all game. in fact, veldril himself is BLATANTLY referred to by the night 0 clue. the fate stay night quote, "unlimited blade works" is, to me, just as obvious as masq's pear jack o lantern night 0 clue.

so from this i can safely say they are both scum

now the question once again is who is more dangerous to leave alive on day 1 town vote. i think that is veldril.

THOUGH, that said, IF the town is smart, they kill neither of these two, but it does not seem to be trending that way and if we are gonna take out one of them, take out the active one.
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
October 13 2010 00:26 GMT
#890
On October 13 2010 09:18 orgolove wrote:
Oh, and I did fix anything people pointed out. Doesn't mean I'm going to remove things just because someone doesn't like it though

i agree that you have your right but a few "wordings" would lead to miss understand later on. I think you should keep the information but fix the word "defending". I dont use that spreadsheet of yours so i personally dont care... Just wana say that the guy got his point.

People... please noticed how many times pandain is trying to avoid to explain himself.....
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
bumatlarge
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States4567 Posts
October 13 2010 00:27 GMT
#891
On October 13 2010 09:08 orgolove wrote:
All right. I updated the spreadsheet with everybody's current votes, voting patterns (changes), smurf lists, suspicious patterns etc.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0Ap0Ejzlf165MdENWM3p1cHNOcDlnT0o4bjNUUFdVMlE&hl=en&output=html


I thought my Veldril -> Masq post was important
Veldril defended masq, and masq didn't associate with him. Veldril could be scum protecting himself or legitimate towny with opinions, or Masq is innocent thats all well, or hes scum and it's a much greater chance that veldril is on his team.

But unless a glaringly obvious lynch comes forward, but between veldril and masq, could dissect which sides we are dealing with. But at a certain point, it does become advantageous for a scum team with >4 players to start town killing...

Please go over the win conditions people and realize what we are supposed to be doing here. They are far from ordinary win conditions.
Together but separate, like oatmeal
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
October 13 2010 00:30 GMT
#892
nevermind on the pandain part, he posted while i was thinking and composing my post =.=
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
October 13 2010 00:30 GMT
#893
On October 13 2010 09:26 annul wrote:
you are not going to fix blatant lies? grats, well done, your input is worthless.

and pandain: masq is scum because of the clue on night 0. how this is even a point of contention is beyond me. veldril is scum due to his actions in this thread all game. in fact, veldril himself is BLATANTLY referred to by the night 0 clue. the fate stay night quote, "unlimited blade works" is, to me, just as obvious as masq's pear jack o lantern night 0 clue.
.


On October 13 2010 08:07 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2010 08:05 meeple wrote:
On October 13 2010 07:43 Pandain wrote:
@host: If, supposedly, there is a red herring, would it show up as a clue anyway?


As far as I know... there will be no deliberate red herrings... although people should keep in mind that the clues are meant to be vague enough to ensure different interpretations


There may or may not be deliberately misleading information in day posts. The mad scientist is the only role able to confirm whether or not a section of the day post contains a legitimate clue or not.


Also note that the blades clue can be taken towards many people, even kingjames for his signature(something like "I walk on unlimited swords" or something
orgolove
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Vatican City State1650 Posts
October 13 2010 00:30 GMT
#894
On October 13 2010 09:26 NB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2010 09:18 orgolove wrote:
Oh, and I did fix anything people pointed out. Doesn't mean I'm going to remove things just because someone doesn't like it though

i agree that you have your right but a few "wordings" would lead to miss understand later on. I think you should keep the information but fix the word "defending". I dont use that spreadsheet of yours so i personally dont care... Just wana say that the guy got his point.

People... please noticed how many times pandain is trying to avoid to explain himself.....

On October 13 2010 09:27 bumatlarge wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2010 09:08 orgolove wrote:
All right. I updated the spreadsheet with everybody's current votes, voting patterns (changes), smurf lists, suspicious patterns etc.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0Ap0Ejzlf165MdENWM3p1cHNOcDlnT0o4bjNUUFdVMlE&hl=en&output=html


I thought my Veldril -> Masq post was important
Veldril defended masq, and masq didn't associate with him. Veldril could be scum protecting himself or legitimate towny with opinions, or Masq is innocent thats all well, or hes scum and it's a much greater chance that veldril is on his team.

But unless a glaringly obvious lynch comes forward, but between veldril and masq, could dissect which sides we are dealing with. But at a certain point, it does become advantageous for a scum team with >4 players to start town killing...

Please go over the win conditions people and realize what we are supposed to be doing here. They are far from ordinary win conditions.


I fixed both.

And you're right, Pandein, just like Bill Murray, continues to avoid answering questions about their true allegiances.
초대 갓, 이영호 | First God, Lee Young Ho
bumatlarge
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States4567 Posts
October 13 2010 00:31 GMT
#895
+ Show Spoiler +
On October 13 2010 09:11 Lexpar wrote:
Pandain and bumatlarge you've yet to defend your arguments.

Pandain:
Show nested quote +

Everyone vote heaven on earth. I think he's really the only good "lynch" today. Either that or Masq, because from there we find out alot on Veldril anyway. But I would prefer Heaven on Earth over masq because we can find out whether the jack o lantern i sactually a clue or not.


Show nested quote +
I want everyone who voted Veldril to change their vote ASAP unless they pm me a reason, or state so in thread. I'd prefer Masq do to. We got this. However, stay on until the end would be preffered in the unlikely case we don't have enough time


bumatlarge:
Show nested quote +
3. The vote lists will help us massively on fishing out opposing faction

The first two points have been discussed to death, so make your own observations there. I underestimated what Bill said regarding the sides. I failed to realize that the objective of either side is to kill the other team, regardless of towns numbers. It's almost as if town and mafia roles are reversed, since town just need to outnumber the remaining 8 scum. That means that either side cant win until much later if they lose one member... which is assumed they will if the other faction is smart.

If the two candidates for lynch (masq/veldril) contain at least one scum, we can be certain that right now on the lists contain a good number of scum from the opposite faction, depending on what they are. We just need mafia/vamps to kill each other decisively. If they don't they risk the other faction rising ahead. Therefore both teams need to rely on end game tactics.

Heh, it's almost as if we don't need to do anything if scum are good players. We just need to follow clues and go with the flow.

Masq is my vote, and if hes scum, then we can sift through the current list of masq people for his opposite faction.


Me:
Show nested quote +
I'm not sure I understand your guys argument. Everyone should bandwagon with you so that once he's lynched and revealed to be a baddie, we'll know with certainty that everyone who didn't vote to lynch him was on his team? This seems like an incredibly polarized point of view. Please explain yourselves pan/bum.


Show nested quote +
I still don't understand why hes suggesting that doing what he says, because everyone who dosen't is obviously baddie, is a foolproof idea. I'm willing to bet a big chunk of people voting for masq/vel did so out of not wanting to "waste" their vote on someone else, and going with whoever had the highest votes at the time. What are the odds these guys are gonna log on now and change their vote in the last 4 hours? Because they're lazy or maybe work nights, we condemn them to being on a baddie team?


I've posted a list of pre-switch votes. Since no one seems to care, I guess they still hold some water. No one is band-wagoning. Just PLEASE pay attention to votes, they are tell tale signs of faction mongering unless people aimlessly throw votes on nobodies. I suggest people investigate those individuals.
Together but separate, like oatmeal
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
October 13 2010 00:33 GMT
#896
On October 13 2010 09:30 orgolove wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2010 09:26 NB wrote:
On October 13 2010 09:18 orgolove wrote:
Oh, and I did fix anything people pointed out. Doesn't mean I'm going to remove things just because someone doesn't like it though

i agree that you have your right but a few "wordings" would lead to miss understand later on. I think you should keep the information but fix the word "defending". I dont use that spreadsheet of yours so i personally dont care... Just wana say that the guy got his point.

People... please noticed how many times pandain is trying to avoid to explain himself.....

Show nested quote +
On October 13 2010 09:27 bumatlarge wrote:
On October 13 2010 09:08 orgolove wrote:
All right. I updated the spreadsheet with everybody's current votes, voting patterns (changes), smurf lists, suspicious patterns etc.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0Ap0Ejzlf165MdENWM3p1cHNOcDlnT0o4bjNUUFdVMlE&hl=en&output=html


I thought my Veldril -> Masq post was important
Veldril defended masq, and masq didn't associate with him. Veldril could be scum protecting himself or legitimate towny with opinions, or Masq is innocent thats all well, or hes scum and it's a much greater chance that veldril is on his team.

But unless a glaringly obvious lynch comes forward, but between veldril and masq, could dissect which sides we are dealing with. But at a certain point, it does become advantageous for a scum team with >4 players to start town killing...

Please go over the win conditions people and realize what we are supposed to be doing here. They are far from ordinary win conditions.


I fixed both.

And you're right, Pandein, just like Bill Murray, continues to avoid answering questions about their true allegiances.


What the fadoodle are you talking about. I've asked many times what I'm being accused of, and the best I've gotten is "your an endangered species"(<3 quickstriker)

And you've been on my scum list for a lil' bit now, orgo. Originally I thought you were very pro town with that spreadsheet but it has many errors, and has a noticable bias in it. Albeit if you're really looking to help, is there a way to send me that list, but without all your info? Only the names and clues and stuff.

Also, related to masq and vendril.
Defending someone is much more revealing than the person whos getting defended.

Aka, mafia could defend me, but I could be town and they're just trying to get pro town points. Or they could be accusing me for their own game. They could do either.

However, a person who is GETTING defended is more revealing. If they are mafia, we know mafia wouldn't just continue the brigade on that(most likely, especially if they are a top contender)
If they are town, then people who accused them should be looked at with suscipion and people who defended them(thus helping stop bandwagon) are good.

Ci? Yum yum
orgolove
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Vatican City State1650 Posts
October 13 2010 00:37 GMT
#897
List of changed votes, in order of who they started to vote:

aztrorisk: shmotz--> masq

coagulation: seraph-->masq
jodogohoo: seraph-->LSB--> coagulation--> youngminii--> coagulation--> Veldril

pandain: Pandain--> Masq --> HeavOnEarth
Lexpar: Masq-->Veldril

jaminz: Veldril --> Bill Murray
jcarlsoniv: Veldril--> masq


youngminii: jodogohoo--> Veldril

seRapH: coagulation--> masq
Bill Murray: coagulation--> Veldril --> orgolove --> Veldril --> kingjames01 --> Pandain --> masq

Kpyolysis32: Kenpachi --> HeavOnEarth
초대 갓, 이영호 | First God, Lee Young Ho
youngminii
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Australia7514 Posts
October 13 2010 00:38 GMT
#898
If anyone ever PMs you a counter argument to one of your arguments in the thread, ignore it, tell the person to post it in the thread and if they don't do it, quote it in the thread yourself.

Do not ever let someone take a public discussion/argument and turn it into a private one.
lalala
orgolove
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Vatican City State1650 Posts
October 13 2010 00:40 GMT
#899
And @ Pandain: lol no need to get your pants in a twist just because I didn't go with your rolefishing.

It appears both you and Bill have done the same thing, as I got a similar PM asking for my list of suspicions.
초대 갓, 이영호 | First God, Lee Young Ho
youngminii
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Australia7514 Posts
October 13 2010 00:40 GMT
#900
That said, Pandain PM'd me (this is suspicious in itself) his argument to my previous post.

i dont like posting with just one response so here

Defending someone is much more revealing than the person whos getting defended.

Aka, mafia could defend me, but I could be town and they're just trying to get pro town points. Or they could be accusing me for their own game. They could do either.

However, a person who is GETTING defended is more revealing. If they are mafia, we know mafia wouldn't just continue the brigade on that(most likely, especially if they are a top contender)
If they are town, then people who accused them should be looked at with suscipion and people who defended them(thus helping stop bandwagon) are good.

Ci? Yum yum


A person getting defended that doesn't defend the original defender (lolwut) doesn't give out any more information if lynched than the defender getting lynched.
lalala
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